I just got the copper clay. I have never used any clay before and still successfully torch fired 5 pieces I made, no problems. I have a small Proxxon torch, costs about 40 bucks, I use propane gas. Start with small pieces, way easier to keep heated. When you start to see your metal surface turn silvery/shiny, you are basically done, 5 minutes are perfect for the small pieces (I made pieces with maximum 1.5mm thickness and under 20mm diameter). And pro tip from a goldsmith: heat your pieces in a metal scourer - the one used to scrub pots. Get a round one, make a lower 'nest' in the middle and put your pieces there. I fired one and then the next time I did 4. Really no issues. You will see how much easier it is to heat the pieces evenly in the nest made of steel wool ;)
I have tried silver, bronze, copper, even steel clay: the secret of success is understanding that 999 silver (silver clay) does not oxidize, other metals oxidize: they must therefore be sintered in a reducing atmosphere (without oxygen). To create a reducing atmosphere, the pieces must be closed in an airtight container (I used a small steel saucepan full of coal grains, with a lid) and I put it in a programmable electric oven: the firing ramp at the start must be low and slow to burn the binder, then higher to sinter the metal. It works! With the torch I work only with silver, which has no oxidation problems... Thanks for your condivision, good experimentation!
Thank you so much for this informative video. A great help to see what can go wrong with Copper clay firing. I did buy some Copper clay last year, but haven't used it yet as I don't have a kiln, & now glad that I didn't fire it. This stuff is too expensive for errors!
Thank you for letting me know you found the video helpful, Victoria! I only paid $20 for the package of copper clay, so I don’t feel too bad. 🙃Maybe one day I’ll get it fired properly.
Just look at the high melting point of copper and the energy output from a propane torch - it's not going to work. Carbon firing in a kiln is what this material needs ... and some small/older kilns meant for enameling might not even reach the temperature for perfect sintering. That's why I would use bronze clay instead: lower melting point and a higher strength of the finished object.
Love your videos. I am a relative newbie trying copper clay. With reasonable success. I do have a kiln, as I use to teach stain glass. I love experimenting with different jewelry techniques and being creative. As you seem to be. Thank you for sharing your results.
There are folks who claim, and even show videos of, having success with a torch. 🤷♀️ I experimented a lot, and just decided not to sink any more time or money into figuring it out. Instead, I bought myself another package of silver clay, which I look forward to successfully using.😃
I know this is a year old but in case you come across this video like I have sharing what I’ve experienced; Art Clay Copper works great with a torch for smaller pieces. The other brands I’ve seen disclose kiln only.
The package I used was labeled for torch firing up to a 25 gram piece. My pieces were much smaller than that, I’m guessing my torch wasn’t powerful enough.
The copper clay isn't all that expensive, about $25 for 50g. The silver clay right now is $70 for 15g at Fire Mountain Gems. But I did see some on Amazon for $45. amzn.to/3XXxr7G I should probably snatch it up before they raise the price. ;-)
So I got to your video as a round about way of of colleague telling me about metal clays as I've never heard of them but it sounded interesting and might be useful to a ceramic composite project I'm working on. The good news for you, I have solutions you can try in you are interested in having another go. Option 1, not sure of your experience level, this is my first viewing of your channel, but microwave kilns work for these very well. They are basically an alumina shell exterior with a thin silicon carbide liner that absorbs thermal radiation (in this case, microwaves) and will turn the interior little section of said kiln a blistering 2300*F without fail. Knowing what they are made of, I kind of refuse to buy one but have converted many a sacrificial terra cotta plant pots to experiment with. If you don't mind plunking $25 or so to play with one, it's an option. Version 2, you can mold a small kiln to fire with your torch or convert again a terra cotta plant pot so long as they have a hole in the base (normally for drainage, in this case it will function as a vent). Going this route, you'll need to expand the exterior dimensions of the pot with an insulative clay and leave or cut in a port for your torch. Doing it this way is somewhat economical if you're just going to try it a few times, but using a hand torch, you'll burn through a bottle of fuel in 15 or so minutes. Out of the two options and taking into consideration a finite amount of uses, the microwave kilns are cheap enough to be sacrificial but can last awhile if taken care of. Or you can spend the same $25 on materials and make a whole bunch out of plant pots. I'd write out a tutorial if you're interested on the latter.
Wow, so much info and so interesting! Thank you. I looked at microwave kilns, but was suspicious, and was afraid of wrecking my microwave. 😀 I'm always interested in learning and would love a tutorial. I'm sure my viewers would be as well. Thanks again for all the helpful information!
@Keepsake Crafts by Sandy Huntress I dont blame you on the overly cautious approach, especially if you've put some coin into your kitchen microwave. It doesn't hurt anything so long as you have adequate spacing (4 or more inches at a minimum on all sides) but you definitely don't want to shoehorn one into a small unit as the vent will act as a miniture volcano caldera in terms of temperature right at the opening. The materials are really cheap and very easy to acquire. I'll try to write a more condensed guide later tonight when I get in front of a proper keyboard.
@@C-M-EHi! Seeing this one year later and would love a guide as well! I’m working with Prometheus bronze clay and even if the packaging says it can be torch fired I haven’t had any success. Now looking into other methods that don’t require a kiln
everything I've ever read about copper clay is that because it oxidizes, it needs to be buried in graphite before you try firing, so no air contacts the clay as it sinters.
That's interesting. I've watched videos of copper clay being torch fired and it wasn't buried in graphite. They do mention you should get it out of the air and into water immediately after you remove the flame because of oxidation. If kiln firing, burying it in carbon is one recommendation.
Thank you for this tutorial. I haven't personally tried any metal clay. I wonder if the packages have a shelf life? or that batch wasn't mixed right from the manufacturer. 🤔 I look forward to your silver clay comeback. 💙💜🧡
Thanks, Shelli. I did wonder if the age of the clay had something to do with it. I can't imagine what? It might be some while before I can buy and work with silver clay again. In the meantime, you can check out my first time trying it. ua-cam.com/play/PLg8Lpg6u0akgFjpUvurfkY_F2ys6UL5PU.html&feature=shares Much more successful than the copper clay!
Hi, love the video! I thought it was just me. I got exactly the same results as yours, super annoyed. I also tried bronze one they got the same results. I’m so curious how the other videos could successfully torched fire on this copper clay 😅 I think I should buy a PMC silver then. Thanks for the video!
Yes, it was a bummer not to be able to get it to work! Wish I knew what the other folks did differently. :::shrug::: I did get myself another package of silver clay, btw. 😀 Thanks for letting me know you had similar results. Happy creating!
Good to know as I recently purchased some copper clay from Amazon. Compared to silver it was much cheaper so figured I might try as I have had some really good results with the silver clay. I had problems with the basic propane touch staying lit cause of the angle I had to point it so I bought a different style torch nozzle. I wonder if that might make a difference.
I’m still having problems with cooper clay. The only way to get it to work is putting your design in a kiln.. But They also works get in the large beehive kiln will work… around $300 but in order to Center, Copper Clay it Hass to be at a much higher degree than 900°F you need to center it torch firing at least 1100°F.. But I’d definitely understand everyone’s frustration. Has anybody tried using the bronze clay? Well, it’s has its own temperament too.. So I can get my bronze and cooper clay to fire torch… but I prefer to put it in the beehive Kiln.. it’s actually called something else and I partner with Cool Tools. Sandy have you gotten it figured out yet for the Copper Clay? Let me know and maybe we can get together on UA-cam and I can show a demonstration.. I am starting my own UA-cam channel. I have my Instagram and my Facebook I am extremely behind. But I am a professional Silversmith instructor but I fell in love with Silver Metal Clay anyway I’m trying to catch up on your videos I’m so behind. 🤗Autumn
Honestly, I've given up on the copper clay. The silver was a joy to work with, so I'll stick with that and my polymer for now. I'm working on another PMC3 video right now, this time combing it with polymer techniques. Once you get rolling with your UA-cam channel, maybe sometime we can collab. 🙂
@@SandyHuntress have you tried using Silver Art Metal Clay? It’s .999 !!!!! it works really well, torch firing. But I get you on the copper and the bronze. There is definitely a technique to it. Anyway, since you work with polymer clay, you definitely have an advantage with people who are just starting with silver Metal Clay. Now I’m using cheap clay to make my molds so I don’t practice with my silver Metal Clay. I’m glad I ran into you again on UA-cam, for some reason, I haven’t been getting any notifications from you and it’s actually happening with several other artist who I’m following. I have enjoyed your videos. I am looking forward to seeing more of your silver Metal Clay designs. And hoping to get my UA-cam channel started. OK well big hugs to you girl.
You cant,,now they tell us, torch copper clay,,,and the carbon you do fire it in has to be coconut carbon,,,not a acid carbon. Along with firing it 1 in the Kiln with no carbon and then a second time in the coconut carbon. Not as easy as silver.
Huh. What confuses me is that several people have demoed it being done. The package directions say it can be done. 🤷♀️ Guess I’ll stick with silver, so much easier.
I just got the copper clay. I have never used any clay before and still successfully torch fired 5 pieces I made, no problems. I have a small Proxxon torch, costs about 40 bucks, I use propane gas. Start with small pieces, way easier to keep heated. When you start to see your metal surface turn silvery/shiny, you are basically done, 5 minutes are perfect for the small pieces (I made pieces with maximum 1.5mm thickness and under 20mm diameter). And pro tip from a goldsmith: heat your pieces in a metal scourer - the one used to scrub pots. Get a round one, make a lower 'nest' in the middle and put your pieces there. I fired one and then the next time I did 4. Really no issues. You will see how much easier it is to heat the pieces evenly in the nest made of steel wool ;)
Great tips, thanks! So glad to hear you had good results.
I have tried silver, bronze, copper, even steel clay: the secret of success is understanding that 999 silver (silver clay) does not oxidize, other metals oxidize: they must therefore be sintered in a reducing atmosphere (without oxygen). To create a reducing atmosphere, the pieces must be closed in an airtight container (I used a small steel saucepan full of coal grains, with a lid) and I put it in a programmable electric oven: the firing ramp at the start must be low and slow to burn the binder, then higher to sinter the metal. It works! With the torch I work only with silver, which has no oxidation problems... Thanks for your condivision, good experimentation!
Thanks for the explanation, Angela! 🙂
I've tried a kiln for copper clay 300C for 30 mins and it worked fine . As recommended by a cooksandgold youtube tutorial .
My bad 600C for 30 mins
Thank you so much for this informative video. A great help to see what can go wrong with Copper clay firing.
I did buy some Copper clay last year, but haven't used it yet as I don't have a kiln, & now glad that I didn't fire it.
This stuff is too expensive for errors!
Thank you for letting me know you found the video helpful, Victoria!
I only paid $20 for the package of copper clay, so I don’t feel too bad. 🙃Maybe one day I’ll get it fired properly.
Just look at the high melting point of copper and the energy output from a propane torch - it's not going to work. Carbon firing in a kiln is what this material needs ... and some small/older kilns meant for enameling might not even reach the temperature for perfect sintering. That's why I would use bronze clay instead: lower melting point and a higher strength of the finished object.
Good points. Thanks!
Love your videos. I am a relative newbie trying copper clay. With reasonable success. I do have a kiln, as I use to teach stain glass. I love experimenting with different jewelry techniques and being creative. As you seem to be. Thank you for sharing your results.
I'm sure a kiln makes a huge difference!
I have tried the torch on it too and they don't work, because it needs a carbon firing in a Kiln. Still harder the silver.
There are folks who claim, and even show videos of, having success with a torch. 🤷♀️ I experimented a lot, and just decided not to sink any more time or money into figuring it out.
Instead, I bought myself another package of silver clay, which I look forward to successfully using.😃
Omg! I am having the same problems! I have spent a fortune! I do have a kiln so, I am going to give that a go!
Yes, I think that is the best way to use this stuff. Let us know how it goes!
@Keepsake Crafts by Sandy Huntress I will. I haven't yet as I have been a bit put off by it. But soon I will get back at it! 🤗
I know this is a year old but in case you come across this video like I have sharing what I’ve experienced; Art Clay Copper works great with a torch for smaller pieces. The other brands I’ve seen disclose kiln only.
The package I used was labeled for torch firing up to a 25 gram piece. My pieces were much smaller than that, I’m guessing my torch wasn’t powerful enough.
Hi Sandy, thank you for this. I have always wanted to try this but the cost....looking forward to your next one!
The copper clay isn't all that expensive, about $25 for 50g. The silver clay right now is $70 for 15g at Fire Mountain Gems.
But I did see some on Amazon for $45. amzn.to/3XXxr7G I should probably snatch it up before they raise the price. ;-)
So I got to your video as a round about way of of colleague telling me about metal clays as I've never heard of them but it sounded interesting and might be useful to a ceramic composite project I'm working on. The good news for you, I have solutions you can try in you are interested in having another go. Option 1, not sure of your experience level, this is my first viewing of your channel, but microwave kilns work for these very well. They are basically an alumina shell exterior with a thin silicon carbide liner that absorbs thermal radiation (in this case, microwaves) and will turn the interior little section of said kiln a blistering 2300*F without fail. Knowing what they are made of, I kind of refuse to buy one but have converted many a sacrificial terra cotta plant pots to experiment with. If you don't mind plunking $25 or so to play with one, it's an option.
Version 2, you can mold a small kiln to fire with your torch or convert again a terra cotta plant pot so long as they have a hole in the base (normally for drainage, in this case it will function as a vent). Going this route, you'll need to expand the exterior dimensions of the pot with an insulative clay and leave or cut in a port for your torch. Doing it this way is somewhat economical if you're just going to try it a few times, but using a hand torch, you'll burn through a bottle of fuel in 15 or so minutes.
Out of the two options and taking into consideration a finite amount of uses, the microwave kilns are cheap enough to be sacrificial but can last awhile if taken care of. Or you can spend the same $25 on materials and make a whole bunch out of plant pots. I'd write out a tutorial if you're interested on the latter.
Wow, so much info and so interesting! Thank you. I looked at microwave kilns, but was suspicious, and was afraid of wrecking my microwave. 😀
I'm always interested in learning and would love a tutorial. I'm sure my viewers would be as well. Thanks again for all the helpful information!
@Keepsake Crafts by Sandy Huntress I dont blame you on the overly cautious approach, especially if you've put some coin into your kitchen microwave. It doesn't hurt anything so long as you have adequate spacing (4 or more inches at a minimum on all sides) but you definitely don't want to shoehorn one into a small unit as the vent will act as a miniture volcano caldera in terms of temperature right at the opening.
The materials are really cheap and very easy to acquire. I'll try to write a more condensed guide later tonight when I get in front of a proper keyboard.
@@C-M-EHi! Seeing this one year later and would love a guide as well! I’m working with Prometheus bronze clay and even if the packaging says it can be torch fired I haven’t had any success. Now looking into other methods that don’t require a kiln
Would you say the size of the torch flame is important?
It was a fail, so I can’t say anything authoritatively. 😞 But I suspect it’s more of the heat of the torch, than the size of the flame.
everything I've ever read about copper clay is that because it oxidizes, it needs to be buried in graphite before you try firing, so no air contacts the clay as it sinters.
That's interesting. I've watched videos of copper clay being torch fired and it wasn't buried in graphite. They do mention you should get it out of the air and into water immediately after you remove the flame because of oxidation.
If kiln firing, burying it in carbon is one recommendation.
Thank you for this tutorial. I haven't personally tried any metal clay. I wonder if the packages have a shelf life? or that batch wasn't mixed right from the manufacturer. 🤔 I look forward to your silver clay comeback. 💙💜🧡
Thanks, Shelli. I did wonder if the age of the clay had something to do with it. I can't imagine what?
It might be some while before I can buy and work with silver clay again. In the meantime, you can check out my first time trying it. ua-cam.com/play/PLg8Lpg6u0akgFjpUvurfkY_F2ys6UL5PU.html&feature=shares
Much more successful than the copper clay!
Hi, love the video! I thought it was just me. I got exactly the same results as yours, super annoyed. I also tried bronze one they got the same results. I’m so curious how the other videos could successfully torched fire on this copper clay 😅 I think I should buy a PMC silver then. Thanks for the video!
Yes, it was a bummer not to be able to get it to work! Wish I knew what the other folks did differently. :::shrug::: I did get myself another package of silver clay, btw. 😀 Thanks for letting me know you had similar results. Happy creating!
Good to know as I recently purchased some copper clay from Amazon. Compared to silver it was much cheaper so figured I might try as I have had some really good results with the silver clay. I had problems with the basic propane touch staying lit cause of the angle I had to point it so I bought a different style torch nozzle. I wonder if that might make a difference.
I hope you get good results! Please share how it works out for you. Have fun, either way. 🙂
I’m still having problems with cooper clay. The only way to get it to work is putting your design in a kiln.. But They also works get in the large beehive kiln will work… around $300 but in order to Center, Copper Clay it Hass to be at a much higher degree than 900°F you need to center it torch firing at least 1100°F..
But I’d definitely understand everyone’s frustration. Has anybody tried using the bronze clay? Well, it’s has its own temperament too..
So I can get my bronze and cooper clay to fire torch… but I prefer to put it in the beehive Kiln.. it’s actually called something else and I partner with Cool Tools. Sandy have you gotten it figured out yet for the Copper Clay? Let me know and maybe we can get together on UA-cam and I can show a demonstration.. I am starting my own UA-cam channel. I have my Instagram and my Facebook I am extremely behind. But I am a professional Silversmith instructor but I fell in love with Silver Metal Clay anyway I’m trying to catch up on your videos I’m so behind. 🤗Autumn
Honestly, I've given up on the copper clay. The silver was a joy to work with, so I'll stick with that and my polymer for now. I'm working on another PMC3 video right now, this time combing it with polymer techniques.
Once you get rolling with your UA-cam channel, maybe sometime we can collab. 🙂
@@SandyHuntress have you tried using Silver Art Metal Clay? It’s .999 !!!!! it works really well, torch firing. But I get you on the copper and the bronze. There is definitely a technique to it.
Anyway, since you work with polymer clay, you definitely have an advantage with people who are just starting with silver Metal Clay. Now I’m using cheap clay to make my molds so I don’t practice with my silver Metal Clay. I’m glad I ran into you again on UA-cam, for some reason, I haven’t been getting any notifications from you and it’s actually happening with several other artist who I’m following. I have enjoyed your videos. I am looking forward to seeing more of your silver Metal Clay designs. And hoping to get my UA-cam channel started. OK well big hugs to you girl.
Can you use open gas fire?
I don’t know that it gets hot enough. You’d have to research that.
You cant,,now they tell us, torch copper clay,,,and the carbon you do fire it in has to be coconut carbon,,,not a acid carbon. Along with firing it 1 in the Kiln with no carbon and then a second time in the coconut carbon. Not as easy as silver.
Huh. What confuses me is that several people have demoed it being done. The package directions say it can be done. 🤷♀️ Guess I’ll stick with silver, so much easier.
🤔
🙂
I think your torches do not reach a high enough temp. I fire my pieces in a kiln with no problems. search Hadar Jacobson's firing schedule.
Yes, although it says it is torch fireable, I think with the copper clay a kiln is your best bet.
Thouse copper clays are not really available now to buy. So silver is better
You can buy them online, Fire Mountain Gems has a selection available.