Man, this killed me. Normally the callers are the dumbest assholes ever but this poor woman sounds like a kind, decent person who was lied to all her life.
Sounds like a decent person until you start talking about what should or should not be taught in schools, separation of church and state, and government in general.
There a huge difference in the way you both talked to this woman than many of your other callers. It's because she was honest, and wasn't trying to use some verbal trick to make their point.
These clips always make me love the people on this show. That they can turn on a dime from the fire-and-brimstone approach to absolute sincerity when they're talking to someone who genuinely wants to understand is incredible.
since I've been watching these vids, the one thing I can say is....most of the time I feel the hosts treat the callers accordingly. When the callers are respectful....they are treated respectfully for the most part. When the callers are petulant, or straight up know-it-all types who can't form a thought in reality....or they are trying to split hairs in order to make one of those "You don't know, therefore you are wrong...but when I don't know I can just say I have faith & that faith makes me less wrong somehow." arguments. It's always funny to watch stupid being stupid....because it doesn't know it's stupid.
@eric sosa I recommend not assuming the motivations of groups to which you don't belong. Atheists don't believe for any number of reasons, but the most commonly mentioned one is "there is insufficient evidence for the god claim." And it seems weird to say "that's what they do" in an accusatory manor when posting in a comment chain about how wholesome these two were. I WISH every atheist approached situations of genuine interest like this.
@eric sosa: "Why do you assume that I believe in God?" Because you made arguments against atheists and in support of theism, as well as going on and on about how you think God is OK with being gay. "It's called having an open mind and knowing that I don't have all the answers!" We aren't the ones pretending to know whether or not a god exists. Atheists tend to be agnostic. "You are desperately looking for people in the comments to just simply agree with you!" Not at all. If I was just desperate for agreement, I'd go to /r/atheism or something. "Are you people that boring that you congregate and talk about something you don't believe in?" We talk about atheism because theists take actions that directly affect us based on their religion, and because religion fills certain roles in people's lives that we have to find solutions for in our own. If you can't understand why atheists would want to talk to other non-believers for help with, say, grieving, then you really haven't thought things over very much. "It is no secret that most of you are gay and think you're going to go to hell!" Oh god, please tell me you're not just super in the closet and projecting. If so, I'm so sorry for you, and I hope you learn to accept yourself. "Are you confused about your sexuality? You sound very confused! Don't be ashamed of who you are! Maybe your parents shunned you?" The fact that you'd read into my sexuality based on four sentences (I'm assuming you missed that that was my second comment here) shows exactly where your mind is. I'm perfectly fine with who I am, and so are my parents. I continue to worry about you though, this continues to sound like projection. "The other reason is your life is shity and you have to blame the non-existence of something, which makes absolutely no sense if you ask me!" A.) My life is fine. This just increases my concern about projection. And you're right! Things that don't exist can't be at fault for anything! But I never ascribe fault to god, for exactly that reason. See my first comment: "I recommend not assuming the motivations of groups to which you don't belong." "You should know this, this is the "group" you claim you belong to🤣 because you so desperately need to belong to something!" I really don't. I actually strongly dislike identity politics, and the whole concept of "us-vs-them." I merely concede that the term describes me. There's a reason I said I wish all atheists acted like these two guys: there are plenty of atheists that conduct themselves incredibly poorly (see: /r/atheism.) "Your so-called "non-believe" does not come from rational thought or critical thinking, it stems from a traumatic event!" [Citation needed] "It's funny though, someone making assumptions, telling someone else not to make assumptions!" I concluded something about you based on information you provided about yourself in the way that you conducted yourself. You assumed multiple things about entire groups of people based on sweet fuck all. To pretend the two are comparable is asinine. 2/10: Low effort drivel dripping with assumptions and projection. Not worth the effort of continued conversation. Blocked.
That woman is very brave. I'm an atheist and all but even if she didn't changed her mind on religion, she has my respect for having the courage to ask and listen to the other side. Edit: I'm no longer an atheist. You will not have any foreign god before me. You will not make any image of what's up in the skies, down on earth, or in the waters below the earth. Thou shalt not bow to them nor honor them, for I am thy Lord, the Creator, strong, jealous, who corrects the evil of father's on their children to the third and fourth generation of those who despise me; and I bring mercy in the thousands to those who love me and keep my commandments. You will not take the name of thy Lord, the Creator in vain, for the Lord won't take as innocent those who take his name in vain. You will remember the day of rest, there's six working days and you will make every task there, but the seventh day is for the Lord your Creator, thou shalt not do any single task then. You, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your servant, nor your maid, nor your beast, nor your foreigner whose habiting inside your gates. For the Lord the Creator in six days made the skies, the earth, and the seas, and everything that is in them, and the seventh day was of rest. Therefore the Creator blessed the day of the Sabbath and sanctified it. You will honor your father and your mother and you'll do well and live a long live in the land that the Lord your Creator has given you. You will not kill. You will not commit adultery. You will not steal. You will not speak false witness against your neighbor. You will not covet the house of your neighbor, nor his wife, nor his servant, nor his maid, nor his ox, nor his donkey, or anything that is of your neighbor.
Lavos2007 I understand is very dissapointing how this works, but religion is specially design to generate this kind of reactions on believers. Before I was an atheist I found the idea of atheism horrible an unnatural and feld guilty for even thinking about it. Creepy stuff, but real.
similar experience to me, but i felt far more guilty about keeping my religion, knowing tons of people both locally and abroad in the country were using it to sound all proper and justified while committing some of the worst atrocities, to me the hypocrisy was just too much and i decided i would be better off without that anchor hanging around my neck
brown boi, It was nice to see that despite her beliefs, she could could talk to and understand people outside of her religious comfort zone. Regardless of what path she takes from here, I think she'll be better off for being able to take in and expand her view of things. Good episode! If only more people were able to talk about their differences without becoming combative in defense of their beliefs. You don't have to be a convert to expand your views and understanding of other people.
its good when theists are open-minded and respectful, in fact if you want to see a real great clip from The Atheist Experience, there should be a vid here on youtube somewhere called "Gavin the Cool Christian" or something, its also likely titled "the atheist experience" but i cant remember exactly, and the title is pretty accurate, he was a person of faith, called in, but had no desire to fight or struggle, he called in to learn and simply ask questions and both sides treated each other well, but then again thats how it should be under ideal conditions where a person of faith is open-minded and not disrespectful i just wish more theists out there were like that, i feel it would benefit the world greatly if they were, as an atheist i merely want to live my life in peace and not be hated for my views, and to their credit, some christians are perfectly fine with that and they dont seek to impede me and many of them are also good friends but the friendship is there BECAUSE of mutual respect and tolerance, they dont demonize me and i dont demonize them, we even talk about religion occasionally and they dont have a problem with me whatsoever, but thats why it works
When she said that the catholic told her her sister would be in hell because she took her own life, my heart broke for her. What a cruel and evil thing to tell someone. I’ve never had an episode make me bawl, but I just wish I could hug this woman.
My aunt took her own life 11 months ago. I know it's cliché, but she genuinely was an extremely lovely person who spent her whole career helping homeless people and her personal life was filled with lots of love for her family. If there is a God that would send her to hell based on issues that he himself had caused, I'd rather be on the side of rebellion against such a God than worship them.
I was raised Catholic and told suicide is worse than murder. I was so outraged that I immediately asked whether they’d rather I jumped off the window or stabbed them dead on the spot. That shut them up real fast.
@@Nocturnalux I bet it did! Good for you calling them out on their BS particularly in what sounds like a really awful and painful time in your life. For what it’s worth, I’m glad you chose neither and are still with us today. I hope things got better for you.
@@katelynnehansen8115 Thanks! It was just such a terrible thing to say to anyone, really. Don't they consider how this can push some people over the edge? Suicide is something so many people contempate, at some points in their life- and the religious are responsible for plenty of that as well!- but homicide is not! And that they shut up, told me all I needed to know. They know it's obviously not worse. Or they had never given it any thought. Either way, these were people in a position of authority saying this to teenagers! Another pearl: I asked the religion class if I was expected to let myself die if I found myself pregnant and complications arose that would result in my and the fetus both dying unless an abortion was performed. And he said...yes!
As an atheist I think this might be the best call and caller ever on the atheist experience. The way they handled the subject so tenderly, with such care and class was amazing viewing. As for the caller the lady was listening and extremely honest about her feelings. It was heartbreaking. I hope she finds the peace her caring attitude deserves.
My EXACT thoughts. It is the best call I've ever heard on this channel. Her innocent surprise at some of the things they explained made *my* eyes moist.
More like shes a middle aged baby with emotional instability so they had to go easy on her to the point of not arguying at all and console her the whole time.
Since you're an Athiest I recommend you join a Satanist group in your area. The Satanist groups are essentially atheist trolling Christians; Putting up Baphomet statues outside of Ten Commandments on gov't grounds and etc. Peaceful trolling.
But God is never the one to blame for our pain, but rather the sovereign one to whom we turn for help. the first human beings turned their backs on God and the amazing life he was offering them. As a result, all people sin and fall short of God's glory. That’s how death, pain, evil, and loneliness became part of our human existence. much of the evil in the universe is due to the direct choice of individuals. Evil came as a result of humanity's choice. Natural disasters are a result of humanity's original sin. When sin entered the universe everything was affected. Suffering and evil go together. The Bible says that the entire creation is now suffering. Therefore God cannot be blamed for the evil that continues. Humanity is directly or indirectly responsible for evil. but Jesus came to bring us back to life. On the cross, the Son of God died for us. He paid full price for all our rebellion and defeated evil. Then he proved it by coming back to life forever. Now he offers full, true, eternal life to anyone who’s willing to trust in him and in what he did for us. It’s a free gift . John 10:10 "I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full."
Ladies and gentlemen: exhibit A on the kindness the hosts show when the callers are honest and willing to talk and listen. I hope the caller is doing well.
seconds that....this is actually a decent example of how a actual conversation plays out when all parties involved are intellectually honest ,even when having wildly different positions so to speak. like me and other relatives ouerselfs said about loses in the family tree.... they hade a full long life and a gentle end to it ,and the last thing they want be for uss to waste the rest of ouer lifes obsessive about them not sharing it with uss.
Not all atheists are angry nutjobs going around flashing/saying Satan is wonderful nonsense. These guys I can dig, though some of their information is off. They should look into what Stuart Hameroff is doing.
@@biblebadcopycatofcuneiform8210 not all ? XD first if its the satan temple last i heard they werent doing anything worse then the local christians over there in nutjobb bible belt ;) for the rest... leets say i meet far more religious people trying to 'flash' ther religion into things for no reason then atheists ...i dont know ,trying to force a hobby on others ^^ who's this 'Stuart hameroff' though and how doess he relate to what they said in this one ?
Finally a completely honest theist, asking a completely honest question, AND listening to the answer. Great job both of you guys in your empathetic response.
Hear Hear! These guys are totally respectful to people who haven't found the real truth yet... it is SO HARD to let go of something you've always been told was true... Thank you!
@@DarkaDusty Yes, the devil (Satan) is a liar and the father of lies. He has so many souls believing that there is no God/Jesus Christ. People believing what they have been told by other people who don't know the truth (Jesus Christ).
Yeah, considering the number of crazy people, morons and jerks that call into this show (especially in the UA-cam clips), it’s nice to see a sincere discussion for once, even if the crazy people are funny.
@@KnakuanaRka The blood that Christ Jesus shed on the cross is the only thing that can take away our sin/sinful condition and enlighten our souls (change our minds) and give us life - eternal life - the capability of knowing him (Spirit to spirit). No religion needed. Just faith, faith plus nothing. No man is justified by being religious - Justification is by grace through faith alone.
I was diagnosed with Stage-IV cancer and told maybe 6 months. I did the chemo/radiation thing and I am still here (5 years now) I have had many people say I should thank God for saving me. My response is always "If there was a God I would not thank him for saving me, I would ask why the fuck you gave me cancer in the first place"? What did I and my family do to deserve that?
Who said God gave you cancer ? Lol, everything has a causality, maybe avoid stuff that give humans cancer, foods and enviroments and so on and so on. It says about the "God" you are talking about, created humans in his own Image, and gave them total domination over the Earth and to live there and create what ever they want. Well everything in reality creates action & reaction. We create so mutch shit and then we suffer and get sick by it, thats why we are maybe sinners, to sin from hebrew just means = To miss the goal litteraly. What is the goal ? To live healthy and not smoke and drink and not to get hateful and create light in your soul to become happy and love and create good enviroment and so on and so on and yada yanda. Free will creates all kinda errors/sins and consequences but also many positive things.
@@el29 free will is an illusion and you were almost there. Sun gives us skin cancer, and yet we need it to live. If there is a creator, they set it up this way. You love to shift the responsibility away from them yet you are listing causes we have no control over as our responsibility. Even down to smoking a cigarette and getting cancer is not in your control. Mammals who are larger than us have significantly lower to no cancer rates. Why would a creator set up the reality where smaller mammals have higher chances of cancer and lower chances of surviving it as well.
@@cqproton Wtf. I wrote a fucking essay to you for 2 days ago to explain the nuances from my view but apperently tadaa its not even here. Well i cant even bother to do it again lol. Well i disagree, from so many causalitie perspectives but have a good day. But i understand anyway, because when i was 14 years old philosopher i was a radical determinist causalitie person that did not belive in free will either, now i realise its limited concepts from the start and pre premisses that was limitating but anyhow but i dont share the same stance today. Its more complicated. But heey everybody want there simplified ideologies to make sence of the complex intercausality network of the realitys hologram that manifests infront of your mind. And when it comes to your God arguments, well those i wrote alot about to why they didnt hold but anyways, what ever. Have a good day =)
@@el29 Do you understand the basics of cancer? Do you know just how many factors contribute to cancerous mutations in your DNA? By your logic, I should avoid the sun and pretty much any object or place where microorganisms can thrive. Educate yourself.
People like Manda are the reason I stopped arguing religion with people years ago. She's not argumentative or superior. She appears to be a good person who's just been raised with some bad beliefs, and as the gentlemen stated, a lack of tools. I got no pleasure from discussing religion with people like her because it felt like I was trying to take away the only real source of comfort they had. While I strongly believe religion is dangerous, not all religious people are dangerous.
What angers me is that she obviously never had any secular source presented to her. The discussion shakes her beliefs as if she was told all of this for the first time. You can't help but wonder how this is possible without a serious lack of education.
Artimus Clydefrog varies from person to person. If she finds fulfilment in religion, why not let her be? Its ignorance to want to bash religious people because you look down on them.
@Quincy Breed atheists don't hate god. How can you hate something that you don't believe exists? Do you hate the "aliens that abduct people?" No because they are not real. Just like your God is more than likely not real.
@Quincy Breed there is a fallacy here in your B.S. lol, are you telling people what they truly feel? We talk about it because for thousands of years religion has not done humanity any good. It stunts critical thinking. Promotes tribalism, an "us vs them" mentality, you can't question anything, In the bible it promotes slavery, killing of atheist and anyone of other religions, kidnapping, rape, abortion, murder and genocide. It's not your made up god that we dislike it's the book that you blindly follow, only read the good parts (cherry picking) while ignoring the bad parts. Somehow it's OK to rip babies out of the stomachs of pregnant women, kill male children, keeping the virgins for yourselves, "happy is he who bashes the little ones against the rocks." So killing children is a form of happiness? In No Context is It OK To murder children And people just because they believe something different. Lucky the bible is a bunch of made up stories so I'm glad most of this didn't happen. When slavery was a thing they used the bible to try and rectify that they enslaved someone. Two last questions, 1. how can someone hate something that has never effected reality? 2. What are the commandments that were put in the ark? Hint, it's in exodus 34 not 32 they get smashed in exodus 32.
@Quincy Breed wait you insult me and demean me with insults and I'm the hateful one? Hypocrisy be thy name. No, it promotes slavery and even beating your slaves as long as they don't die within a couple of days. All of what you said was bull shit. This will be a lot of posts because you said a lot of stupid in just one comment.
@Quincy Breed "the other way around" Is that why in th e bible it says to "never question the lord?" Wait that is stunting critical thinking AND questioning anything.
You may not see them again, but remember that in the case of your family they are a part of you, they are part of what made you who you are and what you become, certainly the influence of your mum, dad and grandparents form a part of what you have grown into.
This UA-cam Channel is therapeutic for me because even, at age 70; I still suffer from the harsh upbringing that I endured in Christian Fundamentalism. I can't stand being in church, anymore, or being around people who want to persuade me to "give my heart to Jesus." It grows so old and tiresome.
I can tell you have a great mind. As a 15 year old...I ask of you for some advice on life. I read a lot of philosophical, and logic books. I’m not very great in school, because I want to do bigger things. I would say I have quite a good head on my shoulders, but that’s not really for me to determine. I want to grow up to be a real intellectual, with logical thoughts, and reasoning. What would your life advice be to me?
@@ZebbyCakes My "life advice" would be for you to place a severe limit on how much you allow other people to influence your decisions. That is because in the long run, you alone must live with the long-term consequence of taking anybody's advice, even long after the person who gave you their advice is gone.
I am much younger than you, only 19, but I feel much of what you are saying. Growing up under a religious structure and a strict household, I fully bought into the ideas that were taught to me, one of which includes the idea of original sin. Now I don't know if you have had the same experience, but this idea was probably the most damaging in my life, not while I was a Christian, but once I began to doubt my faith and eventually stopped believing. Once my "salvation" was gone, all that I thought was left in myself was evil and brokenness. Even now I find it difficult to shake the teachings that I was born evil and must be redeemed. I have felt unloveable, broken, and irreparable for only a fraction of my life, and I cannot imagine what it must feel like to have that feeling or a similar one linger for my whole life. In a book I read about religious fundamentalism, it says that the five main phases of recovery from this are separation, confusion, avoidance, feeling, and rebuilding. I only hope to rebuild one day and reclaim what was taken from me in my childhood. I know this was a bit long and rambling, but it's cathartic for me to express this at the moment, and it feels good to come across those who may understand my perspective while I'm still surrounded by those who look down on me from their faith. I sincerely hope you are doing well and rebuilding your own world. Thank you.
@@ZebbyCakes Choppy my advice would be, read a lot, follow your heart, we all know what's right and wrong we have learnt this through evolution in our genes, education read whatever interests you, and always be be nice to people and animals
@@chrispysaid it was. And it was still tame in comparison. And it was still what? 5 seconds out of over 1600 seconds? If someone is 'aggressive' .3% of the time, they're dealing with you, it's weird to prop it up like it's significant.
@@Chance57 This sounds like something an abuse victim would say, frankly. Matt's abusive speech is utterly unnecessary in most cases, but he defaults to it because of his short fuse. Maybe he's fully aware of it and has just given up trying to control it, maybe he's completely unaware and thinks it's not so bad (which is what I lean towards, given how often he complaints about being interrupted yet CONSTANTLY interrupts people who are just trying to explain their perspective). He's a good skeptical thinker, but the way the guy engages in dialogue is utterly shameful.
@@chrispysaid As someone who has heard and watched TAX for a long time and that is why I have also seen several videos of Matt, at first when they just started the program they did not stop the guys who called, and many times a single idiot out of pure soligism and fallacies that he never recognized and interruptions he sucked up the entire hour that the program lasts and there was no more time for other calls, so that's why Matt is like this, first because after so many years he is tired of listening to so many idiots always saying the same things and second because if it were not so, many take advantage and use the entire hour of the program to preach without ever getting anywhere.
One of the best call ever. I listened to it 5 years ago and stumble on it today and re-listened again to the whole conversation. Manda, your sister is living on:... you shared your experience with us and we all know about her now. She, in a way, changed us a tiny bit because we know of her (and you). This is how I think we live forever by affecting (in a good way) the people around us. (And I just noticed the number of views... (1.5M as of March 2023) A lot of people got to know a bit of you and your sister !)
Yeah, indeed. She was very polite, did not get altered in any way and she was able to listen very well (except once that Matthew had to intervene, but that's fine).
I thought she did extremely well considering how much her entire worldview was being challenged. Unlike some of the idiots who call into this show, she revealed herself to be an intelligent and reasonable person. She actually listened.
I became an atheist almost three years ago after 25+ years as a Christian. In January this year, my 11-year-old niece died from multiple complications originated from a brain tumor. She was 2 years old when the tumor was disovered, only a few days after my sister and her husband adopted her from an orphanage. While she had periods of health and was a right sunbeam, a little fighter if ever there was one, eventually, the complications from the cancer robbed her of one ability after another and she lived a life of pain and constant struggles. My sister and her husband lived a life of constant fear for her life. When my niece died, I had been an atheist for two years and her death did not make me a believer again, not for a single second. I had no need for a god of any kind to deal with my loss and grief and I am in fact grateful I wasn't a theist at that time specifically, because it would only have clouded my grief process and acceptance. I grieve that I will not, according to the knowledge available to us, ever see her again, yes. But I grieve her loss of life more. I grieve that she didn't have a better life here on Earth and I grieve that my sister and her husband struggled so much to even become parents and then, when it finally happened, their beloved child had a severe illness that slowly killed her, little by little over several years. There is no way any god can rationalise that as their divine will and has me accept, respect or bow to that. IF there is a god who could have prevented this, but didn't want to because of some twisted mind games about sin, it will only mean that I acknowledge that god's existence, but in no way, shape or form, will I be able to worship, trust or love them. Becoming an atheist, if anything, has given me peace. I hope this poor, brave woman finds a healthy way of dealing with her pain.
He (God/Jesus Christ) who bestows the oil of joy instead of mourning gives us hope in the midst of the darkest situations. Atheists only offer death, God/Jesus Christ offers life. The free gift of God (eternal life - to know him). The days are evil, and people want more than what an atheist can give them. Faith, hope and love.
@@paulgemme6056 Atheists do not ''offer death". Death exists whether anyone likes it or not. What atheism offers (among other things) is a mental perspective that places more value on actually existing life than on an imaginary afterlife. Neither Jesus Christ, nor any other character from religious stories, can offer life after death because to do so is to offer, like a snake oil salesman, a false promise, and to devalue existing life. Indeed, the belief in a heaven after death is probably destructive to existing life. Why? Because if people believe that there is an escape (in the form of a ''heaven") from the destruction of planet Earth's ecosystems from pollution, global warming, and nuclear war, then they will be less likely to fight against it. But atheists know there is no escape. Earth is the only home that we and our descendants will ever know. Therefore it must be protected. And the protection of Earth's ecosystems should give our lives purpose. Humans should see their purpose as protectors of the planet, not as "spiritual beings" who are magically exempt from the consequences of its destruction. P.S. What is ''the oil of joy"? A sexual lubricant?
@@paulgemme6056 If you would like to contact me please reply as I have a scheme to make a million dollars a week for an investment of 1000 dollars. Do you believe that?
@@paulgemme6056 BS, atheists offer a life that is the only sure thing in this world, you have to live it to the fullest and love the people closest to you, not place faith in an invisible god! I just hope you're not one who thinks you need to oppress others with your opinions. There is no hate like religious "love"
@@robertl4824 There is no love like God's/Jesus Christ's unconditional, unfailing. everlasting, perfect love. Jesus Christ/God loves the unlovable. Can you and I do that? Would you and I love the men that are whipping our backs and spitting in our face. Would you and I say Father forgive them for they know not what they are doing. I don't think so! That's what Christ Jesus did for us. Died for the sin of the whole world. Nothing but Glory, honor and Praise should be given to his Holy name. No religion needed. Just faith, faith plus nothing.
Can we please get a Manda update somehow? This woman broke my heart back when I originally watched this and is once again as I am right now. I genuinely hope she is doing better ❤
wow that caller has such a lovely nature. being presented with a logical worldview that throws her own into turmoil, and yet accepting the information with strength, grace and even humour. wonderful person.
She can be a nice person, and very stupid in this topic(Religion, gods etc.), because she should not believe at the first place in bullshit like that. My mother same thing, she believe in fucking bullshit, "nice" people tend to believe in bullshit, they are naive sometimes.
@Quincy Breed And your god will be cool with you insulting others and being proud and cheerful about believing someone will be tortured for all eternity? What a coincidence, it's almost as if your god is malleable to your own personal traits! But luckily you were just created in its image, right? 🙄
@Quincy Breed Aha, the problem is *you* think its real,not that someone thinks an imaginary thing is displeased. Well, like most people against religion make the mistake of comparing a diestic creator to a religious diety. Convenient for you that they're the same thing yet nothing alike.
@Quincy Breed Yeah, I know those were his words, so I added the diestic creator vs religious diety to flesh out what I meant by your concept of god being the problem, not the poking of religious drivel. "God" does not exist outside our desires. Keep dreaming. Also also, you can't have god without everything attributed/believed about him and get to pick what people think about him. You're saying we can't disagree with fictional characters unless we believe they're real.
That’s probably the most evil false promise you could make to someone. “Oh, you wanna see your dead daddy again? Just give our church money and do everything we say! Don’t worry, Jesus will put you with them after death!”
@@dryfox11 I mean, yeah that specific kind of promise coming from organized religion is awful, but I don't think the concept of an afterlife is inherently wrong.
Thats what makes life beautiful and precious. Once you realise the true value of time, you will endeavour to spend it wisely with family, friends and things that make you happy, instead of waiting for death to start living in an imaginary paradise.
I like this, I like this a lot. Christians and Atheists *politely* debating and discussing Edit: Most of you got the point but some of you missed it entirely. No one has all of the answers, this includes my fellow atheists, and until you can enter a discussion without acting like an all knowing, all seeing entity(lol) you won't learn anything.
I lost both of my parents to cancer. As an atheist, I never thought I'd be reunited with them, and because of that I made sure that I made the most of the time I had with them. I took care of my mom in her last days, and that was a privilege for me, rather than thinking I'd see her again some day. This is one of AXP's best moments. It brought a tear to my eye. Well done, gentlemen.
As a fellow human being, I am proud of u sir . In a time where people look for old age homes to dump their parents in , you proved God/religion isn't the source of morality. Well lived !
I understand you Scott, I saw my dad waste away from lung cancer, a loving father who lived a blameless life. Where was a "loving" god involved in these cases? Have a nice life Scott ,you are a decent man.
This is heartbreaking. It's also a perfect demonstration for the kind of damage religion can do on an individual level. This poor lady has been left with no real coping mechanism for her trauma and nothing but false hope to fall back on.
Gener🇦lly sp🇪aking p🇪ople hav🇪 be🇪n r🇪moved from th🇪ir tru🇪 roots by thre🇪 main r🇪ligions on this 🇪arth. Jud🇦ism, Isl🇦m and Christi🇦nity are the tools that 🇦re b🇪ing us🇪d so no one has any re🇪l spiritu🇦l pow🇪r or knowl🇪dge ex🇪cpt for a sel🇪ct f🇪w at the top. remove the $ sign: exposing$christianity$.com
That goes for so many Christians, like me! 😢. I keep/kept trying to believe! Through so much trauma, I needed help so I searched God. But I am a studier and I kept reading and studying the Bible! Every time that led me to conclude that it's false! A fairy tail! I listen to apologists and I usually side with the atheists even when I was a Christian. I had to stop listening to maintain my faith but I studied extensively in all avenues and it consistently led and leads me to believe that there is no God of the Bible because that God orders rapes, murders, has slaves etc and the only people that seem to make sense are the atheists or the mystical Christians who have a different method of belief other than the Bible. but I still can't find myself a place.
So much respect for Manda. This is easily one of the most constructive calls on the show, or at least the modern UA-cam show. Love those “lost episodes” too though!
He "loses" the person when they realize there's more to apologetics then the basic defenses taught in high school. Manda didn't really realize she was on a discussion show and basically just wanted to lash out at something for making her doubt whether or not she was going to be eternally reunited with her relatives. I'm curious to hear what you think constitutes Matt's word of the day calendar.
@@movietimeateds69 I agree with what he says about the deservice religion does by promising to meet those you lose in an afterlife. Treat everyone like you may never see them again, because you may not. I tell my wife and kids I love them every time I leave the house because you never know. I never stay mad at anyone, because again you may never know. You could step out your front door and get hit by a falling tree branch and if religion is wrong then that's it. My step father fought off cancer for 15 years and was in remission. Then on one random check up was told the cancer was back, there was nothing they could do, and he was dead 3 days later (most of which he was a chemically induced coma because he went down hill so fast). Enjoy your life, love and forgive those around you, treat your existence like it's all you have. Because maybe, probably, it is.
She's not too bright though. I don't have an explanation so there must be God? Atheist is a person who doesn't believe in God? So 2 billion Chinese and Indians having other religions and not believing in God are atheists?? It seems that religion is for below average IQ people.
@@bryonmyers1058 As opposed to open minded societies such as those in the middle east, right? I wonder how a gay person would fair there. Or a woman. Or an apostate. Do you think Matt could be doing this show in Egypt? Or Iran? Or Saudi Arabia? Or Pakistan? Or Somalia? Or Yemen? There are countries where apostacy and blasphemy are punishable by death: how about you name me ONE that is predominantly white?
lewisner ....if you read the bible, god is cruel as f*ck, lot willing to kill his son for him, approval of slavery! Homophobia....etc, etc...not to mention the contradictions on every other page! It's simply anachronistic mumbo that was designed to keep primitives in line! I don't know about you, but I'm not primitive, most of the time anyway, I need no lord or master. Rather than believe obvious rubbish, why is it so hard for folk just to say that they don't know why something is, or where everything came from. Why can't people see that to say "Wow, the universe is so majestic and mysterious, there must be a bloke who made it!", is just plain daft! It's such a limited human concept to say that somebody must have made it! It's such a spurious argument to say, I can't explain this, so therefore, Allah...or Jesus! Pure lunacy! Grow up people, spare your children from religious brainwashing, it's really the only way of propagating religion, no-one rational just suddenly catches faith (unless, having a breakdown!)
I was so pissed when my grandpa died it was the saddest moment in my family after my birth. I was 9 and I thought the best response to God was,no more god in my life. Also my cousins questioned God everyday using science and logic which pushed me to read more stuff. I was so disconnected with religion from 9 that by the time I grew up I had no reason to believe in it.
Such a good honest woman. Usually i cringe when listening to most callers. This was refreshing. She sounds like the kind of person everyone should have in their lives. Wow.
I can't appreciate enough how brave this woman is, she genuinely didn't understand the mindset of an atheist and wanted to learn it and she was so kind and honest with her words even though she learned that she might not see her loved ones again after a life of waiting to meet with them in heaven.It's terrifying and it must be so disappointing. That situation is so sad. She's been lied to her all life, she's been told that her sister is in hell. I've never realized how severely religions could harm people emotionally. That was one of the most unique and best calls I've watched. I hope this woman has found ways to deal with her grief better and is happy now.
13:29 _"How does God tell you that you're gonna meet these people again? - I don't know."_ - That's gotta be the most honest answer ever from a caller on this show!
So...your reward will be to meet your departed ones again in heaven. ????? As an atheist, l find that amusing.. I'm thinking about the man who, during his lifetime, had a total of four wives. Each one, a miserable individual, causing this man 'hell on earth'... Will the same 'reward' be there waiting for him when he arrives in heaven.? Would his four ex-wives be allowed to now make his life 'hell in heaven' ?
When a believer says something happened because they prayed, I always wonder what they think about tragedies? There was just a horrible tornado in Alabama, I guarantee that some of the people that died were praying and they still died! What do believers think of prayer after that? God works in mysterious ways? Grown people talking and asking for things to an invisible man in the sky is just crazy! And yet this woman cannot understand atheism.
@@seanjones2456 Same. I would never make fun of this caller, but I honestly don't understand the mindset that god is responsible for the good things in her life, with the knowledge that bad things happen to people all the time. How is her grandson's life more worth saving than others? It boggles the mind.
Religious people grew up with “god” as a coping mechanism for hard times. Yet they still don’t understand it’s a medieval tale. Props to these guys for being so patient and perfectly and respectfully explaining it to this wonderful woman. Guess I’m just lucky that my parents raised me without any religion, got all the tools I need to be a good person and cope with loss. anyway have a good day and don’t be too hard on religious people guys, they’re people too.
Manda seems like such a sweet and genuine person. Even when she misinterpreted the hosts and thought they were saying horrible things about her, she kept her cool, stayed civil and didn't jump to conclusions. She asked honestly how anyone can be an atheist because she didn't understand it and actually listened to the answers because she genuinely just wanted to know rather than asking to have an excuse to be arrogant and feel superior. I wish her all the best and really hope she's doing well.
@@joshuataylor3550 There was nothing destructive in this conversation. Matt and Jamie were honest, supportive, and deeply empathic. Manda lives in the same reality that we all do (as she always has), and has had an honest conversation.
@joshuataylor3550 i actually understand what you mean by this, however they are not stating anything as complete fact, and actually really understood why she thought the way she did. And she is clearly old enough to either ignore it or not. All they did was show her something she had never considered before. I do wonder if she ever explored those new views on reality more
Vincent Ranger it's important that we pretend out emotions don't exist, right? Because god forbid we connect with people with anything other than our fists...
@@hanshananigan1233 I don't think she's gonna throw away her belief system, but it's nice that she understands that her sister might not be burning in hell for committing suicide.
You can hear her heart breaking slowly as the call goes on, just hit after hit, and damn dude, it feels bad remembering how I had the same breakdowns when I stopped believing
This woman never dealed with her sister's loss, believing she will see her again, until finding out that this is likely not true. I felt sorry for her. Life is hard.
Agreed. Although I think knowing the reality that once you’re dead, you’re dead, is more comforting. Just because you know you that your time is short so don’t hold grudges, do good things for others, take care of yourself and many more stuff that will make life better for not only yourself but for others aswell. Your family member died of cancer? Donate to cancer researchers so you know you’ve just prevented someone else from suffering a loss. What if one day, you’re the person who’s loss was prevented because someone donated to find out a cure?.
Simple answer: We are all born atheists. Right up until you are TAUGHT about god and then the moment you actually believe. Before that you are an atheist.
@@aeronautisch Thats not what Agnostic means. If you actually look at the definition for Agnostic it is impossible to be born Agnostic. Atheism is a lack of belief while agnosticism is an actual belief. Being born with a belief is less reasonable than being born lacking one.
@@aeronautisch Umm no, you can't call a disbelief a belief. It is by definition a LACK of belief and not an actual belief. Like the difference between believing unicorns exist and not. Belief being an acceptance of something usually without proof. To believe is to do. To not believe is to not do. Atheism is the name for the neutral stance people take when they are not believing in deities. The moment someone religious loses their faith they become an atheist until they find a new deity they believe in. Sorry for the extra padding but i needed to make sure you understood that what you said was factually wrong. Just find a dictionary and it should explain this.
Well. To be fair, I dont exactly walk around introducing myself "hi, I'm an atheist", so odds are most people wouldn't ever know they have spoken to one.
Amanda, thank you for calling in. It’s been several years since you did so, but you moved me. When I was a theist, I felt comfort thinking that someday I would see my loved ones who passed. When I realized that was not true, I became hurt. Then I became angry at religion. After that I accepted the truth, and what gives me joy now is not some cruel, baseless promise to make me submit. The thing that brings me joy is the miracle of being conceived, the randomness of it all, and in addition, the finality of being alive. Having the opportunity to have consciousness and sharing my life with loved ones is the reward in itself. To me that is much more valuable and more beautiful than what any religion or god can promise. Hope you are doing well, Amanda. Big virtual hugs from Costa Rica to wherever you may be ❤.
I think this is my favourite call. She is genuinely curious and confused, everyone is polite and gentle, and she seems to understand, even if not accept their reasoning, and they understand her. Poor lady.
The caller, Manda, is an example of the extremes of how religion makes people unhealthy co-dependency on religion. The use of fear factor tactics by religion is very psychologically damaging.
Yet she seems to be a really good person. She should be perfectly free to be whatever she wants. I'm pretty certain she is mistaken, but whether or not she reconciles that mistake with a more logical view or not, it is still entirely her right. Sometimes I even wish I could believe. It would be comforting.
Religion poisons our minds and the church can find a way to make anything bad , Working out " your doing it to attract the opposite sex" same with make up, video games , bars clubs, playing the lottery, looking at a woman for to long is the same as the actual sex act, i could go on and on,
@@leslierhorer1412 The problem is that religious leaders use Manda and those like her to maintain their social, economic, and political dominance over areas like Lynchburg, VA. I live in Virginia myself and am surrounded by Christians. Allowing their views to go unchallenged has stagnated the culture here to an incredible degree. The comfort they derive from their beliefs is always outweighed by the damage wrought to themselves and society.
@@NetAndyCz When I was being brought up Baptist and alcohol, all alcohol was strictly forbidden! No card playing, smoking, rock music, dancing (other than country or ballroom-type), lottery playing, etc. I do now, 40-some years later, have friends and the preacher's wife from a local Baptist church who feel it's fine to have a sip of wine or other alcohol on occasion. It has to do with that verse about not polluting your temple (body).
This caller just made me feel so sad. It very much sounds like she is having doubts but can't quite let go of her faith because of the comfort it brings her. And I guess she has no one around her to discuss these doubts, so it's good she could at least call in and get some things of her chest.
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I think the lies told to her growing up that she would see her brother and sister again prevented her from dealing with their deaths. I think she truly listened to what Matt & Jamie said and it made sense. Now she is conflicted with clinging to a faith that she clearly has doubts about or having to realize that she will not see her brother and sister again. For her it is like the just died again. I have great empathy for her. If she was before me I'd give her a firm hug. This is good example of the damage done by the lies of religion.
I can say the same about atheists...you can't seem to let it go because the comfort it brings you.
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@@3joewj You are wrong, it is the hurt and damage that theist do to others. For example there are christians that are spreading the coronavirus because of pastors that care more about filling their collection plates than people's safety. 1) Can you tell me how many states have laws banning christians from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)? 2) Can you tell me how many states have tried to pass laws banning christians from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)? 3) Can you tell me how many states have laws banning Atheists from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)? 4) Can you tell me how many states have tried to pass laws banning Atheists from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)? 5) How many children are kicked out of the home by christians for saying they no longer believe? 6) How many people are ostracized from family, friends and the community by christians for saying they don't believe? 7) How man children are kicked out of the house for saying they found religion by Atheists? 8) How many people are ostracized from family, friends and the community by Athiests for saying they don't believe? ANSWERS: 1) NONE 2) NONE 3) There are at least 5 states that have laws on the books banning atheists from holding public office even though it is unconstitutional. 4) ALL 50 states have christians trying to get laws past to ban Atheists and non christians from being allowed to serve in any public office. 5) No evidence that this ever happens 6) No evidence that this ever happens 7) 100's of children are either kicked out of the house each year because they no longer believe in god. 8) 100's perhaps 1000's each year people are forced to move or a re too terrified to voice that they no longer believe in the crap that the religion everyone else believes in. Religion teaches people to hate their brothers, their sisters, their children, their mothers and fathers, family and friends. According to the bible the mythical jesus said this.
When your belief system is demolished by a sentence or two, you need something to cope with in the meantime. I'm glad for the manner of both hosts. It's clear this caller will be psychologically broken without religion. Inability to deal with emotional stress is probably from her upbringing given her sister committed suicide.
@Bob Smith a fundamental belief, like your religion? I've never heard a more contradictory statement, delusion or science. Pick one or enjoy cognitive dissonance. Just because you survived jumping off a bridge doesn't mean everyone will. It's clear religion is a crutch for what she should have internally generated.
@Bob Smith well if you're happy living in internal conflict and hold two conflicting ideas, I won't stop you. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'm not worried about how your mind works as it's not based on reason. My years will be many as I'm only 25, I don't aim for peace, it's a fools errand. I'd prefer to live honestly,
@Bob Smith I guess you failed reading comprehension. If you're okay with living conflicted, that's your choice and I won't stop you. Anything else you didn't catch, buddy?
I’ve watched quite a few of these videos and I have to say that the honesty and sincerity shared between these three people showed me more respect, love, and compassion than any religion ever has. The apprehension and earnestness of Manda actually made me sit up a little taller and listen. I just listened. This is the kind of conversation that I would love to have with the Christians in my life, if only they would have a conversation with me rather than proselytizing. I’m saving this one. Thanks.
Yeah, this is one of my favorite episodes as she was so upfront and honest and even though she most likely will not change her beliefs, her call may have planted the seed of doubt for her. Everything about this call was basically the ultimate in compassion.
This Is My Name You’ve got a new horizon it’s ephemeral style A melancholy town where we never smile And all I wanna hear is the message beep My dreams I gotta kiss em cus I don’t get sleep no ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
This was amazing. I feel like this is one of the few religious people who actually got something out of a conversation with you, because she was honest and modest and actually listened to what you had to say
Only because she was genuinely curious and willing to listen and try to understand someone else's point of view. I think all 3 people in this conversation did justice to the difficulty of differences in spiritual beliefs.
@Quincy Breed It's pretty clear that this conversation is going to end quickly, as my IQ is much too high to argue with a brainwashed scrub like yourself. All gods were created by man. The end. Oh btw, the bible has a talking donkey in it. Think about that for a moment, take your time.
Quincy Breed well if that happens I couldn’t honestly say that anymore because that god is right before me. It wouldn’t be in my head. I would be humbled to know a god does in fact exist. I would love to communicate with it. I would have so many questions for it.
@@el29 I agree, he can be rude. But from what I see he makes a clear distinction between people who want to sell him BS and do not even try to go along his reasoning and people who at least try, but can't out of their fortified mindset due to whatever reason. You can clearly see this when Matt, based on what the caller said, made a logical argument, the caller first agrees and then switches back to his old BS without giving any reason why he switches back.
i think theres a fundamental difference between believing in one god, disregarding the others, and disreguarding all of them... you don't have any faith system in a creator so its fundamentally different. i think atheists should stop with the "one god further, you know exactly what its like to not believe" line it seems misleading; do you know what i mean?
@@hunternewberry5860 Most humans grow out of the majority of the fairytales they believed in when they were kids, in fact a non trivial fraction actually grow out of all of them so I really don't find it that convincing to argue that they are fundamentally different because they didn't throw out their childhood belief in one particular sky wizard along with fantasy beliefs in fairies and whatever other mythical creatures from stories kids tend to believe are real until they grow up and learn to tell the difference between fiction and reality on most things in their life.
@@seraphina985 it really should be simple to understand that the difference between belief in 1 god and 0 is fundamentally different than not believe in #2 or 3 or 4. It means you believe in nothing. It's what the lady in the video was having a hard time understanding. I'm just saying it's easy to disregard all but one god, the last leap, from 1 to 0 is by far the longest and most difficult jump for most people because theres nothing to land on on the other side. My point: Its fundamentally not as easy to go one god further as it is to disregard all the others, so people should stop saying it is
@@hunternewberry5860 Err no not at all I believe in many things I just require reasonable evidence to support those beliefs you know like any of the thousands of other beliefs that even religious people have like the belief that the sun will rise tomorrow because it has been demonstrated that the sun does exist and that the rotation of the Earth causes it to consistently rise up from behind the horizon and into the sky in an arc every day at my location. The god belief is usually the only one that people tend to hold that they have massive cognitive dissonance over as they have to constantly twist reality to fit in with the narrative surrounding the one singular belief that they insist on believing not only without evidence but in direct conflict with the evidence.
@@seraphina985 you dont seem to be addressing my point at all. My point, and the only reason I ever commented, was to say that the phrase "we go one god further" is making the jump from a theist to an atheist seem as insignificant as the disregard of other gods, when in reality, and pretty obviously, there is a significant difference in believing in 1 god and none
What an amazing call, being thoughtful and understanding human relating so someone who is in pain. Two Internets each to Jamie and Matt For helping someone who is in grief then putting her in the correct direction to cope you guys are truly goodhearted. That's one of the ways how i became a free of religion. This call was wonderful.
@@uPick-iLick religion isn't exactly seated in morals, they teach us to treat women as second class people, tells us to stone someone who works on Sunday, and has started countless wars. People have morals and have had morals long before any religion graced our presence.
I agree. We can agree to disagree on any issue, but we aren't human without compassion. We all know pain, and we should all feel for those who are clearly suffering emotionally. I miss my dad terribly, and I'd give anything to talk to him and hang out with him again one day. I'd love the afterlife to be true. Unfortunately, I hafta weigh the evidence and accept reality. I'm still grateful for every second I had with him and wouldn't trade places with anybody.
@@APPR3NTIC3 You forgot to mention the innocent women, children, puppies, and kittens that Yahweh ordered slaughtered for the terrible sin of living in a town that he wanted for his chosen tribe.
Wow this made me sad just thinking about my mom and how strongly she feels about Jesus. Child indoctrination is a terrible thing I’m so glad I was able to break out.
Did you ever consider maybe it wasn't God that painted that negative aspect of himself but mankind interpreted it wrong? You just jump right to God not existing instead of possibly thinking the logical thing that human may have made an error in their interpretation. If atheist are prepared to declare God does not exist then they better have a goddamn answer for where imagination comes from, why we are self aware etc. Aspects of life just as mystical and supernatural as atheism thinks God is. God is literally more real than your own imagination, there are several books that mention God and gives some understanding of God, however you are the only person on Earth that is in observance of your own imagination and you are the only one who can validate it no one else. Care to explain why we should believe you have one or your existence is valid since God didn't create you and your existence by default is mystical?
@@evilcowboy Oh i don't know how imagination works, i don't know how my existence is valid, how mystical things happen oh so it must be god! Did you even watch the video!?
Was an extremely devout christian, served and tithed in spite of not having money left over for food or bills (ex-husband's gambling didn't help, the only time that resulted in money was me forcing him to sell his gaming cards). Faithfully brought my kids to church every single weekend, mostly Saturday evenings. Those same kids have zero interest in church today, zero religious faith. Turns out church members freaked them out by being way too touchy feely.
Imagine if this brave and curious woman had been taught critical thinking skills from a young age--her inability to process logically is heartbreaking and a waste of a potentially fine mind.
It really is a shame. I don't hate religious people at all, and I hope that other atheists feel the same way. I only hate what others have done to their brains, because we and the rest of the world are missing out on what they have to offer.
I kinda felt bad about the fact that they couldnt console her better. Look they couldve added that based on scientific evidence we dont know if there is or isnt an afterlife. So far not much says there is proof of an afterlife in a common religious sense, but science always improves and maybe there could be one. After all they cant say there isn't.
greekgoddessmom , well put! I quite agree. It's the indoctrination of youth, that's how religion is propogated and young minds are bent into blind obedience! No-one just wakes up with an organized faith..(except a handful of happy clappers who've had some kind of breakdown!)
Chipmunk I see your point, but for me it comes down to whether you care about actual truth or just what makes people feel better. There are a lot of truths in this world that don't make people very happy, but to me happiness that is based on nonsense feels very hollow. It is possible to be an atheist and find happiness and meaning in life, it just takes some mental work to get there if you've been subjected to religious brainwashing up to that point.
Chipmunk I don’t think it’s a question of spreading atheism, it’s becoming more usual as people educate themselves, and it’s important that people who want to break their religious conditioning know they’re not alone.
She sounded like a really nice lady, who’s been hurt a lot. Whatever she decides to do, I hope that she can get peace of mind and continue to live her life a bit more freely than before.
@NeverFinished 3Digits What call did you listen to? It's not a sob story is a real problem caused by religion that needs to be addressed or you think that religious people going around indoctrinating people about the existence of an afterlife and even worst, hell, is something to ignore?
@NeverFinished 3Digits you cannot be this stupid? this type of caller/person is literally why the show started, because religion can have such a strangle hold on a persons ability to think rationally( exactly like this caller), as well as having no tools to handle grief
@NeverFinished 3Digits when I say " that caller" I mean, a theist that has been trapped her whole life because of religion and doesn't have the tools to cope with loss, or to evaluate things logically. that is pretty much what the show is about, showing people that there is a better way to live life rather than living it with the bullshit reason of faith. 'that caller' is 1 of millions who quite clearly need a wake up call, which is 100% (along with an outlet for atheists themselves, what the show is about and was created for. I didn't think it needed that much of an explanation but with you, clearly it did.
@@Simon-nv5zj Yes he can and is this stupid. He just watches the show for the antagonistic theists defending stupid ideas, he is not interested in morality, society and the effect of religion on both. The waste of time is interacting with this kind of ignorant assholes.
Bryon Myers You never made it out of your Christianity-poluted country, have you? ...don't bother answering. I don't expect any useful response from a rasist. A bit hypocritical, don't you think, as a Christian? ...But certainly not surprising!
I know it’s an old episode, but truly, this was not only a beautiful example of how to explain a position sensibly, it was definitely the most heartfelt and sincere appreciation from both sides I think I’ve ever seen in a debate about atheism and blind faith. Manda has my respect for listening and questioning, and even questioning her own beliefs, even if she didn’t change her stance. Maybe she has, now. Great work, guys.
I came back and found this specific call just to instil some love for humanity. The last four years have been so truly maddening. Yet this call exists 🙏
When I was in high school I was still religious, but my boyfriend was an atheist. We had long conversations much like this one. I very nearly convinced him that it would be nice if Christianity was right so that even if we were separated by death if we were good people we could see each other again someday. But within a couple of years, with my increasing exposure to different ways of thinking as well as learning more about how to reason for myself, my faith was beginning to break. I asked a lot more questions at Sunday school and youth group, and was increasingly uncomfortable with the answers. But the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak, was during Sunday school one week where our pastor was sitting in with our senior high group, and we were discussing the afterlife. I found out that my pastor did not believe that we would be able to see individual loved ones in Heaven, because according to him Heaven was not a place where people live in a great house together, but was more metaphysical. It was the returning of the soul or spirit or energy, whatever you want to call it, back to the great energy that is God. So although you are together again, it's not as individuals but as a big energy ball I guess. His opinion was also that Hell is not a place where people burn, but rather is the sadness and emptiness from the lack of being together with God for all eternity. I asked why no one else had ever said such a thing, and why we were told the story of Heaven as paradise with loved ones, and Hell as burning for your sins. He said that those were just colloquial stories built by popular culture and had no actual basis in the Bible. I suppose that is true, but there also wasn't anything in there describing his exact ideas either. But the reason that his idea broke my faith was that the comfort of the idea of Heaven as a paradise with loved ones was the major selling point for me. I could also see why the fear of burning in Hell would be a deterrent. But without that reward or that threat, what was the incentive? Why would I be afraid of being without God for eternity if I do not experience his presence in life anyway? How is it any different? And even if he was wrong, it just shows the inconsistencies, and that even the people that are supposedly an authority don't know what they're talking about. After college my boyfriend and I married. We wanted to have kids together, but that didn't end up working out because we went through several years of poverty after a series of unfortunate events, and didn't have the money. The culminating unfortunate event was that my husband was taken from me at only 32 years old by cancer. Back when we were in high school and I was a believer, there was a different series of events that had led to us dating, and the arrogant Christian that I was, I had thought that we were meant to be together and God had given us to each other. When he died and people prayed for me and told me their comforting lies about God's plan and being in a better place, it just made me angry. If God had given us to each other, why would he take him away from me too soon, before we even got a chance to have a family? If that was his plan then it sucks. I mourn the loss of him, but also the loss of his time, of our time together, and our dreams. Sometimes I still like to pretend that maybe he is in a separate plane of existence somewhere and he can watch over me even if I can't see him anymore, because it really can be comforting sometimes even if there's absolutely no proof of it. But I'm fully aware that it's just a coping mechanism, and a poor one at that. Now, even though I live in a conservative town and it would be easier to meet new people that way, I wouldn't even try to bring myself back into religion. Although the rituals and the lies and sense of belonging can bring comfort, they can also bring much harm. As an educated adult I cannot support a god that condones slavery, objectifies women, and strikes down anyone he's not happy with despite creating them and knowing that they're imperfect. There's also a lot of evidence that the supposed Word of God- the Bible- has been tampered with repeatedly by men in order to exert greater control over the masses. I suppose if the Christian God really does exist then I will hope that other gods, other heavens, other dimensions, other reincarnations, whatever, also exist and can bring a greater chance of being able to experience again. But if not, if there's really nothing but here and now, then there's still the comfort that I and my atheist husband, as well as people bullied by Christianity such as LGBTQIA+ people, will not have to burn in Hell.
Reading between your lines I can tell you are an intelligent, open-minded person, but most of all a good person. I believe that in the long run our pain makes us stronger (it certainly makes us deeper), but it's not an invisible fix.
Thank you for sharing this. Even though the ultimate reason for me finally giving up on religion is just a bit different from yours, you have articulated my thoughts and sentiments perfectly. And you're very eloquent. I hope everything goes on well for you because I can very much relate to everything you said
As an atheist, I hold no position against religious ppl. If someone like this woman caller so believes that god saved her son, so be it. I don't believe there is real harm in believing things as such if the person is genuinely good. It is when the person(s) are not good, I won't even dare say "genuinely" good, lol that these types of religious beliefs are not just bad but harmful to the person themselves and to others. Richard Dawkins: Many of us saw religion as harmless nonsense. Beliefs might lack all supporting evidence but, we thought if people needed a crutch for consolation, where's the harm? September 11th changed all that. Revealed faith is not harmless nonsense, it can be lethally dangerous nonsense. Dangerous because it gives people unshakeable confidence in their own righteousness. Dangerous because it gives them false courage to kill themselves, which automatically removes normal barriers to killing others. Dangerous because it teaches enmity to others labeled only by a difference of inherited tradition. And dangerous because we have all bought into a weird respect, which uniquely protects religion from normal criticism. Let's now stop being so damned respectful!
I feel it's rather arrogant to think "god" saved "your" child while millions are dying very horribly around the world. We won't get into rape prevention or molesting priests......god works wonders when things are going great but we're told he has a different plan for us when the shit end of the stick snarles it's ugly head🤔
@castroy64 when beliefs aren't questioned and taken for granted you get RELIGION... Most atheists ( not all) were at one time a believer in ones religion until critical thinking comes into play. We have real life issues people are facing here on Earth that any god can't seem to fix but always commanding respect and honor and complete obedience to if not, there's a place for you the saviour created especially for you🔥🔥🔥. Unconditional love is just that.. ( free of judgement)
@castroy64 how the fuck do you explain cancer or natural disasters which take the lives of alot of believers. I suppose all this " bitching" is nonsense and god shouldn't have to hear it? You're the creator asshole do something. Why praise a dog?
@@namelessrose3859 stats are bullshit it really shows your character true gullibility at best. The Catholic Church has hidden child molestation for years undercover. You'll be surprised what goes on right under our noses. Religion is cancer, dumb atheists blah blah. Most people who don't believe now used to hold some form of religious beliefs until you actually READ the Bible or quran they both fall apart quickly after reading genesis. There is a battle going on... ( For our brains) everyone has their hand in the candy jar of imaginary friends. I say "No, thank you"
That she called in to talk and didn't do the typically smug "Here's my argument, I'll let you talk but I'm not listening because I know I'm right" speaks volumes of her. She genuinely didn't know what to expect, and I'm pretty sure this conversation shook her foundations... but to her credit, she let it be a conversation.
@eric sosa So you're going to make an assumption and generalization of all atheists because you don't like his comment, huh? I won't take offense to this cause it's stupid, but I want you to think about the comment you just made and realise that it is a blatant generalization.
@eric sosa Like I said, I don't take offense to it. I just want you to think about what you are saying. Rather than make generalizations and assumptions why not treat us like you would any other person? We're not bad people, but we're seen that way by many simply because religions like to display us in a bad fashion. I'm just trying to have you understand is all.
@eric sosa Look, I completely agree with you that some people can be insulting towards religion without merit. The opposite is also true with religions towards atheism. My point is this: your comment portrayed all atheists in a bad light. There's nothing wrong with you holding an opinion, that's fine. But vocalizing it that way comes off as arrogant and rude. Now, I'm not particularly offended by it, since I more or less just see it as someone having an opinion that doesn't really apply to me, but regardless I felt it would be proper to point out what you did to you. That way, you may learn from it, and hopefully not do it again.
As much as I love a good Matt smackdown, I have always loved his compassion when he's dealing with real searchers like this woman more. Jamie was sweet af usual. Im picking through old episodes I've missed.
@Quincy Breed I can't predict the future, the claim could take so many shapes it's impossible for me to tell you how you should prove your case to me. That being said, a demonstration would be appropriate. Mind you, I'm asking for a demonstration, not an explanation. Show, don't tell. You could show me exactly how a person gets to the afterlife you're attempting to prove. You could show me the place itself, wherever that afterlife is. Now I can save you some time, can we agree that words on an internet forum would not be sufficient to demonstrate the existence of an afterlife?
If you've been lied to your entire life, even if it was intended to be for your benefit, the arrival of truth can be devastating and confusing. I can't overstate how well this was handled by both hosts and caller. Hopefully it was the beginning of a real healing journey. I sometimes regret that these stories don't have follow-ups. Manda, wherever you are, I hope you are well.
Two things: 1) the commercial for this video is from the Mormon church. hehe. 2) if you want to be an atheist, read the bible. If you want to be a believer, cherry pick your bible.
I am an athiest but I don't want to read the bible I'm more into books with lots of fighting like Lord of The Rings and The Hobbit and the bible doesn't have that
There is lots of fighting in the bible! Huge wars waged by wandering desert armies imbued with the power of their god - nations destroying nations. AND there is magic! Pillars of fire and smoke, talking animals and bushes, unicorns and leviathans and angels and demons and devils.
@@LupaPuella yeah but is gandalf in the bible? no he isn't so LOTR-2500000000000000(cause orcs and dwarves and gondor and uruk-hai and sauron and the rest of LOTR) bible-0
There are REAL giants in the bible. They came from angels boning hot human women. Can you find that in your "LOTR?" NO. You can't. There are also witches who talk to the dead and sometimes they do it for the servants of god - which is SNEAKY because. OH yeah, It has GOD - you know, bigger and badder than stupid suron or saran or whatever.
@@LupaPuella yeah but there are *STONE* giants in the Hobbit and the one ring used by Sauron is more powerfull than any god and there are witches in the hobbit that can speak to the dead and there are the Nagul neither dead nor living so LOTR-2500000000001 bible-0
How about GOD`s view? GOD says that we are lawbreakers, and rebels, but He loves us anyway. So either you are a unique creation and loved by GOD or you are a cosmic accident and destined to return to the dust. Which do you prefer?
@@johndoney2665 doesn't matter what I or you prefer. Just matter what actually happens and there is no proof of a creation, therefore I can't say that happened
@@JCbeatProductions So you would prefer to be a worthless cosmic accident rather than a unique creation of GOD. that sounds like a stubborn child that refuses to use logic.
@@johndoney2665 so you would rather be another useless slave to God rather than a beautiful natural organism that came about from natural processes. See how easy it is to reframe these? Ps. You shouldnt accuse anyone else of being a stubborn child given your petulance
She is genuine. God is the existence of Love. Everybody believes Love exists. To degrade that obviously comes with serious Consequences. You egotistically ignoring that is misguided.
@@damianedwards2327 so why call it a god if we already call it love? If love is your god, cool. I believe love is real. I don’t think it’s a god. It’s an emotion. So you god is basically an emotion. A feeling. Nothing more.
@@arios1977 Very True. God and Love are the same thing. But the word God is needed to make a NECESSARY Distinction. Because Athiest are ashamed of Love. When people explain the importance of Love, Athiests Minimize it. Because they see Humbling as being weak. When being humble to Love is actually our Strength. We all access love in our daily life. But we must ALWAYS REMEMBER love obviously has to be ELEVATED. Elevated meaning Higher. That's what the word God MEANS. Which is why people say Higher Power. Because WITHOUT the title God, Love just becomes something Athiests use when they Want something and throw it away when they get tired of it, like an old iPhone. And that Athiest way of thinking is the worst crime we could ever commit.
@Gen. Clorox Bleach Very True. God is the existene of Love and No matter how crazy life gets... you've Never thrown Love away. Right? When you have a Friend who is struggling, you don't throw Love away. That is when our Vanity is humbled. And we realize Love is actually the only thing that matters Thats why I am so passionate against Atheism. We should NEVER throw Hope away. But Athiests Do. And they PROMOTE it. As far as facing Pain in life, You wouldn't have life Without obstacles and hurdles. That's why God created Human Choice. Without the creation of hurdles and human flaw, it would be like shooting a basketball and it always going in the hoop. there would be no point. You would have no story. That is what Life was created for. OUR STORY Without the story, there would be No books, no music, no tv, no movies. Nothing. With human choice and overcoming obstacles...Life has intense MEANING. Obstacles not only show what you CAN achieve. But obstacles also show you what you never thought Possible. To impress athiests,You may publicly disagree...but then you'll probably go watch a movie. Awesome
@@damianedwards2327 how is your god the existence of love? Animals feels love and they have no concept of this god of yours. All you’re saying is your god is an emotion. If you god created anything, you need to demonstrate that. Not just assert it, like this human choice you’re talking about. So if we have a choice, then your god isn’t an all knowing one, so that’s out of the equation. So how does an emotion create whatever it is you think it creates? Please demonstrate. As far as we know, emotions alone don’t create anything. People do.
Of the many AE calls I’ve watched, this is easily my favorite so far. It’s just so sincere and open. Bravo, Matt and Jaime for a refreshing half hour of pure empathy and reason. And to the caller, I just wanted to hug her to make her feel a little better about what happened with her sister. I could only imagine how much guilt she must feel. This is why I watch this show. Greetings from the Philippines.
Hey man. Great to see another Filipino here. I am a closet atheist since many people here in our country do not take kindly with being presented opposing views. Especially with atheism. To make this more relevant, how long have you been an atheist?
I lost my dad when i was 6 and not a day went by that i didnt speak to him. He was like a diary i spoke to everywhere i went. Knowing i would see him again one day felt like all that was keeping me going. The day i acknowledged the fact that i didnt believe in an afterlife anymore it was as if he had died all over again except this time it was real. I felt like a fool for talking to myself for 20 years and i wept for the fact that i would truly never be with him again. I relate to this woman strongly because that was the single greatest disservice my faith did to me. Teaching me to face death by pretending it doesnt exist and that we go on after. Even after 7 years being an atheist i struggle with it emotionally. Being promised eternal life for 26 years only to find out it isnt true feels identical to having it given to you and then taken away. Imagine winning the lottery and then being told "jk" then multiply that by as many stars there are in the sky and that might describe what it feels like to become an atheist after decades of indoctrination. For that reason i get pretty heated when a theist tries to tell me that i just deny god because i wanna sin without consequence... Like fuck you dude i NEVER wanted to be an atheist. Becoming an atheist was an accidental outcome of trying to affirm my belief in god by hearing the arguments against him and refuting them at least to my own satisfaction. I was biased toward god and yet still every argument for god crumbled under basic reasoning and eventually my faith couldnt hold out against reality
The only difference between you and them, is that you actually *looked* at the logic that causes the arguments to crumble. If you were to have gotten angry/stubborn like most and just refute evidence and factual claims, you might still be praying to afterlife santa
It was part of your grief process, and I’m sorry for the loss of your father. I lost my dad a couple years ago, sometimes I would dream about him, I know it was my mental stress in my mind surmising a what if scenario. All I know is that he’s not in pain anymore, and maybe I can do life a lot better for myself because of himz
Same. The day I realized "after life" was a lie, was the day I values my life and my loved one tenfold. I really hate that religion take away my ability to grief. When my dog die I legit didn't think about it because I'm convinced I'm gonna meet him again someday.
It is nice we actually hear from a Christian who actually is a nice person and who actually follows the good things about the words of Jesus even if he was just made up.
I miss my Uncle Lezin. Master storyteller, Korean War veteran, baker, log cabin builder, no one made me laugh like him. Don't think I'll ever see him again but he's with me everyday and still makes me laugh. People we love pass on, our memories become so precious. When I'm dead, hopefully people will remember me in a positive way.
@@cascorick8253 I mean there's people out there with so much problems that an idea of Jesus or any religion really helps them get through it. I feel like some people aren't going to use cold reason because of their circumstance. So in this case faith can be a good thing you know? Whats your perspective?
@@cascorick8253 True but I see it can be a rational choice considering on their socialization environment or ofcourse pain. And then of course they become ignorant and antagonistic of any views outside if their ideology which sucks ass
I gotta give it to that woman. That was a tough conversation for her, you could tell that hit some dark places by her voice. She genuinely tried to wrap her head around the idea too.
notformebeaky Dude have a little empathy, she has been taught since she was little that her god is as real as the air she breathes. Of course she is deluded by her religion but the mere fact that we was willing to take into account the sheer possibility there is no God and think it through is very admirable. As a former Christian I know what it’s like to live in that fantasyland of religion, it’s extremely hard to shake.
I cried when she started to realize that Heaven may not be real. I just wanted to hug that woman when she broke down. This is a reason why I don't talk to my elderly family members about this. What upside is there, I ask myself. They've believed this so deeply for so long that I would be effectively destroying their world by deconverting them. They're good people, that believe in fairytales, yes. But, they have another 20 years max left on this earth and if that fairytale brings them happiness and comfort in their final years on this earth and they can die with a smile on their face, then who am I to take that all away from them. I have no issue deconverting peers (doesn't happen a lot, I'm no deconversion prodigy), and that's because I know they're still young enough that they can have a positive effect on the world around them, and live full and happy lives. It's kind of like the saying, "you can't teach an old dog new tricks." Well, you can't teach an elderly devout Christian to enjoy and love their life without god. I'm not asserting that btw. Basing that statement solely upon my relatives because I know it would destroy them. They would no longer know how to function because their religion and god is so deeply ingrained into the fabric of who they are.
@Bruce Wayne Except not as superficial a loss as Santa Claus or the hypothetical billion dollars mentioned in the show. But Rihards and Adam Ant have a point about potential harm done, and it's not like Heaven will be there for them as a result of their not thinking it won't, so I'm not arguing against their deconversion.
My mother died when I was 14. I was then and still am now an atheist, so I have never believed I would see her again. How did I cope? Well, I missed her and at one level regret that she didn't physically remain in my life. But I never forgot her, and whenever I achieved anything (or even not) I would think she'd have been proud or supportative of me in this situation. It has been all about living well now, not putting life to an imagined afterlife.
Man, this killed me. Normally the callers are the dumbest assholes ever but this poor woman sounds like a kind, decent person who was lied to all her life.
And ladies like this is the majority of the South's population. Just people who were lied to.
Sounds like a decent person until you start talking about what should or should not be taught in schools, separation of church and state, and government in general.
Happens so often and is so sad every time
I really feel bad about brainwashed theist because I've been there, at the same time I hate fuking religions.
Indoctrination is the poison…
There a huge difference in the way you both talked to this woman than many of your other callers.
It's because she was honest, and wasn't trying to use some verbal trick to make their point.
Yes, indeed. This woman called with honest intent of trying to figure out what these guys believe and why, and not to preach
These clips always make me love the people on this show. That they can turn on a dime from the fire-and-brimstone approach to absolute sincerity when they're talking to someone who genuinely wants to understand is incredible.
since I've been watching these vids, the one thing I can say is....most of the time I feel the hosts treat the callers accordingly.
When the callers are respectful....they are treated respectfully for the most part.
When the callers are petulant, or straight up know-it-all types who can't form a thought in reality....or they are trying to split hairs in order to make one of those "You don't know, therefore you are wrong...but when I don't know I can just say I have faith & that faith makes me less wrong somehow." arguments.
It's always funny to watch stupid being stupid....because it doesn't know it's stupid.
@eric sosa I recommend not assuming the motivations of groups to which you don't belong. Atheists don't believe for any number of reasons, but the most commonly mentioned one is "there is insufficient evidence for the god claim."
And it seems weird to say "that's what they do" in an accusatory manor when posting in a comment chain about how wholesome these two were. I WISH every atheist approached situations of genuine interest like this.
@eric sosa:
"Why do you assume that I believe in God?"
Because you made arguments against atheists and in support of theism, as well as going on and on about how you think God is OK with being gay.
"It's called having an open mind and knowing that I don't have all the answers!"
We aren't the ones pretending to know whether or not a god exists. Atheists tend to be agnostic.
"You are desperately looking for people in the comments to just simply agree with you!"
Not at all. If I was just desperate for agreement, I'd go to /r/atheism or something.
"Are you people that boring that you congregate and talk about something you don't believe in?"
We talk about atheism because theists take actions that directly affect us based on their religion, and because religion fills certain roles in people's lives that we have to find solutions for in our own. If you can't understand why atheists would want to talk to other non-believers for help with, say, grieving, then you really haven't thought things over very much.
"It is no secret that most of you are gay and think you're going to go to hell!"
Oh god, please tell me you're not just super in the closet and projecting. If so, I'm so sorry for you, and I hope you learn to accept yourself.
"Are you confused about your sexuality? You sound very confused! Don't be ashamed of who you are! Maybe your parents shunned you?"
The fact that you'd read into my sexuality based on four sentences (I'm assuming you missed that that was my second comment here) shows exactly where your mind is. I'm perfectly fine with who I am, and so are my parents. I continue to worry about you though, this continues to sound like projection.
"The other reason is your life is shity and you have to blame the non-existence of something, which makes absolutely no sense if you ask me!"
A.) My life is fine. This just increases my concern about projection. And you're right! Things that don't exist can't be at fault for anything! But I never ascribe fault to god, for exactly that reason. See my first comment: "I recommend not assuming the motivations of groups to which you don't belong."
"You should know this, this is the "group" you claim you belong to🤣 because you so desperately need to belong to something!"
I really don't. I actually strongly dislike identity politics, and the whole concept of "us-vs-them." I merely concede that the term describes me. There's a reason I said I wish all atheists acted like these two guys: there are plenty of atheists that conduct themselves incredibly poorly (see: /r/atheism.)
"Your so-called "non-believe" does not come from rational thought or critical thinking, it stems from a traumatic event!"
[Citation needed]
"It's funny though, someone making assumptions, telling someone else not to make assumptions!"
I concluded something about you based on information you provided about yourself in the way that you conducted yourself. You assumed multiple things about entire groups of people based on sweet fuck all. To pretend the two are comparable is asinine.
2/10: Low effort drivel dripping with assumptions and projection. Not worth the effort of continued conversation. Blocked.
That woman is very brave. I'm an atheist and all but even if she didn't changed her mind on religion, she has my respect for having the courage to ask and listen to the other side.
Edit: I'm no longer an atheist.
You will not have any foreign god before me.
You will not make any image of what's up in the skies, down on earth, or in the waters below the earth. Thou shalt not bow to them nor honor them, for I am thy Lord, the Creator, strong, jealous, who corrects the evil of father's on their children to the third and fourth generation of those who despise me; and I bring mercy in the thousands to those who love me and keep my commandments.
You will not take the name of thy Lord, the Creator in vain, for the Lord won't take as innocent those who take his name in vain.
You will remember the day of rest, there's six working days and you will make every task there, but the seventh day is for the Lord your Creator, thou shalt not do any single task then. You, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your servant, nor your maid, nor your beast, nor your foreigner whose habiting inside your gates. For the Lord the Creator in six days made the skies, the earth, and the seas, and everything that is in them, and the seventh day was of rest. Therefore the Creator blessed the day of the Sabbath and sanctified it.
You will honor your father and your mother and you'll do well and live a long live in the land that the Lord your Creator has given you.
You will not kill.
You will not commit adultery.
You will not steal.
You will not speak false witness against your neighbor.
You will not covet the house of your neighbor, nor his wife, nor his servant, nor his maid, nor his ox, nor his donkey, or anything that is of your neighbor.
im from the same city and also an atheist, i find it silly anyone could even dare THINK its abnormal to be an atheist
Lavos2007 I understand is very dissapointing how this works, but religion is specially design to generate this kind of reactions on believers. Before I was an atheist I found the idea of atheism horrible an unnatural and feld guilty for even thinking about it. Creepy stuff, but real.
similar experience to me, but i felt far more guilty about keeping my religion, knowing tons of people both locally and abroad in the country were using it to sound all proper and justified while committing some of the worst atrocities, to me the hypocrisy was just too much and i decided i would be better off without that anchor hanging around my neck
brown boi, It was nice to see that despite her beliefs, she could could talk to and understand people outside of her religious comfort zone. Regardless of what path she takes from here, I think she'll be better off for being able to take in and expand her view of things. Good episode! If only more people were able to talk about their differences without becoming combative in defense of their beliefs. You don't have to be a convert to expand your views and understanding of other people.
its good when theists are open-minded and respectful, in fact if you want to see a real great clip from The Atheist Experience, there should be a vid here on youtube somewhere called "Gavin the Cool Christian" or something, its also likely titled "the atheist experience" but i cant remember exactly, and the title is pretty accurate, he was a person of faith, called in, but had no desire to fight or struggle, he called in to learn and simply ask questions and both sides treated each other well, but then again thats how it should be under ideal conditions where a person of faith is open-minded and not disrespectful
i just wish more theists out there were like that, i feel it would benefit the world greatly if they were, as an atheist i merely want to live my life in peace and not be hated for my views, and to their credit, some christians are perfectly fine with that and they dont seek to impede me and many of them are also good friends but the friendship is there BECAUSE of mutual respect and tolerance, they dont demonize me and i dont demonize them, we even talk about religion occasionally and they dont have a problem with me whatsoever, but thats why it works
When she said that the catholic told her her sister would be in hell because she took her own life, my heart broke for her. What a cruel and evil thing to tell someone. I’ve never had an episode make me bawl, but I just wish I could hug this woman.
Absolutely, you said what I was thinking.
My aunt took her own life 11 months ago. I know it's cliché, but she genuinely was an extremely lovely person who spent her whole career helping homeless people and her personal life was filled with lots of love for her family.
If there is a God that would send her to hell based on issues that he himself had caused, I'd rather be on the side of rebellion against such a God than worship them.
I was raised Catholic and told suicide is worse than murder.
I was so outraged that I immediately asked whether they’d rather I jumped off the window or stabbed them dead on the spot. That shut them up real fast.
@@Nocturnalux I bet it did! Good for you calling them out on their BS particularly in what sounds like a really awful and painful time in your life.
For what it’s worth, I’m glad you chose neither and are still with us today. I hope things got better for you.
@@katelynnehansen8115 Thanks!
It was just such a terrible thing to say to anyone, really. Don't they consider how this can push some people over the edge?
Suicide is something so many people contempate, at some points in their life- and the religious are responsible for plenty of that as well!- but homicide is not!
And that they shut up, told me all I needed to know. They know it's obviously not worse. Or they had never given it any thought.
Either way, these were people in a position of authority saying this to teenagers!
Another pearl: I asked the religion class if I was expected to let myself die if I found myself pregnant and complications arose that would result in my and the fetus both dying unless an abortion was performed. And he said...yes!
As an atheist I think this might be the best call and caller ever on the atheist experience. The way they handled the subject so tenderly, with such care and class was amazing viewing. As for the caller the lady was listening and extremely honest about her feelings. It was heartbreaking. I hope she finds the peace her caring attitude deserves.
Totally agree, I think it was one of the shows best interviews and callers ever.
Absolutelly, thats what I was thinking the whole time.
My EXACT thoughts. It is the best call I've ever heard on this channel. Her innocent surprise at some of the things they explained made *my* eyes moist.
More like shes a middle aged baby with emotional instability so they had to go easy on her to the point of not arguying at all and console her the whole time.
Since you're an Athiest I recommend you join a Satanist group in your area.
The Satanist groups are essentially atheist trolling Christians; Putting up Baphomet statues outside of Ten Commandments on gov't grounds and etc.
Peaceful trolling.
God: Saves the grandson from cancer
Also god: lets die 15000 children per day of hunger
Also he helps your grandma find her car keys, dont forget about the car keys
Also god: gives the child cancer to begin with.
@Esben M god cannot save all those kids, he gets busy helping golfers make the final putt to win millions
@Esben M his kids though remember, he created us all and loves us very much apparently. He obviously has his favs
But God is never the one to blame for our pain, but rather the sovereign one to whom we turn for help. the first human beings turned their backs on God and the amazing life he was offering them. As a result, all people sin and fall short of God's glory. That’s how death, pain, evil, and loneliness became part of our human existence. much of the evil in the universe is due to the direct choice of individuals. Evil came as a result of humanity's choice. Natural disasters are a result of humanity's original sin. When sin entered the universe everything was affected. Suffering and evil go together. The Bible says that the entire creation is now suffering. Therefore God cannot be blamed for the evil that continues. Humanity is directly or indirectly responsible for evil.
but Jesus came to bring us back to life. On the cross, the Son of God died for us. He paid full price for all our rebellion and defeated evil. Then he proved it by coming back to life forever. Now he offers full, true, eternal life to anyone who’s willing to trust in him and in what he did for us. It’s a free gift .
John 10:10
"I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full."
Ladies and gentlemen: exhibit A on the kindness the hosts show when the callers are honest and willing to talk and listen. I hope the caller is doing well.
@Satan Supremacist wt??????
seconds that....this is actually a decent example of how a actual conversation plays out when all parties involved are intellectually honest ,even when having wildly different positions so to speak.
like me and other relatives ouerselfs said about loses in the family tree.... they hade a full long life and a gentle end to it ,and the last thing they want be for uss to waste the rest of ouer lifes obsessive about them not sharing it with uss.
Not all atheists are angry nutjobs going around flashing/saying Satan is wonderful nonsense. These guys I can dig, though some of their information is off. They should look into what Stuart Hameroff is doing.
@@biblebadcopycatofcuneiform8210 not all ? XD first if its the satan temple last i heard they werent doing anything worse then the local christians over there in nutjobb bible belt ;)
for the rest... leets say i meet far more religious people trying to 'flash' ther religion into things for no reason then atheists ...i dont know ,trying to force a hobby on others ^^
who's this 'Stuart hameroff' though and how doess he relate to what they said in this one ?
@@Amoth_oth_ras_shash Learn grammar, spelling, and ...more. Maybe then, we'll chat.
Finally a completely honest theist, asking a completely honest question, AND listening to the answer. Great job both of you guys in your empathetic response.
Hear Hear! These guys are totally respectful to people who haven't found the real truth yet... it is SO HARD to let go of something you've always been told was true... Thank you!
@@DarkaDusty Yes, the devil (Satan) is a liar and the father of lies. He has so many souls believing that there is no God/Jesus Christ. People believing what they have been told by other people who don't know the truth (Jesus Christ).
@@paulgemme6056if god gave us any good evidence, we might believe.
Yeah, considering the number of crazy people, morons and jerks that call into this show (especially in the UA-cam clips), it’s nice to see a sincere discussion for once, even if the crazy people are funny.
@@KnakuanaRka The blood that Christ Jesus shed on the cross is the only thing that can take away our sin/sinful condition and enlighten our souls (change our minds) and give us life - eternal life - the capability of knowing him (Spirit to spirit). No religion needed. Just faith, faith plus nothing. No man is justified by being religious - Justification is by grace through faith alone.
I was diagnosed with Stage-IV cancer and told maybe 6 months. I did the chemo/radiation thing and I am still here (5 years now)
I have had many people say I should thank God for saving me. My response is always "If there was a God I would not thank him for saving me, I would ask why the fuck you gave me cancer in the first place"? What did I and my family do to deserve that?
It also throws the hard working staff, and even yourself for enduring it all, under the rug. It’s disrespectful but they don’t realize it
Who said God gave you cancer ? Lol, everything has a causality, maybe avoid stuff that give humans cancer, foods and enviroments and so on and so on. It says about the "God" you are talking about, created humans in his own Image, and gave them total domination over the Earth and to live there and create what ever they want. Well everything in reality creates action & reaction. We create so mutch shit and then we suffer and get sick by it, thats why we are maybe sinners, to sin from hebrew just means = To miss the goal litteraly. What is the goal ? To live healthy and not smoke and drink and not to get hateful and create light in your soul to become happy and love and create good enviroment and so on and so on and yada yanda. Free will creates all kinda errors/sins and consequences but also many positive things.
@@el29 free will is an illusion and you were almost there. Sun gives us skin cancer, and yet we need it to live. If there is a creator, they set it up this way. You love to shift the responsibility away from them yet you are listing causes we have no control over as our responsibility. Even down to smoking a cigarette and getting cancer is not in your control. Mammals who are larger than us have significantly lower to no cancer rates. Why would a creator set up the reality where smaller mammals have higher chances of cancer and lower chances of surviving it as well.
@@cqproton Wtf. I wrote a fucking essay to you for 2 days ago to explain the nuances from my view but apperently tadaa its not even here. Well i cant even bother to do it again lol. Well i disagree, from so many causalitie perspectives but have a good day. But i understand anyway, because when i was 14 years old philosopher i was a radical determinist causalitie person that did not belive in free will either, now i realise its limited concepts from the start and pre premisses that was limitating but anyhow but i dont share the same stance today. Its more complicated. But heey everybody want there simplified ideologies to make sence of the complex intercausality network of the realitys hologram that manifests infront of your mind.
And when it comes to your God arguments, well those i wrote alot about to why they didnt hold but anyways, what ever.
Have a good day =)
@@el29 Do you understand the basics of cancer? Do you know just how many factors contribute to cancerous mutations in your DNA? By your logic, I should avoid the sun and pretty much any object or place where microorganisms can thrive. Educate yourself.
People like Manda are the reason I stopped arguing religion with people years ago. She's not argumentative or superior. She appears to be a good person who's just been raised with some bad beliefs, and as the gentlemen stated, a lack of tools. I got no pleasure from discussing religion with people like her because it felt like I was trying to take away the only real source of comfort they had. While I strongly believe religion is dangerous, not all religious people are dangerous.
Except for the fact they vote like minded people into office who push their beliefs into government.
Throatwobbler Mangrove if it gives her a purpose in life i think its good for her to believe in god
what purpose can a belief in god give you that cannot otherwise come from secular sources?
What angers me is that she obviously never had any secular source presented to her. The discussion shakes her beliefs as if she was told all of this for the first time. You can't help but wonder how this is possible without a serious lack of education.
Artimus Clydefrog varies from person to person. If she finds fulfilment in religion, why not let her be? Its ignorance to want to bash religious people because you look down on them.
You two did more to help this lady in a few minutes than organized religion had in years.
@Quincy Breed atheists don't hate god. How can you hate something that you don't believe exists? Do you hate the "aliens that abduct people?" No because they are not real. Just like your God is more than likely not real.
@Quincy Breed there is a fallacy here in your B.S. lol, are you telling people what they truly feel?
We talk about it because for thousands of years religion has not done humanity any good. It stunts critical thinking. Promotes tribalism, an "us vs them" mentality, you can't question anything,
In the bible it promotes slavery, killing of atheist and anyone of other religions, kidnapping, rape, abortion, murder and genocide. It's not your made up god that we dislike it's the book that you blindly follow, only read the good parts (cherry picking) while ignoring the bad parts. Somehow it's OK to rip babies out of the stomachs of pregnant women, kill male children, keeping the virgins for yourselves, "happy is he who bashes the little ones against the rocks." So killing children is a form of happiness? In No Context is It OK To murder children And people just because they believe something different. Lucky the bible is a bunch of made up stories so I'm glad most of this didn't happen.
When slavery was a thing they used the bible to try and rectify that they enslaved someone.
Two last questions,
1. how can someone hate something that has never effected reality?
2. What are the commandments that were put in the ark? Hint, it's in exodus 34 not 32 they get smashed in exodus 32.
@Quincy Breed wait you insult me and demean me with insults and I'm the hateful one? Hypocrisy be thy name.
No, it promotes slavery and even beating your slaves as long as they don't die within a couple of days. All of what you said was bull shit. This will be a lot of posts because you said a lot of stupid in just one comment.
@Quincy Breed "I'm telling morons how stupid they are."
That is you being hateful, not me
@Quincy Breed "the other way around"
Is that why in th e bible it says to "never question the lord?" Wait that is stunting critical thinking AND questioning anything.
I feel bad for her. Realizing I would never see my dead relatives again was the hardest truth I had to accept when I became Atheist.
Yes is hard.
@@stacielivinthedream8510 are you on crack?
You may not see them again, but remember that in the case of your family they are a part of you, they are part of what made you who you are and what you become, certainly the influence of your mum, dad and grandparents form a part of what you have grown into.
Cherish them while they're here. :)
You won't remember them when you die, you'll just rebirth over and over for a long ass time with no memory of it.
This UA-cam Channel is therapeutic for me because even, at age 70; I still suffer from the harsh upbringing that I endured in Christian Fundamentalism. I can't stand being in church, anymore, or being around people who want to persuade me to "give my heart to Jesus." It grows so old and tiresome.
I can tell you have a great mind. As a 15 year old...I ask of you for some advice on life. I read a lot of philosophical, and logic books. I’m not very great in school, because I want to do bigger things. I would say I have quite a good head on my shoulders, but that’s not really for me to determine. I want to grow up to be a real intellectual, with logical thoughts, and reasoning. What would your life advice be to me?
@@ZebbyCakes
My "life advice" would be for you to place a severe limit on how much you allow other people to influence your decisions.
That is because in the long run, you alone must live with the long-term consequence of taking anybody's advice, even long after the person who gave you their advice is gone.
George X thank you very much! I will write down what you said in my journal, and really think about it. I appreciate you a lot for this!
I am much younger than you, only 19, but I feel much of what you are saying. Growing up under a religious structure and a strict household, I fully bought into the ideas that were taught to me, one of which includes the idea of original sin. Now I don't know if you have had the same experience, but this idea was probably the most damaging in my life, not while I was a Christian, but once I began to doubt my faith and eventually stopped believing. Once my "salvation" was gone, all that I thought was left in myself was evil and brokenness. Even now I find it difficult to shake the teachings that I was born evil and must be redeemed. I have felt unloveable, broken, and irreparable for only a fraction of my life, and I cannot imagine what it must feel like to have that feeling or a similar one linger for my whole life. In a book I read about religious fundamentalism, it says that the five main phases of recovery from this are separation, confusion, avoidance, feeling, and rebuilding. I only hope to rebuild one day and reclaim what was taken from me in my childhood. I know this was a bit long and rambling, but it's cathartic for me to express this at the moment, and it feels good to come across those who may understand my perspective while I'm still surrounded by those who look down on me from their faith. I sincerely hope you are doing well and rebuilding your own world. Thank you.
@@ZebbyCakes Choppy my advice would be, read a lot, follow your heart, we all know what's right and wrong we have learnt this through evolution in our genes, education read whatever interests you, and always be be nice to people and animals
That was the most honest, heartfelt call. Matt was genuinely kind because she was genuinely seeking information and not trying to play semantics
9:46 Seems pretty fkn aggressive to me
@@chrispysaid it was. And it was still tame in comparison. And it was still what? 5 seconds out of over 1600 seconds? If someone is 'aggressive' .3% of the time, they're dealing with you, it's weird to prop it up like it's significant.
@@Chance57 This sounds like something an abuse victim would say, frankly. Matt's abusive speech is utterly unnecessary in most cases, but he defaults to it because of his short fuse. Maybe he's fully aware of it and has just given up trying to control it, maybe he's completely unaware and thinks it's not so bad (which is what I lean towards, given how often he complaints about being interrupted yet CONSTANTLY interrupts people who are just trying to explain their perspective). He's a good skeptical thinker, but the way the guy engages in dialogue is utterly shameful.
@@chrispysaid As someone who has heard and watched TAX for a long time and that is why I have also seen several videos of Matt, at first when they just started the program they did not stop the guys who called, and many times a single idiot out of pure soligism and fallacies that he never recognized and interruptions he sucked up the entire hour that the program lasts and there was no more time for other calls, so that's why Matt is like this, first because after so many years he is tired of listening to so many idiots always saying the same things and second because if it were not so, many take advantage and use the entire hour of the program to preach without ever getting anywhere.
@chrispysaid I can’t fathom what kind of tissue paper world you live in to think that resisting being interrupted is aggressive
One of the best call ever. I listened to it 5 years ago and stumble on it today and re-listened again to the whole conversation. Manda, your sister is living on:... you shared your experience with us and we all know about her now. She, in a way, changed us a tiny bit because we know of her (and you). This is how I think we live forever by affecting (in a good way) the people around us. (And I just noticed the number of views... (1.5M as of March 2023) A lot of people got to know a bit of you and your sister !)
That's the only way in which the spirit of a person can live on.
"Birds born in cage think flying is a disease"
That's good. Who said it? (I ask because you put it in quotation marks, implying attribution to someone else.)
Marko Pollo Alejandro Jodorwsky
chevy
Great quip.
Exactly how I feel, been flying FREE for 86 years now, having never been ''caged''.
Better to say, BIRDS WHO LIVE IN CAGES THINK FLYING IS ABNORMAL.. But we understand what you mean. Agreed dude. ..Agreed!
That's bullshit
That was probably the nicest call I've ever heard on this show. I think all three managed it really well.
Yeah, indeed. She was very polite, did not get altered in any way and she was able to listen very well (except once that Matthew had to intervene, but that's fine).
I thought she did extremely well considering how much her entire worldview was being challenged. Unlike some of the idiots who call into this show, she revealed herself to be an intelligent and reasonable person. She actually listened.
I agree. That was one of the best shows that I have seen.
Makes a change. Honestly listening to Matt on these clips is painful. Doesn't let anyone talk, interrupts, gets angry. Pretty pathetic tbh.
@@Cheximus No u
I became an atheist almost three years ago after 25+ years as a Christian. In January this year, my 11-year-old niece died from multiple complications originated from a brain tumor. She was 2 years old when the tumor was disovered, only a few days after my sister and her husband adopted her from an orphanage. While she had periods of health and was a right sunbeam, a little fighter if ever there was one, eventually, the complications from the cancer robbed her of one ability after another and she lived a life of pain and constant struggles. My sister and her husband lived a life of constant fear for her life.
When my niece died, I had been an atheist for two years and her death did not make me a believer again, not for a single second. I had no need for a god of any kind to deal with my loss and grief and I am in fact grateful I wasn't a theist at that time specifically, because it would only have clouded my grief process and acceptance.
I grieve that I will not, according to the knowledge available to us, ever see her again, yes. But I grieve her loss of life more. I grieve that she didn't have a better life here on Earth and I grieve that my sister and her husband struggled so much to even become parents and then, when it finally happened, their beloved child had a severe illness that slowly killed her, little by little over several years.
There is no way any god can rationalise that as their divine will and has me accept, respect or bow to that. IF there is a god who could have prevented this, but didn't want to because of some twisted mind games about sin, it will only mean that I acknowledge that god's existence, but in no way, shape or form, will I be able to worship, trust or love them.
Becoming an atheist, if anything, has given me peace. I hope this poor, brave woman finds a healthy way of dealing with her pain.
He (God/Jesus Christ) who bestows the oil of joy instead of mourning gives us hope in the midst of the darkest situations. Atheists only offer death, God/Jesus Christ offers life. The free gift of God (eternal life - to know him). The days are evil, and people want more than what an atheist can give them. Faith, hope and love.
@@paulgemme6056 Atheists do not ''offer death". Death exists whether anyone likes it or not. What atheism offers (among other things) is a mental perspective that places more value on actually existing life than on an imaginary afterlife. Neither Jesus Christ, nor any other character from religious stories, can offer life after death because to do so is to offer, like a snake oil salesman, a false promise, and to devalue existing life. Indeed, the belief in a heaven after death is probably destructive to existing life. Why? Because if people believe that there is an escape (in the form of a ''heaven") from the destruction of planet Earth's ecosystems from pollution, global warming, and nuclear war, then they will be less likely to fight against it. But atheists know there is no escape. Earth is the only home that we and our descendants will ever know. Therefore it must be protected. And the protection of Earth's ecosystems should give our lives purpose. Humans should see their purpose as protectors of the planet, not as "spiritual beings" who are magically exempt from the consequences of its destruction.
P.S. What is ''the oil of joy"? A sexual lubricant?
@@paulgemme6056 If you would like to contact me please reply as I have a scheme to make a million dollars a week for an investment of 1000 dollars.
Do you believe that?
@@paulgemme6056 BS, atheists offer a life that is the only sure thing in this world, you have to live it to the fullest and love the people closest to you, not place faith in an invisible god! I just hope you're not one who thinks you need to oppress others with your opinions. There is no hate like religious "love"
@@robertl4824 There is no love like God's/Jesus Christ's unconditional, unfailing. everlasting, perfect love. Jesus Christ/God loves the unlovable. Can you and I do that? Would you and I love the men that are whipping our backs and spitting in our face. Would you and I say Father forgive them for they know not what they are doing. I don't think so! That's what Christ Jesus did for us. Died for the sin of the whole world. Nothing but Glory, honor and Praise should be given to his Holy name. No religion needed. Just faith, faith plus nothing.
Can we please get a Manda update somehow? This woman broke my heart back when I originally watched this and is once again as I am right now. I genuinely hope she is doing better ❤
i hope shes okay wherever she is now
wow that caller has such a lovely nature. being presented with a logical worldview that throws her own into turmoil, and yet accepting the information with strength, grace and even humour. wonderful person.
She can be a nice person, and very stupid in this topic(Religion, gods etc.), because she should not believe at the first place in bullshit like that. My mother same thing, she believe in fucking bullshit, "nice" people tend to believe in bullshit, they are naive sometimes.
Great individual.
@Quincy Breed And your god will be cool with you insulting others and being proud and cheerful about believing someone will be tortured for all eternity? What a coincidence, it's almost as if your god is malleable to your own personal traits! But luckily you were just created in its image, right? 🙄
@Quincy Breed Aha, the problem is *you* think its real,not that someone thinks an imaginary thing is displeased.
Well, like most people against religion make the mistake of comparing a diestic creator to a religious diety. Convenient for you that they're the same thing yet nothing alike.
@Quincy Breed Yeah, I know those were his words, so I added the diestic creator vs religious diety to flesh out what I meant by your concept of god being the problem, not the poking of religious drivel.
"God" does not exist outside our desires. Keep dreaming.
Also also, you can't have god without everything attributed/believed about him and get to pick what people think about him.
You're saying we can't disagree with fictional characters unless we believe they're real.
I'm an atheist but I teared up a little when she started speaking about not seeing her dead relatives again
That’s probably the most evil false promise you could make to someone.
“Oh, you wanna see your dead daddy again? Just give our church money and do everything we say! Don’t worry, Jesus will put you with them after death!”
@@dryfox11 I mean, yeah that specific kind of promise coming from organized religion is awful, but I don't think the concept of an afterlife is inherently wrong.
death can suck sometime z
Being atheist doesn't stop you being human, have empathy or sympathy
Thats what makes life beautiful and precious. Once you realise the true value of time, you will endeavour to spend it wisely with family, friends and things that make you happy, instead of waiting for death to start living in an imaginary paradise.
This woman is so viscerally open with her emotions, I honestly wish the world for her and I hope she lives a long, happy life
I love how much compassion you showed that woman. She was so frightened and got serious cognitive dissonance during the call. Thank you, gentlemen!
I like this, I like this a lot. Christians and Atheists *politely* debating and discussing
Edit: Most of you got the point but some of you missed it entirely. No one has all of the answers, this includes my fellow atheists, and until you can enter a discussion without acting like an all knowing, all seeing entity(lol) you won't learn anything.
Wild Daz yea a lot better than when atheists were executed painfully simply because they were atheists.
The Pineapple Gamer or when Christians were turnt into giant candles by Romans
Wild Daz or when the pope and Muslim powers used religion as a valid reason for war and mass genocide.
The Pineapple Gamer or Vikings 'visiting' English church's
Wild Daz a lot of fucked up things happen lol
This woman breaks my heart, I honestly feel bad for her, religion stopped her from having a a meaningful way to deal with death.
Poorly educated, sadly.
Absolutely right my friend.
You feel sorry for her. God is Love. she has peace in her life. You don't.
@@damianedwards2327 I feel sorry for you, you believe in a god. Like an adult that still believes in Santa or the Toothfairy.
Yes.
Normally, I want to punch the callers, but that woman almost made me cry. She has my sympathy.
She has my deepest respect
She was vulnerable and quite open minded, so polite!
I felt the same. Such a lovely woman but so misguided. Very sad. Imo of course.
yea you can tell they trying to work with her without trying to be disrespectful
It’s sad that she was lied to
Dillahunty's explanations dealing with the loss of a loved one was pure gold.
This was so respectful it was downright Canadian!
Soory
Thank you, and I'm sorry for responding. ;-)
Who in your fam. were who? 'J.A.,' Chile.
Kelly Bults Has a God Prove that there is a god. I’ll wait.
Lmmfao
I lost both of my parents to cancer. As an atheist, I never thought I'd be reunited with them, and because of that I made sure that I made the most of the time I had with them. I took care of my mom in her last days, and that was a privilege for me, rather than thinking I'd see her again some day.
This is one of AXP's best moments. It brought a tear to my eye. Well done, gentlemen.
Scott Plumer: Wow, your story is identical to mine..you made my eyes well up. I send you a heartfelt and respectful hug.
As a fellow human being, I am proud of u sir . In a time where people look for old age homes to dump their parents in , you proved God/religion isn't the source of morality. Well lived !
I understand you Scott, I saw my dad waste away from lung cancer, a loving father who lived a blameless life. Where was a "loving" god involved in these cases? Have a nice life Scott ,you are a decent man.
Quincy Breed that’s a rude thing to say
@Quincy BreedYou are hilarious(stupid) Quincy
This is heartbreaking. It's also a perfect demonstration for the kind of damage religion can do on an individual level. This poor lady has been left with no real coping mechanism for her trauma and nothing but false hope to fall back on.
Gener🇦lly sp🇪aking p🇪ople hav🇪 be🇪n r🇪moved from th🇪ir tru🇪 roots by thre🇪 main r🇪ligions on this 🇪arth. Jud🇦ism, Isl🇦m and Christi🇦nity are the tools that 🇦re b🇪ing us🇪d so no one has any re🇪l spiritu🇦l pow🇪r or knowl🇪dge ex🇪cpt for a sel🇪ct f🇪w at the top.
remove the $ sign: exposing$christianity$.com
That goes for so many Christians, like me! 😢. I keep/kept trying to believe! Through so much trauma, I needed help so I searched God. But I am a studier and I kept reading and studying the Bible! Every time that led me to conclude that it's false! A fairy tail! I listen to apologists and I usually side with the atheists even when I was a Christian. I had to stop listening to maintain my faith but I studied extensively in all avenues and it consistently led and leads me to believe that there is no God of the Bible because that God orders rapes, murders, has slaves etc and the only people that seem to make sense are the atheists or the mystical Christians who have a different method of belief other than the Bible. but I still can't find myself a place.
@@stacielivinthedream8510 remove the $ symbols : joyof$satan$.com & $ancient-forums$.com
@@Henuman something must be wrong with your phone. I didn't put any of those symbols!
@@stacielivinthedream8510 Nothing is wrong here. Messages have to be typed like I did or else I get censored.
So much respect for Manda. This is easily one of the most constructive calls on the show, or at least the modern UA-cam show. Love those “lost episodes” too though!
It's nice to see that there was not only a polite discussion this time, but the hosts appear to have provided Manda a little bit of comfort.
Definitely helps when people don't become hostile when they start slipping in the more formal conversations and their core beliefs are challenged.
CJCroen1393 okay but the bald guy was kind of a dick about it
He "loses" the person when they realize there's more to apologetics then the basic defenses taught in high school. Manda didn't really realize she was on a discussion show and basically just wanted to lash out at something for making her doubt whether or not she was going to be eternally reunited with her relatives.
I'm curious to hear what you think constitutes Matt's word of the day calendar.
Nobody pissed in my Cheerios, and someone disagreeing with you doesn't mean they did. Sorry you don't agree.
Psalm 34:8
Taste and see that the LORD is good; blessed is the one who takes refuge in him.
I've seen a dozen of those videos, and Manda is the first likable caller IMHO.I wish her the best, truly.
I like that she ended with an "I'll pray for you" joke.
@@calebmauer1751 that joke sealed the deal that even though it was though she tried to keep an open mind.
I noticed that too, she’s really nice.
She has no idea she is living inside a man made cult consisting of words.
@@JamesRichardWiley Actually the impression I got throughout the call was that seeds of doubt were being planted.
My heart broke for that caller, she was so sweet, and reasonable, she has my respect and love.
Eric Fouch
Absolutely.
her cognitive dissonance is heartbreaking. You can tell the second she starts doubting her faith.
@@movietimeateds69 I agree with what he says about the deservice religion does by promising to meet those you lose in an afterlife.
Treat everyone like you may never see them again, because you may not.
I tell my wife and kids I love them every time I leave the house because you never know. I never stay mad at anyone, because again you may never know. You could step out your front door and get hit by a falling tree branch and if religion is wrong then that's it.
My step father fought off cancer for 15 years and was in remission. Then on one random check up was told the cancer was back, there was nothing they could do, and he was dead 3 days later (most of which he was a chemically induced coma because he went down hill so fast).
Enjoy your life, love and forgive those around you, treat your existence like it's all you have. Because maybe, probably, it is.
She's not too bright though. I don't have an explanation so there must be God? Atheist is a person who doesn't believe in God? So 2 billion Chinese and Indians having other religions and not believing in God are atheists?? It seems that religion is for below average IQ people.
she's the type who would be having affairs up and down the northeast corridor--it's always these types that do the most sinning.
Seems like a genuinely sweet lady. Whatever she believes today i hope that she's happy and fulfilled.
@@nathanmiller9918 wish we could get her on another call! Although I'm sure not much changed haha
I feel sad for her and angry at religion for doing this to her. You guys did a great job.
@@bryonmyers1058 Explain?
it's not just white people you mouldy tomato
@@bryonmyers1058 it's so funny it's always the fault of white people
@@bryonmyers1058 As opposed to open minded societies such as those in the middle east, right? I wonder how a gay person would fair there. Or a woman. Or an apostate.
Do you think Matt could be doing this show in Egypt? Or Iran? Or Saudi Arabia? Or Pakistan? Or Somalia? Or Yemen? There are countries where apostacy and blasphemy are punishable by death: how about you name me ONE that is predominantly white?
I agree, I think this is one of the best AE clips, love that matt and Jamie show real empathy
Her grandson survives - god healed him, praise be to god.
Her grandson dies - god wanted her grandson to be with him, praise be to god.
Easy answers bro smh
I know right, you can't win against that kind of logic.
lewisner ....if you read the bible, god is cruel as f*ck, lot willing to kill his son for him, approval of slavery! Homophobia....etc, etc...not to mention the contradictions on every other page! It's simply anachronistic mumbo that was designed to keep primitives in line! I don't know about you, but I'm not primitive, most of the time anyway, I need no lord or master. Rather than believe obvious rubbish, why is it so hard for folk just to say that they don't know why something is, or where everything came from. Why can't people see that to say "Wow, the universe is so majestic and mysterious, there must be a bloke who made it!", is just plain daft! It's such a limited human concept to say that somebody must have made it! It's such a spurious argument to say, I can't explain this, so therefore, Allah...or Jesus! Pure lunacy! Grow up people, spare your children from religious brainwashing, it's really the only way of propagating religion, no-one rational just suddenly catches faith (unless, having a breakdown!)
Exactly and...amen!
I was so pissed when my grandpa died it was the saddest moment in my family after my birth. I was 9 and I thought the best response to God was,no more god in my life. Also my cousins questioned God everyday using science and logic which pushed me to read more stuff. I was so disconnected with religion from 9 that by the time I grew up I had no reason to believe in it.
Such a good honest woman. Usually i cringe when listening to most callers. This was refreshing. She sounds like the kind of person everyone should have in their lives. Wow.
Yeah, she's a sweet heart.
Psalm 34:8
Taste and see that the LORD is good; blessed is the one who takes refuge in him.
Poor lass, this is heartbreaking. She's a good girl I think. I'm glad they went easy.
@@loveandfaithfulness4479 well what about how the bible condones slavery? You think that's a good thing?
But on so many of their points did you notice how confused and stuttering she was, as if she just couldn't grasp it or understand what they meant.
It's nice to hear the occasional caller that listens and takes in what the hosts are saying.
I can't appreciate enough how brave this woman is, she genuinely didn't understand the mindset of an atheist and wanted to learn it and she was so kind and honest with her words even though she learned that she might not see her loved ones again after a life of waiting to meet with them in heaven.It's terrifying and it must be so disappointing. That situation is so sad. She's been lied to her all life, she's been told that her sister is in hell. I've never realized how severely religions could harm people emotionally. That was one of the most unique and best calls I've watched. I hope this woman has found ways to deal with her grief better and is happy now.
Agree. In my country (Te Netherlands) young people within several 'indiginous' subreligions have a high suicide rate.
From fear and shame.
13:29 _"How does God tell you that you're gonna meet these people again? - I don't know."_ - That's gotta be the most honest answer ever from a caller on this show!
So...your reward will be to meet your departed ones again in heaven. ?????
As an atheist, l find that amusing..
I'm thinking about the man who, during his lifetime, had a total of four wives.
Each one, a miserable individual, causing this man 'hell on earth'...
Will the same 'reward' be there waiting for him when he arrives in heaven.?
Would his four ex-wives be allowed to now make his life 'hell in heaven' ?
I think shes thinking of rethinking if u know what I mean. I know that was worded horrificly
@@christinecatt5391 Great one! 😍👍😁
Literally the most honest person that has ever called
Sure the yelling and screaming calls are fun to watch, but calls like this are the best, just a nice conversation and answering questions.
When a believer says something happened because they prayed, I always wonder what they think about tragedies? There was just a horrible tornado in Alabama, I guarantee that some of the people that died were praying and they still died! What do believers think of prayer after that? God works in mysterious ways? Grown people talking and asking for things to an invisible man in the sky is just crazy! And yet this woman cannot understand atheism.
@@seanjones2456
Same. I would never make fun of this caller, but I honestly don't understand the mindset that god is responsible for the good things in her life, with the knowledge that bad things happen to people all the time. How is her grandson's life more worth saving than others? It boggles the mind.
Religious people grew up with “god” as a coping mechanism for hard times. Yet they still don’t understand it’s a medieval tale. Props to these guys for being so patient and perfectly and respectfully explaining it to this wonderful woman. Guess I’m just lucky that my parents raised me without any religion, got all the tools I need to be a good person and cope with loss. anyway have a good day and don’t be too hard on religious people guys, they’re people too.
I hate the yelling and screaming calls. They're ugly, and they go nowhere.
"I'll pray for you. That was a joke!" That made me laugh. This call was so wholesome :)
@Sharon Cinna
When people say "I ll pray for you", I answer "I ll THINK for you"
Usually, they flee !
@Sharon Cinna But as a joke, it was spot on.
She was very sweet.
@George Khoory I bet you're pretty young.
@George Khoory That's fine. I don't care what you do.
This is officially my fave video w/ Matt. Lost my Dad a few years ago and this makes me feel some ease
Manda seems like such a sweet and genuine person. Even when she misinterpreted the hosts and thought they were saying horrible things about her, she kept her cool, stayed civil and didn't jump to conclusions. She asked honestly how anyone can be an atheist because she didn't understand it and actually listened to the answers because she genuinely just wanted to know rather than asking to have an excuse to be arrogant and feel superior. I wish her all the best and really hope she's doing well.
I do wonder about the ethics of destroying someone's entire reality. Even though I'm a fervent atheist.
@@joshuataylor3550 There was nothing destructive in this conversation. Matt and Jamie were honest, supportive, and deeply empathic. Manda lives in the same reality that we all do (as she always has), and has had an honest conversation.
@joshuataylor3550 i actually understand what you mean by this, however they are not stating anything as complete fact, and actually really understood why she thought the way she did. And she is clearly old enough to either ignore it or not. All they did was show her something she had never considered before. I do wonder if she ever explored those new views on reality more
@@thedarksiderebelgreat statement, I wanted to say somthing but didnt know how I would word it. Well done
This made me cry. She is so lovely and was handled so sensitively as a result. I hope she was able to cope with the reality bomb.
I know. It made me so sad when she mentioned how she'd lost loved ones and had been looking forward to seeing them again.
Pussy
@@vincentranger09 ur a tough guy like it really rough guy
Vincent Ranger ur profile pic proves your a pussy cuz only pussies like cats! In fact if u feel any emotions at all you’re a fucking pussy princess
Vincent Ranger it's important that we pretend out emotions don't exist, right? Because god forbid we connect with people with anything other than our fists...
"My sister dared me to call the show."
Leaves in tears about her shattered beliefs.
She was asking, "how can y'all be atheists," but wanted to know "how can I become an atheist and still be ok - I am questioning but afraid."
I doubt her sister did that, it’s plausible deniability in case someone from her church or family sees her on this.
@@hanshananigan1233 I don't think she's gonna throw away her belief system, but it's nice that she understands that her sister might not be burning in hell for committing suicide.
@@Christobanistan wait a second, does she have two sisters? because if it's the same sister, then uhhhhhh
…never talks to sister again😟
You can hear her heart breaking slowly as the call goes on, just hit after hit, and damn dude, it feels bad remembering how I had the same breakdowns when I stopped believing
same omg
It's an absolute nightmare
It's so crazy they setup this false narrative then you have to work backwards out of it and it does suck
Same here. I felt like I was losing a father. Really strange and painful
This woman never dealed with her sister's loss, believing she will see her again, until finding out that this is likely not true. I felt sorry for her. Life is hard.
This was a depressing show
Agreed. Although I think knowing the reality that once you’re dead, you’re dead, is more comforting. Just because you know you that your time is short so don’t hold grudges, do good things for others, take care of yourself and many more stuff that will make life better for not only yourself but for others aswell. Your family member died of cancer? Donate to cancer researchers so you know you’ve just prevented someone else from suffering a loss. What if one day, you’re the person who’s loss was prevented because someone donated to find out a cure?.
LIFE IS A MYSTERY AND WILL REMAIN SO.
@@DENIEL381 No, it's not, mostly. Which part don't you understand?
That bit broke my heart. Religion do be shitty like that.
Simple answer: We are all born atheists. Right up until you are TAUGHT about god and then the moment you actually believe. Before that you are an atheist.
@Marcus Vincent Not really.
@Marcus Vincent How?
@Caleb Drake Hopefull... Or stupid, hard to say.
@@aeronautisch Thats not what Agnostic means. If you actually look at the definition for Agnostic it is impossible to be born Agnostic. Atheism is a lack of belief while agnosticism is an actual belief.
Being born with a belief is less reasonable than being born lacking one.
@@aeronautisch Umm no, you can't call a disbelief a belief. It is by definition a LACK of belief and not an actual belief.
Like the difference between believing unicorns exist and not. Belief being an acceptance of something usually without proof. To believe is to do. To not believe is to not do.
Atheism is the name for the neutral stance people take when they are not believing in deities. The moment someone religious loses their faith they become an atheist until they find a new deity they believe in.
Sorry for the extra padding but i needed to make sure you understood that what you said was factually wrong. Just find a dictionary and it should explain this.
She had literally never talked to an athiest. Amazing.
it's a shame the church paints us as demon worshipers so people like Manda are sacred to have a conversation with such a person.
Lynchburg VA. That's why.
She has. She just doesn’t know it.
She has spoken to atheists before but she was probably just not aware they were atheists.
Well. To be fair, I dont exactly walk around introducing myself "hi, I'm an atheist", so odds are most people wouldn't ever know they have spoken to one.
Amanda, thank you for calling in. It’s been several years since you did so, but you moved me. When I was a theist, I felt comfort thinking that someday I would see my loved ones who passed. When I realized that was not true, I became hurt. Then I became angry at religion. After that I accepted the truth, and what gives me joy now is not some cruel, baseless promise to make me submit. The thing that brings me joy is the miracle of being conceived, the randomness of it all, and in addition, the finality of being alive. Having the opportunity to have consciousness and sharing my life with loved ones is the reward in itself. To me that is much more valuable and more beautiful than what any religion or god can promise. Hope you are doing well, Amanda. Big virtual hugs from Costa Rica to wherever you may be ❤.
I think this is my favourite call. She is genuinely curious and confused, everyone is polite and gentle, and she seems to understand, even if not accept their reasoning, and they understand her. Poor lady.
the good cop bad cop duality of matt and jamie drops, matt was the most gentle I've seen him in a long time
@@ntrunnrracl He ALMOST got angry over nothing once, but toned down thankfully haha
Yer I love this call too
The caller, Manda, is an example of the extremes of how religion makes people unhealthy co-dependency on religion. The use of fear factor tactics by religion is very psychologically damaging.
Yet she seems to be a really good person. She should be perfectly free to be whatever she wants. I'm pretty certain she is mistaken, but whether or not she reconciles that mistake with a more logical view or not, it is still entirely her right. Sometimes I even wish I could believe. It would be comforting.
@Folk Aart Yes, but she is not.
@@leslierhorer1412 I'm confused by your post. The OP was not insinuating she wasn't, or shouldn't, be free to believe how she wants.
Religion poisons our minds and the church can find a way to make anything bad , Working out " your doing it to attract the opposite sex" same with make up, video games , bars clubs, playing the lottery, looking at a woman for to long is the same as the actual sex act, i could go on and on,
@@leslierhorer1412 The problem is that religious leaders use Manda and those like her to maintain their social, economic, and political dominance over areas like Lynchburg, VA. I live in Virginia myself and am surrounded by Christians. Allowing their views to go unchallenged has stagnated the culture here to an incredible degree. The comfort they derive from their beliefs is always outweighed by the damage wrought to themselves and society.
“Baptist don’t recognize each other in the liquor store”😆🤣
I do not get the joke, are baptists not allowed to drink alcohol? Why else would not they recognize each other?
Hey I don't get it too. Explain please. :D
@@NetAndyCz When I was being brought up Baptist and alcohol, all alcohol was strictly forbidden! No card playing, smoking, rock music, dancing (other than country or ballroom-type), lottery playing, etc. I do now, 40-some years later, have friends and the preacher's wife from a local Baptist church who feel it's fine to have a sip of wine or other alcohol on occasion. It has to do with that verse about not polluting your temple (body).
@@tomosko2669 See above comment.
@@debbieomi Ah, I suspected that would be the case, thank you for the explanation!
I love it when people take the time to listen to each other.
This caller just made me feel so sad. It very much sounds like she is having doubts but can't quite let go of her faith because of the comfort it brings her. And I guess she has no one around her to discuss these doubts, so it's good she could at least call in and get some things of her chest.
I think the lies told to her growing up that she would see her brother and sister again prevented her from dealing with their deaths. I think she truly listened to what Matt & Jamie said and it made sense. Now she is conflicted with clinging to a faith that she clearly has doubts about or having to realize that she will not see her brother and sister again. For her it is like the just died again. I have great empathy for her. If she was before me I'd give her a firm hug.
This is good example of the damage done by the lies of religion.
I can say the same about atheists...you can't seem to let it go because the comfort it brings you.
@@3joewj You are wrong, it is the hurt and damage that theist do to others. For example there are christians that are spreading the coronavirus because of pastors that care more about filling their collection plates than people's safety.
1) Can you tell me how many states have laws banning christians from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)?
2) Can you tell me how many states have tried to pass laws banning christians from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)?
3) Can you tell me how many states have laws banning Atheists from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)?
4) Can you tell me how many states have tried to pass laws banning Atheists from holding public office (public office is anything from dog catcher to elected official)?
5) How many children are kicked out of the home by christians for saying they no longer believe?
6) How many people are ostracized from family, friends and the community by christians for saying they don't believe?
7) How man children are kicked out of the house for saying they found religion by Atheists?
8) How many people are ostracized from family, friends and the community by Athiests for saying they don't believe?
ANSWERS:
1) NONE
2) NONE
3) There are at least 5 states that have laws on the books banning atheists from holding public office even though it is unconstitutional.
4) ALL 50 states have christians trying to get laws past to ban Atheists and non christians from being allowed to serve in any public office.
5) No evidence that this ever happens
6) No evidence that this ever happens
7) 100's of children are either kicked out of the house each year because they no longer believe in god.
8) 100's perhaps 1000's each year people are forced to move or a re too terrified to voice that they no longer believe in the crap that the religion everyone else believes in. Religion teaches people to hate their brothers, their sisters, their children, their mothers and fathers, family and friends. According to the bible the mythical jesus said this.
@ what you wrote has zero relevance to what I said.
@ bullshit...give me 2 examples of Atheists being killed for their rights or beliefs in America.
My whole heart. She has it. She sounds like a lovely person. Religious or not.
She was trolling!
Right?!
Jule Rulez I don’t think so. She’s just a kind person engaging in a conversation.
Gary B. You’re either an ass, or you’ve lived under a rock and don’t understand language
Jesse Rose He’s just an edgy guy who thinks misrepresenting context gives him a leg up on somebody else, ignore him.
They are so respectful towards her...I love it!
When your belief system is demolished by a sentence or two, you need something to cope with in the meantime. I'm glad for the manner of both hosts. It's clear this caller will be psychologically broken without religion.
Inability to deal with emotional stress is probably from her upbringing given her sister committed suicide.
@Bob Smith a fundamental belief, like your religion?
I've never heard a more contradictory statement, delusion or science. Pick one or enjoy cognitive dissonance.
Just because you survived jumping off a bridge doesn't mean everyone will. It's clear religion is a crutch for what she should have internally generated.
@Bob Smith well if you're happy living in internal conflict and hold two conflicting ideas, I won't stop you. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'm not worried about how your mind works as it's not based on reason. My years will be many as I'm only 25, I don't aim for peace, it's a fools errand. I'd prefer to live honestly,
@Bob Smith I guess you failed reading comprehension. If you're okay with living conflicted, that's your choice and I won't stop you. Anything else you didn't catch, buddy?
@Bob Smith geez, you really are dense, bob.
There isn't a cure for imbecility but I guess Religion is it for you 😂
I’ve watched quite a few of these videos and I have to say that the honesty and sincerity shared between these three people showed me more respect, love, and compassion than any religion ever has. The apprehension and earnestness of Manda actually made me sit up a little taller and listen. I just listened. This is the kind of conversation that I would love to have with the Christians in my life, if only they would have a conversation with me rather than proselytizing.
I’m saving this one. Thanks.
Yeah, this is one of my favorite episodes as she was so upfront and honest and even though she most likely will not change her beliefs, her call may have planted the seed of doubt for her. Everything about this call was basically the ultimate in compassion.
I hope Manda is doing better. She seemed really nice and understanding.
She probably killed herself
Bryon Myers. Hahaha goddamn dude haha.
This Is My Name You’ve got a new horizon it’s ephemeral style
A melancholy town where we never smile
And all I wanna hear is the message beep
My dreams I gotta kiss em cus I don’t get sleep no
❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
@@bryonmyers1058
Even if she did, it's in poor taste to suggest it.
This was amazing. I feel like this is one of the few religious people who actually got something out of a conversation with you, because she was honest and modest and actually listened to what you had to say
nothing but respect for this woman. no matter who are you. These guys handled the conversation like pro's! Nothing but respect for these guys!
This was a very respectful and thoughtful discussion. I wish we could all speak to eachother this way.
I think you actually got through to her, which is rare in these types of debates
Only because she was genuinely curious and willing to listen and try to understand someone else's point of view.
I think all 3 people in this conversation did justice to the difficulty of differences in spiritual beliefs.
A: "How can you possibly not believe in god?"
B: "Do you believe in Zeus, Mithra, Krishna, Xindi... ?"
A: "No! Of course not!"
B: "Here you go..."
I have already killed Zeus in God of war 3
@Quincy Breed no, your god was invented by man, just like the 3000. Nice try tho.
@Quincy Breed It's pretty clear that this conversation is going to end quickly, as my IQ is much too high to argue with a brainwashed scrub like yourself. All gods were created by man. The end. Oh btw, the bible has a talking donkey in it. Think about that for a moment, take your time.
Quincy Breed any person can make up a god because it’s all make believe. It’s all in our heads.
Quincy Breed well if that happens I couldn’t honestly say that anymore because that god is right before me. It wouldn’t be in my head. I would be humbled to know a god does in fact exist. I would love to communicate with it. I would have so many questions for it.
Good for Matt and Jamie for treating her with care and compassion.
This was f___ing amazing. Bravo to both of you for a compassionate and logical discussion with a grieving person.
I love how kind and patient the hosts are. This was a great conversation. I hope the lady is ok.
yeah its not the normative standard, i can tell you that when it comes to Matt.
@@el29 no, its because she didn’t attempt to use semantics or pull any BS tactics or had an air of superiority.
@@el29 I agree, he can be rude. But from what I see he makes a clear distinction between people who want to sell him BS and do not even try to go along his reasoning and people who at least try, but can't out of their fortified mindset due to whatever reason.
You can clearly see this when Matt, based on what the caller said, made a logical argument, the caller first agrees and then switches back to his old BS without giving any reason why he switches back.
Question: How can anyone be an atheist? Answer: You know how you don't believe in leprechauns? It's like that.
i think theres a fundamental difference between believing in one god, disregarding the others, and disreguarding all of them... you don't have any faith system in a creator so its fundamentally different. i think atheists should stop with the "one god further, you know exactly what its like to not believe" line it seems misleading; do you know what i mean?
@@hunternewberry5860 Most humans grow out of the majority of the fairytales they believed in when they were kids, in fact a non trivial fraction actually grow out of all of them so I really don't find it that convincing to argue that they are fundamentally different because they didn't throw out their childhood belief in one particular sky wizard along with fantasy beliefs in fairies and whatever other mythical creatures from stories kids tend to believe are real until they grow up and learn to tell the difference between fiction and reality on most things in their life.
@@seraphina985 it really should be simple to understand that the difference between belief in 1 god and 0 is fundamentally different than not believe in #2 or 3 or 4. It means you believe in nothing. It's what the lady in the video was having a hard time understanding. I'm just saying it's easy to disregard all but one god, the last leap, from 1 to 0 is by far the longest and most difficult jump for most people because theres nothing to land on on the other side.
My point: Its fundamentally not as easy to go one god further as it is to disregard all the others, so people should stop saying it is
@@hunternewberry5860 Err no not at all I believe in many things I just require reasonable evidence to support those beliefs you know like any of the thousands of other beliefs that even religious people have like the belief that the sun will rise tomorrow because it has been demonstrated that the sun does exist and that the rotation of the Earth causes it to consistently rise up from behind the horizon and into the sky in an arc every day at my location.
The god belief is usually the only one that people tend to hold that they have massive cognitive dissonance over as they have to constantly twist reality to fit in with the narrative surrounding the one singular belief that they insist on believing not only without evidence but in direct conflict with the evidence.
@@seraphina985 you dont seem to be addressing my point at all. My point, and the only reason I ever commented, was to say that the phrase "we go one god further" is making the jump from a theist to an atheist seem as insignificant as the disregard of other gods, when in reality, and pretty obviously, there is a significant difference in believing in 1 god and none
Well done! Sensitively handled. I wish this brave lady well.
WOW, a caller that was genuine and actually listened, I don't recall that ever happening. What a nice lady, I kind of felt bad for her.
She also seems to be sort of on the fence with religion!! She didn't sound very certain in her convictions
What an amazing call, being thoughtful and understanding human relating so someone who is in pain. Two Internets each to Jamie and Matt For helping someone who is in grief then putting her in the correct direction to cope you guys are truly goodhearted. That's one of the ways how i became a free of religion. This call was wonderful.
Giant Pants "how can you be kind without god in your life?"
Very glad she was open-minded :]
Of caurse you can be kind with out some tin pot god in your life . You treat other's how you would like to be treated.
@@uPick-iLick religion isn't exactly seated in morals, they teach us to treat women as second class people, tells us to stone someone who works on Sunday, and has started countless wars. People have morals and have had morals long before any religion graced our presence.
I agree. We can agree to disagree on any issue, but we aren't human without compassion. We all know pain, and we should all feel for those who are clearly suffering emotionally. I miss my dad terribly, and I'd give anything to talk to him and hang out with him again one day. I'd love the afterlife to be true. Unfortunately, I hafta weigh the evidence and accept reality. I'm still grateful for every second I had with him and wouldn't trade places with anybody.
@@APPR3NTIC3
You forgot to mention the innocent women, children, puppies, and kittens that Yahweh ordered slaughtered for the terrible sin of living in a town that he wanted for his chosen tribe.
Wow this made me sad just thinking about my mom and how strongly she feels about Jesus. Child indoctrination is a terrible thing I’m so glad I was able to break out.
Glad you escaped my friend
Did you ever consider maybe it wasn't God that painted that negative aspect of himself but mankind interpreted it wrong? You just jump right to God not existing instead of possibly thinking the logical thing that human may have made an error in their interpretation.
If atheist are prepared to declare God does not exist then they better have a goddamn answer for where imagination comes from, why we are self aware etc. Aspects of life just as mystical and supernatural as atheism thinks God is.
God is literally more real than your own imagination, there are several books that mention God and gives some understanding of God, however you are the only person on Earth that is in observance of your own imagination and you are the only one who can validate it no one else. Care to explain why we should believe you have one or your existence is valid since God didn't create you and your existence by default is mystical?
@@evilcowboy Oh i don't know how imagination works, i don't know how my existence is valid, how mystical things happen oh so it must be god! Did you even watch the video!?
@@evilcowboy prove god exists please
Was an extremely devout christian, served and tithed in spite of not having money left over for food or bills (ex-husband's gambling didn't help, the only time that resulted in money was me forcing him to sell his gaming cards). Faithfully brought my kids to church every single weekend, mostly Saturday evenings. Those same kids have zero interest in church today, zero religious faith.
Turns out church members freaked them out by being way too touchy feely.
Imagine if this brave and curious woman had been taught critical thinking skills from a young age--her inability to process logically is heartbreaking and a waste of a potentially fine mind.
It really is a shame. I don't hate religious people at all, and I hope that other atheists feel the same way. I only hate what others have done to their brains, because we and the rest of the world are missing out on what they have to offer.
I kinda felt bad about the fact that they couldnt console her better. Look they couldve added that based on scientific evidence we dont know if there is or isnt an afterlife. So far not much says there is proof of an afterlife in a common religious sense, but science always improves and maybe there could be one. After all they cant say there isn't.
greekgoddessmom , well put! I quite agree. It's the indoctrination of youth, that's how religion is propogated and young minds are bent into blind obedience! No-one just wakes up with an organized faith..(except a handful of happy clappers who've had some kind of breakdown!)
Chipmunk I see your point, but for me it comes down to whether you care about actual truth or just what makes people feel better. There are a lot of truths in this world that don't make people very happy, but to me happiness that is based on nonsense feels very hollow.
It is possible to be an atheist and find happiness and meaning in life, it just takes some mental work to get there if you've been subjected to religious brainwashing up to that point.
Chipmunk I don’t think it’s a question of spreading atheism, it’s becoming more usual as people educate themselves, and it’s important that people who want to break their religious conditioning know they’re not alone.
She sounded like a really nice lady, who’s been hurt a lot. Whatever she decides to do, I hope that she can get peace of mind and continue to live her life a bit more freely than before.
As an atheist who use to be Christian I'd say she's very christ-like. That's how I'd want Christians to be like.
This lady is incredible and sweet. Good for her to challenge herself by calling in.
@NeverFinished 3Digits What call did you listen to? It's not a sob story is a real problem caused by religion that needs to be addressed or you think that religious people going around indoctrinating people about the existence of an afterlife and even worst, hell, is something to ignore?
@NeverFinished 3Digits wtf are you talking about? that caller is pretty much the reason why the atheist experience started
@NeverFinished 3Digits you cannot be this stupid? this type of caller/person is literally why the show started, because religion can have such a strangle hold on a persons ability to think rationally( exactly like this caller), as well as having no tools to handle grief
@NeverFinished 3Digits when I say " that caller" I mean, a theist that has been trapped her whole life because of religion and doesn't have the tools to cope with loss, or to evaluate things logically. that is pretty much what the show is about, showing people that there is a better way to live life rather than living it with the bullshit reason of faith. 'that caller' is 1 of millions who quite clearly need a wake up call, which is 100% (along with an outlet for atheists themselves, what the show is about and was created for. I didn't think it needed that much of an explanation but with you, clearly it did.
@@Simon-nv5zj Yes he can and is this stupid. He just watches the show for the antagonistic theists defending stupid ideas, he is not interested in morality, society and the effect of religion on both. The waste of time is interacting with this kind of ignorant assholes.
That was beautiful!!! Matt and Matt Jr. (aka. Jamie) did a fantastic job.
Also was it refreshing to see a such open-minded Christian!
I 100% agree, that was a really good conversation.
Justin Copley
Um, yeah!
If you'd follow the ACA shows you'd get it. Don't say "No" to something you have no clue about.
Just a bunch of entitled white people disregarding the other 7.5 billion people on this planet.
Bryon Myers
You never made it out of your Christianity-poluted country, have you? ...don't bother answering. I don't expect any useful response from a rasist. A bit hypocritical, don't you think, as a Christian? ...But certainly not surprising!
Bryon Myers
Oh, just a troll. Okay then.
I know it’s an old episode, but truly, this was not only a beautiful example of how to explain a position sensibly, it was definitely the most heartfelt and sincere appreciation from both sides I think I’ve ever seen in a debate about atheism and blind faith. Manda has my respect for listening and questioning, and even questioning her own beliefs, even if she didn’t change her stance. Maybe she has, now. Great work, guys.
I came back and found this specific call just to instil some love for humanity. The last four years have been so truly maddening. Yet this call exists 🙏
When I was in high school I was still religious, but my boyfriend was an atheist. We had long conversations much like this one. I very nearly convinced him that it would be nice if Christianity was right so that even if we were separated by death if we were good people we could see each other again someday.
But within a couple of years, with my increasing exposure to different ways of thinking as well as learning more about how to reason for myself, my faith was beginning to break. I asked a lot more questions at Sunday school and youth group, and was increasingly uncomfortable with the answers.
But the straw that broke the camel's back so to speak, was during Sunday school one week where our pastor was sitting in with our senior high group, and we were discussing the afterlife. I found out that my pastor did not believe that we would be able to see individual loved ones in Heaven, because according to him Heaven was not a place where people live in a great house together, but was more metaphysical. It was the returning of the soul or spirit or energy, whatever you want to call it, back to the great energy that is God. So although you are together again, it's not as individuals but as a big energy ball I guess. His opinion was also that Hell is not a place where people burn, but rather is the sadness and emptiness from the lack of being together with God for all eternity. I asked why no one else had ever said such a thing, and why we were told the story of Heaven as paradise with loved ones, and Hell as burning for your sins. He said that those were just colloquial stories built by popular culture and had no actual basis in the Bible. I suppose that is true, but there also wasn't anything in there describing his exact ideas either.
But the reason that his idea broke my faith was that the comfort of the idea of Heaven as a paradise with loved ones was the major selling point for me. I could also see why the fear of burning in Hell would be a deterrent. But without that reward or that threat, what was the incentive? Why would I be afraid of being without God for eternity if I do not experience his presence in life anyway? How is it any different? And even if he was wrong, it just shows the inconsistencies, and that even the people that are supposedly an authority don't know what they're talking about.
After college my boyfriend and I married. We wanted to have kids together, but that didn't end up working out because we went through several years of poverty after a series of unfortunate events, and didn't have the money. The culminating unfortunate event was that my husband was taken from me at only 32 years old by cancer. Back when we were in high school and I was a believer, there was a different series of events that had led to us dating, and the arrogant Christian that I was, I had thought that we were meant to be together and God had given us to each other. When he died and people prayed for me and told me their comforting lies about God's plan and being in a better place, it just made me angry. If God had given us to each other, why would he take him away from me too soon, before we even got a chance to have a family? If that was his plan then it sucks. I mourn the loss of him, but also the loss of his time, of our time together, and our dreams. Sometimes I still like to pretend that maybe he is in a separate plane of existence somewhere and he can watch over me even if I can't see him anymore, because it really can be comforting sometimes even if there's absolutely no proof of it. But I'm fully aware that it's just a coping mechanism, and a poor one at that.
Now, even though I live in a conservative town and it would be easier to meet new people that way, I wouldn't even try to bring myself back into religion. Although the rituals and the lies and sense of belonging can bring comfort, they can also bring much harm. As an educated adult I cannot support a god that condones slavery, objectifies women, and strikes down anyone he's not happy with despite creating them and knowing that they're imperfect. There's also a lot of evidence that the supposed Word of God- the Bible- has been tampered with repeatedly by men in order to exert greater control over the masses.
I suppose if the Christian God really does exist then I will hope that other gods, other heavens, other dimensions, other reincarnations, whatever, also exist and can bring a greater chance of being able to experience again. But if not, if there's really nothing but here and now, then there's still the comfort that I and my atheist husband, as well as people bullied by Christianity such as LGBTQIA+ people, will not have to burn in Hell.
That is a good comment.
Thank you for sharing.
Reading between your lines I can tell you are an intelligent, open-minded person, but most of all a good person. I believe that in the long run our pain makes us stronger (it certainly makes us deeper), but it's not an invisible fix.
Thank you for sharing this. Even though the ultimate reason for me finally giving up on religion is just a bit different from yours, you have articulated my thoughts and sentiments perfectly. And you're very eloquent. I hope everything goes on well for you because I can very much relate to everything you said
I hope your life improves and happiness comes your way soon.
Credit to you for the dignity & respect you showed to this lady.
If someone says I prayed my grandchild got into remission and got better. It`s gods work. Well where is he when starving children pray for food?
As an atheist, I hold no position against religious ppl. If someone like this woman caller so believes that god saved her son, so be it. I don't believe there is real harm in believing things as such if the person is genuinely good. It is when the person(s) are not good, I won't even dare say "genuinely" good, lol that these types of religious beliefs are not just bad but harmful to the person themselves and to others.
Richard Dawkins: Many of us saw religion as harmless nonsense. Beliefs might lack all supporting evidence but, we thought if people needed a crutch for consolation, where's the harm? September 11th changed all that. Revealed faith is not harmless nonsense, it can be lethally dangerous nonsense. Dangerous because it gives people unshakeable confidence in their own righteousness. Dangerous because it gives them false courage to kill themselves, which automatically removes normal barriers to killing others. Dangerous because it teaches enmity to others labeled only by a difference of inherited tradition. And dangerous because we have all bought into a weird respect, which uniquely protects religion from normal criticism. Let's now stop being so damned respectful!
I feel it's rather arrogant to think "god" saved "your" child while millions are dying very horribly around the world. We won't get into rape prevention or molesting priests......god works wonders when things are going great but we're told he has a different plan for us when the shit end of the stick snarles it's ugly head🤔
@castroy64 when beliefs aren't questioned and taken for granted you get RELIGION... Most atheists ( not all) were at one time a believer in ones religion until critical thinking comes into play. We have real life issues people are facing here on Earth that any god can't seem to fix but always commanding respect and honor and complete obedience to if not, there's a place for you the saviour created especially for you🔥🔥🔥. Unconditional love is just that.. ( free of judgement)
@castroy64 how the fuck do you explain cancer or natural disasters which take the lives of alot of believers. I suppose all this " bitching" is nonsense and god shouldn't have to hear it? You're the creator asshole do something. Why praise a dog?
@@namelessrose3859 stats are bullshit it really shows your character true gullibility at best. The Catholic Church has hidden child molestation for years undercover. You'll be surprised what goes on right under our noses. Religion is cancer, dumb atheists blah blah. Most people who don't believe now used to hold some form of religious beliefs until you actually READ the Bible or quran they both fall apart quickly after reading genesis. There is a battle going on... ( For our brains) everyone has their hand in the candy jar of imaginary friends. I say "No, thank you"
That she called in to talk and didn't do the typically smug "Here's my argument, I'll let you talk but I'm not listening because I know I'm right" speaks volumes of her. She genuinely didn't know what to expect, and I'm pretty sure this conversation shook her foundations... but to her credit, she let it be a conversation.
@eric sosa So you're going to make an assumption and generalization of all atheists because you don't like his comment, huh? I won't take offense to this cause it's stupid, but I want you to think about the comment you just made and realise that it is a blatant generalization.
@eric sosa Like I said, I don't take offense to it. I just want you to think about what you are saying. Rather than make generalizations and assumptions why not treat us like you would any other person? We're not bad people, but we're seen that way by many simply because religions like to display us in a bad fashion. I'm just trying to have you understand is all.
@eric sosa Look, I completely agree with you that some people can be insulting towards religion without merit. The opposite is also true with religions towards atheism. My point is this: your comment portrayed all atheists in a bad light. There's nothing wrong with you holding an opinion, that's fine. But vocalizing it that way comes off as arrogant and rude. Now, I'm not particularly offended by it, since I more or less just see it as someone having an opinion that doesn't really apply to me, but regardless I felt it would be proper to point out what you did to you. That way, you may learn from it, and hopefully not do it again.
She is the best caller I've seen so far in terms of conversation
You guys handled this lady respectfully and beautifully about her loss. Thank you.
As much as I love a good Matt smackdown, I have always loved his compassion when he's dealing with real searchers like this woman more. Jamie was sweet af usual. Im picking through old episodes I've missed.
The lady was genuinely terrified at the thought there may not be an afterlife
The three of them listened to each other, that was the greatest benefit of this conversation
I mean, I am too.
If wanting made things so, we'd all be rich, fit, hung, and immortal.
@Quincy Breed
Is there one?
@Quincy Breed
I think no one has proven there is one.
But I'm ready to be convinced.
@Quincy Breed
I can't predict the future, the claim could take so many shapes it's impossible for me to tell you how you should prove your case to me.
That being said, a demonstration would be appropriate. Mind you, I'm asking for a demonstration, not an explanation. Show, don't tell.
You could show me exactly how a person gets to the afterlife you're attempting to prove.
You could show me the place itself, wherever that afterlife is.
Now I can save you some time, can we agree that words on an internet forum would not be sufficient to demonstrate the existence of an afterlife?
This is a very decent person. I appreciate that Jamie and Matt handled her with care without backing off their position.
If you've been lied to your entire life, even if it was intended to be for your benefit, the arrival of truth can be devastating and confusing. I can't overstate how well this was handled by both hosts and caller. Hopefully it was the beginning of a real healing journey. I sometimes regret that these stories don't have follow-ups. Manda, wherever you are, I hope you are well.
Two things:
1) the commercial for this video is from the Mormon church. hehe.
2) if you want to be an atheist, read the bible. If you want to be a believer, cherry pick your bible.
I am an athiest but I don't want to read the bible I'm more into books with lots of fighting like Lord of The Rings and The Hobbit and the bible doesn't have that
There is lots of fighting in the bible! Huge wars waged by wandering desert armies imbued with the power of their god - nations destroying nations. AND there is magic! Pillars of fire and smoke, talking animals and bushes, unicorns and leviathans and angels and demons and devils.
@@LupaPuella yeah but is gandalf in the bible? no he isn't so
LOTR-2500000000000000(cause orcs and dwarves and gondor and uruk-hai and sauron and the rest of LOTR)
bible-0
There are REAL giants in the bible. They came from angels boning hot human women. Can you find that in your "LOTR?" NO. You can't.
There are also witches who talk to the dead and sometimes they do it for the servants of god - which is SNEAKY because.
OH yeah, It has GOD - you know, bigger and badder than stupid suron or saran or whatever.
@@LupaPuella yeah but there are *STONE* giants in the Hobbit and the one ring used by Sauron is more powerfull than any god and there are witches in the hobbit that can speak to the dead and there are the Nagul neither dead nor living so
LOTR-2500000000001
bible-0
This is the best type of conversation, no one is yelling, no one's hanging up, it's just understand someone else's view.
How about GOD`s view? GOD says that we are lawbreakers, and rebels, but He loves us anyway. So either you are a unique creation and loved by GOD or you are a cosmic accident and destined to return to the dust. Which do you prefer?
@@johndoney2665 doesn't matter what I or you prefer. Just matter what actually happens and there is no proof of a creation, therefore I can't say that happened
@@johndoney2665 I prefer to live based on what I honestly believe to be true, not what sounds good.
@@JCbeatProductions So you would prefer to be a worthless cosmic accident rather than a unique creation of GOD. that sounds like a stubborn child that refuses to use logic.
@@johndoney2665 so you would rather be another useless slave to God rather than a beautiful natural organism that came about from natural processes.
See how easy it is to reframe these?
Ps. You shouldnt accuse anyone else of being a stubborn child given your petulance
She sounds like a genuine person that’s just been misguided. Most of us have. Hopefully she finds her way if she hasn’t by now.
She is genuine. God is the existence of Love. Everybody believes Love exists. To degrade that obviously comes with serious Consequences. You egotistically ignoring that is misguided.
@@damianedwards2327 so why call it a god if we already call it love? If love is your god, cool. I believe love is real. I don’t think it’s a god. It’s an emotion. So you god is basically an emotion. A feeling. Nothing more.
@@arios1977 Very True. God and Love are the same thing. But the word God is needed to make a NECESSARY Distinction.
Because Athiest are ashamed of Love. When people explain the importance of Love, Athiests Minimize it. Because they see Humbling as being weak. When being humble to Love is actually our Strength.
We all access love in our daily life. But we must ALWAYS REMEMBER love obviously has to be ELEVATED.
Elevated meaning Higher.
That's what the word God MEANS.
Which is why people say Higher Power.
Because WITHOUT the title God, Love just becomes something Athiests use when they Want something and throw it away when they get tired of it, like an old iPhone.
And that Athiest way of thinking is the worst crime we could ever commit.
@Gen. Clorox Bleach Very True. God is the existene of Love and No matter how crazy life gets... you've Never thrown Love away.
Right?
When you have a Friend who is struggling, you don't throw Love away.
That is when our Vanity is humbled. And we realize Love is actually the only thing that matters
Thats why I am so passionate against Atheism. We should NEVER throw Hope away. But Athiests Do.
And they PROMOTE it.
As far as facing Pain in life, You wouldn't have life Without obstacles and hurdles.
That's why God created Human Choice. Without the creation of hurdles and human flaw, it would be like shooting a basketball and it always going in the hoop. there would be no point.
You would have no story.
That is what Life was created for. OUR STORY
Without the story, there would be No books, no music, no tv, no movies. Nothing. With human choice and overcoming obstacles...Life has intense MEANING.
Obstacles not only show what you CAN achieve. But obstacles also show you what you never thought Possible.
To impress athiests,You may publicly disagree...but then you'll probably go watch a movie.
Awesome
@@damianedwards2327 how is your god the existence of love? Animals feels love and they have no concept of this god of yours. All you’re saying is your god is an emotion. If you god created anything, you need to demonstrate that. Not just assert it, like this human choice you’re talking about. So if we have a choice, then your god isn’t an all knowing one, so that’s out of the equation. So how does an emotion create whatever it is you think it creates? Please demonstrate. As far as we know, emotions alone don’t create anything. People do.
Most relatable and honest caller I've heard so far, thanks for being nice to her.
Of the many AE calls I’ve watched, this is easily my favorite so far. It’s just so sincere and open. Bravo, Matt and Jaime for a refreshing half hour of pure empathy and reason. And to the caller, I just wanted to hug her to make her feel a little better about what happened with her sister. I could only imagine how much guilt she must feel.
This is why I watch this show.
Greetings from the Philippines.
Hey man. Great to see another Filipino here. I am a closet atheist since many people here in our country do not take kindly with being presented opposing views. Especially with atheism. To make this more relevant, how long have you been an atheist?
I lost my dad when i was 6 and not a day went by that i didnt speak to him. He was like a diary i spoke to everywhere i went. Knowing i would see him again one day felt like all that was keeping me going. The day i acknowledged the fact that i didnt believe in an afterlife anymore it was as if he had died all over again except this time it was real. I felt like a fool for talking to myself for 20 years and i wept for the fact that i would truly never be with him again. I relate to this woman strongly because that was the single greatest disservice my faith did to me. Teaching me to face death by pretending it doesnt exist and that we go on after. Even after 7 years being an atheist i struggle with it emotionally. Being promised eternal life for 26 years only to find out it isnt true feels identical to having it given to you and then taken away. Imagine winning the lottery and then being told "jk" then multiply that by as many stars there are in the sky and that might describe what it feels like to become an atheist after decades of indoctrination. For that reason i get pretty heated when a theist tries to tell me that i just deny god because i wanna sin without consequence... Like fuck you dude i NEVER wanted to be an atheist. Becoming an atheist was an accidental outcome of trying to affirm my belief in god by hearing the arguments against him and refuting them at least to my own satisfaction. I was biased toward god and yet still every argument for god crumbled under basic reasoning and eventually my faith couldnt hold out against reality
The only difference between you and them, is that you actually *looked* at the logic that causes the arguments to crumble. If you were to have gotten angry/stubborn like most and just refute evidence and factual claims, you might still be praying to afterlife santa
It was part of your grief process, and I’m sorry for the loss of your father. I lost my dad a couple years ago, sometimes I would dream about him, I know it was my mental stress in my mind surmising a what if scenario. All I know is that he’s not in pain anymore, and maybe I can do life a lot better for myself because of himz
Same. The day I realized "after life" was a lie, was the day I values my life and my loved one tenfold.
I really hate that religion take away my ability to grief. When my dog die I legit didn't think about it because I'm convinced I'm gonna meet him again someday.
This broke my heart just a little bit. What a lovely woman and a great conversation between humans. I hope she’s doing well :)
"This broke my heart just a little bit. What a lovely woman and a great conversation between humans. I hope she’s doing well :)
"
Me too
It is nice we actually hear from a Christian who actually is a nice person and who actually follows the good things about the words of Jesus even if he was just made up.
I miss my Uncle Lezin. Master storyteller, Korean War veteran, baker, log cabin builder, no one made me laugh like him. Don't think I'll ever see him again but he's with me everyday and still makes me laugh. People we love pass on, our memories become so precious. When I'm dead, hopefully people will remember me in a positive way.
Aw that made me cry, such a thing to leave a long lasting impression and just be "remembered". How perspectives of life can change
Shes the type of person that I don't mind being religious,a genuine good hearted women
Jaybird Jetwings if you like her, why wouldn't you want her to know the truth?
@@cascorick8253 I mean there's people out there with so much problems that an idea of Jesus or any religion really helps them get through it. I feel like some people aren't going to use cold reason because of their circumstance. So in this case faith can be a good thing you know? Whats your perspective?
Jaybird Jetwings you're right, people believe what they believe, some call that crazy! Like the monster under the bed!
@@cascorick8253 True but I see it can be a rational choice considering on their socialization environment or ofcourse pain. And then of course they become ignorant and antagonistic of any views outside if their ideology which sucks ass
Exactly. Such a kind lady
I gotta give it to that woman. That was a tough conversation for her, you could tell that hit some dark places by her voice. She genuinely tried to wrap her head around the idea too.
notformebeaky Dude have a little empathy, she has been taught since she was little that her god is as real as the air she breathes. Of course she is deluded by her religion but the mere fact that we was willing to take into account the sheer possibility there is no God and think it through is very admirable. As a former Christian I know what it’s like to live in that fantasyland of religion, it’s extremely hard to shake.
I cried when she started to realize that Heaven may not be real. I just wanted to hug that woman when she broke down. This is a reason why I don't talk to my elderly family members about this. What upside is there, I ask myself. They've believed this so deeply for so long that I would be effectively destroying their world by deconverting them.
They're good people, that believe in fairytales, yes. But, they have another 20 years max left on this earth and if that fairytale brings them happiness and comfort in their final years on this earth and they can die with a smile on their face, then who am I to take that all away from them.
I have no issue deconverting peers (doesn't happen a lot, I'm no deconversion prodigy), and that's because I know they're still young enough that they can have a positive effect on the world around them, and live full and happy lives.
It's kind of like the saying, "you can't teach an old dog new tricks." Well, you can't teach an elderly devout Christian to enjoy and love their life without god. I'm not asserting that btw. Basing that statement solely upon my relatives because I know it would destroy them. They would no longer know how to function because their religion and god is so deeply ingrained into the fabric of who they are.
Yeah there was that distinct moment when you can tell it all clicked for her. I don't envy that moment one bit, been there done that.
That's 20 years of terrible legislature being put in place on their behalf.
Also 20 years in which they will try to spread the myth to the next generation
@Bruce Wayne Except not as superficial a loss as Santa Claus or the hypothetical billion dollars mentioned in the show. But Rihards and Adam Ant have a point about potential harm done, and it's not like Heaven will be there for them as a result of their not thinking it won't, so I'm not arguing against their deconversion.
Buckeye Beezy makes you iioih
My mother died when I was 14. I was then and still am now an atheist, so I have never believed I would see her again. How did I cope? Well, I missed her and at one level regret that she didn't physically remain in my life. But I never forgot her, and whenever I achieved anything (or even not) I would think she'd have been proud or supportative of me in this situation. It has been all about living well now, not putting life to an imagined afterlife.