@@julian-io5wl Same reason oxygen and water can stick to metal; their atom can easily 'capture' metal's more wayward metal's electron. ...Or something like that. There's more sophisticated explanation, but at this moment that's all I can remember from my HS Chemistry. 😅😅
the corrosion inhibitor is adsorbed on the steel preventing the redox reaction. you can take it a step further by adding a VCI that will protect the vapor space above the oil line in stationary equipment.
“Hope you found that interesting?” Understatement of the year. This is nothing short of awesome. I am not a chemist and I have no real immediate need for knowledge about corrosion inhibition. But I learned an incredible amount. Thanks for the experiment and the best-on-UA-cam explanation style.
Yes, this was incredible! Now I'm just left wondering what wears away this protectant? Knowing this will be so much easier than greasing stuff to protect it.
Bert, I'm with you. Chemistry was my one nemesis subject in college - loved it but so much of it seemed arbitrary (40 years later, oh but could I take it over again with a seasoned brain, patience, and a whole lot more discipline!). I have a small machine shop and though it is very arid here on the Colorado front range, as the population rapidly grows and climate change, I'm seeing rust sneak in more than ever over the years. Though he really didn't speak to it, notice that WD-40 did among the best. That's great, because I use it like cheap beer to wipe down about anything in the shop if I don't have something more specific to use - to that gives some economical hope!
I am corrosion engineer in the subsea business. You did a great job! N-compounds stick and protect copper alloys (brass, bronze, etc) while S-compound protect steels, this os why we use both N & S. You should work with VpCI (vapour phase inhibitors) we use them in closed plastic bags for storing electronics during sea transport
Very well done! The synthesis was interesting and suggests that there might be some applications where this molecule is bonded to resins like epoxy and polyester to produce corrosion inhibiting coatings and paints. Thanks
2 years late but I work for a company that manufacturers corrosion inhibitor permanent and temporary coatings as well as many other products like soaps, solvents, corrosion removing/inhibitor eviromentaly safe acids and many other products that fit niche applications. I really enjoy your content and was excited to comment because you showed interest in my field of work.
it’s not just the abundance of information that you have, but it’s your cadence, sentence flow, and timing on your videos that make them endlessly rewatchable to me.
Interesting video thanks! For a related pdf from the FAA covering aircraft corrosion control, go to the FAA's website, then under 'Advisory Circulars', search for 43-4B. It's about 6.6MB [1], and covers a wide range of materials. As you can imagine, corrosion has always been a major nemesis of aircraft, and a lot of time, effort & research has gone into it's prevention & mitigation. While at the FAA website note there are many other very informative 'advisory circulars'[2], ranging from single page, through multi volume text books... and all free! (Another great one is AC 43.13-1B, titled 'Acceptable Methods, Techniques, and Practices - Aircraft Inspection and Repair'. [1] Note that recently cancelled 43-4A is there as well. [2] The 'AC' prefix seen frequently on/in these documents merely stands for 'Advisory Circular'... the FAA likes & uses that terminology a lot.
Chloride ions definitely have an influence on corrosion rate, it's not just the conductivity. It's also how well the ions can complex the iron, chloride ions do that much better than i.e. formiate salts.
Ahhh, Chuck Norris beat me to it! I will add that chlorine is in particular a good complexing agent for many transition metals, compared to, e.g. sulfate. This is why you need HCl in Aqua Regia - the AuCl4+ (chloroaurate) ion is much more soluble than Ag+, otherwise the dissolution would take impossibly long. H2SO4 + HNO3 does not aqua regia make, because SO4 does not complex as nicely. So yes, any electrolyte increases conductivity, which enhances corrosion, but counterions that complex with the metal and increase its solubility, like halides, really crank up the corrosion rate.
I totally agree with you. I've always seen chloride as a catalyst for rusting. Iron chloride is both soluble as hygroscopic. It will absorb water from the atmosphere so rusting will continue even if the metal looks dry. For more on this topic, look up lawrencite diseace in meteorites. Another area of interest is conservation of metal objects recovered from salt water that archeologists run into. The common way to get the chloride out is by electrolysis in lye. The high pH environment is protecting the object while the chloride ions migrate out of the object.
Thanks for this comment. The "conductivity" explanation by Ben sounded like total bullshit to me. Water with ions conducts because ions cn move around in water under electric fields. Having more ions around should only reduce the influence of electric field onto one particular ion because the field is quickly shielded by other ions moving. I was about to send this video to thunderfoot =)
IIRC, chloride also causes 'depassivation', which shows up as greenish areas in rust. I have not conducted the research to say anything about this with certainty though.
@@victortitov1740 >ignore everything else in this vid >Shit on one error which would most likely be addressed with a follow-up video or pinned comment. >For extra shit, try to send this well produced vid to a 3rd party who tears apart pseudoscience and marketing stupidity. You're smart, but not very bright Victor. 😒
From my Employment Working for the Navy in electronics I would suggest to Try Dow Corning®3140 RTV MIL-A-46146 specifications, Coating is for electronics because it doesn't have acetic acid (which would damage electrical parts and metals). For your gasket sealant. In military electronics it is a mil spec requirement for sealing (among other sealants). We used several types Deoxit for rotary switches, potentiometer's, electrical plugs and sockets. They would clean and protect the above mentioned parts. In another vein of thought, another corrosive breakdown chemical that was heavily relied upon for corroded nuts and bolts on electronic equipment was a brand called Kriol, can you give an explanation of how that works. As a sidelight when we couldn't get frozen corroded parts to release, we had an electrical apparatus in the machine shop called Electric Discharge Machining (EDM) Process that would remove them without damage. One reason I mentioned all of this is, Remember the Navy works in a salt environment year round.
Chloride is also a pitting agent, it binds to the Fe on the surface, in essence removing an Fe-Fe bond and creating an Fe-Cl bond, this reduces the cohesion making it easier for the Fe to leave the surface
FYI: To simplify your apparatus at 9:05, insert a rubber septa on your round bottom with your reagents already inside. Fill a balloon with argon and attach it to a plastic syringe with the plunger removed (easier to attach the balloon to the syringe before filling with argon - use Parafilm to seal balloon/syringe). With a needle on the syringe, pierce the rubber septa. To purge with argon from the balloon, use a second syringe to pierce the septa and draw (pull syringe plunger) air/argon from the round bottom a few times. Leave the balloon/syringe/needle in the septa during the reaction. This will maintain a slight positive pressure of argon in the round bottom. This inert reaction setup with a balloon is done routinely in chem labs.
Thank you for making all of this information free to us! I absolutely love your amazing projects and every upload is incredible. I have learned so much from these videos
I experienced the Acetic acid effect recently by accident. I was resealing an old fish tank and had used razor blades to remove the old silicone seals. I had left a blade in the bottom of the tank when it was resealed using new silicone caulk. It seems that the outgassed Acetic acid vapor is heavier than air and tended to remain in the tank. After curing overnight the previously shiny razor blade was a now very smooth and consistent earthy brown color.
That slightly unusual-looking rust from acetic acid looks a bit like the finish you get on "corten" or weathering steel. I wonder if there is a different chemical in there or if the appearance is something to do with the rate at which it forms.
@@benc8386 It was a very consistent and attractive finished. I wondered if it might actually be useful in a way such as the rust bluing process used on firearms.
@@RichardCasto I use cleaning vinegar as a rust remover sometimes. As long as you keep it thoroughly submerged and agitate from time to time you get a pleasant dark grey (ferric acetate?) coating and a lot of the rust flakes off. I doubt it is as durable as any proper bluing but it's cheap and good enough for restoration/maintenance on old hard-use carbon steel tools (axes, chisels, etc..).
Firearm 'browning', a predecessor to 'bluing', is based on rusting the metal then boiling it in clean water. Boiling changes the loose powdery red rust into clingy black iron oxide. Scrub off whatever is loose, rust and boil again! You know when you are done when the steel doesn't rust any more! Depending on the steel, the colors you can get are browns, light greens and purples. Rub the steel with tallow or lard, then lightly bake it...like seasoning a frying pan! Old flintlock muskets and the like were protected this way. Hematite with oleum top-coat.
Hi dude, I am an engineer working in the production chemical for upstream O&G. You are an extremely talented engineer and while we are striving everyday to come up with much more complicated corrosion inhibitor molecules, I thoroughly enjoyed your approach in synthesizing, applying and testing the concept. I am sending your video as an educational tool to our technical group as just like you said, we sometimes go way deep in the rabbit hole and forget how things are fundamentally sound when you have a fresh perspective. We utilize RCA, RCE and jet impingement tests to determine the efficacy of corrosion inhibitors by using synthetic brine (5% - NaCl) to mimic produced water, 100% CO2 (or 45 psi partial pressures) and sometimes 10-50 ppm of H2S to replicate the worst reservoir conditions. Great work.
I'm gonna try this synthesis on Monday when I get to the lab! Excellent video (it's kind of a given with you), I really appreciate the thought and work you put into this stuff. I'm a farmer, but I've been going back to school for biochemistry recently and you're a big driver in renewing my interest in the sciences. I've been watching your videos for two years and I finally got fed with my limited understanding of some of the topics at hand, so I decided to do something about it. It's incredibly rewarding for me to watch this video today because I finally understand everything you went over, that's huge for me. Thank you for your continued work, I really appreciate what you do and I wanted you to know exactly what kind of life changing impact your videos have had on me. Cheers!
From about 1:05 to 4:21, I think that was all shot in one take. You consistently deliver such clear explanations, without needing a zillion edits. It's really admirable and appreciated. The chemistry nomenclature is interesting too. When you explained the "mercapto" and I thought, "I wonder if that means ethyl mercaptain looks like.... this... yep." Very cool when that happens.
trying to work with my organic chemistry lab was something of a struggle to stay focused... and then there is this that i'm watching in fascination between study sessions... solid material.
Salt has one more special property. Chloride ions are quite agressive against any passivation layer and are capable of creating small spots with pH much lower than surroundings. Additionally chloride ions may complexe metal ions, hindering build up of tight rust layer, which would slow down the corrosion. Especially it shows its agressiveness against stainless steel (pitting) and aluminium, but also helps with corrosion of plain steel.
Every single time when you make a video, I think 'aw, another long video, don't wanna spend over 20 minutes' but end up glued to the screen the entire time. This was really fascinating. By the way, I love your pronunciation of iron.
"Eventually I found this old patent for a corrosion inhibitor, and it had this interesting line in there that said the reaction product were this dark read viscus liquid, right as this [Deoxit] were sitting on the bench, and I thought, oh, really..." These types of experiences are wonderful, even if they turn out to be partly incorrect in the end. It strives forth creativity and new ideas, not to mention a better understanding of the whole. Also, this is a well made video about rust inhibitors and has enlightened me and hopefully others on the subject. Though, in regards to the sacrificial anode, to my knowledge, it protects the metal of interest by oxidizing itself, meaning that it is the metal giving off the electrons, instead of the base metal. (Though, I might not recall correctly, corrosion isn't my field...)
Brilliant discovery by accident with the Acetic acid off-gassing. I must admit, I often look at some of the most amazing stories in history regarding brilliant discoveries, and they often involve details like that where something happened by accident but gave you a result you couldn't possibly thought of doing on purpose. There is truly something special about scrapping things together and working with what you have.
Outstanding work. Organic Chem was the greatest coursework from my early college daze. I would love to sit with you and enjoy some beverages and chat. Thanks again for intelligent discourse
I worked in an engine testing laboratory in the past and the work included assessing the performance of corrosion inhibitors. The performance can be amazing.
Most people working on guitars are aware of it to protect potentiometers. There are different ones depending where they're used and it's all pretty pricy.
14:51 is it possible that the samples being electrically connected to each other would interfere with the experiment? Coud the worse-protected samples act as a sacrificial anode for the better-protected ones, biasing the experiment in favour of the better protected ones?
Very cool analysis and explanation! I would love to hear more regarding chemicals that stop rust that has already formed (like naval jelly) - how they work and how that affects the choice of which one to use.
You're watching a 23 minute culmination of dozens of hours of work. So if a typical class is 40 hours long (15 weeks, 2x/week of 1.25 hour classes) you'd spend that entire class learning one topic.
Thank you for this informative and useful video. One aspect of having a lathe and/or milling machine is the tooling necessary to use them. Most of that tooling isn't cheap and will have much bare metal just waiting to be corroded. An application of an oil film is often not desirable, especially for machine tapers which rely on a bare metal to metal contact to perform correctly. To protect those surfaces I use a VCI (vapor-phase corrosion inhibitor) paper wherever possible. Such papers (Armor Wrap 30G for example) work best in a relatively dry and enclosed environment (such as in a closed plastic or metal container). Since I've been using VCI paper (about two years now) I have yet to see any corrosion on protected tooling. Would be interesting to see a scientifically valid test of such papers.
Great video! I think Castrol's claim "Clinging molecules protect from the start" is about minimising engine wear at start-up (before the lubrication system has a chance to pump oil around the engine) rather than anything to do with corrosion.
Excellent, very informative and highly detailed quantitative experiments. Corrosion is a multi billion monetary problem. Thank you for sharing and best regards from the UK.
W Bailey there is vapor tarnish prévention product to protect silverware it come as an impregnated paper , you wrap the silverware in this special impregnated paper and it does not tarnish .
@@thecarl168 There is a similar product used to wrap machined steel parts and tools, and I've even seen some plastic storage boxes that claim to inhibit corrosion of the contents. One brand that comes to mind was Zerust (IIRC).
Nice video, liked it a lot. I just recently did a few corrosion experiments with iron nails. Where I treated them different. One wrapped with zink wire, one wrapped in copper wire, one bare and the last one smeared with grease. Added them in testtubes with salt water. After that they each received a 2mL shot of 10% H2O2. You can recognize the differences immediately. The copper one rust like crazy. The untreated one rusts, but less intense. The zink and the greased nail don't show any signs of corrosion at all. Greets from Germany, ceep up the great work!
Ben you’ve done it again - nerd candy - I am a chemist and could not have explained it better - nicely designed - pungent side reaction products are common - Look after yourself - if you’re going to do chemistry I do recommend you design and build a fume hood. I’d be interested in the innovations you would bring to such a lab standard.
I have seen a few UA-cam vids on it and this stuff apparently works miracles. I might try it some day. There is a Deoxit product for gold plated connectors too. That would be useful in a computer or anything similar. What I notice in the UA-cam videos is that they don't seem to let the stuff dry. I would let it dry and maybe even help it dry with a fan before powering on the device that was cleaned with it. That would just minimize the chance of a short that could cause permanent damage.
It seems like the scotch brite treatment you gave to the steel shim stock at 19:15 would also dramatically increase the surface area as well as removing any rust preventative. My hypothesis on the improvement of your results there, anyway. Thanks for the interesting video and I hope to see more on the subject.
Holy shit, you have explained this so clearly and I have learned so many of the processes I thought involved with rust and corrosion are wrong. Thank you.
Awesome ! Love it how you explain the Science. So refreshing that you're not just talking about what you did and how your patreons are great, unlike some other channels .
Very cool! Great vid. Formulating corrosion inhibitors from intermediates is very interesting indeed. Some cool testing like LPR and potentiostatic stuff as well as just freeze thaw and solubility testing. LPR, you can see the instantaneous corrosion rate and graph it over time. Once you add the inhibitor You can see the rate plummet in real time. A number of products can be superimposed on the same graph. Some formulations will not adsorb very fast but form a more stable film once established for example. The graphs illustrate minute differences very well indeed. Like the way you increased the severity of the test until all specimens had some corrosion. Good way of benchmarking. The products we used to make were predominantly for internal protection of oil shipping lines and vessels. Sometimes you'll find that you don't need too much dispersant to dissolve actives if you use a mutual solvent in your carrier. An alcohol or something. These mutual solvents can solubilise the actives well. Allowing them to remain in solution without agitation. The active compounds are typically part oil and part water soluble as depicted in this vid. So something that will dissolve both lil and water is good. It's a pain in industry though becasue of the flashpoint. Adding alcohols (especially the lighter ones) can increase the flashpoint above specification thresholds sometimes. You have a batch treatment simulation here, worst case for engine oil which is a nice severe test. Even lower concentrations work (2-5ppm sometimes or 0.0001-0.0005%) if your corrosive liquid is dosed with the inhibitor. In the industry this is called continuous treatment if anyone is interested in terminology. These actives constantly adsorb and desporb to and from the surface in a pseudo-stoichometric fashion. Having residual chemistry in the corrosive liquid ensures that desorption is approximately balanced with adsorbtion and the film integrity (mainly coverage and thickness) is maintained.
I’m working at industrial gearboxes manufacturer. We use different form of inhibitor: VCI (v stands for volatile ) It’s added to test run oil and preserve gearbox internals for many months but gearbox have to air tight. If user want to extend corrosion protection they only need to add ca. 1-2 l per m^3 and close gearbox air tight again . Corrosion protection agent evaporate and cover all metal surfaces. For other components we use VCI foil for packaging. If you like more details google “Flender + operation manual 7300”
Are you aware of a product called Ospho? Basically, it’s phosphoric acid and detergent. My friend uses it to stop rust on his steel boat. It’s very effective, works by converting iron oxide to iron phosphate. Iron oxide crystals look like daggers, and even if you sand them off, the remaining bits will continue to corrode into the steel. The conversion to iron phosphate stops that process. We used it on steel way covers in my CNC mill, and they haven’t re-rusted in 10 years.
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. Your videos are always interesting and educational on so many levels. I'm not sure there is any subject that Applied Science isn't a specialist in.
The Chlorid Ions eat away the passive layer on your average corrosion resistant steel (AISI 304). Instead of water moving the Ions, molten NaCl seems to work fine too. Great video!
I know this sounds crazy, but I found your explanation of the different glassware and their uses pretty interesting. Your videos are always fascinating. Thank you very much. Eric
Here in the midwest some of the best older cars to own and work on are the ones that had significant oil leaks for most of their lives. Between preserving sheetmetal and keeping fasteners from reducing to something that looks like a mars rock dealing with a bit of sludge in a small price.
Great stuff, how well has the ultrasonic fogger held up to the salt water environment? It seems like a good cheap way to do corrosion tests if it lasts
The precission scale you own is really nice. I would recommend putting it further away from the place you are doing reactions, mixing and apply heat. You could damage the scale. In most labs, so precise scales are in a separate temperature controlled room, with low risk of contamination or even dust accumulation.
Excellent! Looking forward to seeing more! Looks like the polar, fatty acid derivative you synthesized is well suited structurally to forming a monolayer. Corrosion inhibitors in ICEs are more likely needed to neutralize acids formed from decomposition of antiwear and other additives, notably those containing sulfur or phosphorous, rather than to combat the effects of salt water.
If you are working with sulfur compounds, it can be worthwhile to use bleach to deodorize things. In your reaction set up, a bleach bubbler might help keep things from stinking up the place.
The difference in the rust colour is due to different forms of hydrated iron oxides. The general rule of thumb is the less water - the darker the colour is. Also when you scratched the bare metal it increased the surface area, making corrosion faster, I hope you accounted for that.
There have been for ages, inhibitors that evaporate onto stuff, including packaged military silver switches. A piece of paper wrapped around piece to protect. The paper looking sheet has one side labled to face toward part being protected. Other vapor products , emitting pads to be placed within sensitive euipment. Another electronic spray by Bullfrog said to emit protecting vapors.
Thank you for steadily offsetting Terrabytes of uploaded junk made by and for idiots. Know and be aware that you are part of a very small and select group of people making social media actually worthwhile, and even moreso; entertaining, educative and inspiring. Don't you ever worry about being too elaborative, boring or geeky, you rock at this.
I do agree, the scale looks amazing, and it looks to be really high performance model. I cringed tho about having it so close to a reaction table and heat source. Too risky. It should be optimally in separate room. And you need to calibrate it with standard masses to measure a mass, not weight, as that changes with air pressure, shape of container, temperature, elevation, and local gravitational acceleration. Especially for the electronic ones. But it can all be automated and done quickly. It looks to be this model: ussolid.com/210-x-0-0001g-0-1-mg-lab-analytical-balance-digital-precision-scale.html (U.S. Solid USS-DBS9 Digital Analytical Balance Scale). It is surprisingly cheap! I guess the electronic sensors got a serious progress recently.
Thanks again for another great video my man! Keep up the good work! Its people like you that help to make the world a better place by teaching people practical uses for the things you find out :) Normally I watch these videos because I like learning but I rather enjoyed this one as I do plan to make a career out of welding and to an extent metal working and thus it'll probably be a good idea to know about this kinda stuff if I make my own creations and repairs and want to keep things from corroding from outside sources of corrosion.
Oh, ok. I always thought Deoxit was snake oil in a can with a cult. You've convinced me to give it a fair shake. As always, you are what every scientist should strive to be. Consistent, thorough, informative...
Can you do a similar episode on the anti corrosion paste that prevents dissimilar metals from redoxing. The green past inside the purple wire nuts that allow you to splice copper wires with aluminum wires in older construction.
You gotta be crazy! First, you tell us that this corrosion inhibitor is a well-kept secret for most manufacturers, but then you make a video about how to make one that works even better! :D
Just a couple of points from a chemist's perspective: 1. There may still be unreacted oleic acid in the final product. A comparison should be made of the crude product vs. one that has been purified of unreacted feedstock and side products. 2. Some of the oleic acid may have polymerized (it does that even in absence of air especially at high temperatures) and may be what the gunk at the bottom is. The gunk is what tells me that you have an impure product. Also the side thiol groups may be active in conferring the corrosion inhibitor properties; if the are both blocked, the activity may go down. It may be interesting to compare a mono-substituted product with the di-substituted one.
Always been a big fan of your content, and If you ever need a corrosive environment to test your results again, just send them down to me! Everything corrodes on a boat in the tropics, even the things that are supposedly corrosion proof...
Really cool stuff! I had absolutely no idea how those corrosion inhibitors worked.
Why does the sulphur stick to the metal ?
@@julian-io5wl Same reason oxygen and water can stick to metal; their atom can easily 'capture' metal's more wayward metal's electron.
...Or something like that. There's more sophisticated explanation, but at this moment that's all I can remember from my HS Chemistry. 😅😅
i was just thinking "put together nilered and ben krasnow on a lab," and then i find your comment! you two are awesome.
The gods united
the corrosion inhibitor is adsorbed on the steel preventing the redox reaction. you can take it a step further by adding a VCI that will protect the vapor space above the oil line in stationary equipment.
“Hope you found that interesting?” Understatement of the year. This is nothing short of awesome. I am not a chemist and I have no real immediate need for knowledge about corrosion inhibition. But I learned an incredible amount. Thanks for the experiment and the best-on-UA-cam explanation style.
Yes, this was incredible! Now I'm just left wondering what wears away this protectant? Knowing this will be so much easier than greasing stuff to protect it.
Bert Holtappels
He’s very good about explaining the methods and logic for his analyses.
Bert, I'm with you. Chemistry was my one nemesis subject in college - loved it but so much of it seemed arbitrary (40 years later, oh but could I take it over again with a seasoned brain, patience, and a whole lot more discipline!). I have a small machine shop and though it is very arid here on the Colorado front range, as the population rapidly grows and climate change, I'm seeing rust sneak in more than ever over the years. Though he really didn't speak to it, notice that WD-40 did among the best. That's great, because I use it like cheap beer to wipe down about anything in the shop if I don't have something more specific to use - to that gives some economical hope!
I'm a chemist working on an anticorrosion polymer. I find this very useful as well.
Dude, never stop posting. You're the best channel on YT, period.
Isn't he a good teacher!? :D
@@chemicalvamp dont let him know that he might start to charge money
The depth of research exposed in each video is worth more than gold
I am corrosion engineer in the subsea business. You did a great job! N-compounds stick and protect copper alloys (brass, bronze, etc) while S-compound protect steels, this os why we use both N & S.
You should work with VpCI (vapour phase inhibitors) we use them in closed plastic bags for storing electronics during sea transport
How is Rust-Oleum oil spray?
Could you recommend a good corrosion inhibiting commercial spray for car?
Pls what are the Laboratory test to determine the efficiency of a corrosion inhibitor?
N compounds also destroy brass in particular and can also dissolve other copper alloys... be very careful
Very well done!
The synthesis was interesting and suggests that there might be some applications where this molecule is bonded to resins like epoxy and polyester to produce corrosion inhibiting coatings and paints.
Thanks
2 years late but I work for a company that manufacturers corrosion inhibitor permanent and temporary coatings as well as many other products like soaps, solvents, corrosion removing/inhibitor eviromentaly safe acids and many other products that fit niche applications.
I really enjoy your content and was excited to comment because you showed interest in my field of work.
it’s not just the abundance of information that you have, but it’s your cadence, sentence flow, and timing on your videos that make them endlessly rewatchable to me.
Interesting video thanks! For a related pdf from the FAA covering aircraft corrosion control, go to the FAA's website, then under 'Advisory Circulars', search for 43-4B. It's about 6.6MB [1], and covers a wide range of materials. As you can imagine, corrosion has always been a major nemesis of aircraft, and a lot of time, effort & research has gone into it's prevention & mitigation. While at the FAA website note there are many other very informative 'advisory circulars'[2], ranging from single page, through multi volume text books... and all free! (Another great one is AC 43.13-1B, titled 'Acceptable Methods, Techniques, and Practices - Aircraft Inspection and Repair'.
[1] Note that recently cancelled 43-4A is there as well.
[2] The 'AC' prefix seen frequently on/in these documents merely stands for 'Advisory Circular'... the FAA likes & uses that terminology a lot.
Chloride ions definitely have an influence on corrosion rate, it's not just the conductivity. It's also how well the ions can complex the iron, chloride ions do that much better than i.e. formiate salts.
Ahhh, Chuck Norris beat me to it! I will add that chlorine is in particular a good complexing agent for many transition metals, compared to, e.g. sulfate. This is why you need HCl in Aqua Regia - the AuCl4+ (chloroaurate) ion is much more soluble than Ag+, otherwise the dissolution would take impossibly long. H2SO4 + HNO3 does not aqua regia make, because SO4 does not complex as nicely.
So yes, any electrolyte increases conductivity, which enhances corrosion, but counterions that complex with the metal and increase its solubility, like halides, really crank up the corrosion rate.
I totally agree with you. I've always seen chloride as a catalyst for rusting. Iron chloride is both soluble as hygroscopic. It will absorb water from the atmosphere so rusting will continue even if the metal looks dry.
For more on this topic, look up lawrencite diseace in meteorites.
Another area of interest is conservation of metal objects recovered from salt water that archeologists run into. The common way to get the chloride out is by electrolysis in lye. The high pH environment is protecting the object while the chloride ions migrate out of the object.
Thanks for this comment. The "conductivity" explanation by Ben sounded like total bullshit to me. Water with ions conducts because ions cn move around in water under electric fields. Having more ions around should only reduce the influence of electric field onto one particular ion because the field is quickly shielded by other ions moving. I was about to send this video to thunderfoot =)
IIRC, chloride also causes 'depassivation', which shows up as greenish areas in rust. I have not conducted the research to say anything about this with certainty though.
@@victortitov1740 >ignore everything else in this vid
>Shit on one error which would most likely be addressed with a follow-up video or pinned comment.
>For extra shit, try to send this well produced vid to a 3rd party who tears apart pseudoscience and marketing stupidity.
You're smart, but not very bright Victor. 😒
From my Employment Working for the Navy in electronics I would suggest to Try Dow Corning®3140 RTV MIL-A-46146 specifications, Coating is for electronics because it doesn't have acetic acid (which would damage electrical parts and metals). For your gasket sealant. In military electronics it is a mil spec requirement for sealing (among other sealants). We used several types Deoxit for rotary switches, potentiometer's, electrical plugs and sockets. They would clean and protect the above mentioned parts.
In another vein of thought, another corrosive breakdown chemical that was heavily relied upon for corroded nuts and bolts on electronic equipment was a brand called Kriol, can you give an explanation of how that works. As a sidelight when we couldn't get frozen corroded parts to release, we had an electrical apparatus in the machine shop called Electric Discharge Machining (EDM) Process that would remove them without damage. One reason I mentioned all of this is, Remember the Navy works in a salt environment year round.
Super interesting, as always! Thanks for sharing!
Chloride is also a pitting agent, it binds to the Fe on the surface, in essence removing an Fe-Fe bond and creating an Fe-Cl bond, this reduces the cohesion making it easier for the Fe to leave the surface
FYI: To simplify your apparatus at 9:05, insert a rubber septa on your round bottom with your reagents already inside. Fill a balloon with argon and attach it to a plastic syringe with the plunger removed (easier to attach the balloon to the syringe before filling with argon - use Parafilm to seal balloon/syringe). With a needle on the syringe, pierce the rubber septa. To purge with argon from the balloon, use a second syringe to pierce the septa and draw (pull syringe plunger) air/argon from the round bottom a few times. Leave the balloon/syringe/needle in the septa during the reaction. This will maintain a slight positive pressure of argon in the round bottom. This inert reaction setup with a balloon is done routinely in chem labs.
Thank you for making all of this information free to us! I absolutely love your amazing projects and every upload is incredible. I have learned so much from these videos
I experienced the Acetic acid effect recently by accident. I was resealing an old fish tank and had used razor blades to remove the old silicone seals. I had left a blade in the bottom of the tank when it was resealed using new silicone caulk. It seems that the outgassed Acetic acid vapor is heavier than air and tended to remain in the tank. After curing overnight the previously shiny razor blade was a now very smooth and consistent earthy brown color.
That slightly unusual-looking rust from acetic acid looks a bit like the finish you get on "corten" or weathering steel. I wonder if there is a different chemical in there or if the appearance is something to do with the rate at which it forms.
@@benc8386 It was a very consistent and attractive finished. I wondered if it might actually be useful in a way such as the rust bluing process used on firearms.
@@RichardCasto I use cleaning vinegar as a rust remover sometimes. As long as you keep it thoroughly submerged and agitate from time to time you get a pleasant dark grey (ferric acetate?) coating and a lot of the rust flakes off. I doubt it is as durable as any proper bluing but it's cheap and good enough for restoration/maintenance on old hard-use carbon steel tools (axes, chisels, etc..).
Firearm 'browning', a predecessor to 'bluing', is based on rusting the metal then boiling it in clean water.
Boiling changes the loose powdery red rust into clingy black iron oxide.
Scrub off whatever is loose, rust and boil again!
You know when you are done when the steel doesn't rust any more!
Depending on the steel, the colors you can get are browns, light greens and purples.
Rub the steel with tallow or lard, then lightly bake it...like seasoning a frying pan!
Old flintlock muskets and the like were protected this way. Hematite with oleum top-coat.
Hi dude, I am an engineer working in the production chemical for upstream O&G. You are an extremely talented engineer and while we are striving everyday to come up with much more complicated corrosion inhibitor molecules, I thoroughly enjoyed your approach in synthesizing, applying and testing the concept. I am sending your video as an educational tool to our technical group as just like you said, we sometimes go way deep in the rabbit hole and forget how things are fundamentally sound when you have a fresh perspective. We utilize RCA, RCE and jet impingement tests to determine the efficacy of corrosion inhibitors by using synthetic brine (5% - NaCl) to mimic produced water, 100% CO2 (or 45 psi partial pressures) and sometimes 10-50 ppm of H2S to replicate the worst reservoir conditions. Great work.
"Quite a nice smell. Almost minty."
Nose falls off.
known to the state of cancer to cause California
@@HPD1171 korntackt
i also wonder. . . does a person want to pursue.. what is this unexpected thing.. what are its properties etc
Get real. people smoke crack and their noses don't fall. This is nothing like crack, as the thumbnail clearly shows
@@adonisds
"This is nothing like crack" - adonisds 2020
I'm gonna try this synthesis on Monday when I get to the lab! Excellent video (it's kind of a given with you), I really appreciate the thought and work you put into this stuff. I'm a farmer, but I've been going back to school for biochemistry recently and you're a big driver in renewing my interest in the sciences. I've been watching your videos for two years and I finally got fed with my limited understanding of some of the topics at hand, so I decided to do something about it. It's incredibly rewarding for me to watch this video today because I finally understand everything you went over, that's huge for me. Thank you for your continued work, I really appreciate what you do and I wanted you to know exactly what kind of life changing impact your videos have had on me. Cheers!
Incredible work. You seem extremely humble, but you are a scientific polymath. So fun to watch
Very cool, and really impressive results!
From about 1:05 to 4:21, I think that was all shot in one take. You consistently deliver such clear explanations, without needing a zillion edits. It's really admirable and appreciated. The chemistry nomenclature is interesting too. When you explained the "mercapto" and I thought, "I wonder if that means ethyl mercaptain looks like.... this... yep." Very cool when that happens.
trying to work with my organic chemistry lab was something of a struggle to stay focused... and then there is this that i'm watching in fascination between study sessions... solid material.
Salt has one more special property. Chloride ions are quite agressive against any passivation layer and are capable of creating small spots with pH much lower than surroundings. Additionally chloride ions may complexe metal ions, hindering build up of tight rust layer, which would slow down the corrosion. Especially it shows its agressiveness against stainless steel (pitting) and aluminium, but also helps with corrosion of plain steel.
3 minutes in, already mindblown📖🖊👌
What an absolutely awesome video Ben!
Every single time when you make a video, I think 'aw, another long video, don't wanna spend over 20 minutes' but end up glued to the screen the entire time. This was really fascinating.
By the way, I love your pronunciation of iron.
"Eventually I found this old patent for a corrosion inhibitor, and it had this interesting line in there that said the reaction product were this dark read viscus liquid, right as this [Deoxit] were sitting on the bench, and I thought, oh, really..."
These types of experiences are wonderful, even if they turn out to be partly incorrect in the end. It strives forth creativity and new ideas, not to mention a better understanding of the whole.
Also, this is a well made video about rust inhibitors and has enlightened me and hopefully others on the subject.
Though, in regards to the sacrificial anode, to my knowledge, it protects the metal of interest by oxidizing itself, meaning that it is the metal giving off the electrons, instead of the base metal. (Though, I might not recall correctly, corrosion isn't my field...)
Brilliant discovery by accident with the Acetic acid off-gassing. I must admit, I often look at some of the most amazing stories in history regarding brilliant discoveries, and they often involve details like that where something happened by accident but gave you a result you couldn't possibly thought of doing on purpose. There is truly something special about scrapping things together and working with what you have.
Outstanding work. Organic Chem was the greatest coursework from my early college daze. I would love to sit with you and enjoy some beverages and chat. Thanks again for intelligent discourse
I worked in an engine testing laboratory in the past and the work included assessing the performance of corrosion inhibitors. The performance can be amazing.
How hydrophobic are those coatings? Are you able to do a contact angle test with some DI water?
^^^^ Please!!
Very cool and comprehensive demonstrations ! All these videos must be part of our academic curriculum !
...and sales of Deoxit suddenly exploded. (I wasn't aware of it but I'll buy a bottle now.) Another good video.
It's fantastic stuff. Great for cleaning dirty contacts in electrical equipment. Dirty pots and jacks in music instruments/amps/radios/etc.
Most people working on guitars are aware of it to protect potentiometers.
There are different ones depending where they're used and it's all pretty pricy.
14:51 is it possible that the samples being electrically connected to each other would interfere with the experiment? Coud the worse-protected samples act as a sacrificial anode for the better-protected ones, biasing the experiment in favour of the better protected ones?
Very cool analysis and explanation!
I would love to hear more regarding chemicals that stop rust that has already formed (like naval jelly) - how they work and how that affects the choice of which one to use.
I wished science was interesting in school. I'm 38 now and feel I got far more from this episode than any class in school.
You're watching a 23 minute culmination of dozens of hours of work. So if a typical class is 40 hours long (15 weeks, 2x/week of 1.25 hour classes) you'd spend that entire class learning one topic.
@@xenonram Excellent observation! Thank you for sharing this.
Thank you for this informative and useful video. One aspect of having a lathe and/or milling machine is the tooling necessary to use them. Most of that tooling isn't cheap and will have much bare metal just waiting to be corroded. An application of an oil film is often not desirable, especially for machine tapers which rely on a bare metal to metal contact to perform correctly. To protect those surfaces I use a VCI (vapor-phase corrosion inhibitor) paper wherever possible. Such papers (Armor Wrap 30G for example) work best in a relatively dry and enclosed environment (such as in a closed plastic or metal container). Since I've been using VCI paper (about two years now) I have yet to see any corrosion on protected tooling. Would be interesting to see a scientifically valid test of such papers.
Outstanding video as always.
Just found this channel via your Tennis ball video. Everything you make is fantastic, subscribed.
Great video! I think Castrol's claim "Clinging molecules protect from the start" is about minimising engine wear at start-up (before the lubrication system has a chance to pump oil around the engine) rather than anything to do with corrosion.
Excellent, very informative and highly detailed quantitative experiments. Corrosion is a multi billion monetary problem.
Thank you for sharing and best regards from the UK.
The best youtube channel in the world.
By far
If you aren't bored of this subject yet, how about taking a look at Volatile corrosion inhibitors?
W Bailey there is vapor tarnish prévention product to protect silverware it come as an impregnated paper , you wrap the silverware in this special impregnated paper and it does not tarnish .
@@thecarl168 There is a similar product used to wrap machined steel parts and tools, and I've even seen some plastic storage boxes that claim to inhibit corrosion of the contents. One brand that comes to mind was Zerust (IIRC).
Kevin Martin I sleep in one these. It prevents me from aging :-)
That slow motion shot at 10:55 is increadible.
Nice video, liked it a lot. I just recently did a few corrosion experiments with iron nails. Where I treated them different. One wrapped with zink wire, one wrapped in copper wire, one bare and the last one smeared with grease. Added them in testtubes with salt water. After that they each received a 2mL shot of 10% H2O2. You can recognize the differences immediately. The copper one rust like crazy. The untreated one rusts, but less intense. The zink and the greased nail don't show any signs of corrosion at all. Greets from Germany, ceep up the great work!
So many wonderful cogent chemical explainations! Thank you!
I love this channel. Where else will you find a machinist's vise sitting on a bench next to test tubes and electronics
at AvEs
and ElementalMaker
and Cody's Lab
your description of the molecule is fantastic, thank you.
Always love hearing about how you trouble shoot your method and apparatus.
Ben you’ve done it again - nerd candy - I am a chemist and could not have explained it better - nicely designed - pungent side reaction products are common - Look after yourself - if you’re going to do chemistry I do recommend you design and build a fume hood. I’d be interested in the innovations you would bring to such a lab standard.
This is the best explanation I've ever seen for sacrificial anodes, and it only took a couple minutes of setup. Boats make sense to me now!
Very neat. I love Deoxit for electrical and electronic cleaning and protection. Nice to learn about how it works, and how effective it is.
I have seen a few UA-cam vids on it and this stuff apparently works miracles. I might try it some day. There is a Deoxit product for gold plated connectors too. That would be useful in a computer or anything similar. What I notice in the UA-cam videos is that they don't seem to let the stuff dry. I would let it dry and maybe even help it dry with a fan before powering on the device that was cleaned with it. That would just minimize the chance of a short that could cause permanent damage.
It seems like the scotch brite treatment you gave to the steel shim stock at 19:15 would also dramatically increase the surface area as well as removing any rust preventative. My hypothesis on the improvement of your results there, anyway.
Thanks for the interesting video and I hope to see more on the subject.
Holy shit, you have explained this so clearly and I have learned so many of the processes I thought involved with rust and corrosion are wrong. Thank you.
Fantastic video! Thank you so much for sharing ALL you HARD work. I absolutely love your work. Fred Ontario, NY
I thoroughly enjoy your videos. Thank you for contributing such wonderful art to society.
Awesome !
Love it how you explain the Science.
So refreshing that you're not just talking about what you did and how your patreons are great, unlike some other channels .
Very cool! Great vid. Formulating corrosion inhibitors from intermediates is very interesting indeed. Some cool testing like LPR and potentiostatic stuff as well as just freeze thaw and solubility testing. LPR, you can see the instantaneous corrosion rate and graph it over time. Once you add the inhibitor You can see the rate plummet in real time. A number of products can be superimposed on the same graph. Some formulations will not adsorb very fast but form a more stable film once established for example. The graphs illustrate minute differences very well indeed.
Like the way you increased the severity of the test until all specimens had some corrosion. Good way of benchmarking.
The products we used to make were predominantly for internal protection of oil shipping lines and vessels. Sometimes you'll find that you don't need too much dispersant to dissolve actives if you use a mutual solvent in your carrier. An alcohol or something.
These mutual solvents can solubilise the actives well. Allowing them to remain in solution without agitation. The active compounds are typically part oil and part water soluble as depicted in this vid. So something that will dissolve both lil and water is good. It's a pain in industry though becasue of the flashpoint. Adding alcohols (especially the lighter ones) can increase the flashpoint above specification thresholds sometimes.
You have a batch treatment simulation here, worst case for engine oil which is a nice severe test. Even lower concentrations work (2-5ppm sometimes or 0.0001-0.0005%) if your corrosive liquid is dosed with the inhibitor. In the industry this is called continuous treatment if anyone is interested in terminology.
These actives constantly adsorb and desporb to and from the surface in a pseudo-stoichometric fashion. Having residual chemistry in the corrosive liquid ensures that desorption is approximately balanced with adsorbtion and the film integrity (mainly coverage and thickness) is maintained.
you know, I end up learning a *lot* more than then title promises, which is awesome.
You are a talented guy Ben - thanks for sharing your wisdom.
I really appreciate the quality and effort you always put into your videos. Thank you so much for sharing that with us!
I’m working at industrial gearboxes manufacturer. We use different form of inhibitor: VCI (v stands for volatile )
It’s added to test run oil and preserve gearbox internals for many months but gearbox have to air tight. If user want to extend corrosion protection they only need to add ca. 1-2 l per m^3 and close gearbox air tight again . Corrosion protection agent evaporate and cover all metal surfaces.
For other components we use VCI foil for packaging.
If you like more details google “Flender + operation manual 7300”
This channel is amazing. Your presentation is top notch.
It's like Nurdrage and Project Farm had a long, drunk night together, and you delivered the baby. Wonderful video.
NileOrange/ProjectScience
honestly Applied Science is just in a league above them
Now to work out how much you need to make your own supply line... but then you come into scales of volume and history deals.
project farm? this is an insult
@@contemporiser Freaking elitists.
Are you aware of a product called Ospho? Basically, it’s phosphoric acid and detergent. My friend uses it to stop rust on his steel boat. It’s very effective, works by converting iron oxide to iron phosphate. Iron oxide crystals look like daggers, and even if you sand them off, the remaining bits will continue to corrode into the steel. The conversion to iron phosphate stops that process. We used it on steel way covers in my CNC mill, and they haven’t re-rusted in 10 years.
Awesome!!! So perfect! Even in university chem course this is not explained! I love this channel!!! The best one ever seen!!! Good Job!!!
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. Your videos are always interesting and educational on so many levels. I'm not sure there is any subject that Applied Science isn't a specialist in.
The Chlorid Ions eat away the passive layer on your average corrosion resistant steel (AISI 304).
Instead of water moving the Ions, molten NaCl seems to work fine too.
Great video!
In order to reduce the smell during the reaction you can try to use a bleach solution to scrub thiols instead of plain water. Thank you for the video!
I know this sounds crazy, but I found your explanation of the different glassware and their uses pretty interesting.
Your videos are always fascinating. Thank you very much.
Eric
Great timing! I've been reading about just this subject lately.
X
Here in the midwest some of the best older cars to own and work on are the ones that had significant oil leaks for most of their lives.
Between preserving sheetmetal and keeping fasteners from reducing to something that looks like a mars rock dealing with a bit of sludge in a small price.
Great stuff,
how well has the ultrasonic fogger held up to the salt water environment?
It seems like a good cheap way to do corrosion tests if it lasts
Your steel's rusting? That's crazy, man. Have youu ever tried DMTD?
It's like you were born to do this, sir. Thank you for another enjoyable video!
The precission scale you own is really nice. I would recommend putting it further away from the place you are doing reactions, mixing and apply heat. You could damage the scale. In most labs, so precise scales are in a separate temperature controlled room, with low risk of contamination or even dust accumulation.
Excellent! Looking forward to seeing more!
Looks like the polar, fatty acid derivative you synthesized is well suited structurally to forming a monolayer.
Corrosion inhibitors in ICEs are more likely needed to neutralize acids formed from decomposition of antiwear and other additives, notably those containing sulfur or phosphorous, rather than to combat the effects of salt water.
If you are working with sulfur compounds, it can be worthwhile to use bleach to deodorize things. In your reaction set up, a bleach bubbler might help keep things from stinking up the place.
That would be _after_ the water bubbler, right? You would not want bleach vapors to back-flow into the test chamber.
Those fogging saltfoggers are fogging amazing!
Harmlessly replying...so I can find this video again in my UA-cam history. Have a like!
The difference in the rust colour is due to different forms of hydrated iron oxides. The general rule of thumb is the less water - the darker the colour is.
Also when you scratched the bare metal it increased the surface area, making corrosion faster, I hope you accounted for that.
thank you! i've been wondering about this for years but could never find much through light googling
There have been for ages, inhibitors that evaporate onto stuff, including packaged military silver switches. A piece of paper wrapped around piece to protect. The paper looking sheet has one side labled to face toward part being protected. Other vapor products , emitting pads to be placed within sensitive euipment. Another electronic spray by Bullfrog said to emit protecting vapors.
Yet another killer video. Excellent. Thank you.
Thank you for steadily offsetting Terrabytes of uploaded junk made by and for idiots. Know and be aware that you are part of a very small and select group of people making social media actually worthwhile, and even moreso; entertaining, educative and inspiring. Don't you ever worry about being too elaborative, boring or geeky, you rock at this.
Nice scale! Love seeing your lab come together over time
I do agree, the scale looks amazing, and it looks to be really high performance model. I cringed tho about having it so close to a reaction table and heat source. Too risky. It should be optimally in separate room. And you need to calibrate it with standard masses to measure a mass, not weight, as that changes with air pressure, shape of container, temperature, elevation, and local gravitational acceleration. Especially for the electronic ones. But it can all be automated and done quickly.
It looks to be this model: ussolid.com/210-x-0-0001g-0-1-mg-lab-analytical-balance-digital-precision-scale.html (U.S. Solid USS-DBS9 Digital Analytical Balance Scale). It is surprisingly cheap! I guess the electronic sensors got a serious progress recently.
@@movax20h Thanks for the info! Not a bad price indeed
Excellent teaching skills... Appreciated the good work and reasearch done... Thank you very much 👍
Thanks again for another great video my man! Keep up the good work! Its people like you that help to make the world a better place by teaching people practical uses for the things you find out :)
Normally I watch these videos because I like learning but I rather enjoyed this one as I do plan to make a career out of welding and to an extent metal working and thus it'll probably be a good idea to know about this kinda stuff if I make my own creations and repairs and want to keep things from corroding from outside sources of corrosion.
I have wanted to know exactly this information for years! Thank you so much!
Oh, ok. I always thought Deoxit was snake oil in a can with a cult. You've convinced me to give it a fair shake. As always, you are what every scientist should strive to be. Consistent, thorough, informative...
Definitely not snake oil. A bit pricey for what it is perhaps but it does work.
You make chemistry fun .Wish I had a chem teacher like you years ago
Can you do a similar episode on the anti corrosion paste that prevents dissimilar metals from redoxing. The green past inside the purple wire nuts that allow you to splice copper wires with aluminum wires in older construction.
Deoxit gold impressed me
I've been using Deoxit for many years. Magic stuff.
You gotta be crazy! First, you tell us that this corrosion inhibitor is a well-kept secret for most manufacturers, but then you make a video about how to make one that works even better! :D
Great video. We use capping agents to mix oils.
Just a couple of points from a chemist's perspective:
1. There may still be unreacted oleic acid in the final product. A comparison should be made of the crude product vs. one that has been purified of unreacted feedstock and side products.
2. Some of the oleic acid may have polymerized (it does that even in absence of air especially at high temperatures) and may be what the gunk at the bottom is. The gunk is what tells me that you have an impure product.
Also the side thiol groups may be active in conferring the corrosion inhibitor properties; if the are both blocked, the activity may go down. It may be interesting to compare a mono-substituted product with the di-substituted one.
Thanks for putting in the time and effort to make this video. I found it very informative, especially the thinking process.
Excellent material and strong scientific foundation as always.
Great illustration. 👍💯✌
Always been a big fan of your content, and If you ever need a corrosive environment to test your results again, just send them down to me! Everything corrodes on a boat in the tropics, even the things that are supposedly corrosion proof...
Extremely intriguing! Next chemical: "NeverWet" =D
He Ka just like Ben Shapiros wife