As a mechanical engineer I think it makes sense. It's basically a spring -damper system. These basic systems can be highly tuned to specific cases (speaker weight, floor type, etc.) but one should be able to make those very cheap (20-50 a piece dollars at most), if looks are less important. It technically works but it's still a bit of audio jewellery. By the way, (only) if you know what specs you need, you can easily select an industrial product for way less. Those are used for highly accurate machines like pick-and-place machines for electronic parts. It will look very simple though.
@@jessewebber9245 Sorbothane calculated for proper loading works great. Aim to be half way in the load range for optimum performance. So with 10kg speakers get 4 pucks rated between 1,5 - 4kg each roughly.
@@tylerhackman6832did you use the nobsound pucks under your lintons sitting on the Linton stands or do you have your lintons on another surface?. Are you still using the nobsound pucks?
I was at the show and listened to these too. I was surprised that there was def a difference also. I could tell. It was subtle but def audible. Def will be adding these to my setup. It made me a believer!
Don's pronunciation 12:12 was hilarious! Theo's a real good sport. Gene was momentarily clueless but he had it right from the get go. 😂😂😂 Thank you gentlemen, I needed that. Can't wait to see the entire video asap. Efcharistó
I use GAIA II, with their spikes, on my carpeted floor over a concrete slab. My speakers are Spatial Audio Lab open baffle X3s which weigh about 100 pounds each. An IsoAcoustics competitor did a demo of speaker resonance (it's on UA-cam somewhere). On concrete, believe it or not, speaker resonance creates a "megaphone" effect through the concrete. When I saw/heard that, I was convinced I needed speaker isolation. The GAIA are so popular with X3 owners that the company now sells them with the speakers.
Found the video. The demo begins at the 9 minute mark. Concrete demo around the 13 minute mark. This is the video that convinced me to get the GAIA II. ua-cam.com/video/6G4HF6wJG38/v-deo.html
My house is on a concrete slab. I can definitely see a potential benefit on a timber sub floor but not on a concrete slab. I was going to try my own $50 rubber matting idea but then read how some speakers actually benefit from being grounded to the floor instead of isolated, so I didn’t bother. On a seperate note I put two 12 volt cooling fans behind my cabinet to keep my amp cool, I tried mounting them in different ways but kept getting noise, I decided to decouple them from the cabinet by hanging them using plastic coated electrical wire, no noise now. Mechanical decoupling does have its place.
Great video guys and always nice to see my Greek friend Theo on there...:) I'm surprised that in the video there is only mention of the GAIAs which are the most expensive but the on the low end of the spectrum there is also the ISO-Pucks that work amazing as well for a very low price in comparison - mind you for smaller bookshelf speakers (based on weight and priced accordingly). I heard the big difference on a pair of Bower & Wilkins 706 S2 700 series speakers and the difference in sound was unreal - due to the uncoupling. If you ever thought that your system can't sound any better than what you've been hearing think again. Go to your local audio/video place that has IsoAcoustics and hear them for yourself. You will walk out of the store buying them. What an investment for a total change in sound - top to bottom and overall imaging and separation as well. No snake oil here or placebo effect Gene. Theo and Don are bang on..!!
Tremendous improvement on center channel speaker! I agree 100%. Improved clarity with vocals and most importantly no more annoying resonance from the shelf the speaker is on.
👋🏼 Gene & Don, the great dynamic duo!!! 😂😉😂 Yes, I definitely believe in & use IsoAcoustics gear ✌🏼. I would have never believed 3 years ago that I would have spent 1,800.00 on IsoAcoustic gear for my home theater, however doing lots of research & doing my own humble AB testing, with my first purchase for my 2 subwoofers, oh yah! I’m a “🎵believer 🎵” (hey hey were the 🙉‘s….sorry I degressed). Over the last few years, I slowly purchased my ISO gear & NEVER have regretted it. My main reason for my initial purchase was to de-couple my subwoofers, to minimize the output because I live in a apartment (both sides of my walls I have neighbors, one on my left & one on my right 🤦🏽♂️). Little did I believe that my base would be tighter & have such clarity & solid 🥊). Here is my speaker gear that’s married to my Iso gear 🤙🏼: Center- Martin Logan 50XTi (ISO- Aperta 300) Main Left & Right- Martin Logan 40i (ISO- 2 sets of GaiaIII) Front L&R Surround- Martin Logan 20i (ISO- 2 sets of GaiaIII) L&R Surround- Martin Logan 30i (ISO- Aperta300) Rear L&R Surround- Martin Logan 30i (ISO- Aperta300) 2 Subwoofers- Martin Logan Dynamo 800X (ISO- Iso200Sub for each Sub) (Eventually upgrade to the GaiaIII for each subwoofer) Peace ✌🏼 my friends 💪🏼
Always appreciate these live Streams. I have an IsoAcoustics stand for my SVS Ultra Center Channel and it opened the sound stage and made dialog even more clear. And it allowed proper positioning and height adjustments. Definitely worth the investment to decouple speakers imo.
Here’s a tip. You can get the ISO-puck (their pro-audio model) from ISO-acoustics for half the price as the Orea. Very similar isolation system and performance except it doesn’t have the premium look. Great way to save if the look of it isn't as important and still get really good performance.
Hi guys - have any of you seen Max Townshend's videos about decoupling loudspeakers from the floor? That is what convinced me to try it. I have used very low-tech silicone feet and was BLOWN AWAY by the huge difference it made with enormous increase in the mid and high frequencies which had previously sounded dull and muted from my KEF Reference III-2 which are exceptionally good loudspeakers. I am so pleased i did this. I recommend checking out the videos from Townshend Audio on this topic. All the best, Rob in Switzerland
I could tell immediately on the first track. I was surprised. I thought that it would take several listening sessions to decide how the sound was affected. The Bass and Drums had more punch and depth, the soundstage and vocals too were better I think due to a lack of smear from the bottom end.
I'm using a pair of KEF Reference 1 nearfield in a production environment on a pair of custom ISO Acoustics stands. They definitely sound different from the stands I was using previously. Not better, not worse...but different. You can like or not what these devices do, but there's no doubt they are doing something.
I got isoacoustic feet for my turntable because I wanted feet with height adjustment and some vibration isolation since it sometimes skipped a bit if someone with heavy feet walks past it (namely me). Not sure how much it changed the sound but the vibration isolation was absolutely helpful
Here is the issue that some, including me will have, Theo said "can you give me". Excellent you were given them, these are expensive for what they "might do". I'm a believer in decoupling speakers, especially subs but these products are expensive.
Very good, I think these would make a big difference. I have 1st edition Canton Vento Reference 7’s with built in shock absorbers. I didn’t think they isolated the speakers enough from wood floors so I use IKEA cutting boards under with good results but I still want the Gaia 2’s. If you want to save money the cutting boards help a lot. Credit to Shawn at Zero Fidelity.
I got the Gaia III and used them on my Marten Duke 2 with its original stands. Yes … there’s a tightening up of the bass and with that, the mids and highs end up cutting through better. But when I used them with my Harbeth P3ESR, I did not get much difference. Maybe it’s because there are some isolation pads between the P3ESR and the top of their stand. I wish it was easier to adjust the Gaia III as we level the speakers.
The Gaia’s do work for sure. But I tried a much cheaper offering from AudioBastion from China , ofc it’s a simpler structure but it works giving sharper imaging , cleaner more focused voice , better soundstage - for abt 1/5 the price. I’m not sure how much better the Gaia’s sound tho, as I haven’t had the chance to AB them side by side
I demo'd these at AXPONA, exact speakers shown. Personally I have not heard anything drastically different. I will say there is a difference for certain, however it is very small. I am not certain if the effect was minimized because it was on a carpet or not, so clearly it may minimize the effect. The demo had a 15 second switch, which worked automatically. No one did the change, I attempted to neglect which one is on and listen with my eyes closed to increase my hearing and perception. You definitely can hear a difference, but I cannot justify the price to performance. If you got carpet and nice padding under with a solid floor, a floor which is not floating. The difference will be fairly slim and I feel it's not worth it. My last paragraph is a great tip/advice for carpet owners. I think they covered all these points in the video, not certain if it's better but it is doing something. I personally own the aperta 200 for speakers that are fairly light, specifically for angling my surrounds. I used them in stereo as well, it personally again feels like it did nothing. They said it increases sound stage, this and that, and I could not get that. I will say for certain that vibration did drastically decrease in the room, my apartment has a floating floor; the sub flooring. By this I mean there's an empty space between the actual ground and sub floor, the hardwood under the padding/carpet or vinyl flooring. So basically my place is very susceptible to huge resonance into the structure, each of the beams in my floor go into the beams on the wall so it can really increase the rattle. What I did as I had a recent remodel/renovation is in my theater room and bedroom where I have stereo setups I ended up investing about 200 dollars to get a very thick and higher weight dispersion under carpet padding. I believe this is referred to as rebound padding, the one I chose is a 12lb density which is the highest possible one I believe for regular priced common upgrades. I figure any higher than that would be custom made and probably overkill for use and price. This did wonders for vibrations in the walls and best part is you can use it for any amount of speakers rather than purchase isoacoustics for each speaker and I have it in 3 rooms.
I wonder how the GAIA compares to a Sorbothane disc or pad that you get from Amazon. They have a rated Durometer and size based on weight. They might not look as high end as the GAIA, but if performs as well at a fraction of the cost.
I've been thinking about trying these for my Arendal 1723 2S subs in my theater room. They would take the GAIA II I believe. It's in a basement though on concrete underneath; however, it's concrete then underlayment then a hickory engineered hardwood, then pad, then carpet based on how we built the house then did the theater room. So I wonder if/how that wood flooring is affecting things even though it is floated on concrete. Might it still be worth isolation given the wood floor layer? Or does the mass of concrete underneath it still negate any value? Super cool for the Focal 1000 content coming. My theater is all 1000 in-walls with the IWLCR6 as my LCRs plus I have a stereo pair of them in my living room. I really like Focal as a brand. Crossing fingers for great results in the review. I would love some purchase justification confirmation bias!
So Gene I know you used the IsoAcoustics Aperta300 on your Perlisten center. But Perlisten makes a stand. I was wondering if putting Gaia in place of the stand feet would be as good or better? Im thinking it matches the towers better all with Gaia?
Haha awesome. We had almost every demo room using your music as source material. Transients are the sudden changes from loud to soft sounds or vice versa (ie. pop of a snare drum hit or rim shot).
Perhaps we need isolation devices for the feet of the listening chair. Actually, I’m agnostic on this topic. If these isolation devices actually change the sound of Gene’s loudspeakers, what would happen to the sound of those loudspeakers if they were placed on a thick rubber mat without these isolation devices? I’m looking forward to seeing the test results.
I have the ZaZen II platform under my CD player/DAC, Orea isolators under pre-amp and power amp, and Gaia IIs under my Focal Kanta N°2 speakers on carpet disks. 👍
I have my speakers on hard wood in the living room. When I finished my basement with double drywall and rock foam thing that is great for sound insulation , I immediately noticed that the speakers were, for lack of a better word, smaller. The floor and basement were amplifying the sound from the speaker.
While I haven't had any issues with decoupling speakers from my floor (the issue could certainly still exist with other speakers) I have had issues with subwoofers. I've used feet similar to these to fix those subwoofer issues entirely, to the point where I can have a sub standing right next to my seating position and still not locate where the sound comes from. Something softer feet does however is to lower the bass capacity somewhat, which is an obvious effect if you have a less stable base. It's not a big difference but since we're talking small details in hifi then people interested in that should easily hear that, otherwise tweaks are pretty meaningless beyond placebo. It hasn't been a problem for me though as I'm using room correction for the bass frequencies. I am a bit skeptical towards that acoustic dampening feet need to be as expensive as IsoAcoustics' products though, seeing how the feet I completely eliminated any issues from a 16" subwoofer were much cheaper. It's not that they would be expensive compared to my speakers, I'm just making a general observation. Granted those feet I used were made for subs and tower speakers can be a lot heavier so you might design them differently, but speakers also aren't nearly as problematic as subs when it comes to floor resonance.
purchase 24 racketballs, a few muffin pans, plkace balls in pans , place subwoofers on balls, place a sheet of neoprene under the pan if worried about vibration and you will have a better isolation solution than these overpriced feet, cost is like 20 bucks total
First time I saw thoses feets were at the Montreal audio fest and meeted the inventor, who said he went to the tv show dragons den. I was almost laughing inside while seeing it and the laser movements analysis they did to show the difference in the movements. Then my brother in law bought them for his hifi setup and he did a demo to me with and without. I was really impress and didnt really undertood why. Then I added to mine also for my totem acoustic bookshelves speakers and it was night and day. Before the tv stand was transmitting noise and after not. Do the different height has an impact? I guess so. Do just hockey pucks could do the same? Maybe I didnt test. But for sure no matter the reason it works great. Im not a believer of the oil snake cables and magical products or tweaks. But really for some reasons it makes a real difference I can confirm. Mines are the isoacoustics plastic version and not the gaia.
I will say, I just purchased some of the original iso-pucks and put them between my bookshelf speakers and the speaker stands. I put 4 of them, each rated at 20lbs, under my 19.1 lb speakers. First thing I noticed was the high treble. It seemed extreme to me but not in a bad way. I have not measured this to prove my perception but I feel like it improved everything. My speaker stands shelf is smaller than my speaker so they literally had nothing between them, speaker cabinet (no rubber feet) on top a wood type Edifier stand. It's definitely clearer at loud volumes. The pucks are really made well, not like that real cheap stuff I always used. I probably could have gotten away with using the mini pucks but I wanted to do it right. They do say to point the logo facing forward for optimum results.
I'm surprised that you heard an improvement because your pucks are too big for your 19 lb speaker. IsoAcoustics has a chart that says the performance of each 20 lb puck is from 10 lbs-20 lbs, so 4 pucks best performance is between 40-80 lbs. Or you should use 3 pucks so that the best performance is between 30-60 lbs which is closer to your 19 lb speaker.
@@mrpmj00 I could see why some would feel the larger ones would be overkill. I felt they worked just as good as the "mini" pucks (which were the first, cheapest ones I tried) but provided better stability. Same with using 4 over 3 of them. I don't think going over spec diminished how they work..but that might be a question for Iso-Acoustics. I'm definitely a believer in the product & own multiple types. I use them under everything these days...and the Gaia's on my Tower speakers. I had tried all the budget types in the past & feel the Iso's are in a different class. Just my opinion of course.
@@NosEL34 I've just bought the mini pucks yesterday for my 12 lb bookshelf main speakers and now I get goosebumps. Tomorrow the 20 lb pucks will arrive for my 2 subwoofers so I'll see if they improve over the seat cushions that are under them now (and are on carpet). My video: ua-cam.com/video/BD_0f_qyFqg/v-deo.html
@@NosEL34 Not only do I get goosebumps in some songs that I didn’t get before, today I hear faint instruments in the background of Elvis “You don’t know me” even though I’ve listened to it 1,000 times.
Good discussion thank you, always enjoyable. WRT to whether or not it’s a placebo effect or not … at the end of the day, what does it really matter if it is or isn’t. If it sounds good to you on your system, that’s what matters. If. You think it provides “value added” then it’s value added to you on your system. End of argument. Personally, I don’t believe in 3rd party power cables and the expensive speaker cables, etc., but if you like them, on your system, have at it. These IsoAcousitcs Gaia isolation feet make sense … I’m planning try them on my Ohm Walsh 2000s. Thanks again …
Did you switch the speaker pairs on and then off of the speaker stands? If yes, we’re the results the same? I am especially interested to the hand clapping immediacy being a result of the speaker stands or a just a minute difference between the speaker pairs. Thanks
Kudos to Gene for being willing to try this and being honest about what he heard. He still sounds like he believes it could be expectation bias, but wouldn’t his bias be against hearing a difference?
Hi Gene. I have audiocrate spring Isolation speaker feet for my speakers and for my subwoofers I have a pair of IsoAcoustics Iso-L8r200Sub Stands the difference the stands made to Stopping the Vibration and the feet has stopped the other 7 speakers Vibration . on the bookshelves etc. as I live in a small 12x12 room 8 foot ceiling. I have a Yamaha 5.2.2 setup. my atmos speakers are ment to fire up but have so the speakers face down to me. and they work go.
I wonder how the those would compare to the feet that come on the Paradigm founder speakers. Because the paradigm have a rubber decoupler built into the feet.
Not sure where my first comment went, but I’ve got 100F Founders. I called Paradigm direct and they actually advised against using GAII II feet for the very reason you mentioned. You can call and email them as well to verify what I’m saying, but they claimed you’d see little to no benefit?!
@@seanlacroix yes they did. When I called they were super nice and knowledgeable in regards to how the engineers designed the feet and how they work in conjunction with the way the cabinetry is already designed. Paradigms website has a cut away view of the feet and they’re already dampened TWICE…I’m saving my 600 dollars over buying the GAII II
We weren’t minimizing the factor. Some have argued that the sound difference with the Gaia is due to a slight increase in height. That may be true if you were sitting 6-feet from the speaker. The context was that in my situation I’m 14 feet from the speaker and with the second set of speakers there was not really any difference when swapping out the manufacturer feet with the GAIA
@@TheoNicolakis the difference in height can definitely be a factor…as can subfloor, speaker design…it all matters. The height can also impact SBIR and room modes.
@@seanb3303 I'm in agreement with you that height can and is a factor-especially at closer listening distances. I was pretty much a skeptic of these things until I tried them. To contextualize my comments, in my particular use case, the Revel and RBH speakers are over 3-feet from the front wall and in two distantly different listening spaces-each nearly 30 feet long with different ceiling heights. Perhaps Gene can comment on how the demo was set up in the room where he listened to the GAIA. Along that same line of thought, then spikes at the same height would yield identical performance to the GAIA. Nevertheless, at the NRC in Canada, IsoAcoustics used a laservibrometer to measure differences in cabinet resonances. The feet on the RBH were nearly identical in height to the GAIA yet there was a perceived difference there too-and as Gene indicated in the show, the RBH speaker engineer did measure a difference with the GAIA. My point in all of this-as in the review-is that this is an area requiring more study and inquiry to see what factors are playing a role in this and perhaps in what living contexts isolation may make sense.
Sorbothane hemispheres is all I use. Raise subs off floor and use washing machine vibration pad or feet etc... anything more than that is approaching diminishing returns imo
I bet raising the speaker will give similar performance. Use long spikes or wood blocks vs these rubber feet for your a to b. I think decoupling is less likely to be the culprit than adding a couple inches. It's like bringing the speaker off the wall from 1 inch(standard) to 3 inches. The focal has a downward firing port along with the 2 front ports. Might be especially susceptible to getting better room gain with a 2 inch hike. Can't wait to see some measurements.
I heard it at axpona and heard a difference but nothing was a night and day difference. I think it really isn't worth it, I think maybe if you are trying to minimize internal vibration for an apartment it may be something. I own the stands for bookshelves and it to me also did nothing. As stated earlier, I feel like the vibration when the bass hits was less rattle in the walls and floor
@@mikegoddard7354 that would be a good reason. I also found use for this sort of isolation product. My RS150 active speaker resonated with the shelf it was on and then I noticed I could feel the speaker playing through it's sides via vibration that never occurs with my heavier tower speakers. A thick foam pad made the resonation mostly go away for $10 off amazon. Now listening to news/ human voices doesn't sound distorted via reverberation.
Question. Mr. Dunn has a blackout curtain off to his side. Please ask him what kind it is. That is precisely what I am looking for. Love your shows. 👍🏻🇺🇸
So don’t forget that part of the formula is that spikes or some variation of that does allow energy to travel to and through the floor but a certain amount of that reflects back into the speaker cabinet… which is not good. These specialized feet don’t allow these energies and vibrations to reflect back into the cabinet.
I say get a better center channel. I took AHs advice and got the Polk L400. Oh man. I’m glad Polk doesn’t have the brand gravitas as other manufactures. There can’t be that much performance left on the table anywhere near that price point. I wonder if they are even better than some centers 1000s more
Cable lifter is not snake oil because I saw a youtube video of a guy holding a noise detector next to the cable comparing on floor versus on cable lifter.
That's not how you would test that. A proper test is to measure the signal after it has passed through the cable, both with and without raisers. Or you can make it easier and use a null tester where you put a signal through two cables to the tester, one with and one without raisers, and then the null tester will reverse the polarity of one signal so it will only output what is different between the two. All that matters is the electrical signal since that is what is moving the speaker elements, and no one has yet been able to provide any proper evidence of raised speaker cables being different. Many have been able to prove the effects of bias and placebo on acoustic perception though, so that's well established.
I’ve been preaching about floor composition for a good while now and particularly where it has to do with speaker stands and bookshelf speaker isolation or coupling. Addressing the floor materials and support is what determines whether isolation or coupling is used. Basically, concrete floor, concrete with carpet or concrete with rigid tile uses spikes. Even concrete with wood over it and any other floors with wooden support need isolation based on my evaluation. Not being an engineer, I rely on ear tests. Some consider this snake oil. It wasn’t back in the middle 80s when I started working in the audio industry and it isn’t now. Some stuff is, but not this.
Why not use rubber stands for washing machine? Washing machine vibrates much more and is usually much more heavy. They make them rather for hard vibrations ;)
I don’t think concrete is inert as believed. I’m in a basement room and certain frequencies seem to arise that are not airborne, even passing through carpet.
What the heck is happening to you Gene 😱 IsoAcoutics also do have a pro range of products for electronics, not really that pricey, would also be cool to check out and the engineering behind those products. Me and my wifey really wanna go from Norway to Florida for visit.
I almost didn't watch this, because Gene is the most skeptical guy out there. On the same token, I have a paper from an university explaining as to why cable matters. I don't kow if I can post the pdf here. I'd love that Gene have a say on that paper.
they make a big difference... cant say better or worse, it really comes down to individual preference. I use them under my Tekton Moabs, the GAIA i's sound better to me over the standard feet
Townsend seismic platforms are better than iso acoustic feet.i have both. if youve ever seen them together at trade shows ,theres a huge difference in vibration delete
For the Gaia $500 per speaker set has me wondering if it would be better spending the same amount on better speakers. That’s a large sum of money for some de-couplers.
Just checked the Isoacoustics website. Can't say the description is very clear, but seems to indicate compliant feet with various size/compliance optimized to different weight speakers. If this is all it does besides lifting the speakers slightly higher, it's hardly a new idea. I've used compliant feet under my speakers for a couple of decades already, and the difference between these and various types of spike feet is huge (to my ears). The more resonant your floor is, the bigger the difference, even more so if you're using desktop monitors or something along those lines. Not being an engineer, my laymans understanding is that higher compliance lowers the resonance frequency in the system consisting of the foot compliance and the weight suspended on top, creating a mechanical lowpass filter between the speaker and the floor. With spikes this resonance may end up somewhere in the hundreds of Hz. With soft feet (like my cheap synthetic foam "rubber" feet) you get the resonance/cutoff well below the audio band (pushing my speakers and letting go, without any kind of measuring devices I guesstimate something around 2-4 Hz or so). It is interesting in technical terms to compare to spikes, and no surprise the difference is audible. But for advice to potential buyers, I'd say it's far more interesting to compare to compliant feet at lower prices (mine are just over a tenth of the price of the Isoacioustics products).
And a sidenote: Yes, compliant feet work under turntables, at least unsuspended ones like mine over the last three decades. I'd be careful with a suspended TT, though, as they are tuned to similar frequencies. There will be a bit going on with off center records at .55Hz, tonearm/cartridge resonance in the 8-13Hz region, and warped records typically between those, along with the suspension tuning. Adding another resonance in that narrow frequency band is risky, and probably not very beneficial since isolation is already handled by the TT suspension. And another: One of my old fashioned amps has a humming transformer (mechanically). Soft feet under it, and it's dead quiet. It no longer sets the shelf in motion, and I suspect even the amp chassis itself vibrates less.
Hi Gene. I'm excited to try Gaia II feet on my RBH SV6500Rs. But you made a comment around 17:25 about seeing if there are any tonal differences and the Isoacoustics website even measures NO tonal differences (i.e. no difference in the frequency response) but they show differences in the mechanical vibrations. So I don't know or think that you should hear any tonal differences, which makes it harder (and likely makes people skeptical) about what differences they/we might hear, if any.
Oh man, the Evangelical cableist are going to have a feld day with this video 😂. but seriously have the SVS isolation feet on my subs for when I lived in an apartment and I can tell you if you share wall this is these best upgrade that you can do. I don't prefer it because like gean said it takes the tactile bass away, but everyone else in other room i.e. my wife will love them.
@@AbsoluteFidelity it's been a while since I had a look at their paper but don't isoacoustics have the speaker suspended in a sort of swing when they take their measurements? That's hardly representative of a speaker coupled to a concrete floor.
@@Audioholics are you going to test them under various conditions? I'd imagine if vibrations from the speaker are causing vibrations in the room that can't be cured then speaker decoupling may be the lesser evil. If external vibrations can be cured then surely it's better to have a speaker coupled to the huge mass that is the floor. But if isolation really is necessary then isn't experimenting with various rubbers going to be more cost effective also?
Why don't you just publish the video proving 10 for 10 double blind?? I mean, this is sadly typical audiophool gibberish!!!!! How about measurements???? You've already done the K2, so do it with the snake oil gizmo. So do we just toss science out whenever we want? We KNOW that any slight alteration in listening/measuring position can have some effect on perceived frequency response, but is it more than say, a db or two, and really, who even cares? Snake oil is snake oil. You already showed that varying off axis by 10 or 20 degrees does the same sort of thing. What is the big deal other than promulgating typical audiophool nonsense?
1000 dollars is absolutely ridiculous when a bunch of racketballs in a muffin pan does a better job, or use a 3/4 inch sheet of wood and use a hole saw to create 3 inch holes for the racketballs, if you're worried about the pan making noise, lay adhesive neoprene under the wood to furthur decouple the sub or speaker
What are you talking about? The video clearly talks about Gene having the difference demonstrated to him. The fact that he went up to look which speaker was which before they told him doesn't mean that they didn't demonstrate a difference. Quite the contrary since if they weren't able to demonstrate the difference he wouldn't have bothered to go up and check closer.
Rising speakers cables from the floor? Ask some other reviewers. GR Research invited you all to his "command center" Why don't you guys take a trip to Texas? Danny is a nice guy.
Raising speaker cables off the floor is ridiculous and a clear example of Placebo. Sad how people fail to understand the basic physics of signal propagation down a wire. You can't compress thr magnetic field but putting a cable on the ground like some claim.
@@shaolin95 You might be right about Danny. I don't know him and since perception makes reality, in my perception he's a nice guy, but the importan question is: would Audioholics go to Texas to have a first hand experience?
As an alternative to these Canadian products try another import from Canada - official NHL hockey pucks made by Michelin rubber products ! 64.00 US for a set of 8. 🤔
I am sure it makes a physical difference. But how audible? No way to know until a double-blind A/B test is properly done. We are talking about a personal subjective perception of difference without a double-blind A/B test here. The difference is these are Gene's, Theo's & Don's subjective perceptions. But are their subjective percetions more valid than those of others? No one escapes the placebo effect. We should judge these subjective perceptions on those isolatolion feet as we judge others petceptions on differences cables make.
Mostly a valid point except there is an obvious mechanical difference with/without the feet whereas most cables, the electrical differences are either nill or imperceptible. I fully admit I could be a victim of placebo under this scenario.
But even blind testing will be influenced by the environment with this one. If there are unwanted external vibrations that can't be cured then decoupling is probably good. If there aren't any external vibrations then decoupling probably bad. I've no doubt people using decoupling will hear a difference but is it an improvement in how the room is reacting and at the same time a degrading of the speaker's performance? Which outweighs which will change by user case. I'd try various rubber feet and would be interested in seeing Gene throwing washing machine isolation feet or small pieces of rubber under those discs that go under spikes (to stop you damaging your floor) or similar into the mix!!
As a mechanical engineer I think it makes sense. It's basically a spring -damper system. These basic systems can be highly tuned to specific cases (speaker weight, floor type, etc.) but one should be able to make those very cheap (20-50 a piece dollars at most), if looks are less important. It technically works but it's still a bit of audio jewellery. By the way, (only) if you know what specs you need, you can easily select an industrial product for way less. Those are used for highly accurate machines like pick-and-place machines for electronic parts. It will look very simple though.
I have some DIY subwoofers that could benefit from the “industrial product” you mentioned. What should I be looking for?
@@jessewebber9245 Sorbothane calculated for proper loading works great. Aim to be half way in the load range for optimum performance. So with 10kg speakers get 4 pucks rated between 1,5 - 4kg each roughly.
Nobsounds are $50 a pair and you can tweak them with how many springs you run. I’d highly recommend them, they really transformed my Lintons.
Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, but only changes form! These “feet” turns vibration into heat that is dissipated.
@@tylerhackman6832did you use the nobsound pucks under your lintons sitting on the Linton stands or do you have your lintons on another surface?. Are you still using the nobsound pucks?
I bought these last week. They are great. I can hear a definite difference. Not snake oil at all!
I did the Focal Demo with these Isoacoustics and it makes a difference. I think they are fantastic products.
I was at the show and listened to these too. I was surprised that there was def a difference also. I could tell. It was subtle but def audible. Def will be adding these to my setup. It made me a believer!
Don's pronunciation 12:12 was hilarious! Theo's a real good sport. Gene was momentarily clueless but he had it right from the get go. 😂😂😂 Thank you gentlemen, I needed that. Can't wait to see the entire video asap. Efcharistó
I use GAIA II, with their spikes, on my carpeted floor over a concrete slab. My speakers are Spatial Audio Lab open baffle X3s which weigh about 100 pounds each. An IsoAcoustics competitor did a demo of speaker resonance (it's on UA-cam somewhere). On concrete, believe it or not, speaker resonance creates a "megaphone" effect through the concrete. When I saw/heard that, I was convinced I needed speaker isolation. The GAIA are so popular with X3 owners that the company now sells them with the speakers.
Found the video. The demo begins at the 9 minute mark. Concrete demo around the 13 minute mark. This is the video that convinced me to get the GAIA II. ua-cam.com/video/6G4HF6wJG38/v-deo.html
My house is on a concrete slab. I can definitely see a potential benefit on a timber sub floor but not on a concrete slab. I was going to try my own $50 rubber matting idea but then read how some speakers actually benefit from being grounded to the floor instead of isolated, so I didn’t bother.
On a seperate note I put two 12 volt cooling fans behind my cabinet to keep my amp cool, I tried mounting them in different ways but kept getting noise, I decided to decouple them from the cabinet by hanging them using plastic coated electrical wire, no noise now. Mechanical decoupling does have its place.
can you make a video showing your setup?
I put the Gaia 2 on my Martin Logan sequel twos and it really help the Imaging and the detail of the speakers
Great video guys and always nice to see my Greek friend Theo on there...:) I'm surprised that in the video there is only mention of the GAIAs which are the most expensive but the on the low end of the spectrum there is also the ISO-Pucks that work amazing as well for a very low price in comparison - mind you for smaller bookshelf speakers (based on weight and priced accordingly). I heard the big difference on a pair of Bower & Wilkins 706 S2 700 series speakers and the difference in sound was unreal - due to the uncoupling. If you ever thought that your system can't sound any better than what you've been hearing think again. Go to your local audio/video place that has IsoAcoustics and hear them for yourself. You will walk out of the store buying them. What an investment for a total change in sound - top to bottom and overall imaging and separation as well. No snake oil here or placebo effect Gene. Theo and Don are bang on..!!
Tremendous improvement on center channel speaker! I agree 100%. Improved clarity with vocals and most importantly no more annoying resonance from the shelf the speaker is on.
👋🏼 Gene & Don, the great dynamic duo!!! 😂😉😂
Yes, I definitely believe in & use IsoAcoustics gear ✌🏼.
I would have never believed 3 years ago that I would have spent 1,800.00 on IsoAcoustic gear for my home theater, however doing lots of research & doing my own humble AB testing, with my first purchase for my 2 subwoofers,
oh yah! I’m a “🎵believer 🎵” (hey hey were the 🙉‘s….sorry I degressed). Over the last few years, I slowly purchased my ISO gear & NEVER have regretted it.
My main reason for my initial purchase was to de-couple my subwoofers, to minimize the output because I live in a apartment (both sides of my walls I have neighbors, one on my left & one on my right 🤦🏽♂️). Little did I believe that my base would be tighter & have such clarity & solid 🥊).
Here is my speaker gear that’s married to my Iso gear 🤙🏼:
Center- Martin Logan 50XTi
(ISO- Aperta 300)
Main Left & Right-
Martin Logan 40i
(ISO- 2 sets of GaiaIII)
Front L&R Surround-
Martin Logan 20i
(ISO- 2 sets of GaiaIII)
L&R Surround-
Martin Logan 30i
(ISO- Aperta300)
Rear L&R Surround-
Martin Logan 30i
(ISO- Aperta300)
2 Subwoofers-
Martin Logan Dynamo 800X
(ISO- Iso200Sub for each Sub)
(Eventually upgrade to the GaiaIII for each subwoofer)
Peace ✌🏼 my friends 💪🏼
Always appreciate these live Streams. I have an IsoAcoustics stand for my SVS Ultra Center Channel and it opened the sound stage and made dialog even more clear. And it allowed proper positioning and height adjustments. Definitely worth the investment to decouple speakers imo.
Off topic but how do you like that SVS Ultra Center speaker and what did you compare to? thx
Here’s a tip. You can get the ISO-puck (their pro-audio model) from ISO-acoustics for half the price as the Orea. Very similar isolation system and performance except it doesn’t have the premium look. Great way to save if the look of it isn't as important and still get really good performance.
Another tip.
Get the svs soundpath, there are much cheaper, and they get the same result.
Hi guys - have any of you seen Max Townshend's videos about decoupling loudspeakers from the floor? That is what convinced me to try it. I have used very low-tech silicone feet and was BLOWN AWAY by the huge difference it made with enormous increase in the mid and high frequencies which had previously sounded dull and muted from my KEF Reference III-2 which are exceptionally good loudspeakers. I am so pleased i did this. I recommend checking out the videos from Townshend Audio on this topic. All the best, Rob in Switzerland
I bought them too and after 10 years without i could clearly hear a difference. Bass was tighter and overall sound was just better.
I just ordered them and I'm looking forward to getting them installed and listening.
Always great to see Don and Theo on with Gene!
I could tell immediately on the first track. I was surprised. I thought that it would take several listening sessions to decide how the sound was affected. The Bass and Drums had more punch and depth, the soundstage and vocals too were better I think due to a lack of smear from the bottom end.
I'm using a pair of KEF Reference 1 nearfield in a production environment on a pair of custom ISO Acoustics stands. They definitely sound different from the stands I was using previously. Not better, not worse...but different. You can like or not what these devices do, but there's no doubt they are doing something.
There's an Gaia A/B demo from Persuit Perfect System (4 years ago) that captures about what is said in this review. Quite an amazing difference.
great video gene !
these are phenomenal products also for creating a solid foundation for uneven floors
I got isoacoustic feet for my turntable because I wanted feet with height adjustment and some vibration isolation since it sometimes skipped a bit if someone with heavy feet walks past it (namely me). Not sure how much it changed the sound but the vibration isolation was absolutely helpful
Here is the issue that some, including me will have, Theo said "can you give me". Excellent you were given them, these are expensive for what they "might do".
I'm a believer in decoupling speakers, especially subs but these products are expensive.
expensive is a relative term
@@SantanKGhey1234 1,000 dollars for speaker isolation is not relative, it's ridiculously expensive. It's 99% profit.
Yes yes yes. No BS , it works wonders , in all areas it improves the sound quite remarkably. Worth the s def.
Very good, I think these would make a big difference. I have 1st edition Canton Vento Reference 7’s with built in shock absorbers. I didn’t think they isolated the speakers enough from wood floors so I use IKEA cutting boards under with good results but I still want the Gaia 2’s. If you want to save money the cutting boards help a lot. Credit to Shawn at Zero Fidelity.
I got the Gaia III and used them on my Marten Duke 2 with its original stands. Yes … there’s a tightening up of the bass and with that, the mids and highs end up cutting through better.
But when I used them with my Harbeth P3ESR, I did not get much difference. Maybe it’s because there are some isolation pads between the P3ESR and the top of their stand.
I wish it was easier to adjust the Gaia III as we level the speakers.
The Gaia’s do work for sure. But I tried a much cheaper offering from AudioBastion from China , ofc it’s a simpler structure but it works giving sharper imaging , cleaner more focused voice , better soundstage - for abt 1/5 the price. I’m not sure how much better the Gaia’s sound tho, as I haven’t had the chance to AB them side by side
Saw these at the audio advice live and they really make a difference. Everything was just tight. Ordering these.
I demo'd these at AXPONA, exact speakers shown. Personally I have not heard anything drastically different. I will say there is a difference for certain, however it is very small. I am not certain if the effect was minimized because it was on a carpet or not, so clearly it may minimize the effect. The demo had a 15 second switch, which worked automatically. No one did the change, I attempted to neglect which one is on and listen with my eyes closed to increase my hearing and perception. You definitely can hear a difference, but I cannot justify the price to performance.
If you got carpet and nice padding under with a solid floor, a floor which is not floating. The difference will be fairly slim and I feel it's not worth it.
My last paragraph is a great tip/advice for carpet owners.
I think they covered all these points in the video, not certain if it's better but it is doing something.
I personally own the aperta 200 for speakers that are fairly light, specifically for angling my surrounds. I used them in stereo as well, it personally again feels like it did nothing. They said it increases sound stage, this and that, and I could not get that. I will say for certain that vibration did drastically decrease in the room, my apartment has a floating floor; the sub flooring. By this I mean there's an empty space between the actual ground and sub floor, the hardwood under the padding/carpet or vinyl flooring. So basically my place is very susceptible to huge resonance into the structure, each of the beams in my floor go into the beams on the wall so it can really increase the rattle.
What I did as I had a recent remodel/renovation is in my theater room and bedroom where I have stereo setups I ended up investing about 200 dollars to get a very thick and higher weight dispersion under carpet padding. I believe this is referred to as rebound padding, the one I chose is a 12lb density which is the highest possible one I believe for regular priced common upgrades. I figure any higher than that would be custom made and probably overkill for use and price.
This did wonders for vibrations in the walls and best part is you can use it for any amount of speakers rather than purchase isoacoustics for each speaker and I have it in 3 rooms.
I wonder how the GAIA compares to a Sorbothane disc or pad that you get from Amazon. They have a rated Durometer and size based on weight. They might not look as high end as the GAIA, but if performs as well at a fraction of the cost.
Wowsers, Don and Theo are on the ISO payroll. Glad to see Gene keep level headed about this.
It just works, I know we're always looking for placebo, but also looking for placebo can make you ignore when you hear non-placebo differences.😊
I've been thinking about trying these for my Arendal 1723 2S subs in my theater room. They would take the GAIA II I believe. It's in a basement though on concrete underneath; however, it's concrete then underlayment then a hickory engineered hardwood, then pad, then carpet based on how we built the house then did the theater room. So I wonder if/how that wood flooring is affecting things even though it is floated on concrete. Might it still be worth isolation given the wood floor layer? Or does the mass of concrete underneath it still negate any value?
Super cool for the Focal 1000 content coming. My theater is all 1000 in-walls with the IWLCR6 as my LCRs plus I have a stereo pair of them in my living room. I really like Focal as a brand. Crossing fingers for great results in the review. I would love some purchase justification confirmation bias!
So Gene I know you used the IsoAcoustics Aperta300 on your Perlisten center. But Perlisten makes a stand. I was wondering if putting Gaia in place of the stand feet would be as good or better? Im thinking it matches the towers better all with Gaia?
Thanks Audioholics for testing these speakers with my song "Birds"! Not sure what clearer transients mean at this point but will look into it 😅
Haha awesome. We had almost every demo room using your music as source material. Transients are the sudden changes from loud to soft sounds or vice versa (ie. pop of a snare drum hit or rim shot).
so if You really hear difference and still doubting in lacebo may be it make a sense to measure it and see if there is difference or make blind test?
Placebo*
Will this work with headphones.
Perhaps we need isolation devices for the feet of the listening chair. Actually, I’m agnostic on this topic. If these isolation devices actually change the sound of Gene’s loudspeakers, what would happen to the sound of those loudspeakers if they were placed on a thick rubber mat without these isolation devices? I’m looking forward to seeing the test results.
Sorry if this was covered. Are these compression springs in tubes or is there other technology involved?
I have the ZaZen II platform under my CD player/DAC, Orea isolators under pre-amp and power amp, and Gaia IIs under my Focal Kanta N°2 speakers on carpet disks. 👍
I’ll bet anything they made a great great difference! No snake oil there
I have my speakers on hard wood in the living room. When I finished my basement with double drywall and rock foam thing that is great for sound insulation , I immediately noticed that the speakers were, for lack of a better word, smaller. The floor and basement were amplifying the sound from the speaker.
While I haven't had any issues with decoupling speakers from my floor (the issue could certainly still exist with other speakers) I have had issues with subwoofers. I've used feet similar to these to fix those subwoofer issues entirely, to the point where I can have a sub standing right next to my seating position and still not locate where the sound comes from.
Something softer feet does however is to lower the bass capacity somewhat, which is an obvious effect if you have a less stable base. It's not a big difference but since we're talking small details in hifi then people interested in that should easily hear that, otherwise tweaks are pretty meaningless beyond placebo. It hasn't been a problem for me though as I'm using room correction for the bass frequencies.
I am a bit skeptical towards that acoustic dampening feet need to be as expensive as IsoAcoustics' products though, seeing how the feet I completely eliminated any issues from a 16" subwoofer were much cheaper. It's not that they would be expensive compared to my speakers, I'm just making a general observation. Granted those feet I used were made for subs and tower speakers can be a lot heavier so you might design them differently, but speakers also aren't nearly as problematic as subs when it comes to floor resonance.
purchase 24 racketballs, a few muffin pans, plkace balls in pans , place subwoofers on balls, place a sheet of neoprene under the pan if worried about vibration and you will have a better isolation solution than these overpriced feet, cost is like 20 bucks total
@Audioholics I am pretty convinced they make a difference on speakers, but how about amps and pre-amps, CDs or a turntable like Linn LP12?
First time I saw thoses feets were at the Montreal audio fest and meeted the inventor, who said he went to the tv show dragons den. I was almost laughing inside while seeing it and the laser movements analysis they did to show the difference in the movements. Then my brother in law bought them for his hifi setup and he did a demo to me with and without. I was really impress and didnt really undertood why. Then I added to mine also for my totem acoustic bookshelves speakers and it was night and day. Before the tv stand was transmitting noise and after not.
Do the different height has an impact? I guess so. Do just hockey pucks could do the same? Maybe I didnt test. But for sure no matter the reason it works great. Im not a believer of the oil snake cables and magical products or tweaks.
But really for some reasons it makes a real difference I can confirm. Mines are the isoacoustics plastic version and not the gaia.
I will say, I just purchased some of the original iso-pucks and put them between my bookshelf speakers and the speaker stands. I put 4 of them, each rated at 20lbs, under my 19.1 lb speakers. First thing I noticed was the high treble. It seemed extreme to me but not in a bad way. I have not measured this to prove my perception but I feel like it improved everything. My speaker stands shelf is smaller than my speaker so they literally had nothing between them, speaker cabinet (no rubber feet) on top a wood type Edifier stand. It's definitely clearer at loud volumes. The pucks are really made well, not like that real cheap stuff I always used. I probably could have gotten away with using the mini pucks but I wanted to do it right. They do say to point the logo facing forward for optimum results.
I'm surprised that you heard an improvement because your pucks are too big for your 19 lb speaker. IsoAcoustics has a chart that says the performance of each 20 lb puck is from 10 lbs-20 lbs, so 4 pucks best performance is between 40-80 lbs.
Or you should use 3 pucks so that the best performance is between 30-60 lbs which is closer to your 19 lb speaker.
@@mrpmj00 I could see why some would feel the larger ones would be overkill. I felt they worked just as good as the "mini" pucks (which were the first, cheapest ones I tried) but provided better stability. Same with using 4 over 3 of them. I don't think going over spec diminished how they work..but that might be a question for Iso-Acoustics. I'm definitely a believer in the product & own multiple types. I use them under everything these days...and the Gaia's on my Tower speakers. I had tried all the budget types in the past & feel the Iso's are in a different class. Just my opinion of course.
@@NosEL34 I've just bought the mini pucks yesterday for my 12 lb bookshelf main speakers and now I get goosebumps.
Tomorrow the 20 lb pucks will arrive for my 2 subwoofers so I'll see if they improve over the seat cushions that are under them now (and are on carpet).
My video: ua-cam.com/video/BD_0f_qyFqg/v-deo.html
@@mrpmj00 very cool 👍
@@NosEL34 Not only do I get goosebumps in some songs that I didn’t get before, today I hear faint instruments in the background of Elvis “You don’t know me” even though I’ve listened to it 1,000 times.
Good discussion thank you, always enjoyable. WRT to whether or not it’s a placebo effect or not … at the end of the day, what does it really matter if it is or isn’t. If it sounds good to you on your system, that’s what matters. If. You think it provides “value added” then it’s value added to you on your system. End of argument. Personally, I don’t believe in 3rd party power cables and the expensive speaker cables, etc., but if you like them, on your system, have at it. These IsoAcousitcs Gaia isolation feet make sense … I’m planning try them on my Ohm Walsh 2000s. Thanks again …
Did you switch the speaker pairs on and then off of the speaker stands? If yes, we’re the results the same? I am especially interested to the hand clapping immediacy being a result of the speaker stands or a just a minute difference between the speaker pairs.
Thanks
Did you ever do the actual review, really curious on your thought Gene.
Kudos to Gene for being willing to try this and being honest about what he heard. He still sounds like he believes it could be expectation bias, but wouldn’t his bias be against hearing a difference?
Nope, expectation bias can work even if you're aware of it. Our brain tricks us.
When will the follow-up video with the measurements be published?
Hi Gene.
I have audiocrate spring Isolation speaker feet for my speakers and for my subwoofers I have a pair of IsoAcoustics Iso-L8r200Sub Stands
the difference the stands made to Stopping the Vibration and the feet has stopped the other 7 speakers Vibration . on the bookshelves etc. as I live in a small 12x12 room 8 foot ceiling. I have a Yamaha 5.2.2 setup. my atmos speakers are ment to fire up but have so the speakers face down to me. and they work go.
These things work great. Worth it for subs too
As I consider these speaker dampers, I’m left wondering how a set of SVS Soundpath feet would compare (on full range speakers) in a blind A-B.
The Gaia will definitely change the sound of your speaker, especially if you are not on concrete slab. Most people like the new sound but some don’t.
I wonder how the those would compare to the feet that come on the Paradigm founder speakers. Because the paradigm have a rubber decoupler built into the feet.
Not sure where my first comment went, but I’ve got 100F Founders. I called Paradigm direct and they actually advised against using GAII II feet for the very reason you mentioned. You can call and email them as well to verify what I’m saying, but they claimed you’d see little to no benefit?!
@@nathanjones4039 that’s what I thought because I know Paradigm spent a lot of time and money developing their feet.
@@seanlacroix yes they did. When I called they were super nice and knowledgeable in regards to how the engineers designed the feet and how they work in conjunction with the way the cabinetry is already designed. Paradigms website has a cut away view of the feet and they’re already dampened TWICE…I’m saving my 600 dollars over buying the GAII II
I use isoacoistic on all my speakers and subs
Good stuff
I am very sensitive to tweeter height so I am surprised that they minimized that factor.
We weren’t minimizing the factor. Some have argued that the sound difference with the Gaia is due to a slight increase in height. That may be true if you were sitting 6-feet from the speaker. The context was that in my situation I’m 14 feet from the speaker and with the second set of speakers there was not really any difference when swapping out the manufacturer feet with the GAIA
@@TheoNicolakis the difference in height can definitely be a factor…as can subfloor, speaker design…it all matters. The height can also impact SBIR and room modes.
@@seanb3303 I'm in agreement with you that height can and is a factor-especially at closer listening distances. I was pretty much a skeptic of these things until I tried them. To contextualize my comments, in my particular use case, the Revel and RBH speakers are over 3-feet from the front wall and in two distantly different listening spaces-each nearly 30 feet long with different ceiling heights. Perhaps Gene can comment on how the demo was set up in the room where he listened to the GAIA. Along that same line of thought, then spikes at the same height would yield identical performance to the GAIA. Nevertheless, at the NRC in Canada, IsoAcoustics used a laservibrometer to measure differences in cabinet resonances. The feet on the RBH were nearly identical in height to the GAIA yet there was a perceived difference there too-and as Gene indicated in the show, the RBH speaker engineer did measure a difference with the GAIA. My point in all of this-as in the review-is that this is an area requiring more study and inquiry to see what factors are playing a role in this and perhaps in what living contexts isolation may make sense.
Sorbothane hemispheres is all I use. Raise subs off floor and use washing machine vibration pad or feet etc... anything more than that is approaching diminishing returns imo
I bet raising the speaker will give similar performance. Use long spikes or wood blocks vs these rubber feet for your a to b. I think decoupling is less likely to be the culprit than adding a couple inches. It's like bringing the speaker off the wall from 1 inch(standard) to 3 inches. The focal has a downward firing port along with the 2 front ports. Might be especially susceptible to getting better room gain with a 2 inch hike.
Can't wait to see some measurements.
I heard it at axpona and heard a difference but nothing was a night and day difference. I think it really isn't worth it, I think maybe if you are trying to minimize internal vibration for an apartment it may be something. I own the stands for bookshelves and it to me also did nothing.
As stated earlier, I feel like the vibration when the bass hits was less rattle in the walls and floor
@@mikegoddard7354 that would be a good reason. I also found use for this sort of isolation product. My RS150 active speaker resonated with the shelf it was on and then I noticed I could feel the speaker playing through it's sides via vibration that never occurs with my heavier tower speakers. A thick foam pad made the resonation mostly go away for $10 off amazon. Now listening to news/ human voices doesn't sound distorted via reverberation.
Reminds me of the old Soundcare SuperSpikes.
Also Stack Audio has great feed!!
Strange that Paul McGowan was saying DSD to vinyl at Octave records is more often preferred to the raw DSD files by most who hear them
Question. Mr. Dunn has a blackout curtain off to his side. Please ask him what kind it is. That is precisely what I am looking for. Love your shows. 👍🏻🇺🇸
So don’t forget that part of the formula is that spikes or some variation of that does allow energy to travel to and through the floor but a certain amount of that reflects back into the speaker cabinet… which is not good. These specialized feet don’t allow these energies and vibrations to reflect back into the cabinet.
I say get a better center channel. I took AHs advice and got the Polk L400. Oh man. I’m glad Polk doesn’t have the brand gravitas as other manufactures. There can’t be that much performance left on the table anywhere near that price point. I wonder if they are even better than some centers 1000s more
What about on cement or carpeted cement?
Cable lifter is not snake oil because I saw a youtube video of a guy holding a noise detector next to the cable comparing on floor versus on cable lifter.
That's not how you would test that. A proper test is to measure the signal after it has passed through the cable, both with and without raisers. Or you can make it easier and use a null tester where you put a signal through two cables to the tester, one with and one without raisers, and then the null tester will reverse the polarity of one signal so it will only output what is different between the two.
All that matters is the electrical signal since that is what is moving the speaker elements, and no one has yet been able to provide any proper evidence of raised speaker cables being different. Many have been able to prove the effects of bias and placebo on acoustic perception though, so that's well established.
I’ve been preaching about floor composition for a good while now and particularly where it has to do with speaker stands and bookshelf speaker isolation or coupling. Addressing the floor materials and support is what determines whether isolation or coupling is used. Basically, concrete floor, concrete with carpet or concrete with rigid tile uses spikes. Even concrete with wood over it and any other floors with wooden support need isolation based on my evaluation. Not being an engineer, I rely on ear tests. Some consider this snake oil. It wasn’t back in the middle 80s when I started working in the audio industry and it isn’t now. Some stuff is, but not this.
Why not use rubber stands for washing machine? Washing machine vibrates much more and is usually much more heavy. They make them rather for hard vibrations ;)
I don’t think concrete is inert as believed. I’m in a basement room and certain frequencies seem to arise that are not airborne, even passing through carpet.
What the heck is happening to you Gene 😱
IsoAcoutics also do have a pro range of products for electronics, not really that pricey, would also be cool to check out and the engineering behind those products.
Me and my wifey really wanna go from Norway to Florida for visit.
How about hockey pucks?
I almost didn't watch this, because Gene is the most skeptical guy out there. On the same token, I have a paper from an university explaining as to why cable matters. I don't kow if I can post the pdf here. I'd love that Gene have a say on that paper.
The Kuthnur paper it wrought with bad science and wrong assumptions. Amir from Audiosciencereview already did a video on his channel about it.
they make a big difference... cant say better or worse, it really comes down to individual preference. I use them under my Tekton Moabs, the GAIA i's sound better to me over the standard feet
Townsend seismic platforms are better than iso acoustic feet.i have both. if youve ever seen them together at trade shows ,theres a huge difference in vibration delete
For the Gaia $500 per speaker set has me wondering if it would be better spending the same amount on better speakers. That’s a large sum of money for some de-couplers.
Very true
Just checked the Isoacoustics website. Can't say the description is very clear, but seems to indicate compliant feet with various size/compliance optimized to different weight speakers. If this is all it does besides lifting the speakers slightly higher, it's hardly a new idea.
I've used compliant feet under my speakers for a couple of decades already, and the difference between these and various types of spike feet is huge (to my ears). The more resonant your floor is, the bigger the difference, even more so if you're using desktop monitors or something along those lines.
Not being an engineer, my laymans understanding is that higher compliance lowers the resonance frequency in the system consisting of the foot compliance and the weight suspended on top, creating a mechanical lowpass filter between the speaker and the floor. With spikes this resonance may end up somewhere in the hundreds of Hz. With soft feet (like my cheap synthetic foam "rubber" feet) you get the resonance/cutoff well below the audio band (pushing my speakers and letting go, without any kind of measuring devices I guesstimate something around 2-4 Hz or so).
It is interesting in technical terms to compare to spikes, and no surprise the difference is audible. But for advice to potential buyers, I'd say it's far more interesting to compare to compliant feet at lower prices (mine are just over a tenth of the price of the Isoacioustics products).
And a sidenote: Yes, compliant feet work under turntables, at least unsuspended ones like mine over the last three decades. I'd be careful with a suspended TT, though, as they are tuned to similar frequencies. There will be a bit going on with off center records at .55Hz, tonearm/cartridge resonance in the 8-13Hz region, and warped records typically between those, along with the suspension tuning. Adding another resonance in that narrow frequency band is risky, and probably not very beneficial since isolation is already handled by the TT suspension.
And another: One of my old fashioned amps has a humming transformer (mechanically). Soft feet under it, and it's dead quiet. It no longer sets the shelf in motion, and I suspect even the amp chassis itself vibrates less.
Hi Gene. I'm excited to try Gaia II feet on my RBH SV6500Rs. But you made a comment around 17:25 about seeing if there are any tonal differences and the Isoacoustics website even measures NO tonal differences (i.e. no difference in the frequency response) but they show differences in the mechanical vibrations. So I don't know or think that you should hear any tonal differences, which makes it harder (and likely makes people skeptical) about what differences they/we might hear, if any.
You can still have a difference in Sound that a simple steady state amplitude response may not show. We will be working on a way to test this.
Gene said it right. It is mechanical, so please stop calling it "Technology." This is why Gene is the man. He call bs.
Oh man, the Evangelical cableist are going to have a feld day with this video 😂. but seriously have the SVS isolation feet on my subs for when I lived in an apartment and I can tell you if you share wall this is these best upgrade that you can do. I don't prefer it because like gean said it takes the tactile bass away, but everyone else in other room i.e. my wife will love them.
Good show. I imagine there is less value in a system like mine on carpeted concrete floors.
If the threads are wrong, we will sell you the right ones, lol.
Didn’t you just put out a video claiming A-B testing speakers like they did here has all kinds of problems connected to it…? :)
i had speech intelligibity problems no matter what processor or centre speaker i used . Then i got a Bryston Sp-3
ENERGY can neither be created nor destroyed, but changes FORM. These pucks change vibration into HEAT and is dissipated.
This dissipation works both ways - from the speaker cabinet and from the surface it sits on.
It work not on every speaker . Not on closed speakers i believe only on basreflex speakers.
wrong
yer its like the same thing we get with different cables..
Its for wibrations not the sound,so why people compare sound
Didn’t you watch the captain planet cartoon 😂? Gaia is the goddess of Earth/ “mother Earth”
To couple or de-couple, that is the question
Off course there are measurements of these claims ... right? Is audioholics
it's coming, stay calm.
Isoacoustics have measurements on their site.
@@AbsoluteFidelity it's been a while since I had a look at their paper but don't isoacoustics have the speaker suspended in a sort of swing when they take their measurements? That's hardly representative of a speaker coupled to a concrete floor.
@@Audioholics are you going to test them under various conditions? I'd imagine if vibrations from the speaker are causing vibrations in the room that can't be cured then speaker decoupling may be the lesser evil. If external vibrations can be cured then surely it's better to have a speaker coupled to the huge mass that is the floor. But if isolation really is necessary then isn't experimenting with various rubbers going to be more cost effective also?
@@asx1248 it isnt as simple as "hardly representitive of a speaker coupled to a concrete floor". Read the entire procedure and test.
Why don't you just publish the video proving 10 for 10 double blind?? I mean, this is sadly typical audiophool gibberish!!!!! How about measurements???? You've already done the K2, so do it with the snake oil gizmo. So do we just toss science out whenever we want? We KNOW that any slight alteration in listening/measuring position can have some effect on perceived frequency response, but is it more than say, a db or two, and really, who even cares? Snake oil is snake oil. You already showed that varying off axis by 10 or 20 degrees does the same sort of thing. What is the big deal other than promulgating typical audiophool nonsense?
1000 dollars is absolutely ridiculous when a bunch of racketballs in a muffin pan does a better job, or use a 3/4 inch sheet of wood and use a hole saw to create 3 inch holes for the racketballs, if you're worried about the pan making noise, lay adhesive neoprene under the wood to furthur decouple the sub or speaker
Sounds like snake oil without measurements. 😂 Looking forward to what you find.
Measure it.
Yes, measuring has it's place but sometimes set-ups can sound different without it actually showing up during testing.
I just spent $$$ on IsoAcoustics after watching this video. I gotta unsubscribe to this channel because it’s costing me an arm and a leg.
Lmao he lost me at demonstrable difference. What the kids say? Ain’t no way! If you got to look for it’s not demonstrable.
What are you talking about? The video clearly talks about Gene having the difference demonstrated to him. The fact that he went up to look which speaker was which before they told him doesn't mean that they didn't demonstrate a difference. Quite the contrary since if they weren't able to demonstrate the difference he wouldn't have bothered to go up and check closer.
Rising speakers cables from the floor? Ask some other reviewers. GR Research invited you all to his "command center" Why don't you guys take a trip to Texas? Danny is a nice guy.
Raising speaker cables off the floor is ridiculous and a clear example of Placebo. Sad how people fail to understand the basic physics of signal propagation down a wire. You can't compress thr magnetic field but putting a cable on the ground like some claim.
@@shaolin95 You might be right about Danny. I don't know him and since perception makes reality, in my perception he's a nice guy, but the importan question is: would Audioholics go to Texas to have a first hand experience?
As an alternative to these Canadian products try another import from Canada - official NHL hockey pucks made by Michelin rubber products ! 64.00 US for a set of 8. 🤔
furniture sliders even cheaper. Stack em and you are good to go
I am sure it makes a physical difference. But how audible? No way to know until a double-blind A/B test is properly done. We are talking about a personal subjective perception of difference without a double-blind A/B test here. The difference is these are Gene's, Theo's & Don's subjective perceptions. But are their subjective percetions more valid than those of others? No one escapes the placebo effect. We should judge these subjective perceptions on those isolatolion feet as we judge others petceptions on differences cables make.
Mostly a valid point except there is an obvious mechanical difference with/without the feet whereas most cables, the electrical differences are either nill or imperceptible. I fully admit I could be a victim of placebo under this scenario.
But even blind testing will be influenced by the environment with this one. If there are unwanted external vibrations that can't be cured then decoupling is probably good. If there aren't any external vibrations then decoupling probably bad. I've no doubt people using decoupling will hear a difference but is it an improvement in how the room is reacting and at the same time a degrading of the speaker's performance? Which outweighs which will change by user case. I'd try various rubber feet and would be interested in seeing Gene throwing washing machine isolation feet or small pieces of rubber under those discs that go under spikes (to stop you damaging your floor) or similar into the mix!!