Exactly! Of all the Chaos Space Marines kit listed I believe only 2 were Horus Heresy intended, so many of those kits long predate the Horus Heresy range!! Guess Kytan’s can be used as Chaos Knights at least
I'm thinking they just slid that in there hoping no one would notice the fact they're axing a huge portion of the Forge World Chaos range again. I wouldn't be surprised if they stopped selling those models soon...
The only reason I can think of that they would axe daemon engines is so that they don’t have to produce them anymore - but that’s an insane and baffling decision
Those entropy cannons ob plagueburst crawlers better be good or we dont have any anti tank apart from possibly myphitic blight haulers and spamming low damage lethal hits. Especially now that combi weapons wont inclide meltas.
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper I was always mildly annoyed that Khorne got so many daemon engines... but my solution was always "give the other gods some too" not "blow up all the cool Khorne toys". SMH.
@@mistformsquirrel Just like I was always annoyed that Chaos lost the old Chaos boxdread and just had the Helbrute, but didn't mean for GW to get rid of all the non-Primaris dreads!
To avoid any "brand confusion" all they'd have to do is put both the 40K and Horus Heresy logos on those boxes. All this is going to really do is cost GW some sales.
Its to avoid brand confusion... oh except for that new plastic Knight they haven't sold to us yet, that can have Heresy packaging and somehow thats fine 😑
Havent they been doing that with daemons since 5th or 6th edition 40k? When those plastics came out. They had boxart with both a fantasy and 40k logo them. And included both square and round 25mm bases. I've been using those square ones to bulk out my larger scenic bases since forever ago.. It's not like they've succesfully done that before..
Chaos marines, the same traitors from the heresy twisted by the chaos powers in the warp. Also chaos, no storm shields, only the lord has remembered where he put the thunder hammers. Now all the heresy stuff which is lore supported they use is gone from many play settings… it’s a joke to say they are the imperiums arch enemy as surprised they remember they keys to the rhinos
They marketed these new plastic kits for both systems knowing they were going to put them all into legends. Extremely irritating, especially if you bought into the short time FOMO announcement that contemptors were leaving with the intention of using them for 40k. For me personally, those kits were the main source ot anti-armour for my KSons in 9th.
@@01oo011 "Just competitive" is fine on paper, but once GW starts saying things aren't okay, casual players tend to not like using them. I've had people refuse to play games with me solely because I brought a jump pack chaos lord since it's a legends unit.
To hell with this, we need to start an email bombardment to show our dissatisfaction with this insane decision. We should be able to use the brand new 30k kits competitively in chaos lists, relegating them to legends effectively kills them off. I mean the lore constantly describes the chaos legions as still using most of their heresy era equipment.
I once stuck a tube with a paper crystal on the end of two Eldar falcons to make them into Fire Prisms. Used them in a tournament. Just do it anyway, LoL
As someone who's first mini was a Contemptor, this hurts me greatly since I don't play HH. Dreadnought Evan has held the line against hoards to an secure objective. Knowing he's going into legends hurts my army not being able to use him.
And everyone is gonna say something like "oh just use him as a helbrute" as if that helps. If we'd wanted helbrutes we'd have bought helbrutes. Not everyone wants a ton of fleshy bits sticking out of their metal.
@@seandowney2338 I don't even like Hellbrutes that much. Its exactly as you said, they are too fleshy (and not decorative). They also make me more sad then normal Dreadnoughts.
@@Nostroman_Praetor Some people play chaos because they like bodyhorror. Some people play chaos becuase they hate the Emperor/Imperium. Some because chaos just has more shenanigans than other faction. They are not the same. Hydra Dominatus my friend, and may we have some regular spiky dreadnoughts again one day.
It makes sense if you realise they just don't want space marine players to be able to use their existing army for both 40k and 30k. Now they have to buy a seperate army for each game.
Sure, i guess, if your heresy army is like a primarch and nothing but tanks and Dreadnoughts. In practice, most people who play both systems already had a split, with maybe a land raider and rhino shared across two armies.
@@queencyrys6309 That's true. People who love the hobby wouldn't mind buying two armies and thematically setting them up. But GW is not really in touch with its audience so i don' think they realise this.
Of course it's a Raven Guard leviathan that shows it getting the axe. I feel like this is going to get huge pushback that may be effective tbh. Especially if tournaments ignore it which they absolutely should
Eh I don't mind. I like removing incentive for competitive people scalping all the models designed for another system. Hh bros not being able to get their vindicators us nuts
Imperium ok but why chaos? It goes like this in terms of amount of models (chaos marines>DG>TS>WE) WE is already poor range and forge world helped definitly.
As of right now the Ironclad and OG/venerable dread models are still listed in the 40k section. Better than nothing, but I wish I hadn't just invested the time and money into getting and painting a Leviathan and Contemptor for my Iron Hands list
So much for doing an accurate Iron Warriors list for competitive play...was hoping theyd get access to Relic Terminators too, but those are gone now as well
Man, Iron Warriors who canonically kept all their Horus Heresy Era shit in working order and had a bunch of Daemon Engines that are are all fucking gone now must be thrilled. Poor fucking Peterturbo, he just can't stop getting screwed in and out of universe
As someone who recently bought the new plastic dreadnoughts for CSM and doesn't really play competitive games, it's still going to suck since Legends has a lack of support after the initial rules release. If it's bad, it's bad. If it's good, it's likely going to be power creeped and then it's bad.
Space marines have such a big number of units because they can't compress primaris marines into mixed units. My god, we really don't need several primaris captains or heavy support unit that was shattered into hellblasters/desolators, e.t.c. Edit: But of course they cut off old stuff, because you have to buy a new shinie
Literally the bloat to the space marine range is wholly the primaris's fault. They have 4 different troops units soon to be 5. If they wanted to cut down bloat they would just stop producing these stupid mono weapon primaris units and stop making different primaris armors.
Exactly, one "primaris fire support squad" could have taken care of 3 different datasheets. Why make Intercessors and assault intercessor a separate thing? Why make 3 dreadnoughts instead of giving one more options? Primaris marines are stupid on every level hobby wise
Tac squads are so great because they can be fit into whatever role you need and are scalable and adaptable. Also really easy for new players to understand; you chuck a bunch of tac squads down and then just equip them with weapons you think they'll need, no need to go through a list of units with really obtuse names to try and figure out which one has the plasma gun and which one has jetpacks.
So they sold the Kytans and Brass Scorpions to WE players, all the while snickering in the corner knowing how they’d be unusable soon. How very GW of them.
Personally I'm more into Horus heresy but loved using my HH army tanks in my 40k Space marines, I can understand the balance element but it's a kick in the teeth for everyone who bought these not just recently but over the years.
@@wiccanthropy1956 for how long? Rules will be too bad or too strong within 1 year. 25% of legends stuff won’t get a data sheet in 11th edition. People frowning at you when you pull them out. If you’ve got a good play group great. Some of us have a couple good friends that will accept it, but when we branch out we will get unnecessary lip service lol
@James KillBot yeah I have a good group. We have so many players in our group with legends units. The lone wolf in space wolves. Harath shen and Pallas mirsan from the salamanders. The eight from farsight enclaves. Etc.
Meanwhile, I'm sitting here with less than 10 proper Cadians in my AM collection, looking at this and remembering what happened to my favorite units, Veterans with Hades Breaching Drills, and all I can do is shrug and live with 2 more of my favorite models getting binned.
It’s official gws general bloat, in rules and factions, is now affecting the depth of the game. No unit should be removed from the rules because it’s not ‘somewhat common’ in 40k. The whole point of the 40k setting is depth not story, if we only get common units we should get rid of basically every chapter specific elite unit, bodyguard, all primarchs and characters, etc. Not only does this not make sense from a material or lore perspective it is also obviously going to impact xenos wayyyy more than marines who will still get plenty of releases
Honestly, if we're only going by 'somewhat common' the entirety of Space Marines should be like... a couple squads of Imperial Agents. I don't want that to be how the game works of course, but if we're going by actual commonality like... every Imperial player should be Guard and then tack on some of the other stuff as allies.
@mistformsquirrel let's also admit that xenos didn't lose too much from this forgeworld competitive ban. And I also like that things won't get scalped as hard
@@wiccanthropy1956 scalping is still a problem even if you play xenos, it revolves around whats good to broken in competitive -stares at harlequin transports-
After the return of the Assault Ramp rule I was kinda toying with the idea of doing a Black Legion Chaos Spartan to drive around a brick of Terminators. Not sure I will do it now, whereas I don't do comoetitive/tournament play, those regulations tend to bleed over to casual play locally. Either way, I appreciate them letting us know this early, that's for sure.
Shouldn't the CSM still have access to HH unit according to the lore? If knights can have a lore'ful reason to have HH units, then it should be the same for CSM.
This hurts. Between my 2 Terrac Drills & the plastic Leviathan for my Death Guard army, I've just lost out on about $400 I've spent in the last year and a quarter of my current 40k army (in points).
Being confused about versions is probably the last thing most people think about when shown 40k. The first thing they notice is the massive price tag and total amount needed just to field a standard size 1.5k army.
I'm a World Eaters player and honestly, after the culling of the range for the 9th edition codex, losing access to all the forgeworld units in competitive (including Kytan and Great Brass Scorpion) makes me not feel so great. Also the excuse that it's because they're "Horus Hersey" Doesn't really fly with those units. Just feels bad.
I agree, I had just bought a blood slaughterer because I wanted something other than just spawn as my fast attack option. GW have screwed WE players over big time with this.
They say "Horus Heresy" but it's more most everything Forgeworld. Hopefully they bring back Decimators in a plastic kit as a new model, maybe a return of the Dreadclaw as a Chaos only drop pod as cutting that really limits tactical drops for CSM.
My 6000 points of mechanicum will never move to 40k. FML. I bought everything waiting to for the Fires book back in 8th that would move them over. I also bought stormeagles in order to make a non chaos version of Emperors Children......smh. Ive never seen a company hate one of its subsidiaries like Games workshop hates forgeworld, from rules being 2-3 years behind every edition to items 1-2 years into their being removed (Cestus assault ram)
Rip dreds in general this ontop of the loss of box dread makes only the unique variebts of box and the primaris playable dredds are basicly just primaris at this point
I was hoping to get into 40k mini and painting and stuff and maybe playing a bit casually, and like really liked the look of the contemptor and leviathan dreadnoughts. I will probably still get a bit to paint and stuff but it is odd that like they arent gonna be kept up to date rules wise but also a bit to mention, demons like belakor are marked as sigmar arent they? so idk that whole box causing confusion thing seems like a semi weird point
Its so much more than just competitive play. Its GW passive aggressively saying stop using these. Psychologically when things go to legends people just stop using them even in casual games. And as the rules slip further and further there's even less incentive to use them.
EXACTLY! It's all the more reason for me to write up my own edition where all this stuff is still useable and I get rid of GW's new corporatised Primaris and Votann stuff in retaliation...
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper Play Grimdark Future, agnostic and you can use everything from 40k... I have a deamon engines army with Brass Scorpion, Decimator, etc... I have a Minotaur army and a Death Guard Army... I can play now only the Death Guard (Minotaurs are viable only for the characters), which they nerfed as hell in 10th edition... Thanks GW and bye bye...
@@Manlio.Cipullo Maybe, but I think I'll just stick with making my own edition. GDF sounds so simple it's lacking in flavour; just like my criticisms of 10th Ed.
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper It Is a misconception, the complete ruleset has a lot of flavour and, more importantly, they update it using the feedback of the players... Also: best army builder and army list creator i have seen... Otherwise there is Warsurge, but it is less popular...
Honestly, i feel like its not that confusing. Im the person who has been in the hobby the longest, in my group (since 5th), and these new people looooove it when they find all the extra-stuff you can put in the game. When my buddy found out you can field FW contemptors, he got one immidiately. I feel like its just an outlying expansion to the hobby, that most people dont get in to, but love that it is there.
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper i like primaris and i anoyed at removing boxnaught more the fact i like having older tech in my chapter to show time progress some primaris some first born and some relics shows a chaoter is older it ads visual story tellinh
@@lilithicanna1861 im talking plastic models thatarnt special varients the base models are alll gone Venerable = a rare varient you wouldnt have many off in any chaoter Furosio and librarian blood angels exclusive units Wulfen = its a kitbashed venerable and exclusive to soace wolves
They killed the boxnaught, Im not sure as an SM player what to think. Anyone saying this doesnt impact casual has never had to only play pick up games with random people. You will get your legends models challenged every time or close to it. GW killed the units in 40k.
Just out of curiosity: What the fuck are you supposed to run as Iron Warriors now? Like GW just removed everything other than Helbrute from the list of stompy robot options.
I just put my vindicators together as Laser destroyers as well, like how is that lost technology GW its literally just 4 lascannons! My IW lost 4 dreadnoughts and 6 tanks.
I’ve only just just got a Sicaran Battle tank… I’m starting a new army and literally just started painting it and I hear this… as someone who doesn’t have full force put together and is working my way up to having enough units built and painted to play, this is a kick in the teeth. Welcome to the hobby! This relatively new model which is compatible with both systems is now NOT an option! Great…
As someone who was bought the AoD box and was intending to use that as the basis for my 40k Dark Angels, this change just fucked over half my army. It's nonsensical, and it invalidates all the marketing they did in 9th to show "Look, you'll be able to use this in 40K too!!". I'm not going to go out and buy an entirely separate army just to play DA in 40k, I can't afford that!! As 10th edition was supposed to be the edition when I finally got physical models on a physical table, this has severely damaged my excitement for it, and this is a change that should 100% be back-tracked on
As most on the choices that GW make are financial, this seems like a odd change, there are several models that I was about to buy to use in 40k that I now won't be because of this. It's great for me because I won't be spending more money just for some variety for my army, but a very odd choice by GW.
Even more reason to not play 40K. GW is making this really easy. So they like losing players and losing money? I personally know 15 people in my local store who have just stopped playing and no longer are interested in buying anything GW. This just made it that much easier.
As an Iron Warriors player and collector, I'm starting to lose my enthusiasm for this game. Not only have I lost subfaction rules, I've lost the units that made the army unique.
I have spent about a year putting together an IW list and painting the models and all but maybe two predators are now basically gone. I could start another army, but why bother when I might lose those units too?
Just as a note on custodes, if custodes get a large amount of plastic kits for 10th, if your favorite kit isn't pulled into plastic I would be surprised if they survive 11th.
Pissing off warhammer community is worthless, no matter what GW does, people will just buy more stuff anyway Just look at how the ban of animation outrage fizzled out
Same here. I had a hh themed deathguard list with contemptors. I guess it’s still usable, but the contemptors need to go. Good thing I had one tournament with them. It was a fun list.
I'm pretty interested in what they plan to do with Xenos and Imperial Guard FW stuff as well. Pre Heresy launch FW was heavily tilted towards Guard with the Mecharius, DKoK and Elysians. The Elysians have now gone, the DKoK line is slowly being whittled away, with the loss of the alternatly armed Leman Russ' with just the Battle Cannon Left. T'au have a couple of fancy suitsbased off of the Riptide. What's going to hapeen to these great models? Are they just going to Legends them? Or will we get a plastic release for them?
Love the standing videos. Very interesting bet that some bean counting algorithm thought about this and this will succeed. Loved seeing the goofys on twitter set their minis on fire. Keep up the good work.
Problem is alot of local stores use the comp lists only. I got now no local stores I can play dreads or other things. I love story play but no one wants to play those... I am just done.
I get that a lot of people don't do competitive play. But this also means all of this stuff will.never be supported again in 40k. So as things change as they do. These things will never change.
Imagin if instead of moving stuff to legends they consolodated units, EG the several Predator/Terminator/All characters/Landraiders/Bikes/ Marines/ Gladius tanks/Dreadnoughts variants, doing that would have probably cut down the entire entry line with 50%. Heck they could even combine the Leviathan and Redemptor dreadnoughts (any flavor of same chasis) in 1 statt/wargear entry. Same with old boxy dreadnought/ Contemptor, Venerable and Ironclad, consolodating them in 1 entry could easily be done. Thats like 6 Dreadnought variants into 2 entries. (which are now probably 9 entries without the Leviathan and Contemptor).
The irony is a lot of people get into HH because they get a jump start by their marine army being somewhat compatible segregating them is more likely to just make people just play one system or the other rather than buy models from both. Loss for GW and loss for the players.
I've been trying to get scout bikes for months (new to the hobby) and love the look but they're constantly sold out, actually been a fair few models that I loved the look that all of a sudden have been discontinued, feel like I came in at the wrong time, but the lore is cool asf
I get wanting to hit Space Marines, although selling the models based on the idea that you could use them for 40k was a dick move in that case. But CSM ? It's already weird that CSM have access to barely any of the standard tech, but that they also wouldn't have access to the old tech when many of them have been fighting the Long War since day one ? Nah. Even for SM, we know some chapters have a reputation for having old weaponry and equipment (looking at you, Dark Angels). Just give SM a rule that they can take up to ONE unit with the "RELIC" keyword or something, bump it up to two or three for CSM, and boom. Sorted.
Nice video! they said that ¨Legions and Legends¨ (The Horus Heresy Models in Games of Warhammer 40,000) will have Datasheets available for download in June, as will Imperial Armour datasheets, but ¿Do you know when? (I nedd Spartan Assault Tank Datasheet). Thanks.
Slimming down the range makes. So thank you GW for helping me buy less, since I don’t need to worry about 40k space marines anymore. I mean it’s a shame. Heresy provided you could do classic marines upscaled and amazing looking without sacrificing the classic 40k vide only to then say, sorry can’t used them competitively. It’s just another example of GW being run by Tzeentch.
You can no longer play anything forge world in 40k with Ad mech and that's a shame.Since admech tend to protect old tech like the terrax drill i would have imagine we could still play them in 40k.And all of that because the GW and FW team hates each other im pretty sure . (30k could be played in 40k but 40k couldn't be played in 30k and that must have pissed GW.)
"you don't need self-awareness for youtube" ... :D :D :D I'm going to be nice here, and not mention anyone else. Kiri you've probably one of the more self-aware creators I watch. It goes a long way to why I keep watching and enjoying. I must admit it's a bit weird they're not including some of the newer kits, but not surprising at all that they're keeping the upcoming plastic Cerastus. There's been some unusual backwards steps with the model and faction rules for 10th. They made Agents Of The Imperium a full faction (at least as many datasheets as World Eaters) for about five minutes, and now they're back to allies. Now they're cutting Heresy era stuff for everyone, including Chaos Marines who've maybe just escaped to the warp from the Siege of Terra and then popped out an hour later into the 41st millennium. The branding aspect is understandable, except for the fact that we can use the older, more modern Land Raider still in 30k, or whatever. It's very confusing but thats nothing new really.
On the one hand I get that the Heresy was literally 10000 years ago in 40k terms and so its somewhat unrealistic that a bunch of stuff from those times are still around and functioning, but on the other hand GW should just let people play with their fucking toys already.
But the majority of the Imperium's technology is that ancient. They're fully capable of maintaining such artefacts, their scarcity has more to do with them being unable to manufacture them and therefore suffering constant attrition. This is why tech-priests act like crackheads when they get the slightest whiff of archaeotech. So in summary, there is no fluff-based reason to exclude all of these items (in fact, most of the chaos ones aren't even 30K, they're exclusively 40K). The only reasons GW are doing this are, once again, cynical ones.
To your point of not being a competitive player: when have you last used one of your chaplain dreadnaughts? Moving stuff to legends affects how the hobby is played because everyone wants to play with the most recent rules to keep it balanced.
I just rage quit 10th before it even began. This was it for me. This broke me. All my VERY expensive Thousand Sons vehicles worthless for 40k. I'm really damn pissed.
@@thebaron2277 no this is exactly legends these kits will receive rules once and wont be updated afterwards. This is legends to a T and GW just raw dawged everyone who bought HH stuff for 40k.
A lot of the chaos stuff is also more 40k than 30k. Brass Scorpion etc. Sad to see it go, the 30k stuff is kinda whatever, but decimators etc. were really cool. Certainly offered more variety for those who like their daemon engines.
All the dreadnoughts for my Black Templars army are the newer Leviathan and Contemptor kits. This sucks so much.... Fluff gone. "You can still use them in non-competitive games" is a lazy thing to say. Few people care to play with old rules and/or think that they are being bullied by GW. People also want SOMETHING ELSE THAN A REDEMPTOR.
Why GW hate Chaos? You got our Bike Lords removed, or Jumppack lords removed, our flyers removed, and now we are getting our only drop pods removed. With no replacements.
I think it makes sense that if the 40k team is trying to keep 40k somewhat balanced they don't want the forgeworld models and horus heresy stuff being in the mix too. I've been expecting something like this and expect to see the 40k forgeworld line decrease over time until it disappears.
No, they are going to make 30 new marine types and have to balance those when they could just balance these. The number of units to balance won’t change.
They didn't even balance the god damn things, FW tanks didn't get any sort of update point wise in forever, they were there for people who liked flavor in ther armies
I can't believe they're getting rid of all the daemon engines. Like how do those fall under the horus heresy only? That's such nonsense.
They are not even playable in the horus heresy...
Exactly! Of all the Chaos Space Marines kit listed I believe only 2 were Horus Heresy intended, so many of those kits long predate the Horus Heresy range!! Guess Kytan’s can be used as Chaos Knights at least
I'm thinking they just slid that in there hoping no one would notice the fact they're axing a huge portion of the Forge World Chaos range again. I wouldn't be surprised if they stopped selling those models soon...
@@Flight_of_Icarus which is weird because brass scorpions are one of the kits that sells the most...
The only reason I can think of that they would axe daemon engines is so that they don’t have to produce them anymore - but that’s an insane and baffling decision
I'll be honest, while this hits Space Marines a bit, this absolutely kicks chaos space Marines of all flavors in the teeth.
Those entropy cannons ob plagueburst crawlers better be good or we dont have any anti tank apart from possibly myphitic blight haulers and spamming low damage lethal hits. Especially now that combi weapons wont inclide meltas.
@@arvatrontheiv2220 I’m sorry for your loss
@@tyroneprime7676 i'll still play them but it will be with a touch of despair.
Thousand sons and world eaters got their options cut by half now 😢
GW is the only company I know who could have an entire football pitch to themselves, and still score an own goal...
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
At this point, GW might as well print a CSM codex that just says “If you play chaos, let the other player kick you in the nuts and call you a dweeb.”
They also dicked over Chaos, with exclusive to 40k units that weren't in the Heresy at all.
And axing most of their flavour, _especially_ Khornate daemon engines for the much-neglected World Eaters!
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper I was always mildly annoyed that Khorne got so many daemon engines... but my solution was always "give the other gods some too" not "blow up all the cool Khorne toys". SMH.
and just to rub a bit a salt in the same wound.. they stil fucking sell them
@@mistformsquirrel Just like I was always annoyed that Chaos lost the old Chaos boxdread and just had the Helbrute, but didn't mean for GW to get rid of all the non-Primaris dreads!
To avoid any "brand confusion" all they'd have to do is put both the 40K and Horus Heresy logos on those boxes. All this is going to really do is cost GW some sales.
Its to avoid brand confusion... oh except for that new plastic Knight they haven't sold to us yet, that can have Heresy packaging and somehow thats fine 😑
Havent they been doing that with daemons since 5th or 6th edition 40k? When those plastics came out.
They had boxart with both a fantasy and 40k logo them. And included both square and round 25mm bases. I've been using those square ones to bulk out my larger scenic bases since forever ago..
It's not like they've succesfully done that before..
Chaos marines, the same traitors from the heresy twisted by the chaos powers in the warp.
Also chaos, no storm shields, only the lord has remembered where he put the thunder hammers. Now all the heresy stuff which is lore supported they use is gone from many play settings… it’s a joke to say they are the imperiums arch enemy as surprised they remember they keys to the rhinos
They marketed these new plastic kits for both systems knowing they were going to put them all into legends. Extremely irritating, especially if you bought into the short time FOMO announcement that contemptors were leaving with the intention of using them for 40k.
For me personally, those kits were the main source ot anti-armour for my KSons in 9th.
Contemptord were never leavibg the special pegion specific ones got replaced thats all
@@demonic_myst4503 what got left were the horus heresy kits horus heresy players couldn't get their hands on
I bought 2 blood angels contemptors! 8 dreads, 3 tanks and a kytan are all going on me… I can’t even use the kytan in heresy as it’s 40K exclusive.
@@wiccanthropy1956 lol what u on about whqts left is the basic plastic contemptor so its still around wh@t got removed was special varients
@Demonic_myst just like the Grey Knights special dreadnought, 1was a few years back. This isn't a new occurrence.
Why on earth release plastic HH, to immediately remove it from 40K? Crazy decision, will 100% impact sales
Because it’s primarily for heresy and the 40k marine range is bloated? Also it’s just competitive.
God forbid 30k get actual kits for their game instead of a tank "that can be used in both"
@@01oo011 the *loyalist* marine range is bloated...
@@01oo011 "Just competitive" is fine on paper, but once GW starts saying things aren't okay, casual players tend to not like using them. I've had people refuse to play games with me solely because I brought a jump pack chaos lord since it's a legends unit.
@@01oo011 well then just let chaos marines have them. it makes more sense for them to use heresy-era stuff anyway.
To hell with this, we need to start an email bombardment to show our dissatisfaction with this insane decision. We should be able to use the brand new 30k kits competitively in chaos lists, relegating them to legends effectively kills them off. I mean the lore constantly describes the chaos legions as still using most of their heresy era equipment.
Death Guard are literally still wearing their Mk3 and Cataphractii armour, but now their Leviathans and Contemptors have went missing somehow 😂
I once stuck a tube with a paper crystal on the end of two Eldar falcons to make them into Fire Prisms. Used them in a tournament. Just do it anyway, LoL
As someone who's first mini was a Contemptor, this hurts me greatly since I don't play HH.
Dreadnought Evan has held the line against hoards to an secure objective. Knowing he's going into legends hurts my army not being able to use him.
And everyone is gonna say something like "oh just use him as a helbrute" as if that helps. If we'd wanted helbrutes we'd have bought helbrutes. Not everyone wants a ton of fleshy bits sticking out of their metal.
@@seandowney2338 I don't even like Hellbrutes that much. Its exactly as you said, they are too fleshy (and not decorative). They also make me more sad then normal Dreadnoughts.
@@Nostroman_Praetor Some people play chaos because they like bodyhorror. Some people play chaos becuase they hate the Emperor/Imperium. Some because chaos just has more shenanigans than other faction. They are not the same. Hydra Dominatus my friend, and may we have some regular spiky dreadnoughts again one day.
It makes sense if you realise they just don't want space marine players to be able to use their existing army for both 40k and 30k. Now they have to buy a seperate army for each game.
GW: Did somebody say money??
Sure, i guess, if your heresy army is like a primarch and nothing but tanks and Dreadnoughts. In practice, most people who play both systems already had a split, with maybe a land raider and rhino shared across two armies.
@@queencyrys6309 That's true. People who love the hobby wouldn't mind buying two armies and thematically setting them up. But GW is not really in touch with its audience so i don' think they realise this.
@@dinosdaniel3508 realistically this isn’t a conspiracy to make people buy two armies, it’s a prelude to the downsizing of forgeworld
@@queencyrys6309 Never said its a conspiracy. Just a scammy move.
When kill team kicked off, most viable units had 'ideal for kill team' stickers on them (Skitarii, Tactical Marines, Eldar guardians for eg).
Ok the Mastodon one would be a MASSIVE kick to the dick for people who got that kit considering it's stupid expensive
Of course it's a Raven Guard leviathan that shows it getting the axe. I feel like this is going to get huge pushback that may be effective tbh. Especially if tournaments ignore it which they absolutely should
Eh I don't mind. I like removing incentive for competitive people scalping all the models designed for another system. Hh bros not being able to get their vindicators us nuts
@@wiccanthropy1956 yes definitely a good business decision, cut out the vast majority of their player base for the very niche HH
@@DefaultProphet it's not always about the money Spiderman
@@wiccanthropy1956 With GW, it's definitely all about the money.
Imperium ok but why chaos? It goes like this in terms of amount of models (chaos marines>DG>TS>WE) WE is already poor range and forge world helped definitly.
And even less when consider the 0 suport for half the chaos legions they get treated worse than loteral minor chapters from loyalists
@@demonic_myst4503 Iron Warriors got really shafted.
@@demonic_myst4503 And with custom warbands which literally just amounts to "what custom warbands?"
@@AAhmou At least our mistreatment is lore friendly.
As of right now the Ironclad and OG/venerable dread models are still listed in the 40k section.
Better than nothing, but I wish I hadn't just invested the time and money into getting and painting a Leviathan and Contemptor for my Iron Hands list
Feeling the same about my deathwatch but at least you have 30k potential with first born.
Update: I just went into the 40k section of forgeworld and so far it appears that WS, BA, and DA get to keep Leviathans.
At some point we deserve to ask ourselves, "How much of 40k is just forcing us to throw away our armies to buy new stuff?"
At this rate, all of it by next year
Seriously, don’t copy magic the gathering. It’s basically bleeding out and gw goes: “we’ll do that”
this right here...is exactly the point.
Just ignore 99.9% of what GDubbs says and does, it works for me.
Play any edition which interests you, house rule it, play it, have fun.
What new stuff? Not everyone plays an Imperium army, some of us NEVER get new models
So much for doing an accurate Iron Warriors list for competitive play...was hoping theyd get access to Relic Terminators too, but those are gone now as well
Man, Iron Warriors who canonically kept all their Horus Heresy Era shit in working order and had a bunch of Daemon Engines that are are all fucking gone now must be thrilled.
Poor fucking Peterturbo, he just can't stop getting screwed in and out of universe
As someone who recently bought the new plastic dreadnoughts for CSM and doesn't really play competitive games, it's still going to suck since Legends has a lack of support after the initial rules release.
If it's bad, it's bad.
If it's good, it's likely going to be power creeped and then it's bad.
Unless they manage to typo something and it's left broken for the rest of the edition.
Space marines have such a big number of units because they can't compress primaris marines into mixed units. My god, we really don't need several primaris captains or heavy support unit that was shattered into hellblasters/desolators, e.t.c.
Edit: But of course they cut off old stuff, because you have to buy a new shinie
A ton of this are kits less than 2 years old!
Forcing you to buy new shiny is part of it i would bet
Literally the bloat to the space marine range is wholly the primaris's fault. They have 4 different troops units soon to be 5. If they wanted to cut down bloat they would just stop producing these stupid mono weapon primaris units and stop making different primaris armors.
Exactly, one "primaris fire support squad" could have taken care of 3 different datasheets. Why make Intercessors and assault intercessor a separate thing? Why make 3 dreadnoughts instead of giving one more options?
Primaris marines are stupid on every level hobby wise
Tac squads are so great because they can be fit into whatever role you need and are scalable and adaptable. Also really easy for new players to understand; you chuck a bunch of tac squads down and then just equip them with weapons you think they'll need, no need to go through a list of units with really obtuse names to try and figure out which one has the plasma gun and which one has jetpacks.
Brass Scorpion deserves a plastic kit, not the axe.
No. Kidding. Wtf.
So they sold the Kytans and Brass Scorpions to WE players, all the while snickering in the corner knowing how they’d be unusable soon. How very GW of them.
Reminds me of the White Dwarf article which had WE Lords Discordant, Dark Apostles and jump pack/terminator lords...
I built my kytan last week. Was very worried ordering it but told myself it could just be a lord of skulls.
Now I am telling myself that harder lol.
RIP all those 40k dual volkite contemptor dreads
Personally I'm more into Horus heresy but loved using my HH army tanks in my 40k Space marines, I can understand the balance element but it's a kick in the teeth for everyone who bought these not just recently but over the years.
It's not that they are are unplayable. Just not tournaments. Casual play unaffected
@@wiccanthropy1956 for how long? Rules will be too bad or too strong within 1 year. 25% of legends stuff won’t get a data sheet in 11th edition. People frowning at you when you pull them out. If you’ve got a good play group great. Some of us have a couple good friends that will accept it, but when we branch out we will get unnecessary lip service lol
@James KillBot yeah I have a good group. We have so many players in our group with legends units. The lone wolf in space wolves. Harath shen and Pallas mirsan from the salamanders. The eight from farsight enclaves. Etc.
Meanwhile, I'm sitting here with less than 10 proper Cadians in my AM collection, looking at this and remembering what happened to my favorite units, Veterans with Hades Breaching Drills, and all I can do is shrug and live with 2 more of my favorite models getting binned.
That makes me beyond sad bru im sorry :(. If its any consolation my AM guardsmen wouldve loved to been demolished by them.
Thousand sons are back down to a whopping 10-ish kits. Cool.
I can save like 12 data sheets if gw just makes gladiators, redemptors, and those new speeders weapon options rather than three different datasheets.
THIS. Why does every primaris unit have to be locked into one loadout?
This is a fucking nightmare for CSM especially for war bands like iron warriors.
CSM FW range got slaughtered.
It’s official gws general bloat, in rules and factions, is now affecting the depth of the game. No unit should be removed from the rules because it’s not ‘somewhat common’ in 40k. The whole point of the 40k setting is depth not story, if we only get common units we should get rid of basically every chapter specific elite unit, bodyguard, all primarchs and characters, etc. Not only does this not make sense from a material or lore perspective it is also obviously going to impact xenos wayyyy more than marines who will still get plenty of releases
Honestly, if we're only going by 'somewhat common' the entirety of Space Marines should be like... a couple squads of Imperial Agents. I don't want that to be how the game works of course, but if we're going by actual commonality like... every Imperial player should be Guard and then tack on some of the other stuff as allies.
@mistformsquirrel let's also admit that xenos didn't lose too much from this forgeworld competitive ban. And I also like that things won't get scalped as hard
@@wiccanthropy1956 scalping is still a problem even if you play xenos, it revolves around whats good to broken in competitive -stares at harlequin transports-
@@corneal35 but now the competitive bros got disincentivised from scalping the kits. Since they aren't supported in competitive play
After the return of the Assault Ramp rule I was kinda toying with the idea of doing a Black Legion Chaos Spartan to drive around a brick of Terminators. Not sure I will do it now, whereas I don't do comoetitive/tournament play, those regulations tend to bleed over to casual play locally. Either way, I appreciate them letting us know this early, that's for sure.
Shouldn't the CSM still have access to HH unit according to the lore? If knights can have a lore'ful reason to have HH units, then it should be the same for CSM.
It's thing's like this why I'm glad I only play casual Warhammer.
the fuck? i have four blood slaughterers because it was literally the only army specific world eaters vehicle. wtf.
This hurts. Between my 2 Terrac Drills & the plastic Leviathan for my Death Guard army, I've just lost out on about $400 I've spent in the last year and a quarter of my current 40k army (in points).
Being confused about versions is probably the last thing most people think about when shown 40k. The first thing they notice is the massive price tag and total amount needed just to field a standard size 1.5k army.
I'm a World Eaters player and honestly, after the culling of the range for the 9th edition codex, losing access to all the forgeworld units in competitive (including Kytan and Great Brass Scorpion) makes me not feel so great. Also the excuse that it's because they're "Horus Hersey" Doesn't really fly with those units. Just feels bad.
I agree, I had just bought a blood slaughterer because I wanted something other than just spawn as my fast attack option. GW have screwed WE players over big time with this.
@@F1madkevin I'm sorry to hear that
They say "Horus Heresy" but it's more most everything Forgeworld. Hopefully they bring back Decimators in a plastic kit as a new model, maybe a return of the Dreadclaw as a Chaos only drop pod as cutting that really limits tactical drops for CSM.
My 6000 points of mechanicum will never move to 40k. FML. I bought everything waiting to for the Fires book back in 8th that would move them over. I also bought stormeagles in order to make a non chaos version of Emperors Children......smh. Ive never seen a company hate one of its subsidiaries like Games workshop hates forgeworld, from rules being 2-3 years behind every edition to items 1-2 years into their being removed (Cestus assault ram)
Regarding Scout bikes, don't the forge world outriders bikes for heresy use the plastic scout bike kit as a base?
they are making more movements towards just being chess. RIP any good chaos dredd options.
Rip dreds in general this ontop of the loss of box dread makes only the unique variebts of box and the primaris playable dredds are basicly just primaris at this point
I was hoping to get into 40k mini and painting and stuff and maybe playing a bit casually, and like really liked the look of the contemptor and leviathan dreadnoughts. I will probably still get a bit to paint and stuff but it is odd that like they arent gonna be kept up to date rules wise
but also a bit to mention, demons like belakor are marked as sigmar arent they? so idk that whole box causing confusion thing seems like a semi weird point
Its so much more than just competitive play. Its GW passive aggressively saying stop using these. Psychologically when things go to legends people just stop using them even in casual games. And as the rules slip further and further there's even less incentive to use them.
EXACTLY! It's all the more reason for me to write up my own edition where all this stuff is still useable and I get rid of GW's new corporatised Primaris and Votann stuff in retaliation...
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper Play Grimdark Future, agnostic and you can use everything from 40k... I have a deamon engines army with Brass Scorpion, Decimator, etc... I have a Minotaur army and a Death Guard Army... I can play now only the Death Guard (Minotaurs are viable only for the characters), which they nerfed as hell in 10th edition... Thanks GW and bye bye...
@@Manlio.Cipullo Maybe, but I think I'll just stick with making my own edition. GDF sounds so simple it's lacking in flavour; just like my criticisms of 10th Ed.
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper It Is a misconception, the complete ruleset has a lot of flavour and, more importantly, they update it using the feedback of the players... Also: best army builder and army list creator i have seen... Otherwise there is Warsurge, but it is less popular...
@@Manlio.Cipullo Thanks! I'll check it out, but I do wanna give my own edition-building a go, too!
Honestly, i feel like its not that confusing. Im the person who has been in the hobby the longest, in my group (since 5th), and these new people looooove it when they find all the extra-stuff you can put in the game.
When my buddy found out you can field FW contemptors, he got one immidiately. I feel like its just an outlying expansion to the hobby, that most people dont get in to, but love that it is there.
I think we are just getting new primaris dreadnoughts and they want to make sure we buy them
Yea they did just nuke 90% of dreadnoughts now its kust primaris or a venerable
@@demonic_myst4503 no, only one gone is the hellfire, basic dread, the venerable, the librarian, the furioso, the wulfen and all that still around.
That's really scummy... I HATED the boxnought getting axed and now they're REALLY doubling down on the Cashmaris obsession!
@@Wanten-the-stormtrooper i like primaris and i anoyed at removing boxnaught more the fact i like having older tech in my chapter to show time progress some primaris some first born and some relics shows a chaoter is older it ads visual story tellinh
@@lilithicanna1861 im talking plastic models thatarnt special varients the base models are alll gone
Venerable = a rare varient you wouldnt have many off in any chaoter
Furosio and librarian blood angels exclusive units
Wulfen = its a kitbashed venerable and exclusive to soace wolves
They killed the boxnaught, Im not sure as an SM player what to think. Anyone saying this doesnt impact casual has never had to only play pick up games with random people. You will get your legends models challenged every time or close to it. GW killed the units in 40k.
Just run it as a venerable. Why would you ever tale the regular boxnaught over the venerable
Just out of curiosity: What the fuck are you supposed to run as Iron Warriors now?
Like GW just removed everything other than Helbrute from the list of stompy robot options.
I just put my vindicators together as Laser destroyers as well, like how is that lost technology GW its literally just 4 lascannons! My IW lost 4 dreadnoughts and 6 tanks.
I’ve only just just got a Sicaran Battle tank… I’m starting a new army and literally just started painting it and I hear this… as someone who doesn’t have full force put together and is working my way up to having enough units built and painted to play, this is a kick in the teeth. Welcome to the hobby! This relatively new model which is compatible with both systems is now NOT an option! Great…
I am really deflated about this. Scrapping all the heresy stuff. Almost my dreadnaughts and 75% of my tanks are no longer supported in 40k.
As someone who was bought the AoD box and was intending to use that as the basis for my 40k Dark Angels, this change just fucked over half my army. It's nonsensical, and it invalidates all the marketing they did in 9th to show "Look, you'll be able to use this in 40K too!!". I'm not going to go out and buy an entirely separate army just to play DA in 40k, I can't afford that!! As 10th edition was supposed to be the edition when I finally got physical models on a physical table, this has severely damaged my excitement for it, and this is a change that should 100% be back-tracked on
Would have thought that 40k Chaos would have had HH style equipment rather than a version of current SM equipment
As most on the choices that GW make are financial, this seems like a odd change, there are several models that I was about to buy to use in 40k that I now won't be because of this. It's great for me because I won't be spending more money just for some variety for my army, but a very odd choice by GW.
Even more reason to not play 40K. GW is making this really easy. So they like losing players and losing money? I personally know 15 people in my local store who have just stopped playing and no longer are interested in buying anything GW. This just made it that much easier.
Grimdark Future is the solution we will adopt alongside Age of Fantasy and Kings of War...
As an Iron Warriors player and collector, I'm starting to lose my enthusiasm for this game. Not only have I lost subfaction rules, I've lost the units that made the army unique.
I have spent about a year putting together an IW list and painting the models and all but maybe two predators are now basically gone. I could start another army, but why bother when I might lose those units too?
@@JanitorScruffy Just change ruleset, use OPR ones, they allow you to play all the models you want...
Just as a note on custodes, if custodes get a large amount of plastic kits for 10th, if your favorite kit isn't pulled into plastic I would be surprised if they survive 11th.
GW: DONT CRY, JUST BUY! CONSUME NEW PRODUCT AND LOVE IT!!!
Also the product you just bought got annulled, buy more product to replace it
The "It has the Horus Heresy logo so we don't want to confuse people" argument holds zero water when all the Demons come in Sigmar boxes.
How to piss off your entire community by GW
Pissing off warhammer community is worthless, no matter what GW does, people will just buy more stuff anyway
Just look at how the ban of animation outrage fizzled out
As someone who's just finished a deathguard army using alot of these units. Frankly I'm slightly irritated.
Same here. I had a hh themed deathguard list with contemptors. I guess it’s still usable, but the contemptors need to go. Good thing I had one tournament with them. It was a fun list.
I'm pretty interested in what they plan to do with Xenos and Imperial Guard FW stuff as well. Pre Heresy launch FW was heavily tilted towards Guard with the Mecharius, DKoK and Elysians. The Elysians have now gone, the DKoK line is slowly being whittled away, with the loss of the alternatly armed Leman Russ' with just the Battle Cannon Left. T'au have a couple of fancy suitsbased off of the Riptide.
What's going to hapeen to these great models? Are they just going to Legends them? Or will we get a plastic release for them?
By Legion Support squads do they mean no more of the Devastators or Havocs using Horus Heresy kits? Those look better than the 40k ones
No it's like the Rapeir battery I think
RIP SPARTAN Tank
Just when I finally decided to pull the trigger on a deredeo…..
The best word I can use right now is despondent. I've been gutted and my fun removed.
No clue why they removibg some demon engines none of the exsplinations fit
Love the standing videos. Very interesting bet that some bean counting algorithm thought about this and this will succeed. Loved seeing the goofys on twitter set their minis on fire. Keep up the good work.
Problem is alot of local stores use the comp lists only. I got now no local stores I can play dreads or other things. I love story play but no one wants to play those... I am just done.
Goodbye my lover, Goodbye my friend
You have been the one, YOU HAVE BEEN THE ONE FOR ME
😭😭
I get that a lot of people don't do competitive play. But this also means all of this stuff will.never be supported again in 40k. So as things change as they do. These things will never change.
Surely a customer who buys a model for over £500 should be able to use it in as many ways as possible, including a tournament
Guess my TS will just have no ranged support, everything 40k ranged TS can take is just bad or ugly AF
Does this mean no relic dreadnoughts?
Correct
@@yammylo2352 well that's saved me 50 quid 😅
You heard ‘em bois, they are trying to tell you how to have fun, let’s respond in kind by breaking out the printers
Imagin if instead of moving stuff to legends they consolodated units, EG the several Predator/Terminator/All characters/Landraiders/Bikes/ Marines/ Gladius tanks/Dreadnoughts variants, doing that would have probably cut down the entire entry line with 50%.
Heck they could even combine the Leviathan and Redemptor dreadnoughts (any flavor of same chasis) in 1 statt/wargear entry. Same with old boxy dreadnought/ Contemptor, Venerable and Ironclad, consolodating them in 1 entry could easily be done. Thats like 6 Dreadnought variants into 2 entries. (which are now probably 9 entries without the Leviathan and Contemptor).
my local shop owner kinda made me feel bad about not being happy about my dreads, that I magnetized, are no longedr going to get balance passes
The irony is a lot of people get into HH because they get a jump start by their marine army being somewhat compatible segregating them is more likely to just make people just play one system or the other rather than buy models from both. Loss for GW and loss for the players.
I've been trying to get scout bikes for months (new to the hobby) and love the look but they're constantly sold out, actually been a fair few models that I loved the look that all of a sudden have been discontinued, feel like I came in at the wrong time, but the lore is cool asf
The redemptor dreadnought is almost 6 years old. This is a reminder that we’re all old.
I get wanting to hit Space Marines, although selling the models based on the idea that you could use them for 40k was a dick move in that case. But CSM ? It's already weird that CSM have access to barely any of the standard tech, but that they also wouldn't have access to the old tech when many of them have been fighting the Long War since day one ? Nah. Even for SM, we know some chapters have a reputation for having old weaponry and equipment (looking at you, Dark Angels). Just give SM a rule that they can take up to ONE unit with the "RELIC" keyword or something, bump it up to two or three for CSM, and boom. Sorted.
Half of my list is gone from competitive
Nice video! they said that ¨Legions and Legends¨ (The Horus Heresy Models in Games of Warhammer 40,000) will have Datasheets available for download in June, as will Imperial Armour datasheets, but ¿Do you know when? (I nedd Spartan Assault Tank Datasheet). Thanks.
Slimming down the range makes. So thank you GW for helping me buy less, since I don’t need to worry about 40k space marines anymore.
I mean it’s a shame. Heresy provided you could do classic marines upscaled and amazing looking without sacrificing the classic 40k vide only to then say, sorry can’t used them competitively. It’s just another example of GW being run by Tzeentch.
You can no longer play anything forge world in 40k with Ad mech and that's a shame.Since admech tend to protect old tech like the terrax drill i would have imagine we could still play them in 40k.And all of that because the GW and FW team hates each other im pretty sure . (30k could be played in 40k but 40k couldn't be played in 30k and that must have pissed GW.)
Alternate title: HH players say hello to a bunch of used leviathans and sicarans
Thank Chaos Gods, my Black Legion Kratos waited long enough!
Fuck this change, ty for making the video tho Kiri
"you don't need self-awareness for youtube" ... :D :D :D I'm going to be nice here, and not mention anyone else. Kiri you've probably one of the more self-aware creators I watch. It goes a long way to why I keep watching and enjoying.
I must admit it's a bit weird they're not including some of the newer kits, but not surprising at all that they're keeping the upcoming plastic Cerastus. There's been some unusual backwards steps with the model and faction rules for 10th. They made Agents Of The Imperium a full faction (at least as many datasheets as World Eaters) for about five minutes, and now they're back to allies. Now they're cutting Heresy era stuff for everyone, including Chaos Marines who've maybe just escaped to the warp from the Siege of Terra and then popped out an hour later into the 41st millennium. The branding aspect is understandable, except for the fact that we can use the older, more modern Land Raider still in 30k, or whatever. It's very confusing but thats nothing new really.
With the terrible rules we got and losing out on the only real AT we have access to, I dont think I'll be playing much 10th Death Guard
On the one hand I get that the Heresy was literally 10000 years ago in 40k terms and so its somewhat unrealistic that a bunch of stuff from those times are still around and functioning, but on the other hand GW should just let people play with their fucking toys already.
But the majority of the Imperium's technology is that ancient. They're fully capable of maintaining such artefacts, their scarcity has more to do with them being unable to manufacture them and therefore suffering constant attrition. This is why tech-priests act like crackheads when they get the slightest whiff of archaeotech.
So in summary, there is no fluff-based reason to exclude all of these items (in fact, most of the chaos ones aren't even 30K, they're exclusively 40K). The only reasons GW are doing this are, once again, cynical ones.
There are still chapters that make some of the various bits of kit though, and for CSM the Heresy wasn't that long ago.
To your point of not being a competitive player: when have you last used one of your chaplain dreadnaughts?
Moving stuff to legends affects how the hobby is played because everyone wants to play with the most recent rules to keep it balanced.
I just rage quit 10th before it even began. This was it for me. This broke me. All my VERY expensive Thousand Sons vehicles worthless for 40k. I'm really damn pissed.
This is different from legends. It only affects tournaments
@@thebaron2277 no this is exactly legends these kits will receive rules once and wont be updated afterwards. This is legends to a T and GW just raw dawged everyone who bought HH stuff for 40k.
@@corneal35 They literally put out articles encouraging you to buy a kratos for 40k.
4 dreadnoughts worth 200 euros together completly useless for me in 1post...
A lot of the chaos stuff is also more 40k than 30k. Brass Scorpion etc. Sad to see it go, the 30k stuff is kinda whatever, but decimators etc. were really cool. Certainly offered more variety for those who like their daemon engines.
All the dreadnoughts for my Black Templars army are the newer Leviathan and Contemptor kits. This sucks so much.... Fluff gone. "You can still use them in non-competitive games" is a lazy thing to say. Few people care to play with old rules and/or think that they are being bullied by GW. People also want SOMETHING ELSE THAN A REDEMPTOR.
Why GW hate Chaos? You got our Bike Lords removed, or Jumppack lords removed, our flyers removed, and now we are getting our only drop pods removed. With no replacements.
I think it makes sense that if the 40k team is trying to keep 40k somewhat balanced they don't want the forgeworld models and horus heresy stuff being in the mix too. I've been expecting something like this and expect to see the 40k forgeworld line decrease over time until it disappears.
Except all the chaos models they axed are quite popular and don't have horus heresy rules...because they are 40k exclusive
No, they are going to make 30 new marine types and have to balance those when they could just balance these. The number of units to balance won’t change.
They didn't even balance the god damn things, FW tanks didn't get any sort of update point wise in forever, they were there for people who liked flavor in ther armies
No, don't "sack off the old ones", sack off the boring Primaris stuff. Just upscale the lovely old designs
Im not even slightly arsed. The tournament scene means nothing to me.
But their rules won’t be updated again so eventually they’ll be useless.