Check out Red Spirit Mask's review. He tends to go in a much more detailed break down of the art and architecture of the Dahomey Kingdom: ua-cam.com/channels/IqBml7QbxT7phZo6S8RAOA.html
Thanks my friend! The shout out is much appreciated. And I'm really glad you addressed the controversies surrounding the film. I 100% agree with you on those points.
Excellent points. The sententious attitudes of critics surrounding the slavery question is baffling. Nearly every civilization worth their salt advanced horrible practices. Also, I’m in total agreement about the current trend of the strong black women trope. Highlighting these stories over male kings or warriors can be seen as innocuous but I believe it points to a more dismissive or nefarious agenda.
Exactly plus the thing that's making it worse they're just going on Wikipedia and pasting what's there, not knowing it's limitations. Wikipedia does not explain why exactly the Dahomean culture was what it was ang why they actually went to fight the French and how exactly it played out. I don't get the double standards the Norse sold Celtics and Slavics to Arabs yet that was not mentioned anywhere on a trailer relating to the Northman. Btw do you plan on covering your reaction of the trailer too? Would love to see it.
yeah it would be nice to have more feminine women and even men portrayed with more sincerity and empathy rather than generic “I fight for my people” stories we’ve seen 10,000,000 times. I also think it perpetuates harmful stereotypes or expectations of black women being super masculine that gate keep them from access to femininity
the Problem i have why the hell tell an obvious positive take about one of the most if not the most evil Kingdoms that benefit really well from the slave trade? i am pretty sure we could have stories about actual resistance against the europeans if there are so desperate rolling that dynamic out for the billionth time. hell today a lot of the Offsprings hide their heritage to these exact slavers because obviously people really dont like them and have still a grudge (and i doesnt help that they are todays politicians and countine the colony explotation). the obvious Problem is glorification and 300 was a trash movie for any historical accuracy and comes from exagerated stories since spartans boast more and had a relative short actual powerful time
unfortunately, the political climate surrounding the trans-Atlantic slave trade means the average movie-goer is not going to understand or want to understand the dynamics of the Atlantic world between the 17th and 19th centuries. Many people legitimately do not understand that slavery was normal for most of history, especially for regional or continental powers. Instead, most Americans are given this anachronistic understanding of world history down to a dichotomy of oppressed and oppressors in monolithic terms (E.g. no agency for non-Western European states as they had no choice but to participate). This not only discredits actual history (participation in West African states in the slave trade was a willful transaction that was not possible without the express consent and participation of these states) but also lends credence to disturbing ahistorical arguments that Western European states dominated and bullied African militaries and states into participating. The most alarming part is even among my fellow historians, the political climate has made the subject of these fascinating West African states almost taboo unless it is done in conjunction with the ahistorical narrative that fits cleanly into either American political camp's preferred version of history. I will see the movie because I feel obligated (my thesis is on the Oyo and Asante Empires and some of the military, political, and economic transformations that arose during this era and I did a few shorter papers on Dahomey) but my expectations are admittedly low in the realms of historical accuracy. The one thing we disagree on is that nobody criticizes the British, Romans, or Norse for their participation in slavery. I can't think of a single history class or period-adjacent film that did not receive criticism for its participation in slavery.
Then why not make movies glamorizing Nazi era Germany. It's too recent and people are still suffering the consequences directly from that era. This film seems to be glorifying some of the main people responsible for our ancestor's enslavement fairly recently, and partly responsible for the subsequent struggles of our people.
Personally would love to see the story of Ghana being told and how they were the first great nation built from liberation. It's crazy people ignore how impactful Ghana was since 50% of ash salt was created there.
@@itsbeyondme5560 Screw the Muslim African kingdoms. They contributed to the decline of our societies. Islam, just like Christianity in Africa are foreign imports which must be banished in due time.
The double standard surrounding slavery really annoys me, and I say that as someone with a much more negative attitude toward this movie than you (I hope for the best from the first mainstream Hollywood movie about pre-colonial West Africa, but it seems to me that they're taking substantial liberties with the timeline in favor of a more digestible Anti-Colonial/Girlboss story, rather than trying to accurately retell a given historical event or accurately represent a given culture). Like, it's absolutely fine for people to be concerned about glorifying the Kingdom of Dahomey, in the same way it would be fine for them to be concerned if a new movie was made about a culture like the Spartans... but I know for a fact that people will defend glorification of the Spartans in movies that have already come out, so I strongly doubt that "concerns" about glorifying a slave power would dominate the popular response to a new movie in that setting, as they have in response to this movie. Considering the movie isn't even out yet, and we can't be entirely sure if it will even gloss over Dahomey's involvement in the slave trade, it's especially striking that that notion is dominating discourse. And add to that how many people who had literally never heard of Dahomey before this film was announced, but suddenly became really invested in criticizing the Kingdom afterwards... it's annoying. Part of me wishes a movie in a West African setting less heavily invested in the slave trade came before this so that we could avoid the discourse, but I feel like literally any involvement in the slave trade (which most kingdoms in West Africa were involved in simply due to economic and cultural realities of the time) would result in undue scrutiny of the sort we'd never see for more well-known countries involved in the slave trade (like Britain, France, Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands, etc.).
If film show that they were slave kingdom And they fought for their interests It Will be like film about greece, rome etc. But i study history i am not "normal spectator"
Why Sub-Saharan black African cannot made historical movie like Asian? even Thailand, Cambodian and Indonesian do better like "The Legend of King Naresuan"
@@safuwanfauzi5014 There are Sub Saharan African historical films, they just tend to be very low budget because most African countries don't have well developed film industries.
yeah it’s really sad and upsetting. Like they had really cool architecture in places like the Mali empire but so much of our knowledge of these places has been lost or destroyed. I want really accurate depictions of these cultures but it’s so hard to do that 100% which is a damn shame
A@@galientl4723 Dahomey Kingdom opposing slavery when they were apart of the slave trade. But like From Nothing said we get movies about America being the good guys yet they were also having a stable economy off slavery. Which is hypocritical
If they had to make a movie on pre colonial African empires defending their land from Europeans, the Dahomey kingdom wouldn't have been my first choice. I would have preferred if they did the Ashanti empire instead, but it is what it is.
Kinda cringe to focus on a kingdom with a slavery-centric economy and depict them as opposing slavery. Especially when the (anachronistic) king they chose opposed abolition. Kinda feels like 300. I don’t think it’s bad to tell a story focused on a slave state at all. There are a lot of nuanced ways you could tell the story. I just think it’s absurd to depict them as opposing slavery. Kinda disappointing the Minon don’t seem to be using the guns they’re known for.
I didn't see any part of the trailer where they "opposed slavery." I thought the premise of the film was to oppose colonization, not slavery. Nanisca literally said "They will not stop until the whole of Africa is theirs"
@@FromNothing The reality of the war they fought at that time against the europeans is that it was to keep their rights to take and sell slaves. Of the million different badass stories they could have told about the dahomey and the million different badass stories about opposition to colonialism, they managed to thread the needle and tell just the wrong one.
@@jimboblordofeskimos You sound like they were doing this stuff. Same goes to other african kingdoms. They were went to war against another kingdom to get some slaves and others resources. I get your point.
@@FromNothing As you rightly pointed out, the movie is trying to give the false impression the empire weeps at the mention of war. They're fetishizing women and Africans to match their politics, their literal race-war ideology where the Dahomey are struggling for the sake of all Africans... when their real concern was conquering other Africans. Thus, Hollywood who loves to lie and rewrite history is surely not going to mention their reliance on trading humans.
The Kingdom of Dahomey was also the victim of slavery. The French enslaved thousands and thousands of people from Dahomey. Most of them were transported on the French colonie of Saint-Domingue (Haiti today). This is why the Haitian Vodou come from the Kingdom of Dahomey. Among the slaves transported there were many Agoji (Amazons) from Dahomey. One of them known as "Toya" was a fighter in Jean-Jacques Dessalines army during the Haitian Revolution. She had served as a warrior for the Empire of Dahomey before she was shipped as a slave by the Frenchs to Haiti. She soon escaped the plantation and she agreed to rescue a newborn baby and train him in battle skills she learned as a warrior in Dahomey. This young boy became the future Haitian leader, Jean-Jacques Dessalines who defeated the French army of Napoleon Bonaparte at the Battle of Vertières in 1803 in Haiti. Because the French have been humiliated by their defeat in battle in Haiti, and as a revenge for "what Haitians have done to them, they demonized the Vodou, the Haitians, the Agoji (Amazons) and the Kingdom of Dahomey. They used literature and movies to depict them as evil or as worthy of contempt or blame. This is why we should all time "take with a pinch of salt" any French version of their story about the Agoji (Amazons). The french cannot be trusted, they will lie simply because their ego have been bruised
They're saying 30% of slave trade people in this truck the reason the French went to work with that is to stop them from selling slaves this is where the majority of their wealth came from this drive is one of my pain factors that you have black Americans mistakes today your glorifying these Africans were selling black sacrifice hundreds of thousands due to African sacrifice
Yeah I'm looking at this new black panther 2 and the whole new diversity push of black/African women and while i appreciate it....I can feel them wiping black men out of the picture and putting alot of LGBT black women and "masculine" black women as leaders in their place...we can't celebrate our queens and act like they didn't have kings
But at the same time, this sentiment also incentives the lack of representation in those areas as well. It's all a balance man. The LGBT aren't gonna kill the Black Community
Agree with your point at 11:44! I hope for a story like that too. I remember how important it was for Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon to become mainstream in the West.
I wholeheartedly agree with the point about the "strong black woman" theme. It's getting very annoying. Obviously it's meant to pander to Western liberals and leftists at the expense of black men's history. It also has the effect of falsely portraying Africa as "backwards" or different from the rest of the ancient and medieval world, in that the leaders (particularly military leaders) of the great empires of Eurasia were strong masculine men 9.9 times out of 10. Also, to your final point about making a positively themed African film, this is why we need to advocate for change in Africa itself today. Starting with major African countries like Nigeria. I implore all Africans and African Americans to start advocating for revolutionary change in Africa by any means necessary. Why should we continue to accept living in foreign nations while our homelands are plundered by corrupt people. We can write positive narratives on our own terms if we begin creating prosperous nations in our own land.
I don't why some people have a problem about a strong black woman. Plus every country have at least a strong woman leader in history. How is it backwards?
The original goal of Liberia was to creat an african america if you will, with the goal being to turn africa into a union of states led by Liberia. This should be considered.
Looks like an ok movie I just wish we had fantasy films and books about Africa without European slavery permeated through the narrative. A Tolkien style epic about Buganda
Two Words: THANK YOU!!! Further Comments: -Thank You for exposing the fact that it is bias that allows many to critique this film based off the fact that the Dahomey participated in the slave trade, yet ignore how other cultures and people have done "bad" in our eyes. History is told with a lot of bias. -While I am excited for this film, I HEAVILY agree we need a movie where it is NOT about Black vs White. Africa vs the Western world. It's tiring. We need a film just about us! That's it. No agenda, no feminist propaganda.
Good point about movies about African history could deal with "internal businesses" instead of "black vs white". Colonialism sucked, everyone with a brain already knows it.
Exactly! So many stories exist of interaction with other ethnicities without the white vs black thing. Pre-colonial stories are so many. Why would they choose this!
Agreed, but it would still be interesting to see an African Kingdom against a Middle Eastern one for example a war that took place in 701 BC during the Siege of Jerusalem when the Kingdom of Kush under the leadership of General Taharqa made an alliance with the Israelites and made war with the Neo-Assyrians during the reign of King Hezekiah of Judah, it would be kinda be boring to see a Kingdom that is isolated.
@@MichaelClayton64 That would be cool no doubt. I'm not talking about complete isolation btw. A story like the one you speak of has nothing to do with Colonialism, The Slave Trade, nor has any "Black v White" undertones. So I'm good with that. I would love to see anything about the Aksum Powers vs Merore. Mali vs Songhay Songhay vs Arab powers in the north. Kush vs Egypt Even a fantasy tale of Kush vs Zulus lol 😆. Such are stories that don't involve us vs the white man and European Powers.
@@MichaelClayton64 oh can't forget about -Meroe vs Rome. -Kush vs Assyria. Or even Fictional Stories with African characters. Like a -Merotic Gladiator -Memnon -Aksum vs Persia
I'll check it out. The overnight experts on African History are always hilarious. I can't think of any warrior caste that had the foul shit they pulled swept under the rug. Didn't Samurai test their swords on peasants? Historical fiction is a thing. I'm just not crazy about the impeding Colonization back drop of the story. I'm still waiting for someone to adapt "Nada the lily," although I'm afraid that some woke Hollywood type will do to it.
@obakpo88 "Historical fiction is a thing. I'm just not crazy about the impeding Colonization back drop of the story." why does this fact bother you, didn't colonization happen once Europeans got a strong enough foothold in Africa, admittedly it did take almost 400 years, but historically it did happen. And if you are unsure about the line or actions taken, remember this. There was a vassal Kingdom in Angola and their vassal King did tell the primary Kingdom in Angola that this would happen, historically speaking it did happen, so what is your beef with that point?
I think the horsemen are meant to be Yorubas from the Oyo empire, I noticed an Ida blade as the Mino were fighting the men on foot. And ye the way they're portraying Gezo (the Usurper) is way off this guy was a tyrant bent on war with the remnants of the Oyo after its decline. Even after losing some battles he wanted more so no way he would be afraid to start a war. And I totally agree I'm not sure why they're just focusing on the strong black woman trope I wouldn't have an issue if they showed variation. Anyway I don't know if you're aware South African Network is working on a Shaka Zulu series called Shaka Ilembe the trailer was leaked on Tik Tok (of all places) it looks interesting and I believe Showtime Network and CBS Studios are producing their own version in America so two Shaka Zulu retelling are coming. This is good but, I want more! Hopefully on figures like Sundiata Keita, Changamire Dombo, Sunni Ali and King Taharqa for example done right they'd be awesome. And thank you for bringing Mr Bigot back!! 😂😂 I've been seeing this same criticism all over the comments. Yet they aren't looking into the history or situation as well as both perspectives. 🤦🏿♂️ I would have wanted a more accurate portrayal but it's not a deal breaker I will still be watching this. And the slave thing is strange, the Norse and Danes sold Slavics to Arabs but, do you see this being the topic on the comment section of the Northman trailer? Nope the double standards are real. Exactly this Dahomey film could have focused on the twins king Akaba and Hangbe when the Mino were relatively new. The political intrigue and also the unique administration introduced where male officials had to have female counter parts is interesting The wars and the overall dynamic during this period would have been more epic even the period of King Agaja would have been interesting the conflict with Oyo and other powers around them is what I would have wanted to see rather than the colonialism resistance storyline.
@@admirekashiri9879 Personally, we need films that focus on western Africa more. Eastern and Southern Africa have gotten too much love from around the world. I think, in my opinion, they love the culture and history of Easten and Southern Africa because there are "less" urban and more tribes than western Africa. I'm not trashing their culture but if we want to destory any stereotype about Africa, a film about western African Muslim kingdoms like Mali or Ghana or Oyo kingdom. Something that Africa has amazing kingdoms and cities....not living like tribal, pastoral people. I'm already scared about the woman king I hope it's good.
@@FromNothing Oops. Sorry However, there are plenty of kingdoms at western Africa. Traditional or not. Plenty of material to create stories. I'm surprised Hollywood is not doing a Sundeita Keita story. ( yes, I mess up his name. I'm sorry)
A trope gets hated when it's done poorly too many times, like the strong woman trope and black victim trope. Hollywood have worsened people's views and keep ruining their chances. I haven't seen this movie yet, but I will and I hope more give it a try.
Slavery is terrible, but not showing historical movies because they practiced slavery doesn't make sense. I am excited for more African history videos. Showing the kingdoms of Mali, Ghana, Ethiopia, among others would be great and could really be used to dispel some myths about African history.
the Problem isnt slavery itself but the attempt showing one of the most guilty of them being the good freedom fighters. i have yet to see any roman movie that shows the romans as some sort of freedom fighters. it is similar showing a guy like Crassus like a good guy to slaves kinda ignoring the fact he nailed every single slave on a cross after the third serville war. and seriously asking Hollywood of all places making a movie subtle in terms of History is so dumb given the absolute terrible track record of historically movies that make any historians rather attempt suicide than actually honestly saying it is even remotely accurate. if they cannot even get well documated european history right ,how abd will they screw up african history?
The problem isn't slavery; it's the glorification and absurdity of framing that trailer presented the Dahomey in. Many Africans gladly fought on behalf of the French to put Dahomey into the ground because that's how terrible Dahomey was
@@tompossessed1729 Never said they fought to end slavery I said many Africans, such as the Yoruba, gladly fought on behalf of the French to put the Dahomey down. Slavery was a reason for some as those "Amazons" were known for raiding villages for slaves but the rest had their own disputes with Dahomey.
It's baffling that you specifically said West, Central, and Southern African kingdoms were prolific slavers when in reality it was nearly every world Empire that were prolific slavers. In and out of Africa. It's even more baffling that you excluded North Africa in that assessment considering the bulk of the intra-African slave trade was between North Africa and Sub-Saharan Africa. The Islamic states of North Africa sought pagan slaves from Sub-Saharan Africa.
I'm not supporting this movie. We need a movie that doesn't involve colonials or dependence on white settlers as an arbitrary bad guy. This came close to being what we need but I'd prefer something based on Africa alone. There's many stories to be told. Imagine The Northman but with the motherland's diaspora. I don't expect it from Hollywood but someone out there has to have that vision and passion.
In terms of the women warriors I dont like this new trend because its the same old trend of emasclating black men and making black women seem confrontational. I hope the movie is more in line with African Americans then with Dahomey though.
So what I've seen in the movie I have a few caveats I that I am concern about. One is I feel like they are going to push heavily into the whole black vs. white motive when in fact it was a very mixed. You had Africans fighting for the Europeans and you had Europeans supplying the Dahomey. They're going to probably play up the white slavery but not show any of the Dahomey owning slaves. That was one thing that I was surprised about Amina is that they not only showed black Africans owning and trading slaves but even Amina's own kingdom was doing slave trading. Also it doesn't seem they aren't using firearms which you mention in your video. This also looks like they're going to play the whole guns is dishonorable and cowardly trope and that only Europeans/white people use them. This is done in many movies like The Last Samurai, any Kung Fu movie, and most Westerns. I'm kind of tired of this trope because it really hurts everyone. One one side it makes Whites/Europeans look "dishonorable" and "cowardly" because they only won because of superior technology and not from strategy or diplomatic maneuvers. On the other hand is makes all the other people look primitive and backwater because they're not smart enough to make/use a gun and rather fight in a style that was modern 3 centuries ago.
It were modern medicines that enable Europeans to colonise them in the 19th century. Before that not much colonising was done. More like pick up cargo and get out asap. Slavery isn't about race, it's about power and vulnerability. In how much we are wage slaves these days,.. I think that depends a lot on where you're living. In the US? Absolutely! Where I'm from much less so. I held many different jobs and wouldn't hesitate to switch careers knowing I wouldn't fall into abject poverty by doing so. I always enjoyed doing the things I did. Or if not try something else.
Thanks for your views. It really is a shame that no stories about African kingdoms simply rising to power or existing in a pre slavery period are being told. We see films about the fall of Rome or about the anglo Saxons fighting off Vikings but Africa doesn't get the same treatment
Not to mention the British Empire took out the largest loan in their country's history to pay reparations to British slaveholding families once they "abolished slavery" within their territories. A loan English taxpayers didn't finish paying off until 2015. I already knew overnight historians were going to tap into their internal bias in regards to Dahomey's role in the Trans-Atlantic slave trade while ostentatiously downplaying the role European kingdoms and countries played in it to get wealthy beyond belief. It's just a microcosm of their usual deflect/blame/gaslight someone else tactic instead of just looking at the history objectively.
"once they "abolished slavery" within their territories. " Why is this in scare-quotes? They factually did. Its the reasons the Dahomey fought the western powers in the first place. When the dahomey were defeated by the french, they were one of the last countries in the region that 1) Didnt submit to the western powers 2) Still kept slaves.
@@Greggah Because while on paper, Britain halted its slave trade in 1837, the country did not exclude itself from profiting off it decades afterward. The irony of the Anti-Slavery Squadrons operating off West Africa confiscated slave ships, while these actions were in place to halt the exploitation of slave ships reaching the Americas, there are stories of squadrons capturing outbound slave ships only to sell them to the Portegeus and Spanish anyway. Slavery was still at play throughout the British Empire well after the Emancipation Act of 1837. Notably in British-occupied India and British-occupied Nigeria. Not to mention British investment firms and banks still raked in profit in places where slavery was still legal at the time in Brazil and Cuba. In essence, the quotation marks are for the planet-size loopholes that allowed Britain to still have a hand in profiling the slave trade, despite excluding itself from it.
@@mburks3748 "Slavery was still at play at X" do you know of any other faction trying to end slavery at the time? This is what people studying CRT and African-American studies and other left-wing greivance studies miss- slavery is almost a universal constant, the abolishment movements were almost 100% western european.
I do agree that Burke is being unfair by downplaying the British role in the abolishment of slavery. However saying that it was 100% Western movement is also unfair. Reason being being that westerners were not the only ones who wanted to end it, it's just that they had the most power influence and capability to do so due to their massive influence on global trade in economics. In fact, one thing I forgot to mention in this video is that king Gezo's predecessor attempted to evolve attempted to abolish slavery but was but was usurped. Hopefully they cover that detail in the movie.
@@Greggah The abolishment movement was formed primarily in Britain, and was led by several former slaves under the Sons of Africa political group, Olaudah Equiano being the most notable.
100% agree✨💯🙌🏾I’m excited to see the movie. Hopefully this movie, good or bad, it may open the door to more Ancient African movies but with a different narrative.
Also a great move trilogy that could easily be a hit with holly wood would be about the life and rise of Okomfo Anokye. I mean seriously he is underrated as a historical figure.
My perspective as an African is that slavery directly led to conditions that opened up Africa for colonialism. And the impact of colonialism, racism, etc still exists. So Africans are not telling a story of overcoming and succeeding despite these factors (like Jews can). On the other hand the non-African cultures you mentioned did evil in the past but that evil resulted in them winning to the point where they’re looked up to and their people are prosperous. In other words celebrating African nations that directly contributed to Africa’s current dismal state is not a good look.
I agree but the kingdom that this qween is based of didn’t take part in the trans Atlantic slave trade. Sure they did in the Islamic one but the Islamic slave trade was practiced in Europe and east Asia so it was far from an African problem like the trans Atlantic one which was a African issue
@@makeytgreatagain6256 Are you talking about Dahomey/Benin? They certainly did take part in the Atlantic slave trade. Not like it really mattered. Both Islamic and Atlantic cause plenty of destabilization. If I recall correctly, Islamic did last longer and I’m not even sure the Arabs cared to end it until the Europeans forced them.
@@UnDark1 Islamic one was global so it wasn’t just blacks in that slave trade that was the point I was making they also didn’t take people in the same huge numbers as the Atlantic one. The Atlantic one destabilised the region of west and central Africa. The Islamic one didn’t destabilise any region of africa or the world, ironicallt enslaving warrior Turk nomads ended up backfiring with the Turks just Turing around and taking over the Middle East in the end
As much as I love West African history, the whole women becoming king to me points to the current trend of blurring the gender line especially among so-called ‘people of color’. Definitely seems like excessive liberties were taken with portraying this history… Also, in Latino societies especially those with heavy native descended populations, many are taught to view the enslavement and genocide against our indigenous as necessary because the Spanish were superior morally and bought Christianity to out lands. We generally are taught to look down upon our native indigenous ancestry and also our African ancestry especially those of us from the Caribbean
Yeah that seems to be something I’ve noticed considering I’m of Latin American and Black Caribbean ancestry. They glorify western (European) traditions a lot.
The problem is Hollywood loves states. Heck I guess most people do. But by their very nature they are exploitive and held together by oppression. In my opinion there could have been a better story to tell making it about a citizen, be it of Dahomey or elsewhere and their struggle at surviving or making sense of the changing world. I also disagree about the Aztec being celebrated, the one thing an average Joe or Jane is going to know about them if they know anything at all is there human sacrificing. Far from something positive.
Those shields weren't being used by the Dahomey. Something to remember was when the cavalry with the shields were shown John Boyega said "An Evil is coming" referring to the Cavalry attacking. Dahomey never had a Cavalry. the Oyo did. Plus we can see Dahomey fighting these shield wielding warriors later in the trailer.
I saw this preview in the theatres 3 times now and every time I get excitement chills! I can't help but to look for connections made that may connect to my Igbo and Tikar ancestors! The building decor to me appears to be what I've seen in describing one of the largest sacred libraries in the area, Timbuktu. Thanks for such a wonderful vision of balanced narrative not just from mine but the entire world's origins and traditions. Which we know our old traditions when we migrated from Alkebulan/Africa and still practiced by most all cultures Ive seen throughout the world at large.
do agree though I think it would be problematic if this movie ignores the Dahomeys part in the slave trade. I do not want anyone walking away thinking "they fought for freedom" just to get greatly disappointed when they read a history book.
If you want some good information and interior drawings of African traditional architecture, I highly recommend Drawn from African Dwellings by Jean-Paul Bourdier. One of the best books ever on the topic, and I've read several books on African architecture. I actually recognized several of the structural traits from the book in the screenshots of the movie.
Great video, I'm so happy you covered this topic and agree with your acessment. I just hope that the guys that did it were smart enough to be pullung a bait and switch on us, making we think they will hide the bad but actually they will also cover it and trust the audience the make their mind on whether the bad side of Dahomey overshine its good side.
OK my thoughts are a bit complicated but I'll do my best to summarize. Short version: Movie looks interesting (a few small reservations aside) and I'm definitely checking it out when it comes out. Long version: Much of what you stated in the video. It's nice to see a film set in a Pre-Colonial African kingdom, featuring African characters and having a semi accurate depiction of what life was like in said kingdom; Dahomey in this case. Obviously due to depictions of precolonial African architecture (like you said palaces for example) it will be difficult to deduce what is and is not accurate in certain places but I'll remain optimistic. As for Hollywood pushing the "Strong Black Woman" trope in these movies, I kinda agree to an extent. I personally don't feel the trope is being pushed as hard as some people claim though I am admittedly biased because i love seeing female warriors kick butt! Heck, Okoye's fight scenes in black Panther were always fun for me to watch and that was on top of her dialogue being hilarious and enjoyable. However I do agree that Hollywood can and should do a better job of diversifying what black woman can do in movies about Africa. Seeing the warriors and martial skill is great and all but they can also show the important roles women played in things like statecraft, economics, diplomacy, religion/spirituality and even just familial traditions. Also I agree that the whole thing of Black people fighting against White colonizers is interesting but is often overdone. Also I am very thankful you called out the double standard of people who talking about Dahomey's role in the slave trade! Yes Dahomey was a major contributor of that horrific practice; yes, they did practice it long after the British ended the trade internationally; yes, one of the Dahomey kings self admitted that slavery and war built his kingdom's power. But how come people are totally fine with calling this stuff out but like you said these same people stay silent when we make movies about the Romans, British, French etc. who have their own crimes they've committed. And it's the same with individuals like George Washington but also with people like Augustus Caesar, Genghis Khan and Napoleon. All these men accomplished great things and contributed to the glory of their respective nations but also caused intense suffering to those around them, and in some cases their own people as well! But they don't face as much criticism; at least from what I've seen. All this stuff is strictly my opinion and I know there will be people who disagree and I know damn well from reading twitter that there are people who will down right chew me out for saying some of these things but this is just what I believe. Anyway long rant over, I'm still gonna watch the movie before making any concrete thoughts on it because I firmly believe you can't and shouldn't make serious judgment on a piece of media until you actually watch it. I'll keep some things I've mentioned above in mind but I'm mostly hoping the movie is at least enjoyable to watch. And who knows, at the very least the movie is increasing discussion about history surrounding the Dahomey, even if it's not being done in the most civil way (especially on twitter). I'm just hoping this movie can at least, somehow make it easier for not only African centered movies but also African creators to shine in Hollywood. The people of Africa and of African descent have many stories they are capable of telling and it's about time they're given the chance to tell them.
I'm curious to see if any historical African movies will be set in the Nile Valley. How would the racial makeup of the Nile Valley be handled? That would be interesting to see.
A movie about the 25th Dynasty and Taharqa with his war with the Assyrian in 701 BC would be interesting to watch. This war is even mentioned in the Hebrew Bible (2nd Kings 19:9, Isaiah 37:9).
🤩🤩🤩 finally! I didn't even hear about this but it's about damn time. Like seriously I can't wait for more african history to get some focus on the media.
Yes but please don’t take a movie as a representation of history. That is the danger of historical movies. People get that narrative and the visuals in their heads and internalize it as if it is fax.
I agree with you about t They’re being too many depictions of “female warrior “ Archetypes. I feel the industry is going too far showing females as being basically males with breast. They are not Showcasing The Other realistic strengths women have. It’s becoming cartoonish. I , Like you, I’ve had enough of the “Black person as victim”. I doubt I will be seeing this movie. I don’t think I can take the emotional trauma. For what it’s worth, I am a black female.
Thank you for your insight from a female perspective. I always tread lightly when expressing such opinions and I'm glad I was able to get it across without any bad blood.
Thank you. The subtitles are active, just click the CC button at the bottom. If they weren't active before, it was probably because it was still processing.
I totally agree with you're concerns about the 'African Warrior Female' trope. It's intersectionality cinema. Rather than just telling African stories, (finally!) it's telling the story of oppressor and oppressed. A political narrative emerging from the western political tradition of the 'left'. This is a story of colonialism and misogyny told from the perspective of female Africans. Hollywood has made this movie for a modern liberal western audience. Just tell an African story! It can stand on it's own!
Im personally excited to see this movie even though i know itll have some historical inaccuracies like when the amazon warriors jump off each others shields to do this almost video game-y downward slash. At least we can compliment hollywood as its treating african history movies like all other history movies, As ahistorically as Apocalypto, Braveheart, and even 300(comic book movie but your average American would think its a documentary). Its shitty to see the culture war take this and run with it though as arguments are disingenuous on both sides, just gotta tune out all the noise and enjoy the scraps we get.
Dahomey didnt go to war with Europeans during Ghezos rule he actually Partnered with them in the Slave trade They didnt Go to war with Europe until the Franco- Dahomey wars under his Grandson rule
I didn’t know about this movie until this video! I hope it’s good, there is a criminal lack of films about pre-colonial Africa and I hope this starts a trend
I don't like the title, a woman king is a queen. Of course they named it like that to accentuate how she's a strong black woman but it sounds weird having the word queen. If it was called "the queen" I'd think is same and generic, like all those Netflix films called "the king". I don't think titles like these are appealingapealing. For example Xena the warrior princess is more or less the same kind of title but better, first it has the protagonist' s name so there's only one Xena who is also a warrior princess, and the warrior princess part is a bit more specific. if it was called, "The princess" it wouldn't be as apealing. I don't know how this film should be called because I now have the need to educate myself on her story. But I'm sure anyone can come up whith a better title. I have 0 problems whith it being set in an African empire. As you said it, most places did slavery and human sacrifice, including my own ancestors, who sacrificed messangers to ask the gods for favour. And I'm European. I agree 100% whith you whith the need for a full african film before European contact, and have an African villain and african protagonist, basically the same as if it was set in Europe or China or any place. The thing that makes me sceptical is that maybe they'll try not to upset Africans, so I think the black people will be very good and virtuous, maybe even peaceful while the evil Europe and force them to teach them a lesson. This way of telling independence stories is so common that I'm sure this won't be an exception. If in filmed set in Europe where the oppressors are other white guys they tend to make the enemy look bad, and accentuate how the protagonists people is both peaceful warrior like, I doubt that a film about blacks vs whites will do diferent things. I don't mind it so much because I'm kinda used to it, but who knows, maybe this film surprises us, maybe it has more depth than black team vs white team. But as you said it, being the first Hollywood film set in historical Africa, we have to watch it, I'm not sure if it will be good or not but I'll watch it, I'm kinda excited. Also don't listen to ignorant people belittling your work! you're easily on my top 3 history channels for a reason! many europeans are actually very intrigued to learn about precolonial Africa, since is something we don't learn anywhere. So after a year or two of watching your content it feels so great telling my friends about little african anecdotes and historical facts and watching how they get so interested and ask questions. And were talking about people who don't study history like me. Most people I talked whith were very opened and even wanted to know about these things for years. So keep it up! and I loved to see the southern accent racist character coming back 😁
Excellent video, as always! I, too, would love to see more entertainment using African and indigenous cultures' elements! Though, I found funny that you mention amerindian civilizations being "praised", because as someone who lives in latin America and wants to specialize on these pre-columbian cultures, I only listen to people calling them savage and brutal. And whenever someone tries to "compliment" them, it's usually just about how good fighters they were :/ But, I guess the grass is always greener on the other side, right? lol
Yeah in the U.S. Native-Americans are usually portrayed as "Noble Savages." Peaceful innocent victims of European imperialism. However those of Mesoamerica and the Andes are looked upon as highly advanced and sophisticated. I doubt anyone would complain if a movie was made about the Aztec despite their practice of human sacrifice. In fact, apocalypto was entirely based on the Maya including the language spoken, the actors, and the architecture etc and it even featured human sacrifice in the movie! Yet nobody complained about that. Just the historical inaccuracy of the cultural elements.
@@FromNothing I misinterpreted the idea, I'm sorry. You're right, "at least" the Inca, Maya, and Aztec civilizations (alone) are viewed as worthy of attention, if in a pitying way, of misguided people with potential; as in Apocalypto, with the ending that seem to imply that the Spanish conquistadors "saved the day"; while just showing up an African nation, even if they're not doing anything bad, is enough to enrage people. Keep up with the good content! :D
I think the main issue is the dahomey sacrificing slaves every year, and the war being about the french and brits wanting to END slavery. Also, the aztecs werent really glorified in their slave and slave sacrifices- look at Apocalypto, its not about making the aztecs look good, they are the antagonists/bad guys.
That's not unusual when you consider how many animes have been written by whites. Just sensless to attach taboos to non-black people writing stories about black people. As long as it doesn't slander us as a people or present inaccurate cultural aspects
One thing i seemed to get from the Trailer is that Ghezo is the king when the French war started but in history it is actually Gbehanzin his grandson. other than that seems quite accurate, I even think the men raiding on horses with the shields are Oyo, who Ghezo was able to secure Dahomey independence from after c. 100 years of being vassals to the Oyo empire As for the trolls who hate to see a hollywood movie on an african kingdom, they will just have to deal with it. We all know they don't care about all that excuse they're making, they have no problem watching shows about Vikings who killed innocent monks and pillaged all over Europe. In fact the way so many white people jumped on it, it was obvious the overwhelming majority of the trolls never even heard of Dahomey before now, so it was like fresh news
given how rarely Hollywood movies treated history with any care it has 80% of being garbage. the northman that was praised was created outside the hellhole known as Hollywood and is the prime reason it was historically accurate with the customs. this movie especially with the obsession of politics first ,story and historically accuracy later will be very hard to be actually great. i could be wrong but after the 70th movie from Hollywood with pure stereotype sold as "represantation" i keep my expections low
Question: Do you have any idea how I can make this video popular? I really think people should hear your viewpoint, especially the Mr. Bigo- eh I mean some of "those people", if you know what I mean. Also I agree that there should be more African media that have African heroes and African villains fighting each other. Because, like you said, anyone can be evil regardless of race, it's not all black and white (pun may or may not be intended)
" Do you have any idea how I can make this video popular?" I think every content creator in the world wish they had that answer but I appreciate the thought lol. Also everything else, you said I agree, including the "black and white" pun may or may not be intended part :p
Share it with your friends and family who will watch hopefully they do.the same that's the best you can do unless you have other resources to your disposal.
10:23 I personally seen most discussion about the Aztecs at least only talk about the human sacrifices. That’s the only part I’d semi disagree with, great video!
I see them always glorified for building their massive cities and pyramids, creating an artificial island, sewage systems, the size of their Army, and independently developing a writing system in the New World. I hear those discussed much more often than any negative scrutinization.
I hope that Woman King will be a good movie about the dislikes and criticisms, unfortunately they explored the apparent hypocrisy about a movie that the trailer hints is about freedom fighters vs opressors but seems to forget that the dahomey flourished because of transatlantic slavery perhaps if the movie apporached in a way similar of The Northman, recognizing the brutality and contradictions of the Dahomey Kingdom and their warriors and society it would be less criticized Unfortunately in that last years is more dificult forgive these kinds of hipocrisies, specially when made by groups of people that criticized those hipocrisies in more conventional and eurocentric/male-centric/heteronormative stories made until the mid 2010s
depends on what perspective the movie is set to view from. Since it seems the main theme of the movie are the Mino and not the slave trade, then the movie would have no need to present them as brutal just to please people who want to make Dahomey's image bad. there are other qualities to the Mino and the entire Dahomey army than 'brutality', from the trailer i think they want to emphasize on things like women steping up to fight for their country or an african kingdom fighting against colonization which are all true to the history.
Too much people that never watched the movie is asking for it to be boycotted, but in that gets me is that I've never seen so much Mayo looking people on the comment section talking about how it's about the slave trade, mayo people never called for boycotting of any slave movie nor had any interest, go watch the film stop listening to people that's not seen it!
Love to see them do the Movie of the Battle Of Ekpenede who founded Okere Versus Ginuwa who founded Big Warri of which such history is shrouded with mythical an real events from the area we now call Warri in Delta state in Nigeria But yes indeed I am going to watch that movie Woman King 🤴
To be fair, the Dahomey kingdom is a little bit misrepresented and a lot of what people think is that they were really bad slavers who sacrificed humans. Other than that people who know of the Dahomey don’t know much else about them.
Yeah we need more movies like this even if many of them are not accurate or not the best movies, if they keep making more precolonial african movies, we will eventually get some amazing films that will be awesome and do a lot to spread african history.
i will supporting Something like this only if i dont see any white people in it . i am so tired of colonialism, europeans being the bad guys ...again . over 2000 years of history and we tap dance around the same old 500 years around and only with white people around. sigh...
@@laisphinto6372 Yeah, I would love to see an African historical epic without any white people as well. Though it would be cool to see a movie about Aksum and their connections to the byzantine/arab world. There are so many awesome parts of history that everyone simply ignores.
The problem is that so far know about Dahomey's role in slavery so having the movie take place during the war were Dahomey sought to enslave African living under the French protectorate, and portray Dahomey as the good guys, is literally spitting on the graves of those who were enslaved by Dahomey who thanks to this move are remembered as the ones fight against slavery.
Here's my problem with everybody critism. When 12 years a slave came out we said no more passive begging slave narrative. When black panther came out we went OTT and loved the film. Bc it was great and meshed our cultures perfectly Dahomey gets a movie and now we critical? I saw an African American called Kwame Brown claim he wasn't African lol I've seen every indegenous lie under the sun. To me this critique of the film that isn't out yet just makes me question whether this is coming more from the disassociation with Africa movement that's building up....
When I seen the trailer I just thought of the recent Harriet Tubman film mix with wakanda , it going to add more of a western feminist message too it than more the complex historical pov and ideologies of the nation’s involved of the time , in which you taught us in a prior video, I have a feeling their going to add a white savior vibe than the historical reasoning of European alliances between the kingdoms against a other European nation
I was really hoping this would be more realistic and historically accurate but it seems like as with all movies and series nowadays the current political theme of making women more masculine and men more feminine is clearly present in the trailer. They should've used you as a subject matter expert!
My ancestors weren't enslaved by the Romans, and the descents of Rome's slaves aren't still living with the consequences of their forebears' enslavement. I'm descended from those who were shipped to the US via the Transatlantic slave trade, and this, Dahomey, kingdom was partially responsible for that triangular trade. My very ancestors could be victims of that kingdom.
Hey man, it's been a long time since I've seen you comment. You were my first ever patron! How have you been? Also yes you are correct and that is true, I just mentioned the Roman thing to emphasize my point about "every empire practiced slavery so its unfair to single out Dahomey as bad/evil." I also mentioned how its unfair to criticize a movie about Dahomey for that reason but not criticize movies about Britain or any other European power that partook in it.
@@FromNothing I still watch most of your videos As for the subject, the point of recency applies here and the fact that you're dealing with living communities. Black Americans (and other Transatlantic trade diaspora) are the product of Dahomey (and other kingdoms) slave raids and military campaigns, and we peoples who are the product of that are still here and suffer from the effects of that. The Dahomey kingdom also still exists. The Roman empire, Jutes and Angles and Varangians and whatever groups the Romans enslaved most also no longer exist. Are we at a point yet where we can make movies about "heroic" and "badass" SS troops? I hope not. And yes, I do see this as a good comparison.
@@suedecomponent8931 Again, fair point on the Roman thing. I agree and have even mentioned this to people who were apologetic to slavers. Ones who get angry at me for not mentioning the Arabic slave trade for example. I always mention to them that the Trans-Atlantic slave trade was more far reaching, more recent, and still affects us. However I still feel like you misunderstood MY point. The point of mentioning the Romans was specifically stressing the previous point about the slave trade. I mentioned how Dahomey partook in the trans-Atlantic slave trade, so did the British, the Spanish, the Portuguese etc. We have a movie made about Queen Elizabeth and her exploration of the New World for example. We have a game released by Amazon literally called "New World" loosely based on the conquest of the Americas. A very very popular game. Nobody bats an eyelid. So I say again, the part about the Romans was just a way of further stressing it, I wasn't saying it was equal or the same in regards to modern influence but the European powers involved were equal if not greater of an influence and we don't scrutinize them. So I think it's unfair to just cancel Dahomey outright from it's ambiguous trailer alone just because it partook in the slave trade yet release movies and video games on European players and praise them. The default go-to reaction to something based on England isn't OMG CANCEL just because they were slavers and conquerors of indigenous lands. It's a double standard.
I want a movie on the Gullah wars/Seminole wars. Most people really thin black Americans in America never fought black agains slavery outside of marches and speeches.
Almost certainly no film would be made today in which Britain, Spain etc. Would be depicted as the good guy during the transatlantic slave trade unless they were fighting one another. A film in which Cortes or Pizarro or Magellan et al were depicted heroically wouldnt be allowed to be made unless it was an already wealthy and ostracized film maker (Mel Gibson) so I dont think it is that hypocritical to point out that this is a movie about slavers being wokewashed by Hollywood into a black girl magic resistance piece. BTW they won't even make media depicting white europeans as victims by "non white" non europeans. For example Balkans was conquered and colonized and enslaved for about 500 years by Ottomans. But like Albanians such as Skanderberg get lumped in as oppressors with like Leopold or Hapsburg era Spain etc. because they share melanin levels and same religion.
Then how do you explain Pocahantas? How about Elizabeth: The Golden Age? Even Apocalypto, based on the Maya AND featured human sacrifice IN THE MOVIE. They exist, nobody complains. It's a very obvious dobule standard.
@@FromNothing pocahontas is an actual children's movie from 25 years ago my dude. And the english were certainly not the heros of that story. And Apocalypto is the aformentioned independently wealthy outside of Hollywood film maker (Gibson) and is about one "tribe" of central Americans escaping persecution from the larger, more powerful tribe. The spanish hardly fit into that story at all. Never seen Elizabeth TGA but she largely predates Britains role in colonization and transatlantic slave trade. Do love their girlbosses though especially those who help to uphold the black legend and anti-catholic sentiment.
@@fbaallied the turks are more greek today than theyre willing to admit even if their origins are central asian and all their art depicts them as asian. But it cant be both ways. Middle east and north africa cant be white when theyre doing the invading (from as early as Phoenician period to early 20th century collapse of Ottoman Empire) and non white when theyre invaded themselves. The mediterranean basin was for a very long time pretty much a single continuous civilization with the free flowing of ideas, goods, services etc. So to me theyre the same. But for many on either side theyre not.
If any story deserves a movie it would be the epic of Sundiata. One of the best stories out there. This movie only happened because Dahomey had female warriors. Of all the kingdoms to pick, Dahomey is just not it. Why not the Asantehne’s story or king tutu’s story. This dumb as movie will only lead to ridicule.
Kandakes, Ndate Yalla Mbodj, Nzinga, Yaa Asantewaa, Amina, etc. Your mind is still colonized by Western Ideals because Black men of Africa were not intimidated by strong women. This appears to be a Western thing. Many African men had no problem being led into battle by strong women. It is a part of the Nature of African historical societies. Even in my country, we were still electing Queen mothers to act as a judge over any disputes among Yoruba descendants living in The Bahamas in the late 1800s. They did this so they didn't have to take their issues to the colonial courts.
If you listened to that part of the video and concluded that I'm intimidated by strong black women then you clearly have selective hearing. I've also mentioned Nzinga, Yaa Asantewaa, and Amina in multiple videos. I'm already aware of them. If you watch the video again without selectively hearing things, I clearly stated stated that there were historical leaders throughout Africa history who were women but it was not the norm. The fact is that most warriors and war generals in African kingdoms were men, whether you like it or not even if there were more women than in European armies comparatively speaking. So I just feel like there is an over emphasis on physically strong black women in this new genre of film.
How bizarre is it that you go on a tangent about how african themed media should not feature African women warrior so prominently only to have to admit seconds later that these women warriors in media are based on actually existing warriors. Would you like your dahomey movie to not feature dahomey amazons? Like what's the end game? If they existed, the complaint just seems reactionary. Men are "biologically stronger" and therefore suited for warfare, yet this movie depicts an actual group of women. It's not like they made them up for representation. Theyre not even "manly," they're just warriors lol
Um ok? What's your point? Nobody is having a pissing contest here. Nearly every kingdom in the world lost to Europeans at the time in history due to rapid military technological improvements. I'm not sure why that matters anyway.
I saw this trailer and something that came to mind is, Yeah Back in the Day the Title Queen wasn't a thing as a Female Monarch was rare. An Example is King Jadwiga of Poland. She was crowned King of Poland.
I don't think Jadwiga counts for this. Poland was either going to be absorbed by another kingdom or face a civil war where everyone and their mother could make a claim, but someone went rules lawyer and said "nowhere in our laws it is said that the ruler needs to be a man, just a king" and that solved the issue. Besides, some place like Iberia had more space for ruling queens, if I'm not mistaken.
@@rimfire8217 the thing is that, to the people making the movies these days, "queen" is worth less than "king", so even if Jadwiga could take the thrones as Queen of Poland they would try to push the "no, she was a king" idea.
african tribes/kingdoms did NOT have palaces like that. The closest thing was when Egypt colonized Nubia. And once Egypt left, the building and pyramids fell to disrepair and finally dust. They also never invented their own version of the wheel or a ocean going vessel.
it is people like you that compelled me to make this channel in the first place: *"African tribes/kingdoms did NOT have palaces like that."* See the royal palace of Kilwa or the Bamilike royal palaces. The Royal palace of Kumasi. I could go on *"They also never invented their own version of the wheel or a ocean going vessel."* Well let's just ignore the fact that neither of those inventions have ANYTHING to do with this video. I will say that very few people around the world "invented their own version of the wheel." It was only invented once or twice and then the technology spread around the world through trade, migration, and warfare. Just like writing, agriculture, gunpowder, and paper. Hell just like modern technology like cars, computers, and smart phones. In fact I made a video about that very topic if you're interested, I'll leave a link to it at the end of this comment. As for oceangoing vessels? That's just not true. Do yourself a favor and look up the Mtepe. That's one of many East African seagoing vessels that regularly made voyages as far away as India and China, with evidence of their use spanning back to the first century CE. I'll be releasing a video on that at the end of the month. Most of these vessels were manufactured in the Lamu Islands off the coast of Kenya. Wheel video: ua-cam.com/video/a_aUC4zkT-I/v-deo.html
"Women can't fight because they're not stronger than men." "All of these examples are based on actually historical female warriors that fought against and alongside men." You can make one observation, not both.
I feel like you totally missed the point I made in the video. I also feel like you're alone in that fact. I never said "women can't fight." I just said that female fighters are not the norm throughout history due to biology. However it seems to be mainstream in all of these new African kingdom movies. It's becoming the go-to theme in the genre and I dislike it. I also said "it's just my opinion." That said if you are confused about it, it's your own fault. It's a fact that men are "favored" biologically as fighters. Men are stronger, faster, bigger, and better reflexes and coordination. Those are all facts. Why do you think they have men and women's boxing? Sports? Biology, that's why. Hell even a girl commented down below agreeing with me.
You're not wanted here. All you do is ask ridiculous and racist questions that aren't even on topic. You don't want to learn, you've never wanted to learn. If I were to name or show you any African fortresses/castles you would either dismiss or downplay them. Get lost.
@@willfakaroni5808 can you give me 1 fort and castle in ancient or medieval times in central africa republic, south sudan, uganda, malawi, rwanda, burundi, gabon, cameroon, congo and others espciallly bantu, niger-congo and khoisan. And did they have old medieval city and herritage old city will old city wall like in north africa "old cairo, fez, rabat, tangier, in europe like rome, taledo and others? Give me 1 example of sub saharan africa old city and castle that equal comparable in europe, middle east, india and asia
yessss. they practiced human sacrifices and they were slave economy and important slave trade for Europeans. i cant wait how they handle this :D (but i like that they finally start make films from Afrikan history)
I'm hoping the script writers and marketing people were smart enough to pull a bait and switch on us, lulling us to think they will downplay the dirty side of Dahomey but they will be fair, showing the good and sutbly condemning the bad.
its Hollywood we are talking about, you can also ask for Hollywood movies to finally give us realistic armor aka you cannot slice people in plate armor up witha sword. most likely will never ever happen
Check out Red Spirit Mask's review. He tends to go in a much more detailed break down of the art and architecture of the Dahomey Kingdom:
ua-cam.com/channels/IqBml7QbxT7phZo6S8RAOA.html
Thanks my friend! The shout out is much appreciated. And I'm really glad you addressed the controversies surrounding the film. I 100% agree with you on those points.
Excellent points. The sententious attitudes of critics surrounding the slavery question is baffling. Nearly every civilization worth their salt advanced horrible practices. Also, I’m in total agreement about the current trend of the strong black women trope. Highlighting these stories over male kings or warriors can be seen as innocuous but I believe it points to a more dismissive or nefarious agenda.
Exactly plus the thing that's making it worse they're just going on Wikipedia and pasting what's there, not knowing it's limitations. Wikipedia does not explain why exactly the Dahomean culture was what it was ang why they actually went to fight the French and how exactly it played out. I don't get the double standards the Norse sold Celtics and Slavics to Arabs yet that was not mentioned anywhere on a trailer relating to the Northman.
Btw do you plan on covering your reaction of the trailer too? Would love to see it.
yeah it would be nice to have more feminine women and even men portrayed with more sincerity and empathy rather than generic “I fight for my people” stories we’ve seen 10,000,000 times. I also think it perpetuates harmful stereotypes or expectations of black women being super masculine that gate keep them from access to femininity
the Problem i have why the hell tell an obvious positive take about one of the most if not the most evil Kingdoms that benefit really well from the slave trade? i am pretty sure we could have stories about actual resistance against the europeans if there are so desperate rolling that dynamic out for the billionth time. hell today a lot of the Offsprings hide their heritage to these exact slavers because obviously people really dont like them and have still a grudge (and i doesnt help that they are todays politicians and countine the colony explotation).
the obvious Problem is glorification and 300 was a trash movie for any historical accuracy and comes from exagerated stories since spartans boast more and had a relative short actual powerful time
unfortunately, the political climate surrounding the trans-Atlantic slave trade means the average movie-goer is not going to understand or want to understand the dynamics of the Atlantic world between the 17th and 19th centuries. Many people legitimately do not understand that slavery was normal for most of history, especially for regional or continental powers. Instead, most Americans are given this anachronistic understanding of world history down to a dichotomy of oppressed and oppressors in monolithic terms (E.g. no agency for non-Western European states as they had no choice but to participate). This not only discredits actual history (participation in West African states in the slave trade was a willful transaction that was not possible without the express consent and participation of these states) but also lends credence to disturbing ahistorical arguments that Western European states dominated and bullied African militaries and states into participating.
The most alarming part is even among my fellow historians, the political climate has made the subject of these fascinating West African states almost taboo unless it is done in conjunction with the ahistorical narrative that fits cleanly into either American political camp's preferred version of history. I will see the movie because I feel obligated (my thesis is on the Oyo and Asante Empires and some of the military, political, and economic transformations that arose during this era and I did a few shorter papers on Dahomey) but my expectations are admittedly low in the realms of historical accuracy. The one thing we disagree on is that nobody criticizes the British, Romans, or Norse for their participation in slavery. I can't think of a single history class or period-adjacent film that did not receive criticism for its participation in slavery.
Then why not make movies glamorizing Nazi era Germany. It's too recent and people are still suffering the consequences directly from that era. This film seems to be glorifying some of the main people responsible for our ancestor's enslavement fairly recently, and partly responsible for the subsequent struggles of our people.
I want a movie about the Ethiopians vs Italians personally
Nah. Want something a story surrounding the Muslim afrian kingdoms
Personally would love to see the story of Ghana being told and how they were the first great nation built from liberation. It's crazy people ignore how impactful Ghana was since 50% of ash salt was created there.
Ethiopia based film would be weird bc Ethiopia was conquering its neighbors same time it opposed italian attempts to colonize.
@@itsbeyondme5560 Screw the Muslim African kingdoms. They contributed to the decline of our societies.
Islam, just like Christianity in Africa are foreign imports which must be banished in due time.
@@itsbeyondme5560 sultanate of mogadisciu so people can have an idea of how far has Somalia fallen.
The double standard surrounding slavery really annoys me, and I say that as someone with a much more negative attitude toward this movie than you (I hope for the best from the first mainstream Hollywood movie about pre-colonial West Africa, but it seems to me that they're taking substantial liberties with the timeline in favor of a more digestible Anti-Colonial/Girlboss story, rather than trying to accurately retell a given historical event or accurately represent a given culture). Like, it's absolutely fine for people to be concerned about glorifying the Kingdom of Dahomey, in the same way it would be fine for them to be concerned if a new movie was made about a culture like the Spartans... but I know for a fact that people will defend glorification of the Spartans in movies that have already come out, so I strongly doubt that "concerns" about glorifying a slave power would dominate the popular response to a new movie in that setting, as they have in response to this movie. Considering the movie isn't even out yet, and we can't be entirely sure if it will even gloss over Dahomey's involvement in the slave trade, it's especially striking that that notion is dominating discourse. And add to that how many people who had literally never heard of Dahomey before this film was announced, but suddenly became really invested in criticizing the Kingdom afterwards... it's annoying. Part of me wishes a movie in a West African setting less heavily invested in the slave trade came before this so that we could avoid the discourse, but I feel like literally any involvement in the slave trade (which most kingdoms in West Africa were involved in simply due to economic and cultural realities of the time) would result in undue scrutiny of the sort we'd never see for more well-known countries involved in the slave trade (like Britain, France, Spain, Portugal, the Netherlands, etc.).
If film show that they were slave kingdom And they fought for their interests It Will be like film about greece, rome etc. But i study history i am not "normal spectator"
@@fuksji Dahomey didn't fight to maintain slave trading and they stop trading slaves when britian alright arrived to do the blockade .
Why Sub-Saharan black African cannot made historical movie like Asian? even Thailand, Cambodian and Indonesian do better like "The Legend of King Naresuan"
@@safuwanfauzi5014 There are Sub Saharan African historical films, they just tend to be very low budget because most African countries don't have well developed film industries.
I do not remember, did the 300 film touch on the Helots?
I like the part of the interior analysis the most. Never concidered how little pictural evidence of interior of African palaces exist.
yeah it’s really sad and upsetting. Like they had really cool architecture in places like the Mali empire but so much of our knowledge of these places has been lost or destroyed. I want really accurate depictions of these cultures but it’s so hard to do that 100% which is a damn shame
@@andreja9425 damn
Despite the controversy around the Women King. I gotta watch it too, it’s still pretty interesting tbh.
Same as me. It is a step in the right direction and I' going to throw my support in it.
What’s the controversy?
A@@galientl4723 Dahomey Kingdom opposing slavery when they were apart of the slave trade. But like From Nothing said we get movies about America being the good guys yet they were also having a stable economy off slavery. Which is hypocritical
@@justju0rd appreciate it!
If they had to make a movie on pre colonial African empires defending their land from Europeans, the Dahomey kingdom wouldn't have been my first choice. I would have preferred if they did the Ashanti empire instead, but it is what it is.
I agree
Kinda cringe to focus on a kingdom with a slavery-centric economy and depict them as opposing slavery. Especially when the (anachronistic) king they chose opposed abolition.
Kinda feels like 300.
I don’t think it’s bad to tell a story focused on a slave state at all. There are a lot of nuanced ways you could tell the story. I just think it’s absurd to depict them as opposing slavery.
Kinda disappointing the Minon don’t seem to be using the guns they’re known for.
Not really because the British colonize half the world. So , they have not got rid of slavery.
I didn't see any part of the trailer where they "opposed slavery." I thought the premise of the film was to oppose colonization, not slavery. Nanisca literally said "They will not stop until the whole of Africa is theirs"
@@FromNothing The reality of the war they fought at that time against the europeans is that it was to keep their rights to take and sell slaves. Of the million different badass stories they could have told about the dahomey and the million different badass stories about opposition to colonialism, they managed to thread the needle and tell just the wrong one.
@@jimboblordofeskimos
You sound like they were doing this stuff. Same goes to other african kingdoms. They were went to war against another kingdom to get some slaves and others resources.
I get your point.
@@FromNothing As you rightly pointed out, the movie is trying to give the false impression the empire weeps at the mention of war. They're fetishizing women and Africans to match their politics, their literal race-war ideology where the Dahomey are struggling for the sake of all Africans... when their real concern was conquering other Africans. Thus, Hollywood who loves to lie and rewrite history is surely not going to mention their reliance on trading humans.
Don't forget Haiti and jamaica slave revolts had a impact to force European to stop slavery
The Kingdom of Dahomey was also the victim of slavery. The French enslaved thousands and thousands of people from Dahomey. Most of them were transported on the French colonie of Saint-Domingue (Haiti today). This is why the Haitian Vodou come from the Kingdom of Dahomey. Among the slaves transported there were many Agoji (Amazons) from Dahomey. One of them known as "Toya" was a fighter in Jean-Jacques Dessalines army during the Haitian Revolution. She had served as a warrior for the Empire of Dahomey before she was shipped as a slave by the Frenchs to Haiti. She soon escaped the plantation and she agreed to rescue a newborn baby and train him in battle skills she learned as a warrior in Dahomey. This young boy became the future Haitian leader, Jean-Jacques Dessalines who defeated the French army of Napoleon Bonaparte at the Battle of Vertières in 1803 in Haiti. Because the French have been humiliated by their defeat in battle in Haiti, and as a revenge for "what Haitians have done to them, they demonized the Vodou, the Haitians, the Agoji (Amazons) and the Kingdom of Dahomey. They used literature and movies to depict them as evil or as worthy of contempt or blame. This is why we should all time "take with a pinch of salt" any French version of their story about the Agoji (Amazons). The french cannot be trusted, they will lie simply because their ego have been bruised
Didnt the french have a war with them cuz they were taking slaves from french controlled lands?
@Rosita Scarborough that shit sounds like a crazy a time. Hard to imagine what it must have been like.
They're saying 30% of slave trade people in this truck the reason the French went to work with that is to stop them from selling slaves this is where the majority of their wealth came from this drive is one of my pain factors that you have black Americans mistakes today your glorifying these Africans were selling black sacrifice hundreds of thousands due to African sacrifice
@@bullet7873 Funny thing is that the French who abolished slavery, later established forced labor in their French colonies.
Yeah I'm looking at this new black panther 2 and the whole new diversity push of black/African women and while i appreciate it....I can feel them wiping black men out of the picture and putting alot of LGBT black women and "masculine" black women as leaders in their place...we can't celebrate our queens and act like they didn't have kings
I don't see it. They push a black woman and white man agenda.
I don't know why they even went through with Black Panther 2. I can't picture anyone but T'Challa at the mantle.
But at the same time, this sentiment also incentives the lack of representation in those areas as well. It's all a balance man. The LGBT aren't gonna kill the Black Community
@@innitbruv-lascocomics9910 most def not, I'm all for it, but just don't cut the strong black male representation after we only got 1 film
Agree with your point at 11:44! I hope for a story like that too. I remember how important it was for Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon to become mainstream in the West.
I wholeheartedly agree with the point about the "strong black woman" theme. It's getting very annoying. Obviously it's meant to pander to Western liberals and leftists at the expense of black men's history. It also has the effect of falsely portraying Africa as "backwards" or different from the rest of the ancient and medieval world, in that the leaders (particularly military leaders) of the great empires of Eurasia were strong masculine men 9.9 times out of 10.
Also, to your final point about making a positively themed African film, this is why we need to advocate for change in Africa itself today. Starting with major African countries like Nigeria. I implore all Africans and African Americans to start advocating for revolutionary change in Africa by any means necessary. Why should we continue to accept living in foreign nations while our homelands are plundered by corrupt people. We can write positive narratives on our own terms if we begin creating prosperous nations in our own land.
I don't why some people have a problem about a strong black woman.
Plus every country have at least a strong woman leader in history. How is it backwards?
The original goal of Liberia was to creat an african america if you will, with the goal being to turn africa into a union of states led by Liberia. This should be considered.
@@tylerrobbins8311 What should be considered, is nearly everyone there dhied... It was gen o side of AfAms, a literal attempt to clear the US.
@@tylerrobbins8311 and look at what the African Americans did to the natives in Liberia… yeah I’d prefer that not repeat itself
"Advocate" - that's where you people keep getting this world wrong 🤣
Looks like an ok movie I just wish we had fantasy films and books about Africa without European slavery permeated through the narrative. A Tolkien style epic about Buganda
Children of Blood and Bone and Black Leopard Red Wolf are those type of stories you're most likely to see on the big screen.
Write it.
Two Words: THANK YOU!!!
Further Comments:
-Thank You for exposing the fact that it is bias that allows many to critique this film based off the fact that the Dahomey participated in the slave trade, yet ignore how other cultures and people have done "bad" in our eyes. History is told with a lot of bias.
-While I am excited for this film, I HEAVILY agree we need a movie where it is NOT about Black vs White. Africa vs the Western world. It's tiring.
We need a film just about us! That's it. No agenda, no feminist propaganda.
Good point about movies about African history could deal with "internal businesses" instead of "black vs white". Colonialism sucked, everyone with a brain already knows it.
Exactly! So many stories exist of interaction with other ethnicities without the white vs black thing. Pre-colonial stories are so many. Why would they choose this!
Agreed, but it would still be interesting to see an African Kingdom against a Middle Eastern one for example a war that took place in 701 BC during the Siege of Jerusalem when the Kingdom of Kush under the leadership of General Taharqa made an alliance with the Israelites and made war with the Neo-Assyrians during the reign of King Hezekiah of Judah, it would be kinda be boring to see a Kingdom that is isolated.
@@MichaelClayton64
That would be cool no doubt. I'm not talking about complete isolation btw. A story like the one you speak of has nothing to do with Colonialism, The Slave Trade, nor has any "Black v White" undertones. So I'm good with that.
I would love to see anything about the Aksum Powers vs Merore.
Mali vs Songhay
Songhay vs Arab powers in the north.
Kush vs Egypt
Even a fantasy tale of Kush vs Zulus lol 😆.
Such are stories that don't involve us vs the white man and European Powers.
@@MichaelClayton64 oh can't forget about
-Meroe vs Rome.
-Kush vs Assyria.
Or even Fictional Stories with African characters. Like a -Merotic Gladiator
-Memnon
-Aksum vs Persia
I'll check it out. The overnight experts on African History are always hilarious. I can't think of any warrior caste that had the foul shit they pulled swept under the rug. Didn't Samurai test their swords on peasants? Historical fiction is a thing. I'm just not crazy about the impeding Colonization back drop of the story. I'm still waiting for someone to adapt "Nada the lily," although I'm afraid that some woke Hollywood type will do to it.
@obakpo88 "Historical fiction is a thing. I'm just not crazy about the impeding Colonization back drop of the story." why does this fact bother you, didn't colonization happen once Europeans got a strong enough foothold in Africa, admittedly it did take almost 400 years, but historically it did happen. And if you are unsure about the line or actions taken, remember this. There was a vassal Kingdom in Angola and their vassal King did tell the primary Kingdom in Angola that this would happen, historically speaking it did happen, so what is your beef with that point?
I think the horsemen are meant to be Yorubas from the Oyo empire, I noticed an Ida blade as the Mino were fighting the men on foot.
And ye the way they're portraying Gezo (the Usurper) is way off this guy was a tyrant bent on war with the remnants of the Oyo after its decline. Even after losing some battles he wanted more so no way he would be afraid to start a war.
And I totally agree I'm not sure why they're just focusing on the strong black woman trope I wouldn't have an issue if they showed variation. Anyway I don't know if you're aware South African Network is working on a Shaka Zulu series called Shaka Ilembe the trailer was leaked on Tik Tok (of all places) it looks interesting and I believe Showtime Network and CBS Studios are producing their own version in America so two Shaka Zulu retelling are coming. This is good but, I want more! Hopefully on figures like Sundiata Keita, Changamire Dombo, Sunni Ali and King Taharqa for example done right they'd be awesome.
And thank you for bringing Mr Bigot back!! 😂😂 I've been seeing this same criticism all over the comments. Yet they aren't looking into the history or situation as well as both perspectives. 🤦🏿♂️ I would have wanted a more accurate portrayal but it's not a deal breaker I will still be watching this.
And the slave thing is strange, the Norse and Danes sold Slavics to Arabs but, do you see this being the topic on the comment section of the Northman trailer? Nope the double standards are real.
Exactly this Dahomey film could have focused on the twins king Akaba and Hangbe when the Mino were relatively new. The political intrigue and also the unique administration introduced where male officials had to have female counter parts is interesting The wars and the overall dynamic during this period would have been more epic even the period of King Agaja would have been interesting the conflict with Oyo and other powers around them is what I would have wanted to see rather than the colonialism resistance storyline.
Another Zulu? Skip it.
@@itsbeyondme5560 Shaka Zulu and why? This one is more accurate to the Zulu history.
@@admirekashiri9879
Personally, we need films that focus on western Africa more.
Eastern and Southern Africa have gotten too much love from around the world.
I think, in my opinion, they love the culture and history of Easten and Southern Africa because there are "less" urban and more tribes than western Africa.
I'm not trashing their culture but if we want to destory any stereotype about Africa, a film about western African Muslim kingdoms like Mali or Ghana or Oyo kingdom.
Something that Africa has amazing kingdoms and cities....not living like tribal, pastoral people.
I'm already scared about the woman king I hope it's good.
Ghana and Oyo were traditional kingdoms, not Muslim.
@@FromNothing
Oops. Sorry
However, there are plenty of kingdoms at western Africa. Traditional or not.
Plenty of material to create stories.
I'm surprised Hollywood is not doing a Sundeita Keita story. ( yes, I mess up his name. I'm sorry)
A trope gets hated when it's done poorly too many times, like the strong woman trope and black victim trope. Hollywood have worsened people's views and keep ruining their chances. I haven't seen this movie yet, but I will and I hope more give it a try.
Slavery is terrible, but not showing historical movies because they practiced slavery doesn't make sense. I am excited for more African history videos. Showing the kingdoms of Mali, Ghana, Ethiopia, among others would be great and could really be used to dispel some myths about African history.
the Problem isnt slavery itself but the attempt showing one of the most guilty of them being the good freedom fighters. i have yet to see any roman movie that shows the romans as some sort of freedom fighters. it is similar showing a guy like Crassus like a good guy to slaves kinda ignoring the fact he nailed every single slave on a cross after the third serville war. and seriously asking Hollywood of all places making a movie subtle in terms of History is so dumb given the absolute terrible track record of historically movies that make any historians rather attempt suicide than actually honestly saying it is even remotely accurate. if they cannot even get well documated european history right ,how abd will they screw up african history?
The problem isn't slavery; it's the glorification and absurdity of framing that trailer presented the Dahomey in.
Many Africans gladly fought on behalf of the French to put Dahomey into the ground because that's how terrible Dahomey was
@@chidubemimari9015 They fight for the French because of ethinc differences not slavery
@@tompossessed1729 Never said they fought to end slavery I said many Africans, such as the Yoruba, gladly fought on behalf of the French to put the Dahomey down.
Slavery was a reason for some as those "Amazons" were known for raiding villages for slaves but the rest had their own disputes with Dahomey.
It's baffling that you specifically said West, Central, and Southern African kingdoms were prolific slavers when in reality it was nearly every world Empire that were prolific slavers. In and out of Africa. It's even more baffling that you excluded North Africa in that assessment considering the bulk of the intra-African slave trade was between North Africa and Sub-Saharan Africa. The Islamic states of North Africa sought pagan slaves from Sub-Saharan Africa.
I'm not supporting this movie. We need a movie that doesn't involve colonials or dependence on white settlers as an arbitrary bad guy. This came close to being what we need but I'd prefer something based on Africa alone. There's many stories to be told. Imagine The Northman but with the motherland's diaspora. I don't expect it from Hollywood but someone out there has to have that vision and passion.
In terms of the women warriors I dont like this new trend because its the same old trend of emasclating black men and making black women seem confrontational.
I hope the movie is more in line with African Americans then with Dahomey though.
Bingo! 🎯. I, for one, will NOT be watching this film.
So what I've seen in the movie I have a few caveats I that I am concern about. One is I feel like they are going to push heavily into the whole black vs. white motive when in fact it was a very mixed. You had Africans fighting for the Europeans and you had Europeans supplying the Dahomey. They're going to probably play up the white slavery but not show any of the Dahomey owning slaves. That was one thing that I was surprised about Amina is that they not only showed black Africans owning and trading slaves but even Amina's own kingdom was doing slave trading.
Also it doesn't seem they aren't using firearms which you mention in your video. This also looks like they're going to play the whole guns is dishonorable and cowardly trope and that only Europeans/white people use them. This is done in many movies like The Last Samurai, any Kung Fu movie, and most Westerns. I'm kind of tired of this trope because it really hurts everyone. One one side it makes Whites/Europeans look "dishonorable" and "cowardly" because they only won because of superior technology and not from strategy or diplomatic maneuvers. On the other hand is makes all the other people look primitive and backwater because they're not smart enough to make/use a gun and rather fight in a style that was modern 3 centuries ago.
I don't see how you can get all this from just that trailer though.
It were modern medicines that enable Europeans to colonise them in the 19th century. Before that not much colonising was done. More like pick up cargo and get out asap. Slavery isn't about race, it's about power and vulnerability. In how much we are wage slaves these days,.. I think that depends a lot on where you're living. In the US? Absolutely! Where I'm from much less so. I held many different jobs and wouldn't hesitate to switch careers knowing I wouldn't fall into abject poverty by doing so. I always enjoyed doing the things I did. Or if not try something else.
@@chubbymoth5810 Slavery in the Americas was very much about race, to deny that is insanity.
Thanks for your views. It really is a shame that no stories about African kingdoms simply rising to power or existing in a pre slavery period are being told. We see films about the fall of Rome or about the anglo Saxons fighting off Vikings but Africa doesn't get the same treatment
lets hope and pray
Not to mention the British Empire took out the largest loan in their country's history to pay reparations to British slaveholding families once they "abolished slavery" within their territories. A loan English taxpayers didn't finish paying off until 2015.
I already knew overnight historians were going to tap into their internal bias in regards to Dahomey's role in the Trans-Atlantic slave trade while ostentatiously downplaying the role European kingdoms and countries played in it to get wealthy beyond belief. It's just a microcosm of their usual deflect/blame/gaslight someone else tactic instead of just looking at the history objectively.
"once they "abolished slavery" within their territories. "
Why is this in scare-quotes? They factually did. Its the reasons the Dahomey fought the western powers in the first place. When the dahomey were defeated by the french, they were one of the last countries in the region that
1) Didnt submit to the western powers
2) Still kept slaves.
@@Greggah Because while on paper, Britain halted its slave trade in 1837, the country did not exclude itself from profiting off it decades afterward.
The irony of the Anti-Slavery Squadrons operating off West Africa confiscated slave ships, while these actions were in place to halt the exploitation of slave ships reaching the Americas, there are stories of squadrons capturing outbound slave ships only to sell them to the Portegeus and Spanish anyway. Slavery was still at play throughout the British Empire well after the Emancipation Act of 1837. Notably in British-occupied India and British-occupied Nigeria.
Not to mention British investment firms and banks still raked in profit in places where slavery was still legal at the time in Brazil and Cuba.
In essence, the quotation marks are for the planet-size loopholes that allowed Britain to still have a hand in profiling the slave trade, despite excluding itself from it.
@@mburks3748 "Slavery was still at play at X" do you know of any other faction trying to end slavery at the time?
This is what people studying CRT and African-American studies and other left-wing greivance studies miss- slavery is almost a universal constant, the abolishment movements were almost 100% western european.
I do agree that Burke is being unfair by downplaying the British role in the abolishment of slavery. However saying that it was 100% Western movement is also unfair. Reason being being that westerners were not the only ones who wanted to end it, it's just that they had the most power influence and capability to do so due to their massive influence on global trade in economics. In fact, one thing I forgot to mention in this video is that king Gezo's predecessor attempted to evolve attempted to abolish slavery but was but was usurped. Hopefully they cover that detail in the movie.
@@Greggah The abolishment movement was formed primarily in Britain, and was led by several former slaves under the Sons of Africa political group, Olaudah Equiano being the most notable.
100% agree✨💯🙌🏾I’m excited to see the movie. Hopefully this movie, good or bad, it may open the door to more Ancient African movies but with a different narrative.
Also a great move trilogy that could easily be a hit with holly wood would be about the life and rise of Okomfo Anokye. I mean seriously he is underrated as a historical figure.
Unless that’s a woman you just described, that ain’t hapnin.
@@bigevil1001 Well then a group of individuals should to indi with it as it's a story that would dominate.
@@bigevil1001 Why?
The Asantehne of Ghana might suffice at least it was a woman
@@fbaallied Wish I knew. You'll have to ask Hollywood.
My perspective as an African is that slavery directly led to conditions that opened up Africa for colonialism. And the impact of colonialism, racism, etc still exists. So Africans are not telling a story of overcoming and succeeding despite these factors (like Jews can). On the other hand the non-African cultures you mentioned did evil in the past but that evil resulted in them winning to the point where they’re looked up to and their people are prosperous. In other words celebrating African nations that directly contributed to Africa’s current dismal state is not a good look.
I agree but the kingdom that this qween is based of didn’t take part in the trans Atlantic slave trade. Sure they did in the Islamic one but the Islamic slave trade was practiced in Europe and east Asia so it was far from an African problem like the trans Atlantic one which was a African issue
@@makeytgreatagain6256 Are you talking about Dahomey/Benin? They certainly did take part in the Atlantic slave trade. Not like it really mattered. Both Islamic and Atlantic cause plenty of destabilization. If I recall correctly, Islamic did last longer and I’m not even sure the Arabs cared to end it until the Europeans forced them.
@@UnDark1 Islamic one was global so it wasn’t just blacks in that slave trade that was the point I was making they also didn’t take people in the same huge numbers as the Atlantic one. The Atlantic one destabilised the region of west and central Africa. The Islamic one didn’t destabilise any region of africa or the world, ironicallt enslaving warrior Turk nomads ended up backfiring with the Turks just Turing around and taking over the Middle East in the end
As much as I love West African history, the whole women becoming king to me points to the current trend of blurring the gender line especially among so-called ‘people of color’. Definitely seems like excessive liberties were taken with portraying this history…
Also, in Latino societies especially those with heavy native descended populations, many are taught to view the enslavement and genocide against our indigenous as necessary because the Spanish were superior morally and bought Christianity to out lands. We generally are taught to look down upon our native indigenous ancestry and also our African ancestry especially those of us from the Caribbean
Yeah that seems to be something I’ve noticed considering I’m of Latin American and Black Caribbean ancestry. They glorify western (European) traditions a lot.
The problem is Hollywood loves states. Heck I guess most people do. But by their very nature they are exploitive and held together by oppression. In my opinion there could have been a better story to tell making it about a citizen, be it of Dahomey or elsewhere and their struggle at surviving or making sense of the changing world.
I also disagree about the Aztec being celebrated, the one thing an average Joe or Jane is going to know about them if they know anything at all is there human sacrificing. Far from something positive.
Those shields weren't being used by the Dahomey. Something to remember was when the cavalry with the shields were shown John Boyega said "An Evil is coming" referring to the Cavalry attacking. Dahomey never had a Cavalry. the Oyo did. Plus we can see Dahomey fighting these shield wielding warriors later in the trailer.
I saw this preview in the theatres 3 times now and every time I get excitement chills! I can't help but to look for connections made that may connect to my Igbo and Tikar ancestors! The building decor to me appears to be what I've seen in describing one of the largest sacred libraries in the area, Timbuktu. Thanks for such a wonderful vision of balanced narrative not just from mine but the entire world's origins and traditions. Which we know our old traditions when we migrated from Alkebulan/Africa and still practiced by most all cultures Ive seen throughout the world at large.
do agree though I think it would be problematic if this movie ignores the Dahomeys part in the slave trade. I do not want anyone walking away thinking "they fought for freedom" just to get greatly disappointed when they read a history book.
If we want to explore history, and don't want to talk about cultures and countries that had slavery, there would be very little to talk about.
The return of Mr Bigot was a welcome one, I missed his accent
If you want some good information and interior drawings of African traditional architecture, I highly recommend Drawn from African Dwellings by Jean-Paul Bourdier. One of the best books ever on the topic, and I've read several books on African architecture. I actually recognized several of the structural traits from the book in the screenshots of the movie.
After being disappointed by Amina , I’m looking forward to a high quality production.
I couldn't agree more. Amina was very obviously just a slightly more polished Nollywood film. Very cheap sets and props and inexperienced actors.
I hope someone does Amina justice in the future with a good budget and deeper understanding of the history.
Great video, I'm so happy you covered this topic and agree with your acessment. I just hope that the guys that did it were smart enough to be pullung a bait and switch on us, making we think they will hide the bad but actually they will also cover it and trust the audience the make their mind on whether the bad side of Dahomey overshine its good side.
OK my thoughts are a bit complicated but I'll do my best to summarize.
Short version: Movie looks interesting (a few small reservations aside) and I'm definitely checking it out when it comes out.
Long version: Much of what you stated in the video. It's nice to see a film set in a Pre-Colonial African kingdom, featuring African characters and having a semi accurate depiction of what life was like in said kingdom; Dahomey in this case. Obviously due to depictions of precolonial African architecture (like you said palaces for example) it will be difficult to deduce what is and is not accurate in certain places but I'll remain optimistic.
As for Hollywood pushing the "Strong Black Woman" trope in these movies, I kinda agree to an extent. I personally don't feel the trope is being pushed as hard as some people claim though I am admittedly biased because i love seeing female warriors kick butt! Heck, Okoye's fight scenes in black Panther were always fun for me to watch and that was on top of her dialogue being hilarious and enjoyable. However I do agree that Hollywood can and should do a better job of diversifying what black woman can do in movies about Africa. Seeing the warriors and martial skill is great and all but they can also show the important roles women played in things like statecraft, economics, diplomacy, religion/spirituality and even just familial traditions. Also I agree that the whole thing of Black people fighting against White colonizers is interesting but is often overdone.
Also I am very thankful you called out the double standard of people who talking about Dahomey's role in the slave trade! Yes Dahomey was a major contributor of that horrific practice; yes, they did practice it long after the British ended the trade internationally; yes, one of the Dahomey kings self admitted that slavery and war built his kingdom's power. But how come people are totally fine with calling this stuff out but like you said these same people stay silent when we make movies about the Romans, British, French etc. who have their own crimes they've committed. And it's the same with individuals like George Washington but also with people like Augustus Caesar, Genghis Khan and Napoleon. All these men accomplished great things and contributed to the glory of their respective nations but also caused intense suffering to those around them, and in some cases their own people as well! But they don't face as much criticism; at least from what I've seen.
All this stuff is strictly my opinion and I know there will be people who disagree and I know damn well from reading twitter that there are people who will down right chew me out for saying some of these things but this is just what I believe.
Anyway long rant over, I'm still gonna watch the movie before making any concrete thoughts on it because I firmly believe you can't and shouldn't make serious judgment on a piece of media until you actually watch it. I'll keep some things I've mentioned above in mind but I'm mostly hoping the movie is at least enjoyable to watch. And who knows, at the very least the movie is increasing discussion about history surrounding the Dahomey, even if it's not being done in the most civil way (especially on twitter). I'm just hoping this movie can at least, somehow make it easier for not only African centered movies but also African creators to shine in Hollywood. The people of Africa and of African descent have many stories they are capable of telling and it's about time they're given the chance to tell them.
I'm curious to see if any historical African movies will be set in the Nile Valley. How would the racial makeup of the Nile Valley be handled? That would be interesting to see.
A movie about the 25th Dynasty and Taharqa with his war with the Assyrian in 701 BC would be interesting to watch. This war is even mentioned in the Hebrew Bible (2nd Kings 19:9, Isaiah 37:9).
🤩🤩🤩 finally! I didn't even hear about this but it's about damn time. Like seriously I can't wait for more african history to get some focus on the media.
Yes but please don’t take a movie as a representation of history. That is the danger of historical movies. People get that narrative and the visuals in their heads and internalize it as if it is fax.
@@indigop38 That is crazy I have always seen it as a way to spark intrest to go research an study. But yes nobody should take any media as fact.
I agree with you about t They’re being too many depictions of “female warrior “ Archetypes. I feel the industry is going too far showing females as being basically males with breast. They are not Showcasing The Other realistic strengths women have. It’s becoming cartoonish.
I , Like you, I’ve had enough of the “Black person as victim”. I doubt I will be seeing this movie. I don’t think I can take the emotional trauma.
For what it’s worth, I am a black female.
Thank you for your insight from a female perspective. I always tread lightly when expressing such opinions and I'm glad I was able to get it across without any bad blood.
Ahhhh, what a great channel, could you please activate the subtitles, my English is not very good and subtitles are a great support.
Thank you. The subtitles are active, just click the CC button at the bottom. If they weren't active before, it was probably because it was still processing.
I totally agree with you're concerns about the 'African Warrior Female' trope. It's intersectionality cinema. Rather than just telling African stories, (finally!) it's telling the story of oppressor and oppressed. A political narrative emerging from the western political tradition of the 'left'. This is a story of colonialism and misogyny told from the perspective of female Africans. Hollywood has made this movie for a modern liberal western audience. Just tell an African story! It can stand on it's own!
Im personally excited to see this movie even though i know itll have some historical inaccuracies like when the amazon warriors jump off each others shields to do this almost video game-y downward slash. At least we can compliment hollywood as its treating african history movies like all other history movies, As ahistorically as Apocalypto, Braveheart, and even 300(comic book movie but your average American would think its a documentary). Its shitty to see the culture war take this and run with it though as arguments are disingenuous on both sides, just gotta tune out all the noise and enjoy the scraps we get.
Appreciate your mature and objective perspective
That sounds like a limp "oh thank you Hollywood for giving African culture scraps of attention" mindset.
Dahomey didnt go to war with Europeans during Ghezos rule he actually Partnered with them in the Slave trade They didnt Go to war with Europe until the Franco- Dahomey wars under his Grandson rule
The best part is the exposure and research or search on this subject will bring more audience to channels like these. Im ready for the movie.
I didn’t know about this movie until this video! I hope it’s good, there is a criminal lack of films about pre-colonial Africa and I hope this starts a trend
I don't like the title, a woman king is a queen. Of course they named it like that to accentuate how she's a strong black woman but it sounds weird having the word queen. If it was called "the queen" I'd think is same and generic, like all those Netflix films called "the king". I don't think titles like these are appealingapealing. For example Xena the warrior princess is more or less the same kind of title but better, first it has the protagonist' s name so there's only one Xena who is also a warrior princess, and the warrior princess part is a bit more specific. if it was called, "The princess" it wouldn't be as apealing.
I don't know how this film should be called because I now have the need to educate myself on her story. But I'm sure anyone can come up whith a better title.
I have 0 problems whith it being set in an African empire. As you said it, most places did slavery and human sacrifice, including my own ancestors, who sacrificed messangers to ask the gods for favour. And I'm European. I agree 100% whith you whith the need for a full african film before European contact, and have an African villain and african protagonist, basically the same as if it was set in Europe or China or any place.
The thing that makes me sceptical is that maybe they'll try not to upset Africans, so I think the black people will be very good and virtuous, maybe even peaceful while the evil Europe and force them to teach them a lesson. This way of telling independence stories is so common that I'm sure this won't be an exception. If in filmed set in Europe where the oppressors are other white guys they tend to make the enemy look bad, and accentuate how the protagonists people is both peaceful warrior like, I doubt that a film about blacks vs whites will do diferent things. I don't mind it so much because I'm kinda used to it, but who knows, maybe this film surprises us, maybe it has more depth than black team vs white team. But as you said it, being the first Hollywood film set in historical Africa, we have to watch it, I'm not sure if it will be good or not but I'll watch it, I'm kinda excited.
Also don't listen to ignorant people belittling your work! you're easily on my top 3 history channels for a reason! many europeans are actually very intrigued to learn about precolonial Africa, since is something we don't learn anywhere. So after a year or two of watching your content it feels so great telling my friends about little african anecdotes and historical facts and watching how they get so interested and ask questions. And were talking about people who don't study history like me. Most people I talked whith were very opened and even wanted to know about these things for years. So keep it up! and I loved to see the southern accent racist character coming back 😁
Liberals need to check off the whole list, black check, woman check, Muslim (maybe?, won’t surprise me if they make her LGBT as well lmfao
Wow. I've been gone for awhile and your content is still as good, Jabari. Keep up the work man.
DOUBLE STANDARD
Excellent video, as always! I, too, would love to see more entertainment using African and indigenous cultures' elements!
Though, I found funny that you mention amerindian civilizations being "praised", because as someone who lives in latin America and wants to specialize on these pre-columbian cultures, I only listen to people calling them savage and brutal. And whenever someone tries to "compliment" them, it's usually just about how good fighters they were :/ But, I guess the grass is always greener on the other side, right? lol
Yeah in the U.S. Native-Americans are usually portrayed as "Noble Savages." Peaceful innocent victims of European imperialism. However those of Mesoamerica and the Andes are looked upon as highly advanced and sophisticated. I doubt anyone would complain if a movie was made about the Aztec despite their practice of human sacrifice. In fact, apocalypto was entirely based on the Maya including the language spoken, the actors, and the architecture etc and it even featured human sacrifice in the movie! Yet nobody complained about that. Just the historical inaccuracy of the cultural elements.
@@FromNothing I misinterpreted the idea, I'm sorry. You're right, "at least" the Inca, Maya, and Aztec civilizations (alone) are viewed as worthy of attention, if in a pitying way, of misguided people with potential; as in Apocalypto, with the ending that seem to imply that the Spanish conquistadors "saved the day"; while just showing up an African nation, even if they're not doing anything bad, is enough to enrage people.
Keep up with the good content! :D
I think the main issue is the dahomey sacrificing slaves every year, and the war being about the french and brits wanting to END slavery.
Also, the aztecs werent really glorified in their slave and slave sacrifices- look at Apocalypto, its not about making the aztecs look good, they are the antagonists/bad guys.
What I find amazing is that two whyte vvomen wrote "The Woman King."
That's not unusual when you consider how many animes have been written by whites. Just sensless to attach taboos to non-black people writing stories about black people. As long as it doesn't slander us as a people or present inaccurate cultural aspects
I Agree with you
One thing i seemed to get from the Trailer is that Ghezo is the king when the French war started but in history it is actually Gbehanzin his grandson. other than that seems quite accurate, I even think the men raiding on horses with the shields are Oyo, who Ghezo was able to secure Dahomey independence from after c. 100 years of being vassals to the Oyo empire
As for the trolls who hate to see a hollywood movie on an african kingdom, they will just have to deal with it. We all know they don't care about all that excuse they're making, they have no problem watching shows about Vikings who killed innocent monks and pillaged all over Europe. In fact the way so many white people jumped on it, it was obvious the overwhelming majority of the trolls never even heard of Dahomey before now, so it was like fresh news
given how rarely Hollywood movies treated history with any care it has 80% of being garbage. the northman that was praised was created outside the hellhole known as Hollywood and is the prime reason it was historically accurate with the customs. this movie especially with the obsession of politics first ,story and historically accuracy later will be very hard to be actually great. i could be wrong but after the 70th movie from Hollywood with pure stereotype sold as "represantation" i keep my expections low
Question: Do you have any idea how I can make this video popular? I really think people should hear your viewpoint, especially the Mr. Bigo- eh I mean some of "those people", if you know what I mean. Also I agree that there should be more African media that have African heroes and African villains fighting each other. Because, like you said, anyone can be evil regardless of race, it's not all black and white (pun may or may not be intended)
" Do you have any idea how I can make this video popular?" I think every content creator in the world wish they had that answer but I appreciate the thought lol. Also everything else, you said I agree, including the "black and white" pun may or may not be intended part :p
Share it with your friends and family who will watch hopefully they do.the same that's the best you can do unless you have other resources to your disposal.
Good job FN this video was very informal!
10:23 I personally seen most discussion about the Aztecs at least only talk about the human sacrifices. That’s the only part I’d semi disagree with, great video!
I see them always glorified for building their massive cities and pyramids, creating an artificial island, sewage systems, the size of their Army, and independently developing a writing system in the New World. I hear those discussed much more often than any negative scrutinization.
▪ You did an excellent job schooling these folks about slavery. The movie was so good for me I'll pay to see it again.
Good making
Thanks for this video 👊🏾🔥
i think the woman king will be a good mokie but not an accurate documentary
I hope that Woman King will be a good movie
about the dislikes and criticisms, unfortunately they explored the apparent hypocrisy about a movie that the trailer hints is about freedom fighters vs opressors but seems to forget that the dahomey flourished because of transatlantic slavery
perhaps if the movie apporached in a way similar of The Northman, recognizing the brutality and contradictions of the Dahomey Kingdom and their warriors and society it would be less criticized
Unfortunately in that last years is more dificult forgive these kinds of hipocrisies, specially when made by groups of people that criticized those hipocrisies in more conventional and eurocentric/male-centric/heteronormative stories made until the mid 2010s
depends on what perspective the movie is set to view from. Since it seems the main theme of the movie are the Mino and not the slave trade, then the movie would have no need to present them as brutal just to please people who want to make Dahomey's image bad. there are other qualities to the Mino and the entire Dahomey army than 'brutality', from the trailer i think they want to emphasize on things like women steping up to fight for their country or an african kingdom fighting against colonization which are all true to the history.
Too much people that never watched the movie is asking for it to be boycotted, but in that gets me is that I've never seen so much Mayo looking people on the comment section talking about how it's about the slave trade, mayo people never called for boycotting of any slave movie nor had any interest, go watch the film stop listening to people that's not seen it!
Yep. British had colonization, Germany had Nazis, and every empire had good and bad parts .
The reviews are good .
Great commentary!!! Thank you!
I'm waiting for the Shango movie
It's gotta be good there is so much substance there... So many angles to write from
I'm excited to see the film. I'm just worried people won't go see it and just condemn the concept due to a colonial mindset on cultures like this.
Love to see them do the Movie of the Battle Of Ekpenede who founded Okere Versus Ginuwa who founded Big Warri of which such history is shrouded with mythical an real events from the area we now call Warri in Delta state in Nigeria
But yes indeed I am going to watch that movie Woman King 🤴
To be fair, the Dahomey kingdom is a little bit misrepresented and a lot of what people think is that they were really bad slavers who sacrificed humans. Other than that people who know of the Dahomey don’t know much else about them.
This is very promising. Thanks
Yeah we need more movies like this even if many of them are not accurate or not the best movies, if they keep making more precolonial african movies, we will eventually get some amazing films that will be awesome and do a lot to spread african history.
i will supporting Something like this only if i dont see any white people in it . i am so tired of colonialism, europeans being the bad guys ...again . over 2000 years of history and we tap dance around the same old 500 years around and only with white people around. sigh...
@@laisphinto6372 Yeah, I would love to see an African historical epic without any white people as well. Though it would be cool to see a movie about Aksum and their connections to the byzantine/arab world. There are so many awesome parts of history that everyone simply ignores.
You must love savage slavers who sold black africans into bondage, held slaves and sacrificed thousands in rituals if you like this movie.
And you must have not even watched the movie
The problem is that so far know about Dahomey's role in slavery so having the movie take place during the war were Dahomey sought to enslave African living under the French protectorate, and portray Dahomey as the good guys, is literally spitting on the graves of those who were enslaved by Dahomey who thanks to this move are remembered as the ones fight against slavery.
Umm no and you are sub to er of all people so your opinion is invalid
@@tompossessed1729 Lol
@@tompossessed1729 As if you are the one to be deciding on that. :P
@@crimsonfucker4167that literally what documented about ghezo initial contact and the movie doesn't even glorify them at all
youre the best man bro i bless you
I wonder why they didnt Make the Movie about Anagbe the actual only Woman who did rule Dahomey
Here's my problem with everybody critism. When 12 years a slave came out we said no more passive begging slave narrative. When black panther came out we went OTT and loved the film. Bc it was great and meshed our cultures perfectly
Dahomey gets a movie and now we critical? I saw an African American called Kwame Brown claim he wasn't African lol I've seen every indegenous lie under the sun. To me this critique of the film that isn't out yet just makes me question whether this is coming more from the disassociation with Africa movement that's building up....
When I seen the trailer I just thought of the recent Harriet Tubman film mix with wakanda , it going to add more of a western feminist message too it than more the complex historical pov and ideologies of the nation’s involved of the time , in which you taught us in a prior video, I have a feeling their going to add a white savior vibe than the historical reasoning of European alliances between the kingdoms against a other European nation
historical?
I was really hoping this would be more realistic and historically accurate but it seems like as with all movies and series nowadays the current political theme of making women more masculine and men more feminine is clearly present in the trailer. They should've used you as a subject matter expert!
My ancestors weren't enslaved by the Romans, and the descents of Rome's slaves aren't still living with the consequences of their forebears' enslavement. I'm descended from those who were shipped to the US via the Transatlantic slave trade, and this, Dahomey, kingdom was partially responsible for that triangular trade. My very ancestors could be victims of that kingdom.
Hey man, it's been a long time since I've seen you comment. You were my first ever patron! How have you been? Also yes you are correct and that is true, I just mentioned the Roman thing to emphasize my point about "every empire practiced slavery so its unfair to single out Dahomey as bad/evil." I also mentioned how its unfair to criticize a movie about Dahomey for that reason but not criticize movies about Britain or any other European power that partook in it.
@@FromNothing I still watch most of your videos
As for the subject, the point of recency applies here and the fact that you're dealing with living communities. Black Americans (and other Transatlantic trade diaspora) are the product of Dahomey (and other kingdoms) slave raids and military campaigns, and we peoples who are the product of that are still here and suffer from the effects of that. The Dahomey kingdom also still exists. The Roman empire, Jutes and Angles and Varangians and whatever groups the Romans enslaved most also no longer exist.
Are we at a point yet where we can make movies about "heroic" and "badass" SS troops? I hope not. And yes, I do see this as a good comparison.
@@suedecomponent8931 Again, fair point on the Roman thing. I agree and have even mentioned this to people who were apologetic to slavers. Ones who get angry at me for not mentioning the Arabic slave trade for example. I always mention to them that the Trans-Atlantic slave trade was more far reaching, more recent, and still affects us. However I still feel like you misunderstood MY point. The point of mentioning the Romans was specifically stressing the previous point about the slave trade.
I mentioned how Dahomey partook in the trans-Atlantic slave trade, so did the British, the Spanish, the Portuguese etc. We have a movie made about Queen Elizabeth and her exploration of the New World for example. We have a game released by Amazon literally called "New World" loosely based on the conquest of the Americas. A very very popular game. Nobody bats an eyelid. So I say again, the part about the Romans was just a way of further stressing it, I wasn't saying it was equal or the same in regards to modern influence but the European powers involved were equal if not greater of an influence and we don't scrutinize them.
So I think it's unfair to just cancel Dahomey outright from it's ambiguous trailer alone just because it partook in the slave trade yet release movies and video games on European players and praise them. The default go-to reaction to something based on England isn't OMG CANCEL just because they were slavers and conquerors of indigenous lands. It's a double standard.
Your content is so sick, thank you for letting me know about this movie.
I want a movie on the Gullah wars/Seminole wars. Most people really thin black Americans in America never fought black agains slavery outside of marches and speeches.
I'd like to see cavalry, although I heard Dahomey did not have much
What about Shaka Zulu ?
Almost certainly no film would be made today in which Britain, Spain etc. Would be depicted as the good guy during the transatlantic slave trade unless they were fighting one another. A film in which Cortes or Pizarro or Magellan et al were depicted heroically wouldnt be allowed to be made unless it was an already wealthy and ostracized film maker (Mel Gibson) so I dont think it is that hypocritical to point out that this is a movie about slavers being wokewashed by Hollywood into a black girl magic resistance piece.
BTW they won't even make media depicting white europeans as victims by "non white" non europeans. For example Balkans was conquered and colonized and enslaved for about 500 years by Ottomans. But like Albanians such as Skanderberg get lumped in as oppressors with like Leopold or Hapsburg era Spain etc. because they share melanin levels and same religion.
Then how do you explain Pocahantas? How about Elizabeth: The Golden Age? Even Apocalypto, based on the Maya AND featured human sacrifice IN THE MOVIE. They exist, nobody complains. It's a very obvious dobule standard.
The Ottomans were White, no?
@@FromNothing pocahontas is an actual children's movie from 25 years ago my dude. And the english were certainly not the heros of that story. And Apocalypto is the aformentioned independently wealthy outside of Hollywood film maker (Gibson) and is about one "tribe" of central Americans escaping persecution from the larger, more powerful tribe. The spanish hardly fit into that story at all. Never seen Elizabeth TGA but she largely predates Britains role in colonization and transatlantic slave trade. Do love their girlbosses though especially those who help to uphold the black legend and anti-catholic sentiment.
@@fbaallied the turks are more greek today than theyre willing to admit even if their origins are central asian and all their art depicts them as asian. But it cant be both ways. Middle east and north africa cant be white when theyre doing the invading (from as early as Phoenician period to early 20th century collapse of Ottoman Empire) and non white when theyre invaded themselves.
The mediterranean basin was for a very long time pretty much a single continuous civilization with the free flowing of ideas, goods, services etc. So to me theyre the same. But for many on either side theyre not.
@@JohnnyLodge2 Whiteness is a contrust, that's why you're having a tough time categorising Europeans 😆
I'm jenraly not exited for any historical movie because I think there usually rediculies.🤔
Shaka Zulu
If any story deserves a movie it would be the epic of Sundiata. One of the best stories out there. This movie only happened because Dahomey had female warriors. Of all the kingdoms to pick, Dahomey is just not it. Why not the Asantehne’s story or king tutu’s story. This dumb as movie will only lead to ridicule.
Kandakes, Ndate Yalla Mbodj, Nzinga, Yaa Asantewaa, Amina, etc.
Your mind is still colonized by Western Ideals because Black men of Africa were not intimidated by strong women. This appears to be a Western thing. Many African men had no problem being led into battle by strong women. It is a part of the Nature of African historical societies. Even in my country, we were still electing Queen mothers to act as a judge over any disputes among Yoruba descendants living in The Bahamas in the late 1800s. They did this so they didn't have to take their issues to the colonial courts.
If you listened to that part of the video and concluded that I'm intimidated by strong black women then you clearly have selective hearing. I've also mentioned Nzinga, Yaa Asantewaa, and Amina in multiple videos. I'm already aware of them. If you watch the video again without selectively hearing things, I clearly stated stated that there were historical leaders throughout Africa history who were women but it was not the norm. The fact is that most warriors and war generals in African kingdoms were men, whether you like it or not even if there were more women than in European armies comparatively speaking. So I just feel like there is an over emphasis on physically strong black women in this new genre of film.
@@FromNothing Do you think the Bamun have the best traditional architecture in Sub-saharan Africa?
Definitely one of my most favorite for sure.
@@Neo-Femme There's a video showing Bamileke West African architecture
👍🏿🤠👍🏿
How bizarre is it that you go on a tangent about how african themed media should not feature African women warrior so prominently only to have to admit seconds later that these women warriors in media are based on actually existing warriors. Would you like your dahomey movie to not feature dahomey amazons? Like what's the end game? If they existed, the complaint just seems reactionary. Men are "biologically stronger" and therefore suited for warfare, yet this movie depicts an actual group of women. It's not like they made them up for representation. Theyre not even "manly," they're just warriors lol
Right......the Dahomely were so tough they were whipped by the French.
Um ok? What's your point? Nobody is having a pissing contest here. Nearly every kingdom in the world lost to Europeans at the time in history due to rapid military technological improvements. I'm not sure why that matters anyway.
France was whipped by Germany.........
@@Niani23455 really? I didn't know that.
And the French were whipped by the Germans, then the Vietnamese and Algerians during the colonial wars
@@luchamiomaridekakio6429 And don't forget the Haitians.
I saw this trailer and something that came to mind is, Yeah Back in the Day the Title Queen wasn't a thing as a Female Monarch was rare.
An Example is King Jadwiga of Poland. She was crowned King of Poland.
I don't think Jadwiga counts for this. Poland was either going to be absorbed by another kingdom or face a civil war where everyone and their mother could make a claim, but someone went rules lawyer and said "nowhere in our laws it is said that the ruler needs to be a man, just a king" and that solved the issue. Besides, some place like Iberia had more space for ruling queens, if I'm not mistaken.
@@alexandrejose8362 Well it is still a Female who was crowned "King".
@@rimfire8217 the thing is that, to the people making the movies these days, "queen" is worth less than "king", so even if Jadwiga could take the thrones as Queen of Poland they would try to push the "no, she was a king" idea.
african tribes/kingdoms did NOT have palaces like that. The closest thing was when Egypt colonized Nubia. And once Egypt left, the building and pyramids fell to disrepair and finally dust. They also never invented their own version of the wheel or a ocean going vessel.
it is people like you that compelled me to make this channel in the first place:
*"African tribes/kingdoms did NOT have palaces like that."*
See the royal palace of Kilwa or the Bamilike royal palaces. The Royal palace of Kumasi. I could go on
*"They also never invented their own version of the wheel or a ocean going vessel."*
Well let's just ignore the fact that neither of those inventions have ANYTHING to do with this video. I will say that very few people around the world "invented their own version of the wheel." It was only invented once or twice and then the technology spread around the world through trade, migration, and warfare. Just like writing, agriculture, gunpowder, and paper. Hell just like modern technology like cars, computers, and smart phones. In fact I made a video about that very topic if you're interested, I'll leave a link to it at the end of this comment. As for oceangoing vessels? That's just not true. Do yourself a favor and look up the Mtepe. That's one of many East African seagoing vessels that regularly made voyages as far away as India and China, with evidence of their use spanning back to the first century CE. I'll be releasing a video on that at the end of the month. Most of these vessels were manufactured in the Lamu Islands off the coast of Kenya.
Wheel video:
ua-cam.com/video/a_aUC4zkT-I/v-deo.html
Nubian pyramids did not fall to Dust and some egyptian architecture is based on Kushite/Nubian. Quit spreading ignorance and easily refuted lies.
"Women can't fight because they're not stronger than men."
"All of these examples are based on actually historical female warriors that fought against and alongside men."
You can make one observation, not both.
I feel like you totally missed the point I made in the video. I also feel like you're alone in that fact. I never said "women can't fight." I just said that female fighters are not the norm throughout history due to biology. However it seems to be mainstream in all of these new African kingdom movies. It's becoming the go-to theme in the genre and I dislike it. I also said "it's just my opinion." That said if you are confused about it, it's your own fault. It's a fact that men are "favored" biologically as fighters. Men are stronger, faster, bigger, and better reflexes and coordination. Those are all facts. Why do you think they have men and women's boxing? Sports? Biology, that's why. Hell even a girl commented down below agreeing with me.
Why sub-Sahara African do not build castle and fort like European and Arab(Oman, Egypt and Morocco)
Why ask such absurd and irrelevant questions? Stop pestering this channel and move on, troll.
They did. You're just being an obtuse troll. Try harder, fool.
You're not wanted here. All you do is ask ridiculous and racist questions that aren't even on topic. You don't want to learn, you've never wanted to learn. If I were to name or show you any African fortresses/castles you would either dismiss or downplay them. Get lost.
Infact they did
@@willfakaroni5808 can you give me 1 fort and castle in ancient or medieval times in central africa republic, south sudan, uganda, malawi, rwanda, burundi, gabon, cameroon, congo and others espciallly bantu, niger-congo and khoisan. And did they have old medieval city and herritage old city will old city wall like in north africa "old cairo, fez, rabat, tangier, in europe like rome, taledo and others? Give me 1 example of sub saharan africa old city and castle that equal comparable in europe, middle east, india and asia
yessss. they practiced human sacrifices and they were slave economy and important slave trade for Europeans. i cant wait how they handle this :D (but i like that they finally start make films from Afrikan history)
I'm hoping the script writers and marketing people were smart enough to pull a bait and switch on us, lulling us to think they will downplay the dirty side of Dahomey but they will be fair, showing the good and sutbly condemning the bad.
its Hollywood we are talking about, you can also ask for Hollywood movies to finally give us realistic armor aka you cannot slice people in plate armor up witha sword. most likely will never ever happen