Not in this case. No Females around too see it. And I said "Females" not "women". Females as in any thing Female from a horta to a kazinti to a Breen. 😂😂😂
other kirk: he’s fake shoot him kirk: shoot both of us, it’s the only way to save the enterprise spock: *shoots the other kirk* the REAL kirk would never pass up a chance to die for the enterprise
Spock's decision as I see it was based solely on the fact that Kirk told him to stun both of them. The shapeshifter would not demand Spock to do so because he would reshape into his real form. Only the real Kirk would have nothing to hide, since he is, in fact, truly Kirk.
@@fierysage6521 I think he just realized Kirk cared for the ship. Because in the other case, if he just said shoot both, without adding about the safety of the Enterprise, he could've been bluffing, and well, that wouldn't be the first time
If I was in Spock's place, I would've started talking trash about Garth and not let up. Kirk may advise against insults, but Garth's ego would never tolerate it.
Alex Palmer Are you kidding? Do ye not remember the slew of insults Kirk hurled at Spock in another episode when he was trying to make him angry enough to snap out of a trance induced by poppy-like plants? 😂
Why not just ask both of them a better question, like what's my wife's name? The real Kirk should have no trouble with this, Garth would have no clue. This is a fantastic episode, with wonderful performances by Steve Ihnat as Garth and Yvonne Craig as Marta.
Another good idea but I think when Kirk says just shoot both of us for the safety it shows Captain Kirk would sacrifice himself in order for better outcome.
@@redpyre Yes. Originally Garth was supposed to punch Spock and knock him out. Nimoy objected because it was against established rules. Spock is stronger than an ordinary human and no blow from a human - Garth was human just with this shape shifting ability should be able to knock him out.
You could kick your own ass, press assault charges,have yourself locked up then go bail yourself out. All in a days work,provided you don't die laughing!
When Spock saw the two of them . He said a clue . But he waited til one of the captains made the first move. William Shatner and Leonard Niony are both terrific actors
If Spock had known that stunning would cause the disguise to end, he could have just stunned them both from the beginning. The STUN capability of a phaser makes so many of our present-day techniques obsolete.
Except, if you know Spock, he is logical to the core and strictly by the Starfleet rule book (at this point in his career). Assault on an superior officer is a serious criminal act. Basically, he won't do that unless Kirk to give him the order, which Kirk kind of did...Finally. He made a calculated guess and happened to shoot Garth first. Its Kirk who should have told Spock, "Shoot us both! I gave you an order."
I agree with Spock the real captain Kirk would rather give his life than risk the ship and also you remember from a previous episode Spock said that striking an officer is a court marshal offence which he would probability want to avoid purely logical Arya daughter of Spock.
He tried that. First he asked (I think) about their last chess game. But Kirk probably doesn't remember chess moves the way Spock does. Then the next question that came to mind could be answered by almost anyone. Waiting was more logical....100% chance of success eventually.
The chess question was pre-discussed in this episode. Even Scotty was made aware of it on the ship. It was meant as a code before beaming up. Kirk was fully aware of it.
Why didn't Spock just stun them both, right from the start? I know, I know, he delayed so we could have drama and action. Spock's eyebrow raise and look of bemusement upon encountering the two Kirks is priceless. That was always the best part of watching Star Trek as kid: the episodes where Shatner battles the villain mano-a-mano.
Exactly, that would have been the most logical expedient choice, like taking care of the heartbeat in the transporter room. Besides it was only stunning and they have medical gear to fix lots of stuff.
@@Slashkamr Not exclusively. In "The Return of the Archons," Captain Kirk and Mr. Spock used hand phasers on that setting to subdue the Beta III inhabitants during Landru's attack on the landing party via the Body. You are thinking of "A Piece of the Action," when Kirk ordered the _Enterprise_ to perform an orbital strike to neutralize Okmyx's and Krako's gangs.
Does anyone know how the effect of having two Captain Kirks in the same room was achieved? I imagined that 60s technology would've made this very difficult, but I'm not really sure. Also, I wonder if it's possible to keep note of who is who throughout the whole fight so we can know who was the actual Kirk as soon as Spock entered the room.
They called the technique a "split screen" where 2 different shots are joined together as one. If you'll notice in the scene Spock in the background and the 2 Kirks are in the foreground, it's Shatner and I'm guessing his stuntman I think Ed Paskey was his name with Shatner on the left and Paskey on the right. With them facing away they didn't need to use the split screen effect.
Split screen was popular in the sixties but the limitation was that there had to be a distinct vertical line separating the two shots comprising the actor protraying the twin. Also the audio from each character was more easily handled if presented sequentially. (Harder to edit otherwise) Fight scenes had to be choreographed and edited with a stunt double so that only the principle actor's face was shown at any time. Lots of work, but doable.
It can be a multiple exposure technique (simplest) or two negatives overlaid on an optical printer with very precise masking (looks better but can blur at the seam between the shots). This clip has been digitally remastered to look better as well. Either way the camera must be locked and all background detail, including lighting, must match exactly.
Gotta say, it's high time that casting found a stunt double with a really keen likeness to Shatner. It's really hard to tell them apart when they were wrestling, even though what you see of their faces is limited. Good thing Nimoy knew who to shoot. Otherwise, there goes TOS. 😂
So.... I assume Spock shot to stun which caused the antagonist to reveal himself. That begs the question of why he did not stun them both and let it sort itself out. And that was a bone head move with the chair, Spock.
@@BedsitBob Is that a Red Dwarf reference I see? I absolutely love the show!!😃 ( I know you wrote this comment a while ago, so you might not even see this but I just had to reply)
Reminds me of a scene in Star Trek VI when Martia the shape shifter turns into Kirk's double and the Klingons try to determine which is the real Kirk. of course this came first .
Thought the Kirks, when they were fighting on the floor, would roll around and rollover Spock. It was like a prelude to the Kirks fight in ST VI: The Undiscovered Country.
The fake Kirk reminds me of the two women in the Bible when they both claimed that the baby 👶 was their. The fake mother said told Solomon to kill the baby & the other said spare it. The fake Kirk said shoot yet the real one said shoot us both to ensure the safety of the enterprise. Classic moment.
Spock should have ask the logical question: “What side of my butt houses a large black mole, the left or right? Only the REAL Captain Kirk would know.”
Reminds me of an episode of "Karate Kat" where he's fighting his evil double. The Smart Guy of the series knocks out the evil double, and Karate Kat asks him how he could tell which was the right one. Smart Guy says "Oh, it was easy. I knocked out the one who was winning."
Yes, but it seems that Spock was turned around by the blow and by the time he looked back, the two Kirks were fighting it out. He couldn't tell which of the two had hit him.
@@apsoypike1956 Pillow Blindness. Remember the GIF set? And honestly interlocking fingers of both hands for a mega hit will give you no range and break your fingers if you actually land a blow.
Even as an 8 year old kid when I saw this episode on the family B & W TV for the first time, I wondered- "Why didn't Mr. Spock just outright shoot them BOTH? It's STUN SETTING! He wasn't risking killing ANYONE!"
The fake Kirk said to shoot the other one, because he's maintaining an illusion which will disappear when he's stunned. The real Kirk said to stun them both because he has nothing to hide. Spock realized that the one who said to shoot the other was fake Kirk so just shot him. It's similar to King Solomon and the baby decision. He said he'd slice the baby in two, and found the real mother that way. Of course if both Kirks said to stun the other, he could just go ahead and do both, but after the real Kirk showed that he cared about the Enterptise more than himself, that became unnecessary.
Spock was just waiting for the real Kirk to rip his shirt. It was really only a matter of time.
Not in this case. No Females around too see it.
And I said "Females" not "women".
Females as in any thing Female from a horta to a kazinti to a Breen. 😂😂😂
@@jackgibsxxx0750 If it's Acturian it doesn't matter!
This trick will be repeated years later on a Klingon prison planet.
"That shirt cannot be maintained indefinitely. And I have time."
"Because rips.. rips are our business!" 😮
"Spock! Can't you tell I'm your Captain?! That other guy looks like a stuntman!"
*two Kirks fighting dramarically in an epic showdown*
Meanwhile... Spock sitting on the floor doing eenie-meanie-miney-mo in his head.
spock would already know the end result of that sequence, esp in a binary set, is easily determined by the initial choice
The next time this happens , it's up to the Klingons to decide: Star Trek 6.
2:27 the fake grunts.
Speculation on Spock's thoughts here depends very much on what type of fan is doingbthe speculating.
other kirk: he’s fake shoot him
kirk: shoot both of us, it’s the only way to save the enterprise
spock: *shoots the other kirk* the REAL kirk would never pass up a chance to die for the enterprise
Neither was going to die. The phaser was on stun.
the story was that the real Kirk was depleated from imprisonment hence was the logical one to loose the fight. Hence he shot the one with the chair.
Spock's decision as I see it was based solely on the fact that Kirk told him to stun both of them. The shapeshifter would not demand Spock to do so because he would reshape into his real form. Only the real Kirk would have nothing to hide, since he is, in fact, truly Kirk.
@@fierysage6521 I think he just realized Kirk cared for the ship. Because in the other case, if he just said shoot both, without adding about the safety of the Enterprise, he could've been bluffing, and well, that wouldn't be the first time
That is logical
If I was in Spock's place, I would've started talking trash about Garth and not let up. Kirk may advise against insults, but Garth's ego would never tolerate it.
And if it had been 2 Scottys just start talking trash about you know what and that's all it would take.
😂😂😂😂
Alex Palmer Are you kidding? Do ye not remember the slew of insults Kirk hurled at Spock in another episode when he was trying to make him angry enough to snap out of a trance induced by poppy-like plants? 😂
Just ask Kirk about the preceeding episode.
Garth would be clueless.
Why not just ask both of them a better question, like what's my wife's name? The real Kirk should have no trouble with this, Garth would have no clue. This is a fantastic episode, with wonderful performances by Steve Ihnat as Garth and Yvonne Craig as Marta.
Another good idea but I think when Kirk says just shoot both of us for the safety it shows Captain Kirk would sacrifice himself in order for better outcome.
When I saw this scene long ago I had this response, "What's the problem, Spock? Put your phaser on stun and shoot them both right away."
Exactly then tie them both up and get Bones to come in and determine who's who. But that would have been not as dramatic.
Leonard Nimoy wrote a long letter to the producers because this scene made no sense lol
@@redpyre Yes. Originally Garth was supposed to punch Spock and knock him out. Nimoy objected because it was against established rules. Spock is stronger than an ordinary human and no blow from a human - Garth was human just with this shape shifting ability should be able to knock him out.
"Hey Bob, we need you to double for Shatner for some Shatner on Shatner action."
"What? Again!? How many times does this guy get duplicated?"
Lol! Right. I can think of at least 3 others.
"I can't believe I kissed you."
"Must have been your lifelong ambition."
it probably was. let's not kid ourselves, kirk would do kirk.
"Isn't it about time you became someone else?"
"I like it here".
@@barneys4236 "Well, well, well..."
Spock found himself in a “King Solomon’s choice” situation and was given a similar solution to his conundrum.
I came here for that comment.
Now I understand Kirk's comment at the end of the episode. Thanks!
I was thinking exact same thing
If I had to fight myself, I’d die laughing
Pure class. lmao.
You could kick your own ass, press assault charges,have yourself locked up then go bail yourself out. All in a days work,provided you don't die laughing!
BigNoseDoggie
So will the other one!
From the UK , very amusing, made me laugh.
Kirk gets to do that twice. Here and Star Trek VI The Undiscovered Country.
"I've got two guns, one for each of you"
Love the Tombstone homage ❤️
Those fight scenes looked so real when I was 10 years old.
The DW Ray guns where they just flash a light and the actor flies backwards
I enjoy how 60s television used real stand-ins instead of the fake CGI digital faces of today
Sure, because nothing helps keep the immersion like an obvious look at a stuntman's face.
Because CGI didn’t exist then. This wasn’t really a look at the 23rd Century.
They still use stunt doubles, a lot more than you may realize.
When i watched this fight scene for the first time, my brother yelled, "Spock, shoot the body double!" XD
For some reason at 2:04 for a split second I thought "no it's the chair, the chair is Garth"
11/10 For the fighting scene.
Vinzhionald Radam g
I just love how Garth puts the chair down before he falls to the ground! :) Flawless :D
Can't mess up the room
When Spock saw the two of them . He said a clue . But he waited til one of the captains made the first move. William Shatner and Leonard Niony are both terrific actors
“I’ve got more important things to do than play Choose the Changeling!” - O’Brien, a century later
The one time you see William Shatner actually fight his Stunt Double.
Just like when Sean Connery gets to fight his stunt double in Thunderball!
@Tejesh Patel they didn't fight.
It happens again in 'The Undiscovered Country.'
If Spock had known that stunning would cause the disguise to end, he could have just stunned them both from the beginning.
The STUN capability of a phaser makes so many of our present-day techniques obsolete.
Except, if you know Spock, he is logical to the core and strictly by the Starfleet rule book (at this point in his career). Assault on an superior officer is a serious criminal act. Basically, he won't do that unless Kirk to give him the order, which Kirk kind of did...Finally. He made a calculated guess and happened to shoot Garth first. Its Kirk who should have told Spock, "Shoot us both! I gave you an order."
The great Steve Ihnat. He left us way too soon.
For Captain James T Kirk, the safety of the USS Enterprise is a priority.
I agree with Spock the real captain Kirk would rather give his life than risk the ship and also you remember from a previous episode Spock said that striking an officer is a court marshal offence which he would probability want to avoid
purely logical
Arya
daughter of
Spock.
Biblical reference. King Soloman and the two women who are in dispute over a baby.
Yes I could not agree more, purely logical
Anna Finlayson martial
Michael Fawcett. Ya
Spock was just waiting for one them to go on about a Priceline commercial.
That would have nailed it for him..
Oldsmobile?
Being stunned must hurt like the dickens.😂😂
Couldn't Spock have asked Kirk a personal question like his last pon farr experience or who his parents are?
He tried that. First he asked (I think) about their last chess game. But Kirk probably doesn't remember chess moves the way Spock does. Then the next question that came to mind could be answered by almost anyone. Waiting was more logical....100% chance of success eventually.
The chess question was pre-discussed in this episode. Even Scotty was made aware of it on the ship. It was meant as a code before beaming up. Kirk was fully aware of it.
I misread that as “his last porn star experience”
@@itwontcomeout5678 Well, I suppose it's somewhat related lmao
@@itwontcomeout5678 same thing really...
Spock: "Jim, I understand you feel great disappointment over the current situation, but there's no need to beat yourself up."
Stun them both right away, but no dramatic climax.
Captain Garth...It's Wayne's World! Party time! Excellent!
It's a good thing Shatner was able to evoke this episode during his momentary breakdown with the Trekkies.
I think it was another episode when a transporter malfunction made good Kirk and evil Kirk.
@@AlanSmitheeman Also the android duplicator.
That stuntman had a very rare treat…he got to fight James T. Kirk….while BEING James T.Kirk!
the hammiest actor is probably the real Kirk..make em both do shakespeare.....
That’s where Shatner started anyway.
“TO BE.
OR NOT.
TO BE.”
Oh shit.
Was Christopher Plummer Shatnering in Star Trek 6?
"Rosebud"
or recite "Lucy in the sky ...'
@@Smeginator hah XD so true hehe so very true :)
@@marchess286 Not in a primetime slot on TV!
Spock shot after using logic to determine only a righteous man like Kirk would call for his own demise to save the many
The Wisdom of Solomon.
It's the one on your left, Spock! The Shatner stand-in! Stun him! 😁
1:40 "Agreed Captain.....Captains."
Why didn't Spock just stun them both, right from the start? I know, I know, he delayed so we could have drama and action. Spock's eyebrow raise and look of bemusement upon encountering the two Kirks is priceless. That was always the best part of watching Star Trek as kid: the episodes where Shatner battles the villain mano-a-mano.
Exactly, that would have been the most logical expedient choice, like taking care of the heartbeat in the transporter room. Besides it was only stunning and they have medical gear to fix lots of stuff.
He couldn't shoot both when he entered they were standing too far apart...
@@Slashkamr Not unless he set the phaser to wide-angle stun. Then again, that move gets employed in but a few _Star Trek_ episodes.
@@verentyee5413 Wasn't wide angle stun a ship maneuver at that stage?
@@Slashkamr Not exclusively. In "The Return of the Archons," Captain Kirk and Mr. Spock used hand phasers on that setting to subdue the Beta III inhabitants during Landru's attack on the landing party via the Body. You are thinking of "A Piece of the Action," when Kirk ordered the _Enterprise_ to perform an orbital strike to neutralize Okmyx's and Krako's gangs.
I would have asked "Capt Kirk how many yomen have you slept within the past solar month?'
Stun them both and see which one changes. Or a mind meld would do too.
Does anyone know how the effect of having two Captain Kirks in the same room was achieved? I imagined that 60s technology would've made this very difficult, but I'm not really sure. Also, I wonder if it's possible to keep note of who is who throughout the whole fight so we can know who was the actual Kirk as soon as Spock entered the room.
For shots where you had to see Shatner's faces, I'd assume some sort of very literal splicing was used, but I'm no expert admittedly.
They called the technique a "split screen" where 2 different shots are joined together as one. If you'll notice in the scene Spock in the background and the 2 Kirks are in the foreground, it's Shatner and I'm guessing his stuntman I think Ed Paskey was his name with Shatner on the left and Paskey on the right. With them facing away they didn't need to use the split screen effect.
Split screen was popular in the sixties but the limitation was that there had to be a distinct vertical line separating the two shots comprising the actor protraying the twin. Also the audio from each character was more easily handled if presented sequentially. (Harder to edit otherwise) Fight scenes had to be choreographed and edited with a stunt double so that only the principle actor's face was shown at any time.
Lots of work, but doable.
Deep fake
It can be a multiple exposure technique (simplest) or two negatives overlaid on an optical printer with very precise masking (looks better but can blur at the seam between the shots). This clip has been digitally remastered to look better as well. Either way the camera must be locked and all background detail, including lighting, must match exactly.
What I love is that when Garth changes shape so does his clothing. How convenient!
What a fantastic show.
2:31 I love how Shatner covers his stuntman's face
No Spock's logic is correct.
Gotta say, it's high time that casting found a stunt double with a really keen likeness to Shatner. It's really hard to tell them apart when they were wrestling, even though what you see of their faces is limited. Good thing Nimoy knew who to shoot. Otherwise, there goes TOS. 😂
They're both wearing wigs and girdles; how can Spock possibly tell them apart?
It’s soooooo good, you forget you’re watching a short clip on UA-cam. D’oh!
The one on the right is obviously a stunt double at least from the back.
So.... I assume Spock shot to stun which caused the antagonist to reveal himself. That begs the question of why he did not stun them both and let it sort itself out. And that was a bone head move with the chair, Spock.
he was low key enjoying seeing his captain getting his butt kicked. Besides, Garth tiring him out would make him more susceptible to the stun
Kirk on Kirk violence!
Fascinating.
They should sing Rocket Man in chorus.
I cannot stop laughing. That's hilarious!
Or Double Vision by Foreigner.
liprandi That would definitely put me in the hospital 😁
Get them both to play the guitar.
Shoot the one who doesn't sound like a ten-thumbed, tone-deaf, talent-less noise polluter.
@@BedsitBob Is that a Red Dwarf reference I see? I absolutely love the show!!😃 ( I know you wrote this comment a while ago, so you might not even see this but I just had to reply)
Reminds me of a scene in Star Trek VI when Martia the shape shifter turns into Kirk's double and the Klingons try to determine which is the real Kirk. of course this came first .
Garth's fabulous wardrobe, obviously.
I just finished season one Star Trek TOS. On to season two. One of Best TV series of the 60s!
these fight scenes, especially with Kirk, are the catalysts for every cripple fight we've ever watched
That's an insult to every cripple fight we've seen in South Park.
This was like Star Trek meets The Patty Duke Show.
Love the stunt doubles.😂😂😂
Thought the Kirks, when they were fighting on the floor, would roll around and rollover Spock. It was like a prelude to the Kirks fight in ST VI: The Undiscovered Country.
The fake Kirk reminds me of the two women in the Bible when they both claimed that the baby 👶 was their. The fake mother said told Solomon to kill the baby & the other said spare it. The fake Kirk said shoot yet the real one said shoot us both to ensure the safety of the enterprise. Classic moment.
Spock: One of you is clearly a stunt double. *shoots stunt double*
TWISHE......Spock stuns both walking in :)
I grew up on TOS...I love it 😊
One of my favorite episodes
Epic body double selection!
Spock: this gun is on stun, I'll just shoot you both and figure it out later
Captain Kirk, I presume.
"Mommy, my twin brother stole my cookie!"
"Did not."
"King to Queens Level 3?" "Fascinating" :-) ^_^
I always enjoy watching any clip or episode of Star Trek: The Original Series, The Next Generation and DS9 very much.
Please do remain indoors during this quarentine as much as possible. ©®
November 11, 2020 @ 2:00 am ©®
Agree with Spock.
The fight scene was dragging.
Let me take a seat, I have time.
Spock! Look at us from behind! We look very different from the rear!
Kirk revealed who he was with a King Solomon type of response.
2:40 Spock just chillin
My fsvorite funny scene when he turns into kirk an throes a fit
2:27 when a fight breaks out on the short bus
Spock should have ask the logical question:
“What side of my butt houses a large black mole, the left or right?
Only the REAL Captain Kirk would know.”
Reminds me of an episode of "Karate Kat" where he's fighting his evil double. The Smart Guy of the series knocks out the evil double, and Karate Kat asks him how he could tell which was the right one. Smart Guy says "Oh, it was easy. I knocked out the one who was winning."
Kirk: Spock...How did you know?
Spock: Just had to wait and shoot the one whose face I never actually saw during the fight Captain.
The scene with two kirks from Star Trek 6 The Undiscovered Country is very very similar to this...
yes I quit agree
but the shape shifter was Hot, Hot , Hooooooooot! Did I mention she was hot?
I want the chameloids back already. Discovery brought back the Orions, I say bring on the bronze-skinned beauties too!
Ah! The “two Kirk” scenario. Repeated in “The Undiscovered Country.”
I think Spock could have assumed that the "Kirk" who lunged at and struck him as he tried to sit down was Captain Garth. 🙂
Yes, but it seems that Spock was turned around by the blow and by the time he looked back, the two Kirks were fighting it out. He couldn't tell which of the two had hit him.
@@paulchapman603 Fair enough 🙂
@@whatisawwhenisaw3322 Also, Plot Armor.
Love the obvious stunt double
This was an awesome scene here.
For such a low budget show, they had quite a few exceptionally good theatrical guest actors.
All spock would have to do is see that the impostor is a stage actor lol
The effect is surprisingly good for 1968
The real Kirk should of done a drop kick. No one else in the universe can pull off that move.
@@apsoypike1956 Pillow Blindness. Remember the GIF set? And honestly interlocking fingers of both hands for a mega hit will give you no range and break your fingers if you actually land a blow.
Even as an 8 year old kid when I saw this episode on the family B & W TV for the first time, I wondered- "Why didn't Mr. Spock just outright shoot them BOTH? It's STUN SETTING! He wasn't risking killing ANYONE!"
Might've put Shatner's hair piece at risk.
lord garth..master of all he surveyed
Why not just stun both in the end?
Perhaps he was no up so stunning his captain
jerome96114 Cause he only has one phaser
The fake Kirk said to shoot the other one, because he's maintaining an illusion which will disappear when he's stunned. The real Kirk said to stun them both because he has nothing to hide. Spock realized that the one who said to shoot the other was fake Kirk so just shot him. It's similar to King Solomon and the baby decision. He said he'd slice the baby in two, and found the real mother that way. Of course if both Kirks said to stun the other, he could just go ahead and do both, but after the real Kirk showed that he cared about the Enterptise more than himself, that became unnecessary.
Check the hair... Garth won't be wearing a piece.
This is one of my favorite TOS episodes but I cannot determine why...
Thank you and down the HALL 😊😊❤❤❤🎉
1:40 "Agreed.... Captain............Captains."
Ich hatte eigentlich nach der Folge mit dem Teleporter und den 2 Captain Kirk gesucht, aber das war auch gut 👍
Yup, classic Salomon King maneuver
Spock should have ask Kirk a personal question about all of them adventures that they have been in.
Garth: Do you think it's attractive when Bugs Bunny dresses up like a girl bunny?
Wayne: No. haha. NO.
Spock: Highly illogical.
Kirk: You'll have to shoot both of us to save the Enterprise
Spock: (No hesitation) Yep that's him