DTS Play-Fi is now GAPLESS 🙏🏻 BUT... (Audiolab 6000A Play follow-up)
Вставка
- Опубліковано 29 чер 2024
- 👉🏻 This episode is brought to you by Marantz:
bit.ly/3BKcJyS
🎥 Camera: Olaf von Voss
🎬 Editor: John Darko
🕺🏻 Motion GFX: John Darko
💰 Ad segment: Jana Dagdagan
🛋 My listening room in 2022:
darko.audio/darkos-listening-...
🎵 Song IDs? Playlists of all music heard in this video - and other videos - can be found on PATREON: / johndarko
0:00 Backstory
4:29 Update
5:47 Upshot
6:48 Gotcha!
7:58 Further reservations
9:26 Why still use the Audiolab 6000A Play?
10:04 Buying advice
15:30 Bloopers
👉🏻 As seen in this video...
Monitor Audio Silver 100 7G
🛒 bit.ly/3eWV9zQ
🛒 bit.ly/3QZfgdY
Solid Steel SS-6 speaker stands
🛒 howl.me/ch7ADEkZHUV
Audiolab 6000A Play
🛒 howl.me/ch9pr4Z1Xm9
What is gapless playback?
📖 darko.audio/2020/05/what-is-g...
📖 How important is gapless playback?
darko.audio/2021/12/global-fe...
📺 Audiolab 6000A Play video
darko.audio/2021/12/audiolabs...
Audiolab 6000A Play follow-up video
📺 darko.audio/2022/01/der-teufe...
#dtsplayfi #sonos #spotify
__________________________________________________________________
⏰ HOW OUR UA-cam VIDEOS GET MADE:
darko.audio/2021/10/how-our-y...
Darko.Audio FAQ:
darko.audio/faq/
Why are/were comments turned OFF?
darko.audio/2020/10/why-im-sw...
What the bloody hell am I talking about?
• What the bloody hell a...
How is Darko.Audio funded?
darko.audio/funding/
Darko.Audio may earn a small commission from items purchased via affiliate links.
__________________________________________________________________
DID YOU KNOW WE HAVE A PODCAST?
podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast...
open.spotify.com/show/1mnKixp...
/ johnhdarko
__________________________________________________________________
Darko.Audio is a web magazine covering new and exciting developments in the audio world and we aren’t afraid of indie rock or techno.
Web: Darko.Audio
Instagram: / darkoaudio
Facebook: / darkodotaudio - Розваги
Ad warnings honestly make the ads less annoying, thanks
Agree
It's honestly so nice to not have the ad cut in while he's mid-sentence. I wouldn't mind ads so much if all * cough * "content creators" on this platform applied ad breaks in similar ways.
As of Nov 25/22 the 6000n is fully gapless. Just updated the unit and listened to Pink Floyd DOTM and wonderful gapless. Thank you AudioLab.
Cambridge Audio's CXN V2 is still the class-leading streamer in this price range imo
My Wiim Mini plays gapless faultlessly and yes you can browse whilst using Qobuz, Tidal etc ....
If there were Darko Audio themed merch with a ‘Mind The Gap’ logo, I’d buy some 😁. Based on some of your previous videos, I’m still tinkering with volumio/raspberry pi. Thanks for another great video, John!
Hi John, I have the solo and had the audio lab 6000 A . Fantastic for the same reason you told: it’s a versatile setup with possibility to use the audiolab as a poweramp so easily. In my case together with a surround receiver. The only thing missing is that it doesn’t automatically powers from sleep on when it gets a sound signal from the solo. Living with 5 at home and nobody understanding what Port to set the amp to when looking tv or listening to music made me send it back . I wanted to be able to just tell google to play music, he recognises me and plays my music through the solo. When other do, my nest mini plays their Spotify list. That doesn’t work with the audiolab and most other amplifiers. So I finally hooked the solo up to my elder nad amp1: it jumps on automatically when getting signal from solo or my tv (fiber) , everybody happy :) I just didn’t solve my problem with my old nad receiver that I wanted to still use in case of intense film watching. I will test a amp switch this weekend. My audiolab was send back but everyday I look back at your channels I hope to find a way to solve my problem with the audiolab 6000 A and buy it back again. In Belgium we can by it for 599 euros.
I’ll find another streamer then! Thanks for the valuable information. I’m an old timer that lives via cd/ vinyl and so streaming has to be gapless..
Congrats 250k subscribers! 🥳
When you said; "Last Christmas"... I was waiting for, "I gave you my heart"
Ha ha! Me too!
Yes I've been obsessed for choice selection.. Just a note: Your reviews IMHO are singularly among the very best. You cover the gambit of the subjective sound quality aspects of these products, yet you still also dive into all the possibilities for how these various products may be utilized together. You cover all the details and leave little out objectively, and are very diligent to not miss items of importance on all these products. You even amend reviews with further information as it is identified. Just a note of appreciation and Merry Christmas.
Thank you for the update John :-)
Excellent review and good advice, thank you!
Great show. Answered many questions I hadn't even thought about.
The WiiM mini app has gotten pretty good actually.
Your videos are so well done. You never miss.
Thanks to you Darko, I've chosen Audiolab 6000a in combination with WiiM Mini. I'm happy with it since I'm using Audiolab internal DAC and WiiM Mini got couple of useful updates in the meantime.
Thanks for this, was looking at streaming options and the wiim/ Argon Solo/ Blue sound node are perfect. Thank you!
Great review John as usual. Very educational.
Always putting out great content...
I hate the gaps between tracks as my CD changer is shuffling! 😀 Thanks John! Love your videos. Very educational for an old man like me. ☠️🏴☠️
Great content John
Agreed! Just get the 6000A without the DTS Play-Fi............... I have had the 6000CDT CD transport for almost 2 years, and love it!
Very informative John. I’m struggling with what to purchase at the moment and these comparisons do help ✌️
6000a play also does the Spotify Connect - that’s how I role, sounds great.
Plus no extra cables and boxes.
Thats what I'm trying to understand : if I listen to spotify, does the whole Play-fi issue affect me? Don't I just open the spotify app and listen from there? Why would I neec to use the Play-fi app?
What I like the most about the bluesound node is the bass management feature. I bought the plain 6000A and the node 2i. It's an elegant and reliable solution.
I love both my 8000a play which I run Spotify and CDs through on Keff LS Metas and a standard 8000a which I run with my MacBook through an ifi DAC that sounds fantastic. Not bothered about gaps, I always loved Terry Thomas.
Decided on the the 6000A (non play) based on your previous review. Went for a Sonos port for the streaming element as already in that eco system.
Using the 6000a Play with the Sonos Port has a small advantage to the non Play: You can use the Port in digital fixed volume and control the volume with Alexa on the Play, should you be into voice control. Digital fixed allegedly sounds much better on the Port, but then you need to control the volume from the amplifier (so no pre-pwr mode in that use case). The 12v trigger on the Port also works nicely with the Audiolab 6000a amps. However, paying extra just for volume control over voice is probably not worth it for most users, as the sound quality will be equally impressive with both combinations.
The tension at 5:34! Could even see it in your grip :)
Hello. I bought a wiim mini and use it for my Audiolab 6000A. Used a very expensive Yamaha streamer before. But I think Wiim sounds better
Thank you I really appreciate your insistence on gapless playback. Imo, the integrated streaming apps included in this or any product should be of equal refinement as the hardware it is supporting. If I buy a diy kit amp and it's wonky, that's one thing, but if I'm buying a modern consumer electronic product in the year 2022 it should work "seamlessly" out of the box. However, far too often this is not the case.
Thanks John!
I have tried (believe me I've tried) to live with Playfi and my 6000N for a year and I'm now throwing in the towel.
Just pleased I bought a separate 6000A & CDT.
Hi John. Loved the video. Have the 6000a and have recently added the wiim mini and am loving it. One question I had. You discuss different streamers at the end moving from the Wiim to the Argon to the Bluesound, and each time you use the phrase, "if you want to step it up a bit". Can I ask what you're referring to? If you're using the dac in the 6000a for all of them don't they sound the same? Curious as to what is the "Step up" you're referring to...i.e. the build, the associated app, the functionality etc
I use a wiim on a 6000a and happy with it for now. saying that the 6000n looks nice with cdt so I still might purchase one second though 👍
John, this update showed up on my iPad yesterday and you were the first person I thought about when testing. So funny to see your review today. I have Paradigm PwLink, which is a nifty little unit that has a DAC (optical), Anthem room correction software, and Play-Fi. From a usability point of view, it's not in the same league as Audrivana Studio and Qobuz. AS is only $7/month and makes using Qobuz from any device in my hand effortless. Sonically, Play-Fi is very different than AS and my iFi Signature DAC. However, I spent some time listening to Play-Fi, and even though the Paradigm didn't get the gapless upgrade yet, It wasn't horrible. Actually, for casual listening, it was very enjoyable. Yes the gaps were still about 5 seconds and it lacks Quobuz's auto-play capability, but for $200 (new from Paradigm) you get a DAC, very nice room correction software, and a streamer. I agree with you about the phone still needing to be in the loop, but for a casual listener, it's progress.
I own the 6000A with the WiiM streamer, awesome! The WiiM is get updates all the time:)
Only problem is that I need to change the volume with the controller because i put the “fixed volume output” option. (the maximum quality is when the streamer is on maximum volume).
I also use the WiiM to play music files from my computer (i make my music folder sharing open). Great streamer.
I subscribe to every word you say about DTS Play-Fi!
I have found a great workaround with the "mconnect" app.
It uses the 6000a play as a DLNA device and supports Tidal.
I can even use my iPhone to adjust the volume on the Audiolab while playing.
It sounds much better than using the audiolab as a power amp and my Blousound Node 2i as a preamp.
The only downside is that it takes almost a minute for the Audiolab to find its wifi connection from startup,
so I listen to less music because I don't just turn it on for a few minutes in between...
Big thanks for this review 🙏🏽
I’m an 6000a and 6000n owner, and I’ve also been waiting to see about the gapless update. I’ve long been hoping it’d solve the issues with the streamer, but there’s clearly the user interface issue and the transfer BS. I didn’t want to sell the 6000n as a product it sits so well with the 6000a, both sound and looks, but it’s taking so long.
I am totally on the same page. I watched this video while music was playing through a WiiM connected to Amazon music. I like to answer texts sort email and other things on my phone sometime while listening to music.
Thanks for your continued attention to this topic! I never payed much attention to gapless playback until I listened to Steve Miller Band -Book of Dreams album…track 1 and how it is meant to not pause and seamlessly go into track 2, the two tracks are meant to go together. Take a listen and then you will hear the importance of gapless playback!!
Thanks for the update. This is very useful information regarding how important the streaming apps have become on the software side and balancing that with the excellence of the Audiolab hardware. Having fixed the gapless playback fault I would hope that DTS will update its software quickly before the reputation of the Audiolab is damaged too badly. If not then it may be time for Audiolab to re-access its partnership with DTS. Come on DTS, I am routing for you but you've gotta meet us half way!
Was searching if you did a review of the Audiolab 8300CDQ and then stumbled across this video. It's kind of funny how they built their 'competing' apps.
When you mentioned Tool, it really jumped me how it would be listening to the Lateralus album where 'Parabol' is basically the perfect intro song and then 'Parabola' kills you, but only five seconds later. Unimaginable.
Received my quad vena ii play yesterday, which sounds great 😊, and after trying 2 routers both modern and one actually recommended by play fi, the app would work on setup, after putting amp into standby it would no longer connect, requiring factory reset. So after several hours trying I ordered wiim pro, received this pm, setup in 10 mins and streaming. There really is no comparison. I suspect many others have had similar experience.
Completely agree. Exactly what I did. And I'm not looking back. Wiim just worked out of the box.
Excellent
Gapless playback and me goes together like peanut butter and jelly🤞👌♥️
Umpf, Kind of a dealbreaker. Happily the Lyngdorf tdai 1120 has its update with Tidal connect.
One simple and relatively inexpensive way of adding streaming capability to something like a 6000A (no “play”) would be the newest generation Apple Airport Express wi-fi router (now discontinued.) It was made airplay 2 compatible in an update a few years back. As long as AirPlay 2 is sufficient, you can find them for between $20-60 in used to like new condition, and can connect via 3.5mm or mini-toslink. I have a few and love them.
Thanks, good video! The Audiolab is an interesting proportion as an analog unit. Related to this review, I think, would be one of Innuos' line of streamers since they released InnuOs 2.0. Since that release, we, the owners, no longer need to toil with the hateful LMS on a day to day basis (although Squeezebox still looms in the background).
For an integrated as popular as the 6000A Play is, your comprehensive review and usage follow-ups is invaluable consumer advice.
I own the 6000a Play-Fi and echo the pluses and minuses. Great sounding and very flexible, but I don’t use Play-Fi anymore because it’s so frustrating. I don’t care much about gapless playback, but what broke me was the imperfect “Transfer” mode. There needs to be a system setting where Play-Fi defaults to “Transfer” immediately vs having to click on it every time you choose a song.
John another excellent video
I have a Hegel h95 and I don’t like the way it sounds much
And I was looking for a replacement amp that doesn’t cost much .
Thanks again
I’ve been using the 6000A + Argon Audio Solo combo for about 9 months now, and I’m very happy with both. I just wish they would add Tidal Connect to the Solo.
You’re correct John, the audiolab truely is an amazing amp, the soundstage is the largest I have heard from an amp so far in my journey.
Hi John, love your reviews, always clear and to the point. This may be slightly off topic. If you start adding streamers as you did with the Node to the Audiolab, would you just be better off just buying the NAD C700, or M10 V2? Or is the audio quality from the Audiolab that mush better? Thanks in advance.
You've convinced me to spend the extra money to get the Audiolab 6000A over a few other intergrated amps I was considering. Play-Fi completely turned me off to the 6000A Play.
However, I have what might be a dumb question. Are the streams from the optical out from the Wiim Mini, Bluesound Node, and Argon Solo equal in quality? I already have a Wiim Mini but would the others be a step up in sound quality using optical? Is a datastream a just datastream?
equal in quality
No they would be the same. Wiim mini with spitify connect or tidal connect is amazing deal for 100. Infinetly better than play-fi
Hi Darko, love your videos. Looking for some advice, have you any experience with the Cambridge Audio CXA81? I recently purchased it and I’m running it through Dynaudio Emit 10s. The soundstage is amazing but I find for things like rock it’s missing something in the low mids. I was originally looking at the audiolab 6000A. I don’t suppose you know whether it may suit my needs better than the CXA81. I’m living in Canada and it’s hard to locate places to test this gear with my setup! Thanks I’m advance. Sorry, I know not related to the DTS playfi
I see in the cover photo for your video that you listened to Animals 2018 Remix; I think it's one of the albums that I prefer more then the original and Pigs, between "04:12 - 06:00" tests pretty well the soundstage with those pig sounds and bass that comes out at 6:11 after 6 minutes is something unexpected; is one of the songs that I believe the experience is enhanced with a subwoofer.
Brilliant thank you the playfi app was concerning me. Would be great if you mentioned the products streaming rate if it is actually high resolution 👍👍
I totally agree. I own a 6000A Play and as much as i'm loving it the Play-Fi app is a pain in the ass.
Just fyi, you can browse music in transfer mode with Android, just hit music button on left, then go to tidal to browse…
I would take the 6000 amp in combination with the node. 👍
It sounds like the Audiolab only has minimal set backs. Every reviewer has given the amp, the sound quality, plus the headphone and the turntable connections outstanding reviews. If and when my current receiver goes south, the Audiolab 6000 series is at the top of my list.
Thank you for the updates and great reviews.
I love mine
The other bonus of connecting an external digital streamer is that you can swap it out for a new one when the technology inevitably becomes obsolete. A good amp could easily last a few decades. Streaming protocols and apps update every few years. I don't see any reason to combine them unless you really need to conserve the space.
Hey John, you did reference a number of streamers as stepping up from another. If you leave the UX of the apps and the internal dacs aside for a second, do blue sound node’s toslink output sound different (better) than the wiim mini when they are connected to the same integrated amp with a good dac?
Hi John
Enjoyed your reviews. I am in limbo I have heard your review on kef LS50 2s.I did go and listen to them.
My Question is there speakers as good as the kefs
Regards
Colin.
So, John showed using the Bluesound Node to connect optically to the internal DAC in the Audiolab 6000A, then in order to control volume using the Node, he connected it via analog out to the Audiolab 6000A (thus using the Node's DAC). Convenience aside, which would offer the better sound quality, the DAC in the Node or the DAC in the Audiolab 6000A?
Hello John.. for your otuside the box thinking thats what i like in the reviews and the products you choose
If got to choose between a audiolab 6000n play streamer or a denon dnp800 which one would you recommend...
Cut off bluenode coz it looks small and ruins the look lol
Thanks
Interesting. I have One Audiolab 6000A and also a 6000 A play. I use them in the lave house with Play Fi to intégrate them in two zones playing at the dame time, same Music. Before that, I also used the 6000A alone, streaming from a bluesound node and it work ed very well. About the bluesound, Connected to the amplifier, would you recommend to use the internal dac of the node or use the 6000A dac? By the wey, good review.
My room sounds like your neighbor's and I use a vintage Bose 901 S5 system that takes advantage of this room, but needs a equalizer in the analog chain. I believe these modern streaming amps don't offer the option to integrate stuff in the analog path of the amp so I can still use my speakers with the amp's DAC, do they? Untill I sound treat my room for a different system these speakers sound incredible, especially with live content. I now use separate components for streaming, no "FUTURE FI" for me.
Jumping in late. Even with this update I still don’t like Play-Fi and would steer people away from the platform. My current issue is that it doesn’t release the volume control on my phone meaning that when I try to use my remote (6000a) it bumps then immediately lowers the volume, all the while the volume control is flashing on my phone (app can be open or I can be in another). I am very happy with the 6000a otherwise (sound, aesthetics, build quality) but if I knew then what I know now it would be a node or ifi zen or basically anything else. Live and learn.
Well, this is from DTS site :
Do Transferred Streams support Gapless Playback ?
At the moment, no, but this will be coming with a future update, and we'll have news to share on this soon. I think they will do an update very soon. After that, you need to convince them to do plastic surgery on the interface😁.
I have got Argon Solo, unfortunately it doesn't do gapless with Bubble UPnP neither with Chromecast. Otherwise it's a very reliable streamer and has a good internal DAC either!
John. Great video, as always. Any plans to sell on the 6000a Play for the 6000a now you have finally discounted DTS, and to confirm your thoughts on how good an amp this is? Whilst I’m sure that the pre and power amp sections are the same, we are currently just assuming. And i know you love a side by side. You could then confirm that this is a killer £600 amp. This is coming from a 6000a owner, with Spotify fed through a Sonos Connect to the internal DAC.
Normally when you make videos about gapless playback I tend to chuckle because I know it just gets your goat, but in all honesty interrupted playback is a dealbreaker when listening for me, too. I’d find it easier to adjust to compromised sound quality, before the jarring transition of spaces between tracks on my favorite “LIVE” CD/stream.
Hi chat. Advice please. I have a Marantz pm6005, had it for almost 10 years and it’s used most days. It’s fantastic and never been tempted to replace it in this time. (Also a little sentimental as purchased when living at home, through uni, first and second house). However I’ve now seen the reviews for the 6000a and now I’m tempted. Anyone moved from a Marantz to audiolab and was it worth the move? Mainly listen to heavy rock/metal. I prevail, bury tomorrow, atreyu etc. TIA
I have an Audiolab 8300 CDQ & XP stereo power amp pairing and am very happy indeed… perhaps you can review some of their over pieces?
Talking about gapless. Take a listen on Minilogue - Blomma, lovely album.
Very good You Tube video. Cheers
I currently use the 6000a with just a Chromecast audio puck but will definitely upgrade to a better streamer. I think the 6000a phono input is damn good as are its digital and optical inputs.
The phono input is amazing, couldn’t believe the quality in comparison to my denon.
Great video John, Play-Fi need to step up their game otherwise people will completely avoid products with their streaming boards. Nice to see a brief shot of ‘A Flock Of Bleeps’ by Younger Brother. Spent many an evening listening to that one.
Where do you recomend to buy SACDs?
WiiM mini kicks the llama's arse. Thanks for another informative presentation, but...
I'm really hoping Wiim 1) keeps updating their software at the pace they've established and 2) release a larger product with A USB out.
I really feel like WiiM is nipping at the heels of Bluesound and that it wont take too much to push them over the edge.
Wiim software with the arylic s50+ is a good combo, but I wish they would fix their app to display album covers under home music share and have a short cut button to album. Basically copy USB audio players way of doing things.
John does the headphone amp on the audiolab sound as good as your kick ass system for under $500?
I have the Audiolab 6000A but have never used DTS Play-Fi. This is because I do not like proprietary software, but nor do I stream cloud based music. I bought the Play-fi version of the unit as it has DLNA/UPNP, as occasionally I will use pulseaudio-dlna to stream music from my laptop or phone over the wifi. Latency is SHOCKING!
Mostly, I use my own library collection or radio played through a Kodi box connected to the amp.
Wiim works with tidal browsing.
Question is if the black box is doing simple passthrough or stream is processed before getting to toslink?
I prefer 4stream over wiim.
So Spotify connect adn Tidal connect won't work from their native apps on the 6000A? I has to be done from the DTS app? That's so dum....
great video, keep pushing the DTS developers, without your video may be the gapless would be implemented in 2025 ;)
Listening to dsotm was a killer for me, I put my 6000n back in the box and put up for sale.Now I may reconsider, let's see.
Hi John. Does the playfi app not support Spotify connect?
I almost bought into the Yamaha music cast system with a streaming amp but discovered that also doesn't do gapless with Tidal/Qobuz. What is wrong with tech that so many big players can't do it in 2022? Interesting you mentioned mConnect, yes it's "free" but some high-end companies kinda rely on it unless you're a Roon subscriber (we all should be perhaps). But seeing as I already pay for Tidal, I kinda regret buying a unit (Gato Audio) that gives you such a poor streaming experience OOTB when others (Naim, BluOS devices etc.) have such a comparatively rich app as standard.
If it doesn't have that particular item then fair enough, however I find that the Yamaha app works very well in so many other areas that for most people like myself it is very slick and easy to use.
Any idea how the audio lab sounds with the kefls50 on a desktop set up?
I finally got Play fi working good !
With me Audiolab 'Omnia' also have regular 6000a and 8300a which is amazing with its 8 outputstage transitors
(BJT) I pops the hood !
Thanks John you da man ! It worked !! I was just using my phone !!!!!
You get time check out my short video of the ifi neo 😆 sometimes you must unleash the Beast !
I have to reevaluate the WIIM since it now does 192khz/24bt on the optical output (it used to be just 48Khz). What do you think About the IFI Zen stream John?
Many reviewers have noted that it sounds excellent, but is plagued by Wi-Fi connection issues that have not yet been fixed by iFi.
What futurefi boxes still have good (and gapless!) USB mass storage integration? Uniti Atom? At this point I'm so fed up of apps, need for network connection, etc, but it'd be nice to put the library on shuffle every now and then at CD quality.
Yea functionality can really change things, but these musings are really where the gold is at for this listener.
Hi John,i see you had MF Doom on your playlist now im wondering do you use equalizer/tone controls to tone down the bass or do you go the "audiophile" route and leave the sound as is?
About the hdmi functionality: so with a trigger and Rca-cables between the Node and the Audiolab, turning on my TV would also turn on the sound through the Audiolab (when in power amp mode)? 🙏
And are there any lag/lip sync issues?
Without bringing the play fi app in this topic
Do the audiolab 6000N sound better than volumio primo hifi edition using rca2rca.
About the play fi is some of the bugs fixed with latest 8.3 version update
Can You compare 6000a with Marantz Model 40n?
Using digital out on Sonos Port and Wiim mini to stream Qobuz both excellent. I am surprised DTS get away with their product or make any money