Catherine was fun loving. I think she initially thought Seymour’s behaviour with Elizabeth was just shenanigans, Catherine herself participated in some of the Tom foolery. When she realised what was going on she sent Elizabeth away.
I don't think it should be held against her, especially as the testimony regarding those events comes from Kat Astley. And while she does find Seymour's behaviour inappropriate, what stands out to me is the fact that she herself found Seymour charming and she even said he would have made a good match for Elizabeth. So, the same person saying he behaved inappropriately is saying he was cool and he would have made a good match for Elizabeth, which... is confusing. I don't think those events were as obviously abusive as we imagine them to have been. I think we have the benefit of hindsight, something Katherine and Astley didn't have.
I just finished watching Firebrand. I cannot believe all that I have learned just from watching this channel! I could tell many times when the plot deviated from history all by myself! Thank you Claire!
My 14th great grandfather was a younger brother of her second husband John Neville 3rd Baron Latimer 🙂 Really cool knowing it's possible I have ancestors that knew Catherine, Anne Boleyn, Elizabeth I, etc and many of my other favorite people from the Tudor period (explains why i've always been so interested in and drawn to the Tudor period since I was a little kid) ❤️ Side note what was done to Catherine in death is so horrific- her resting place was rediscovered after being lost and multiple times after that people kept digging her remains up with the last time resulting in the monsters having an "unwrapping" party where they basically tore her remains apart then threw her away like trash wasn't until later the was finally left alone and reentered for good 😕 So sad and cruel. But great video as always! ❤️
I'm doing a section on Tudor Queens in an upcoming vocal recital. Catherine Parr wrote English words in 1544 to Thomas Tallis' Gaude Gloriosa. I recently got a copy of these words (Psalms and Prayers) and was quite surprised. I'd expected a classic, humble Protestant hymn like what we hear today. Instead, what's there is a person pleading to God to save her from people who would do her harm. It's quite graphic and goes on and on. I think she was in fear for her life several years before her near arrest and may even have been the entire time she was married to Henry. Thanks for the video!
Catherine was a remarkable woman, with so many achievements. I just can't reconcile all of that good work with her seemingly injudicious marriage to Thomas Seymour, and her subsequent condonance of his behaviour towards Elizabeth. If she was such a pious Protestant, how could she excuse Thomas? Or even defy the King to hastily marry someone like Thomas, who she must have known to be a bit rascally? It doesn't make sense to me.
Catherine Parr is such an interesting historical figure 🧐 Have you had a chance to watch the film ‘Firebrand’ starring Alicia Vikander as Parr? I haven’t watched it yet but from what little I’ve seen; the costumes look incredible and so historically accurate 🧡
Thanks Claire for another good video. I think Catherine was lucky to survive Henry's wrath and played the little woman to win him round. I think she was a good queen, very intelligent. However, when married, she allowed Thomas too much access to Elizabeth, which I feel he sexually abused her, maybe not had sex, but near enough.
I don't think there's a misunderstanding regarding those events. You say "allowed Thomas"... could she have stopped him? Don't forget that as her husband he was her "lord" and he made the decisions. While we are more egalitarian today, I don't know if she was in any position to tell him what to do. Second, I don't think we should imagine those events as clear cut abuse. Why? Because the description of what happened came from Kat Astley when she was interrogated after Seymour was arrested. And... she does find his behaviour inappropriate, but at the same time she herself found Seymour charming and said he would have made a good match for Elizabeth. So, in her view, as someone who saw it with her own eyes, it was inappropriate, but not enough to trigger a sense of "stay away from her, you monster". And by the way, if I recall correctly, Astley herself took part in some of the "horseplay", not just Katherine. So... yes, it would have been ideal if people realized sooner what he was doing, but I don't think we should blame them for not understanding sooner.
Having read and enjoyed Firebrand by Elizabeth Freemantle, I was looking forward to the film. It was SO disappointing - no resemblance either to history or to the book AT ALL. The casting of the 3 children was all wrong due to age inaccuracies and the diction of the actress playing Katherine was terrible.
Catherine had a lot of good points but I can’t give her a pass on how she allowed Elizabeth to be treated by Thomas Seymour.
Catherine was fun loving. I think she initially thought Seymour’s behaviour with Elizabeth was just shenanigans, Catherine herself participated in some of the Tom foolery. When she realised what was going on she sent Elizabeth away.
Exactly
I don't think it should be held against her, especially as the testimony regarding those events comes from Kat Astley. And while she does find Seymour's behaviour inappropriate, what stands out to me is the fact that she herself found Seymour charming and she even said he would have made a good match for Elizabeth. So, the same person saying he behaved inappropriately is saying he was cool and he would have made a good match for Elizabeth, which... is confusing. I don't think those events were as obviously abusive as we imagine them to have been. I think we have the benefit of hindsight, something Katherine and Astley didn't have.
I just finished watching Firebrand. I cannot believe all that I have learned just from watching this channel! I could tell many times when the plot deviated from history all by myself! Thank you Claire!
I know. But did they have to arrest her though? I think the real history of those events is more interesting.
My 14th great grandfather was a younger brother of her second husband John Neville 3rd Baron Latimer 🙂 Really cool knowing it's possible I have ancestors that knew Catherine, Anne Boleyn, Elizabeth I, etc and many of my other favorite people from the Tudor period (explains why i've always been so interested in and drawn to the Tudor period since I was a little kid) ❤️
Side note what was done to Catherine in death is so horrific- her resting place was rediscovered after being lost and multiple times after that people kept digging her remains up with the last time resulting in the monsters having an "unwrapping" party where they basically tore her remains apart then threw her away like trash wasn't until later the was finally left alone and reentered for good 😕 So sad and cruel.
But great video as always! ❤️
Every US president save one is descended from King John.
She was an incredible person and was a perfect example for Elizabeth. Elizabeth learned a lot from her.
I'm doing a section on Tudor Queens in an upcoming vocal recital. Catherine Parr wrote English words in 1544 to Thomas Tallis' Gaude Gloriosa. I recently got a copy of these words (Psalms and Prayers) and was quite surprised. I'd expected a classic, humble Protestant hymn like what we hear today. Instead, what's there is a person pleading to God to save her from people who would do her harm. It's quite graphic and goes on and on. I think she was in fear for her life several years before her near arrest and may even have been the entire time she was married to Henry. Thanks for the video!
I love you're videos ❤ so informative
Good video. Can’t wait for the next one. Thanks!
Catherine was a remarkable woman, with so many achievements. I just can't reconcile all of that good work with her seemingly injudicious marriage to Thomas Seymour, and her subsequent condonance of his behaviour towards Elizabeth. If she was such a pious Protestant, how could she excuse Thomas? Or even defy the King to hastily marry someone like Thomas, who she must have known to be a bit rascally? It doesn't make sense to me.
Glad Catherine Parr made it through!
Catherine Parr is such an interesting historical figure 🧐 Have you had a chance to watch the film ‘Firebrand’ starring Alicia Vikander as Parr? I haven’t watched it yet but from what little I’ve seen; the costumes look incredible and so historically accurate 🧡
Thank you claire. ❤
I agree. I think now that she sent her away to protect her but at the same time, she should have taken more measures
Are those books still being printed? They sound fascinating
My favorite wife!
Catherine of Aragon had ALSO been married before....
Did she bring her stepchildren with her when she married Henry VIII?
What do you think made Katherine a fantastic stepmom?
Thanks Claire for another good video. I think Catherine was lucky to survive Henry's wrath and played the little woman to win him round. I think she was a good queen, very intelligent.
However, when married, she allowed Thomas too much access to Elizabeth, which I feel he sexually abused her, maybe not had sex, but near enough.
I don't think there's a misunderstanding regarding those events. You say "allowed Thomas"... could she have stopped him? Don't forget that as her husband he was her "lord" and he made the decisions. While we are more egalitarian today, I don't know if she was in any position to tell him what to do. Second, I don't think we should imagine those events as clear cut abuse. Why? Because the description of what happened came from Kat Astley when she was interrogated after Seymour was arrested. And... she does find his behaviour inappropriate, but at the same time she herself found Seymour charming and said he would have made a good match for Elizabeth. So, in her view, as someone who saw it with her own eyes, it was inappropriate, but not enough to trigger a sense of "stay away from her, you monster". And by the way, if I recall correctly, Astley herself took part in some of the "horseplay", not just Katherine. So... yes, it would have been ideal if people realized sooner what he was doing, but I don't think we should blame them for not understanding sooner.
Having read and enjoyed Firebrand by Elizabeth Freemantle, I was looking forward to the film. It was SO disappointing - no resemblance either to history or to the book AT ALL. The casting of the 3 children was all wrong due to age inaccuracies and the diction of the actress playing Katherine was terrible.
Yeah! First here?!