The Many Retcons of Warhammer 40K.
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- There's been a lot of talk of "retcon" and "gaslighting" from Games Workshop this week with the introduction of Female Custodes. But did you know that an entire Black Library series have been recalled?
Didn't think so, Tourist ;)
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Edited by @WoodImp
Fucking remember when a whole army got written out of the setting for 20 years? And we made a verb of their name?
and people got them back from making their displeasure known?
@@Khobai Half of 'em were.
I would say though, the Votann are a pretty good example of how to do a retcon right. It wasn't just "they were always there" it was "they were always there and HERE is why they've been absent from the main narratives until now" - they explained why the Imperium thought they'd been eaten by Tyranids, they explained their relationship to the Necromundan Squats (and gave those guys a proper range too) they even the Demiurg from the obscure game no one played and their relationship with the Tau. So I think it shows GW are capable of adding decent in-lore explanations for stuff.
That said I guess they added female squats with no explanation and everyone was like "yeah that seems logical" and people loved the AI robot pals they added too.
@@Khobai it's cool you headcanon them as transwomen with beards. i appreciate your open mind and disdain for transmeds
That’s great, but they forgot to add the models to sell me the stuff.
Someone needs to make a "first time" meme at the Fallout fans for the retcon that didn't happen
There have been retcons in every single Fallout. Fallout "fans" just want to complain, that's all.
@San_Vito aye true that! The timeline one that wasn't a retcon just has me like 🤦♂️. The retcons anyway I've always just looked at as things evolving as time has gone on
Jet inside a pre war vault.. already happen
@@freeRadioArmageddon yeah, fuck Myron and his lab :D
@@San_VitoYeah I saw the trailers for the TV series and thought "cool!" Then looked at the comments and was like.. oh.. quite glad I just thought I'll wait and see. Series is great. Is it stupid? Yes. Are the Fallout games stupid? Also yes.
Turning the Emperor from "Guy who jusst wanted to enslave humans" into a "Dragon Ball Z super Psyker who also wanted an excuse to enslave humanns but ALSO can make demi gods" was sooooo much of a bigger retcon than GALstodes
Dont forget Necrons were retconned TWICE: they were art firs chaos possesed automatons with terminator aesthetic
And they wiped out Malal D:
The entirety of RT was removed from the canon (despite still being highly respected by the fanbase). Necrons were mentioned in 2nd Edition (specifically Gorkamorka), albeit not by name and were not a playable faction. They were then introduced as a full-fledged faction in 3rd.
However, keep in mind that a lot of people are still unhappy with the Necron retcon in 5th edition.
But now Chaos Androids are back in canon and they sound fucking awesome.
I can't stand GW, they retconned Rogue Trader! >:V
i cant believe they retconned that one line from that one book that 400th time.
I dont remember no primarchs in rogue trader.
@@Bobyoudontneeemyname Leman Russ was an Planetary Governor, but yeh they only turned up in Epic towards the back end of Rogure Trader
@@HellstormWargamingnow that they retconned my favorite book I shall never read again!
I won’t even read stop signs and speed limits!
When the cops pull me over I’ll tell them and the cop will say “You are the greatest driver of all time, drive on your ideological agenda path and do so with the blessings of all law enforcement that has ever lived.”
Srsly. I will.
The funny thing is way back in the 90s during 2nd edition we still thought Rogue Trader lore was batshit
I first got into 40k in 2005, as a collector of Tau and Necrons. As I was an incredibly easily distracted child, I lost interest by 2006, and then got back into it in 2020, having had almost 0 contact with the universe in the intervening 14 years, other than seeing the occasional meme. Horus Rising hadn't even been published before I dipped. The SHEER AMOUNT of stuff that was wildly different, especially with Tau and Necrons, was incredible, it was like an entirely different universe. I thought that was cool as shit. I think female Custodians is also cool as shit. Expanding the universe, funnily enough, is cool as shit. People picking and choosing their times to be outraged about something that isn't even a new practice is hilarious, and sad
> Custodes are small group of half-naked guys that never leave the imperial palace.
> actually, they're an entire legion of golden armored warriors with unique vehicles and hardware
> actually, Valdor dosn't look like a generic Custodes shield captain anymore he's a pseudo Primarch that looks like something out of Final Fantasy and now has a magic spear that reads the mind of anything he stabs
> actually, they're not all golden they have their own equivalent of Space Marine chapters they've just never been mentioned until Psychic Awakening
It's not so much that there are now female Custodes. It's the "to hell with it" attitude that is felt as to the way they did this. Nearly all of the most recent retcons were met with scepticism and pushback. The first retcons, I would chalk up to as growing pains. A finessing of the groundwork. Also, who's to say there weren't people upset with those changes. The hobby and the community didn't have near the connectivity that it does now. The whole fustrer cluck that was the addition of the Primaris and their associated lore is not but bad development, communication and implementation. I don't think there was a single fan that saw this and was like 'Yeah, that was handled well'. The lore changes to the Orks and Necrons, I think helped to enrich and move them forward. The Orks are a lot more fun for it and the Necrontyr are much more interesting. The "return" of the Squats at first was celebrated but as the lore was introduced it ruffled a majority of the communities feathers. I don't play them so I haven't read their Codex but it is to my understanding the Votaan are technically not Squats. I don't know and I admit my ignorance of them but their lore kinda helps explain the Tau's extreme advancement. The reason I feel that the community is bristling so much is the X tweet stating there has always been female Custodes. The Primaris were around since the end of the Heresy but they at least gave a reason as to why they were never seen, regardless of how ham-fisted the explanation was. This doesn't do that. It's a thump on the head for objecting and a "that's how it is and your gonna like or else" response. They could have simply said "Yes there are female Custodes now. Please buy the new Codex and learn all about the new members of the Imperial House". Now that is how it should have been handled, barring there is an actual explanation in the book. This was not handled by GW in anything approaching appropriate. The other thing is that there really isn't a good reason to add female Custodes when an expansion of the Sisters of Silence's lore and model range would have been so much more appreciated and approved of. GW dropped the ball on this in every regard.
The reason the " community" is bristling is because this touches on culture war dogshit that channels outside the hobby can drum up. That is it. lol It's just about people who benefit from making other people angry having something new to make people angry about. You all keep talking absolutely bollocks rather than just admit that is every complaint that can always be applied to a GW retcon can be applied to this one, but people never got angry before, then the cause of the anger is pretty clear. lol
Female Custodes is basically an optional head swap or potentially a special characted model. How that garners so much vitriol is just... bizarre to me. It literally changes nothing about a players current model collection. I just don't get it.
The issue is that previous lore states, it's just boys who become Custodes. The change stinks of a "woke" reason, and not a "hey guys, we just wanted muscle mommies in golden armor". I could accept the latter reason, I can not accept the former. Make sense? Some of us dont enjoy communist enshittening of things.
There was a time, long ago before the Change, when the Thousand Sons of Magnus the Red wore the blood-red armour of their primarch. But times change. Everything changes. We have changed. This is one of the constant laws of our chaotic times. The key is to learn how to control the changes, how to master them and transform them to your own advantage © Ahriman the Librarian
And so, I can only agree, and there are just mentioned codex' retcons, but how much more there was in BL novels of different types! Erasing possibly duplicity of Lion from Astelan's words in Angels of Darkness, retconning that Luther tried to kill Lion in his novel, First of the Fallen, that are only 10k astartes in TS legion heresy time, etc. Imo, it'd be better, if BL just hire more editors, but changing perspectives/opinions after decades is understandable, different creative visions, different writers, different narrative designers.
Yes! Thank you for bringing up Astelan and Angels of Darkness book. Man they really missed out on really adding texture to the Lion's story.
Plus the existence of Tau and Kroot. Space marines not using shuriken catapults. Space marines not using camouflage. Eldar having Aspects. Eldar not using land raiders and rhinos. Everything beyond the original Rogue Trader is a woke retcon.
Consumerism is usually a good guess when it comes to Games Workshop, at least in the past, but that does not fly here.
If the point is to make money, why are there no Femstodes models, novels, or even upgrade sprues available?
Also, if the point is to make money, why did they do this with a short story and a tweet knowing the change would be controversial and would anger many fans?
Seems like a very stupid way to go about "expanding the customer base" and/or "making more money."
Isn't about money per say as growth 📈
Also when companies have board rooms they are typically so large that one person or even team of people aren't in control of it.
And why exactly would it anger anybody?
@@wolfgangbrooks Nearly any change to lore angers some segment of any fandom. That is even more true when done lazily.
It's not the retcon that people are mad about it's the obvious reason behind it.
They could have easily implemented it better and made it so much more of a smoother change with Sisters of Silence getting upgrades or maybe some of them getting strength augmentations that we could field on the tabletop but no they didn't even bother with that because they never intended to even sell models in the first place.
This was literally just to get social credit on twitter. Appealing to an audience who would never invest in the hobby in the first place. The fans most upset are the ones who have invested more than the average twitter user (I spent 12k over the course of 6 years on models) and people like me don't wanna see the setting or the hobby turn to shit. (Just look at Halo, Lord of The Rings, MCU Phase 4, Even Ghostbusters at one point and atleast a hundred different IPs besides) If you like the change so much that you dedicate videos to this then go ahead and wait until the new line of Warhammer Tv Series, Movies, releases in the next few years. If they turn out good then you'd have reason to celebrate right? But if they turn out bad will you admit people told warned you?
Also be honest if you think this will truly make them money how many girls do you think are interested in playing tabletop wargames that will join because of this change compared to the guys who've already invested thousands of dollars into it? Do you honestly believe it will be a profit for them?
You make a good point but I think GW doesn't realize that it won't actually make them money in the long-run. That company is so allergic to fandom. They have one of the most dedicated communities out there that love their setting but they piss on them time and again which is baffling from an outside perspective and personally I think this isn't their biggest insult to the fandom yet but it's definitely a sign of things to come in my opinion. Btw I'm an actual tourist that's only spent like 10 bucks on a model at a garage sale.
I'm like 16 so what do I know but I've seen other folks post something similar to this and I've only ever seen them get called bigots and sexists but I never saw them attack it head on in the vast majority of the time.
@@JrSmashter It's the average western mindset to resort to ad hominems to a arguement unfortunately.
@@WilderBrummie With respect sir I personally think it's more of a city folk thing rather than a western mindset. I notice city folk have it the worse with just talking calmly. But maybe that's just me being a country boy.
Lol obvious reason? It's a few paragraphs the size of the original Horus Heresy reference. Social media 😂 whose team often have to change product images is in charge of product direction 😅 please
Out of curiosity of those thousands of dollars how much of it is the same codex but different edition 😂
Also you must be new here, Mikeh reports on anything Warhammer so if it's trending...
Yes, we're fully aware GW has retconned things before, that doesn't make the practice any better, now that they're doing it AGAIN. Personally, I like *basic continuity* in my sci-fi universe. And I'm really not a fan of being gaslit that "it was always that way" every time they do it, either.
If they got rid of SoS or SoB via a retcon all the people “owning the chuds” by saying the Custodes retcon isn’t a big deal would lose their shit. Since retcons dont matter and happen all the time let’s just make the Emperor a giant sentient piece of cotton candy while we are at it.
@@NoSyrupLeftbecause those are pretty fucking expensive models you twat.
How on Earth is losing an army you spent a small fortune on in any way compatible to there potentially being a new model at some point in the future that's not a guy?
We're you dropped on your head a few too many times or do you practice saying being this stupid?
So you be happier if their were no Primarchs, and Leman Russ was just some random planetary governor, and the Ultramarines had a Half-Eldar Chief Librarian.
@@Enazel lore is established over time. The changes you list are almost 30 years old and reached a point where they haven’t had a need to change for over 30 years.
Nobodies saying retcons are inherently bad but they need to add more that they take away and with the 40k universe being far better established these retcons need an even better reason to happen
Talons of the emperor came out in 2017 right, Soo it's less then a decade old lore
so far by reading 1e stuff:
- Genestealers were aligned with chaos and not the Tyranids, and there is a difference between a "genestealer clan" and a "genestealer (chaos) cult"
- Beastmen were in the Imperial Guard alongside Ogryns and Ratlings
- freaking Ronins
- an Ork clan allied with the Imperial Guard / Ogryns
- the imperial guard would wipe out any forces that fought against chaos even if they won to avoid the taint. (at least in the couple of audiobooks i listened to, this was never brought up)
I can’t believe the Deathwing aren’t Indigenous American coded anymore :(
3d printers go brrrrrrt.
Go ahead bigot buy 3d printers. GW can always just sell their ip and be successful in other ways. Bigots like you deserve to be put out of your little racist hobby.
misogynists go reeeeeeeeee
@@gwitch Never been about women in the game. Learn the argument of your opposition before criticizing it or its proponents.
@@Teadon86 we know you only like the women that can't speak it's ok. just be honest with yourself
@@Teadon86the argument is you hate women lol. there wasn't this much outrage when necrons got rewritten twice over. you can roleplay as the Stoic Intellectual all you want but you're still pretending a page in a nerd rulebook having female pronouns is something that actually matters and impacts the franchise. the custodes battleforce is already sold out. you lost. it's over.
I think the biggest issue is people are acting like they're only freaking out about this retcon. They freak out about every retcon, It's just this one has politics behind it so it's getting more news.
Imagine how mad they'd be if they retconned a retcon. Saying that I will die on the hill of Snotlings needing to return as the brains behind orkdom
Well, to my mind, the biggest retcon ever was the removal of space Marines. Then there were firstborn, and there are now primarus, and this was the plan all along, from a borderline heretek that no body had ever heard of before, and this guy somehow isn't a front operation for Fabius Bile? Someone needs to call the Tyrantine Cabal over in Calixis because some truly indecipherable decisions were made which make Erasmus Haarlock seem like a mere pretender to convoluted long term plans. Hell, the only reason we haven't had Astartes battle sisters from the get go is because they figured the models wouldn't sell very well. They actually had plans to make them originally. Necrons used to be chaos cyborgs before the undead angle was pursued, and I just tell myself the Flayed ones aren't a throwback to that era, and it keeps me happy. Blood for the... Star god? I think having women custodes has always been feasible within the lore as written over the years, I would be in favor of Astartes women, if they ever decide to make that change, but I'm also fine if they don't, cos the whole gimmick with them was commentary on machismo death cults of the sort you might see under a fascist regime, so if they never change that, I get it. If they do, I'll be totally fine with it as well, because the setting at face value (the Imperium specifically) is not overly concerned with IRL gender roles, so long as you serve your big E and shoot the things the Commissar tells you to shoot, yr as good as the next servant really, this provides little cultural reasoning for them to not also create lady fash super human death troopers, I mean the Sororitas are literally 2/3 of the way there already, raised from a young age to highest standards of military instructions, given the 2nd best equipment set in the Imperium (or at least it used to be that way back in the 4-5e days) insanely loyal, perhaps only grey knights are less likely to be corrupted, but grey who, amirite, never heard of 'em. The only thing they lack is the implants, even just the black carapace alone would do wonders for their ability to fight (although that never really seemed to make it to table top, in rpg mode, there was an agility penalty for wearing power armor unless you were Astartes ofc, Deathwatch was good fun) but yeah, retcons from GW are like raindrops in a shower, they happen all the time, it's the least remarkable thing about that company, their prices are the sticking point for me, I haven't been able to afford it since 6e came out. Still love the setting and "lore" (mostly lol)
It's not enough to have Adeptus Sororitas, Sisters of Silence, and Callidus assassin's. AMAZON demanded girlboss Custodes because Larry Fink of Blackrock is under the thumb of Chinese communists.
I just want to say that I am unreasonably upset that they wrote some bullshit lore to remove Skaven from The Old World.
"There are 2000km of Skaven tunnels under the Empire, but NOT ONE Skaven has ventured above ground in 150 years because two of them are no longer besties"
that could just be empire propaganda. since empire says skaven dont exist
The main issues beyond ignoring all the old text saying otherwise. They just ham fisted it in, instead of making it fit narratively with a great story around it. Could have had one of their great writers something. Instead GW just just gaslights on twitter.
just just
honestly. if they had release minis or heads for female custodes with it. it would have went better
The Leagues of Votann ARE the classic Squats, GW has said several time they're the return of the Squats. Even their announcement video was saying "They're back!". "Squats" are just the Imperial name for their species, the Ironhead Squats are former Leagues of Votann Kin who use the Imperial name because they're on an Imperial world.
Love to see those female Custodes in the original outfits, the classic loincloth and cloak number. The genetically engineered golden armored banana boys are a retcon themselves, but i'm sure those guys going on about it are kinda doing it for views as well, I cant actually believe that many people really care about Custodes.
I'm still pissed off about primaris.
How come no one talks about the female space marine from Rogue trader, or the half Eldar space marine?
Same. They did the Space Marines dirty by replacing them.
It's mostly because RT is not considered canon to Warhammer 40k, despite being the first rulebook and being highly respected by fans. Plus, the "female Space Marines" there are just women in Power Armour, not actual Space Marines, as far as I know. That's how they are advertised in old catalogues I've seen, anyway.
@@Grymbaldknight The mini in question is called "female trooper" in the "imperial army" range (I'm looking at a catalogue right now), which seem like normal people in power armor. I don't know if they were space marines, they seem quite slim, but they weren't Imperial Guard either.
@KainMarko-kj2op Nope their was a Half Eldar Ultramarine Chief Librarian.
@@San_Vito they were proportional about the same as normal Space Marines back then, maybe with slighly slimmer stomachs and wider hips, but not far from RT era marines.
@@Enazel True, but that's because SM back then were quite small. About the same size as any other random humanoid.
But the "female trooper" in the "imperial army" in the catalog I mentioned is *not* surrounded by SM. Rogue Trader SM were different. These troopers are from a line that was discontinued, they weren't neither SM nor Imperial Guard.
People have just been watching videos talking about why they should be angry, now they're angry. It's like if they don't equate woke with bad, their identity is lost.
No, I have hated "Woke" for a decade before it was ever called Woke, and for entirely justified reasons.
Wokeness (Intersectional Critical Theory) is basically a variant of socialism which incorporates identity politics (gender, sexuality, race, etc.) into its "oppressor/oppressed" framework. For example, to a Woke person, a straight, white man is essentially a member of the "demographic bourgeoisie", and must be attacked as per standard socialist doctrine. By contrast, a black lesbian is a member of the noble poor who must be uplifted.
This is why it's never enough to simply create new spaces which benefit "oppressed" groups, or to expand existing "minority spaces"; they must _always_ attack and destroy things belonging to demographics they don't like. Why? Because they are an enemy to be destroyed, so that their "power" can be redistributed to other social groups. Attacks must be carried out by any means necessary, whether physical, social, or cultural.
It's worth noting, too, that "socialism + identity politics" also describes Nazism. The Nazis were essentially "ethno-nationalist communists", and they disliked the Jews much as modern Wokeists hate straight, white men, and for similar reasons (demographic which hordes power). Wokeism and Nazism are obviously not identical, but they are much more similar than they are different.
I dislike Woke because it is fundamentally sexist, racist, and so many other terrible things besides, in addition to being essentially a type of communism (I support capitalism and democracy). It is fundamentally envious, hateful, and aggressive. These are reasons enough why I should "hate the Woke".
that's the whole point of woke, to strip you of your identity.
Wait til you find out that bad and inconsistent writing doesn't justify more bad and inconsistent writing and previous retcons never justify more of them
true but the question is why a lot of "angry fans" are fine with all the other retcons
I mean if they wanted to make money off of this why not sell models? Seems kinda weird to me that they'd do this for money and then not sell models. It gets really hard to not think this is politically motivated by a handful of people at the company.
But whatever view you have of proper gender roles is totally "apolitical" and beyond reproach. After all, if you see something as common, then it has to be good. Hence why your neck of the woods is nigh on perfect. After all sacred tradition should never be questioned.
Thanks for being a voice of reason in this age of madness!
It's because those other retcons weren't part of our current cultural zeitgeist.
of women existing?
chud: they destroyed the lore with this change is the biggest change ever made
Everyone: what about the end of the 13th black crusade?
Chud: what's a crusade?
The chuds are being bussed in from outside the hobby. Most fans are being sane about this thankfully.
*edit for spelling
No, I don't like The Gathering Storm series either. I haven't forgiven GW for Cawl and the Primaris Marines.
Chud doesn't know what an upgrade sprew is because Chud thinks the minis come painted and assembled.
@@NeoHellPoet Is that addressed to me? If so, it has no relation to what I actually said.
The issue with the retcon is not the change itself, but the context in which it is happening and how. They sneak in the change, then when called upon it...gaslighting. And this in the middle of W40K getting more and more mainstream attention, plus the absolute awful and repetitive discussion about having female space marines that emerges periodically mainly by the hand of bad actors. In isolation female custodes isn't that big of a deal, (though I find it unnecesary) , but the circumstances around the deed is what kills it.
But isn't it a compromise to the fsm issue tho 😅 and likely from in-house tug of war since it could almost be a typo. As for that's how it's always been, they did the Dorn tank like that..
@@freeRadioArmageddon But the Dorn tank is clearly to...please buy the tank. Not something that seems parallel to femmarines
"Everything changes. But, war - war never changes."
the problem is you make the argument outside of the wider context that is going on elsewhere in society and with other businesses, which stock prices are also doing much worse due to things like DEI, Disney is a good example.
Also you talk about previous retcons, but we all know that some of them have caused controversy in the past, for example the primaris being the biggest one. but also people complained about 'squats' being removed so frequently they were eventually put back in, even then people have been vocal them not getting more lore or a book to support them. perhaps some of these voices were not as loud as we are hearing now with femstodes but they were there.
And so what if it's a compromise to fsm, votanns lore of being in basically the sci-fi equivalent of a mountain hole worked since their only contract would be with rogue traders who would have a vested interest not to announce goods were xeno made. Similar how we don't really know what's going on inside the palace after the Heresy..
the true retcons were the friends we made along the way
In time the universe we all feel in love with in the 1st place will just be unrecognisable
What because they let women in? What did they do to hurt you?
Dry your eyes, mate.
You are too young to have fallen in love with the original 40k setting and new players will like it or not when they encounter it. Off to the servitor farm with you, you are too dumb for the imperial salt mine.
Looks at first edition Rogue Trader, you shall not be missed chud.
feel in love
I would love that GW would find a way to produce enough minis...that would also give them more money
I can’t wait for you to see how ‘correct’ Warhammer becomes in five years. They did it with WoW, and now they’re doing it with 40k. Good we ll have this videos around.
Those who are mad about this need to just get over it. Being mad isnt gonna change a darn thing.
Bring us SW Shield Maidens!
Live for these comments
You say that, but "being mad" is fundamentally what prompted the lore change in the first place, albeit indirectly.
Now we need to "be mad" to get GW to change it back again.
@Grymbaldknight 🤭 "change it back again," he says.
The only constant IS change. Evolve already.
@@bdgarrett81 Y'know "Progress" isn't linear. A lot of "new ideas" in history turned out to be very regressive indeed.
Besides, who says 40k needs to "evolve". It's art. Art is a cultural statement from the time it was created in. Suggesting that art needs to be constantly revised to keep up with political doctrine is extremely Orwellian, and I reject the notion outright.
Also, "shield maidens" are not a thing; the historical literature is very clear on this, despite how much you want your Dommy Mommy love pillow to love you back. The few female soldiers who existed throughout history have always lost to men in a straight fight - particularly in close combat.
This is one reason why "female super-soldiers" doesn't make much sense, unless they have something other than martial strength to back them up (like the Sisters of Battle and their faith powers).
@@Grymbaldknight Without change/evolution you wouldn't have the current 40k setting. This is the problem with the appeal to stasis.
If people reacted like you're reacting right now to WH40k 2nd edition you wouldn't have almost anything you do now.
you know what I'm mad about in regard to the custodes? they look way stockier as figurines than in illustrations, and it really bothers me.
Also the helpets are not pointy enough, unnacceptable
I still belive that most people are angry about this redcon because of how they addressed it, and not about the subject itself.
Of course there are people who are just mad for the sake of be mad, but if they handleded differently, alot of people wound't be angry, why did't they make a short story explaning in detalis "why the Imperium needed more man-power , and they started taking the daughters aswell of the sons" , or something like Cawl did some thing and now women are as strong are male. Something simple was fine!
The problem is the comments like "There have always been female Custodians.", that's the real problem.
Aside from that, good video as always, keep it up!
Why would man-power factor into it at all, it makes perfect sense for it to have been all along and they shouldn't need to justify it? The first custodes were made from the children of the conquered terran warlords who Probably had children that weren't males across the board. More than that, the custodes creation doesn't follow a formula or template the way space marines do so there isn't a solid reason why any given custodes at any point could not be female. There are only 4 or 5 focus books and a few short stories, much less compared to most factiond, which make it much easier to say none of the featured cast were female and there simply weren't relevant ones until Kesh
I think most people simply aren't angry about this. It has been jumped on by a certain group of people, many of whom are not fans at all IMO, to push an agenda and been further pushes by clueless media outlets and drama youtubers all of which further that agenda, all trying to make out like 'woke' is a bad thing. I'm part of multiple groups to do with the hobby, on discords, whattsapps etc. and basically have seen no negative reactions to this, most people range from 'cool' to 'not bothered', and most people are aware GW change the lore all the time, they also know that Custodes are not made the same way as marines so nothing ever explicitly said 'they are men' and the 'there have always been female Custodians' seems a fair enough explanation to me. There are only a very small handful of named known Custodes anyway and they have limited lore, having been for most of the time they have been around, basically very shiny and glorious security guards who never left Terra. So from a small handful of named Custodes all being men from a limited amount of lore, chances are logical enough that the female ones just didn't get mentioned until now.
We all know why people are more angry about this lore change than other lore changes, don't try and dress it up as something else, it is what is and it is why stuff like this needs doing.
@@tajj7 I have seen negative reactions, almost all on twitter and facebook.. by people who claim to have been fans for years and major lore heads.
The proposal itself was... controversial. However, GW's handling of it definitely fanned the flames.
Horseshit. It’s chuds mad about female characters being made more prominent in the setting. They change shit every edition and retcons happen all the time. This one blows up because it goes into right wing reactionary culture war bullshit.
Something tells me that warhammer youtubers have a conflict of interest when talking about anything that would affect their channels popularity lol
Firstly I'm fine with Female Custodes as a concept because they are not created the same way as Space Marines so it stands to reason that they can exist. That being said I'm not cool with the lazy as hell handwave explanation GW gave that "They have always been there" when that's bullshit and we all know it's bullshit.
There was an easy way to do this with minimal issue the initial 10K Custodes were men but they were so desperate for new recruits to replenish their ranks after the Horus Heresy they pretty much took any Highborn Infant with a pulse. So a few women managed to survive the process and become Custodes like 50 to 100 max of the 10K and because there were so few it allows for the suspension of disbelief as to why we've never heard of them till now cause they simply did nothing of note beyond guarding the throne until the Era Indomitus.
Lastly I don't want them to Supplant the Sisters of Silence they serve an important purpose but I feel that with the inclusion of Female Custodes it could lead to them being swept under the rug to show off the "New Shiny Keys"
So we agree, if new golden mommy doesn't also include another sos kit we riot 😅 district 11 style
Dorn was dead snd encased in amber.
Now he's just missing but minus his hands.
Dorn will be back.
he just needs someone to give him a hand
To be fair from 2nd eddition till 8th edition imperial and chaos faction lore was sett in stone.
Not really.
I preferred it that way.
Nah, the Imperial faction added units all the time.
@@San_Vito So, adding new content is cool, but retconning stuff can be a bit touchy. It's alright if GW wants to introduce female Custodians, but claiming they were always there might not sit well with some fans.
@@San_Vito "The Imperial Faction". Tell me you're not a fan of 40k without telling me you're not a fan of 40k.
I have no issue with narrative _additions_ (unless they're poorly written); my objection is to _retcons_ and rewrites specifically.
It wasn't the retcon, it was the 'there have always been....'. If they did introduce them and showed models, some people might not like it but it wouldn't get the backlash.
Again it is NOT the RETCON 'BUT' their LAME EXCUSES
After BlcakRock / Vanguard buy 8% of GW and planned to make movie with amazon
we know ... thing will change
StarWar -> StarWoke
Load of the Ring -> Load of the Kink
Coming Up
WarHammer 40K -> WokeHammer 40gay
I was bigot / paying customer they stomp out, and I save lots of money from keep my wallet close. that money will go to SLA. they don't miss my money anyway.
Don't think it's the ret con that has people pissed, it the gasslighting and insulting about being called out on the gasslighting. Kind of amazing how you explained why they did these ret cons but didn't explain why female costodies. I've never heard "No Female SM.", All I've ever heard is if your going to do it, make it make sense.
GWs real issue is they shit on your floor, then try to pretend like its always been there. They gaslight and try to rewrite books to further gaslight to convince you that the shit was always there. They have done this forever. Sometimes, it's to sell new shit. Sometimes, to hide some authors' random nonesense, they hated. Sometimes, to hide that the community hated something.
When you accept that their Lore is put together about as well as the Imperium of Man itself, it stops bothering you.
Hey Mikey, I am from India and starting this with photon mono 6ks, I just want to know what would be the best resin for models in cheap. Like would the standard anycubic would be enough or to add flexibility there is some other chems too?
Honestly I don't care about female Custodes it's not gonna make me stop playing. The only thing I'm more disappointed in is how they retconned it. I'm assuming custodian aspirants go through trials similar or greater than Marines. We have Cawl who has been messing with the Emperor's works for a millennium to create primarius Marines. He could have easily figured out the process for custodians. I think anything would have been better than they've been here.
The custodes thing is one of the most minor retcons they've ever done. Also it's not just 40k. I'm still a little sad that the story of Grimgor headbutting Archaon and breaking his crown got retconned. That was a genuinely amusing end to a campaign.
It’s a major change to the lore of a faction. Stop copeing.
Really was so small, all this angry based on a small paragraph talking about sons from noble houses, that doesn't stop him also taking females as well, just he 100% did take males from all noble houses. Also custodes were about before he took control of Earth, so definitely not all of them were noble house born as he would not had access to them in the early days.
@@DJScootagroov*coping and it is a minor change, pull your pants up
Heck, Knights used to be only noble sons too, but then that got retconned as we now have female knight pilots too. @@Enazel
@@EnazelI also just remembered that the Vostroyan Firstborn IG regiment was also firstborn sons, but at some point they retconned into firstborn child.
Too bad they removed that model line, they were so cool.
How dare they retcon necrons form choas robots to ctan control alien robots to the alien robots pokeball the ctan
Sneaky Zelda OoT music!
Snuck some classics into this one ;)
Golden metal mommies are gonna sell like hot cakes just you see
YAAAAS can't wait for new models!
Nice highlighting of the changes but as an economist I have to disagree with the introduction!
A public company does not have to make more profit from year to year or quarter to quarter.
It's just common and it follows the stupidest of all economic concepts: "big numbers great".
Absolute Stone Age logic!
This is one reason why the purpose economy has become more popular and growing in recent years.
It is also not the right way to express it that it is generally assumed that all investors want to see a constantly increasing return on their invested capital. Large investors in particular are often not concerned with returns.
In the case of takeovers, this is completely irrelevant, as it only concerns the value of companies or relevant parts of companies and the reservation price of investors.
As is well known, sometimes entire companies are bought in order to get the rights to an IP.
Or if we look at Twitter/X, then no one will think that the current owner was interested in returns. It was about power, influence and politics.
Investments in companies to protect capital from inflation are also not uncommon.
But that's just some "aCtUAlly" from a German Member of Mensa ;-)
This whole thing is about the misogyny of a relative small but outspoken group incel 40k players and a lot of youtubers looking for clicks, many of which are not really into the overall hobby.
Don't forget the conservative outrage grifters jumping in for the clicks.
This is not being done by GW to increase it's fan base, or sales. It is being done to pander to a political ideology. “Because stories aren’t just hypothetical word games where whatever we say goes. They are a reflection of our reality-however strange or distant. They are a part of the transcendent made manifest, no matter how silly or satirical. In short, they are important.”
“And when you compromise that internal structure-that internal beauty-you are defacing it. And it’s especially ugly when you deface a piece of art for a blatant political agenda that has no basis in transcendent reality. It’s downright disgusting, and we all know it,” “‘But it’s Warhammer! It’s not meant to be taken seriously!’ If it wasn’t serious, you wouldn’t bother going after it. I’m especially tired of this argument. No matter how silly or over the top, stories are always serious, important business-because they are meant to be fun.”
“Humanity has invested more energy into fun than any other endeavor. It’s not something to be taken lightly. Just think how many trillions America alone has spent on every form of entertainment imaginable. Fun is a serious thing, and the Left want to control it,”
its not the retcons its the gaslighting thats the issue
If they want us to consume more then where the heck are our female custodes models?
Goat comment
buy stormcast sets and use female bare heads. They are awesome.
If the rumours are to be believed, GW never wanted this. They were strong-armed into it by Amazon, because they wanted a female Custodian in their upcoming show.
As such, GW had no intention of producing female Custodes models. They just did the bare minimum to try and satisfy Amazon's retcon without pissing off the fanbase. It just didn't work.
@@Grymbaldknight That's... usually now how licensing stuff works. In fact, that is usually the *opposite* of how liscensee and licensed properties operate.
Cides, if that was true, then the one people would probably be blaming for it anyway is Henry Caville, aka the same people that those probably whining about this are putting on their own golden thrones for making it 'lore accurate'
@@gratuitouslurking8610 I don't understand your point. Why would the fans be blaming Henry Cavill for a retcon when the man is a proven stickler for lore accuracy?
If they want to make profit every quarter i doubt thats going to happen with everyone now boycotting them over female custodes. My wife is happy now as i have decided to stop buying GW products before it gets disneyfied. Spent nearly £8k in the last 2 years so thats me saving big bucks and getting cheap 3D models of things i like
😅by "everyone" you mean dozen people right
did you tell your wife it's because they're adding women to the game
@gwitch yeah. We already have multiple female only factions. This is just a pander go losers
Dont stand still for too long or you'll get retconned too
It isnt about the reconning, its how theyve done it. Its boring how much your banging on about the reconning now
Is the point of the video just to poke the bear? The video starts with argument that they are just trying to sell models, but there are no female custodes models, and probably won't be for this edition, so it seems like a nonsense point.
I also do not think anyone who plays the game and is annoyed with the change is unaware of most of the retcons you mentioned, it just seems like a strawman and from my understanding most people seem to have the cutoff for cannon around the beginning of 3rd edition, with before that being more like the prototype for the universe (especially rogue trader).
And, with the unreliable narration of 40k I was under the understanding that most people view one or two mentions as maybe cannon, but the more often something is referenced the more likely that the fact is cannon. So when something the longer something is referred to in only one way the more cannon it comes off, and with the custodes being in dozens of books only referenced one way as male, with an all female counterpart in the sisters, it feels like it could use some explanation. And the whole, well we never explicitly said it couldn't happen just comes off like an annoying grade schooler trying to get around things.
And with the selling models and that's there goal, what part of GW's response to people asking why that made this change help them in selling models. It just seems like it was done to be political and antagonize a portion of the player base, and I do not know how that helps them.
Personally I didn't like the change, for a few reasons, but it was more curious as to why it was done. And in my case GW's handling of it just feels like they are spitting in my face, and videos like this just seem to antagonize it. Like why would someone spend $1000s of dollars and hundreds of hours on something just to be antagonized. People come to hobbies for escapism, and bringing modern politics into it just starts excluding people and making it hostile (I don't think female custodes being a thing itself would be political, especially if it was done early on in the Horus heresy novels or when they became a faction, but GW's response to it, and the fallout just reeks of politics).
Since I mentioned I was annoyed, may reasons are: feels like it takes away from the dichotomy between the sisters of silence and custodes; feels like the sisters are going to be denied new models (I want more sisters models, especially since they have their own detachment now), felt like it was going to blow over into overly political crap (way more than I thought it would); no real back story as to the change given (are they enhanced sisters of silence, was the genecraft applied to women in the age of apostasy and that's why the first few saints of the sisters of battle were able to hold their own against custodes); and in my headcanon Thunderwarriors, Space Marines, and Custodes were all male in part because they were not supposed to ever be able to reproduce on their own and would always need to be reliant on humanity, as a safeguard. It show they are just abhuman stopgaps to help protect humanity until it's next evolution, and is a bit more on the Big E refusing to be seen as a god by avoiding creating a new race of humans.
No new custodian models, 100% pandering.
There's only 2 of these could reasonably be considered these days. 100 years and votann. The rest happened so long ago as 40k being barely established or, in the case of the necrons, the faction barely established 🤷♂️
It was established. They were Terminators. They had zero Egyptian Influence and then they became Tomb Kings.
If the argument is that it doesn't matter, yeah, none of the lore changes actually matter.
@NeoHellPoet not really. If they'd had more than 1 codex to really imprint them in the game then I might agree with you, but they didn't. They weren't firmly established.
And don't gas light.
Plague wars was recent 😅
@@NeoHellPoetzero? Lol take another look at the old pewder lord model ktmkbai
@@freeRadioArmageddon plague wars was recent and noted in my comment
As a custodes player, I'm not overly bothered by a female custode, I'm more annoyed by gw calling me stupid because I didn't know they already existed to be honest. I don't understand why they didn't just create a new female army, which would ultimately make them more money and still attract the same people they are looking to capture.
Exactly this, or come up with new lore to explain why female infants were now being taken.
When they say there's "always" been female Custodians, it's with a wink, just like a couple or three years ago, when they told us there'd "always" been Rogal Dorn tanks, and that the Leagues of Votann had "always" had a thriving society in the galactic core. We know that they've just been retconned into existence, and they know we know it, but they expect us to go, "Sure, why not?", the way we have for all the other retcons. This retcon is not particularly major, as Hellstorm points out...*unless* you are the kind insecure of person who derives his sense of masculinity from the flavor of toy soldiers you collect. That said, despite the furor this week, it will be forgotten in a month, outside of the occasional grumble. Most of them will figure out that nothing's really changed, they don't HAVE to include female models in their Custodes units if they don't want to, and they'll go right back to buying and painting the models and playing the game. If you want to find some people who have a reason to complain, go talk to a Beastmen AOS player--THEY have a good reason to be mad at GW, and yet everyone's already forgotten that GW has just invalidated some peoples' ENTIRE MODEL COLLECTIONS.
@@printandplaygamer7134hey some of us had a lot of sacrosanct models too. 6 fucking year old range… boom ….gone. Also a custodes player . So I’m double pissed at the moment. Not at a female custodes, but the way it got retconned and apparently im a bigot cos I noticed. Fuck GW
@printandplaygamer7134 like I said I'm not OVERLY BOTHERED if there is a female custode, the fact that your name is print and play makes me wonder why you're in this conversation anyway because you most likely don't buy gw models anyway. Trying to call me a bigot, which, let's be honest is what you're trying to say because I can clearly see you like to patronise people wink wink. I'm entitled to my personal opinion as much as you are entitled to your personal opinion. The only reason Mickey is even covering this is because it gets him views, it gets him money......yes he's mentioned plenty that there should be more representation in the hobby, but none of his competitive armies show that inclusion so he can't feel that strongly about it. I know that there's no point in having a conversation with you because from your previous reply you will just copy and paste what other people have said. You've literally just replied with Mikey's response. In regards to the AOS "legending" of most of the army, I don't agree with that, it's one of the reasons I'm not buying anything from gw because its not right to remove half of someone's army who have spent thousands on their army.
The main reason people are annoyed by this specific recon is the reason for it being that Amazon wants more female boss babes in their upcoming series. The other is that this is another case of woke subversion of something already popular. Anything all male must be subverted.
But I agree with this video that GW have never cared about keeping the lore the same at all retconning things all the time.
If someone cares about this retcon and not another then the difference between the two is what they actually care about. If you are for example okay with the LoV faction getting added cause it expands the possibilities of people who like dwarfs and you are not okay with female custodes that expand the options of those who like female characters then obviously the problem is that it's not at all a 40k problem it's culture war Problem coming into 40k. GW will go to shit for sure but not being a sausage fest isn't what will ruin it. The capitalist duty for returns on investment pushing prices up and the qaulity of the deals down is what will ruin GW like every other company eventually. They are owned by shareholders their job is not to produce cool games for the sake of games it's to make money and games are just the means to an end.
I hope that female custodes are the thing that makes you happy bro. Must be amazing that your dream show with 50% women and trans people is finally coming!
to be fair we do not know what the show will be. apparently it will be eisenhorn
@@chakradarrat8832 we very much know what the show will be, that's why "rumors" say Henry Cavill is desperately trying to jump ship but can't
@@radoslav2913 those rumours came from the same 4chan threads that don't like the female custodes so you have to understand why i'm taking those with a grain of salt.
As it should. If you don't get how these things aren't equal, I don't know what to tell you. No, go try to figure it out yourself. I'm sure you're smart enough to figure it out.
Graph MUST go up!
You miss the point. We get that they can adjust the lore WHEN THERE IS A REASON. Like fixing a plot hole or making something work. But there is no reason for female custodes other than to appease Woke investors and anti-fans.
Tell me, what part of the story does female custodes improve? What’s the in universe justification for this. I’ll wait.
And don’t give me this “wider audience” shit. There is no wider audience. That’s always been the marketing department version of the fountain of youth. There is no “wider audience” there is only the core audience and GW is losing that with this retcon.
Manykudos ahh video title
That's my only problem with it... It could have been a cool story! In a good book! They could have made a cool femstode to put on the table top!
WOKE’CON! WHY THEY CHANGE THE BUK! INTERN GONE WILE! P.s. I’ve got a big old girl’stodes on my paint shelf
Most of the complaints on UA-cam come from people calling them Cus-Toads….
I think we can all agree this is valraks fault for selling the golden models to someone other then Mikeh
If you can't see why this is an issue, are you really a fan of warhammer?
you have to hate women to be a fan of warhammer?
@@gwitch That's an insane leap of logic. You clearly have none. Goodbye.
It's pointless virtue signaling. If they Do female marines, I'm out.
They already did in the 90's, so bye-bye chuddite tourist.
10/10 video.
It's not the retcon itself, its the feeling of "Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia" in their tone.
Bullshit. They did the exact same thing just a few months ago with the Rogal Dorn Tank.
For some reason nobody mentioning a huge, ubiquitous tank that's always been there was fine lore wise but nobody mentioning the gender of the huge gold clad, fully covered soldiers of myth and legend, that's a sep to far?
Again, bullshit
@@NeoHellPoet Exactly. They did this already at least dozens of times. People only get mad when it involves women for some reason...
you lost me at "adding someone with she/her pronouns as a custode is really cool"
GW sending out panic emails to all the youtubers and 90% of the youtubers blocking everyone on X
Why?
my problem is not that gw did it, but how they did it.
Don't lie.
You're just a bigot, respectfully end yourself please.
Warhammer has been far too alt-right
It's time we took it away from undeserving incels like you.
@@scannerbarklyThese dishonest incels will lie no matter what all because GW finally turned around and wanted to be good.
Did they appeal to us lefties? Yes
Is it bad? NO
It's high time we took your hobby away from you little terrorist.
They did this hundreds of times and no one cared. "Squats were eaten by Tyranids" then "The Leagues of Wotann were always there, only a few Squats were eaten by Tyranids!" and also "The Dark Eldar were always there". But no, female Custodes is too much!!11one!
@@San_Vito no. As i said, it's the how. With votan gw started with one Model in necromunda, than some lore about a mystery and than the codex with Storys were they came from, what they did... And i want that here, too. Give me a short Story or a book about a girl that got a Vision, went to the trials, became one of few female custodes. And the lore behind how custodes are made, and that it is possible but rare,.... And not a cool short Story about a female with no background or even mentioned to posability and on docial Media, a gaslight, always has been.
The whole primaris story is a retcon. Personally more than retcons. Many of us are concerned this might be the first treatment step that Star Wars followed. Which personally I don’t consume anymore.
Female imperial guard. Tau. Etc. NP. But custodes are red flags to me. The “women can be anything” shouldn’t overwrite things in the universe this way. And I have a baby girl. Trust me.
My personal opinion.
Cheers
The lore has been changing since Rogue Trader in 1987. When did we *not* have retcons? You do remember that Horus started as a random General and the whole Heresy was a fraction of a single page, right?
WH40k wouldn't exist without retcons.
Watching you makes me daydream of the Pedro Pascal scene against the mountain while you work to kill the last si-fi setting standing. Just a thought
Your logic is false. This retcon makes the product LESS appealing. I'm sorry, but reality is that women cannot be warriors. Army conscription standards need to be relaxed to let women into the US military (as an example). Also, women MMA champions have fought men without any training multiple times and have always lost to the men. War is the domain of men and male protagonists are cool as warriors. This is basic human nature. You Milady Stans will not stop buying the products no matter what they do. However, there are a significant number of GW fans that will not allow this to go un-challenged, so this is a stupid business decision.
Secondly, if you can retcon anything, then you are making the arguement for fans to not care about this brand. It would have no unique flavour and offer nothing different than random product for consumer to consume .
Thirdly, women do not play wargames. They do not like wargames. They will never like wargames. The number of women that play are not even a rounding error. To believe this will EVER change is simply delusional. For evidence of this, you only have to look to the American comic book industry. They pandered to what they thought women wanted, lost the bulk of the male audience, and did not get any women to buy any comics. The numbers don't lie on this.
Your premise is sheer fantasy.
You don't know what 40k is do you? 🤣 40k is sheer fantasy. A space opera with demons, magic , witch hunters and monsters. The people farming outrage are just trying to get revenue.
Isn't there the counterpoint to be made that arguments over the alleged real world ability of baseline women to be warriors is sort of overshadowed by the whole issue of the impossibility of achieving the sort of level of bioengineering required to create Custodians in the first place with current levels of technology or any level of reasonably foreseeable biotechnology? Remember, Custodians are so powerful that they are to Astartes as Astartes are to baseline humans. Their physical capacity is thousands of times greater than anything any peak human athlete or warrior of either sex has ever achieved in history. The gulf in physical potency between what a Custodian is supposed to be capable of and what any normal human is capable of dwarfs into insignificance the average differences in physical ability between men and women. If you have the extreme level of technology required to create a Custodian at all, offsetting any difference in physical capacity between your male and female candidates who are compatible for such enhancement should be absolute child's play by comparison.
GW's handling of this incident has been inarguably poor, and their response did come off as smug. The lore matters a great deal, but I for one do not think female Custodians is a big enough change to be all that concerned about. It is not as though the simple existence of female Custodians in and of itself changes the essential character of the 40K universe or the sort of stories that can be told within it.
Fewer women enjoy wargaming, but not none. I personally have met women wargamers, and for some reason most of them gravitated toward more monstrous factions, with Tyranids and Genestealer Cults being especially popular. Make of that what you will.
@@gregorygreenwood-nimmo4954 If you have a magical or technological ability to increase the fighting capability of men and women by 500% (which the Custodes genetic engineering process essentially is), it _still_ makes more logical sense to only recruit from the biggest, strongest, and most martial men... or, at least, the infant boys with that genetic profile.
@@gregorygreenwood-nimmo4954 Exactly my thought, explained in the best possible way. This post should go on Warhammer Community xD!!!
@@gregorygreenwood-nimmo4954 Unfortunately the lore does not support your assertion, as they use existing adult men to modify, instead of a zygote. So the Imperium's technology does not allow them to modify humanity in any manner they please. If you are going to use an existing human, you would still use a male as it is the gender that exhibits the traits you are looking for. It would make no sense to pick the physically weaker gender of a species as a baseline for such a process.
It was a lazy retcon and its illogical according to lore. And its a useless retcon as they DID NOT release any cool models with it. All in all i dont give a fuck about it since theres no impact on anything unless they write books about it. And even then. Doesnt matter. We still play with plastic models and paint and have fun. Again it was stupid. Lazy. But no models so meh ill forget bout it in a month when they start talking about NEW MODELS lol
Maybe GW will hire you for Warhammer + if you keep shilling. Keep grinding!
I have several problems with your fundamental premise:
1) The fact that the lore has been retconned in the past isn't a defence of retcons in the present or future. Retcons are fundamentally bad storytelling; good storytelling involves _adding to_ what already exists, not _modifying_ it. This is because lore is a self-contained set of premises upon which a fictional world is built, and tampering with the foundations compromises the integrity of the shared story... which pisses people off.
2) Fans have been up in arms about previous retcons. Famously, 40k fans dislike GW messing with the canon. The Necron Reboot Controversy and the Primaris Marines Schism are two big examples of long-time fans taking umbrage with the lore. Hell, some people still don't like Tau after all these years. It's not as if this is the first time fans have complained about such things. The notion that this is specifically about "keeping women out of 40k" is at best nonsense, and at worst slander. None of us ever had a problem with the Sisters of Battle, Commander Shadowsun, Maugan Rah, or any of the other female characters already in the lore, nor did we have a problem with women in the hobby space. What we have a problem with is GW messing around with a universe which we want to be internally consistent.
3) Previous retcons were fundamentally done to increase sales. This is irritating but, given that GW is a business, it is at least understandable. By contrast, this change was _so obviously_ done to tick ESG checkboxes and score "Woke points". This is unacceptable. This is activism influencing art. This is turning an existing story into propaganda.
We all knew this was coming, too; partly because "Female Space Marines" has been a heated lore topic in the fandom for some time, and partly because we've seen other media companies - such as Disney - succumb to similar pandering. Those who opposed all this knew this day would come, and that's why we were ready to push back against it. We don't want this SJW crap in our hobby.
He'll never tackle that head on and if he does he'll defend it's cause with a zeal politically captured youtubers will have once they know that their political side is capturing a fandom. I've seen it happen with Star Wars and Marvel and it's likely to happen to 40k too unfortunately.
What's being _modified?_ They just _added_ female Custodes. The male Custodes are still there.
@@San_Vito Yeah, that's not relevant to my objections.
@@Grymbaldknight They won't understand that it's not about female Custodes, it's the reason behind it.
So many other franchises dug this hole for themselves and 40k will be no different at the rate GW is going about it. If they wanna be political, go ahead be political see where it gets them in the next few years, surely not like the Witcher show, Halo, Rings of Power, the entirety of MCU Phase 4.
Your jugs bounce, cut out the soy.
Its not retcon thats the problem, its the gaslighting...
This is not selling nor will it sell more models
But keep up the woke bootlicking, its entertaining
You can gaslight people as much as you like but the fact remains this was down to pressure from outside the hobby. It is an unwanted change from the majority of the fanbase. Your disingenuous bullshit wont change that.
"the fact remains" source: crack pipe
No. Thats not ok. They could simply have found a way to create them now. Cawl could just now have found a way. Not like this. You dont care but youve lost a sub.
Sorry but this video makes no sense. Just to be clear I am perfectly happy with the introduction of female Custodes, I think lore wise it makes perfect sense, and the only minor annoyance I have with this introduction is the stupid way they did it, with a Twitter post, instead of making a nice book with a badass character or something similar.
Anyway, back to the point, as absurd as the stance of the offended people is, you are really not addressing anything and just listing a long list of retcon that happened gradually, to which they could answer back "yes exactly, things keep changing every few years, and we accept that. But this only reinforces the exceptionality of this specific change, because it is not a gradual change after a few years, it is something that has been repeatedly confirmed for many editions, and now all of a sudden, for no apparent reason except wokeness, has been forced on the community".
As much as I don't agree with this, I don't think your video has any comeback against this hypotetical answer, because honestly it is just applying the same level of stubborness as they do in their obtuse pov.
If you wanted to actually address their criticism I think the only thing to point out is the lorewise while it is true that all references suggest that Custodes were only man, nowhere is actually stated that women could not be made into custodes, so again strictly from a lore point of view, while the manner in which they were introduced is very stupid, the fact that they are now canon is actually undeniably possible, especially in a lore that is alway extremely vague and secretive, if not outright confusing.
So again, to conclude, their concerns are obviously political (and quite honestly very lame), but descending to their same level to try and prove them wrong does not really serve anyone, and doesn't really look great on your part.
Apologies if this is offensive in any way to you, but what I am just saying is that I heard you arguing much better points in some of your streams; this video is just not one of those better points.
Peace.
So what's a female custodes look like? How do they retain femininity whilst being able to compare with the physicality of a male custodes?
And if their dna has been reprogrammed to the point of which they now have a man's physiology, are they still female? And why would the emporer spend the extra time and money creating a female custodes that resembles a male custodes, when he can just make a male custodes?
@@StigPrice I assume a female custodes would look very similar to a male custodes. I don't think anybody is suggesting that they have to look "extremely feminine", just that they are females.
They are not reprogrammed to the point where they are men, they are reprogrammed to the point where they are custodes, which is several order of magnitudes higher and stronger than any human, male or female. And you are seriously suggesting that the emperor, a creature that is almost, if not completely, a God, isn't able to work on an infant to make it a custodes, no matter what their gender is? Because if you are I think you might want to venture into historical fiction instead of Sci-fi/fantasy.
You are assuming that the creation of a custodes is in any way similar to that of an Astartes. Space Marines are "industrially" created from young boys, and is repeatedly stated that the gene seed only works on young males (for some pseudo scientific reason). Custodes are instead created from infants that show some extremely specific characteristics (and is never stated that these are only present in male infants); furthermore every Custodes is like a single work of art, not a repeated process like for the astartes, and their creation has never been explained fully. So I don't see what the "extra time and money" you are talking about should come into place at all. If the unspecified markers are there in the infant, doesn't matter the gender, that is a good candidate to become a Custodes.
@@Alec_Evenor wait wait? You aren't under the impression that custodes candidates have a 100% survival rate are you?
@@StigPrice Where did I say that?
@@Alec_Evenor you didn't, it's just you are talking about the emporer as if he's infallible, and I'm just making sure you are aware theirs a much higher death rate amongst potential custodes than there is Astartes.
do you think the death rate would be higher or lower amongst female candidates?
And do you know what would happen to the candidate pool if the emperor began killing off entire generations of their women to create a single female custodes? Do you know how many potential male candidates a single female candidate could produce if the emporer were to just leave them alone and not turn them into sterile super soldiers with male physiology?
And as we both know. the emperor himself painstakingly reprograms a custodes DNA in order to maximise their size strength and speed. And given that not all custodes are equal in combat ability, the base genetics dictate the efficiency of the final product.
A "retcon" isn't always bad. This is a bad retcon. It doesn't fix anything. It doesn't add anything meaningful. It's just a blatant wokification of the setting for dei and esg scores.
if it doesn't fix or add anything why is it a problem then aaahahaha
@@CaptainRadiator It's unnecessary and insulting...
@@beardfistthegoldenone7273 Yeah, like when they added the Necrons. Or the Dark Eldars. Or the Tau. Or Leagues of Votann. Unnecessary and insulting.
@San_Vito you know that's not the same thing. Figures I get intellectual dishonesty in this channels comment section.
@@beardfistthegoldenone7273 How is this not the same to all the previous retcons GW has done through out the years?
The issue isn't female custodes. To be honest female custodes actually make sense. It would actually be an improvement ( not space marines though that would break the whole setting) the issue is WHY they are doing it. Nobody wants to see 40k go down the road star wars did which is what's going to happen if the fandom doesn't stand against retcons done for politics.
Warhammer apologists make me laugh
Love the channel, but this isn’t the pandaverse. If it’s to sell models, there aren’t any. 100 years is meaningless with FTL travel. Lore has been almost exclusively been written from human perspective, orks shooting better not lore. Necrons, weren’t known to imperium to even be a race, humans didn’t chat with them, the whole lore change is change of perspective. Squats are not great, but space big, main issue with them is STC usage. Custodies, with sisters of silence, are the very last line of defence for big E. The idea that the entirely utilitarian, facist imperium would use incredibly rare resources to make weaker custodies out of choice undermines the setting by making the imperium sympathetic to modern DIE standards. It is not. This imperium would rather send 100,000 men and women into battle just to deplete enemies ammo rather than use an expensive missile to wipe enemy out, but now big e has always been protected by less than the best possible troops because feelings? The attraction of this universe is that we don’t have representation, we don’t see ourselves in the characters. Nobody is a snarling 7 foot blood thirsty mushroom, or a space nazi, or rotting corpse. To reiterate, division doesn’t sell product, can see that in the stock prices, so real question nobody will ever answer is why the change.
You have pont! Im just slightly mad about female custodes as i dont relay care (im playing SoB), because it was made for "agenda", and i fear warhammer will go down the spiral like Witcher or Rings of power series , they already destroyed 2 of my loved "geek spots"
Wokestorm gaming! Everything is a retcon!