I will never understand the people who claim Liszt was a first rate pianist and a second rate composer. This composition is so mesmerizing and incredible by itself that it alone is enough to put Liszt in the absolute top tier.
his concert Etudes go beyond any other etude I know of (they also pass most pieces in musicality as well), and then there are his transcriptions. The tannhaeuser transcription captures everything.
Besides the fugue, this piece is truly quite the masterpiece. I found the fugue quite forceful, clearly Liszt wasn't the greatest contrapuntal writer, but at least it fits in nicely.
THE OLDER I GET, NOW 71, THE BETTER LISZT GETS. TO THINK THAT HE GAVE CONCERTS HERE IN MADRID, SPAIN WHERE I LIVE IN THE THYSSEN BORNAMIZZA MUSEUM TODAY.
One more thing: the ending from 30:49 is one of the greatest ever written in classical music. Theme 1 snakes down deep in the bass, ending on an accented C, a semitone above the tonic. High above, like woodwinds, three chords sound, and with a tritone leap from an F major to B major chord (absurdly daring, but anticipated by all the tritone progressions earlier in the sonata) the piece apparently ends, before a brief, dark, low B belatedly gives the chord its true bass -- and closes the piece as it began.
Ashish Xiangyi Kumar i am always fascinated by your insightful Analysis, but Its usually very hard for me to sit through such long, elaborate pieces. I wish you did bernstein-like analasys Videos in which you Break down the Parts you mention in the description, i would be happy to watch them!
I think it might be meant to indicate to gradually unsustain the other chords note by note and maybe using the soft pedal and sustain pedal both to limit their resonance, but letting the F major chord ring all the way through to the next one, which is then played even more quietly, giving a crescendo-like effect relative to the surrounding chords.
For phones Introduction + Transition 00:00 - Theme 1 (m.1-7) 00:52 - Theme 2 (m.8-13) 01:02 - Theme 3 (m.13-15, LH) [Transition] 01:24 - T2 (note that m.26 is based on m.10 - the initial suspension is shortened from two beats to a semiquaver, and the diminished 7th downward run is lengthened) 01:33 - T3 Movement 1, Sonata-Allegro = Exposition 01:39 - Subject 1 = T2 (RH) + T3 (LH). The integration of T2 and T3 is extraordinary: note that the D-E#-F#-A in the LH (in the middle of m.32) mirrors theme 2 in the RH above. See similarly m.36. This subject is never directly developed: instead, its constituent parts are, and its purpose is to illustrate the close relationship between T2 and T3. 01:50 - T2, transformed. See the similarity to m.11-12 (3 scalar notes leading to a diminished 7th descent), as well as the beginning upbeat of Theme 3. 02:10 - T2, in Major. 02:48 - T1 (m.82-104) 03:23 - Subject 2 (m.105-114) 04:17 - T2 (m.120-140, transition) 05:13 - T3 05:41 - Subject 3 = T3+2 transformed. One of the most beautiful thematic transformations in the entire literature, where the macabre repeated notes of T3 are pulled out into long cantando melodic lines. T2 occurs at 6:01 (m.161), in highly compressed form. Note also how the bass harmony in T2 moves in tritones - a masterful long-range anticipation of the ending cadence. 06:49 - T2, transformed (LH) 07:05 - T3, transformed 07:15 - T2, transformed (LH, m.197-204) 07:41 - T2, in Major (m.205-208) This is the recapitulation of the first internal movement of the sonata. 07:46 - T1 (LH, modified) 08:03 - T2 08:24 - T2, transformed (again, a beautiful transformation) 08:44 - T3, augmented (RH) 09:09 - T1 (LH) 09:21 - T2 09:36 - Subject 2 10:56 - T3 11:10 - T2 (just its head) 11:20 - T2+3 (T3 an ostinato in LH, T2 in RH) Movement 2, Andante = Development 12:04 - Subject 4, the main theme of the slow movement (note how this movement begins with a tritone shift in harmony) 13:22 - Subject 3, with just T3 14:28 - Subject 2 15:31 - T2 15:55 - Subject 4 Note how in the scalar passage beginning at 17:03 how the key changes by a tritone 17:51 - Subject 3 = T3+2 19:43 - T1 Movement 3, Scherzo = lead-back from development to recapitulation 20:36 - Subject 1 = T2+3 (the fugue subject is simply the themes played one after another) Note how intensely the themes are developed: from m.502-8 T2 (in chords) is combined with T3, while a middle voice, also sounding T3, creates a stretto between the two lower parts. One half of the fugue subject (T2) is superimposed over the other (T3), before T2 [21:43] is inverted in the LH, accompanying a dotted, augmented version of itself in the RH(!) 22:01 - T2 Note how m.526-9 are not decorative but based on m.12 (T2) Movement 4, Finale = Recapitulation + Coda 22:12 - T3 22:17 - Subject 1 22:46 - T1 23:02 - T2+1 (alternating in LH) 23:18 - T2, diminished 23:30 - T3 23:43 - Subject 2 24:52 - Subject 3 = T3+2 (25:16) 25:50 - Subject 3 = T3+2 (26:11. Note tritone shifts in LH) 26:22 - T3, augmented [Coda] 26:27 - T1 26:57 - T2, augmented, in RH then LH 27:15 - Subject 2 27:41 - Subject 4 29:00 - T3 (Note how the themes are presented in reverse order) 29:24 - T2 30:20 - T1
Alexei Grynyuk is an underrated keyboard giant. His Beethoven 'Emperor' Concerto is unsurpassed, proving that piano competitions have little credibility, since he never made it past the 1st round during the 12th Van Cliburn International Piano Competition in 2005. This performance of the Liszt Sonata is also unsurpassed.
While I will always pick Laplante's performance for my all time favorite, this is a really unique and exciting interpretation and I'm very glad to have had it introduced to me!
I agree with you. Though the Presto and Prestissimo part in Laplante's interpretation are inferior to Zimmerman's in my opinion. Less dramatic or accentuated. But overall, I think Laplante is the best.
WOW ! I WAS NOT EXPECTING SUCH PYRO TECHNIC BRAVURA. AMAZING TO FIND SUCH A DISCOVERY OF GENIUS AND BRILLIANCE. FULL AND CLEAR AT THE SAME TIME. EVERYTHING CLEARLY DEFINED AND TUMULTOUS EVERYTHING WHICH ROMANTICISM COULD POSSIBLY BE ABOUT . THANKYOU FOR THE DISCOVERY. RON
one of the greates, most titanic, work ever written for piano. Very few pieces of music are this emotionally deep, beatuful, complex, mastodontic...Definifely putting this sonata in the list of the pieces i want, some day, to study and go deep in.
Thank you for the many true gems of music re-creation (rather than 'interpretation'). I am happy to have just discovered your uploads. Your comments are excellent. I'm sure you know Tovey's writings. After 60 years of listening (growing up with Kapell, Lipatti, Abby Simon, Cherkassky, & many more) great music still offers and allows me to enter a sane world, amid the mindless chaos, irrationality, and violence of these times. Thank you.
Amazingly beautiful performance. One of the few interpretations that understands the beginning, transformations, ending and return of the journey of this masterpiece.
Am I crazy or is Theme 2 just the inversion of Theme 1's first four notes? (comparing m.2-3 and m.9-10) If it is, Liszt's ability on thematic unity just blew my mind (Edit: Also notice the similarity between the beginning of Theme 1 and the inverted Theme 2 Liszt applies on the fugue at 21:49)
Thanks for the upload. Somehow I actually prefer this over Zimmerman's. I'm just wondering, do you not consider the Grandioso (3:23) to be it's own theme?
Certainly it is! Except that it's *more than* just a theme, it is one of the *subjects* of the first movement, and of the entire sonata as a whole (as indicated in my commentary). The themes are the germs from which the subjects spring (you can see how both Subject 1 and Subject 3 are different combinations of Themes 2 & 3.) The Grandioso, however, is not ever presented in any germlike form (as Subject 1 & 3 are in the introduction) -- it emerges fully formed, and so is immediately promoted to Subject status.
I assume you're referring just to the theme extension from m.291 onward, because 8:24 is just a transformation of theme 2? But yeah -- there's a bunch of stuff I had to leave out, including stuff on false entries and the significance of E-flat major in the piece, quite literally because I'd run out of space.
I assume this is Alexei Grynyuk, who's recorded quite a bit of Liszt, and not Sasha Grynyuk. This version is 2 mins longer than the other (3- part) version in UA-cam.
From the point of view of four movements, in the first movement wouldn’t you say that 7:41 is the beginning of more of a development section than the recapitulation, and instead 9:21 is the recapitulation? 9:21 follows the original texture of the T2 (pure octaves) and also has a restatement of the second subject afterwards. It would be a different kind of recapitulation, but still. edit after 3 months: I noticed that 9:21 is T2 transposed by a tritone (to F minor), allowing the same descending diminished arpeggios to be used and adding to the number of tritone-related ideas in the piece.
A bit like having a floor plan while walking round an unknown building. You wouldn't need one for your own home; but when in a new and complex structure it certainly helps to know where you are.
I don't know, sometimes it's just nice to walk around and enjoy the view. I can see the point of using a structure as a composer, for aesthetic or expressive reasons, or to study it as an analyst, but as a listener I don't feel my experience augmented in any way by knowing about it. Moreso how much a piece conforms or less to a predetermined form. I would even say that seeing the frames behind the scenography lessens the magic. On the other hand, I find stylistical or harmonic notes very interesting. Go figure.
You don't want to listen to this sonata as a random assortment of unrelated melodies, surely? Structure simply means the lack of randomness. A cadence is a musical structure, as is a melody, as is sonata form.
Maybe I couldn't make myself clear. Of course structure gives a piece balance and coherence, but that's on the composer's to design it. As a listener, I can't see why the knowledge of its details should be that important. Reprising the architecture analogy, the proportions chosen by an architect are definitely important in a building's design, but can be enjoyed by the visitor even without knowing much about them. Had I no idea about what the difference between a sonata, or a symphony or whatever is supposed to be, wouldn't I be able to enjoy a piece of music?
I will never understand the people who claim Liszt was a first rate pianist and a second rate composer. This composition is so mesmerizing and incredible by itself that it alone is enough to put Liszt in the absolute top tier.
True.
his concert Etudes go beyond any other etude I know of (they also pass most pieces in musicality as well), and then there are his transcriptions. The tannhaeuser transcription captures everything.
Besides the fugue, this piece is truly quite the masterpiece. I found the fugue quite forceful, clearly Liszt wasn't the greatest contrapuntal writer, but at least it fits in nicely.
This is a good counterpoint, don't limit yourself to bach.
THE OLDER I GET, NOW 71, THE BETTER LISZT GETS. TO THINK THAT HE GAVE CONCERTS HERE IN MADRID, SPAIN WHERE I LIVE IN THE THYSSEN BORNAMIZZA MUSEUM TODAY.
Wow this is fantastic. I think Grynyuk deserves more attention. Clearly he's not just an octaves showman
One more thing: the ending from 30:49 is one of the greatest ever written in classical music. Theme 1 snakes down deep in the bass, ending on an accented C, a semitone above the tonic. High above, like woodwinds, three chords sound, and with a tritone leap from an F major to B major chord (absurdly daring, but anticipated by all the tritone progressions earlier in the sonata) the piece apparently ends, before a brief, dark, low B belatedly gives the chord its true bass -- and closes the piece as it began.
Ashish Xiangyi Kumar i am always fascinated by your insightful Analysis, but Its usually very hard for me to sit through such long, elaborate pieces. I wish you did bernstein-like analasys Videos in which you Break down the Parts you mention in the description, i would be happy to watch them!
Never seen an edition with an octave at the end.
Is this Alexei Grynyuk?
I studied with him in Kiev brilliant teacher as well as pianist
I think it might be meant to indicate to gradually unsustain the other chords note by note and maybe using the soft pedal and sustain pedal both to limit their resonance, but letting the F major chord ring all the way through to the next one, which is then played even more quietly, giving a crescendo-like effect relative to the surrounding chords.
This is my favorite piece in all of Music
It's amazing that Liszt turned three lines into a 30 minutes masterpiece
Liszt's greatest work.
For phones
Introduction + Transition
00:00 - Theme 1 (m.1-7)
00:52 - Theme 2 (m.8-13)
01:02 - Theme 3 (m.13-15, LH)
[Transition]
01:24 - T2 (note that m.26 is based on m.10 - the initial suspension is shortened from two beats to a semiquaver, and the diminished 7th downward run is lengthened)
01:33 - T3
Movement 1, Sonata-Allegro = Exposition
01:39 - Subject 1 = T2 (RH) + T3 (LH). The integration of T2 and T3 is extraordinary: note that the D-E#-F#-A in the LH (in the middle of m.32) mirrors theme 2 in the RH above. See similarly m.36. This subject is never directly developed: instead, its constituent parts are, and its purpose is to illustrate the close relationship between T2 and T3.
01:50 - T2, transformed. See the similarity to m.11-12 (3 scalar notes leading to a diminished 7th descent), as well as the beginning upbeat of Theme 3.
02:10 - T2, in Major.
02:48 - T1 (m.82-104)
03:23 - Subject 2 (m.105-114)
04:17 - T2 (m.120-140, transition)
05:13 - T3
05:41 - Subject 3 = T3+2 transformed. One of the most beautiful thematic transformations in the entire literature, where the macabre repeated notes of T3 are pulled out into long cantando melodic lines. T2 occurs at 6:01 (m.161), in highly compressed form. Note also how the bass harmony in T2 moves in tritones - a masterful long-range anticipation of the ending cadence.
06:49 - T2, transformed (LH)
07:05 - T3, transformed
07:15 - T2, transformed (LH, m.197-204)
07:41 - T2, in Major (m.205-208) This is the recapitulation of the first internal movement of the sonata.
07:46 - T1 (LH, modified)
08:03 - T2
08:24 - T2, transformed (again, a beautiful transformation)
08:44 - T3, augmented (RH)
09:09 - T1 (LH)
09:21 - T2
09:36 - Subject 2
10:56 - T3
11:10 - T2 (just its head)
11:20 - T2+3 (T3 an ostinato in LH, T2 in RH)
Movement 2, Andante = Development
12:04 - Subject 4, the main theme of the slow movement (note how this movement begins with a tritone shift in harmony)
13:22 - Subject 3, with just T3
14:28 - Subject 2
15:31 - T2
15:55 - Subject 4
Note how in the scalar passage beginning at 17:03 how the key changes by a tritone
17:51 - Subject 3 = T3+2
19:43 - T1
Movement 3, Scherzo = lead-back from development to recapitulation
20:36 - Subject 1 = T2+3 (the fugue subject is simply the themes played one after another) Note how intensely the themes are developed: from m.502-8 T2 (in chords) is combined with T3, while a middle voice, also sounding T3, creates a stretto between the two lower parts. One half of the fugue subject (T2) is superimposed over the other (T3), before T2 [21:43] is inverted in the LH, accompanying a dotted, augmented version of itself in the RH(!)
22:01 - T2
Note how m.526-9 are not decorative but based on m.12 (T2)
Movement 4, Finale = Recapitulation + Coda
22:12 - T3
22:17 - Subject 1
22:46 - T1
23:02 - T2+1 (alternating in LH)
23:18 - T2, diminished
23:30 - T3
23:43 - Subject 2
24:52 - Subject 3 = T3+2 (25:16)
25:50 - Subject 3 = T3+2 (26:11. Note tritone shifts in LH)
26:22 - T3, augmented
[Coda]
26:27 - T1
26:57 - T2, augmented, in RH then LH
27:15 - Subject 2
27:41 - Subject 4
29:00 - T3 (Note how the themes are presented in reverse order)
29:24 - T2
30:20 - T1
Holy shit, I never realized just how complex some of his songs were.
@@azearaazymoto461 pieces
Alexei Grynyuk is an underrated keyboard giant. His Beethoven 'Emperor' Concerto is unsurpassed, proving that piano competitions have little credibility, since he never made it past the 1st round during the 12th Van Cliburn International Piano Competition in 2005. This performance of the Liszt Sonata is also unsurpassed.
True
Si es muy buena la interpretación de esta Sonata, también la de Yundi Li me parece excelente 👍🏼
Grynuks version has some of the best tones I've heard. Not flashy or bangy like leplantes, but a different musical dimension. Quite amazing
While I will always pick Laplante's performance for my all time favorite, this is a really unique and exciting interpretation and I'm very glad to have had it introduced to me!
I agree with you. Though the Presto and Prestissimo part in Laplante's interpretation are inferior to Zimmerman's in my opinion. Less dramatic or accentuated. But overall, I think Laplante is the best.
Also at the middle at around 17:50 in this recording, Laplante is just in a little bit of rush IMO.
WOW ! I WAS NOT EXPECTING SUCH PYRO TECHNIC BRAVURA. AMAZING TO FIND SUCH A DISCOVERY OF GENIUS AND BRILLIANCE. FULL AND CLEAR AT THE SAME TIME. EVERYTHING CLEARLY DEFINED AND TUMULTOUS EVERYTHING WHICH ROMANTICISM COULD POSSIBLY BE ABOUT . THANKYOU FOR THE DISCOVERY. RON
one of the greates, most titanic, work ever written for piano. Very few pieces of music are this emotionally deep, beatuful, complex, mastodontic...Definifely putting this sonata in the list of the pieces i want, some day, to study and go deep in.
Thank you for the many true gems of music re-creation (rather than 'interpretation'). I am happy to have just discovered your uploads. Your comments are excellent. I'm sure you know Tovey's writings. After 60 years of listening (growing up with Kapell, Lipatti, Abby Simon, Cherkassky, & many more) great music still offers and allows me to enter a sane world, amid the mindless chaos, irrationality, and violence of these times. Thank you.
I can't wait to give this one a full listen and compare it to Zimmerman's recording.
I prefer this one.
Amazingly beautiful performance. One of the few interpretations that understands the beginning, transformations, ending and return of the journey of this masterpiece.
Fantastic work by all 3 of you!
thanks for the upload and also the detailed description. now i have another good rendition to choose from to listen😀
This is that crazy octave guy isn't it?
He plays octaves better than all
Best interpretation of this sonata.
Masterpiece.
Indeed.
brilliant masterpiece!
15:50
Wow, thank you so much for this detailed motivic analysis and for the amazing description. Keep it up!
13:22 -T2 is also presented (13:55)
26:12 -T2 heavily transformed, in both hands, amazingly
26:47 -T1 *instead of 26:27
The album that contains this recording also has the single best recording of the AdP Petrarca sonnets I've ever heard
Thank you so much for this post along with such a deliberate insightful analysis that I feel like I am taking a mini-masterclass :)
Absolutely Brilliant!!
0:02
0:53
1:03
1:14
1:39
2:10 (octaves #1)
2:49 (VERY GOOD)
3:24
4:18
- How stunning do you want it to be ?
Liszt : Yes.
First time I've followed the score--dang! Key signature is D/Bm, seems to start in Gm, but then comes that A-flat. This is some crazy s#!^!
In the repeat, F# leads to Bb minor.
17:08 - Liszt anticipates Wagner
Thomas Reith how?
Wagner was a friend of Liszt
@@ryacoli T r i s t a n C h o r d
@@manuelbes Wagner was Liszt son in law
@@scriabinismydog2439 Ah yes also that
Liszt Ferenc:h-moll Szonáta
1.Lento assai - Allegro energico 00:00
2.Andante sostenuto 12:04
3.Allegro energico - Andante sostenuto - Lento assai 20:34
Alexei Grynyuk-zongora
Amazing upload. Thank you!
i love this interpretation over zimmerman (btw i love zimmerman)
760 measures! Wow its the longest piano composition i have seen!
once i seen a 4 hour piece lmao... If someone can play that, it's not human
@@ClassikalBoi Opus Clavicembalisticum by Sorabji? That's about 4 hours long and there are actually people playing it :D
@@ClassikalBoi Sorabji Sequentia Cyclica lasted for 8 hours, and I'm sure there's a recording on UA-cam.
Am I crazy or is Theme 2 just the inversion of Theme 1's first four notes? (comparing m.2-3 and m.9-10) If it is, Liszt's ability on thematic unity just blew my mind
(Edit: Also notice the similarity between the beginning of Theme 1 and the inverted Theme 2 Liszt applies on the fugue at 21:49)
While the intervals don’t quite match I do see where you’re coming from, and there definitely is a link. I love it!
Have you heard Katsaris' 19 year old live performance. It is quite something as well.
He was 22. Recorded live in July of 1973, agreed it is an amazing version my favorite.
Thanks for the upload. Somehow I actually prefer this over Zimmerman's. I'm just wondering, do you not consider the Grandioso (3:23) to be it's own theme?
Certainly it is! Except that it's *more than* just a theme, it is one of the *subjects* of the first movement, and of the entire sonata as a whole (as indicated in my commentary).
The themes are the germs from which the subjects spring (you can see how both Subject 1 and Subject 3 are different combinations of Themes 2 & 3.)
The Grandioso, however, is not ever presented in any germlike form (as Subject 1 & 3 are in the introduction) -- it emerges fully formed, and so is immediately promoted to Subject status.
Thanks for the explanation! I was slightly confused but I see what you mean now.
I noticed that you didn't mention that the fugue used the melody from 8:24 and 9:28 that followed his use of theme 2.
I assume you're referring just to the theme extension from m.291 onward, because 8:24 is just a transformation of theme 2?
But yeah -- there's a bunch of stuff I had to leave out, including stuff on false entries and the significance of E-flat major in the piece, quite literally because I'd run out of space.
Yes, I am.
I assume this is Alexei Grynyuk, who's recorded quite a bit of Liszt, and not Sasha Grynyuk. This version is 2 mins longer than the other (3- part) version in UA-cam.
You should do a video like this with pollini's listz sonata recording with the DG
From the point of view of four movements, in the first movement wouldn’t you say that 7:41 is the beginning of more of a development section than the recapitulation, and instead 9:21 is the recapitulation? 9:21 follows the original texture of the T2 (pure octaves) and also has a restatement of the second subject afterwards. It would be a different kind of recapitulation, but still.
edit after 3 months: I noticed that 9:21 is T2 transposed by a tritone (to F minor), allowing the same descending diminished arpeggios to be used and adding to the number of tritone-related ideas in the piece.
Wow! This is better than Zimerman's!
5:42
something I always wonder when I watch this amazing videos and read their notes: why is it so important to define and describe a piece's structure?
A very good question.
A bit like having a floor plan while walking round an unknown building. You wouldn't need one for your own home; but when in a new and complex structure it certainly helps to know where you are.
I don't know, sometimes it's just nice to walk around and enjoy the view.
I can see the point of using a structure as a composer, for aesthetic or expressive reasons, or to study it as an analyst, but as a listener I don't feel my experience augmented in any way by knowing about it. Moreso how much a piece conforms or less to a predetermined form. I would even say that seeing the frames behind the scenography lessens the magic.
On the other hand, I find stylistical or harmonic notes very interesting. Go figure.
You don't want to listen to this sonata as a random assortment of unrelated melodies, surely? Structure simply means the lack of randomness. A cadence is a musical structure, as is a melody, as is sonata form.
Maybe I couldn't make myself clear. Of course structure gives a piece balance and coherence, but that's on the composer's to design it. As a listener, I can't see why the knowledge of its details should be that important. Reprising the architecture analogy, the proportions chosen by an architect are definitely important in a building's design, but can be enjoyed by the visitor even without knowing much about them.
Had I no idea about what the difference between a sonata, or a symphony or whatever is supposed to be, wouldn't I be able to enjoy a piece of music?
26:40
One question: is the third section a fugue or a fugato
It is a fugato.
Lucas Cheong loves music It’s been so long... thank you!
@@TheModicaLiszt Do you have a recording of the original ending? Or of Yuja Wang?
Lucas Cheong loves music Errmmmm there are some on UA-cam (original ending probably by MIDI)
@@TheModicaLiszt Ending that isn't MIDI
Why do you say four movements instead of three?
Is that your second video for this sonata?
Yes, the other one is Zimerman's performance.
P.S.-Lmao this was 3 yrs ago
But this is superlative, though
Still prefer the Cziffra interpretation
You must be a music profession, so many jargon that i can not understand, lol
Wikipedia lol.
lol.
video too quiet
Jesus christ you went whole hog on the breakdown.
I dont really like his grandioso to be honest, pretty ungrandiose
blah
Perfect technique and no inspiration at all.
Poor man, so much compentece wasted.
And playing this after Horowitz ...... perdendosi .....
11:48
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