as someone who has been doing alignments for over 25yrs. I consider myself an expert. the way that visual shows Ackerman is way better than I can explain. I will be looking into this. awesome simple product to show something complicated
Love my Bambu Lab printer. Such a breath of fresh air having a printer that lets me focus on the products I'm printing instead of always having to tinker with it
Truly impressive Josiah. Great idea and execution. Handy tool. And the Grip Racing segment answered questions that I’ve had in my head for months. Thanks!
And I thought it was only me that was obsessed with attention to detail and amending drawing after drawing and design after design. Fair play dude I’ve watched your previous content on suspension geometry and your practical demonstrations are far better than a book full of words. Unfortunately now I have to question my actual sanity as my E36 race car now only has the steering rack and rear light clusters from the original car literally everything else has been made or taken from a different car . Fries one’s brain sometimes 😵💫🤭
awww glad you're entering the front rack scenario. I have a front rack! :D Lemme see! Nice educational model tho, I love these! Geometry is cool and all but visualizing it may be hard without a model.
Ok this is awesome. Visualization makes understanding so much easier to grasp. Excellent job. About to see if I can order if so, I’m supporting this kind of useful project.
This is AWESOME! I have been getting my students to design something similar already! It would be cool if for Formula Student teams (who are budget limited) you could add a way to purchase the files so we can print them ourselves as being in the UK it would be out of our budget if you include the shipping (Cries in GBP)
Looks a lot like many other suspension things, where what's good for 'handling' for Road Course racecars, is the Opposite to what's needed for Drift Cars. Rear rack positive Akerman where the load is on the outside tyre, and the wheels need to follow different corner radius's because of the width of the car, is a better choice. Stiffer front roll bar compared to rear bar is good for handling, no front bar and a stiff rear bar is good for Drift. Stretched tyres suck for for generating lateral G-force needed for good road course handling, but loose grip earlier for drifting, making transition to oversteer quicker. Lots of people will argue about what 'good handling' is, but the truth is, it's very very different for each class of racing. One thing a lot miss, the true real world advantage of Steering in front of Axle, is that it's much much easier to lower the engine in the chassis if the rack or drag link isn't running under the crank, which is why some sportscars have long front ends and front-steer, to drop the motors lower, so the mass improves roll coupling performance.
Can you print this with some in-between holes soe people can see potentially more realistic amounts of Ackerman angle? Also, in line with that whole "it would be way too complicated" thing, you also forgot that there are cars with double lower ball joints which function completely different when setting up Ackerman.
They don't function differently. The only difference is that those setups have virtual pivot points, thus the effective length of the linkages can't be measured physically. If you're designing or adjusting a multi-link-suspension, you should be well past the point where you need a 3d printed gadget meant to explain the basic principle of the Ackermann Effect.
@@protator Based on your virtual pivot point theory, most DBJ lowers should have anti-ackerman, and instead, they seem to have a fair bit of normal Ackerman. I think it's due to the motion ratio between the outer tie rod pickup point and the two ball joints. When turning one way, the "rear" ball joint acts as the pivot and the middle one moves, while when turning the opposite way the middle is the pivot, and so you get more angle. Hence, the more evenly spaced the tie rod pickup, middle, and rear joints are, the closer to parallel steering you should have. But really, I need a model to mess with to make sure.
@@Drunken_Hamster It's more than a theory. Many cars have multi-link/5-link suspensions so the engineers can place certain pivot points/ instance centers where they physically can't go. (Well, it also allows them to tweak the various geometric properties and compliance under different load conditions in isolation) That's also why you have split lower a-arms on some McPherson front suspensions; if the strut had to be placed in an undesirable position/angle, a virtual lower pivot point via separate links can change the effective steering axis and correct important parameters like KPI and scrub radius. But none of that has a fundamental effect on steering geometry or how Ackermann works in general. The main difference between this printed toy and a real car is the model's single linkage between the wheels. A real car has three elements with moving pivot points as well as motion ratios that constantly change over the wheel hub's range of motion. Which is why I have no clue what this 3d print's practical purpose is supposed to be. You can explain the basic principle with a napkin drawing in ten seconds, no need to run a printer for ten hours.
Which part are you referring too? When drifting at high angle, due to jacking and weight transfer, the trailing wheel has little to no weight on it. Often times it will even come off the ground, or will be locked and dragging from left foot tracking with minimal weight on it. So this is accurate and it is why the trailing wheel bind on a front rack isn’t as important as if it were a rear rack. And for grip racing the outside tire has more weight hence why F1 cars run negative Ackermann to gain more grip through the slip angle of the tire compound.
If the gentleman would realize hiw big of idiots we all are, the pressure to use oversized words may smooth the nerves. The info snd design sre great. And the story of the race help given too. We will see how the set goes. I hope it goes well. But, i want to smile about the i made it perfect comment.
Unfortunatly I don't think they will sell good, they have a purpose, teach people, I saw the video and I'm glad I did, but I already understand, no need to have a phisical object
Well i guess thats one way to answer my front vs rear rack question lol
as someone who has been doing alignments for over 25yrs. I consider myself an expert. the way that visual shows Ackerman is way better than I can explain. I will be looking into this. awesome simple product to show something complicated
This answered questions i did not even know i needed an answers for. And very informative video to boot great job.
That's awesome! I can see myself buy the 3d model to print it at home
the first 5 minutes of this video saved me about 6 years of head scratching with ackerman angles
This is great for education and showing customers stuff. I will be buying. Please make more
Love my Bambu Lab printer. Such a breath of fresh air having a printer that lets me focus on the products I'm printing instead of always having to tinker with it
That is really awesome, could be interesting for our courses in vocational schools!
I don't know how I got here, but this was very informative, thank you!
this is so awesome, this would make such a great gift for car ppl for Xmas
Super cool, I would want this in shops waiting area. So that customers educate themself.
Thanks for making a complicate thing so easy to understand
Truly impressive Josiah. Great idea and execution. Handy tool. And the Grip Racing segment answered questions that I’ve had in my head for months. Thanks!
That’s slick I’m gonna be following these tray builds !!
And I thought it was only me that was obsessed with attention to detail and amending drawing after drawing and design after design.
Fair play dude I’ve watched your previous content on suspension geometry and your practical demonstrations are far better than a book full of words.
Unfortunately now I have to question my actual sanity as my E36 race car now only has the steering rack and rear light clusters from the original car literally everything else has been made or taken from a different car . Fries one’s brain sometimes 😵💫🤭
Incredibly educational!
The explanation of binding really helped
This is awesome man! Keep up the great work 🎉
Appreciate it!
awww glad you're entering the front rack scenario. I have a front rack! :D Lemme see!
Nice educational model tho, I love these! Geometry is cool and all but visualizing it may be hard without a model.
Such a good idea!
I have an X1C carbon is it possible for us to print it ourselves? I'd love to purchase the ability to print it.
What he said
Dude I love this. Definitely going to be buying these and setting them up on my box at the shop.
Around 5:25 the labels could be on the holder that the set completes.
Love this, cant wait to see future trays.
Ok this is awesome. Visualization makes understanding so much easier to grasp. Excellent job. About to see if I can order if so, I’m supporting this kind of useful project.
Thank you!🤝🏼
i cant wait to see the other ones!!!!!!!!!!!!! great job btw
Appreciate it🙏🏼
This is AWESOME! I have been getting my students to design something similar already! It would be cool if for Formula Student teams (who are budget limited) you could add a way to purchase the files so we can print them ourselves as being in the UK it would be out of our budget if you include the shipping (Cries in GBP)
This is really genius!!
Looks a lot like many other suspension things, where what's good for 'handling' for Road Course racecars, is the Opposite to what's needed for Drift Cars.
Rear rack positive Akerman where the load is on the outside tyre, and the wheels need to follow different corner radius's because of the width of the car, is a better choice.
Stiffer front roll bar compared to rear bar is good for handling, no front bar and a stiff rear bar is good for Drift.
Stretched tyres suck for for generating lateral G-force needed for good road course handling, but loose grip earlier for drifting, making transition to oversteer quicker.
Lots of people will argue about what 'good handling' is, but the truth is, it's very very different for each class of racing.
One thing a lot miss, the true real world advantage of Steering in front of Axle, is that it's much much easier to lower the engine in the chassis if the rack or drag link isn't running under the crank, which is why some sportscars have long front ends and front-steer, to drop the motors lower, so the mass improves roll coupling performance.
Any chance of making the files for sale? This is sick.
Very cool. Would you be willing to share/sell the stl files for the people who have acces to a 3D printer?
awesome video
Very cool man
i get it now...
I might have missed it, but some magnets in the boards would go a long way to keep them together in storage
11:45 17:38
Can you print this with some in-between holes soe people can see potentially more realistic amounts of Ackerman angle?
Also, in line with that whole "it would be way too complicated" thing, you also forgot that there are cars with double lower ball joints which function completely different when setting up Ackerman.
They don't function differently. The only difference is that those setups have virtual pivot points, thus the effective length of the linkages can't be measured physically.
If you're designing or adjusting a multi-link-suspension, you should be well past the point where you need a 3d printed gadget meant to explain the basic principle of the Ackermann Effect.
@@protator Based on your virtual pivot point theory, most DBJ lowers should have anti-ackerman, and instead, they seem to have a fair bit of normal Ackerman. I think it's due to the motion ratio between the outer tie rod pickup point and the two ball joints.
When turning one way, the "rear" ball joint acts as the pivot and the middle one moves, while when turning the opposite way the middle is the pivot, and so you get more angle. Hence, the more evenly spaced the tie rod pickup, middle, and rear joints are, the closer to parallel steering you should have.
But really, I need a model to mess with to make sure.
@@Drunken_Hamster It's more than a theory. Many cars have multi-link/5-link suspensions so the engineers can place certain pivot points/ instance centers where they physically can't go. (Well, it also allows them to tweak the various geometric properties and compliance under different load conditions in isolation) That's also why you have split lower a-arms on some McPherson front suspensions; if the strut had to be placed in an undesirable position/angle, a virtual lower pivot point via separate links can change the effective steering axis and correct important parameters like KPI and scrub radius. But none of that has a fundamental effect on steering geometry or how Ackermann works in general.
The main difference between this printed toy and a real car is the model's single linkage between the wheels. A real car has three elements with moving pivot points as well as motion ratios that constantly change over the wheel hub's range of motion.
Which is why I have no clue what this 3d print's practical purpose is supposed to be. You can explain the basic principle with a napkin drawing in ten seconds, no need to run a printer for ten hours.
It's no secret a slit supplies relief....🤣
Has anyone got a good video on wheel flop mid drift?
intro song name . sounds pretty fire
You know, those instructional products are cool!
I don't know why you would supply false information about where weight is.
Which part are you referring too? When drifting at high angle, due to jacking and weight transfer, the trailing wheel has little to no weight on it. Often times it will even come off the ground, or will be locked and dragging from left foot tracking with minimal weight on it. So this is accurate and it is why the trailing wheel bind on a front rack isn’t as important as if it were a rear rack. And for grip racing the outside tire has more weight hence why F1 cars run negative Ackermann to gain more grip through the slip angle of the tire compound.
@FDFraceshop Let me just say that the weight and load is always on the outside wheel.
If the gentleman would realize hiw big of idiots we all are, the pressure to use oversized words may smooth the nerves.
The info snd design sre great. And the story of the race help given too. We will see how the set goes. I hope it goes well. But, i want to smile about the i made it perfect comment.
First I guess
☝🏼
Unfortunatly I don't think they will sell good, they have a purpose, teach people, I saw the video and I'm glad I did, but I already understand, no need to have a phisical object
US$30 for a 20 cent print?
Ripoff.
So Ackerman racks are mullets.