up in the cold climates, its the go to, now. I've seen it survive minor freezes and contract back (nearly) to original size. Just about every new construction and full remodel site I've been on, is using pex. Crimp, cinch or expansion though, never shark bite.
Duck Multiverse it’s not rust, mostly chloramines used by city to treat water. Also old water heater deposits steel in the pipe then electrolysis causes corrosion and you get a pinhole. Copper coating 4x what PEX does is a big factor too.
Primary advantage is it's cheaper.. also easier to install without screwing up. Also when the asshole plumber lays half of it on top of your steel ducts with no insulators, it doesn't rot in 3-5 years and flood out your basement.
@@ericconner9971 I wont use them unless I absolutely have to or in an emergency and I always try to come back later with a proper fix. I have seen too many fail to rely on them for permanent use.
@@georgemckenzie2525 I have had a mouse chew though some I installed, luckely it was accesable and I heard the leak not long after it happend. that mouse is now dead but it is a huge flaw no one ever talks about.
I rebuilt an 82 dodge motor home into a fishing motor home and plumbed everything with PEX then a tree fell on the motor home right down the middle, thanks a lot PEX's.
@@danielrouw2593 I like your filter idea. 👍 That's the problem with these cheap LED lights and their drivers. They don't use sufficient capacitors, because of cost. Or worse, they overdrive and oversell the LED's, and rely on the brief down time to get the device through it's 90 day warranty without catching fire.
Just a note on PEX. You said it was a thermo-plastic, but the cross-linking process actually converts the HDPE base to a thermoset in nature and behaves more like a elastomer. This increases it's temperature stability quite a bit along with other qualities that are beneficial to it's purpose.
The shark-bite relieved the pressure over 500psi and then sealed back up? Thats awesome. Built in relief valve. Why does he dislike pex? Because its somewhat related to swelling plastic seals?
so it didn't go off until the weaner was laying on its back exhausted and covered in shmoo, and even then it needed assistance in just the right spot.... why does that sound familiar.
That's another thing we scratch our heads over in Europe. Sausages on the grill should get smaller as they loose fat and the cheap ones will also loose injected water as well. WTF is in that stuff you eat that it gets bigger?!?!?
My friend thank you for the hours of what some would call boring information. You make the even the most technical drawn out explanations great to listen to and watch with your Canadian humor. Thank you for being an encyclopedia of knowledge that actually keeps it interesting.
We use PEX too in Western Europe. I used the ALPEX, which is PEX with a aluminium layer in between. No leaks since 15 years. I had some leaks, but all in the fittings, mainly the shut-off valves of the central heating system which runs mostly at 70°C
One of the biggest advantages of PEX piping is the lack of fittings. I’m a plumber by trade in Florida. So being able to run the piping through the attic and not having 90’s to run down to a wall creates one less possibility of a failed fitting. And we have noticed through the ten years or so it’s been used that it’s able to handle thermal expansion really well (Attics can reach 145*F During the summer). Copper is being replaced everyday due to salt water intrusion and rot. So for now this is the best stuff to use.
Pex ain't so bad. One good thing about it, I've seen it swell when the line freezes. Normal copper lines bust when water freezes inside. It sounds like that's the main reason a lot of guys are starting to use it.
Speed of installation, not needing access around the fitting for crimping etc (for push fit like sharkbite). Doesn’t get stolen. Can re use sharkbite fittings and twist them once pushed in. All those reasons really
Pex works better than copper where freezing is an issue, such as where tenants are responsible for remembering to keep the heat on in your property if they leave town. It usually will not burst in the pipe itself, as long as you strategically place the fittings (crimp are much stronger than Sharkbite) in less freeze-prone locations then you can save a lot of flooding hassles. When it gets -25F or below here and the 40mph winds kick up, I've had copper pipe runs in the exterior walls freeze if no one is using water and they have the heat down to 55 degrees, no problems with Pex yet.
That would be very interesting, I think. A force test on those cheap models your job throws at you would be cool too. I never trust anything my boss says is safe. 🤨
There is a lot to like about PEX, especially when you get to proper crimped connections. It's easy to work with even in tight spaces. No scorch marks on your 2x4 from repair work. You can put a joint together on a pipe with a leaking upstream valve. I'm a little concerned about aging down the road. We've been down the plastic pipe road before with less than ideal results. Copper has problems as well, especially when attached to dis-similar metals.
Worked in an area where the static pressure was 90 psi from gravity. Had a poor shift changeover and watched that pressure jump over 200. Water hammer shook the entire system for half an hour as we tried to find which valve got closed.
I worked at a house where all the hydronic heating had been put together with PEX and SharkBites, they lost power during a hurricane for about a week, and it all froze, all the fittings failed but none of the PEX showed any damage.
Hurricane sandy knocked out the east coast of USA in 2010-12and a snowstorm with freezing cold temperatures impacted much of the disaster area two days after.
After working with water treatment equipment for 5 years, pex beats copper. Troublesome water (high hardness or iron content) will absolutely shred copper much faster than pex and associated fittings.
So glad you did this. I use copper mostly because I enjoy soldering & the many other reasons copper can be beneficial. When I bought my 1st house & was picking up some parts to get rid of a bit of galvanized in the house an employee at the home dippo tried selling me on the shark bite pex combo because "it can expand to 10x it's size".
In Romania we used PEX-Al pipes as replacement for the older steel pipes which tend to rust. The problem with PEX-Al is that the pipes tend to leak at the fittings or even pop out. Recently, plumbers started using PPR for water and heating(distribution from the furnace to the radiators), there's no metal and the fittings are heat welded to the pipes.
I'm a plumber, polyethylene pipe is used all over England for all applications even natural gas. I think the main advantage of plastique over copper is the freezing properties, copper freezes and splits at about -6°C but plastic can stretch a bit more. I use plastic 90% of the time even though I personally prefer working with copper, much more satisfying soldering a fitting than just slipping one over the end 😉
I replaced our water heater a few years back and needed to replace the circulation lines as well and I saved so much time and money using PEX that I swore I'd never use anything else for water lines. Ended up doing the whole house system in it and never had a leak in 14 years. Thing I liked about was time saved on having to make joints and elbows and the like in tight spaces since you can just loop it around. Now there are places I'd still use something rated for higher pressure, especially in hard to reach or sealed up installs but it's good for general home use.
Here in north Europe pex is used as the main type of pipe now. The fittings are either push fit like these shark bite fittings or Rems squeeze fittings.
Pex works great but not the shark bite fittings. Ive never seen a shark bite fail, but it's just common sense to me that a copper crimp fitting is superior to a shark bite. I've installed thousands of copper crimp fittings and never had a failure nor have I seen one fail. It's imperative that the crimp tool is squared up properly to the crimp ring to guarantee a good crimp. I'll never go back to sweating pipe. Try freezing a pex pipe assembly. It just expands and bounce back to shape when it thaws. Try that with copper.
Residential plumbing in the U.S. does indeed now allow for blue or green pex. The color code helps speed up installation, especially in multistory buildings. All the pex naysayers need to see this. And what was the sharkbite fitting rated for? No where near 500 psi. Extensive testing has found little difference in performance between hot or cold usage.
I recently re-plumbed my whole central heating with PEX pipe (JG Speedfit) and I much prefer it to copper for two main reasons: one, it bends; two I can dismount the fittings and change things if I need to. Other than one broken o ring that was from a dodgy fitting (it was free, I should have checked it more closely) it's absolutely fine. I can never find much information about the thermal conductivity compared to copper though, just that it should be lagged too - my main aim is that the radiators get hot and I heat my house, not the ventilated gap underneath the house. Would be curious to know about the surface finish of the inside of the pipe compared to copper (both bright copper and some full of Copper I oxide) and see what effect that has on flow
PEX was originally designed for Radiant Heat Applications. Many Contractors will use it when pouring concrete(they put it inside the concrete) to prevent ice and snow buildup. I haven't shoveled snow since I installed mine in the driveway and walkways around here. Installed it in 2007 and I live where it gets below zero in the Winter .
We do have a type of layered plastic pipe that is some kind of plastic, Aluminum, and another layer plastic prewrapped in with some insulation in Germany. I don't know how it would compare in terms of strength and how much its rated for but the waterline coming in is reduced to 5 Bar, at least in my house. My guess would also be that the sharkbite fitting are the same here and if i remember the design correctly the crimp on fittings we used would also allow the fluid to leak because the actual sealing is done by a o-ring and the crimp basically just prevents the fitting from being pushed off.
I'm a Master Plumber and retired from plumbing in 2007 and at that time I was running Pex almost exclusively for water. I've never used one of those damn Shark Bites but can see the value in certain situations but still feel their main purpose is so the average citizen doesn't have to call a professional. But copper had gotten so expensive that it had to be specked on plans or requested by a customer or I was running Pex. I was a late adopter too and was one of the last plumbing contractors still running copper after Pex was adopted into the Code. My contractors didn't like it when I started using it because my copper was always so pretty and you just can't make Pex look like you can make hard copper look. Everything straight and plumb and all the joints wiped, etc. They hated when I stopped running iron pipe for gas even more though and one contractor (Glen) paid extra for me to run black iron gas lines on his jobs long after I'd started running gas flex. He always took photos of the jobs in different stages and said it was like art work. I remember a home builder asked Glen if he could take a tour through a home that we were building as his personal residence. All of the water was copper and the gas was black iron with no less than 11 drops. I had everything pressured up and was ready for the top out inspection. But this home builder stopped where I was working and handed me his card and commented that he builds million dollar houses and wondered aloud why he couldn't get plumbing work that looks like mine? We were outside the shower in the master bath that Glen's crew had nicknamed "the car wash" because it was a four person shower (Don't judge) with body sprays through-out and I answered him bluntly: "Because you're not willing to pay for it". He then asked if I'd be interested in bidding one of his jobs and I told him sure, but if I don't get the bid don't bother to send me any more plans because my time is too valuable for people to waste. But that's how I learned 40+ years ago when I was an apprentice, use a level and measure everything twice and if it isn't plumb and level, redo that section until it is and damnit, wipe the flux off of your copper! Thanks for this demonstration! I just discovered you last night and the scope of work that I've seen so far has been impressive. Very impressive! It should be noted, I think, that Pex will freeze if exposed to sub freezing temperatures but doesn't split or burst like copper and especially PVC or CPVC will when it freezes. And mice was also a concern so companies developed a PEX with an aluminized coating (FostaPex) they couldn't chew their way through. Viega makes FostaPex and if other companies make something similar I am not familiar with it but that coating also helped make it run a little bit straighter and look a little bit better, you just have to be sure and mark hot and cold because it is all the same color.
My German friend said his house in Germany has water pipes that are stainless steel pipes lined with pex that are crimped to fittings with a hydraulic crinping tool.
the pex tubing is used for hot water in europe. at work we make some 7x1,5mm HDPE pipes for fibre optics in germany. the had to hold about 1100 PSI in 80 degree c water for about 150 hours.
I've had 3/4" PEX with copper crimp fittings in my shop for 5 years now with 0 leaks or problems . I run 125 PSI in it and there is a lot of it , with many tees and drops . I shut the air valve off at the tank every night and it doesn't leak down unless I leave something chucked in the end of an air hose that leaks . It's so easy to install that I wouldn't consider anything else . Supposedly it is not uv resistant , though .
If you have stress instead of an easy slide, you went too light on the coffee. Or you've been afflicted with an "accessible" seat height to get your innards in a bind. You want as close to squatting as you can get, straightens the works out for less resistance.
As a full time RVer Pex saved our pipes more then once on cold winters. The Pex line can expand when the water freezes, while copper splits and has to be replaced.
Every home I've owned in Texas has had copper pipes burst or generally fail over time. I replace all of it with PEX, crimped of course. It's easier to work with and way cheaper than copper. I just solder on a PEX adapter or threaded fitting and a shut-off valve if possible and replace everything above with PEX
I've been in apartment buildings where they've used CPVC (the white Sched 40 stuff, rated for irrigation and drainage) as their main water lines, then use a MIPxPex adapter. Had to use a brand new type of glue and primer that came onto the market. So new, in fact, my boss never heard of it. Well, let me tell you: regardless of what it says on the website it does NOT set and cure in fifteen minutes. I found that out the hard way. Cost me my job too.
@Mother Algorithm Not much else to say. There was an ongoing leak down into the basement parkade and they tracked the leak down to the pipe chase in the ceiling of a suite's half bath up on the third floor. The call came in on a Sunday night, and I have no idea why they couldn't wait for Monday morning. Especially since almost no wholesalers carry the stuff. I had to call around to three of them before I found one who assured me they'd have it at their main location. I got the fittings I figured I'd need (paid an extra $150 to open late Sunday which we pass onto the customer) and the pipe was just rigid enough that I had to install a swing joint to make it fit using four 90 degree fittings. The website my boss looked up said it sets in fifteen minutes I think, so when I glued it all together I let it cure for half an hour. It held for about five minutes, enough time for the building rep who was manning the building shutoffs to get to the elevator and come up. Lots of damage to the drywall and such. Now if you want to talk about a real head scratcher, try Aqua Rise pipe. That stuff is supposed to be hot shit but it's a headache. It's dense plastic usually in a dull navy blue with a really slick coating so carrying more than a couple sticks at a time is fun, but the real fun is cutting and gluing it together. According to manufacturer specs the outer edge of the pipe needs to be beveled with an angle grinder to give some room in the fitting for the glue to go which adds to the mess, but the real evil is the primer. It's real caustic stuff. If you want to find any nicks or scrapes on your hands you use PVC primer; the sting means it's working. But Aqua Rise primer? That stuff is pure pain. Feels like your hand's getting stabbed wherever there's a scrape. Oh, also: never, NEVER use a bristle brush and glue pot to apply it to the pipe and fittings. It's caustic enough that it makes the bristles fall out onto the pipe and fittings (fun,) as well as bleach them thoroughly (even more fun.) And bristles are hollow too, yay! You end up with pinhole leaks all over the place that way. So use the cotton ball-type applicator. Or just avoid the stuff in the first place.
@@RedneckTimelord This was a while ago and it doesn't bring up good memories so I try to put it out of my head and so a lot of the details are fuzzy (legal weed and plentiful beer does that too, I've heard,) I'm fairly certain it was indeed CPVC pipe and fittings, which like I've said is usually used just for irrigation and drainage for things like high efficiency furnaces or for hot water tank drain pans. Here in western Canada domestic water is almost always carried in a) Copper, b) Pex, c) Wirsbo, so seeing an entire building, especially one that was a 1920s office building renovated over into bougie loft style apartments, piped in CPVC was a bit of a puzzle to me.
@@ChrisGilliamOffGrid That's pretty much up in the air. Some say it's because the crimping was improperly done, some that it reacts to UV radiation and sunlight, some that it reacts to oxidents in the water which sublimate out in hot water especially, same with chlorine. All I know is that you can't use regular pex fittings on it. Adapt with a coupling first. Plus it gets brittle with age so try not to bend the stuff if you're working with it.
Love sharkbites. Don't mess with much plumbing other than home diy / remodeling. Usually only use them on pvc or to switch from old copper to pvc. In florida so don't have to worry about freezing.
I also found it to be great for running air lines around the shop. Also just buy the clamps and tool. Cheaper in the long run and less risk of malfunction.
Same here in Europe/Germany, everybody is using those tubes because they can be fitted together so quickly. But I do agree, copper piping is still superior and you don't need expensive tools to press them together (except when using copper piping with press fittings instead of soldering them).
So, PEX - plastic time! True PEX means PolyEthylene-Crosslinked. Extremely tough material, and a great water barrier (and moisture barrier) but not actually a great air barrier.. well... It gets better when you cross link it.. but I digress. PE isn't hygroscopic (unlike Nylon which is quite hygroscopic and actually plasticizes with moisture) Cross-linking also essentially makes the whole thing one giant polymer chain, and the polymer no longer "melts". It will soften but you could not melt process it again. In summary: PE is not effected by moisture. PEX (not polybutyl) is great for hot water applications. PE doesn't degrade over time. Doesn't degrade with UV (not that this would be an issue) And the cross-linking makes sure it isn't melting and adds a whole heap of toughness to it.
Regular PE will melt back down, PEX will not. Once PE is crosslinked(the X) and becomes PEX it can withstand over 500F and still not melt to dripping stage. The crosslink creates a Memory as it strengthens the material and will return to that memory as it cools down or thaws out. Regular PE is extruded around 200F and has no memory to it, which allows it to be melted back down and recycled. Also, the problem with irradiated PEX is that not all PE resins are the same and each batch of resin reacts different to the process. Chemically crosslinked eliminates that variable as it's being extruded.
@@charlessharp9795 yup! Well... I agree with everything other than the irradiated vs chemical comment. But perhaps that's because the company I work for makes and maintains our own irradiation equipment for our film work. 😂 But perhaps it's just pride talking.
@@bradleynealdaley I've had experience producing both types. Chemically crossed is done during the extrusion process and effects all PE the same. Irradiated is extruded and then processed through the BEAM to crosslink it. The facility where I worked order the Resin from several suppliers and we discovered that each brand of resin reacted different to the beaming process. They were all strong but the difference was seen during the Quality testing. Some resins burst sooner at lower temps and pressures where others were much stronger and could handle higher temps and pressures. The other noticeable difference was the finish of the pipe itself. Some would come out with a type of rough finish and others had a smooth finish. Dull versus Shiny. We discovered slight differences in the processes used by the Suppliers when they produced the Resin Beads and some were softer where others were harder. That hardness/softness affects the finish and overall strength. Don't get me wrong, the softer stuff was still stronger than ANSI required, but we could see a difference when testing the Quality under extreme conditions.
We’ve used them in Finland for over 30 years, and I’ve never seen or heard of any failures. But, we run them inside a tube, so if they start leaking, it spills over in the boiler room where there’s a floor drain anyhow. It’s also very handy if a drywall fitter screws right trough the line, just find the offending screw, loosen the line at both ends and pull it out and shove a new one right back in.
Great test, thanks for this. I ran sharkbite for air distribution around my workshop. I've had a few people reckon it wasnt safe. I was confident it was more than safe and you have confirmed it.
Alupex is usually used in heating, because that aluminium layer makes it gas tight. There's also PEX with glass fibre layer, for the same reason. Normal PEX will allow gasses to migrate into installation, creating airpockets. It doesn't really matter in case of water delivery system, as the process is slow, so there you can use PE or PP pipes.
In the UK we dont really use alupex, our plastic pipes all have an oxygen barrier though. Not sure what it is, but it appears to be just a different plastic. The oxygen barrier isn't so much for preventing air pockets, but if oxygen gets into a heating system it dissolves in the water and causes corrosion issues.
@@98dizzard you also don't use metric ;-) just kidding.( No but really...) Polyethylene is very chemically inert and doesn't leaches molecules into the water. It's also cheaper then PP per ton. As for PP its way more difficult to work with than PE because it's so tough. Making clean cuts would be a pain. (Unless using modifiers in the plastic... Wich can Leach into your water.
I do new construction plumbing and run houses everyday with pex. It’s some tough stuff to be plastic. 1” pex and a crimped coupling works great as a tow rope in a pinch. Also to test the houses for inspection we pump it up to 140psi and it sits and holds for weeks. I have yet to throw enough air to it for the pex itself to fail.
@@mattberg6816 for sure Viaga makes great products. I sold plumbing products for 12 years, starting just before all the new lines of pex fittings started coming around. I really like the Viaga stuff, hands down the fastest installation of all the brands.
PEX is absolutely awesome stuff. Crimp on fittings are my go to but the press fittings are surprisingly good. The biggest advantage of PEX is that it doesn't break as easy due to freezing. You can have a PEX line froze solid, filled with water, and it wont explode like copper will. Plus its cheap, easy, and fast to replace a broken PEX line vs copper. I cant really think of a reason I would install copper over PEX in almost any situation. I guess if I was going to do something with really hot water or in direct thermal transfer from an exchange, then id use copper.
'It was April the 41st Being a quadruple leap year I was driving through downtown Atlantis My Barracuda was in the shop, so I was in a rented Stingray And it was overheating So I pulled into a Shell station They said I'd blown a seal I said, "Fix the damn thing And leave my private life out of it Okay, pal?” '
Had to use pex and sharkbite replacing an hose silcock. Was built into an interior wall cavity and through the flooring. After cutting the subfloor out around the copper was the only way to make the 90 turn from the exterior wall and through into the crawl space. Beat having to do a drywall repair though.
I've had stuff that was 2 ish years old that shattered in my face when i tried to use a tubing cutter. I'm pretty sure the guy had turned his water heater waaay up. Thankfully i had the safety squints on.
I repair foundations in florida and irrigation pvc is always brittle as hell no matter when it was installed. We end up breaking pipes often along the sides of house. Then we gotta fix em.
That plastic piping is pretty much universally used here in the UK too, has been for at least 15-20 years. Both in domestic water supply, and also central heating runs to radiators.
Plastic plumbing i s massive over here in the uk. Every single volume built home since the late 90's has been plumbed in the stuff. gas lines are still copper thou. Also an interesting point is that whilst heating systems are exclusively plastic, larger systems with circulating domestic hot water lines have to be done in copper
When I bought my house 6.5yrs ago, someone stole most of the copper pipe the night before I was supposed to close. Good for me! I got 2 new water heaters and the missing pipe was replaced (with pex). So far so good. I left my outdoor spigot on one winter and brass split, but pex was good. I'll let you know in 15 more years I have issues. 🤷♀️
14 years and counting here and I've never turned off my Spigot. I live in Ohio(USA) and sometimes it gets pretty cold(-20F) in the Winter. My neighbors, however, have to fix their Copper almost every year because it freezes and breaks open. PEX tubing is so strong, I even used some 1 1/2" to build a structure for a Greenhouse. Built in 2007 and it's still holding up great. I used to make the stuff, I know how tough the stuff really is.
I'm considering a DIY reno to expose my roof trusses, because 8' ceilings suck. Will need to re-route the wet wall, and due to space, accessibility and budget I am very drawn toward PEX. But I have Fears Concerning PEX. Content like this matters to me!
I was going to comment the same thing: Very common in France on account of easy installation and very high labor costs. As for longevity, if people have any sense they install it in a conduit, so if it leaks, the water comes out at one end or the other, so it's quickly noticed and doesn't destroy the walls. And being in a conduit, you can usually pull a new pipe through, maybe having to cut a few holes in the walls for access, but that's it.
@@fartingfury but if your taking the time and spending the money to use conduit on it then your loosing out on the savings of time and money of pex, so you may as well just use better pipes.
@@ahndeux I guess you're thinking of rigid conduit that has to be laboriously assembled from rigid pieces, in which case, yeah, you're right, just use copper (or multi-layer tubes, whatever). What I used is flexible conduit that came with PEX tube already inside, so apart from trimming back some conduit at each end (like stripping a wire, I guess) there's no extra effort required: Pull the whole lot through and fix it in place as if it were bare PEX. The conduit also shields UV, which is important if it's exposed anywhere (though I've seen it exposed outside for years without bursting, not that I'd fancy trying that myself).
Yes i see it used a lot of the time here in France in new constructions. Also used for under floor heating systems and all sorts ! I think the regulations make it obligatory to have crimp on fittings.
This is also a great explanation for why pipes burst when they freeze. Water expands about 9% when frozen, causing a massive pressure spike, the ice isn't what breaks the pipe, it's the pressure.
Wirsbo has so many advantages, I love how it will go back to faktree configuration with just some BTUs! And, unlike German women, it never stretches out at the fittin' ends!
I searched the comments until I found an Uponor comment, just to give it a thumbs up! Great product and company. Get the 3" ProPEX fittings, Milwaukee cold expansion tool, and their 3" tubing... Impressive stuff!
If AVE tests on the Uponor Pex, I hope he includes a bit on the chemical differences of how the irradiation process is different during manufacture and how it can recover from kinks unlike the inferior pexs.
@@timkunsa7249 Uponor PEX is not cross linked with irradiation, it is chemically crosslinked during extrusion. I agree that hearing of the differences between PEX-A and B would be interesting for many. I do the kink demonstration often and it gets everyone excited!
Great video, impressed with the pressure the pex can hold. However when twisting the shark bite fitting on, or when you spun it around to make the hotdog stay in place you compromised the "bite" of the fitting. I've used them before but only in emergency situations where tools couldn't access the fitting or severe risk of fire were present. Pex pipe has worked very well where I live (southern coast of NC) BUT if it is exposed to the sun and salt for a decent amount of time, picture a sink on the end of a dock, it will rupture at 32° guaranteed.
They take a lot less pressure when a ham fisted apprentice has dragged them on the skew through a hole and gouged a canyon down one side big enough to prove your whomp rat disassembling ability in. You barely tickled it with that yellow handled splinter remover.
When I lived in Texas, I lived in two rentals with poly tube (not PEX but same basic design, all grey lines, thinner wall thickness) both rather old, and most of the issues I had with leaks were the joining fittings, especially elbows and Ts corroding and cracking. The two times I had the plastic lines break, it was due to Freeze damage. I've also never seen rodent damage to either PEX or the grey poly. The poly I know had some additive (capsaisin iirc) supposed to keep them from gnawing on it)
Buddy redid half his house in 04 with sharkbites and Pex. Still working today without leaks. Solder will always be better but sharkbites aren' t the worst thing u can do either.
@@gearjammergamer8560 The main failure mode for Sharkbites and similar connectors is burrs and sharp edges mangling the rubber seals. Break pipe edges so they don't damage seals on their way in and those push connectors should last a long time.
Sharkbite's great if there's little clearance and the copper's full of water. I've done a few hot swaps like that. Very dicey. Note: they do make a deburring tool for sharkbite that's mainly meant for pex but it does work on copper for a few times. Otherwise I give it a few passes with the sandcloth.
Best things about Pex: easier to install, cheaper, no hot soldering torch by your floor joists, no cracking when frozen. Most plumbers in my area charge WAY higher labor for copper pipe work compared to pex. Some won't even bother with copper at all anymore. PS the best fitting method for pex are the compressed copper rings, though they require a special tool to attach.
The real fun happens when you take the class to get your Swagelok card and get to destroy a piece of copper tubing after you practice putting fittings on it. That stuff'll take a couple thousand PSI or more before it blows out like that plastique did. They have a special machine that pressures the assemblies up with water so they don't explode like they would with air. It just leaves a nice tear in the side wall and you end up with a fun paper weight for your desk.
I used Swagelok for decades in science and development applications. I don't ever remember a properly installed fitting leaking. For that matter most improperly installed Swageloks don't leak.
@@mwechtal They work great but are always out of stock ,take forever to arrive and cost a fortune. There are flexible alternatives for up to 45000psi now.
@@Chris_Garman our application was for a particular alloy, and the storeroom kept them in stock. I only needed about 200 psi. I did have to wait for a needle valve once. I swear they had to mine the ore to get started manufacturing one. It was months.
Pex has a few things going for it over copper in the house. Most household water pressure is only 40-60psi. Plastic pipe in general has less resistance to flow than copper, so you get more pressure out of your faucets with the smaller lines. To add to that it also tends to not get the scale build up that copper and iron does. It's more end user serviceable. Most people aren't going to know how to sweat a copper pipe properly. just about anyone can cut out a bad section of pex and push on a couple of fittings. You also save on labor and down time. My grandfathers house had all copper and every other week we were fixing pin hole leaks. My cousin and i cut all of that out, replaced with pex and he had water again in a fraction of the time it would have taken us to rebuild the water lines with copper. Neither him nor i are plumbers.
Yep I use them all the time with crimp fittings, have a Rems 20v Mini crimper with 16mm,20mm,25mm,32mm and 40mm jaws, i have all the reamer sizes for my drill to as well as manual one's, the fittings have a inspection window to see if you pushed the pipe all the way through. I'm sure you use the same stuff, very rarely get a leak, only if someone tries to bend the pipe right at the fitting or does not ream it properly
You should try it again with crimp fittings. I used to make the Barrier PEX(Orange) used for Boiler Systems. That tubing is some wicked plumbing pipe and can withstand a lot more pressure than you realize. Your leak is from the fitting not being mounted correctly or it's a bad fitting, hence the suggestion of the crimp fits. We would take 6 inch(15.24cm) samples and hook them up to a monitored pressure test at different temperatures to check the quality of it. 1,000 psi(70.3kgf/cm) was our start pressure at 70F(21C) and it would handle the increase of pressure exceeding 1,800psi(126.6kgf/cm), bursting around 2,100psi(147.6kgf/cm) at 85F(29.4C). The test would continue with increases in temps up to 300F(148.9C) and burst at 1,500psi(105.5kgf/cm). Yes, the temps exceeded boiling point. We always made sure our testing exceeded ANSI requirements by a landslide. The Print String on the tubing states the ANSI specs, not the in-house testing specs. ANSI specs were well under our own expectations of our product. If I'm not mistaken, the ANSI specs(NSF-U.P. Code) are 100psi@180F and 160psi@73F for 1/2 inch tubing. Our extruders used air pressure to operate the feed gates for the resin pellets and our Factory used this tubing(3/4") as the airlines with over 200psi running through it at all times. Even on a hot Summer day reaching 100F(120F+ inside). Myself, I even conducted Freeze Testing on the stuff. The uniqueness of the tubing is its ability to stretch and swell and then return to the original memory as it thaws. Metal and PVC tubing will burst when frozen, as well as the fittings for PEX.
30 years ago Wirsbo came out with a cross linked pex product that was put into wide use in Europe as a hot water heating product, and pex is generally accepted for hot and cold distribution in buildings and dwellings.
We run "pex" in modern houses in Norway, but we run them in corrugated plastic tubes. So if they ever leak the water comes back to the manifold cabinet and spills out on the floor in a room that should have a floor drain. Also, each consumer has its own run of tube, no fittings other than at the ends. It's a good system, also makes it theoretically possible to change the tube without ripping out the walls.
Don't know if you've heard about it but I would love to see you try out the system we used back in Germany do redo our plumbing in the house. It's a Company called TECE and it's essentially the same as this Pax stuff but it was a thin metal lining. Keep up the great video always love to watch and learn something new!
For an ideal, thin walled tube, the maximum stress is at approximately 25° angle to the axis of the pipe. Having tested pipe, it usually fails in a spiral like the Pillsbury pop and cook rolls.
The primary advantage of PEX vs. copper is crackheads and meth addicts don't rip it out of the walls when homes are under construction.
up in the cold climates, its the go to, now. I've seen it survive minor freezes and contract back (nearly) to original size. Just about every new construction and full remodel site I've been on, is using pex. Crimp, cinch or expansion though, never shark bite.
PEX also isn't sensitive to rust settling in the pipe, whereas copper develops pinholes.
Duck Multiverse it’s not rust, mostly chloramines used by city to treat water. Also old water heater deposits steel in the pipe then electrolysis causes corrosion and you get a pinhole. Copper coating 4x what PEX does is a big factor too.
Primary advantage is it's cheaper.. also easier to install without screwing up. Also when the asshole plumber lays half of it on top of your steel ducts with no insulators, it doesn't rot in 3-5 years and flood out your basement.
way easier to run overhead as well and still accessible
I ran 1/2" for my shop air too, but used the blue Pex because I wanted cool air, not that hot wet stuff.
@@GreeceUranusPutin Hot air? I'll have my wife get back to you with some:)
White for AC?
@@billpetersen298 Exactly!!! I wish I had that in my shop about now!
@@ChrisGilliamOffGrid It's what I had on hand. Biggest port in my tank is 3/8", and the runs aren't long enough to worry about friction loss.
How many psi? I didn't use pex because I read of stories of it blowing out when used for air pressure.
Fingies crossed, hoping AvE will test Pex with crimp on fittings.
This turd herder concurs
also two types, copper crimp rings and stainless crimp rings
Now we are getting into pipe bombery, NICE!
I was about to say the same thing. I NEVER use push on fittings in any location I cannot get at it fairly easily.
@@ericconner9971 exactly, we do the same
@@ericconner9971 I wont use them unless I absolutely have to or in an emergency and I always try to come back later with a proper fix. I have seen too many fail to rely on them for permanent use.
PEX can be filled , frozen , folded , flattened and boiled without leaking
And fail from a misplaced 5/16 staple.
Plus mice loves it.
@@fredhelmecke6073 I have not had that experience. Though I have seen plenty of wiring jacket chewed off
@@georgemckenzie2525 I have had a mouse chew though some I installed, luckely it was accesable and I heard the leak not long after it happend. that mouse is now dead but it is a huge flaw no one ever talks about.
@@aaronmeyer6244 I wonder if coating it in Denatonium Benzoate would alleviate the rodent issue. Also known as Bitrex
@@Fanta.... thats funny i literally just looked up that stuff as it was in rubbing alcohol so as not to drink it
This Milwaukee is apparently the best investment you've ever made. So many activities!
MINI CHAINSAW is a strong contender
That's a good point
That big ass hydraulic ratchet wrench ain't no joke too
Dont forget the hass
@@galvanizedgnome I like that better. Best letter opener ever.
"These are ideal conditions" says AvE as he Teflon tapes a frankfurter to the hose.
it was difficult to watch
Ya! That's why I never miss one of his videos!
With a kink in the pex
Ya ever been so pretty you had to paint your stainless steel black so the internet doesnt fall in love with your reflection?
AvE has
LPL blurs his face in reflections off shiny locks.
Either that or he's so damn ugly that at the sight of him you suffer a stroke and shit the bed.....
We once saw the top of AvE's head in an old vidjeo....i still think about it late at night :{)
He has a beard, I saw it in the side of something once. I have a screenshot somewhere.
@@chrisv4640 16 more of those and we can collage his whole face together
I rebuilt an 82 dodge motor home into a fishing motor home and plumbed everything with PEX then a tree fell on the motor home right down the middle, thanks a lot PEX's.
Gave a fella a like for that 70’s style load blowing slo-mo with the shuttering lights.
Lol just the camera picking up the 60hrz flash of the light
impressive ropes for a man of his age
@@MAGAMAN Good is surprisingly hard to find. Nearly all of them flicker.
@@danielrouw2593 I like your filter idea. 👍 That's the problem with these cheap LED lights and their drivers. They don't use sufficient capacitors, because of cost. Or worse, they overdrive and oversell the LED's, and rely on the brief down time to get the device through it's 90 day warranty without catching fire.
@@notsevenfeettall todally. nothin' like a cheap 70s porn music track for when she blows in slo mo
Just a note on PEX. You said it was a thermo-plastic, but the cross-linking process actually converts the HDPE base to a thermoset in nature and behaves more like a elastomer. This increases it's temperature stability quite a bit along with other qualities that are beneficial to it's purpose.
The shark-bite relieved the pressure over 500psi and then sealed back up? Thats awesome. Built in relief valve.
Why does he dislike pex? Because its somewhat related to swelling plastic seals?
so it didn't go off until the weaner was laying on its back exhausted and covered in shmoo, and even then it needed assistance in just the right spot.... why does that sound familiar.
We call our cat Schmoo
That looks like one of those high end hotdogs that comes individually wrapped in plastic and swells to peter north size on the grill.
I agree, the pipe will fail before the crimp fitting does. More pressure, more boom! Perhaps some hot dog carnage.
An unexpected Peter North shower probably isn’t a good thing. Especially when it is in your house.
That's another thing we scratch our heads over in Europe. Sausages on the grill should get smaller as they loose fat and the cheap ones will also loose injected water as well. WTF is in that stuff you eat that it gets bigger?!?!?
@@5Komma5 lose not loose my guy perhaps you should edit your comment again big yikes
Get yourself some intumescent silicone, inject the dogs before cooking, never buy the high end ones again (dn't try this at home)
My friend thank you for the hours of what some would call boring information. You make the even the most technical drawn out explanations great to listen to and watch with your Canadian humor. Thank you for being an encyclopedia of knowledge that actually keeps it interesting.
I know for a fact that the 1/2 will stand to fire one .410 standard pressure shotgun shell. The second split it right in two.
That sounds like an interesting series of events
Gross impulsive over pressure. Testimony to the material's toughness that it withstood one such event.
Right half in two
Captain MufDyven can you curve some pex and shoot paintballs around corners?
We use PEX too in Western Europe. I used the ALPEX, which is PEX with a aluminium layer in between. No leaks since 15 years. I had some leaks, but all in the fittings, mainly the shut-off valves of the central heating system which runs mostly at 70°C
We'll use Teflon tape to simulate real conditions, not because it was just real handy.
One of the biggest advantages of PEX piping is the lack of fittings. I’m a plumber by trade in Florida. So being able to run the piping through the attic and not having 90’s to run down to a wall creates one less possibility of a failed fitting. And we have noticed through the ten years or so it’s been used that it’s able to handle thermal expansion really well (Attics can reach 145*F During the summer). Copper is being replaced everyday due to salt water intrusion and rot. So for now this is the best stuff to use.
"just blew a seal, nah that's just frost on my mustache" took me a few seconds before my brain actually registered wtf you said :D
My mechanic told me I blew a seal once; I told him "just fix the car and leave my private life out of it".
I died when I realized what he actually said! 🤣
Those PEX fittings with the remora teeth remind me of a Bullhead City waitress I knew.
I kinda think it was lamprey teeth that he had in mind, but point taken.
TEETH a.k.a. vagina dentata
Pex ain't so bad. One good thing about it, I've seen it swell when the line freezes. Normal copper lines bust when water freezes inside. It sounds like that's the main reason a lot of guys are starting to use it.
@@danielrouw2593 shhhhh the plumbers are talking.
Speed of installation, not needing access around the fitting for crimping etc (for push fit like sharkbite). Doesn’t get stolen. Can re use sharkbite fittings and twist them once pushed in. All those reasons really
Pex works better than copper where freezing is an issue, such as where tenants are responsible for remembering to keep the heat on in your property if they leave town. It usually will not burst in the pipe itself, as long as you strategically place the fittings (crimp are much stronger than Sharkbite) in less freeze-prone locations then you can save a lot of flooding hassles. When it gets -25F or below here and the 40mph winds kick up, I've had copper pipe runs in the exterior walls freeze if no one is using water and they have the heat down to 55 degrees, no problems with Pex yet.
You tried hydraulic injection injuries on gloves, why not try safety glasses?
That would be very interesting, I think. A force test on those cheap models your job throws at you would be cool too. I never trust anything my boss says is safe. 🤨
Interesting, curious if it would penetrate, etch or just glance.
That I would like to see
How would one even try safety glasses on gloves?
I'd like to see that.
as an electrician i always enjoy seeing the red white and blue plastic shavings at the end of my drill bit. makes me feel more patriotic.
Thanks for answering the questions we all want to know and cleaning up the mess we don't want to touch!
Bold of you to assume he'd ever clean his workshop
There is a lot to like about PEX, especially when you get to proper crimped connections. It's easy to work with even in tight spaces. No scorch marks on your 2x4 from repair work. You can put a joint together on a pipe with a leaking upstream valve. I'm a little concerned about aging down the road. We've been down the plastic pipe road before with less than ideal results. Copper has problems as well, especially when attached to dis-similar metals.
"no potable water system shall exceed 80 psi"
Ave- hold my beer
I've seen 'em over 125. (the city doesn't install [functional] pressure regulating valves.)
175 here lol and we had a leaking prv
@@poiiihy Might've gone higher if the pop-off on the hot water heater weren't 125.
Worked in an area where the static pressure was 90 psi from gravity. Had a poor shift changeover and watched that pressure jump over 200. Water hammer shook the entire system for half an hour as we tried to find which valve got closed.
Increase pressure to 50,000 Kilopascals!
I worked at a house where all the hydronic heating had been put together with PEX and SharkBites, they lost power during a hurricane for about a week, and it all froze, all the fittings failed but none of the PEX showed any damage.
Hurricane? Froze? The fuck?
Hurricane sandy knocked out the east coast of USA in 2010-12and a snowstorm with freezing cold temperatures impacted much of the disaster area two days after.
Kavurcen see other comment, Hurricanes and freezing weather come around the same time of year to the Northeastern US and the Canadian Maritimes
That’s why you are always supposed to run a glycol solution in those systems.....
Same happened to me during Sandy, All my pex is still good 15 + years in the walls and it's going strong. No complaints.
"Couple thousand dollhairs worth of fittings" - not far off on that one, pricey sharkbites.
After working with water treatment equipment for 5 years, pex beats copper. Troublesome water (high hardness or iron content) will absolutely shred copper much faster than pex and associated fittings.
Always glad to see you upload AvE. It means you were still alive a couple days ago.
So glad you did this. I use copper mostly because I enjoy soldering & the many other reasons copper can be beneficial. When I bought my 1st house & was picking up some parts to get rid of a bit of galvanized in the house an employee at the home dippo tried selling me on the shark bite pex combo because "it can expand to 10x it's size".
500 pissys is still impressive though
In Romania we used PEX-Al pipes as replacement for the older steel pipes which tend to rust. The problem with PEX-Al is that the pipes tend to leak at the fittings or even pop out. Recently, plumbers started using PPR for water and heating(distribution from the furnace to the radiators), there's no metal and the fittings are heat welded to the pipes.
Spoiler alert shark bite fails first. Matt Rissinger did a real good break down of all types and fittings
I'm a plumber, polyethylene pipe is used all over England for all applications even natural gas. I think the main advantage of plastique over copper is the freezing properties, copper freezes and splits at about -6°C but plastic can stretch a bit more. I use plastic 90% of the time even though I personally prefer working with copper, much more satisfying soldering a fitting than just slipping one over the end 😉
AVE: *Blows a seal*
AVE: "Nah that's just frost on my mustache."
I replaced our water heater a few years back and needed to replace the circulation lines as well and I saved so much time and money using PEX that I swore I'd never use anything else for water lines. Ended up doing the whole house system in it and never had a leak in 14 years. Thing I liked about was time saved on having to make joints and elbows and the like in tight spaces since you can just loop it around. Now there are places I'd still use something rated for higher pressure, especially in hard to reach or sealed up installs but it's good for general home use.
shark bite ball valves have gotten me out of a pickle holding back water while soldering, worth keeping some around for me
Here in north Europe pex is used as the main type of pipe now. The fittings are either push fit like these shark bite fittings or Rems squeeze fittings.
Pex works great but not the shark bite fittings. Ive never seen a shark bite fail, but it's just common sense to me that a copper crimp fitting is superior to a shark bite. I've installed thousands of copper crimp fittings and never had a failure nor have I seen one fail. It's imperative that the crimp tool is squared up properly to the crimp ring to guarantee a good crimp. I'll never go back to sweating pipe. Try freezing a pex pipe assembly. It just expands and bounce back to shape when it thaws. Try that with copper.
Residential plumbing in the U.S. does indeed now allow for blue or green pex. The color code helps speed up installation, especially in multistory buildings. All the pex naysayers need to see this. And what was the sharkbite fitting rated for? No where near 500 psi. Extensive testing has found little difference in performance between hot or cold usage.
I recently re-plumbed my whole central heating with PEX pipe (JG Speedfit) and I much prefer it to copper for two main reasons: one, it bends; two I can dismount the fittings and change things if I need to. Other than one broken o ring that was from a dodgy fitting (it was free, I should have checked it more closely) it's absolutely fine. I can never find much information about the thermal conductivity compared to copper though, just that it should be lagged too - my main aim is that the radiators get hot and I heat my house, not the ventilated gap underneath the house.
Would be curious to know about the surface finish of the inside of the pipe compared to copper (both bright copper and some full of Copper I oxide) and see what effect that has on flow
PEX was originally designed for Radiant Heat Applications. Many Contractors will use it when pouring concrete(they put it inside the concrete) to prevent ice and snow buildup. I haven't shoveled snow since I installed mine in the driveway and walkways around here. Installed it in 2007 and I live where it gets below zero in the Winter
.
We do have a type of layered plastic pipe that is some kind of plastic, Aluminum, and another layer plastic prewrapped in with some insulation in Germany. I don't know how it would compare in terms of strength and how much its rated for but the waterline coming in is reduced to 5 Bar, at least in my house. My guess would also be that the sharkbite fitting are the same here and if i remember the design correctly the crimp on fittings we used would also allow the fluid to leak because the actual sealing is done by a o-ring and the crimp basically just prevents the fitting from being pushed off.
I'm a Master Plumber and retired from plumbing in 2007 and at that time I was running Pex almost exclusively for water. I've never used one of those damn Shark Bites but can see the value in certain situations but still feel their main purpose is so the average citizen doesn't have to call a professional. But copper had gotten so expensive that it had to be specked on plans or requested by a customer or I was running Pex. I was a late adopter too and was one of the last plumbing contractors still running copper after Pex was adopted into the Code. My contractors didn't like it when I started using it because my copper was always so pretty and you just can't make Pex look like you can make hard copper look. Everything straight and plumb and all the joints wiped, etc. They hated when I stopped running iron pipe for gas even more though and one contractor (Glen) paid extra for me to run black iron gas lines on his jobs long after I'd started running gas flex. He always took photos of the jobs in different stages and said it was like art work. I remember a home builder asked Glen if he could take a tour through a home that we were building as his personal residence. All of the water was copper and the gas was black iron with no less than 11 drops. I had everything pressured up and was ready for the top out inspection. But this home builder stopped where I was working and handed me his card and commented that he builds million dollar houses and wondered aloud why he couldn't get plumbing work that looks like mine? We were outside the shower in the master bath that Glen's crew had nicknamed "the car wash" because it was a four person shower (Don't judge) with body sprays through-out and I answered him bluntly: "Because you're not willing to pay for it". He then asked if I'd be interested in bidding one of his jobs and I told him sure, but if I don't get the bid don't bother to send me any more plans because my time is too valuable for people to waste. But that's how I learned 40+ years ago when I was an apprentice, use a level and measure everything twice and if it isn't plumb and level, redo that section until it is and damnit, wipe the flux off of your copper!
Thanks for this demonstration! I just discovered you last night and the scope of work that I've seen so far has been impressive. Very impressive! It should be noted, I think, that Pex will freeze if exposed to sub freezing temperatures but doesn't split or burst like copper and especially PVC or CPVC will when it freezes. And mice was also a concern so companies developed a PEX with an aluminized coating (FostaPex) they couldn't chew their way through. Viega makes FostaPex and if other companies make something similar I am not familiar with it but that coating also helped make it run a little bit straighter and look a little bit better, you just have to be sure and mark hot and cold because it is all the same color.
My German friend said his house in Germany has water pipes that are stainless steel pipes lined with pex that are crimped to fittings with a hydraulic crinping tool.
Frost on my moustache - took me a few seconds to figure it out... 😆😆😂😂
the pex tubing is used for hot water in europe.
at work we make some 7x1,5mm HDPE pipes for fibre optics in germany. the had to hold about 1100 PSI in 80 degree c water for about 150 hours.
Hoop stress analysis sounds like info I'll never use that I need in my brainbox.
I've had 3/4" PEX with copper crimp fittings in my shop for 5 years now with 0 leaks or problems . I run 125 PSI in it and there is a lot of it , with many tees and drops . I shut the air valve off at the tank every night and it doesn't leak down unless I leave something chucked in the end of an air hose that leaks . It's so easy to install that I wouldn't consider anything else . Supposedly it is not uv resistant , though .
Hoop stress, also experienced when sitting on the throne after yer morning coffee
If you have stress instead of an easy slide, you went too light on the coffee.
Or you've been afflicted with an "accessible" seat height to get your innards in a bind. You want as close to squatting as you can get, straightens the works out for less resistance.
You may need one of those “paper ass gaskets” ! Might hold in some additional PPSI( poop per square inch).
How the fork did you write this comment 4 days ago
@@ostracizedelite5096 patreon early access privileges my friend!
You're going to have an o-ring blowout or burst a blood vessel in your eyes.
As a full time RVer Pex saved our pipes more then once on cold winters. The Pex line can expand when the water freezes, while copper splits and has to be replaced.
Every home I've owned in Texas has had copper pipes burst or generally fail over time. I replace all of it with PEX, crimped of course. It's easier to work with and way cheaper than copper. I just solder on a PEX adapter or threaded fitting and a shut-off valve if possible and replace everything above with PEX
At least it's more skookum then that damned gray polybutylene crap
Or the orange Kitec pipe. I had to disconnect and decommission my in-floor heating, otherwise the insurance company was going to drop me.
I've been in apartment buildings where they've used CPVC (the white Sched 40 stuff, rated for irrigation and drainage) as their main water lines, then use a MIPxPex adapter. Had to use a brand new type of glue and primer that came onto the market. So new, in fact, my boss never heard of it. Well, let me tell you: regardless of what it says on the website it does NOT set and cure in fifteen minutes. I found that out the hard way. Cost me my job too.
@Mother Algorithm Not much else to say. There was an ongoing leak down into the basement parkade and they tracked the leak down to the pipe chase in the ceiling of a suite's half bath up on the third floor. The call came in on a Sunday night, and I have no idea why they couldn't wait for Monday morning. Especially since almost no wholesalers carry the stuff. I had to call around to three of them before I found one who assured me they'd have it at their main location. I got the fittings I figured I'd need (paid an extra $150 to open late Sunday which we pass onto the customer) and the pipe was just rigid enough that I had to install a swing joint to make it fit using four 90 degree fittings. The website my boss looked up said it sets in fifteen minutes I think, so when I glued it all together I let it cure for half an hour. It held for about five minutes, enough time for the building rep who was manning the building shutoffs to get to the elevator and come up. Lots of damage to the drywall and such.
Now if you want to talk about a real head scratcher, try Aqua Rise pipe. That stuff is supposed to be hot shit but it's a headache. It's dense plastic usually in a dull navy blue with a really slick coating so carrying more than a couple sticks at a time is fun, but the real fun is cutting and gluing it together. According to manufacturer specs the outer edge of the pipe needs to be beveled with an angle grinder to give some room in the fitting for the glue to go which adds to the mess, but the real evil is the primer. It's real caustic stuff. If you want to find any nicks or scrapes on your hands you use PVC primer; the sting means it's working. But Aqua Rise primer? That stuff is pure pain. Feels like your hand's getting stabbed wherever there's a scrape. Oh, also: never, NEVER use a bristle brush and glue pot to apply it to the pipe and fittings. It's caustic enough that it makes the bristles fall out onto the pipe and fittings (fun,) as well as bleach them thoroughly (even more fun.) And bristles are hollow too, yay! You end up with pinhole leaks all over the place that way. So use the cotton ball-type applicator. Or just avoid the stuff in the first place.
@@RedneckTimelord This was a while ago and it doesn't bring up good memories so I try to put it out of my head and so a lot of the details are fuzzy (legal weed and plentiful beer does that too, I've heard,) I'm fairly certain it was indeed CPVC pipe and fittings, which like I've said is usually used just for irrigation and drainage for things like high efficiency furnaces or for hot water tank drain pans. Here in western Canada domestic water is almost always carried in a) Copper, b) Pex, c) Wirsbo, so seeing an entire building, especially one that was a 1920s office building renovated over into bougie loft style apartments, piped in CPVC was a bit of a puzzle to me.
@@ChrisGilliamOffGrid That's pretty much up in the air. Some say it's because the crimping was improperly done, some that it reacts to UV radiation and sunlight, some that it reacts to oxidents in the water which sublimate out in hot water especially, same with chlorine. All I know is that you can't use regular pex fittings on it. Adapt with a coupling first. Plus it gets brittle with age so try not to bend the stuff if you're working with it.
Love sharkbites. Don't mess with much plumbing other than home diy / remodeling. Usually only use them on pvc or to switch from old copper to pvc. In florida so don't have to worry about freezing.
I also found it to be great for running air lines around the shop. Also just buy the clamps and tool. Cheaper in the long run and less risk of malfunction.
The most I was most impressed and surprised by in this video?
That you referenced D&D with the remorhaz
Best be carefulling. Your about to get a cease and desist from the hydraulic press channel if you keep this up.
Same here in Europe/Germany, everybody is using those tubes because they can be fitted together so quickly. But I do agree, copper piping is still superior and you don't need expensive tools to press them together (except when using copper piping with press fittings instead of soldering them).
So, PEX - plastic time!
True PEX means PolyEthylene-Crosslinked.
Extremely tough material, and a great water barrier (and moisture barrier) but not actually a great air barrier.. well... It gets better when you cross link it.. but I digress.
PE isn't hygroscopic (unlike Nylon which is quite hygroscopic and actually plasticizes with moisture)
Cross-linking also essentially makes the whole thing one giant polymer chain, and the polymer no longer "melts". It will soften but you could not melt process it again.
In summary: PE is not effected by moisture. PEX (not polybutyl) is great for hot water applications.
PE doesn't degrade over time.
Doesn't degrade with UV (not that this would be an issue)
And the cross-linking makes sure it isn't melting and adds a whole heap of toughness to it.
Regular PE will melt back down, PEX will not. Once PE is crosslinked(the X) and becomes PEX it can withstand over 500F and still not melt to dripping stage. The crosslink creates a Memory as it strengthens the material and will return to that memory as it cools down or thaws out. Regular PE is extruded around 200F and has no memory to it, which allows it to be melted back down and recycled. Also, the problem with irradiated PEX is that not all PE resins are the same and each batch of resin reacts different to the process. Chemically crosslinked eliminates that variable as it's being extruded.
@@charlessharp9795 yup! Well... I agree with everything other than the irradiated vs chemical comment. But perhaps that's because the company I work for makes and maintains our own irradiation equipment for our film work. 😂 But perhaps it's just pride talking.
@@bradleynealdaley I've had experience producing both types. Chemically crossed is done during the extrusion process and effects all PE the same. Irradiated is extruded and then processed through the BEAM to crosslink it. The facility where I worked order the Resin from several suppliers and we discovered that each brand of resin reacted different to the beaming process. They were all strong but the difference was seen during the Quality testing. Some resins burst sooner at lower temps and pressures where others were much stronger and could handle higher temps and pressures. The other noticeable difference was the finish of the pipe itself. Some would come out with a type of rough finish and others had a smooth finish. Dull versus Shiny. We discovered slight differences in the processes used by the Suppliers when they produced the Resin Beads and some were softer where others were harder. That hardness/softness affects the finish and overall strength. Don't get me wrong, the softer stuff was still stronger than ANSI required, but we could see a difference when testing the Quality under extreme conditions.
We’ve used them in Finland for over 30 years, and I’ve never seen or heard of any failures. But, we run them inside a tube, so if they start leaking, it spills over in the boiler room where there’s a floor drain anyhow. It’s also very handy if a drywall fitter screws right trough the line, just find the offending screw, loosen the line at both ends and pull it out and shove a new one right back in.
As a plumber i can say that after 20 years pex looks better than copper
I'm addicted to your channel. I lose track of time watching these. Thank you
The music choice on all these slow-mo schmoo shots recently is 👌
agreed. soon people will start posting stuff like "who's here because of Ave" over there ua-cam.com/video/hnNhZywf-98/v-deo.html
Song is:
New Land - Duane Fraley
ua-cam.com/video/hnNhZywf-98/v-deo.html
Great test, thanks for this. I ran sharkbite for air distribution around my workshop. I've had a few people reckon it wasnt safe. I was confident it was more than safe and you have confirmed it.
Here in Europe we use Alupex. It's first polyethylene on the inside aluminium of 0.xmm inbetween and then polyethylene on the outside.
Alupex is usually used in heating, because that aluminium layer makes it gas tight. There's also PEX with glass fibre layer, for the same reason. Normal PEX will allow gasses to migrate into installation, creating airpockets. It doesn't really matter in case of water delivery system, as the process is slow, so there you can use PE or PP pipes.
Sounds a lot like kitec, I've been repiping houses in California that had it fail. We do a kitec house or 2 a week. Garbage.
In the UK we dont really use alupex, our plastic pipes all have an oxygen barrier though. Not sure what it is, but it appears to be just a different plastic. The oxygen barrier isn't so much for preventing air pockets, but if oxygen gets into a heating system it dissolves in the water and causes corrosion issues.
The phrase you're looking for is "gas impermeable" and we have that in the United States too.
@@98dizzard you also don't use metric ;-) just kidding.( No but really...) Polyethylene is very chemically inert and doesn't leaches molecules into the water. It's also cheaper then PP per ton. As for PP its way more difficult to work with than PE because it's so tough. Making clean cuts would be a pain. (Unless using modifiers in the plastic... Wich can Leach into your water.
I do new construction plumbing and run houses everyday with pex. It’s some tough stuff to be plastic. 1” pex and a crimped coupling works great as a tow rope in a pinch. Also to test the houses for inspection we pump it up to 140psi and it sits and holds for weeks. I have yet to throw enough air to it for the pex itself to fail.
You need to try Uponor PEX, not the other stuff. Aqua PEX seems to be the gold standard. Different ends too. But you can use Shark Bites if you want.
Viaga is really the best around
I'd say Rehau Everloc is the most robust connection type. Combines the pex-a shrink over fitting like Uponor and a slide on compression sleeve.
Nathan D I’ve never had a viaga fitting fail and I started using them in 2003
I also started pro press very early my shop was the first in the states to use it
@@mattberg6816 for sure Viaga makes great products. I sold plumbing products for 12 years, starting just before all the new lines of pex fittings started coming around. I really like the Viaga stuff, hands down the fastest installation of all the brands.
PEX is absolutely awesome stuff. Crimp on fittings are my go to but the press fittings are surprisingly good. The biggest advantage of PEX is that it doesn't break as easy due to freezing. You can have a PEX line froze solid, filled with water, and it wont explode like copper will. Plus its cheap, easy, and fast to replace a broken PEX line vs copper. I cant really think of a reason I would install copper over PEX in almost any situation. I guess if I was going to do something with really hot water or in direct thermal transfer from an exchange, then id use copper.
That blew a seal comment had me quietly chuckling in tears next to my sleeping wifey. I think I blew a seal trying to contain my laughter.
Hope the seal appreciated it!
man, so did I... there's a seal smoking a cigarette somewhere now
'It was April the 41st
Being a quadruple leap year
I was driving through downtown Atlantis
My Barracuda was in the shop, so
I was in a rented Stingray
And it was overheating
So I pulled into a Shell station
They said I'd blown a seal
I said, "Fix the damn thing
And leave my private life out of it
Okay, pal?” '
Did he frost your mustache too?
“Just fix the damn thing and keep my private life out of it.”, Wet Dream, Kip Adotta.
Had to use pex and sharkbite replacing an hose silcock. Was built into an interior wall cavity and through the flooring. After cutting the subfloor out around the copper was the only way to make the 90 turn from the exterior wall and through into the crawl space. Beat having to do a drywall repair though.
"we just blew a seal... naw, that's just frost on my mustache" had me laughing hard 🤣
I live in Belgium and our hose was built 15 years ago with coated aluminium tubing for hot and cold water. They have a similar style of quick connect
Aging? Try 25 year old cpvc...brittle like Staind Glass
Even 5 year old you have to cut with a saw and not a tubing cutter
I've had stuff that was 2 ish years old that shattered in my face when i tried to use a tubing cutter. I'm pretty sure the guy had turned his water heater waaay up. Thankfully i had the safety squints on.
Aye, CPVC is fekkin gahbage
Try 20 year old polybutylene. Now that is some hot garbage
I repair foundations in florida and irrigation pvc is always brittle as hell no matter when it was installed. We end up breaking pipes often along the sides of house. Then we gotta fix em.
That plastic piping is pretty much universally used here in the UK too, has been for at least 15-20 years. Both in domestic water supply, and also central heating runs to radiators.
Not all pex is the same. Shark bite is a class b pex(not as good) . Class A is what most plumbers use.
Sharkbite is the fittings. They work on a multitude of different materials including copper. What are you talking about?
@@GrahamBartle there is a shark bite brand of pex also. It's sold at home depot. Most pros use upanor pex. Been around in europe for decades now.
@@mattmcc7930
Yup 👍
Plastic plumbing i s massive over here in the uk. Every single volume built home since the late 90's has been plumbed in the stuff. gas lines are still copper thou. Also an interesting point is that whilst heating systems are exclusively plastic, larger systems with circulating domestic hot water lines have to be done in copper
"No, that's just frost on my moustache." Made me laugh out loud.
Me too, the cat was rather startled 🤣.
When I bought my house 6.5yrs ago, someone stole most of the copper pipe the night before I was supposed to close. Good for me! I got 2 new water heaters and the missing pipe was replaced (with pex). So far so good. I left my outdoor spigot on one winter and brass split, but pex was good. I'll let you know in 15 more years I have issues. 🤷♀️
14 years and counting here and I've never turned off my Spigot. I live in Ohio(USA) and sometimes it gets pretty cold(-20F) in the Winter. My neighbors, however, have to fix their Copper almost every year because it freezes and breaks open. PEX tubing is so strong, I even used some 1 1/2" to build a structure for a Greenhouse. Built in 2007 and it's still holding up great. I used to make the stuff, I know how tough the stuff really is.
Pull out, man, you've hit an artery!
Far Side FTW
I'm considering a DIY reno to expose my roof trusses, because 8' ceilings suck. Will need to re-route the wet wall, and due to space, accessibility and budget I am very drawn toward PEX. But I have Fears Concerning PEX. Content like this matters to me!
We've been using pex for hot water for a long time in Europe.
I was going to comment the same thing: Very common in France on account of easy installation and very high labor costs. As for longevity, if people have any sense they install it in a conduit, so if it leaks, the water comes out at one end or the other, so it's quickly noticed and doesn't destroy the walls. And being in a conduit, you can usually pull a new pipe through, maybe having to cut a few holes in the walls for access, but that's it.
@@fartingfury but if your taking the time and spending the money to use conduit on it then your loosing out on the savings of time and money of pex, so you may as well just use better pipes.
@@fartingfury That kind of defeats the purpose of pex if you have to run conduits.
@@ahndeux I guess you're thinking of rigid conduit that has to be laboriously assembled from rigid pieces, in which case, yeah, you're right, just use copper (or multi-layer tubes, whatever). What I used is flexible conduit that came with PEX tube already inside, so apart from trimming back some conduit at each end (like stripping a wire, I guess) there's no extra effort required: Pull the whole lot through and fix it in place as if it were bare PEX. The conduit also shields UV, which is important if it's exposed anywhere (though I've seen it exposed outside for years without bursting, not that I'd fancy trying that myself).
Yes i see it used a lot of the time here in France in new constructions. Also used for under floor heating systems and all sorts ! I think the regulations make it obligatory to have crimp on fittings.
This is also a great explanation for why pipes burst when they freeze. Water expands about 9% when frozen, causing a massive pressure spike, the ice isn't what breaks the pipe, it's the pressure.
Repeat with Uponor ProPex. Bet that's a good show. Sharkbite sux, btw.
Wirsbo has so many advantages, I love how it will go back to faktree configuration with just some BTUs! And, unlike German women, it never stretches out at the fittin' ends!
I searched the comments until I found an Uponor comment, just to give it a thumbs up! Great product and company. Get the 3" ProPEX fittings, Milwaukee cold expansion tool, and their 3" tubing... Impressive stuff!
If AVE tests on the Uponor Pex, I hope he includes a bit on the chemical differences of how the irradiation process is different during manufacture and how it can recover from kinks unlike the inferior pexs.
@@timkunsa7249 Uponor PEX is not cross linked with irradiation, it is chemically crosslinked during extrusion. I agree that hearing of the differences between PEX-A and B would be interesting for many. I do the kink demonstration often and it gets everyone excited!
@@SlipNSlideMNzx2 Thanks for clarifying, I couldn't remember how the cross-linking was different.
Great video, impressed with the pressure the pex can hold. However when twisting the shark bite fitting on, or when you spun it around to make the hotdog stay in place you compromised the "bite" of the fitting. I've used them before but only in emergency situations where tools couldn't access the fitting or severe risk of fire were present. Pex pipe has worked very well where I live (southern coast of NC) BUT if it is exposed to the sun and salt for a decent amount of time, picture a sink on the end of a dock, it will rupture at 32° guaranteed.
They take a lot less pressure when a ham fisted apprentice has dragged them on the skew through a hole and gouged a canyon down one side big enough to prove your whomp rat disassembling ability in.
You barely tickled it with that yellow handled splinter remover.
When I lived in Texas, I lived in two rentals with poly tube (not PEX but same basic design, all grey lines, thinner wall thickness) both rather old, and most of the issues I had with leaks were the joining fittings, especially elbows and Ts corroding and cracking. The two times I had the plastic lines break, it was due to Freeze damage. I've also never seen rodent damage to either PEX or the grey poly. The poly I know had some additive (capsaisin iirc) supposed to keep them from gnawing on it)
I just re-piped my kitchen with pex AND shark bite . No leaks. SO FAR. HAH
Buddy redid half his house in 04 with sharkbites and Pex. Still working today without leaks. Solder will always be better but sharkbites aren' t the worst thing u can do either.
@@gearjammergamer8560 The main failure mode for Sharkbites and similar connectors is burrs and sharp edges mangling the rubber seals. Break pipe edges so they don't damage seals on their way in and those push connectors should last a long time.
Now get the milfukkie out and test the pipes pressure.
Sharkbite's great if there's little clearance and the copper's full of water. I've done a few hot swaps like that. Very dicey.
Note: they do make a deburring tool for sharkbite that's mainly meant for pex but it does work on copper for a few times. Otherwise I give it a few passes with the sandcloth.
@@gearjammergamer8560 Wow, early adopter in 2004.
Best things about Pex: easier to install, cheaper, no hot soldering torch by your floor joists, no cracking when frozen.
Most plumbers in my area charge WAY higher labor for copper pipe work compared to pex. Some won't even bother with copper at all anymore.
PS the best fitting method for pex are the compressed copper rings, though they require a special tool to attach.
The real fun happens when you take the class to get your Swagelok card and get to destroy a piece of copper tubing after you practice putting fittings on it. That stuff'll take a couple thousand PSI or more before it blows out like that plastique did. They have a special machine that pressures the assemblies up with water so they don't explode like they would with air. It just leaves a nice tear in the side wall and you end up with a fun paper weight for your desk.
Gotta love swagelock, I work in the gas field and gotta use them everyday.
I used Swagelok for decades in science and development applications. I don't ever remember a properly installed fitting leaking. For that matter most improperly installed Swageloks don't leak.
@@mwechtal They work great but are always out of stock ,take forever to arrive and cost a fortune. There are flexible alternatives for up to 45000psi now.
@@Chris_Garman our application was for a particular alloy, and the storeroom kept them in stock. I only needed about 200 psi. I did have to wait for a needle valve once. I swear they had to mine the ore to get started manufacturing one. It was months.
@@mwechtal we use ours for natural gas don't think no more than 3-500psi but usally lot lot lower
Pex has a few things going for it over copper in the house. Most household water pressure is only 40-60psi. Plastic pipe in general has less resistance to flow than copper, so you get more pressure out of your faucets with the smaller lines. To add to that it also tends to not get the scale build up that copper and iron does. It's more end user serviceable. Most people aren't going to know how to sweat a copper pipe properly. just about anyone can cut out a bad section of pex and push on a couple of fittings. You also save on labor and down time. My grandfathers house had all copper and every other week we were fixing pin hole leaks. My cousin and i cut all of that out, replaced with pex and he had water again in a fraction of the time it would have taken us to rebuild the water lines with copper. Neither him nor i are plumbers.
In Europe the prefer alumINIum reinforced plastic pipes (PEX-AL-PEX).
Yep I use them all the time with crimp fittings, have a Rems 20v Mini crimper with 16mm,20mm,25mm,32mm and 40mm jaws, i have all the reamer sizes for my drill to as well as manual one's, the fittings have a inspection window to see if you pushed the pipe all the way through. I'm sure you use the same stuff, very rarely get a leak, only if someone tries to bend the pipe right at the fitting or does not ream it properly
You should try it again with crimp fittings. I used to make the Barrier PEX(Orange) used for Boiler Systems. That tubing is some wicked plumbing pipe and can withstand a lot more pressure than you realize. Your leak is from the fitting not being mounted correctly or it's a bad fitting, hence the suggestion of the crimp fits. We would take 6 inch(15.24cm) samples and hook them up to a monitored pressure test at different temperatures to check the quality of it. 1,000 psi(70.3kgf/cm) was our start pressure at 70F(21C) and it would handle the increase of pressure exceeding 1,800psi(126.6kgf/cm), bursting around 2,100psi(147.6kgf/cm) at 85F(29.4C). The test would continue with increases in temps up to 300F(148.9C) and burst at 1,500psi(105.5kgf/cm). Yes, the temps exceeded boiling point. We always made sure our testing exceeded ANSI requirements by a landslide. The Print String on the tubing states the ANSI specs, not the in-house testing specs. ANSI specs were well under our own expectations of our product. If I'm not mistaken, the ANSI specs(NSF-U.P. Code) are 100psi@180F and 160psi@73F for 1/2 inch tubing. Our extruders used air pressure to operate the feed gates for the resin pellets and our Factory used this tubing(3/4") as the airlines with over 200psi running through it at all times. Even on a hot Summer day reaching 100F(120F+ inside). Myself, I even conducted Freeze Testing on the stuff. The uniqueness of the tubing is its ability to stretch and swell and then return to the original memory as it thaws. Metal and PVC tubing will burst when frozen, as well as the fittings for PEX.
@4:17
You used my comment from the last vijayo..!
Bloody luv ya fella
30 years ago Wirsbo came out with a cross linked pex product that was put into wide use in Europe as a hot water heating product, and pex is generally accepted for hot and cold distribution in buildings and dwellings.
5:49 if it's coming out that colour you should definitely see a doctor. Or an exorcist
We run "pex" in modern houses in Norway, but we run them in corrugated plastic tubes. So if they ever leak the water comes back to the manifold cabinet and spills out on the floor in a room that should have a floor drain. Also, each consumer has its own run of tube, no fittings other than at the ends. It's a good system, also makes it theoretically possible to change the tube without ripping out the walls.
5:43 cue money shot scene music 💦
My Peck bursted like the pex
Don't know if you've heard about it but I would love to see you try out the system we used back in Germany do redo our plumbing in the house. It's a Company called TECE and it's essentially the same as this Pax stuff but it was a thin metal lining.
Keep up the great video always love to watch and learn something new!
I feel like I need google translate sometimes with "AveSpeak"
I remember seeing a whole AveTionary out there somewhere one time.
For an ideal, thin walled tube, the maximum stress is at approximately 25° angle to the axis of the pipe. Having tested pipe, it usually fails in a spiral like the Pillsbury pop and cook rolls.