I’ve read about the Nevermore devices but haven’t seen any real data on how effective they are ? Like actual particle measure testing on how effective they are. Looks like a great machine
I had a 500 VCore 4 in my early bird cart, but waited until I could see one in action. Now it is gone, but am glad to see your video. I have a 500 and a 400 Vcore 3 and what I can see there will be no way to upgrade them to the Vcore 4 - everything has changed. It looks like they addressed all of the weaknesses in the 3 and made the changes in the 4. Looks like a good machine, I agree that the BTT Kraken would be a good replacement for the Octopus for just a little extra. It would be a good option and should be included in the new version of RatOS
Absolutely awesome content, thanks Nero! I’m super excited to get my early bird 500mm hybrid kit delivered and I can’t wait for the IDEX kit to be officially released.
This printers are becoming just too expensive, 1600€ for a kit? Not worth it imho, there are plenty of commercial printers at that price point that do 99% of what this one does
I'm not sure how i feel about the hybrid system. I love the concept but... belt tension. Corexy accuracy is already easily effected by belt tension. Adding the y axis helper system only creates more opportunities for belt tension to cause issues. I give this squinty eyes for now, just have to see what users report.
That V Core 4 is looking hot. I wonder what chamber temps it can hold reasonably, because while no tool changer, with that IDEX setup, I could see that being a really nice printer solution maybe slapping on an ercf for multi color and then your special material on the other extruder.
All electronics (except motors and potentially toolboard, obviously) are outside in the box presented in the video. You may want to skip the toolboard when going for 80-100C (or look for one made for those operating temperatures). You also want to upgrade to gates EPDM belts, otherwise you should be good to go :)
@@vim55k The V-Core 4 is a highly modifiable DIY printer, you can do whatever you want with it. Toolboard or no toolboard, RatOS doesn't care, neither does the toolhead :)
@@miklschmidt thanks. Good to know. Is it even possible without the toolboard?? I liked that v4 fullfilles most of the wishes including that fast new probe. Would prefer to tinker less.
I got my eye on ratrig, Im not sure if I'm going to get one juat yet. I got distracted by the 2 "nerf" blasters in the other booth in the background. Looks like an orion lynx and a Captain slug caliburn. It's hard to tell, though.
I had the early bird special in my cart a 500 cube with almost all of the options and it was right at $2000 from the American store. I did not pull the trigger and is now out of stock, I waited too long, but wanted to see a video of it in action.
Most of these types of printers are enclosed well enough where you putting out enough heat from a mains bed to get the chamber plenty warm enough to print anything but the higher end engineering plastics like PEEK/PEKK/ULTEM etc an additional chamber heater isnt really needed for the majority of use cases
You see them sold as a feature on some off the shelf printers like Bambu and Qidi machines. But those are mostly to make up for the fact the printer enclosures are quite thin and full of holes so they leak a ton of heat
@@CanuckCreator true. I guess I would like to see both highly insulated chambers and the active heater :D that is what I'm currently doing with my machine, hopefully it will work well.
@@riba2233 In addition to what he just wrote. VC3/4 also uses mains powered bed heaters, 600W/1000W/1500W for the 3 sizes. Thats really a lot of heat you get passively vs the often 24V beds that some of those printers with active heaters have. And yes, the VC4 is sealed pretty well, helps to easily have chamber temps for ABS etc.
A 500 size machine was ~2000USD shipped. Depends a lot on what you pick (CoreXY, Hybrid, IDEX) and what you might already have. ~1200 to 2000€ from 300 size to 500 size
No it does not. It uses the RatRig Toolhead. There was already a beta for that for 3.1. VC4 uses a changed version (that still shares the same base plate of the 3.1 beta toolhead)
Definitely liking the upgrades they've brought to the table. Sure hope one can get panels with the kits this go-around, as that was something there was a lot of contention about in the past.
They're still not shipping the panels, those are self sourced. Reason being it's a shipping nightmare. HOWEVER! Panels are now rectangular and just needs a few holes drilled with a jig, so much cheaper and easy to self source locally!
Like Helge said, when we saw what the Voron boys were cooking it just motivated us even more, i'm sure it works both ways. Very curious about what you guys are gonna do as far as software goes @CanuckCreator. Helge and me have been working on solving and working around all the inherent issues in the klipper IDEX implementation, slicing, macros, calibration etc etc. It wasn't easy, but we're both very proud of the result!
It could, easily BUT Then when your running IDEX, toolheads cant occupy the same space cus ya know....solid objects, so you still waste that portion of the bed. SO best to just not use a bed that large and spec a bed thats both toolheads can utilize (same reason theres free room at the back for the nozzle alignment camera
It's not really AWD, as the extra motors just apply to the Y axis. From my understanding, it's basically a second motion system only moving the Y axis added on top. Since the Y axis has to move the whole X gantry, it can't accelerate as fast as X. The extra motors for Y should bring its acceleration closer to X and use more of the potential.
@@ThomasS17 Yes that's quite a refreshing approach. I hope Nero does a technical breakdown of this and explain how effective this additional speed can be, maybe as compared to an AWD system
@@efboiz5302 Correct indeed, spacious to do lots of fun stuff :) Active heater, internal spools, internal MMU (stay tuned), filter systems, side air curtains, stowable tools, etc :)
Electronics are still in the back (outside printer enclosure) and the Electronics enclosure is included in the kit. Stepper motors are still outside, at the bottom bellow the steel plate (plate is included in the kit) The stepper motors, that you see inside are Nema 17 HT - that are specifically designed to work in a High Temperature environment!
This will be my next printer
I missed the early bird sale by a couple days. :(
Great vid. Looks like a major update the Vcore. Thanks for going to RMRRF and making these great videos for all us armchair printer geeks.
I’ve read about the Nevermore devices but haven’t seen any real data on how effective they are ? Like actual particle measure testing on how effective they are. Looks like a great machine
It's for VOCs, not particulates.
V-Core 4 looks great. Love the advancements.
its soo awesome, definitely on my list of future 3d printers
Was contemplating a Voron but….
Anyway, why not use eddy currents instead of a probe?
Putting bigger rails on the z axis is like putting a class five hitch on a ford Maverick. Neat printer though.
Definitely going to need the 500x500 version!! 😮
really concentrated vidéo, love that! thanks
I can’t wait to get it! This week lead time should be announced! I hope so
it's great but kinda pricey
The video quality seems to have undergone an upgrade. New piece of kit?
Swapped out from using the gopro hero10 as my "event coverage camera" to a DJI pocket osmo 3
Larger and better image sensor + Built in gimbal
@@CanuckCreator Very NICE!
Having a truely built in IDEX printer with camera alignment, metal brakcets, etc. Such a good update
I had a 500 VCore 4 in my early bird cart, but waited until I could see one in action. Now it is gone, but am glad to see your video. I have a 500 and a 400 Vcore 3 and what I can see there will be no way to upgrade them to the Vcore 4 - everything has changed. It looks like they addressed all of the weaknesses in the 3 and made the changes in the 4. Looks like a good machine, I agree that the BTT Kraken would be a good replacement for the Octopus for just a little extra. It would be a good option and should be included in the new version of RatOS
That is a damn fine printer!
2:03 small correction, its a steel plate
Solid
@@CanuckCreator Heavy
@@miklschmidtwould you say, chonky, even .. ?
@@travistucker7317 megachonk
Those Y-assist motors are intriguing
Absolutely awesome content, thanks Nero! I’m super excited to get my early bird 500mm hybrid kit delivered and I can’t wait for the IDEX kit to be officially released.
I pre-ordered the 500. Excited to upgrade it to the idex
Got my early bird pre-order for the 400 in queue.
Looks cool, already have 4 printers 😂 still can’t resist it’s awesomeness ❤.
This printers are becoming just too expensive, 1600€ for a kit? Not worth it imho, there are plenty of commercial printers at that price point that do 99% of what this one does
K
These printers always look bloody awesome. This one is no exception.
I want to go to there.
I'm not sure how i feel about the hybrid system. I love the concept but... belt tension. Corexy accuracy is already easily effected by belt tension. Adding the y axis helper system only creates more opportunities for belt tension to cause issues. I give this squinty eyes for now, just have to see what users report.
With price almost like 2 Bambu lab p1p or p1s. :D
rat rig 4 300 mm 1200 euro + VAT
From rat rig facebook
Standard Mode (CoreXY)
Size 300 - 1200+VAT
Size 400 - 1350+VAT
Size 500 - 1500+VAT
Performance Mode (Hybrid Core XY)
Size 300 - 1300+VAT
Size 400 - 1450+VAT
Size 500 - 1600+VAT
Base or idex?
@@UNVIRUSLETALE the most basic. It was written on Facebook.
@@Pasha4ur not + VAT. That’s including VAT. Also a weird comparison.
That V Core 4 is looking hot. I wonder what chamber temps it can hold reasonably, because while no tool changer, with that IDEX setup, I could see that being a really nice printer solution maybe slapping on an ercf for multi color and then your special material on the other extruder.
Great video and you asked all the right questions. The 500 MM version is calling my name, I can hear it.... :)
It uses LDO HT motors (180c) (on the website). I hope that all the electronics is outside.
Then maybe possible heated chamber like 80c-100c?
All electronics (except motors and potentially toolboard, obviously) are outside in the box presented in the video. You may want to skip the toolboard when going for 80-100C (or look for one made for those operating temperatures). You also want to upgrade to gates EPDM belts, otherwise you should be good to go :)
@@miklschmidt thanks. Ok, belts - good to know.
The toolboard is what I was afraid of. What do you mean - skip it? Isn't it is in the toolhead?
@@vim55k The V-Core 4 is a highly modifiable DIY printer, you can do whatever you want with it. Toolboard or no toolboard, RatOS doesn't care, neither does the toolhead :)
@@miklschmidt thanks. Good to know.
Is it even possible without the toolboard??
I liked that v4 fullfilles most of the wishes including that fast new probe. Would prefer to tinker less.
@@vim55k Oh yes, hybrid needs 8 drivers including the extruder, so works on an octopus, which coincidentally ships with the default kit :)
I got my eye on ratrig, Im not sure if I'm going to get one juat yet. I got distracted by the 2 "nerf" blasters in the other booth in the background. Looks like an orion lynx and a Captain slug caliburn. It's hard to tell, though.
Cost?
I had the early bird special in my cart a 500 cube with almost all of the options and it was right at $2000 from the American store. I did not pull the trigger and is now out of stock, I waited too long, but wanted to see a video of it in action.
Waiting for the release of CAD files to me outsource in Brazil!!! Already have a vcore 3.1
ratrig is giving me old time "Prusa" vibes lately.
very nice video, very informative first look at the V-core 4
also nice Rat Rig hat. Voron hat when?
Any idea on pricing? Especially on the idex version?
500x500 sounds like a massive machine.....I want one.
Just can't wait. And thanks for revealing a more or less date.
still no chamber heater as standard...
Most of these types of printers are enclosed well enough where you putting out enough heat from a mains bed to get the chamber plenty warm enough to print anything but the higher end engineering plastics like PEEK/PEKK/ULTEM etc
an additional chamber heater isnt really needed for the majority of use cases
@@CanuckCreator ok, thanks for the answer!
You see them sold as a feature on some off the shelf printers like Bambu and Qidi machines. But those are mostly to make up for the fact the printer enclosures are quite thin and full of holes so they leak a ton of heat
@@CanuckCreator true. I guess I would like to see both highly insulated chambers and the active heater :D that is what I'm currently doing with my machine, hopefully it will work well.
@@riba2233 In addition to what he just wrote.
VC3/4 also uses mains powered bed heaters, 600W/1000W/1500W for the 3 sizes.
Thats really a lot of heat you get passively vs the often 24V beds that some of those printers with active heaters have.
And yes, the VC4 is sealed pretty well, helps to easily have chamber temps for ABS etc.
The spec on the website - it is just maxed out!
price ? are we talking in thousands or hundreds...
Likely in between; 1200 to 1500 euros would be my guess.
1900
@@SentientTeapot2444 Early bird price was higher than that iirc. I think the base 400mm was about 1600.
A 500 size machine was ~2000USD shipped.
Depends a lot on what you pick (CoreXY, Hybrid, IDEX) and what you might already have.
~1200 to 2000€ from 300 size to 500 size
Early bird price for a 400 with basic options like a pi was $1800
Sharp looking machine.
looks like a cracking machine
Anyone know if it uses the EVA carriage assembly? It looks like it but wanted to confirm.
No it does not. It uses the RatRig Toolhead. There was already a beta for that for 3.1.
VC4 uses a changed version (that still shares the same base plate of the 3.1 beta toolhead)
Definitely liking the upgrades they've brought to the table. Sure hope one can get panels with the kits this go-around, as that was something there was a lot of contention about in the past.
They're still not shipping the panels, those are self sourced. Reason being it's a shipping nightmare. HOWEVER! Panels are now rectangular and just needs a few holes drilled with a jig, so much cheaper and easy to self source locally!
Yet another reason why Voron should give up on the Phoenix 😅
nah
we need both printers, one is pushing the other
Like Helge said, when we saw what the Voron boys were cooking it just motivated us even more, i'm sure it works both ways. Very curious about what you guys are gonna do as far as software goes @CanuckCreator. Helge and me have been working on solving and working around all the inherent issues in the klipper IDEX implementation, slicing, macros, calibration etc etc. It wasn't easy, but we're both very proud of the result!
Does that look like the build plate could be at lest 50mm wider?
It could, easily
BUT
Then when your running IDEX, toolheads cant occupy the same space cus ya know....solid objects, so you still waste that portion of the bed.
SO
best to just not use a bed that large and spec a bed thats both toolheads can utilize (same reason theres free room at the back for the nozzle alignment camera
Does that mean it's AWD now? Why does he say that the quad motors help only Y acceleration? Not X too?
It's not really AWD, as the extra motors just apply to the Y axis. From my understanding, it's basically a second motion system only moving the Y axis added on top. Since the Y axis has to move the whole X gantry, it can't accelerate as fast as X. The extra motors for Y should bring its acceleration closer to X and use more of the potential.
@@ThomasS17 Yes that's quite a refreshing approach. I hope Nero does a technical breakdown of this and explain how effective this additional speed can be, maybe as compared to an AWD system
I wish LDO or someone would offer these prebuilt as well as the kit. I would love one of these, but I do not have the time to build it.
There are a few retailers that will build one for you. I believe Portachiavi in Spain offer such a service.
Fabreeko too. I think even RatRig themselves will build one. Obviously all come with a price tag
Small build plate given the machine size
You need the extra room for IDEX and the offset adjustment camera
Also leaves room for the spool too and the nozzle wipers
To put second spool inside as well?
Thought on the website it showed it could handle up to four spools
@@efboiz5302 Indeed
@@efboiz5302 Correct indeed, spacious to do lots of fun stuff :) Active heater, internal spools, internal MMU (stay tuned), filter systems, side air curtains, stowable tools, etc :)
Does anybody have info on the plastics used in the chamber? Is it petg or abs/asa?
It's all abs
I don’t like it. 3x was better with back electronics and stepper motor’s outside the box
Electronics are still in the back (outside printer enclosure) and the Electronics enclosure is included in the kit.
Stepper motors are still outside, at the bottom bellow the steel plate (plate is included in the kit)
The stepper motors, that you see inside are Nema 17 HT - that are specifically designed to work in a High Temperature environment!