Can Marines From 2003 Compete with Modern Primaris?
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2024
- In this tutorial Jay paints up some retro Oldhammer Space Marines to match his Black Templar. If you were ever curious how he painted them now you know! We have new videos every Monday, Wednesday and Friday! We're streaming Monday-Saturday starting at 9PM CST!! JOIN USSSS! Thanks for watching!
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Evil March by Kevin MacLeod
Link: incompetech.fi...
License: filmmusic.io/s...
#warhammer40k #miniatures #gamesworkshop
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I mean, the plastic is a different colour, but that's the same genestealer sculpt that was in 1st ed Space Hulk, so that's now a 32 year old sculpt.
It was not identical but slightly modified, as the toes of one foot were curled under unlike the totally flat-footed 'stealers from the original Space Hulk and Deathwing boxes.
i'm 21, i've been in Warhammer since 14 or so, my first army was Tyranids. 2 years ago one old guy that visits my local GW store quite usually, spoke to me about some retro and old minis that he had in his home, the next time i saw him, he gifted to me 24 old Genestealers and a modern Broodlord, i was so happy and so thankfull to him. It's so crazy to me that i play and paint miniatures that are older than me thanks to this old man. He usually gives some boxes away to people that usually comes to the shop and has a good relationship with him, he is trully a veteran that has been in the hobby practically since the start and has a enormous collection. He also likes to share his skills in painting and kitbashing, but he never plays, he says that is not a good loser so prefers not to play at all. The ancient and mightiest of all our community.
Same model from space crusade, just the basenis newer
"Long range close combat weapons"... Spoken like a true Black Templar. Love it.
It's really just preemptive self-defense.
I've recently converted to BT's. I used to play Blood Angels, but they haven't had many primaris updates, so I decided to give BT's a go now that they have loads of really nice new primaris minis. I'm really hoping we get a Primaris Landraider Crusader, and maybe even a Primaris Chaplain Dreadnought as well.
I'm a big fan of assault space marine chapters. I played BA's since I was a wee lad. I am thinking about starting some White Scars as well though and making them a bike heavy army. I am hoping I can convert the regular space marine bikes to have primaris riders though, as I really don't want any "stumpies" in my armies.
I know we have the outriders now, but I think we still need some regular space marine bikes for an army. Maybe I can convert the outriders to have the correct weapon load out's though. I think the idea of a biker gang astartes army is awesome.
I think anything that's not on bikes I'll likely use drop pods to get into the thick of it, maybe a flying transport or two. I used to run the flying transports in my BA army. I'd drop a Death Company Dread out of it, and a squad of death company out of the other one. It was a shame that there was such a glaring weakness in the DC rules though (the fact they attack the closest enemy) as they were able to be exploited. They were incredibly string for about a week, then people worked out they could just kite them.
I ended up playing Nurgle CSM instead after this. This was way before the Death Guard plastics though, and we actually had to convert our plague marines from plastic CSM kits. I mean we did have some plague marine minis, but only 5 or sculpts. We used to actually cut out the abdomen from the plastic CSM kits and sculpt in bloated bellys with green stuff.
TBH what got me into doing this was that I seen an army where someone had made blood angels infected with nurgle, and the conversions were gorgeous. the freedom the nurgle CSM players had with conversions really spoke to me and from then out I collected Nurgle CSM.
I still have a Nurgle CSM army now, but I have all new Death Guard plastics. I'm just taking my time with them as they're a passion project, and I want to get them exactly right.
So I picked Black templar as my army I will paint faster to play games with. I thought the paint scheme was simple enough where I didn't have to do lots of testers, and also the scheme is already locked in. With my Nurgle CSM I have so many options on how to paint them. Whether to stick with green or go another colour, then what method to achieve the colour I want.
It's nice to have an army like BT where the colour scheme is already locked in, and I can just crack on with painting and converting them, without all the sleepless nights about how to do them. I think the most work will be adding details to my 3 redemptor dreads. I want to add lots of bits and bobs to them to sell that they are BT.
@@D00M3R_MAVS I am confused. Why did you choose my comment to reply to it without actually replying to it seven months after I commented?
@@marcwittkowski5146 I only seen the video last night.
@@marcwittkowski5146 also I was wasted.
the comment wasn't supposed to be as long as it was. it just kind of kept going.
Sprue layout isn't actually computer generated. Darren Latham confirmed in an interview that it is all human design that they consider int he miniature design process.
So sprue space efficiency skills got so good folks thinks they're computer generated and thus have a less "human" feel to them versus the older(less space efficient) ones.
There's something either philosophical or psychological going on here
I don't believe them.
Well, they are probably using a CAD program to make the mould.
I bet it is in CAD that the sprue is made, with the bits imported from a 3D sculpting program.
So they most likely run a simulation on how the plastic flows and make the sprue after those results.
I guess when he says human made, he meant it like that, dont think there is an automated program to do that for them.
IF you believe anything GW say in interviews, you might be a squig
@@danepatterson8107 🙄
2003 was the peak of mainstream interest in the hobby, every one and there mum's was collecting the stuff here in the uk back then!
Yes. The tail end of 3rd? Tau and Necrons were fresh and the average game was 1500 points and arguably still skirmish.
The best way to enjoy retro 40k is to just play imperial guard or craftworld eldar in 9th edition.
haha well said!
What are all u guys gonna bitch and cry about when elder and imperial guard get done
@@michaeldorn5330 im not crying or bitching i just thought it was funny i play imperial guard among other armies and i think theyre great how they are!
@@yoyoyo9669 I added some Cadian gasmask heads now I like em better
@@michaeldorn5330 ohhhhh no are they possibly upset that eldar have ancient kits and lots of fine cast, are they upset we still only have 2 regiments for imperial guard with one being outdated and ugly.
Jay you are mistaken in one point: the sculpts you painted are not 3rd Edition.
They are leftovers from 2nd Edition repacked for 3rd.
The actual 3rd edition plastic marines were the first multiposeable Tactical Space Marines.
I am from the time of 3rd hutting the world.
With the first edition that came with a stand alone core rulebook.
Also the instructions of Battleforces.
I ended playing as the Tau were teased for 40k. Rumors had it that 40k introduced the mercenary system that Fantasy had.
@Tristan: What's your favorite rules edition of 40K and why? Respectfully curious: I stopped after 5th edition (which I liked overall).
@@danepatterson8107
Difficult question for me.
I started end of second, played some years third, paused for RL reasons, came back end of 8th, or more precise had one game before Corona-Hysteria, and here we are now. 9th is waiting for learning.
But the similarities with 3rd and the more streamlined gameplay is pretty appealing to me.
I remember when those multi-pose Tac-Marines came out! I bought a set and that was where my love of conversion and kitbashing started. I specifically remember a White Dwarf article that went over some options you could try to make things look unique. Oh the good old days when GW actually loved player creativity!
The first multiposeable tactical space marines were the plastics from first edition.
@@andrewmarrington5654
I didnt knew Rouge Trader had plastic miniatures at all.
But after that, the tactical Marines introduced in 3rd were the first multiposeable ones I came across.
Before you had the starter box in plastic and the blister ones in metal to do the job.
This is cool - aren't those models originally from 1993 though?
Yes, 2nd edition starter set had 20, plus the first plastic orks.
@@bionicgeekgrrl Um no. There were plastic multi part Orks in 1989 iirc. It’s rare to see pics of them. They were pretty crap.
Must be using the same sculpts
Nice to see you here Dan!
Yeah, they used those molds for a decade, pretty much all starter sets between 1993 to 2003 used these marine models
I work in automotive manufacturing and can tell you 1) yes, a computer algorithm 'nests' the parts into the sprue based on known dimensions, 2) they conduct flow analysis to ensure every part is filled every time and doesn't mar or warp the part due to variances in cooling and 3) this saves them a huge amount of time and money in reduced scrap, waste and higher customer satisfaction. They have also been making injection molded plastics for a few decades and have gotten pretty good at it by now.
I find citadel Wraithbone to work really great on Black Templars shoulders.
I remember 40k being extremely popular in the early 2000s (in the UK at least). Official and unofficial shops in most towns, all running clubs where you could go and build models and play games. Very cool model job btw! The cat litter and cork was a nice touch
Be fair, those monopose tactical marines looked a bit janky even when they were first released in 1993!
BUT they were really cheap at the time. It was like...I think £8 for a full set of ten tactical marines (this is back when GW did a box of 20 skeletons for like a fiver). The only other option were the all metal kits which were, for the time, fairly expensive.
I think they look AMAZING. I love the old squat marines. They have so much more charm to them than the tacticool primaris.
@@thequestbro I much prefer the beakie marines that preceded the monopose mkVII marines, they had far more charm and character in my eyes.
@@anotherzingbo they're all good. It's primaris I hate. Generic garbagio.
@theviewbot nah im with you. sculpts have become amazing. Nostalgia is for people who cannot change.
I am not sure about going through an airbrush but Formula P3 is super smooth for standard painting. Their line of paints are naturally thin so it might be really good for airbrushing. Menoth White or Menoth White Highlight might be a good option!
These exact space marine sculpts were my very first models I ever bought and painted over 20 years ago. They were cast in grey plastic though and came in a Start Painting box. I believe one had a missile launcher as well. Good memories...
When you started gushing about sprues i was like wtf? But you opened my eyes to something i never would think two seconds about. Thats a like in my book :)
use ushabti bone and throw in the bottle (or what ever gw calls it) a few drops of tamiya acrylic paint retarder. works wonders and makes very nice smooth offwhite-ish bone colour
I have an even better recipe- one drop of Tamiya x-20a, two drops of Acrylic Medium and two drops of paint.
Oh man, you could have spent a whole half hour just clowning on that manual . . . COULD you make a half hour video clowning on that manual?
Gosh I remember these coming home from Gamesworkshop with my Nan and Grandad. I've not played Warhammer in decades (aside from the video games ofc) and would kill to have these talents to paint. Brought back a lot of memories and (IMO) have more personality with the proportions than the newer ones
Such a great paint job, the bases look awesome. You should do basing tutorials
I have been thinking of breaking into the basing video game.
it was massively popular in the UK in 2003, we had a games workshop store on every major city high street.
Painting black templars chapter is like ASMR for me
Ahh
I wish game workshop come to my country
I've got a batch of seven old sisters sitting in acetone RN. Definitely going to paint and incorporate into my new force of the new plastics
But did you finish dusting because that’s important for allergy control
For Sigismund!!
I started Black Templars in 4th ed. I'm glad you're educating the web on BT and our original Codex.
Am I old if I remember buying and still actually have a bunch of those guys!!?
and a bunch of the plastic beakies!!!!!
Love the beakies!!
I also remember buying them back in the 90s, and I'm apparently super old so there you have it 🤣
@@EternalQuestion me too. We're not old, we're veterans
@@EternalQuestion So not just old - but Super Old!! - at least we're super something!!
Yes we're old, and despite our decades of experience we get no respect from the newer hobbyists
I have a complete box of the 2nd edition 40k starter set and man this is getting me tempted to paint all 20 of those Tactical bois up.
They may be stocky, short, and bulky as hell. But they are pure classics that might always stand the tides of time
Yeah. I absolutely love the old boxes. Got a small collection steadily growing that I too don't have the heart to clip from the sprues.
slowly falling in love with this channel. Great work :)
I played Epic 40k, more than a decade ago, back in the good old days. Just brought some memories back, when i watched your video and i really like your stile of how you presented and explained everything. You got a new sub.
Space Marine Assault was released in 1994 and is one of two Starter's Boxes for Second Edition 40k, which was released in 1993. Third Edition 40k was released in 1998. :)
I was thinking this exact thing! They are 2nd ed marines and genestealers…. Was this a reprint they did out of some early nostalgic sensibility?
This is as good as a TV show in terms of script or presentation
Great job with the editing/montages! Really dynamic. You never fail to impress!
Bro I LOVE your Black Templars. Their color scheme is absolutely sick.
"Painted models perfoms better" I remember that quote !
Okay that background lofi just meshes so well with this video!
That was your best intro in my opinion, that was soooooo smooth and nice
Field them as Crusader squads and save 15 points on your list!
Black Templars go!
18:07 ngl those kitbashed space marines are pretty dope
The press fit models were honestly they best, being able to play right out of the box after getting some at the end of school and playing your friend half an hour later
My recommendation for a replacement for Vallejo Bonewhite - Tamiya XF-57 Buff. Thin it in the bottle with Tamiya X-20A thinner and it air-brushes like a dream. You can still brush it on, it covers well, I've never needed more than two coats, it dries quickly with a completely matt finish.
I use Tamiya for all my base coats these days, I keep Vallejo for glazing, blending and dry-brushing.
I should try that, everything Tamiya I've bought has been good.
This was my first ever 40k box that I got from Borders book store back in maybe 2005? I painted the marines as ultramarines, then lamenters, then ultramarines, then my custom chapter...years before I found out about thinning your paints or stripping.
Love them in the coloured plastic just the way they are.
Sayyyyy what?? I've never heard such love and appreciation for a sprue. Huge respect for that level of love for the humanity displayed in these earlier sets.
Oh man. Oh oh oh oh oh my. Love for the lore too, for that wonderfully worded Emperor "quote". Dude you earned a sub based solely on your personality.
9:00 i love to use that paint with a very dry brush to highlight almost everything that isn't metallic, givin it a dusty sensation or using it as a base for another dry brush
its sooooo good to see progress being made in terms of vids quality
Army Painter Mummy Robes is the cream color I use. The paints a bit thick, but it isn't chunky like yours appears to be and can be thinned down as needed.
I love a classic & wholesome painting vid!
"Long range close combat weapon" - Black Templars, 41k millennium
I was ready to scrap some old minis. Thanks blood helping me change my mind.
I have pre 94 Space Marines and currently working on stripping the old paint as well as making them into classic Crimson Fists.
Enjoying that different intro and music to it.
great video also a big fan of taking the old and new and putting it all together into one army.
Just starting black Templars going for an (almost) all Primaris army, what great timing!
Those old genestealers are the beeeeesssst!
My Bonewhite is fine. I use a brush, but thinned with medium or water, it works fine. Not grainy, etc as whites can be. Try again, maybe? Also look into Model Air Sand or Game Air Bonewhite.
A tip for the eyes: do what you do and then paint fluorescent orange by Vallejo over the entire eye! It does wonders for mimicking glowing eyes.
BTW thanks for the painting tutorial for the black templars, i personally collect black templars and i never had a paint scheme for them, i would use layers of blue, but then they never felt like black templars, and i never found a cool paint scheme on the internet, but thanks to you're tutorial i found a cool way to paint them (i will use different colors to make them my own but i will use your help with it) thanks again.
When I produced those plastic miniatures for GW, the colour used was mostly mid grey, mixed in with the polymer with some lubricating agent to make them pop off the tooling mould easily. The exceptions were the plastic skeleton kits they used to produce, which was a flesh coloured master batch, can't recall its exact name right now, but we never used pinks or purples, though I left GW around 1995.
Those genestealer sprues have been around since the 1st space hulk release, I had them around 1988 while I was still in school, which is weird because I am clearly not that old... 😆
2003 --> old stuff?
That really makes me feel old.
Man, I remember when the Armageddon campaign boom came out in third edition, I was immediately intrigued by the Salamanders and Black Templars. Over 20 years later, I’ve completed my Salamanders, and with the 9e BT codex supp on the horizon, I think it’s finally time to start Black Templars, and if they look anything like yours, it’ll be awesome.
Hey! Very nice video! And I still have 70 oldschool 3-6 ed. Black Templar Marines with about 20 Primaris added to their force ^^ Love how You make the Shoulder Pad creamy colour!
The Army Painter Banshee Brown is a good creamy colour and goes through the airbrush well.
All of the Templars look so great.
Sure they can! I believe in my brothers' skill to change the odds in their favor!
AK Interactive colors go very well through airbrushes, they even have a cream color that color matches Vallejo
I love mixing in old models in. Makes the army look so cool. Yours looks sweet.
Love the intro 💕
Thank you Jay.
3:30 That quote actually got adapted into the song "Legion" by Galaxy Aflame
I realise this is a late response, but my friend suggested to me to use Vallejo Pale Grey Blue. Not quite so creamy, but a cold white that he applied over a black primer in one single coat with great coverage.
I know I'm a year late buuuut Titan Buff from Golden acrylics is a FANTASTIC off-white color for me!
Love the vids Jay!
As someone who actually lives and grew up in Nottingham, I have to take this opportunity to point out that you Americans always hilariously over pronounce the 'ham' in any British place name. I'm sure you think you're saying it correctly, but us Brits do all have a bit of a giggle every time we hear it. We're arseholes like that.
It's not Notting-HAM. We say it more like NOTTING-um. If we're trying to sound posh we might enunciate the 'ham' a little better, but we would never put the emphasis on it like you do.
By the way, those models were already 10 years old in 2003, having been replaced by a (far superior) multipart kit in 1998 when 3rd edition was released. However those models hold so much nostalgia for anyone who played 2E and will always be a classic. I've never seen that box before, but I assume they were trying to sell off the last few of them or something! The genestealers were the ones from the original space hulk.
Meh. Ham is delicious.
You should EMBRACE the HAM.
gotcha so it's more notting-PORK not notting HAM
We folks across the pond eat way too much pork so the emphasis on the last syllable is probably cholesterol-based LOL
And according to Connor from the Trash Taste podcast, Brits like to complain about everything as well😁.
Can you confirm or deny?
@@AluminiumRabbit I'm English and can confirm this.
I still use my beaky marines from 93. Though they have been stripped a few times. And have settled as Dark Angels.
Eldar player here, I've done a few newer armies for previous editions that I've since sold off, but I'm currently working on a 2E retro army, with the one piece metal guardians and aspect warriors. The old models are (like marines) a little smaller and less dynamic looking, but full of charm.
Plus a lot of the current models are just the same sculpts in fine cast.
"long range close combat weapons" love it!
Loved this video, they look fantastic! This is such a weird comment, but I’ve always been super anxious about applying decals but you’re always so enthusiastic about them that it makes me want to try applying more!
Jay: 2003, classic
Me still playing with models from 1989 to 1992: hold my brush...
3:18 It was considered inviting bad luck with your rolls if you had unpainted models, was a running joke.
i had those old school marines in my blood angel army circa 95 -97
I went to a construction sight with a coffee can, and a spoon.
Yes a spoon.
Blast from the past here lol. Used to have some of those exact minis, painted in the same colour scheme too! I never saw anyone else collect Black Templars during my time doing 40k, real nice to see.
Interesting I got this recommend cuz today I received four of these marines painted as Ultramarines. They look cool.
My classic SM that I bought over 20 year's ago were not in blue plastic. They were grey, with black slotted bases.
I really wonder about that “painted models perform better” - because it irks me that, I had painted up this DeathGuard heavy gunner for my son’s KillTeam - and I literally threw an entire full KillTeam of SpaceMarines to kill the damn thing - AND IT SURVIVED. Not only did it survive - but it single handedly DESTROYED 3 of those SpaceMarines - before getting sniped by the last remaining SpaceMarine warrior. But man - that was the only model painted up to display standard compared to the others on the board and it was tough as nails!!
Those space marines sculpts are actually older than 2003 - though they might've been made then. By 2003 the three piece design had been replaced by pose-able multi part marines. Back then, these marines were still being made (or at least sold), but they only came in the starter paint set.
Also that box features the old style paint pots. By 2003 the paint pots in this kit would've been black topped hexagonal pots. However IIRC there were starter paint sets like this one that had the new style pots inside with the old style pots on the box artwork.
I think they were the mid 90's starter box sculpts for the marines. If not, they're just like I remember them.
I love the retro models. There's excellence in simplicity.
Regarding the cream/ bone color: Try AK Interactive range of paints, the majority of them are made specifically for airbrush use.
I use them, despite being a brush only person!
Those look great! I also love your unique style for Black Templar...definitely an improvement.
still in love with my xv15 stealthsuides
It was massively popular in 2000. Shops in most towns in the UK and all over the world
These models look great! The new models are better but that doesn't make the old ones bad! And the paint job and bases are great!
I'm just really into older warhammer. I think the old sculpts just have so much more heart.
Me too! Is there any kind of community on youtube (or anywhere for that matter) of like-minded older 40K enthusiasts like you and I that you know of, or anyone knows of, like for 3rd through 7th Edition era? That's my favorite era of 40K and for me that was peak 40K, can anyone please point me towards that, so I don't have to just keep hearing about how great the generic-as-fuck-looking, could-be-from-Halo-or-literally-any-unoriginal-non-gothic-non-grimdark-sci-fi-setting "Primarily Ass" marines are, please? No offense, to anyone who loves them, I just really don't prefer them. :(
my first copy of 40k was the 2nd edition box with the blood angels on the front (was space marines and orks) and you got a cardboard cutout of a dreadnought and Killa kan. They were too stingy to give us plastic ones (in fact plastic ones didn't exist back then, that's probably why. we only had metal ones)
when my little brother got into the hobby, his first box had an actual plastic dreadnought in it. He ended up giving all the space marine minis to me as well, as he collected orks. This was definitely via influence of my step dad though (who didn't really understand that they were a horde army and he'd never be able to realistically field a proper army with them on a childs pocket money and paper round money)
When I came back into the picture, I explained to him about how space marines are usually better to start with as you require far fewer minis to play a proper game. He almost started Black templars, but as I was doing Blood Angels at the time, he picked Tyranids instead so we could be mortal enemies. I actually bought him a 1k points army to get started. Was cool when he was younger and would get into hobbies with me. He did get into 40k after I'd moved out of home though, so it was totally by chance as well that we'd have that in common when I came back home years later.
In my opinion, you may not want to take those genestealers off the sprues... but it's doing them a disservice. They are begging you to play with them, to assemble them and construct all of their terrifying glory. It's ultimately your choice, but a mini left on its sprue is a mini that will never see the excitement of the tabletop.
"A time capsule" that's how i did my orks. Your templar would look amazing with them
Long-range close combat weapons...Sigismund is proud of you, battle-brother
20:35 I love those cream-colored shields.
18:35 top right corner with rockerlauncher
18:38 2 marines upp from bottom and 2 in from left
18:42 far top right with bolter
thats the 3 diffrent once i could find so pretty solid
Pale sand
You did a good job making them look like they fit in with the bigger marines of modern times
Jay, ProAcryl Olive Flesh or Ivory might be the cream paint you need. Airbrushes like a dream.