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Hello Doug, I'm Tola, seventeen years old. During hard times, I am grateful for the help in Buddhism, and I want to thank you for making the teachings accessible. Take care.
Very interesting discussion. To me, phrases like “in the seen, just the seen” always evoked a sense of having experiences without the illusory self inserting itself into the experience. There’s just seeing without a self doing the seeing. Just pure experience without discursive thought entering the moment.
Doug, as a fellow scholar and Buddhist studying the Tripitaka, and Mahayna Sutta/Sutras for the past 18 years, I would like to offer a bit more about the Bahiya Sutta that often isn't linked. First though, I'd like to thank you for your dedication to the presentation of the True Dhamma. Having recently joined the Buddhist Reddit, I see 99% of the thousands there have not sat down, sutta in hand and read anything themselves. The west has an obsession with Right Concentration, before cultivating Right View (MN117), so it is refreshing you see that you clearly have read and studied the Dhamma. Every video I watch I am expecting the same Wrong View I've seen from other commentators, or redditors who have compiled Blog posts, or brief quotes and forming then into they believe is Right View, but every video you have surprised me and expounded the Right View on all topics, clearly displaying you have read the source material itself, so thank you 🙏 your mastery of Dhamma study does not go Unnoticed. I'd like to point something out, firstly across the Tripitaka and the Mahayana, the number one way cited for realizing Nibbana, is indeed knowledge alone, for both lay people and Bhikkus. Often considered the Buddha's second teaching, the Fire sermon do you recall how many lay people realized Nibbana? Recall, in SN22.89, and interesting story, 60 elder Bhikkus, where questioning an elder Bhikku why he has not realized Nibbana yet, and as he was exposing how he knows everything conceptually, and explaining why he has not yet realized Nibbana yet, he himself, along with the other 60 Bhikkus in attendance realized Nibbana. I have not seen anyone else talk about how the most cited way people realized Nibbana on the Suttas is through hearing alone, so I had some apprehension sharing as I was going to do my own video on this. I have culminated thousands of cited material on "Nibbana by hearing alone", and if we get into the Mahayana sutta, it's not even fair 😂 then you're looking at "Innumerable Amounts" liberated "upon hearing this". Happy to provide this to you, if you have interest. The Bahiya Story, also is the direct path to realize Nibbana in as little as 7 days in the Sattipatthana Sutta. This is also the common misconception Vajrayana in the west has, saying that Vajrayana is the quickest path to Nibbana, meanwhile the Pali Cannon says here's how to do it in a week. In the Satipatthana Sutta "The direct path to Nibbana is this". Vajrayana, instead is the quickest path to Buddha hood, not Nibbana. It is the Alaya-Vijanna, the unconscious/subconscious mind which transforms into the Omniscient mind/Buddha hood, and that is why the mudra hand signs, mantras, and diety visualizations are all dealing with transforming the subconscious mind (and also why it's dangerous for beginners, and not intended as a school to "start") I digress... So we see hearing alone is most cited for Nibbana. We also see the method given to Bahiya is given to Bhikkus in the Satipatthana Sutta to realize Nibbana in as little as 7 days. It is Mindfullness, 24/7 waking mindfullness. 🪷The Buddha is teaching Bahiya Anatta here as well: Where it is said: "And since for you, Bāhiya, in what is seen there will be only what is seen, in what is heard there will be only what is heard, in what is sensed there will be only what is sensed, in what is cognized there will be only what is cognized, therefore, Bāhiya, you will not be with that; and since, Bāhiya, you will not be with that, therefore, Bāhiya, you will not be in that; and since, Bāhiya, you will not be in that, therefore, Bāhiya, you will not be here or hereafter or in between the two-just this is the end of suffering.” The Buddha is speaking about Anatta, there will be no self. The core basis of Anatta is that phenomenon has never required a self. The common misconception is people tie Phenomena, to "self" when the Buddha teaches Anatta, phenomena does not require a self at all, and it never has. Thinking, no thinker, seeing, no seer, hearing, no hearer, doing, no doer. This is precisely WHY mindfullness is the direct path to "being present with Nibbana" you are seeing with no self. Hearing, is hearing, doing, is doing, walking, note walking, bending over, note bending over. There is no self present, it just is phenomena as it is. He is saying: "Bahiya, since in what is experienced is only what is experienced (Mindfullness like Satipatthana Sutta explains) you will realize there is no self with the experience. You will realize there never has been a self inside the experience, and you will realize there has never been a self with the experience, inside the experience, or both with and inside the experience. It is a reference to Anatta, as when you are purely seeing reality as it's true nature through the mechanisms of mindfullness, hearing, is just hearing... There is no self in hearing or outside of hearing, there has never been a possesor and never a possesor required. No self is not "created" when it's realized... The true nature of reality is true regardless of realization, so all that is realized is simply that this IS how your subjective experience has been operating the entire time. The most cruel person on the planet is directly experiencing no self right now, just as you are too: Reading, no reader. When Anatta is fully understood, it is truly liberating my friends. If you have existential crisis, it is indication of Wrong View. It means you understand part truth not whole truth. You have "Alright View", not "Right View". Phenomenon has never needed a possesor, it is simply the first cause in dependent origination the cause we call ignorance, ignorance of true nature (Nibbana) that makes us believe we are "being". Again, the good news here, is your subjective experience that you fear ends if you believe in No Self, does not end! 👉Anatta is trying to tell you "Being", is not what creates that subjective experience you have. "Being" is not required for experience. Experience does not require a possesor to operate, it is simply ignorance of that Truth, that makes us think there is an us. Now, alongside that Nibbana is not separate from Samsara.. That would mean it's conditioned upon samsara. Only looking from Nibbana, into Samsara can you say it's "illusory" but saying that as absolute truth would indicate Nibbana is opposite of samsara, and if we're opposite, then it would be conditioned upon samsara and it is not conditioned upon anything. So too... As the diamond Sutrs expounds "Because the true nature of Living Beings, is NOT a living being, that is why it is a living being." (This is the only Mahayana reference I've used this entire sermon, but chew on it, it'll make sense. If not ask). The Buddha taught the middle path.. Non being is true ultimately, but ultimate truth includes conventional truth, it is not seperate from conventional truth. There is a reason the Buddha didn't emerge into Paranibbana from Nirdoha Samapatti.... Rather he displayed Paranibbana was the middle path. His last show. Jhana 0 is Existence, Jhana 1-4 is formed states, Jhana 4-8 is formless states, Jhana 9 is Non-Existence. If non existence was paranibbana, Buddha would of abides in Jhana 9 and emerged into Paranibbana but he did not. If typical everyday existence was Paranibanna, he would of emerged into Paranibanna immediately, without any absorption. Instead, the Buddha showed us neither non existence, nor existence was Paranibbana, neither form, nor formless. He went forward through 0-9 Jhana states, then in reverse order, then up to Jhana 4 and instead of emerging into 5th,he emerged and abided in Paranibbana... The middle path, neither form nor formless, neither existence, nor non existence. Lastly, another focus for Anatta, that experience does NOT need a "possesor", that it's never had an "I am" is found in MN121.12 : The Buddha entered Nirodha Samapatti, and recalls: "This perception, is void of the taint of being", upon which he emerges from it. Alright hope something ws helpful here. You are excellent Doug, your study is immaculate, it is refreshing to see someone studied and well versed in the Dhamma and suttas directly not just making UA-cam videoes on getting to Jhana states or mudras etc.. For fun with wrong view which achieves no result. I would like to start my channel around Sutta study as well.
In my experience after listening to many Dharma talks over years and reading many texts a just few words at the right time can bring things into sudden clarity.
Once again, excellent! Thank you. This is very similar to the instructions Sariputtta gave to Anathapindika when he was near death. After hearing this profound teaching, Anathapindika reacted: When this was said, Anathapindika the householder wept and shed tears. Ven. Ananda said to him, "Are you sinking, householder? Are you foundering?" "No, venerable sir. I'm not sinking, nor am I foundering. It's just that for a long time I have attended to the Teacher, and to the monks who inspire my heart, but never before have I heard a talk on the Dhamma like this." "This sort of talk on the Dhamma, householder, is not given to lay people clad in white. This sort of talk on the Dhamma is given to those gone forth." "In that case, Ven. Sariputta, please let this sort of talk on the Dhamma be given to lay people clad in white. There are clansmen with little dust in their eyes who are wasting away through not hearing [this] Dhamma. There will be those who will understand it."
To love the ephemeral quality of experiences... what a challenge, and what an awesome skill to master. It is also a useful thing to remember when we go through difficult times.
Thank you for this video (plus references, links etc.), Doug! Your splendid work cannot be overestimated! 😻 Wow, the Buddha's words here remind me a lot of those of some old Zen Masters (see for example the first few verses of Sengcan's "Xinxinming", or Hongzhi's teachings about "Silent Illumination", or Dogen's "When both body and mind are at peace, all things appear as they are: perfect, complete, lacking nothing"). No choosing/picking, no avoiding, no I/mine/me - then what...?! 💥 😊🙏
Yes, I think the Buddha's instructions to Bāhiya are very similar to Zen instructions. I imagine there might have been some influence through the centuries ...! 😊
this makes me think of the fire sermon, where the buddha sais, that everything is on fire. The sense contact sets us on fire, and hence we are "by that"
You're so knowledgeable, Doug! I'm a huge fan, been binge-watching your channel for a couple of years now. I kind of just want to absorb everything that sharp mind of yours contains. But I know I'm just being lazy. I'll keep studying early Buddhism and the original Dhamma both internally and externally, but your channel really helps me organize certain thoughts and ideas in my own mind thanks to your scholarly rhetoric and ability to didactically unpack complex topics. Thank you! 💚🙏🏼
My understanding is that Buddha is advising Bahia to approach the world with a non-self perspective, allowing the products of the sense organs to manifest without mental interpretation or preconception, akin to the experience of a beginner's mind. And one of the earliest Burmese meditation teachers, Mahasi Sayadaw, taught a meditation technique exactly with this approach, to see the products of sense organs without any judgement but only noting them as thoughts or sounds or sights etc in open awareness, and I think this can be a powerful meditation technique towards realizing non-self.
I interpret it as: our direct perceptions are just that, anything further are thoughts, desires, expectations, beliefs, and ruminations that we have attached to them. When we are no longer existing immersed in mental states affected by our collection of thoughts, desires, expectations, beliefs, and confusions, we are no longer caught up in them. This is the end of suffering.
I think Doug might have pinpointed the essence of the Buddha's dharma for Bahiya. "Allowing the mind to get in between us and what we are seeing and what we are experiencing" is exactly what we all do that the Buddha's dharma warns us about. The Diamond Sutra has a very similar dharma. "we should know everything as it is, see everything as it is, understand and accept everything as it is, without any subjective reconstruction of what we see, hear, ...."
Profound! A clearer exposition is hard to come by. People hear similar instructions in many traditions and still find it hard to understand. One of the reasons might be that the process of separating from direct experience is deeply engrained and many don't believe it's possible to break away. Others won't see any use in doing so, they have no "faith" that "seeing only what is seen" is of any use. To become detached from clinging to worldly concerns seems counterintuitive. The scientific trend is towards the theory of "predictive processing", which sees the mind as always filtering perceptions through past experiences, of anticipating and conceptualizing experience. It's a way of conserving energy. Life can be more. Like Rumi's parrot, we have to listen to the message if we want to fly away to a better place.
Interesting! I had always interpreted this passage as a straight up Anatta teaching - there are only 6 sense, 5 aggregates - no you. But clinging in regard to the sense makes sense! I also love the mindfulness passage halfway through (was it SN 95.35??) - the passage and it’s meaning have inspired me to double down on daily mindfulness outside of mediation. Great video!
I wonder.. There's a practice among, I believe, some indigenous Japanese in which they make clothing out of bark. In this case, they soften the inner bark by pounding the fibers down into sheets and fashion that into clothing. Fascinating stuff!
Interesting! I think though in this case that the clothing is intended as an ascetic practice, that is it wouldn't be intended to be comfortable. It's rather like the other ascetic Ajita Kesakambali is so-named because he wore a blanket made of human hair.
Thank you Doug. I like the explanation of by that and in that. It explains the process of relishing sense object to identifying with it creating a Self.
Well spoken! Essentially, I hear the Buddha emphasizing mindfulness in everyday life. Not practicing mindfulness results in more dukkha throughout the day and practicing mindfulness results in less dukkha throughout the day. The aim is no dukkha throughout every day thus leading to nibbana: the extinguishing of samsara. For me, it is time to double down on yoniso manasikara (wise reflection). Might you be inclined towards a video on that subject? 😊
@@lillystern In MN2 Sabbasava sutta, effluent to be abandoned by seeing, has some details of how it should be practiced. In essence, it is to observe to process of how dukkha arises and ceases, thereby establishing right view.
I don’t think simply being with things as they are solves it since there can still be desire and passion for what is seen. As the poem says, “When you see a sight, mindfulness is lost as attention latches onto a pleasant feature.” The point about desire not being in the unseen sight shows that the fetters are not inherent in any of the of the sense media. It’s the desire or passion for the sense media that is the fetter. One escape from this is to train the mind not to fabricate perceptions of beauty (called pleasant features in the poem). This is what “in the seen there will only be the seen” means. When there is no perception of beauty or pleasant feature, then there is nothing for consciousness to latch onto. So, it cannot be said to be by that, in that, here, beyond, or between. This state is described by the analogy of a ray of light shining through a window. If the opposite wall, ground, and water are taken away, the light has no where to land.
I want to ask you people about something I've been thinking about. Is a lot of the teaching designed so that it catapults you forward and at some point you let go of it? Like the metaphor of the cobbled together raft? As an analogy take a space rocket. The booster rockets drop off when they're spent and the vessel keeps going. Thanks Doug for warming my cockles btw. I'm really missing my Buddhist friends during restrictions.
It's my pleasure, Sam! Glad to have you here. As to your question, I did an earlier video on the raft parable that might help: ua-cam.com/video/4hDmFFXT_sg/v-deo.html
Thanks for another comprehensive and informative video. I was unaware of the second sutta you pointed out. My interpretation of the Bahya Sutta has always been that when you have only bare knowledge of your senses than the illusion of self vanishes. I think you are saying the same thing using terms related to greed, attachment, and volition in general instead of bare knowledge. Please let me know if I am mistaken.
I think it meant not to crave for and grasp on to whatever that is experienced. Experiences are fleeting and grasping onto them is going to create dukkha.
Thanks Dread, yes it might be the same thing, "bare knowledge" isn't really a concept we get in early Buddhism but I think the discourse is pointing in that direction.
Yes, but one question is whether this breakthrough is to literal, full enlightenment or instead to something more like stream-entry, a glimpse of enlightenment.
Thank you for making this wisdom accessible in english in an understandable presentation. Is your recent book buddhist wisdom available on Amazon? I am in India.
Until my appointment for enlightenment I would like to have a pair of glasses like the colorful filter you seem to use in these videos. Would make the waiting period more fun.
Is it possible to retract reactions entirely, without any sort of higher order thinking to ground yourself? Releasing from the need to analyze. I'm finding that I'm doing this an increasing amount in some areas of my life and its letting me enjoy the present more. I used to try very hard to get my mind in order, but now it feels like I'm not trying at all and I'm just releasing. Is this what we should strive towards? Because it feels intuitive and right to me. Side note but Im aware of the irony of this being an object of desire for me, lol.
@@DougsDharma Its interesting that I spent so many years and so much energy trying to fix myself just to realize that there isnt anything fundamentally wrong. That gave me the toolset to let off the gas, and now im focusing mostly on observing what my mind is doing. I still want some parts of my ego and am okay with it, but I want to give it a green light to stay rather than occur without awareness. Anyways thanks a lot, great content on your channel
Interesting, thank you. You should read the Surangama Sutra , in there are mentioned 25 means to enlightenment and which one is the best and the ultimate. different practices can lead to the initial enlightenment but for complete enlightenment and Buddhahood only one method can bring one to that ultimate nirvana and is the Quan Yin method. Quan Yin means listening inwardly to ones own self nature . it is the vibration which creates and sustains the whole multiverse and is the voice of God or spirit and is known as the 'word ' in the bible. it can be heard by a specific method of meditation imparted by a living master at the time of initiation . the inner sound is very real and not something abstract . it can be heard clearly and manifests as innumerable sounds in different levels of consciousness and sounds like beautiful melodious heavenly music. it's known in many traditions by different names such as Anahad naad, Shabd, Naam , the logos , the music of the spheres the saut-e- sarmod of the Sufi's , the voice of the silence in theosophy, the audible life stream ,the cosmic sound ,the Aum , the heavenly melody the celestial sound stream etc etc. all refer to the same primordial sound which is the direct connection to the source or Nirvana and by listening to it we become fully enlightened. it is mentioned in that Sutra that all Buddhas use that vibration to come and go from Nirvana . My spiritual teacher Supreme Master Ching Hai offers initiation into this practice free of charge to sincere aspirants. Namaste
My master would say that some people do the work, and then see the truth. Some other people see the truth, and then do the work.One way or another the work will have to be done. I'm pretty sure that wasn't his teaching, but a teaching that he was passing along.
@@DougsDharma That is a good tease! I do not know the answer. Is the mind only the voice in our heads? Or is it the lens through which we experience every perception? The voice seems possible to silence, but removing our mental goggles sounds like turning-off all perception, or like forgetting all memory and perceiving anew... (Great topics!)
I think you're on to something. Enjoying a picture might not be the best way to fully absorb what it looks like. You might need a different practice to get a photographic memory. If it is not fully absorbed, it can be hard to manifest in altered states. You see, I think that for desire to be fully extinguished, you need a state that allows you to interact with your desire and satisfy it. You must remember what is dukkha, what is the problem specifically Sidartha sat down to solve. There are many different types of dukkha. Nirvana means liberation. The liberation means the cessation if these dukkhas.
My interpretation of here, in-between and there (Malunkyaputta's poem based on access to insight translation). {here} Seeing a form -mindfulness lapsed- {in-between} attending to the theme of ‘endearing,’ impassioned in mind, one feels and remains fastened on it. One’s feelings, born of the form, grow numerous, {there} Greed & annoyance injure one’s mind. Thus amassing stress, one is said to be far from unbinding. {second scenario with mindfulness - here} Not impassioned with forms -seeing a form with mindfulness firm- {in-between} dispassioned in mind, one knows and doesn’t remain fastened on it. While one is seeing a form -and even experiencing feeling- it falls away and doesn’t accumulate. {there} Thus one fares mindfully. Thus not amassing stress, one is said to be in the presence of unbinding.
@@DougsDharma yes indeed. And it summarised the Dhamma that is good in the beginning, middle and end very well. Malunkyaputta has came a long way from his confused state in the early days.
Keep going. Don't ever stop posting videos on YT. Also please lower your books kindle price for India. In India due to currency exchange rates your book peice is nearly 750 ruppees. We never pay more than 300 rupees for any book in India.
Seems like this is basically dzogchen/mahamudra or other formless practices? Pointing out instructions + leaving phenomena on their own, with no imputation of a “self” (just halfway through video rn so sorry if you already said this)
Last night I had a lucid dream in which I invented a wellness product and named it "Doug's Dharmah". So I inadvertently stole this channel's name lol. Anybody else dream about this channel in one way or another?
No it's not possible to be enlightened just by listening to a word. A lot of you guys deceiving yourselves by thinking you can become enlightened by just listening and understanding intellectually. Didn't you know that Bahiya in his previous life was also a follower of the Buddha at that time? In other words he had cultivated in his past lifetime so that's why he was able to be enlightened that easily
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Hello Doug, I'm Tola, seventeen years old. During hard times, I am grateful for the help in Buddhism, and I want to thank you for making the teachings accessible. Take care.
You're very welcome Tola, glad you are finding some benefit in the videos!
Hope you’re doing well Tola. I love Doug’s work too
You are easy to like Tola !
Very interesting discussion. To me, phrases like “in the seen, just the seen” always evoked a sense of having experiences without the illusory self inserting itself into the experience. There’s just seeing without a self doing the seeing. Just pure experience without discursive thought entering the moment.
Doug, as a fellow scholar and Buddhist studying the Tripitaka, and Mahayna Sutta/Sutras for the past 18 years, I would like to offer a bit more about the Bahiya Sutta that often isn't linked.
First though, I'd like to thank you for your dedication to the presentation of the True Dhamma. Having recently joined the Buddhist Reddit, I see 99% of the thousands there have not sat down, sutta in hand and read anything themselves.
The west has an obsession with Right Concentration, before cultivating Right View (MN117), so it is refreshing you see that you clearly have read and studied the Dhamma. Every video I watch I am expecting the same Wrong View I've seen from other commentators, or redditors who have compiled Blog posts, or brief quotes and forming then into they believe is Right View, but every video you have surprised me and expounded the Right View on all topics, clearly displaying you have read the source material itself, so thank you 🙏 your mastery of Dhamma study does not go Unnoticed.
I'd like to point something out, firstly across the Tripitaka and the Mahayana, the number one way cited for realizing Nibbana, is indeed knowledge alone, for both lay people and Bhikkus. Often considered the Buddha's second teaching, the Fire sermon do you recall how many lay people realized Nibbana? Recall, in SN22.89, and interesting story, 60 elder Bhikkus, where questioning an elder Bhikku why he has not realized Nibbana yet, and as he was exposing how he knows everything conceptually, and explaining why he has not yet realized Nibbana yet, he himself, along with the other 60 Bhikkus in attendance realized Nibbana.
I have not seen anyone else talk about how the most cited way people realized Nibbana on the Suttas is through hearing alone, so I had some apprehension sharing as I was going to do my own video on this. I have culminated thousands of cited material on "Nibbana by hearing alone", and if we get into the Mahayana sutta, it's not even fair 😂 then you're looking at "Innumerable Amounts" liberated "upon hearing this". Happy to provide this to you, if you have interest.
The Bahiya Story, also is the direct path to realize Nibbana in as little as 7 days in the Sattipatthana Sutta. This is also the common misconception Vajrayana in the west has, saying that Vajrayana is the quickest path to Nibbana, meanwhile the Pali Cannon says here's how to do it in a week. In the Satipatthana Sutta "The direct path to Nibbana is this". Vajrayana, instead is the quickest path to Buddha hood, not Nibbana. It is the Alaya-Vijanna, the unconscious/subconscious mind which transforms into the Omniscient mind/Buddha hood, and that is why the mudra hand signs, mantras, and diety visualizations are all dealing with transforming the subconscious mind (and also why it's dangerous for beginners, and not intended as a school to "start")
I digress... So we see hearing alone is most cited for Nibbana. We also see the method given to Bahiya is given to Bhikkus in the Satipatthana Sutta to realize Nibbana in as little as 7 days. It is Mindfullness, 24/7 waking mindfullness.
🪷The Buddha is teaching Bahiya Anatta here as well:
Where it is said: "And since for you, Bāhiya, in what is seen there will be only what is seen, in what is heard there will be only what is heard, in what is sensed there will be only what is sensed, in what is cognized there will be only what is cognized, therefore, Bāhiya, you will not be with that; and since, Bāhiya, you will not be with that, therefore, Bāhiya, you will not be in that; and since, Bāhiya, you will not be in that, therefore, Bāhiya, you will not be here or hereafter or in between the two-just this is the end of suffering.”
The Buddha is speaking about Anatta, there will be no self. The core basis of Anatta is that phenomenon has never required a self. The common misconception is people tie Phenomena, to "self" when the Buddha teaches Anatta, phenomena does not require a self at all, and it never has. Thinking, no thinker, seeing, no seer, hearing, no hearer, doing, no doer. This is precisely WHY mindfullness is the direct path to "being present with Nibbana" you are seeing with no self. Hearing, is hearing, doing, is doing, walking, note walking, bending over, note bending over. There is no self present, it just is phenomena as it is.
He is saying: "Bahiya, since in what is experienced is only what is experienced (Mindfullness like Satipatthana Sutta explains) you will realize there is no self with the experience. You will realize there never has been a self inside the experience, and you will realize there has never been a self with the experience, inside the experience, or both with and inside the experience.
It is a reference to Anatta, as when you are purely seeing reality as it's true nature through the mechanisms of mindfullness, hearing, is just hearing... There is no self in hearing or outside of hearing, there has never been a possesor and never a possesor required. No self is not "created" when it's realized... The true nature of reality is true regardless of realization, so all that is realized is simply that this IS how your subjective experience has been operating the entire time. The most cruel person on the planet is directly experiencing no self right now, just as you are too:
Reading, no reader.
When Anatta is fully understood, it is truly liberating my friends. If you have existential crisis, it is indication of Wrong View. It means you understand part truth not whole truth. You have "Alright View", not "Right View". Phenomenon has never needed a possesor, it is simply the first cause in dependent origination the cause we call ignorance, ignorance of true nature (Nibbana) that makes us believe we are "being". Again, the good news here, is your subjective experience that you fear ends if you believe in No Self, does not end!
👉Anatta is trying to tell you "Being", is not what creates that subjective experience you have. "Being" is not required for experience. Experience does not require a possesor to operate, it is simply ignorance of that Truth, that makes us think there is an us. Now, alongside that Nibbana is not separate from Samsara.. That would mean it's conditioned upon samsara. Only looking from Nibbana, into Samsara can you say it's "illusory" but saying that as absolute truth would indicate Nibbana is opposite of samsara, and if we're opposite, then it would be conditioned upon samsara and it is not conditioned upon anything. So too... As the diamond Sutrs expounds "Because the true nature of Living Beings, is NOT a living being, that is why it is a living being." (This is the only Mahayana reference I've used this entire sermon, but chew on it, it'll make sense. If not ask).
The Buddha taught the middle path.. Non being is true ultimately, but ultimate truth includes conventional truth, it is not seperate from conventional truth.
There is a reason the Buddha didn't emerge into Paranibbana from Nirdoha Samapatti.... Rather he displayed Paranibbana was the middle path. His last show. Jhana 0 is Existence, Jhana 1-4 is formed states, Jhana 4-8 is formless states, Jhana 9 is Non-Existence. If non existence was paranibbana, Buddha would of abides in Jhana 9 and emerged into Paranibbana but he did not. If typical everyday existence was Paranibanna, he would of emerged into Paranibanna immediately, without any absorption. Instead, the Buddha showed us neither non existence, nor existence was Paranibbana, neither form, nor formless. He went forward through 0-9 Jhana states, then in reverse order, then up to Jhana 4 and instead of emerging into 5th,he emerged and abided in Paranibbana... The middle path, neither form nor formless, neither existence, nor non existence.
Lastly, another focus for Anatta, that experience does NOT need a "possesor", that it's never had an "I am" is found in MN121.12 : The Buddha entered Nirodha Samapatti, and recalls: "This perception, is void of the taint of being", upon which he emerges from it.
Alright hope something ws helpful here. You are excellent Doug, your study is immaculate, it is refreshing to see someone studied and well versed in the Dhamma and suttas directly not just making UA-cam videoes on getting to Jhana states or mudras etc.. For fun with wrong view which achieves no result. I would like to start my channel around Sutta study as well.
You deserve millions of subscribers tbh. Well, I am also sure that this is not what you're fascinated to. You're truly amazing sir.
Thanks so much Abhishek! Very kind of you.
In my experience after listening to many Dharma talks over years and reading many texts a just few words at the right time can bring things into sudden clarity.
Yes, absolutely.
Once again, excellent! Thank you. This is very similar to the instructions Sariputtta gave to Anathapindika when he was near death.
After hearing this profound teaching, Anathapindika reacted:
When this was said, Anathapindika the householder wept and shed tears. Ven. Ananda said to him, "Are you sinking, householder? Are you foundering?"
"No, venerable sir. I'm not sinking, nor am I foundering. It's just that for a long time I have attended to the Teacher, and to the monks who inspire my heart, but never before have I heard a talk on the Dhamma like this."
"This sort of talk on the Dhamma, householder, is not given to lay people clad in white. This sort of talk on the Dhamma is given to those gone forth."
"In that case, Ven. Sariputta, please let this sort of talk on the Dhamma be given to lay people clad in white. There are clansmen with little dust in their eyes who are wasting away through not hearing [this] Dhamma. There will be those who will understand it."
Yes that's right, though I think many of us would have trouble understanding it without some explanation! 😄
@@DougsDharma Agreed!
Fantastic Dharma talk!
Glad you enjoyed! 🙏
Great teaching, thank you so much 🙏
My pleasure, Pablo!
What a clear explanation from you! I appreciate your video so much.
"Don't let thought intrude in between us and mindfulness".
My pleasure, thanks for the comment! 🙏
To love the ephemeral quality of experiences... what a challenge, and what an awesome skill to master. It is also a useful thing to remember when we go through difficult times.
It really is!
Thank you for this video (plus references, links etc.), Doug! Your splendid work cannot be overestimated! 😻
Wow, the Buddha's words here remind me a lot of those of some old Zen Masters (see for example the first few verses of Sengcan's "Xinxinming", or Hongzhi's teachings about "Silent Illumination", or Dogen's "When both body and mind are at peace, all things appear as they are: perfect, complete, lacking nothing"). No choosing/picking, no avoiding, no I/mine/me - then what...?! 💥
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Yes, I think the Buddha's instructions to Bāhiya are very similar to Zen instructions. I imagine there might have been some influence through the centuries ...! 😊
this makes me think of the fire sermon, where the buddha sais, that everything is on fire. The sense contact sets us on fire, and hence we are "by that"
Yes, for sure.
Great video Doug very deep and clear. I found it very insightful, thank you for your great effort in your videos😀
My pleasure, Kaman. 🙏😊
Wow, thank you for explaining the meaning of this puzzling teaching! You are an amazing teacher.
You're very welcome Sarah! 🙏
Wow! Very clearly explained. Thank you for giving this very enlightening dharma talk.
My pleasure 😊
@@DougsDharma Is enlightenment some kind of a complete abandonment of self and desires?
Splendid! An awesome teaching of Buddha explained so clearly!
Thank you kindly!
Wow. That was one of the best teachings I've ever heard. And I saw my problems clearly.
Thank you.
Glad it was helpful!
You're so knowledgeable, Doug! I'm a huge fan, been binge-watching your channel for a couple of years now. I kind of just want to absorb everything that sharp mind of yours contains. But I know I'm just being lazy. I'll keep studying early Buddhism and the original Dhamma both internally and externally, but your channel really helps me organize certain thoughts and ideas in my own mind thanks to your scholarly rhetoric and ability to didactically unpack complex topics. Thank you! 💚🙏🏼
My pleasure Gabriel, thanks for the comment! 🙏😊
My understanding is that Buddha is advising Bahia to approach the world with a non-self perspective, allowing the products of the sense organs to manifest without mental interpretation or preconception, akin to the experience of a beginner's mind. And one of the earliest Burmese meditation teachers, Mahasi Sayadaw, taught a meditation technique exactly with this approach, to see the products of sense organs without any judgement but only noting them as thoughts or sounds or sights etc in open awareness, and I think this can be a powerful meditation technique towards realizing non-self.
Yes, I think that's one way to look at it.
Another well-researched, nicely presented video! Thank you, Doug, for your wisdom, kindness, & teaching! Sadhu x 3!
My pleasure, thanks for watching! 🙏😊
Love From Nepal 🇳🇵
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I interpret it as: our direct perceptions are just that, anything further are thoughts, desires, expectations, beliefs, and ruminations that we have attached to them. When we are no longer existing immersed in mental states affected by our collection of thoughts, desires, expectations, beliefs, and confusions, we are no longer caught up in them. This is the end of suffering.
This is an excellent review. Thank you.
My pleasure, Dunna, glad it was helpful!
I think Doug might have pinpointed the essence of the Buddha's dharma for Bahiya. "Allowing the mind to get in between us and what we are seeing and what we are experiencing" is exactly what we all do that the Buddha's dharma warns us about.
The Diamond Sutra has a very similar dharma. "we should know everything as it is, see everything as it is, understand and accept everything as it is, without any subjective reconstruction of what we see, hear, ...."
Yes, that sounds similar. Thanks!
Profound! A clearer exposition is hard to come by. People hear similar instructions in many traditions and still find it hard to understand. One of the reasons might be that the process of separating from direct experience is deeply engrained and many don't believe it's possible to break away. Others won't see any use in doing so, they have no "faith" that "seeing only what is seen" is of any use. To become detached from clinging to worldly concerns seems counterintuitive.
The scientific trend is towards the theory of "predictive processing", which sees the mind as always filtering perceptions through past experiences, of anticipating and conceptualizing experience. It's a way of conserving energy.
Life can be more. Like Rumi's parrot, we have to listen to the message if we want to fly away to a better place.
Thank you kindly Angel. Yes, "predictive processing" I think is even a method used for designing CPUs in computers.
Interesting! I had always interpreted this passage as a straight up Anatta teaching - there are only 6 sense, 5 aggregates - no you. But clinging in regard to the sense makes sense!
I also love the mindfulness passage halfway through (was it SN 95.35??) - the passage and it’s meaning have inspired me to double down on daily mindfulness outside of mediation.
Great video!
Thanks so much, glad you found it worthwhile!
Wonderful summary
Thank you kindly. 🙏
I wonder.. There's a practice among, I believe, some indigenous Japanese in which they make clothing out of bark. In this case, they soften the inner bark by pounding the fibers down into sheets and fashion that into clothing. Fascinating stuff!
It appears this was common among pacific islanders, to the steppes of Asia, to Africa. Wikipedia has a neat article about it.
Interesting! I think though in this case that the clothing is intended as an ascetic practice, that is it wouldn't be intended to be comfortable. It's rather like the other ascetic Ajita Kesakambali is so-named because he wore a blanket made of human hair.
@@DougsDharma I love it! That must've been a sight to behold. I'm itching just thinking about it
Thank you Doug. I like the explanation of by that and in that. It explains the process of relishing sense object to identifying with it creating a Self.
You're very welcome, and thanks for the comment!
Well spoken! Essentially, I hear the Buddha emphasizing mindfulness in everyday life. Not practicing mindfulness results in more dukkha throughout the day and practicing mindfulness results in less dukkha throughout the day. The aim is no dukkha throughout every day thus leading to nibbana: the extinguishing of samsara. For me, it is time to double down on yoniso manasikara (wise reflection). Might you be inclined towards a video on that subject? 😊
Thanks Aron! Ah yes, yoniso manasikara. I'll put that on the list and if I can figure out a good way to present it I will!
Yes, wise attention is the critical factor towards stream entry. An important topic.
I would love to learn more about this! Your comments sparked my curiosity, thank you.
@@lillystern In MN2 Sabbasava sutta, effluent to be abandoned by seeing, has some details of how it should be practiced. In essence, it is to observe to process of how dukkha arises and ceases, thereby establishing right view.
Thank you.
My pleasure, Jason.
I don’t think simply being with things as they are solves it since there can still be desire and passion for what is seen. As the poem says, “When you see a sight, mindfulness is lost as attention latches onto a pleasant feature.” The point about desire not being in the unseen sight shows that the fetters are not inherent in any of the of the sense media. It’s the desire or passion for the sense media that is the fetter. One escape from this is to train the mind not to fabricate perceptions of beauty (called pleasant features in the poem). This is what “in the seen there will only be the seen” means. When there is no perception of beauty or pleasant feature, then there is nothing for consciousness to latch onto. So, it cannot be said to be by that, in that, here, beyond, or between. This state is described by the analogy of a ray of light shining through a window. If the opposite wall, ground, and water are taken away, the light has no where to land.
Right, the fetters aren't inherent in sense media, otherwise it would be impossible for an arahant to overcome them during this lifetime.
I want to ask you people about something I've been thinking about. Is a lot of the teaching designed so that it catapults you forward and at some point you let go of it? Like the metaphor of the cobbled together raft? As an analogy take a space rocket. The booster rockets drop off when they're spent and the vessel keeps going. Thanks Doug for warming my cockles btw. I'm really missing my Buddhist friends during restrictions.
It's my pleasure, Sam! Glad to have you here. As to your question, I did an earlier video on the raft parable that might help: ua-cam.com/video/4hDmFFXT_sg/v-deo.html
Thanks for another comprehensive and informative video. I was unaware of the second sutta you pointed out. My interpretation of the Bahya Sutta has always been that when you have only bare knowledge of your senses than the illusion of self vanishes. I think you are saying the same thing using terms related to greed, attachment, and volition in general instead of bare knowledge. Please let me know if I am mistaken.
I think it meant not to crave for and grasp on to whatever that is experienced. Experiences are fleeting and grasping onto them is going to create dukkha.
Thanks Dread, yes it might be the same thing, "bare knowledge" isn't really a concept we get in early Buddhism but I think the discourse is pointing in that direction.
I think it would be interesting to discuss this teaching and how it relates to emptiness.
Yes there are many ways they could be seen to interrelate.
Enlightenment in a few words similar to the sudden insight of Zen Buddhism where a Zen master suddenly makes a breakthrough and gets enlightened
Yes, but one question is whether this breakthrough is to literal, full enlightenment or instead to something more like stream-entry, a glimpse of enlightenment.
@@DougsDharma Perhaps it just refers to a realization of non-self
Thank you for making this wisdom accessible in english in an understandable presentation. Is your recent book buddhist wisdom available on Amazon? I am in India.
You're very welcome Rajendra. Yes, the book is on Amazon and should be available worldwide. 🙏
@@DougsDharma Just bought the book.
Until my appointment for enlightenment I would like to have a pair of glasses like the colorful filter you seem to use in these videos. Would make the waiting period more fun.
😄 You mean the lights in back?
@@DougsDharma Yes I guess so
As I see it, Bahia was a forest yogi, so he was already close to Enlightenment, so it did not take that much to push him all the way there.
Is it possible to retract reactions entirely, without any sort of higher order thinking to ground yourself? Releasing from the need to analyze. I'm finding that I'm doing this an increasing amount in some areas of my life and its letting me enjoy the present more. I used to try very hard to get my mind in order, but now it feels like I'm not trying at all and I'm just releasing. Is this what we should strive towards? Because it feels intuitive and right to me.
Side note but Im aware of the irony of this being an object of desire for me, lol.
That desire is part of the path. 😊 But yes, I think one aspect of practice is that we stop needing to analyze so much.
@@DougsDharma Its interesting that I spent so many years and so much energy trying to fix myself just to realize that there isnt anything fundamentally wrong. That gave me the toolset to let off the gas, and now im focusing mostly on observing what my mind is doing. I still want some parts of my ego and am okay with it, but I want to give it a green light to stay rather than occur without awareness. Anyways thanks a lot, great content on your channel
Blessings
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Interesting, thank you. You should read the Surangama Sutra , in there are mentioned 25 means to enlightenment and which one is the best and the ultimate. different practices can lead to the initial enlightenment but for complete enlightenment and Buddhahood only one method can bring one to that ultimate nirvana and is the Quan Yin method. Quan Yin means listening inwardly to ones own self nature . it is the vibration which creates and sustains the whole multiverse and is the voice of God or spirit and is known as the 'word ' in the bible. it can be heard by a specific method of meditation imparted by a living master at the time of initiation . the inner sound is very real and not something abstract . it can be heard clearly and manifests as innumerable sounds in different levels of consciousness and sounds like beautiful melodious heavenly music. it's known in many traditions by different names such as Anahad naad, Shabd, Naam , the logos , the music of the spheres the saut-e- sarmod of the Sufi's , the voice of the silence in theosophy, the audible life stream ,the cosmic sound ,the Aum , the heavenly melody the celestial sound stream etc etc. all refer to the same primordial sound which is the direct connection to the source or Nirvana and by listening to it we become fully enlightened. it is mentioned in that Sutra that all Buddhas use that vibration to come and go from Nirvana . My spiritual teacher Supreme Master Ching Hai offers initiation into this practice free of charge to sincere aspirants. Namaste
Thanks for the information, Matthew. 🙏
@@DougsDharmaYour welcome Doug
My master would say that some people do the work, and then see the truth. Some other people see the truth, and then do the work.One way or another the work will have to be done. I'm pretty sure that wasn't his teaching, but a teaching that he was passing along.
Yes there are definitely different routes to the same end.
"Transcending flesh could be a breeze
Sending me over the Moon"
from The red hot chili peppers' "Transcending"
Neat, can we transcend mind as well? 🤔 🙂
@@DougsDharma That is a good tease! I do not know the answer. Is the mind only the voice in our heads? Or is it the lens through which we experience every perception?
The voice seems possible to silence, but removing our mental goggles sounds like turning-off all perception, or like forgetting all memory and perceiving anew...
(Great topics!)
13:42 - impermanence, sometimes it feels like I just died when i notice it but that's probably a load of papanca
I think you're on to something. Enjoying a picture might not be the best way to fully absorb what it looks like. You might need a different practice to get a photographic memory. If it is not fully absorbed, it can be hard to manifest in altered states. You see, I think that for desire to be fully extinguished, you need a state that allows you to interact with your desire and satisfy it. You must remember what is dukkha, what is the problem specifically Sidartha sat down to solve. There are many different types of dukkha. Nirvana means liberation. The liberation means the cessation if these dukkhas.
I HATE YOU
I LOVE YOU
Enlightened
I LOVE YOU ALL
I LOVE
LOVE
Awakened
The end
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My interpretation of here, in-between and there (Malunkyaputta's poem based on access to insight translation).
{here}
Seeing a form
-mindfulness lapsed-
{in-between}
attending to the theme of ‘endearing,’
impassioned in mind,
one feels
and remains fastened on it.
One’s feelings, born of the form,
grow numerous,
{there}
Greed & annoyance
injure one’s mind.
Thus amassing stress,
one is said to be far
from unbinding.
{second scenario with mindfulness - here}
Not impassioned with forms
-seeing a form with mindfulness firm-
{in-between}
dispassioned in mind,
one knows
and doesn’t remain fastened on it.
While one is seeing a form
-and even experiencing feeling-
it falls away and doesn’t accumulate.
{there}
Thus one fares mindfully.
Thus not amassing stress,
one is said to be
in the presence of unbinding.
Yes it's a neat little poem isn't it? Thanks for your interpretation!
@@DougsDharma yes indeed. And it summarised the Dhamma that is good in the beginning, middle and end very well. Malunkyaputta has came a long way from his confused state in the early days.
Keep going. Don't ever stop posting videos on YT. Also please lower your books kindle price for India. In India due to currency exchange rates your book peice is nearly 750 ruppees. We never pay more than 300 rupees for any book in India.
Thanks T G, I hope to continue for quite awhile! As for the book price, it's set worldwide, I can't change it for one country.
Seems like this is basically dzogchen/mahamudra or other formless practices? Pointing out instructions + leaving phenomena on their own, with no imputation of a “self” (just halfway through video rn so sorry if you already said this)
Sure, those practices would have arisen partly out of such teachings.
Last night I had a lucid dream in which I invented a wellness product and named it "Doug's Dharmah". So I inadvertently stole this channel's name lol. Anybody else dream about this channel in one way or another?
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There are so many teachings asking us to be here, in the now. What I take from this is that everything else can be here, as it is, but You, No.
Everything is just as it is. Dukkha is grasping at what's not.
No it's not possible to be enlightened just by listening to a word. A lot of you guys deceiving yourselves by thinking you can become enlightened by just listening and understanding intellectually. Didn't you know that Bahiya in his previous life was also a follower of the Buddha at that time?
In other words he had cultivated in his past lifetime so that's why he was able to be enlightened that easily
If that's the case then how did you know we weren't followers of the buddha in previous lifetimes.
Serious I cannot take anyone with a Makima profile seriously. It always seem to be a simp.