There are many problems with this build. 1. You can only use 2 weapons (the 2 shotguns). Picking any other gun is not viable. 2. Your MGL is basically useless. If you run out of shotgun ammo, most of the perks are useless. 3. You cannot kill specials fast and reliably, you will throw a C4 at a tanky specials and have to keep shooting them wasting time instead of hitting the swarm. 4. Shotguns are not reliable i.e you are always unsure if a shot is a kill, you cannot close cover a teammate without friendly fire, bad range to deal frontal DPS. 5. You cannot multitask like throwing MGL at pyramid, bull and shooting strays at the same time. 6. Since you are already using third hand to auto reload, it cancels nimble thumbs fast reload since you never have to reload anyway. 7. You are forced to use C4 on a Bull since your MGL will not 1 shot him and shotguns are bad at killing strays so you are not efficient at killing strays since you used your C4 on Bulls, etc. 8. Cannot kill far away screamer fast with PDW/shotgun. 9. If you empty PDW and use Baton then it is very cheesy in the first place and screamer cannot be killed. Baton+PDW is more OP than a flaregun. This build is not versatile, reliable for any map, situation. Also maximum kills I got was 24 kills per shot, however since the combat shotgun has 7 pellets per shot and each pellet has 3 Pen means 7*(3+1) kills per shot i.e 28 kills per shot. I never got 28 kills in a shot since you have to angle the shot very slant such that 7 pellets separate onto incoming horde. I think combat shotgun was always the strongest primary in terms on kills per shot. Incidentally, 1 improved MGL shot kills 28 per shot as well so that number isn't random.
1. You don't need any other gun other than the combat shotgun. Positive point: You are ready for all situations at spawn so if you spawn during a defense you are already equipped. This eliminates the problem of joining a losing defense with T1 shotgun. 2. You use the MGL and get a different heavy. Positive point: you can pick up whatever heavy you come across. There's usually more than enough per map. And you can pick a situational heavy like RPG, chainsaw, MG for no FF, etc. 3. That is a tradeoff of the build. You can either use more explosives on armor or use C4 burn like an Ext build. 4. Eagle Scout increases shotgun range by 150% and PDW/baton is good for strays. Play as stun only or play as shoot>empty>stun. 5. MGL still exists, C4 still exists, guns still exist. The damage is different but multitasking is not exclusive to MGL build. 6. Third Hand doesn't proc all the time. You need nimble hands to put shells in shotgun quickly so you can proc the Third Hand on 15-17th shell. You don't always have a full shotgun when the opportunity of Third Hand comes. Nimble thumbs also useful in non-horde segments. If you play without nimble you'd notice its not that good. Even Ext third hand is hard on combat shotgun except for purely pyramids. Nimble allows for better quality of life during traversal segments. 7. Plenty of other ways to kill a bull. C4 burn is enough most times, same as Ext. Positive point: C4 can be used as typical molotov fire trap except you can leave it undetonated until needed. Lots of C4 can be placed as opposed to using it once or twice and saving for next specials. 8. PDW with +2 accuracy and +20% damage is not bad. 9. Not sure if cheesy is what I would call it. Signature is not guaranteed safe. Need to use 3 melees. Can still be hit during 2x melee and sig animation. Zombies can just be outside of stun range and hit you during animation. Signature move has long startup. Setting up PDW+baton requires dedicated CQB perk, and having a PDW in inventory which also uses up a class perk, extra step of emptying PDW at some point. To have PDW+baton combo requires 2 perks + dump PDW ammo + 3 melee swings + still potentially getting hit. Flare requires finding it, switching to it, and firing. Can be repeated quickly. Can have up to 15-22 flares in inventory vs. baton stamina is only enough for 2-3 signatures. Flare allows you to distract zombies away from you. 10. No build is versatile for any map. The shotgunraiser is an offshoot build of HR that allows for huge pen gains and pyramid killing. It finally makes all the shotgun HR perks viable and gives the class a new way to be played. You rely less on RNG bounce of MGL, with potentially less friendly fire explosions. You kill more in pyramids and only need to use crate ammo. You never have to spend time looking for a gun or competing for the best guns. Your heavy choice becomes flexible. You can use c4+fire creatively. You spawn immediately ready for an intense defense. The main loss is wheatgrass, but the build is designed for pyramids so Job Sat synergizes better and most HR don't run wheatgrass either. You can even switch to a claymore build with just 2 different perks thus allowing to being creative with claymores. Disabling enemy claymores gives one back to inventory as a minor buff to claymore builds. Its a legit build for different playstyle and way more fun than MGL IMO. 🙂 Class is still at mercy of green heads surprising you in corners and cramped spaces regardless of build. However, having combat shotgun with fast reload definitely makes green heads easier to kill.
@@KokakWWZ It's just another ineffective build. Good build should be 1. Fun 2. DPS Effective 3. Require most skill. But this shotgun build only fulfills maybe the fun part of shooting longer on pyramids. 1. You do need other weapons because you cannot have range with shotgun. Rifles kill more at range in many sections as soon as horde start spawning. Additionally, rifles help to unpin or cover teammates from lurker, bull or zombies around them which shotguns don't do. Basically if you are using any shotgun you are only good for pyramids and allow the zombies to pile up thus more zombies come to teammates. Shotguns are ineffective weapons in all shooter games including PvP games. The only reason shotguns have use in this game is because of reload perks but they require very less skill since no aiming required. The only way people are doing solo runs in this game is abusing shotgun reloads and spread because without them you cannot beat most solos. 2. The point of multitasking is it's DPS effectiveness. This build requires or provides no multitasking since the weak MGL will not down a pyramid or kill a bull. Thus switching to MGL is pointless because it does nothing. In the improved MGL build I switch to MGL to completely demolish a pyramid and go back to my primary or take out a bull with it. While MGL is bouncing and blowing up I am actually shooting at strays at the same time. In this build even using C4+MGL combo will not insta kill a bull, so a bull will be roaming/charging around and no one has any idea when he will die. You cannot kill specials or get highest special kills with build like this or exterminator. If specials are not killed fast they only distract team and lose time and DPS on pyramids. This is why even the top 1% players will never main exterminator since it only allows specials to stay alive longer. 3. Planting C4s as traps or using Claymores is killing passively. Passive kills require less skill just like defense kits or pistol drone. 4. Imagine joining a game with team dead and strays/specials everywhere with pyramids which build will have more success? With MGL I can just toss one at a pyramid or a bull and 2 major problems are gone while I am already shooting at strays with T1 shotgun. If I spawn with your build I just have to keep shooting with shotgun only and throw C4. The specials will still be alive and so will the pyramids be. I cannot shoot strays and down a pyramid at the same time. Definitely improved MGL has more chance of success since I have more ways of dealing with the situation using high damage MGL, pistol, and shotgun. 5. I don't think you kill more in pyramids since improved MGL kills 28 per shot and while the MGL is killing you are also shooting at the pyramid. Also it's not always about getting max kills, it's about effectively managing the spawns. If you just shoot constantly at horde and ignore strays and specials then it is just tunneling and not being aware. This is why this build is not good since a more skillful gameplay will not require tunneling but shooting in all directions depending on priority and managing the spawns. 6. Talking about MGL bounce RNG. That is the game issue and 1-2 bad bounces out of 10 shouldn't deter anyone from skillful gameplay just like with greenheads. Since MGL bounces off vertical walls always properly it is not gun RNG issue. Also your build has more RNG than MGL build. The shotgun pellet spread, the PDW spray is inherent gun RNG. If you use C4 traps or claymores you rely on game spawn RNG. If you use Baton you rely on zombie hit animation RNG to avoid getting hit. Also it is effective to blow up enemy mines than defusing since it is faster and if you blow up all mines nobody will accidentally trip over a random forgotten mine since zombies spawning blow them up as well. 7. Bad teammates never go for the guns first so you always get the best guns without competition. Good teammates will always go for the best guns and if they pick up the good guns then you do not have to worry about failing. Not everyone should have the OP guns else game is not fun either. 8. Talking about PDW, it has spray and pray cannot accurately 1 shot a far screamer like pistol but need to spray and screamer keeps falling down. Baton allows you to do solo dead bots Marseille 1 with gunslinger just with an AK and it will work same with shotgun hellraiser by stunning zombies around you with a pause> regen stamina > stun again while shooting the pyramid. Without the baton Marseille 1 dead bots is not possible even if you had a flare gun. The baton+PDW is most broken thing in the game and a bigger cheat than flaregun and one can only realize this when one can time the signature strike and stuns properly. Sometimes stuns do not work or you can get hit because of hit animation but when it works properly then you cannot die and do all solo dead bots (iron man) runs. The other broken mechanic is ofcourse T3 shotgun with chainsaw giving constant 360 deg pushback on zombies around you. When you only talk about skill and having fun from skilled and DPS effective gameplay which is based on risk and reward, speed and timing, No luck or RNG then all these cheesy methods become baseless and one would only play with rifles, doing headshots and bouncing MGLs to kill with maximum damage on them. I also think the payload is kinda broken since it requires no precise aiming on the bull to 1-2 shot him. Any weapon especially a sniper type which can 1-2 shot any target need to require precise aiming. This is why dronemasters running around with improved payloads sniping bulls no ADS is DPS effective but unbalanced and still cheesy gameplay.
@@matsumototatsuo See a lot of your replies are what I would call "just your opinion." "Passive skills are bad" is your opinion. "Shotguns are ineffective in all shooter games," is just your opinion. What constitutes as "Fun," build is your opinion. You still have an MGL in this build. You can still use it and fire shotgun. Except you kill more by not using the MGL because the shotgun kills more and faster. So you don't need to switch. Switching between primary and heavy still requires a switching animation and firing the MGL switching back to primary and shooting only offers a small kill boost then goes back to being slower. It also uses your heavy resources. And you are more vulnerable during switching animations to whatever zombies come around. T1 shotguns main issue is the pump action and the downtime when at low ammo and still needing to deal with multiple stragglers. You can argue all you want that you can survive a losing fight with a T1 shotgun but I'm not going to believe you. You can agree to disagree. But this discussion is now done because this will just go back and forth and your opinion is your opinion and no objective discourse is going to change that. Have a good day. 🙂
@@KokakWWZ Positivepandemic can also make the exact same word-to-word arguments as you do and call it FUN and legit to play Vanguard, just pressing 2 buttons and posting Vanguard clips on reddit.."Hey Kokak, you don't like Vanguard because it takes no skill? That's just your opinion bro because it is FUN and you are vulnerable using other classes to whatever zombies come around and I get choice to pick up any heavy weapon and I can jesus heal and steal from breaching doors with sword". One can only believe when one actually cares to watch the clips of a HR joining a game with dead teammates clutching with T1 shotgun and improved MGL until they all respawn back; let alone asking those top 2-3 players who play that way. It's 4 years now and by now you should know to differentiate between FACTS and OPINIONS. At the end of the day, Shotgun HR cannot be superior to the MGL build just like Vanguard cannot be a legit class to play. If everyone just calls everything as opinion then the truth can never be determined.
@@KokakWWZI’m pretty sure he was talking about the perks that weren’t shown 🙂 to do what you do in the video I’m curious as well since I wanna use shotguns (coming from fixer class)
@@doctor-bag1034 No worries. Things have slightly changed a little now with updates though. With the new 4th row of perks, a mix of shotgun and MGL HR is the newer, stronger build. Plus the ghost pistol is so OP it beats any secondary in the game. So with the new meta, I would run 243-323-432 with a ghost pistol. Same shotgun setup. Melee is your choice now (no longer baton+pdw combo), personally I run dual knives. Still not recommended for beginners due to not having wheatgrass.
![EASIEST IRON MAN BORDER CHEESE (Iron Man Portrait Frame) [Credit to xD3viLz]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/HJMosqO4loU/mqdefault.jpg)
![EASIEST IRON MAN BORDER CHEESE (Iron Man Portrait Frame) [Credit to xD3viLz]](/img/tr.png)
There are many problems with this build.
1. You can only use 2 weapons (the 2 shotguns). Picking any other gun is not viable.
2. Your MGL is basically useless. If you run out of shotgun ammo, most of the perks are useless.
3. You cannot kill specials fast and reliably, you will throw a C4 at a tanky specials and have to keep shooting them wasting time instead of hitting the swarm.
4. Shotguns are not reliable i.e you are always unsure if a shot is a kill, you cannot close cover a teammate without friendly fire, bad range to deal frontal DPS.
5. You cannot multitask like throwing MGL at pyramid, bull and shooting strays at the same time.
6. Since you are already using third hand to auto reload, it cancels nimble thumbs fast reload since you never have to reload anyway.
7. You are forced to use C4 on a Bull since your MGL will not 1 shot him and shotguns are bad at killing strays so you are not efficient at killing strays since you used your C4 on Bulls, etc.
8. Cannot kill far away screamer fast with PDW/shotgun.
9. If you empty PDW and use Baton then it is very cheesy in the first place and screamer cannot be killed. Baton+PDW is more OP than a flaregun.
This build is not versatile, reliable for any map, situation.
Also maximum kills I got was 24 kills per shot, however since the combat shotgun has 7 pellets per shot and each pellet has 3 Pen means 7*(3+1) kills per shot i.e 28 kills per shot. I never got 28 kills in a shot since you have to angle the shot very slant such that 7 pellets separate onto incoming horde. I think combat shotgun was always the strongest primary in terms on kills per shot. Incidentally, 1 improved MGL shot kills 28 per shot as well so that number isn't random.
1. You don't need any other gun other than the combat shotgun. Positive point: You are ready for all situations at spawn so if you spawn during a defense you are already equipped. This eliminates the problem of joining a losing defense with T1 shotgun.
2. You use the MGL and get a different heavy. Positive point: you can pick up whatever heavy you come across. There's usually more than enough per map. And you can pick a situational heavy like RPG, chainsaw, MG for no FF, etc.
3. That is a tradeoff of the build. You can either use more explosives on armor or use C4 burn like an Ext build.
4. Eagle Scout increases shotgun range by 150% and PDW/baton is good for strays. Play as stun only or play as shoot>empty>stun.
5. MGL still exists, C4 still exists, guns still exist. The damage is different but multitasking is not exclusive to MGL build.
6. Third Hand doesn't proc all the time. You need nimble hands to put shells in shotgun quickly so you can proc the Third Hand on 15-17th shell. You don't always have a full shotgun when the opportunity of Third Hand comes. Nimble thumbs also useful in non-horde segments. If you play without nimble you'd notice its not that good. Even Ext third hand is hard on combat shotgun except for purely pyramids. Nimble allows for better quality of life during traversal segments.
7. Plenty of other ways to kill a bull. C4 burn is enough most times, same as Ext. Positive point: C4 can be used as typical molotov fire trap except you can leave it undetonated until needed. Lots of C4 can be placed as opposed to using it once or twice and saving for next specials.
8. PDW with +2 accuracy and +20% damage is not bad.
9. Not sure if cheesy is what I would call it. Signature is not guaranteed safe. Need to use 3 melees. Can still be hit during 2x melee and sig animation. Zombies can just be outside of stun range and hit you during animation. Signature move has long startup. Setting up PDW+baton requires dedicated CQB perk, and having a PDW in inventory which also uses up a class perk, extra step of emptying PDW at some point. To have PDW+baton combo requires 2 perks + dump PDW ammo + 3 melee swings + still potentially getting hit. Flare requires finding it, switching to it, and firing. Can be repeated quickly. Can have up to 15-22 flares in inventory vs. baton stamina is only enough for 2-3 signatures. Flare allows you to distract zombies away from you.
10. No build is versatile for any map.
The shotgunraiser is an offshoot build of HR that allows for huge pen gains and pyramid killing. It finally makes all the shotgun HR perks viable and gives the class a new way to be played. You rely less on RNG bounce of MGL, with potentially less friendly fire explosions. You kill more in pyramids and only need to use crate ammo. You never have to spend time looking for a gun or competing for the best guns. Your heavy choice becomes flexible. You can use c4+fire creatively. You spawn immediately ready for an intense defense. The main loss is wheatgrass, but the build is designed for pyramids so Job Sat synergizes better and most HR don't run wheatgrass either. You can even switch to a claymore build with just 2 different perks thus allowing to being creative with claymores. Disabling enemy claymores gives one back to inventory as a minor buff to claymore builds.
Its a legit build for different playstyle and way more fun than MGL IMO. 🙂
Class is still at mercy of green heads surprising you in corners and cramped spaces regardless of build. However, having combat shotgun with fast reload definitely makes green heads easier to kill.
@@KokakWWZ It's just another ineffective build. Good build should be 1. Fun 2. DPS Effective 3. Require most skill. But this shotgun build only fulfills maybe the fun part of shooting longer on pyramids.
1. You do need other weapons because you cannot have range with shotgun. Rifles kill more at range in many sections as soon as horde start spawning. Additionally, rifles help to unpin or cover teammates from lurker, bull or zombies around them which shotguns don't do. Basically if you are using any shotgun you are only good for pyramids and allow the zombies to pile up thus more zombies come to teammates. Shotguns are ineffective weapons in all shooter games including PvP games. The only reason shotguns have use in this game is because of reload perks but they require very less skill since no aiming required. The only way people are doing solo runs in this game is abusing shotgun reloads and spread because without them you cannot beat most solos.
2. The point of multitasking is it's DPS effectiveness. This build requires or provides no multitasking since the weak MGL will not down a pyramid or kill a bull. Thus switching to MGL is pointless because it does nothing. In the improved MGL build I switch to MGL to completely demolish a pyramid and go back to my primary or take out a bull with it. While MGL is bouncing and blowing up I am actually shooting at strays at the same time. In this build even using C4+MGL combo will not insta kill a bull, so a bull will be roaming/charging around and no one has any idea when he will die. You cannot kill specials or get highest special kills with build like this or exterminator. If specials are not killed fast they only distract team and lose time and DPS on pyramids. This is why even the top 1% players will never main exterminator since it only allows specials to stay alive longer.
3. Planting C4s as traps or using Claymores is killing passively. Passive kills require less skill just like defense kits or pistol drone.
4. Imagine joining a game with team dead and strays/specials everywhere with pyramids which build will have more success? With MGL I can just toss one at a pyramid or a bull and 2 major problems are gone while I am already shooting at strays with T1 shotgun. If I spawn with your build I just have to keep shooting with shotgun only and throw C4. The specials will still be alive and so will the pyramids be. I cannot shoot strays and down a pyramid at the same time. Definitely improved MGL has more chance of success since I have more ways of dealing with the situation using high damage MGL, pistol, and shotgun.
5. I don't think you kill more in pyramids since improved MGL kills 28 per shot and while the MGL is killing you are also shooting at the pyramid. Also it's not always about getting max kills, it's about effectively managing the spawns. If you just shoot constantly at horde and ignore strays and specials then it is just tunneling and not being aware. This is why this build is not good since a more skillful gameplay will not require tunneling but shooting in all directions depending on priority and managing the spawns.
6. Talking about MGL bounce RNG. That is the game issue and 1-2 bad bounces out of 10 shouldn't deter anyone from skillful gameplay just like with greenheads. Since MGL bounces off vertical walls always properly it is not gun RNG issue. Also your build has more RNG than MGL build. The shotgun pellet spread, the PDW spray is inherent gun RNG. If you use C4 traps or claymores you rely on game spawn RNG. If you use Baton you rely on zombie hit animation RNG to avoid getting hit. Also it is effective to blow up enemy mines than defusing since it is faster and if you blow up all mines nobody will accidentally trip over a random forgotten mine since zombies spawning blow them up as well.
7. Bad teammates never go for the guns first so you always get the best guns without competition. Good teammates will always go for the best guns and if they pick up the good guns then you do not have to worry about failing. Not everyone should have the OP guns else game is not fun either.
8. Talking about PDW, it has spray and pray cannot accurately 1 shot a far screamer like pistol but need to spray and screamer keeps falling down. Baton allows you to do solo dead bots Marseille 1 with gunslinger just with an AK and it will work same with shotgun hellraiser by stunning zombies around you with a pause> regen stamina > stun again while shooting the pyramid. Without the baton Marseille 1 dead bots is not possible even if you had a flare gun. The baton+PDW is most broken thing in the game and a bigger cheat than flaregun and one can only realize this when one can time the signature strike and stuns properly. Sometimes stuns do not work or you can get hit because of hit animation but when it works properly then you cannot die and do all solo dead bots (iron man) runs. The other broken mechanic is ofcourse T3 shotgun with chainsaw giving constant 360 deg pushback on zombies around you.
When you only talk about skill and having fun from skilled and DPS effective gameplay which is based on risk and reward, speed and timing, No luck or RNG then all these cheesy methods become baseless and one would only play with rifles, doing headshots and bouncing MGLs to kill with maximum damage on them. I also think the payload is kinda broken since it requires no precise aiming on the bull to 1-2 shot him. Any weapon especially a sniper type which can 1-2 shot any target need to require precise aiming. This is why dronemasters running around with improved payloads sniping bulls no ADS is DPS effective but unbalanced and still cheesy gameplay.
@@matsumototatsuo See a lot of your replies are what I would call "just your opinion." "Passive skills are bad" is your opinion. "Shotguns are ineffective in all shooter games," is just your opinion. What constitutes as "Fun," build is your opinion.
You still have an MGL in this build. You can still use it and fire shotgun. Except you kill more by not using the MGL because the shotgun kills more and faster. So you don't need to switch. Switching between primary and heavy still requires a switching animation and firing the MGL switching back to primary and shooting only offers a small kill boost then goes back to being slower. It also uses your heavy resources. And you are more vulnerable during switching animations to whatever zombies come around.
T1 shotguns main issue is the pump action and the downtime when at low ammo and still needing to deal with multiple stragglers. You can argue all you want that you can survive a losing fight with a T1 shotgun but I'm not going to believe you.
You can agree to disagree. But this discussion is now done because this will just go back and forth and your opinion is your opinion and no objective discourse is going to change that. Have a good day. 🙂
@@KokakWWZ Positivepandemic can also make the exact same word-to-word arguments as you do and call it FUN and legit to play Vanguard, just pressing 2 buttons and posting Vanguard clips on reddit.."Hey Kokak, you don't like Vanguard because it takes no skill? That's just your opinion bro because it is FUN and you are vulnerable using other classes to whatever zombies come around and I get choice to pick up any heavy weapon and I can jesus heal and steal from breaching doors with sword". One can only believe when one actually cares to watch the clips of a HR joining a game with dead teammates clutching with T1 shotgun and improved MGL until they all respawn back; let alone asking those top 2-3 players who play that way. It's 4 years now and by now you should know to differentiate between FACTS and OPINIONS. At the end of the day, Shotgun HR cannot be superior to the MGL build just like Vanguard cannot be a legit class to play. If everyone just calls everything as opinion then the truth can never be determined.
that's the smartest frog ever 👏👏
Exterminator and gunslinger are just as good if not better at that swarm.
It depends. Ext and GS needs to look for a gun. Ext may need to use valuable resources like an RPG. GS definitely needs to find a pen gun. 🙂
How and what build?
I made 1200 kill at this wave with the fixer power shot
Build?
Its at 2:34 in the video. 🙂
@@KokakWWZI’m pretty sure he was talking about the perks that weren’t shown 🙂 to do what you do in the video I’m curious as well since I wanna use shotguns (coming from fixer class)
@@doctor-bag1034 Have a goooooood look at 2:34. Up in the top where it says, "Build: ".
@@KokakWWZthanks I didn’t know what the numbers meant I was just looking for the actual build to be shown on screen I’ll give the build a try today
@@doctor-bag1034 No worries. Things have slightly changed a little now with updates though.
With the new 4th row of perks, a mix of shotgun and MGL HR is the newer, stronger build. Plus the ghost pistol is so OP it beats any secondary in the game.
So with the new meta, I would run 243-323-432 with a ghost pistol. Same shotgun setup. Melee is your choice now (no longer baton+pdw combo), personally I run dual knives. Still not recommended for beginners due to not having wheatgrass.
nice