As mentioned in the Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah (#48 Arabic), there's another sign of love: "... fortitude under My decree, and patience under My trials."
With the mention of his name, Russell Garcia, the tears sprang from my eyes. He was truly a radiant light, just as Tom said. Everyone felt special when with Russ. Yes, it is possible to practice the 12 signs of love. Wonderful talk, wonderful insights into our beloved Faith and, of course, the lessons which each of the Divine Prophets have come to share with us. All humanity, at all times, moves in a veritable ocean of oneness, if only we could know it. Peace and goodwill to all.
What a lovely gathering and speaker. The place is so beautiful, comfortable, intimate and cozy. The subject is wonderful. I am so glad it is on UA-cam.I can enjoy it 7 years later. Thank you for posting.
I've played in orchestras under Tom Price, I've sung in his choirs, and he's just as much fun and loving when he does all that as when he gives these lectures. I hope he's still doing that somewhere.
Although we could not see you in Singapore or Malaysia, we watched your video and felt close to you. It was a joy to the heart and mind. You made LOVE understandable and within our abilities. We thank God for your gift of speech.
Excellent! Very nice to hear a description of a tool to enable us to receive the love of God by focusing on giving unto others. Yes, it will flow as much as we make ourselves conduits for it. Thanx :)
One time I went to visit someone in the hospital an old man. We said prayers in the ward there was my work mate who was also there looking after he son who has been ill for years. He was the age of my son. You can see bones at him. Ok when finishing prayers with the old man then we proceeded to them. I was with my son and my daughter l allowed them tonpray the short healing prayer. Atfer few days the old man and the youth passed on. I was so guilty coz at the end it says healing in both this wotld and the world to come
let the foolish man value pleasure & wealth and let him died in the pit, but for Me and my family we will first seek the Face of the Lord through Christ Jesus our savior.
For God i dont undestand very good the english, but i undestand everything, thankyou so much my dear friend Tomy aim from Ecuador iam bahai too jajajaja, i love this conversations
Try this. Tell everyone to write down without sharing with others as many words as they can that they associate with LOVE. Give them 3 minutes. Then ask them to classify the words as a group into 'common' (everyone in the room has exactly the same word - a plural is different from singular, if there is a suffix like 'ing' it's different too, etc.), shared (where a few in the room have the same word) and unique (where no one else in the room has the same word). Then work out the proportion of each grouping - you will be surprised. The first thing it will challenge is that concept of 'we all speak a common language' or 'it's common sense'. It's a great game for discussion of communication, feelings, etc.
The Twelve Signs of Love Sign 1 - Unity Above All Sign 3 - Praise and Gratitude Sign 4 - Only see good in others Sign 6 - Forgiveness Sign 7 - A kindly Tongue Sign 8 - Selfless Love Sign 9 - Service Sign 10 - Always be the cause of happiness to others Sign 11 - Never make people unhappy Sign 12 - The Golden Rule
Loved your talk and have shared with friends. As I intended they are now asking questions, but also how to get your book. Please let me know when it may be available. thanks
@sam .zad: I appreciate the research you put into the Baha'i Faith before making your comment, but I would like to add some information that you are missing. The Baha'i Faith is actually the first world religion whose Writings explicitly restrict the followers to monogamy. The Bible has many instances of polygamy, and the New Testament, although it implies monogamy in several contexts, never forbids polygamy. Most early Christians were Roman or Gentile, and already practiced monogamy due to that background. Hinduism and Islam allowed for polygamy, and Buddhism was silent on the issue. Baha'u'llah was a polygamist because he was raised Muslim, and it was both allowed and expected in His culture to practice polygamy. But He took no more wives after He manifested God's attributes. In His wisdom He would often unfold new laws gradually over time, to allow time for His followers to transition. He forbade His followers from marrying more than two wives, and strongly endorsed monogamy in the Kitab-I-Aqdas. He also gave His son, Abdul-Baha, the absolute authority to interpret His Writings and lead the Baha'i community. Abdu'l-Baha expounded in His own Writings that the Writings of Baha'u'llah lay restrictions on marriage that would make polygamy for any Baha'i impossible. Thus, the Baha'i Faith only allows for monogamy, and is the first world religion to explicitly do so in it's authoritative texts. I hope this provided some clarity!
Tom is a kind, nice man - and his principals for love are good. Humankind can benefit from listening to his wise words regarding love. I wish Tom was as logical and discerning in choosing his religion, as his passion for helping people. Tom stated in the beginning of his speech, that all the great religions have come from one God. This is not true. Hindus believe in polytheistic gods. Jews believe in God and no Messiah. Buddhists believe that people can become gods themselves, the universe created itself & reincarnation. Christians believe that God & Jesus are one, although, Jesus is the Son of God. God would not send various prophets to confuse and deceive his children. God also does not send a polygamist, who never performed any miracles, to spread his teachings - namely Mirza Nuri, alias ' Baha u llah'. The one true God, of the Bible, does not allow a poser prophet, Mirza, to allow a man to marry more than one wife, as written in the original kitab agdas. People....use your brains, as well as your hearts to truly understand what your Father in Heaven & Lord Jesus want to give you!
sam .zad the foundations of religion are the same. Man has over time corrupted the word of God hence the need for a new messenger. Progressive revelation. Miracles aren't sufficient proof of being a prophet which is what Bahá'u'lláh stated. Non believers and even people there would still not see a miracle as suffice so clarifying that point- it's not sufficient proof. Why are there so many denominations yet one saviour? Exactly. Man has divided the word of God and is why God has sent Bahá'u'lláh. Investigate the truth for yourself before stating claims.
It is my opinion that people should not b viewed as giving the impression that they are eligible for public service thru, expeciationally speaking! I can elobrate if asked🤗
The speaker makes some good points regarding listening, showing gratitude. However being "nice" is not a sign of love, being "genuine in caring" is. If you cared about someone you might even at times be tough on them. Being receptive to criticsm is a sign of maturity. Ultimately genuine caring will help an individual to be more mature. Comparing human relations to light and darkness is simplistic and not practical.
I can't speak for Tom but he would probably agree with you. The great thing about sharing out thoughts is we get to expound upon them. Which makes sense since there is really no way to get all the many facets of a topic covered completely in a roughly hour long talk. Knowledge and learning is inexhaustible. And of course there are many things we can agree and areas to disagree on but as Tom does here starting with general principles is a good foundation. thanks,
Billy: The problem is Abdul-Baha's contradicting statements and even actions. Despite the discriminating laws toward women in Aqdas, the holiest Bahai book, He sets the equality of men and women as one of the Bahai principles. But at the same time he bars women from serving in the universal house of justice. Even in 1909 in response to Corrine True who had asked Him to reconsider the decision, He re-affirmed that women should not serve in UHJ. Also in response to a woman who asked him why God has not yet appointed a woman as prophet, He states, although men and women share talents, but there is no doubt that in the sight of God men are stronger and have priority (Golzaare Taalim e Bahai, P288). Please note that the UHJ has changed the principle in regard to equality of genders: "as long as men and women are not equal, the bird of humanity can not fly.".... Although in Aqdas kissing the hands are prohibited, but when the Master traveled to America, allowed the women to kiss His hand.
Donald Moderational My friend, I applaud to your deep research and wonderful knowledge about the history of the faith. However, I believe there were some misunderstandings. You seem to view to barring of women from the highest governing form of the faith as inequality between men and women. To clarify this, men and women are not unequal when they do different things. For example, is it considered unequal when a woman is able to get pregnant and be considered the primary caretaker of the child. To be a UHJ member is to devote 24 hours of a day to the well-being, and upliftment of the Baha'i community. In the faith, it is revealed that when all 9 UHJ members are gathered together doing their work they are considered "infallible". So if a mother gets pregnant, her child gets sick etc. The women is not able to "take a break" for a couple of months. In the writings, we are told that this is a subject that the wisdom of which will be revealed in the Future. But there are some obvious wisdoms. You fairly cite the quote from abdul-baha in which he shares the reason why women were never manifestations of God. If you examine the history of the manifestations, you see that he's right! In past ages, men were far more powerful and prioritized than women were! If a woman were to go out in the streets and proclaim this message, or proclaim to a specific person. Women had such a low station that no one would even turn their face towards her. She couldn't have gone anywhere unsupervised, and beaten severely. Men also had a higher tolerance than women. And as you know all the manifestations got severely prosecuted and tortured. Women were not able to bear such torment at their time. However, abdul-baha does not mention the impossibility of a female manifestation of God in the future! This is beyond the reach of our thoughts! The quote that the UHJ had sent out to the world is not always related to what role men and women take, but the education they get, the attention, the care, praise, spiritual empowerment etc. Your final point is a very good point, and I am impressed with your deep research my friend. However, one must consider that these women were not Baha'is, and had not heard the aforementioned law in the kitab-i-aqdas. Abdul-baha did not have the heart to pull away his hand, and tell the women not to do what they wanted. Thank you for your investigations, I wish you much success and truth.
Kiya Shahidi: I highly respect your positive attitude in a critical discussion. Every person agrees that women and men are physiologically different , however we agree that they should stand equal in social rights. Suppose, there is a 55 year old woman whose children are married and well settled, even she can not serve on the universal house of justice UHJ. Your argument does not stand if you remember in 1990s simultaneously three Muslim countries, Turkey, Pakistan and Bangladesh were governed by three women. In regard to why a woman has not been a prophet, I agree with your point that it has been in part, due to men's attitude toward the women, but let me remind you that simultaneously with prophet Muhammad, a woman claimed prophet-hood (I think her name was Asma?) and even gathered 15000 followers, but she lost to the Muslim army. Also Ayesheh, the wife of prophet, after her husband's death, lead the Muslim army of 30,000 men. Abdul Baha, however, closes the door when he concludes, in the sight of God, men have priority and are stronger. Regards
Thank you for your reply. I observe many good points in your response. As to your references to the two women in the Muslim Era, i definitely do not deny your good point! But i believe there might be some misunderstanding. Abdul-Baha says what he did taking into perspective of that of a prophet/Manifestation. Asma did gather an impressive following but when comparing them to the main prophets of God, the influence i think speaks for itself. There is no doubt that women are not able to show power and strength, and in some cases even superior to men. And abdul-baha does not deny this stating in the Promulgation of Universal Peace pg. 74-75 "History records the appearance in the world of women who have been signs of guidance, power and accomplishment. Some were notable poets, some philosophers and scientists, others courageous upon the field of battle. Qurratu'l-'Ayn, a Bahai, was a poetess. She discomfited the learned men of Persia by her brilliancy and fervor. When she entered a meeting, even the learned were silent. She was so well versed in philosophy and science that those in her presence always considered and consulted her first. Her courage was unparalleled; she faced her enemies fearlessly until she was killed. She withstood a despotic King, the shah of Persia, who had the power to decree the death of any of his subjects. There was not a day during which he did not command the execution of some. This woman singly and alone withstood such o despot until her last breath, then gave her life for her faith." As aforementioned women are not barred authority in all governing branches, such as the International teaching center, it is but the Universal House of Justice from which Men are only granted this station. I deeply respect your opinion, but we are told that the wisdom thereof will be manifest in the future. and thus it is a matter of faith. But within the hearts of the baha'is, men and women alike, there is certitude that no trace of inequality exists on a spiritual level within The numerous activities we participate in, and all the gatherings that take place. I generally dont participate in discussion on the youtube comment section as it only fuels conflict and this will only contribute to the degradation of the world, but it is people like you my friend that give this world value and opportunity to think and consult with peace, and positive result. i think that your level of knowledge is exponential, and that you are thirsty for truth, and willing to do deep research for it. I wish you luck in every way. Regards, Kiya
During the First World War the entire bay area of Haifa/'Acca was placed under a sea blockade and mined by the Turks. Haifa was hard hit by the First World War, especially as a result of the cessation of all economic and commercial activities prevailing at that time. This was a time of great poverty and famine in the North of Palestine. When the British arrived in Haifa, where the blockade had caused a perilous condition for the inhabitants, it was discovered that 'Abdu'l-Bahá had saved the civilian population from starvation. Provisions which He had grown, buried in underground pits, and otherwise stored, had been given out to the civilians of every nation living in Haifa. 'Abdu'l-Bahá did this in a military way as an army would give rations, and deep was the gratitude of those women and children who had been saved by His power to see into the future of tragedy and woe as early as 1912, when He began the preparations for the catastrophe which was to overtake that land in 1917 and 1918. When Haifa was finally occupied by the British, reserve provisions had not yet come for the army, and someone in authority approached 'Abdu'l-Bahá. He told them that there was also enough to provide for the British Army. He was knighted for the great humanitarian efforts made to feed the needy in the Haifa/'Akka area during the war. (Some of this information was gleaned from the internet, and a portion quoted from a book entitled *The Chosen Highway*)
He was given the title of sir because long before it was a drought in Palestine Abdul Baha predicted it and ordered to save on wheat and when the drought came and every body including British army was hungry for piece of bread ,Abdul Baha went to the city and made sure every body including the soldiers do not go hungry and because of his wise prediction and love for every body,British government gave him the title of sir.
The Bahai principle of "independent investigation of truth", although very attractive, but is in contradiction to the holiest Bahai book, Aqdas, which limits the freedom only to "submit unto My Commandments". "Humans are a flock of sheep that need a shepherd" and "the symbol of liberty is animal": 122- Consider the pettiness of men's mind. They ask for that which injures them...We find some men desiring liberty and priding themselves therein. Such men are in depth of ignorance. 123- Liberty must in the end lead to sedition whose flames none can quench...Know ye that the embodiment of liberty and its symbol is the animal...Liberty causeth man to overstep the bounds of propriety, and to infringe on the dignity of his station. It debases him to the level of extreme depravity and wickedness. 124- Regard men as a flock of sheep that need a shepherd for their protection. This verily is truth, the certain truth. We approve liberty in certain circumstances and refuse to sanction in the others.... 125- Say: True Liberty consisteth in man's submission unto My commandments, little as you know it...The Liberty profiteth you is to be found nowhere except in complete servitude unto God, the Eternal Truth....
Hi My MOST beautiful Holy 3/4 God 1/4 👼 husband son❤ together forever eternity. LOVE infinity 🕯 u r My little sunshine :) i Love u 🙋God💋. Hi momma! The guy from another galaxy is teaching us how to use our new video game consoles!!!! Thanks honey. I adore you DeiBy, t🌈💕
He should back his statements by quotations from central figures and the universal House of Justice,other wise it looks like he is taking the credit for himself and this is dishonest,besides some they believe if it comes from infallible source and not from himself.
Too many " "I think " "in my opinion" when almost all is from Baha'i writings and he is not making reference to the writings or the central figures who where "the authors" "
As mentioned in the Hidden Words of Baha'u'llah (#48 Arabic), there's another sign of love: "... fortitude under My decree, and patience under My trials."
👍
i'm a bahai student in Taiwan i'm just finished this talk! i was learning English and how to love people in these way ,
so helpful for me!
With the mention of his name, Russell Garcia, the tears sprang from my eyes. He was truly a radiant light, just as Tom said. Everyone felt special when with Russ. Yes, it is possible to practice the 12 signs of love. Wonderful talk, wonderful insights into our beloved Faith and, of course, the lessons which each of the Divine Prophets have come to share with us. All humanity, at all times, moves in a veritable ocean of oneness, if only we could know it. Peace and goodwill to all.
A fabulous lecture on love for everyone regardless of religion or belief, including atheists! Thank you Tom :)
What a lovely gathering and speaker. The place is so beautiful, comfortable, intimate and cozy. The subject is wonderful. I am so glad it is on UA-cam.I can enjoy it 7 years later. Thank you for posting.
I've played in orchestras under Tom Price, I've sung in his choirs, and he's just as much fun and loving when he does all that as when he gives these lectures. I hope he's still doing that somewhere.
Wonderful talk, with many practical and inspiring ideas on how to better love.
Simple and easy. Tom Price shows us how to practice love in our life.
Thanks Tom. I love you too. So true.God e with you in all your endeavours in the Faith.
Although we could not see you in Singapore or Malaysia, we watched your video and felt close to you. It was a joy to the heart and mind. You made LOVE understandable and within our abilities. We thank God for your gift of speech.
Very good points, by the speaker to evaluate to ponder.
wonderful talk and I can't stop taking notes.Please post more videos of your talk Mr Price.allah u abha
I am going to practice one by one.
Thank you sir for your lovely speech..
Love and Regards ❤️
Excellent! Very nice to hear a description of a tool to enable us to receive the love of God by focusing on giving unto others. Yes, it will flow as much as we make ourselves conduits for it. Thanx :)
Allah'u'Abha,
Beautiful! Thank you Tom, you really opened my eyes.
Awesome. An eye opener...
Happy Ridvan dear Mr Tom Price, We are enjoying the fruits of your training to the point of culmination !
So beautifully shared
Rajkumari Prasad y
Excuse me Francisca Schilder
Thank you. Yes.
One time I went to visit someone in the hospital an old man. We said prayers in the ward there was my work mate who was also there looking after he son who has been ill for years. He was the age of my son. You can see bones at him. Ok when finishing prayers with the old man then we proceeded to them. I was with my son and my daughter l allowed them tonpray the short healing prayer. Atfer few days the old man and the youth passed on. I was so guilty coz at the end it says healing in both this wotld and the world to come
wonderful talk ,sweet voice , humble posture.Mr Tom Price .keep it up always.we love you
This very great Mr. Price, it actually will bring if not big, but at least few changes to some people. May God Bless you.
let the foolish man value pleasure & wealth and let him died in the pit, but for Me and my family we will first seek the Face of the Lord through Christ Jesus our savior.
Again thank you for sharing Love and Faith thinking accordingly !
extrordinary talk! thank you so much!!!
Wow! The love chapter (1 Corinthians 13) comes alive with this concrete exploration of love. Thanks for posting!
For God i dont undestand very good the english, but i undestand everything, thankyou so much my dear friend Tomy aim from Ecuador iam bahai too jajajaja, i love this conversations
Thank you very much. I love it
Thank you....all ready sharing..
From malaysia
Thank You Balan for your assistance.
Thank You Balan.
KK Tang
Together in His Service
Thanks so very much, Tom! Brilliant! :)
Perfect !
fabulous any one would enjoy this Enjoy!
Woah! This is simply refreshing.. Thank you so much
absolutely beautiful- how beautiful.
what an amazing talk! thank you so much for sharing! I am passing along this link
Try this. Tell everyone to write down without sharing with others as many words as they can that they associate with LOVE. Give them 3 minutes. Then ask them to classify the words as a group into 'common' (everyone in the room has exactly the same word - a plural is different from singular, if there is a suffix like 'ing' it's different too, etc.), shared (where a few in the room have the same word) and unique (where no one else in the room has the same word). Then work out the proportion of each grouping - you will be surprised. The first thing it will challenge is that concept of 'we all speak a common language' or 'it's common sense'. It's a great game for discussion of communication, feelings, etc.
Paulthepsych Thank you!
wonderful! Thanks
Lovely talk. Thanks
I love this so much. Thank you x
Thank you so much in deed.
This is just Fantastic...
Thank you for sharing !! Lena from Sweden
Inspiring talk, Tom. Well done :)
he is very good..
The Twelve Signs of Love
Sign 1 - Unity Above All
Sign 3 - Praise and Gratitude
Sign 4 - Only see good in others
Sign 6 - Forgiveness
Sign 7 - A kindly Tongue
Sign 8 - Selfless Love
Sign 9 - Service
Sign 10 - Always be the cause of happiness to others
Sign 11 - Never make people unhappy
Sign 12 - The Golden Rule
Loved your talk and have shared with friends. As I intended they are now asking questions, but also how to get your book. Please let me know when it may be available. thanks
@sam .zad: I appreciate the research you put into the Baha'i Faith before making your comment, but I would like to add some information that you are missing. The Baha'i Faith is actually the first world religion whose Writings explicitly restrict the followers to monogamy. The Bible has many instances of polygamy, and the New Testament, although it implies monogamy in several contexts, never forbids polygamy. Most early Christians were Roman or Gentile, and already practiced monogamy due to that background. Hinduism and Islam allowed for polygamy, and Buddhism was silent on the issue. Baha'u'llah was a polygamist because he was raised Muslim, and it was both allowed and expected in His culture to practice polygamy. But He took no more wives after He manifested God's attributes. In His wisdom He would often unfold new laws gradually over time, to allow time for His followers to transition. He forbade His followers from marrying more than two wives, and strongly endorsed monogamy in the Kitab-I-Aqdas. He also gave His son, Abdul-Baha, the absolute authority to interpret His Writings and lead the Baha'i community. Abdu'l-Baha expounded in His own Writings that the Writings of Baha'u'llah lay restrictions on marriage that would make polygamy for any Baha'i impossible. Thus, the Baha'i Faith only allows for monogamy, and is the first world religion to explicitly do so in it's authoritative texts. I hope this provided some clarity!
Spirit of Austin great shares my friend! But I believe in the holy quran is revealed "if you feel you will be unjust then marry only one"
Spirit of Austin the reason for polygamic marriage in Islam is probably of corruption.
Thank you
Thank you Mr Price, I really liked your talk and has inspired me to put those ideas into practice. How can we get access to the book you mention?
Fabulous, will share thank you :))
Tom is a kind, nice man - and his principals for love are good. Humankind can benefit from listening to his wise words regarding love. I wish Tom was as logical and discerning in choosing his religion, as his passion for helping people. Tom stated in the beginning of his speech, that all the great religions have come from one God. This is not true. Hindus believe in polytheistic gods. Jews believe in God and no Messiah. Buddhists believe that people can become gods themselves, the universe created itself & reincarnation. Christians believe that God & Jesus are one, although, Jesus is the Son of God. God would not send various prophets to confuse and deceive his children. God also does not send a polygamist, who never performed any miracles, to spread his teachings - namely Mirza Nuri, alias ' Baha u llah'. The one true God, of the Bible, does not allow a poser prophet, Mirza, to allow a man to marry more than one wife, as written in the original kitab agdas. People....use your brains, as well as your hearts to truly understand what your Father in Heaven & Lord Jesus want to give you!
sam .zad the foundations of religion are the same. Man has over time corrupted the word of God hence the need for a new messenger. Progressive revelation. Miracles aren't sufficient proof of being a prophet which is what Bahá'u'lláh stated. Non believers and even people there would still not see a miracle as suffice so clarifying that point- it's not sufficient proof. Why are there so many denominations yet one saviour? Exactly. Man has divided the word of God and is why God has sent Bahá'u'lláh. Investigate the truth for yourself before stating claims.
It is my opinion that people should not b viewed as giving the impression that they are eligible for public service thru, expeciationally speaking! I can elobrate if asked🤗
The speaker makes some good points regarding listening, showing gratitude. However being "nice" is not a sign of love, being "genuine in caring" is. If you cared about someone you might even at times be tough on them. Being receptive to criticsm is a sign of maturity. Ultimately genuine caring will help an individual to be more mature. Comparing human relations to light and darkness is simplistic and not practical.
I can't speak for Tom but he would probably agree with you. The great thing about sharing out thoughts is we get to expound upon them. Which makes sense since there is really no way to get all the many facets of a topic covered completely in a roughly hour long talk. Knowledge and learning is inexhaustible. And of course there are many things we can agree and areas to disagree on but as Tom does here starting with general principles is a good foundation. thanks,
Where can you purchase the book?
POR FAVOR TRADUCIR AL ESPAÑOL POER FAVOR, POR FAVOR, POR FAVOR Y GRACIAS AMO SUS CHARLAS
Pls Activate the english subtitles
Por favor alguém poderia colocar legenda em português?
Tank you!
hey tom price. why are u censoring your other channel the positive side of 2012. why are u banning messages on your channel? what are you hiding?
Abdulbaha in America
Billy:
The problem is Abdul-Baha's contradicting statements and even actions. Despite the discriminating laws toward women in Aqdas, the holiest Bahai book, He sets the equality of men and women as one of the Bahai principles. But at the same time he bars women from serving in the universal house of justice. Even in 1909 in response to Corrine True who had asked Him to reconsider the decision, He re-affirmed that women should not serve in UHJ. Also in response to a woman who asked him why God has not yet appointed a woman as prophet, He states, although men and women share talents, but there is no doubt that in the sight of God men are stronger and have priority (Golzaare Taalim e Bahai, P288). Please note that the UHJ has changed the principle in regard to equality of genders: "as long as men and women are not equal, the bird of humanity can not fly."....
Although in Aqdas kissing the hands are prohibited, but when the Master traveled to America, allowed the women to kiss His hand.
Donald Moderational
My friend, I applaud to your deep research and wonderful knowledge about the history of the faith. However, I believe there were some misunderstandings.
You seem to view to barring of women from the highest governing form of the faith as inequality between men and women. To clarify this, men and women are not unequal when they do different things. For example, is it considered unequal when a woman is able to get pregnant and be considered the primary caretaker of the child.
To be a UHJ member is to devote 24 hours of a day to the well-being, and upliftment of the Baha'i community.
In the faith, it is revealed that when all 9 UHJ members are gathered together doing their work they are considered "infallible".
So if a mother gets pregnant, her child gets sick etc. The women is not able to "take a break" for a couple of months.
In the writings, we are told that this is a subject that the wisdom of which will be revealed in the Future. But there are some obvious wisdoms.
You fairly cite the quote from abdul-baha in which he shares the reason why women were never manifestations of God.
If you examine the history of the manifestations, you see that he's right! In past ages, men were far more powerful and prioritized than women were! If a woman were to go out in the streets and proclaim this message, or proclaim to a specific person. Women had such a low station that no one would even turn their face towards her. She couldn't have gone anywhere unsupervised, and beaten severely. Men also had a higher tolerance than women. And as you know all the manifestations got severely prosecuted and tortured. Women were not able to bear such torment at their time.
However, abdul-baha does not mention the impossibility of a female manifestation of God in the future! This is beyond the reach of our thoughts!
The quote that the UHJ had sent out to the world is not always related to what role men and women take, but the education they get, the attention, the care, praise, spiritual empowerment etc.
Your final point is a very good point, and I am impressed with your deep research my friend. However, one must consider that these women were not Baha'is, and had not heard the aforementioned law in the kitab-i-aqdas. Abdul-baha did not have the heart to pull away his hand, and tell the women not to do what they wanted.
Thank you for your investigations, I wish you much success and truth.
Kiya Shahidi: I highly respect your positive attitude in a critical discussion. Every person agrees that women and men are physiologically different , however we agree that they should stand equal in social rights. Suppose, there is a 55 year old woman whose children are married and well settled, even she can not serve on the universal house of justice UHJ. Your argument does not stand if you remember in 1990s simultaneously three Muslim countries, Turkey, Pakistan and Bangladesh were governed by three women. In regard to why a woman has not been a prophet, I agree with your point that it has been in part, due to men's attitude toward the women, but let me remind you that simultaneously with prophet Muhammad, a woman claimed prophet-hood (I think her name was Asma?) and even gathered 15000 followers, but she lost to the Muslim army. Also Ayesheh, the wife of prophet, after her husband's death, lead the Muslim army of 30,000 men.
Abdul Baha, however, closes the door when he concludes, in the sight of God, men have priority and are stronger.
Regards
Thank you for your reply. I observe many good points in your response.
As to your references to the two women in the Muslim Era, i definitely do not deny your good point! But i believe there might be some misunderstanding. Abdul-Baha says what he did taking into perspective of that of a prophet/Manifestation.
Asma did gather an impressive following but when comparing them to the main prophets of God, the influence i think speaks for itself.
There is no doubt that women are not able to show power and strength, and in some cases even superior to men. And abdul-baha does not deny this stating in the Promulgation of Universal Peace pg. 74-75 "History records the appearance in the world of women who have been signs of guidance, power and accomplishment. Some were notable poets, some philosophers and scientists, others courageous upon the field of battle. Qurratu'l-'Ayn, a Bahai, was a poetess. She discomfited the learned men of Persia by her brilliancy and fervor. When she entered a meeting, even the learned were silent. She was so well versed in philosophy and science that those in her presence always considered and consulted her first. Her courage was unparalleled; she faced her enemies fearlessly until she was killed. She withstood a despotic King, the shah of Persia, who had the power to decree the death of any of his subjects. There was not a day during which he did not command the execution of some. This woman singly and alone withstood such o despot until her last breath, then gave her life for her faith."
As aforementioned women are not barred authority in all governing branches, such as the International teaching center, it is but the Universal House of Justice from which Men are only granted this station. I deeply respect your opinion, but we are told that the wisdom thereof will be manifest in the future. and thus it is a matter of faith. But within the hearts of the baha'is, men and women alike, there is certitude that no trace of inequality exists on a spiritual level within The numerous activities we participate in, and all the gatherings that take place.
I generally dont participate in discussion on the youtube comment section as it only fuels conflict and this will only contribute to the degradation of the world, but it is people like you my friend that give this world value and opportunity to think and consult with peace, and positive result. i think that your level of knowledge is exponential, and that you are thirsty for truth, and willing to do deep research for it. I wish you luck in every way.
Regards,
Kiya
What a yahoo......! CW Chanter got me here....
Could you tell me why son of Baha u Allah " Abdul Baha " received the title of " Sir " from British government ?
During the First World War the entire bay area of Haifa/'Acca was placed under a sea blockade and mined by the Turks. Haifa was hard hit by the First World War, especially as a result of the cessation of all economic and commercial activities prevailing at that time. This was a time of great poverty and famine in the North of Palestine. When the British arrived in Haifa, where the blockade had caused a perilous condition for the inhabitants, it was discovered that 'Abdu'l-Bahá had saved the civilian population from starvation. Provisions which He had grown, buried in underground pits, and otherwise stored, had been given out to the civilians of every nation living in Haifa. 'Abdu'l-Bahá did this in a military way as an army would give rations, and deep was the gratitude of those women and children who had been saved by His power to see into the future of tragedy and woe as early as 1912, when He began the preparations for the catastrophe which was to overtake that land in 1917 and 1918. When Haifa was finally occupied by the British, reserve provisions had not yet come for the army, and someone in authority approached 'Abdu'l-Bahá. He told them that there was also enough to provide for the British Army. He was knighted for the great humanitarian efforts made to feed the needy in the Haifa/'Akka area during the war. (Some of this information was gleaned from the internet, and a portion quoted from a book entitled *The Chosen Highway*)
He was given the title of sir because long before it was a drought in Palestine Abdul Baha predicted it and ordered to save on wheat and when the drought came and every body including British army was hungry for piece of bread ,Abdul Baha went to the city and made sure every body including the soldiers do not go hungry and because of his wise prediction and love for every body,British government gave him the title of sir.
The Great Britain give title of SIR to those people who serve and help Britain purposes . lol.
@@TheNader123 I think u can surely research better, no?
The Bahai principle of "independent investigation of truth", although very attractive, but is in contradiction to the holiest Bahai book, Aqdas, which limits the freedom only to "submit unto My Commandments". "Humans are a flock of sheep that need a shepherd" and "the symbol of liberty is animal":
122- Consider the pettiness of men's mind. They ask for that which injures them...We find some men desiring liberty and priding themselves therein. Such men are in depth of ignorance.
123- Liberty must in the end lead to sedition whose flames none can quench...Know ye that the embodiment of liberty and its symbol is the animal...Liberty causeth man to overstep the bounds of propriety, and to infringe on the dignity of his station. It debases him to the level of extreme depravity and wickedness.
124- Regard men as a flock of sheep that need a shepherd for their protection. This verily is truth, the certain truth. We approve liberty in certain circumstances and refuse to sanction in the others....
125- Say: True Liberty consisteth in man's submission unto My commandments, little as you know it...The Liberty profiteth you is to be found nowhere except in complete servitude unto God, the Eternal Truth....
If u care to shorten Yr question, then, may b, people have time for Yr sudden lost of brain activity
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In other words, keep your but out of your praise. :-)
He should back his statements by quotations from central figures and the universal House of Justice,other wise it looks like he is taking the credit for himself and this is dishonest,besides some they believe if it comes from infallible
source and not from himself.
Too many " "I think " "in my opinion" when almost all is from Baha'i writings and he is not making reference to the writings or the central figures who where "the authors" "