If the angel had told Joe Smith not to join any church, why did he become a Methodist when trying to woo Emma Smith? Erratum: was too quick to write "become". He did not become an official member, but was involved in earnest with a congregation while courting Emma and trying to earn his father's respect.
He attended the Methodist Church as did his father while his mother attended the Presbyterian church. If you don’t believe in it, don’t believe in it. Millions of us do millions and millions.
@@KB-nv4bl The early sources indicate he did not only visit on a Sunday, check them back. Incidentally, your failed attempt at an argument is what is called an "ad populum fallacy" in logic, just in case you'd like to find out what it is.
@@elderinisrael There is evidence that he was on the Sunday School rolls in 1828 and attending with Emma before being called out as a necromancer by Emma's cousin, Joseph Lewis.
Very nice, all these visions, but apparently, Mr. Moroni (or was it Nephi? It gets confusing!), had no problem with young Joseph's treasure hunting escapades throughout these "formative" years!
Love your enthusiasm to discern the meaning behind these events. I know Joseph saw the ressurected Moroni, a Nephite. I know Joseph was called of God to translate the Book of Mormon (Mormon was Moroni's father) and to restore the Lord's true and living church to the Earth to prepare the world for the Second Coming of the Lord. I invite you to secure this witness for yourself. 💞🙏
@@mattctr Unfortunately, you don't "know" what and how you think you "know" it. You are actually claiming you have direct access to deity when you are just a homo sapiens like myself, with no special faculties to know the mind of any god. Mormon history lesson: The early Times and Seasons (vol 3, pp. 749, 753) referred to the angel as Nephi, which presumably was not corrected by the editor in chief, the prophet Joseph. Apparently, the identities of angels were a bit blurry at the beginning.
@@hobgoblin1976 Im glad you have such a keen interest in knowing more about your dispensation head prophet, Joseph Smith. That is a testament to your God-given mental faculties. Moroni is a Nephite, a son of Nephi, so I will happily refer to him as such at times. I am grateful for Joseph's publication efforts and forgive any editing errors that may have slipped by him or others as they worked tirelessly to dispense the gospel to the world. I know for myself, independent of any other man, that God the Father sits enthroned in the heavens and Jesus is the Christ, who was prepared for His atoning role long before this Earth was created. I also know of myself that Joseph Smith's witness and description of the ressurected Nephite, Moroni, is a precisely perfect description of how an angel of glory descending from the throne of God appears to mortal man. Now, that you have my personal witness. Either accept it or move along. Condemn not the things of God.💘
@@mattctr If you were to change all those names in your non-argument (Nephi, Moroni, ...) and replace them with Gandalf, Frodo, and Sauron, the meaning would remain intact. They are all mythical characters who never existed. Someone's revealed feelings do not constitute a sound argument in any rigorous discussion of anything. One day you will see the truth. It happened to me, of all people!
@@hobgoblin1976 I love you enough to confirm my witness is not limited to feelings or thoughts. Read it again, knowing that my experience involves the very senses you rely on to navigate your way to the market in addition to the unmistakable power of the Holy Ghost. This restoration still yields rich, personal interactions with the heavenly realm. The angels and visions of old are returning, the veil o'r the Earth is continuing to burst. I'll sing, and I'll shout with the hosts of heaven: Hosanna! Hosanna! HOSANNA! To God and the Lamb!
Poor devotional history here. History writing requires sound selection of the sources, but LDS historians have a prefabricated narrative in mind into which they shoehorn only the tidbits and fragments of the written record that do not contradict said authorized version of the Mormon past. Even in the age of the internet they continue to produce this pseudohistory.
@hobgoblin1976 You do know that Steven C. Harper has studied this time period, its documents, and other relevant non-Mormon documents to give context to them, right? He has a Phd and wrote a book about the First Vision accounts published by Oxford University Press, which is probably the most comprehensive treatise on the subject to-date. But, oh well, you probably know better...🤷♂
Thanks for putting this together. I appreciate Joseph Smith and am thankful for what he did.
Let me tell you a true story read my comment and then repent to GOD.
Read above and learn.
More!!! 😊
More let me tell you a true story read my comment about your church.
Read the top comment and learn.
The music sounds louder than the speaker
Revelation 22:18-19
😅Great news
Now i know
read my true comment, about this rotten church.
If the angel had told Joe Smith not to join any church, why did he become a Methodist when trying to woo Emma Smith? Erratum: was too quick to write "become". He did not become an official member, but was involved in earnest with a congregation while courting Emma and trying to earn his father's respect.
He attended the Methodist Church as did his father while his mother attended the Presbyterian church. If you don’t believe in it, don’t believe in it. Millions of us do millions and millions.
@@KB-nv4bl The early sources indicate he did not only visit on a Sunday, check them back. Incidentally, your failed attempt at an argument is what is called an "ad populum fallacy" in logic, just in case you'd like to find out what it is.
There is a difference between attending church services and joining them. You can attend church services without joining a church.
Who asked for your bigoted comment?
@@elderinisrael There is evidence that he was on the Sunday School rolls in 1828 and attending with Emma before being called out as a necromancer by Emma's cousin, Joseph Lewis.
Very nice, all these visions, but apparently, Mr. Moroni (or was it Nephi? It gets confusing!), had no problem with young Joseph's treasure hunting escapades throughout these "formative" years!
Love your enthusiasm to discern the meaning behind these events. I know Joseph saw the ressurected Moroni, a Nephite. I know Joseph was called of God to translate the Book of Mormon (Mormon was Moroni's father) and to restore the Lord's true and living church to the Earth to prepare the world for the Second Coming of the Lord. I invite you to secure this witness for yourself. 💞🙏
@@mattctr Unfortunately, you don't "know" what and how you think you "know" it. You are actually claiming you have direct access to deity when you are just a homo sapiens like myself, with no special faculties to know the mind of any god. Mormon history lesson: The early Times and Seasons (vol 3, pp. 749, 753) referred to the angel as Nephi, which presumably was not corrected by the editor in chief, the prophet Joseph. Apparently, the identities of angels were a bit blurry at the beginning.
@@hobgoblin1976 Im glad you have such a keen interest in knowing more about your dispensation head prophet, Joseph Smith. That is a testament to your God-given mental faculties.
Moroni is a Nephite, a son of Nephi, so I will happily refer to him as such at times. I am grateful for Joseph's publication efforts and forgive any editing errors that may have slipped by him or others as they worked tirelessly to dispense the gospel to the world.
I know for myself, independent of any other man, that God the Father sits enthroned in the heavens and Jesus is the Christ, who was prepared for His atoning role long before this Earth was created.
I also know of myself that Joseph Smith's witness and description of the ressurected Nephite, Moroni, is a precisely perfect description of how an angel of glory descending from the throne of God appears to mortal man.
Now, that you have my personal witness. Either accept it or move along. Condemn not the things of God.💘
@@mattctr If you were to change all those names in your non-argument (Nephi, Moroni, ...) and replace them with Gandalf, Frodo, and Sauron, the meaning would remain intact. They are all mythical characters who never existed. Someone's revealed feelings do not constitute a sound argument in any rigorous discussion of anything. One day you will see the truth. It happened to me, of all people!
@@hobgoblin1976 I love you enough to confirm my witness is not limited to feelings or thoughts. Read it again, knowing that my experience involves the very senses you rely on to navigate your way to the market in addition to the unmistakable power of the Holy Ghost. This restoration still yields rich, personal interactions with the heavenly realm. The angels and visions of old are returning, the veil o'r the Earth is continuing to burst. I'll sing, and I'll shout with the hosts of heaven: Hosanna! Hosanna! HOSANNA! To God and the Lamb!
Poor devotional history here. History writing requires sound selection of the sources, but LDS historians have a prefabricated narrative in mind into which they shoehorn only the tidbits and fragments of the written record that do not contradict said authorized version of the Mormon past. Even in the age of the internet they continue to produce this pseudohistory.
What is your response to the reality of Paul Gregersen debunking the arrogant Egyptologists?
@@richardholmes5676 Very simple: pseudoegyptology
@@hobgoblin1976 ?
@hobgoblin1976 You do know that Steven C. Harper has studied this time period, its documents, and other relevant non-Mormon documents to give context to them, right? He has a Phd and wrote a book about the First Vision accounts published by Oxford University Press, which is probably the most comprehensive treatise on the subject to-date. But, oh well, you probably know better...🤷♂
@@richardholmes5676 whoever this person is, they are not a good source, nor are they a specialist in that field.
@HelloSaints
read my true comment about this vile rotten church.