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@@Haurath Paradigm does not respond to our or viewer requests to get us gear for review. Actually they pretend they don't know who we are so we'll just have to take your word on it. LOL.
Nice review but is the credit card smoking? And do you have a new set of speakers? And thanks for the idea of a matte finish, I’m building a set of bookshelf speakers but was waffleling on finish. 👍
I really appreciate Kristi pushing the comparisons! It’s hard to get a feel for the “levels” of products. Andrew comment of “how do you compare a car to a rocketship” makes total sense, but that context comes out with these questions, and it’s super valuable!! Thank you both!!
Yeah I think it's very important to compare a Camry to a Lexus. One is nicer, one affords you other things and still a very good experience, specially old Lexus to new Camry.
I've owned my 805 D4 for two weeks, and they are just starting to impress and come on to a sound I'm enjoying immensely. At first, I found the bass too much and boomy, now they are sounding just right in the bass. The diamond tweeter is just so natural.
Surprisingly, I hear no difference in the sound of my 805 D4’s I bought new in April 2023 compared to right now. They were magnificent right out of the box and equally magnificent now. Conversely, the Martin-Logan CLS electrostatic speakers (Andrew has a video on these) took a freaking year to break in and were still improving when I sold them. BTW, the CLS were shrill and without bass for weeks & weeks when they were new.
I just got the McIntosh MAC7200 Stereo receiver & the B&W 805D4 gloss black speakers....I took me a life time to get them////over $20,000.00 & I am still spending...sales tax & the B&W stands. I think the sound great
I really wish Andrew spoke a little bit about the vs formation duo, given how glowing he was about them in his review. I feel comparison is valid for the fans of the channel who listen attentively to his recommendation and overall thoughts no matter how odd ball the comparisons.
This is a speaker on my shortlist and I appreciate your review. I thought the format was fun and the way that you went back-and-forth asking one other questions. I am curious about the different finishes available and I would love to see some crazy colors like bright orange.
I discovered your and Kristi's channel while trying to build out my living room and computer setups. Both setups have been completed for a few weeks now, so I really don't have a "need" to keep coming back and watching your content...at least, I shouldn't if I have any respect for my wallet. Jokes aside, your production value, charisma, honesty, knowledge, and, most importantly, realistic perspective on HiFi audio and home theater keep bringing me back. I will likely never buy the B & W 805 D4s, but I sat through your entire review for whatever reason. You and Kristi need to buckle up...I have a feeling this 295k subscriber number is going to be shooting up very quickly. I understand subscriber count is no indication of content quality, but it's obvious you both are on another level. I cannot wait to watch the continued growth of your channel.
This was one of my favorite episodes! Andrew you can tell these Bowers struck a chord with you. You had an undeniable grin almost the entire time! It was fun watching & all of the comparisons were informative. As an owner of 802D3s I admit I’m fond of the brand. Certainly iconic but at the end of the day they have to sound great. And they do. Fantastic episode! ❤
@Andrew, I decided against the 800‘er series and went for the Dutch & Dutch 8c- active stand speakers with cardiod design and built in DSP. Would be great if you tested these, they‘re excellent.
Watch the whole video before posting y’all! Literally answered ALL my comparisons! I would recommend anyone buying these to pair them with a Rel Sub over high level
As a B&W lover, I absolutely loved this review/video. And once again I'm re-invigorated to make it my goal to get my hands on a set of 805s. I may not end up with the D4s, but a D3 will do. Loved Kristi's comparisons this time. You Know she IS right with her somewhat outrageous comparisons. All those speakers are in the back of our minds, wondering which would come up on top. Good to know 805's did every time. Here is one setup to think about. This would be my no-cost-an-object setup. The 805s ($8500) + McIntosh MA1200 ($15000) + MCD 1200 ($12000) [$375000 + Tax] ... Yes, it's a downpayment for a house in most parts of the US, even in this root canal of an economy. But I think it would fit in the category of an "End-Game" system. Your Thoughts...if you care. Anyways...LOVE the channel! Cheers
I do have 805 D3’s with a Luxman L-590 AxII Class A integrated amplifier. Wonderful combination. Save a few bucks and divert it to a PAIR of sealed subs. That makes the biggest difference.
Thanks! andrew, I have been an "audiophile," or as I call it, a music lover, since I was in college back in 2003. In 2016, we built our dream home with a theater/media room and custom built in wall rack to show off my McIntosh equipment that I purchased for the room and brought my B&W Nautilus 802's up front, HTM1 Center, N804's sides, N805's rears, and 4 B&W Cinema 7's in the ceiling for Atmos channels. Running the theater: McIntosh MX122 McIntosh C2500 preamp McIntosh MC452 on fronts McIntosh MC207 on 7 other channels McIntosh MC152 on the remaining two One day coming home from work in 2018, I decided on a whim to stop by my dealer and purchase the new B&W 802 D3's and matching center because why not? But really, I had never owned anything but B&W and loved them.. WELP........... lived with the D3's for 4 years and over that time, I found myself NOT listening to music (2 channel) almost never. This hit me like a brick all because from 2002 to 2018, I listened to 2 channel for about 2-4 hours a day/night with a few glasses of bourbon. I made an real effort to find out why and it was obvious that I DESPISED the 802 D3''s' I didn't want to believe it was the speaker, so I first sold the MX122 and replaced with Anthem AVM 70 and traded Mac C2500 in and bought the C2700. It still sounded horrid, I dragged my Focal Aria 926's to the theater and replaced the 802s. It was a much more enjoyable experience. I made the decision right there to rid myself of the 802 D3's. While that was happening, I was pretty disappointed in the DAC in the new McIntosh C2700 tube preamp considering it was nearly 9000 dollars. The final straw was when I pulled my Meridian Prime Headphone Amp/Dac and Power Supply and streamed Tidal though it and it made the 2700 sound like a Walmart Kenwood car stereo. I may have made a crazy stupid decision.....I sold/traded every single piece of equipment expect my MC452. I live in Alabama, so it's hard to audition great speakers. I took a blind chance based on your review and my affinity for other Focal's and purchased a pair of Focal Diablo Utopia Colour Evo speakers. THey are being driven by the MC452 and my source. So, I am extremely disappointed in the Diablo's and have been getting bullied by every Focal dealer over in Georgia telling me that McIntosh is garbage and I need to get new electronics and sources. I am so damn lost hrew and need help/advice. Luxman 509 is an integrated that one dealer is trying to shove down my throat, but I really want to hear the Focal's on the Rotel Diamond you reviewed as well as the Michi X3 and X5. The Diablo's are so damn great with highs, but the mids are super disappointing. I am sorry for the book, but I am wondering around the audio industry forrest. 🤢
It sounds like you've had just about every high-end offering under the sun. Not sure why or what has caused you to be unhappy for of all the speakers and equipment you listed, if happiness didn't rest in one or more of the combos I think the issue may rest less with the gear and more with the setup and/or room. There is nothing "wrong" with B&W, Focal, McIntosh etc. Sure you can prefer one over another, but wrong, I don't personally think so. SO, is your room treated? Before going to B&W what speakers did you have? Because whatever it was, moving to B&W then Focal at a minimum tells me you moved to less rolled-off speakers on the top end, which may be the culprit to a degree. But at the same time you also are saying you like the top end of the Focals, so 🤷♂️. Regardless, you don't need to talk to dealers right now, you. need to sit with your system and honestly determine sonically what it is you like and don't like. Then ask yourself how many of those things can be addressed with proper setup/treatments before spending another dime on gear because it's not the gear I'm afraid.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Room is treated. We built the theater from scratch with a dealer. Soy 675es projector. I have always had B&W. In fact, I absolutely LOVE the old B&W sound. So much, that I came across a pair of CDM1SE's on FB for 300 (pair) and I snatched them up to use in my office. I pulled my pair of SVS SB12-Plus subs out of storage and used the hi pass on them in conjunction with the B&W........The sound gave me nostalgia goosebumps and listened for hours. Back to your question......I have owned B&W speakers from 1999-2022. In 2017, I purchased my first non B&W speakers....a 9 channel Aria setup for our living room. I came to where I am now in a very non tradtional way ha. In 2002, I had a good summer and a scholarship check arrived (which my parents were unaware of) and I did what any 22 year old living I a fraternity house would do, I traded them in for Nautilus 804’s and bought a McIntosh MC162. That last year in a 12x12 room was interesting. I started grad school in 2003 and when the scholarship arrived again, I sold the 804’s and bought some 803’s, the HTM1, and another MC162. The following year and my last as a student, I cashed the check, sold the 162’s , traded the 803’s , sold the Marantz and enjoyed N802’s, a MC352, a MC2255, and a Meridian 561M. I was in my own apartment and it sounded damn good. I kept those 802’s and HTM1 until 2019, when I moved to the 802 D3. I’ve tried different equipment, room treatments, room correction, etc, but I just love them like I used to. I think they are a little too forward and analytical for me now. I listened to as many speakers in the 15-20k range as I could, and fell head over heels for the Focal Sopra 2. Selling the 802’s is really hard and the few dealers who still take trades, we’re offering 8-10k for them. I ended up finding a Focal dealer who has a client that wanted the 802’s down to the color. So, he offered me a brand new pair of Utopia Diablo s for my 802’s and HTM1 D3. I pulled the trigger. I've moed them around, changed rooms, borrowed equipment, from dealers and I just cant fall in love with them. I can still return for credit and was going to consider Meridian, Sonus Faber,Legacy and Magico A5. Every delaer tells me to get rid of all the Mcintosh, it's not worth the money I know Meridian is a weird choice, but back at our old house I had a Meridian 861 processor and Mac amps running the Nautilus 802's and it still the best set up I have heard to this day
@@AuburnM5 maybe you should organize a blind auditioning at your home. Meaning, get some of your friends to hook-up different speakers under the same setup, without telling you which brand you're listening every time. Ignore the logo's/brand. Just check what you truly like. And also what mood you're in that particular day. Seems like you've already spent quite a crazy amount of $ and I think you should have reached the most in a home-setup. Also check John Darko's channel ;)
@@AuburnM5 why you just don’t go back to the pre B&W Continuum Speakers like the 800 D2? You are not alone in not liking the new B&W sound. Electronic wise I personally would suggest Linn. Goes well with B&W in my opinion. Get a Linn Selekt with Katalyst (or even organik if you can afford it) and buy 2 Klimax Solo power amps. Pair this with something like the 802 D2 and you will have an awesome set up that probably produces the sound you like.
Wonderful review, as always! Without sounding pessimistic, I'm not looking forward to anything as the year closes, but embracing the habit of cherishing whatever positives life throws my way, big or small. Thanks for the great content!
Someday my budget may allow. Until then my 2007 B&W 604 series 3 (last year made in England) will remain my main speakers in my two channel set up…. Great review!! 🎉🎉😊😊
That was GREAT! Love the fact that Andrew didn't know there was going to be a test, lol. And yeah the gloss black works better on curving speaker enclosures because the reflections wrap around, preventing the shiny box look. Another well done video you two.
Dynaudio Confidence is my choice over B&W ( and any other speaker I have had / listent to). Had the C1 mk 2 for years and are currently saving up to the confidence 20
Just bought a well priced pair of Ex Demo pair of C20, did listen to the B&W. The B&W sound is not for me; blown away by the C20, not cheap but still feel good value.
What I'm looking forward to for the end of the year - other than your Best Of the Year video, of course, is my Marantz Cinema 50 showing up today so I can get it hooked up and finish off my downstairs listening / viewing room. Thanks for the link for that purchase and for all the great reviews and work you two do. Talk about a dream job.... If only everyone could have a job that they are passionate about and enjoy, like this. ;-) You two make a pretty great team!!!
Great video Andrew! I recently heard the 805D4 & the Formation Duos & to be honest my listening experience was a little different on the low end. I found the 805 to be bass heavy & boomier, while the Formation Duos lacked the extra low end boom, but had really accurate & tight bass which I was really impressed by. I connected the formation sub as well & that surely helped. I wanted to know your thoughts on what you feel about both these & how would you compare these speakers in detail, given that they share some of the same components, but have a huge price difference. What are your thoughts on pairing the Mcintosh MA252 with the 805D4? Can I connect an external subwoofer (not the Formation Bass) wired to the Formation Audio device? (To pair with formation duos)
Hi both. I love your review and enthusiasm for this speaker. Kristi the unrealistic comparison is actually a fabulous idea, because that's what people will think about so please feel free to repeat with any other review, you have my support. I also agree with you both about integrating and living with the B&W speaker in a domestic environment is far easier and would keep all family members happy, especially in the UK and Europe where houses/rooms are smaller. Finally I have a pair of 702 S2 speakers which give some 80% of the equivalent 800 series at a fraction of the cost, however, having recently auditioned the 800 D4 as well as the KEF Blade Meta and new PS Audio speakers, I seriously want the 800 D4s. Best speaker that I've heard that will fit in my listening space, no question. Please keep up the great work.
Andrew, new subscriber here on your channel, love your reviews. I purchased the QA Concept 500's, not primarily from your review as Ive had the 3030i bookshelfs and the Concept 40's, but your review solidified my purchase of the Concept 500's. My question to you would be, could you do a review of your Top Ten all time favorite speakers (no cost associated). Obviously, the more expensive speakers are going to make the list, but it would be interesting to get your thoughts on the no-cost option (within reason of course) on what you think are the best speakers out there, 1 through 10.
Thanks to the both of you! I love the B&W 800 line and have seen two A/V setups with three behind the screen with surround, back and ceiling but it took serious horse power and engineering design to pull off. Not my pocket book! End of the year wish is to go to my favorite hot spring and enjoy a few days of soaking. lol
I have some B&W 703’s. You know…listening to reviews on subjective things like speakers is amusing to me. Don’t get me wrong…I love listening to this stuff, but it seems self-indulgent. Please keep it up. Love your reviews.
Got me to peruse the B&W website. Love the matchups Kristi asked about. Looking forward to just enjoying music with my present system. Haven't caught the change bug yet. Interested in open baffle speakers though.
I was laughing so hard when andrew had his internal struggle with the 805d4 vs b&O 28s, I am baised as B&O 28s owner, the greatest asspect of those speakers for me is that I have let go of my desire for new components, I have very little self control so it kinda nice to see that even though its my "settle down" hifi setup its still in the same category as the best of the best.
There's something inherently advantageous to a small book shelf speaker that has most of the full frequency range of the recorded music. It seems to project the sound better in a 3 dimensional holographic image that lends to a more realistic sound stage and musical presentation. It has less cabinet reflection of sound as well. That's why I walked away with the 805's over the larger full range B&W speakers. I had also purchased the B&W bass woofers but never hooked them up because I felt I didn't need the extra bottom end and was satisfied with what I heard. That all said, I totally agreed with your honest and analytical review. Kristi's input is invaluable as well.
I’ve been waiting for this one for a while. I really want to switch back to bookshelves because of space constraints, and since I am a B&W *itch this is the one for me. Totally different finish, rosewood would be the one. So this is perfect. Thank you! Once I sell enough extended warranties, I’ll definitely get a pair! lol But awesome video guys again! Especially the bush moment. I do want you guys to get the Beolab 90s. You have no idea. Wishing you all a great day!
I would love to test the 90s. Ever since we watched a video of Alicia Keys new house tour with them, I've wanted them. I think they would look crazy cool in our house.
They state 8200 watts per speaker. How many outlets do you need? Even 20A at 2,400, you need 4 dedicated outlets per speaker, right? How do you protect against a surge?
@@techsamurai11 I’m lost on this one. What are we talking about? If you’re referring to the BeoLab 90, then you get a dedicated 40/50amp circuit like your electric stove has. One is plenty enough.
I'll be looking forward for an end of the year video showing you both with the perfect set up (from this year reviews) for a whole day activity (including explenation for the sound treck): waking up, , showring, some mid-day preparations, making cocktails, having dinner with wine, dancing (!!), late night drink and if you're drunk enough some...
The comparison that REALLY needs to be made here is between the 805 D4 and the KEF Reference 1 Meta. They are the exact same price and both can be bought from the same retailer.
@Andrew Robinson any chance of this review ahead? I would love to hear your take on these two since they directly compete against each other (basically the KEF are made to order by hand) but they cost the same, and are both supposed to be spectacular.
B&W 805 D4 or Formation Duo or B&O Beolab 28 - all down to how much time to find the "right" amp for the passive speakers. B&W formation Duo rule themselves out as they can not form part of a surround sound system. With the B&O a mix and match of 28. 20 and 18 with their sub and centre speaker all via WiSA. No bargain choices and once set up without an A/B comparison you are just left to enjoy the sound they make.
Hey Andrew, I just bought the B&W 805 D4 signature speakers. I am currently running them w/ anthem AVM70 and Emotiva DR3 reference amp, but that pairing is going down in the basement w/ my ML XTF100’s for a home theater… I prefer tighter faster bass than big and boomy.. and my question is: should I do a separate preamp and amp or go with a integrated amp. I was considering the Yamaha RN-2000a, but the dealer who sold me the speakers said it might not have enough power for the 805d4 and recommended some of the higher priced Yamaha stuff but I couldn’t tell a difference other than less modern and less features I really want. I want this primarily for music but I do want to watch my TV in the living room too.. will I be going backwards from what I’m currently listening to these speakers on by getting the Yamaha 2000a? Almost entirely listening to digital streaming music, I don’t have a cd player or a record player.. what do you think I should look at? I definitely don’t want it to sound worse than what I’m running now haha. Sorry for the essay. Thanks!
The Yamaha 2000A is a great match IMHO for the 805 D4s and has more than enough power to drive them to their fullest potential. Plus, depending on your room conditions, YPAO (room correction) may tighten the 805's bass up even more for you giving you exactly what you're looking for. I have ZERO hesitation recommending the pairing as I've used and enjoyed it myself!
I agree. Similar size, similar price, similar companies - subtly different design philosophy. One or other of those two may well be my end game speakers. But which one? I have heard them both - but in very differing circumstances. I would love to see someone (Andrew!) audition them side by side.
I didn't google US prices, but in Europe Bowers & Wilkins 805 D4 costs almost 9k, Focal Kanta1 5k. and Focal Sopra1 7.5k. So maybe Focal Sopra 1 review someday? The Kanta is simply not a competitor to the 805 D5 in my opinion, but after your review I would really like to hear how these B&W sound. 😉
@@andrewrobinsonreviews B&W Formation Duo for connect to MacBook Pro 14-inch M2 Max B&W Formation Duo is most powerfull B&W ever. B&W Formation Duo is number 1 speaker in the World!
I’ve been a fan of B&W since I got serious about the time I spend listening to music. I’ve set up a few 2-channel systems. B&W 805 bookshelf (that I really like), another with some 801’s. I’ve done the Focal signatures (currently on one of my 2-ch setups) and several others in 2K TO 3K a pair range. I don’t have a fancy UA-cam Channel to test out 100K speakers ☺. I took your advice and got a Naim Unity Atom, and I LOVE IT. Thanks for the reviews, it’s nice to hear details on things I’ll likely never have in my own system (s) . Why do we never see Christy?
Great review. Huge B&W fan and have the 802 D4s. Just got Fyne F1-8 speakers for another room. You MUST review these - they are unreal in all the ways.
Great review. Thank you! Would love you guys to do a review on Gershman Acousitics Studio II speakers. Small outfit from Toronto, handmade, incredible quality and sound!
I was first in to buy B&W speakers. But now Im thinking of buying the Triangle Borea BR08. Seems like a very good speaker for the price. Bought the B&W PX8 this weekend tho
@@KristiWright The new B&W 805 D4 would been a dream well well i for live quite happy with my M Audio Silver 300 6 G some more years i have the center C 350 all in white And Marantz sr 7012 for the 2 fronts i have the Xtz edge A 2 300 really happy with theXtz☺☺😎😎
Still using B&W Concept 90 CM1/CM2 combination that I purchased in the mid 90s. (Three way towers with a small footprint. 6" drivers in the bottom compartment face the back. White towers with black grills) Often wonder if an amp upgrade is in order. Currently using with a Denon receiver.
Still have mine. One thing I did find was that they needed a minimum of 100w RMS and a high current delivery to sound at their best. With them being only 86db efficient (B+W crossovers are power-sapping) more is always better where these are concerned.
@@mako1100 Using a Denon DRA-395 receiver. Often wonder if I should upgrade. Rated for 80W per channel, 8 ohm When I bought the speakers the store let me hear on their Krell system. Also heard the flagship 801 speaker. Other than lower end, I thought the Concept 90 compared well.
Looks : If you compare with Focal Kanta for looks, yes then the B&W might be better looking, but if you compare with a Focal Sopra, the Sopra wins hands down. (I don't like that external tweeter of the B&W series and I've seen it breaks off very easiliy). Sound : The B&W diamond tweeter is too shouty for me, the Beryllium tweeters of Focal (Kanta, Sopra and Utopia) sound more smooth. Price : The Focal Kanta is cheaper here in Europe then the B&W 805D4, the Sopra 1 is slightly more expensive. So I think a comparison with the Sopra would have been more fair. I heard the 805D4, I heard the Sopra, and went home with Sopra and never regretted it.
I very much agree with your remarks about the shoutiness. Ultimately it came down between Dynaudio Heritage Special and Sopra no1 for me. Both are very impressive but in different areas. I pulled the trigger on the Dynaudios, as their top end was more to my taste and their tonality couldn't be matched. Sopra's airiness was really impressive, Sopra no2 especially more so.
I just picked up some BW683’s. I just started listening to them today but believe I will have them for a while. To answers Kristi’s question; I am looking forward to a better economy in the coming year as well as hopefully less crime and a victory in Ukraine. I wish you both well and keep doing what you do. Morgan
Was looking at the 28s and B&W.. settled on a like new modern self powered B&O “vintage” beolab9 and called it a day…2k$ later its all smiles not dealing with subs and amps
One thing I’m very sure of, and if money were no object, and based on all your speaker reviews, and with all the choices possible at the high-end level of audio, I still wouldn’t know where to start 😂
just got a pair of B&W 705 S-2 speakers -- (looking at them for awhile - and since new "S-3" is out I got for good price) Very detailed sound. "Tight" bass (if not tons of it) Pretty good for price I paid. I have Polk LSiM 703s - which for price I got them for Also Good. Are the B&Ws better than the Polks on digital tracks at higher volume? Yes - they are! But on my older (I grew up in 1960s) "analog" stuff the difference is not that much - the Polks are fine with that stuff. I like the modern (and touch strange) look of the B&Ws too. Something "different" with the "tweeter on top" thing. I am now to point where it would take a lot of $$ to make appreciable difference.
only reason to buy a pair of these is because they are a beauty piece of furniture for a fancy living room. With respect to sound there are many other better options
Good work (as always). What I'd be interested in is how you'd say these stack against the Concept 300's that were the reference for so long. Given the price differential, I bet its closer than you'd expect.
I don't know why people spend so much money on B&W when they could easily get a pair of Genelec 8361, which are calibrated to be neutral, and are $10k a pair, and you don't need an amplifier. (That is the 10 inch woofer). To compete against the 805 you would get the Genelec 8351, which is 8" woofer, and is about $8k a pair. You run the calibration software on those units, and flatten it against your room, and now you have what a recording engineer has; 99% accuracy. If you want punch, the B&W 801's are incredible, esp. with 1000 watts behind them. That chest thump is a special feeling. But most home stereo equipment is highly colored, and frankly silly. Flat speakers give you what was made in the studio.
@@raymaksimavicius4902 If a speaker is within +- 3 DB (or better) from low to high frequencies, it is flat, which is the objective with a studio monitor. It thus reproduces almost exactly what the mixing engineers intended. Home stereo equipment is notorious for coloration. No speaker can "blow away" a highly accurate studio monitor. The only difference between the members of the Genelec family is how low you want to be able to reproduce. You pay a great deal more, and require a much larger cabinet volume and piston diameter if you want to get fidelity below 50 hz. The latest Genelecs have a microphone and software that allows you to compensate for your room quirks, and this is commonly used to further flatten the curve to the mixing engineer. Unless you have a specially designed and equipped room, you will have odd resonances that will throw things off. Very few home units bother to fix this issue. The B&W 801's have 16" woofers, and with 1000 watts driving, has that chest thump that is so satisfying. The whole consumer hi-fi business is mostly nonsense, with crazy fetishes like fancy cabling, and other immeasurable, expensive niceties that allow the retailers to make a lot of money from gullible people. The fact remains that the music is mixed on studio monitors from Neumann, Genelec, Focal, and others with modest piston diameters, because close-range monitors are much tighter coupled to the ear, and many times the engineers only need occasional verification with large diameter stuff for certain kinds of music. If you go to B&H or Thomann, and look up studio monitors you will find that most of the products are close range. Every engineer i've seen interviewed has a similar configuration. Maybe Vandersteen should pursue the studio monitor market. They may indeed have a wonderful product. But the monitors that exist today are awfully good, and so much better than the lousy speakers that people listen on (which are often their phones, or crappy bluetooth speakers, or car stereos). Accuracy can be measured, and many consumer products are wildly inaccurate. If the bias happens to be to your taste, fine.
Please allow me my personal opinion as an aging engineer. The eternal problem when nearfield studio monitors are compared to hi-fi or high-end speakers. Nearfield studio monitors are monitoring speakers and have no real relevance in the living room. The Genelec are excellent speakers, but actually nothing for the living room. I know the Genelec 8351 from several trade fairs. This is my own personal opinion. Therefore, there are at least two categories of loudspeakers in a proper studio. Near-field studio monitors and a pair of good hi-fi speakers. Whether these must necessarily cost several thousand dollars or even more, each studio must decide for itself. Of course, quality usually has its price. I own a pair of B&W in my living room. I grew up with Bowers & Wilkins. My very first time and experiences as a young little boy in a professional studio. There were Bowers & Wilkins speakers, what else? I also own a pair of Neumann Studio monitors next to inexpensive hi-fi speakers in a small hobby studio.
@@btsr2553 You are correct regarding near-field monitors and "a pair of good hi-fi speakers" as studio mainstays, but there are also mid-field and far-field monitors whose use is dependent upon the distance to the mixing board. I've heard many many great speakers during my 64 years as a hobbyist and enthusiast, and to me, the sound of a good pair of active studio monitors beats the sound of 95% of home speakers, including B&W. I've also compared passive speakers to their active counterparts and you can tell the difference in about 5 seconds...even when level matched. Just my opinion, of course.
I own Klipsch Forte 2 and NHT Model Four from many years ago. I think I've been looking at wrong price categories of speakers for my next audiophile journey, $8k and $16k, eh? Searching for end-game speakers, for a live music type Klipsch-phile, I am not sure if La Scala will be my final destination? Maybe open baffle speakers?
I like that it looks like you pulled your shirt out of the laundry basket and didn't even care to iron or hang it. You're every man's audiophile. Keep it up.
Another great review. I bought the 805 D4's and didn't like their sound in my room. I replaced them with La Scala AL5's, in part based on your prior comments about them. The La Scala's were much better. By the way, they throw a larger soundstage than did the 805's. But they do, as you say, not tolerate poor recordings. Of course, the 801 D4's are a whole different thing! But there is also the $38,000 part!
I have demo'd some B&W's at a high end store and could not have been less impressed. Their build quality was exquisite, but the sound was completely sterile and lifeless, and they were extremely inefficient. In the end, I found them to be all show, no go.
@@andreasmoller9798 For sure. Anything that isn't an anechoic measurement of a speaker, or detailing data points about a speaker is subjective. I don't begrudge anyone who likes this speaker, and to be fair I have not heard THIS speaker, just other B&W's of this and higher price range and have always been extremely underwhelmed for the price you pay. Aesthetically they are near works of craftsmanship, if not art.
@@dlloyd6300 i use 702 s2 and love them and they have good amount of detail, but they are not neutral, but i will buy different brand next time, i will absolutly look into perlisten r7t they seem promising, if they sound good it will be win, becouse those speakers have serious spl output
@@andreasmoller9798 I hear nothing but praise for Perlisten, both measurements and subjective. Also a beautiful speaker. Certainly not cheap but I think fair for what you get. You're lucky to be able to dabble in such equipment 👍. Arendal and Paradigm also have some lovely offerings.
@@andreasmoller9798 My personal speakers are Klipsch RF7 III's. Certainly Klipsch is devisive in the community, and they may not be the best measuring speaker but oh the output levels without breaking a sweat, and the things that true compression driver tweeter can do. I find them to have the perfect level of detail without being too bright.
Now that 20222 is coming to an end and you two have experienced more products, can we expect to see some sort of update of what stack you and Kristi would purchase at the $1000, $2500 and maybe $4k price points? I'm curious what amps would be chosen in those price points....
Holy Smokes!! We did NOT know that. Last December when we reviewed them they were around 16K. At this new price, hell no. Gonna live that B&W life and fly somewhere nice with the leftover cash. First class both ways. :)
Love the comparison to other speakers. I compare cars the same way, Corolla vs my Lexus. I think I understand your style of review better. I can afford QC50, 705 and 805. Would please let me know how far apart they are in sound quality?
I always have to tell myself do I "need" these speakers. The constant need to upgrade even though I enjoy my fluance set up. Great video as always andrewand kristi! Hope yall enjoy the holidays
Thanks for the great review Andrew. If I have a room with a large bookcase and the setup is such that I am limited to have my bookshelf speakers on the bookshelf (and therefore very close to the wall) do you think either these or even the B&W 705s will still be able to shine? Is there another bookshelf speaker you would recommend that may work well when placed on the shelf near the wall or do I need to seriously think about using another room for my proper listening setup?
Can of worms alert ... Last speakers you'll ever own? Gird your loins for all of the outraged audiophiles who are about to tell you how vastly superior their "insert speaker brand here" speakers are ... It's just the nature of the audiophile beast.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Andrew..much like the video on the audiophile ladder of climbing the of ever more expensive gear ( I was at the Toronto Audiofest last weekend..listening to gear that cost more than the house I grew up in) there’s always next level or another improved model…BUT if these are your End Games speakers ..then congrats 🍾
I LOVE the B&W sound. It sounds the least fatiguing, 'pleasant' and laid back to my ears. And it plays modern Electronic music so damn well! One of the most versatile speakers out there and they don't get credit for that...Sadly, for myself, the one from them that I truly like (801) , which seems to be my holy grail speaker, is way too impractical and I will never buy it (too expensive, too heavy). I have to spend time researching alternatives now.
Great review. I have 802D floor standing models, the model after the original 802 Diamond, and before the D2 that you mentioned owning, so I'm not surprised that you really like these. I think they're more neutral than my second generation "D" series. What I'm really impressed by is that the Denon amp/DAC combination unit that emerged as your favorite was so good driving speakers of this caliber (and presumably the Focal as well). $4,000 for an amp that good, plus a comparably excellent DAC, while not cheap, is really giving us some astonishing performance for the money. (My B&W's are driven by a McIntosh MC450, so probably a subtly different flavor to the sound).
Hi Andrew, love your reviews. I’m looking to buy 805 D4 as my front speakers. However couldn’t decide if they’d be adequate for 2-channel listening. Do you recommend these speakers for a 17x25x10 ft dedicated room, listening distance of abt 10-12ft?
Nah, too small for your room. I'd suggest some 804 D4's or even 803 D4's if you can accommodate and are set on B&W. You can take a look at other options like KEF Reference as well ;-)
Idk I had the 805D3’s in a little bit larger living room 20x25x10. I thought the 805’s sounded fantastic, I had demo’s a pair of Arendal 1723 speakers which are much longer and the 805’s were so much better and clearer, even in the bass area. I have now upgraded to the 803D3 and I can tell you they are more full sounding which is obvious with the two additional 7” bass drivers and larger midrange but, I totally think the 805D4 can work in that space, I don’t listen at super high levels either, for me if the clarity isn’t there at lower volumes, it’s not for me.
Great review. My B&W Matrix 805s probably need replacement (not need, want LOL). I knew I'd probably go for the 805D4 and you just sealed it!! Incidentally, showing my age, but I looked for years for a great pair of speakers when I was in my late teens and early to mid 20s. I listened to Spendor, Wharfedale, Quadral, Pro-Ac and a LOT of KEF. I was almost sold on the KEF Reference 104/2s around early 1992 but there was something missing. Then I went to a B&W dealer and listened to the Concept 90, an innovative loudspeaker that was made of a bass column and a top that was a pair of bookshelf speakers which you could buy first, then add the column with the bass drivers later. I listened to the full version (the bookshelf speakers were called the CM1 and when mated to the matching rear-firing 4 bass driver (6.5 inch I think) column, the whole thing became the CM2. It blew me away........... I had never heard anything so clear, with so much depth, so much neutrality and so much precision. A pretty average CD of the Brandenburg Concerti went from basically noise to a 3D musical picture. It lead me to buy my M805s - I also bought the matching (then) Matrix HTM (Vertical M805) centre speaker and I sorely regret not buying the Matrix 800 ASW Sub as well. Anyway, I've been nuts for anything B&W since - I have a Panorama 1 Sound-bar in my lounge-room which along with my TV is recessed into the wall, Matrix 805s paired to rears (Boston Accoustics VRS-Pro) and a Boston Acoustics PV1 Sub (the Boston Acoustic Sub is very well made but a bit of disappointment. So Andrew and Kristi, WHEN I buy my 805D4s and the matching Centre Speaker, what Sub should I pair them with for a Home Theatre (the 805s will also be used to listen to Vinyl, CD, 24bit streaming, etc. via Apple Music. AND, if I replace the rears, what should I go for, 705s?? I would then plan to put the Matrix 805s, Matrix HTM Centre and VRS-Pros into my bedroom for an awesome second system. Look forward to your response if you have time!!
✅ *👉B&W 805 D4: **bit.ly/3aZ3Ebz*
✅ *👉FOCAL BATHYS: **bit.ly/3CmKLL*
✅ *CLICK ❤ THANKS to highlight your question!*
✅ *IF IT’S IN THE VIDEO, IT’S IN THE DESX ☝CLICK “MORE”*
✅ *RULES: NO OUTSIDE LINKS OR PERSONAL INFO. PLEASE STAY ON TOPIC AND BE RESPECTFUL*
Should check out the Paradigm Founder 40B. They are crazy good.
@@Haurath Paradigm does not respond to our or viewer requests to get us gear for review. Actually they pretend they don't know who we are so we'll just have to take your word on it. LOL.
@@KristiWright Ouch. Seems some of us Canadians can be rude afterall. Who would have guessed.
@@Haurath No idea why they wouldn't send stuff as Andrew has owned P/ML/A over the years and has typically been a fan.
Nice review but is the credit card smoking? And do you have a new set of speakers? And thanks for the idea of a matte finish, I’m building a set of bookshelf speakers but was waffleling on finish. 👍
I really appreciate Kristi pushing the comparisons! It’s hard to get a feel for the “levels” of products. Andrew comment of “how do you compare a car to a rocketship” makes total sense, but that context comes out with these questions, and it’s super valuable!! Thank you both!!
Yeah I think it's very important to compare a Camry to a Lexus. One is nicer, one affords you other things and still a very good experience, specially old Lexus to new Camry.
Agreed - this was awesome!
I've owned my 805 D4 for two weeks, and they are just starting to impress and come on to a sound I'm enjoying immensely. At first, I found the bass too much and boomy, now they are sounding just right in the bass. The diamond tweeter is just so natural.
Surprisingly, I hear no difference in the sound of my 805 D4’s I bought new in April 2023 compared to right now. They were magnificent right out of the box and equally magnificent now. Conversely, the Martin-Logan CLS electrostatic speakers (Andrew has a video on these) took a freaking year to break in and were still improving when I sold them. BTW, the CLS were shrill and without bass for weeks & weeks when they were new.
I just got the McIntosh MAC7200
Stereo receiver & the B&W 805D4 gloss black speakers....I took me a life time to get them////over $20,000.00 & I am still spending...sales tax & the B&W stands.
I think the sound great
I really wish Andrew spoke a little bit about the vs formation duo, given how glowing he was about them in his review. I feel comparison is valid for the fans of the channel who listen attentively to his recommendation and overall thoughts no matter how odd ball the comparisons.
This is a speaker on my shortlist and I appreciate your review. I thought the format was fun and the way that you went back-and-forth asking one other questions. I am curious about the different finishes available and I would love to see some crazy colors like bright orange.
Glad you enjoyed it!
I discovered your and Kristi's channel while trying to build out my living room and computer setups. Both setups have been completed for a few weeks now, so I really don't have a "need" to keep coming back and watching your content...at least, I shouldn't if I have any respect for my wallet. Jokes aside, your production value, charisma, honesty, knowledge, and, most importantly, realistic perspective on HiFi audio and home theater keep bringing me back. I will likely never buy the B & W 805 D4s, but I sat through your entire review for whatever reason. You and Kristi need to buckle up...I have a feeling this 295k subscriber number is going to be shooting up very quickly. I understand subscriber count is no indication of content quality, but it's obvious you both are on another level. I cannot wait to watch the continued growth of your channel.
This was one of my favorite episodes! Andrew you can tell these Bowers struck a chord with you. You had an undeniable grin almost the entire time! It was fun watching & all of the comparisons were informative. As an owner of 802D3s I admit I’m fond of the brand. Certainly iconic but at the end of the day they have to sound great. And they do. Fantastic episode! ❤
Thank you so much, Timobi_1! We appreciate you watching.
One of your best review and interaction. I appreciated this. Thank you.
@Andrew, I decided against the 800‘er series and went for the Dutch & Dutch 8c- active stand speakers with cardiod design and built in DSP. Would be great if you tested these, they‘re excellent.
Kristi - thank you for asking those comparison questions. Super helpful
Watch the whole video before posting y’all! Literally answered ALL my comparisons! I would recommend anyone buying these to pair them with a Rel Sub over high level
Novilicious out here doing the lord's work. LOL.
As a B&W lover, I absolutely loved this review/video. And once again I'm re-invigorated to make it my goal to get my hands on a set of 805s. I may not end up with the D4s, but a D3 will do.
Loved Kristi's comparisons this time. You Know she IS right with her somewhat outrageous comparisons. All those speakers are in the back of our minds, wondering which would come up on top. Good to know 805's did every time.
Here is one setup to think about. This would be my no-cost-an-object setup.
The 805s ($8500) + McIntosh MA1200 ($15000) + MCD 1200 ($12000) [$375000 + Tax] ...
Yes, it's a downpayment for a house in most parts of the US, even in this root canal of an economy. But I think it would fit in the category of an "End-Game" system.
Your Thoughts...if you care.
Anyways...LOVE the channel!
Cheers
I do have 805 D3’s with a Luxman L-590 AxII Class A integrated amplifier. Wonderful combination. Save a few bucks and divert it to a PAIR of sealed subs. That makes the biggest difference.
Thanks!
andrew, I have been an "audiophile," or as I call it, a music lover, since I was in college back in 2003. In 2016, we built our dream home with a theater/media room and custom built in wall rack to show off my McIntosh equipment that I purchased for the room and brought my B&W Nautilus 802's up front, HTM1 Center, N804's sides, N805's rears, and 4 B&W Cinema 7's in the ceiling for Atmos channels. Running the theater:
McIntosh MX122
McIntosh C2500 preamp
McIntosh MC452 on fronts
McIntosh MC207 on 7 other channels
McIntosh MC152 on the remaining two
One day coming home from work in 2018, I decided on a whim to stop by my dealer and purchase the new B&W 802 D3's and matching center because why not? But really, I had never owned anything but B&W and loved them.. WELP........... lived with the D3's for 4 years and over that time, I found myself NOT listening to music (2 channel) almost never. This hit me like a brick all because from 2002 to 2018, I listened to 2 channel for about 2-4 hours a day/night with a few glasses of bourbon. I made an real effort to find out why and it was obvious that I DESPISED the 802 D3''s'
I didn't want to believe it was the speaker, so I first sold the MX122 and replaced with Anthem AVM 70 and traded Mac C2500 in and bought the C2700. It still sounded horrid, I dragged my Focal Aria 926's to the theater and replaced the 802s. It was a much more enjoyable experience. I made the decision right there to rid myself of the 802 D3's. While that was happening, I was pretty disappointed in the DAC in the new McIntosh C2700 tube preamp considering it was nearly 9000 dollars. The final straw was when I pulled my Meridian Prime Headphone Amp/Dac and Power Supply and streamed Tidal though it and it made the 2700 sound like a Walmart Kenwood car stereo.
I may have made a crazy stupid decision.....I sold/traded every single piece of equipment expect my MC452. I live in Alabama, so it's hard to audition great speakers. I took a blind chance based on your review and my affinity for other Focal's and purchased a pair of Focal Diablo Utopia Colour Evo speakers. THey are being driven by the MC452 and my source. So, I am extremely disappointed in the Diablo's and have been getting bullied by every Focal dealer over in Georgia telling me that McIntosh is garbage and I need to get new electronics and sources. I am so damn lost hrew and need help/advice. Luxman 509 is an integrated that one dealer is trying to shove down my throat, but I really want to hear the Focal's on the Rotel Diamond you reviewed as well as the Michi X3 and X5.
The Diablo's are so damn great with highs, but the mids are super disappointing. I am sorry for the book, but I am wondering around the audio industry forrest. 🤢
It sounds like you've had just about every high-end offering under the sun. Not sure why or what has caused you to be unhappy for of all the speakers and equipment you listed, if happiness didn't rest in one or more of the combos I think the issue may rest less with the gear and more with the setup and/or room. There is nothing "wrong" with B&W, Focal, McIntosh etc. Sure you can prefer one over another, but wrong, I don't personally think so. SO, is your room treated? Before going to B&W what speakers did you have? Because whatever it was, moving to B&W then Focal at a minimum tells me you moved to less rolled-off speakers on the top end, which may be the culprit to a degree. But at the same time you also are saying you like the top end of the Focals, so 🤷♂️. Regardless, you don't need to talk to dealers right now, you. need to sit with your system and honestly determine sonically what it is you like and don't like. Then ask yourself how many of those things can be addressed with proper setup/treatments before spending another dime on gear because it's not the gear I'm afraid.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Room is treated. We built the theater from scratch with a dealer. Soy 675es projector. I have always had B&W. In fact, I absolutely LOVE the old B&W sound. So much, that I came across a pair of CDM1SE's on FB for 300 (pair) and I snatched them up to use in my office. I pulled my pair of SVS SB12-Plus subs out of storage and used the hi pass on them in conjunction with the B&W........The sound gave me nostalgia goosebumps and listened for hours.
Back to your question......I have owned B&W speakers from 1999-2022. In 2017, I purchased my first non B&W speakers....a 9 channel Aria setup for our living room. I came to where I am now in a very non tradtional way ha.
In 2002, I had a good summer and a scholarship check arrived (which my parents were unaware of) and I did what any 22 year old living I a fraternity house would do, I traded them in for Nautilus 804’s and bought a McIntosh MC162. That last year in a 12x12 room was interesting.
I started grad school in 2003 and when the scholarship arrived again, I sold the 804’s and bought some 803’s, the HTM1, and another MC162. The following year and my last as a student, I cashed the check, sold the 162’s , traded the 803’s , sold the Marantz and enjoyed N802’s, a MC352, a MC2255, and a Meridian 561M. I was in my own apartment and it sounded damn good. I kept those 802’s and HTM1 until 2019, when I moved to the 802 D3.
I’ve tried different equipment, room treatments, room correction, etc, but I just love them like I used to. I think they are a little too forward and analytical for me now. I listened to as many speakers in the 15-20k range as I could, and fell head over heels for the Focal Sopra 2. Selling the 802’s is really hard and the few dealers who still take trades, we’re offering 8-10k for them. I ended up finding a Focal dealer who has a client that wanted the 802’s down to the color. So, he offered me a brand new pair of Utopia Diablo s for my 802’s and HTM1 D3. I pulled the trigger. I've moed them around, changed rooms, borrowed equipment, from dealers and I just cant fall in love with them. I can still return for credit and was going to consider Meridian, Sonus Faber,Legacy and Magico A5. Every delaer tells me to get rid of all the Mcintosh, it's not worth the money
I know Meridian is a weird choice, but back at our old house I had a Meridian 861 processor and Mac amps running the Nautilus
802's and it still the best set up I have heard to this day
@@AuburnM5 maybe you should organize a blind auditioning at your home. Meaning, get some of your friends to hook-up different speakers under the same setup, without telling you which brand you're listening every time. Ignore the logo's/brand. Just check what you truly like. And also what mood you're in that particular day. Seems like you've already spent quite a crazy amount of $ and I think you should have reached the most in a home-setup. Also check John Darko's channel ;)
@@AuburnM5 why you just don’t go back to the pre B&W Continuum Speakers like the 800 D2? You are not alone in not liking the new B&W sound. Electronic wise I personally would suggest Linn. Goes well with B&W in my opinion. Get a Linn Selekt with Katalyst (or even organik if you can afford it) and buy 2 Klimax Solo power amps. Pair this with something like the 802 D2 and you will have an awesome set up that probably produces the sound you like.
How would you compare this to the B&W formation Duos?
Wonderful review, as always!
Without sounding pessimistic, I'm not looking forward to anything as the year closes, but embracing the habit of cherishing whatever positives life throws my way, big or small. Thanks for the great content!
I've found that low (no) expectations often leads to less disappointment 😂
Someday my budget may allow. Until then my 2007 B&W 604 series 3 (last year made in England) will remain my main speakers in my two channel set up…. Great review!! 🎉🎉😊😊
I have had my Cerwin Vegas since 1976. Had them re-coned a few years ago. They still sound great. "Loud is beautiful, if its clean".
The Holly Grail of Bookshelf speakers reviews. Haven’t clicked faster in my life.
You're going to want to watch every second of this one. It's start to finish packed with goodies!
That was GREAT! Love the fact that Andrew didn't know there was going to be a test, lol. And yeah the gloss black works better on curving speaker enclosures because the reflections wrap around, preventing the shiny box look. Another well done video you two.
Dynaudio Confidence is my choice over B&W ( and any other speaker I have had / listent to). Had the C1 mk 2 for years and are currently saving up to the confidence 20
Just bought a well priced pair of Ex Demo pair of C20, did listen to the B&W. The B&W sound is not for me; blown away by the C20, not cheap but still feel good value.
What I'm looking forward to for the end of the year - other than your Best Of the Year video, of course, is my Marantz Cinema 50 showing up today so I can get it hooked up and finish off my downstairs listening / viewing room. Thanks for the link for that purchase and for all the great reviews and work you two do. Talk about a dream job.... If only everyone could have a job that they are passionate about and enjoy, like this. ;-) You two make a pretty great team!!!
Great video Andrew! I recently heard the 805D4 & the Formation Duos & to be honest my listening experience was a little different on the low end. I found the 805 to be bass heavy & boomier, while the Formation Duos lacked the extra low end boom, but had really accurate & tight bass which I was really impressed by. I connected the formation sub as well & that surely helped. I wanted to know your thoughts on what you feel about both these & how would you compare these speakers in detail, given that they share some of the same components, but have a huge price difference.
What are your thoughts on pairing the Mcintosh MA252 with the 805D4?
Can I connect an external subwoofer (not the Formation Bass) wired to the Formation Audio device? (To pair with formation duos)
Hi both. I love your review and enthusiasm for this speaker. Kristi the unrealistic comparison is actually a fabulous idea, because that's what people will think about so please feel free to repeat with any other review, you have my support. I also agree with you both about integrating and living with the B&W speaker in a domestic environment is far easier and would keep all family members happy, especially in the UK and Europe where houses/rooms are smaller. Finally I have a pair of 702 S2 speakers which give some 80% of the equivalent 800 series at a fraction of the cost, however, having recently auditioned the 800 D4 as well as the KEF Blade Meta and new PS Audio speakers, I seriously want the 800 D4s. Best speaker that I've heard that will fit in my listening space, no question. Please keep up the great work.
Andrew, new subscriber here on your channel, love your reviews. I purchased the QA Concept 500's, not primarily from your review as Ive had the 3030i bookshelfs and the Concept 40's, but your review solidified my purchase of the Concept 500's. My question to you would be, could you do a review of your Top Ten all time favorite speakers (no cost associated). Obviously, the more expensive speakers are going to make the list, but it would be interesting to get your thoughts on the no-cost option (within reason of course) on what you think are the best speakers out there, 1 through 10.
Thanks to the both of you! I love the B&W 800 line and have seen two A/V setups with three behind the screen with surround, back and ceiling but it took serious horse power and engineering design to pull off. Not my pocket book! End of the year wish is to go to my favorite hot spring and enjoy a few days of soaking. lol
I have some B&W 703’s. You know…listening to reviews on subjective things like speakers is amusing to me. Don’t get me wrong…I love listening to this stuff, but it seems self-indulgent. Please keep it up. Love your reviews.
Yea I totally agree. It’s entertainment, no more nor less. Especially if you think about the influence of the room. Crazy. Take care
Got me to peruse the B&W website. Love the matchups Kristi asked about. Looking forward to just enjoying music with my present system. Haven't caught the change bug yet. Interested in open baffle speakers though.
I was laughing so hard when andrew had his internal struggle with the 805d4 vs b&O 28s, I am baised as B&O 28s owner, the greatest asspect of those speakers for me is that I have let go of my desire for new components, I have very little self control so it kinda nice to see that even though its my "settle down" hifi setup its still in the same category as the best of the best.
I’d hope so for the price.
There's something inherently advantageous to a small book shelf speaker that has most of the full frequency range of the recorded music. It seems to project the sound better in a 3 dimensional holographic image that lends to a more realistic sound stage and musical presentation. It has less cabinet reflection of sound as well. That's why I walked away with the 805's over the larger full range B&W speakers. I had also purchased the B&W bass woofers but never hooked them up because I felt I didn't need the extra bottom end and was satisfied with what I heard. That all said, I totally agreed with your honest and analytical review. Kristi's input is invaluable as well.
I’ve been waiting for this one for a while. I really want to switch back to bookshelves because of space constraints, and since I am a B&W *itch this is the one for me. Totally different finish, rosewood would be the one. So this is perfect. Thank you! Once I sell enough extended warranties, I’ll definitely get a pair! lol
But awesome video guys again! Especially the bush moment. I do want you guys to get the Beolab 90s. You have no idea.
Wishing you all a great day!
I would love to test the 90s. Ever since we watched a video of Alicia Keys new house tour with them, I've wanted them. I think they would look crazy cool in our house.
They state 8200 watts per speaker. How many outlets do you need? Even 20A at 2,400, you need 4 dedicated outlets per speaker, right? How do you protect against a surge?
@@techsamurai11 I’m lost on this one. What are we talking about? If you’re referring to the BeoLab 90, then you get a dedicated 40/50amp circuit like your electric stove has. One is plenty enough.
Good morning! So many Easter eggs. These last 2 months of the year should have some great stuff. Can’t wait. Have a great week.
Do you have any opinions on Spendors? A1 / A4s?
I'll be looking forward for an end of the year video showing you both with the perfect set up (from this year reviews) for a whole day activity (including explenation for the sound treck): waking up, , showring, some mid-day preparations, making cocktails, having dinner with wine, dancing (!!), late night drink and if you're drunk enough some...
The comparison that REALLY needs to be made here is between the 805 D4 and the KEF Reference 1 Meta. They are the exact same price and both can be bought from the same retailer.
@Andrew Robinson any chance of this review ahead? I would love to hear your take on these two since they directly compete against each other (basically the KEF are made to order by hand) but they cost the same, and are both supposed to be spectacular.
B&W 805 D4 or Formation Duo or B&O Beolab 28 - all down to how much time to find the "right" amp for the passive speakers. B&W formation Duo rule themselves out as they can not form part of a surround sound system. With the B&O a mix and match of 28. 20 and 18 with their sub and centre speaker all via WiSA.
No bargain choices and once set up without an A/B comparison you are just left to enjoy the sound they make.
Love this review!! Christy had the best gut punching comparisons. The Bush was hilarious 😆😂
Thank you!! 😁
Hey Andrew, I just bought the B&W 805 D4 signature speakers. I am currently running them w/ anthem AVM70 and Emotiva DR3 reference amp, but that pairing is going down in the basement w/ my ML XTF100’s for a home theater… I prefer tighter faster bass than big and boomy.. and my question is: should I do a separate preamp and amp or go with a integrated amp. I was considering the Yamaha RN-2000a, but the dealer who sold me the speakers said it might not have enough power for the 805d4 and recommended some of the higher priced Yamaha stuff but I couldn’t tell a difference other than less modern and less features I really want. I want this primarily for music but I do want to watch my TV in the living room too.. will I be going backwards from what I’m currently listening to these speakers on by getting the Yamaha 2000a? Almost entirely listening to digital streaming music, I don’t have a cd player or a record player.. what do you think I should look at? I definitely don’t want it to sound worse than what I’m running now haha. Sorry for the essay. Thanks!
The Yamaha 2000A is a great match IMHO for the 805 D4s and has more than enough power to drive them to their fullest potential. Plus, depending on your room conditions, YPAO (room correction) may tighten the 805's bass up even more for you giving you exactly what you're looking for. I have ZERO hesitation recommending the pairing as I've used and enjoyed it myself!
How are you enjoying the new 804's? Do you know for sure if there is a new motor system in the 804?
I am down to the KEF Reference 1 and the B&W 805 D4. That comparison would be amazing. Make it happen!!
I agree. Similar size, similar price, similar companies - subtly different design philosophy. One or other of those two may well be my end game speakers. But which one? I have heard them both - but in very differing circumstances. I would love to see someone (Andrew!) audition them side by side.
I’d love for you guys to get a hold of the MA Platinum 100s for comparison. Great review!
Hope you get your chance to review the NEW 805 D4 signature series that just got announced.
I second that!
I didn't google US prices, but in Europe Bowers & Wilkins 805 D4 costs almost 9k, Focal Kanta1 5k. and Focal Sopra1 7.5k. So maybe Focal Sopra 1 review someday? The Kanta is simply not a competitor to the 805 D5 in my opinion, but after your review I would really like to hear how these B&W sound. 😉
Great review! But question about Formation Duo was cut… So can tou answer about comparison B&W 805 d4 vs B&W Duo?
The 805s are the better speaker.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews B&W Formation Duo for connect to MacBook Pro 14-inch M2 Max
B&W Formation Duo is most powerfull B&W ever.
B&W Formation Duo is number 1 speaker in the World!
I’ve been a fan of B&W since I got serious about the time I spend listening to music. I’ve set up a few 2-channel systems. B&W 805 bookshelf (that I really like), another with some 801’s. I’ve done the Focal signatures (currently on one of my 2-ch setups) and several others in 2K TO 3K a pair range. I don’t have a fancy UA-cam Channel to test out 100K speakers ☺. I took your advice and got a Naim Unity Atom, and I LOVE IT. Thanks for the reviews, it’s nice to hear details on things I’ll likely never have in my own system (s) . Why do we never see Christy?
Best hifi reviews on UA-cam. 👍
Aww thanks!
Great review. Huge B&W fan and have the 802 D4s. Just got Fyne F1-8 speakers for another room. You MUST review these - they are unreal in all the ways.
I would just buy the Polk audio R 700's , and have amazing sound and have a ton of extra cash ! Have a great day !
This is a VERY good strategy!
I want to do the same but I'm concerned with the center being a two way
I bought a pair of R 700's and am happy I did!
Great review. Thank you! Would love you guys to do a review on Gershman Acousitics Studio II speakers. Small outfit from Toronto, handmade, incredible quality and sound!
Andrew is my "go to" reviewer now! I trust him and that's not something you can say about many reviewers!!
I appreciate that.
I was first in to buy B&W speakers. But now Im thinking of buying the Triangle Borea BR08. Seems like a very good speaker for the price. Bought the B&W PX8 this weekend tho
Kristi: Bang & Olufsen 28
Andrew: cut cut cut. CUT!!!
HAHAH.
Slam dunk review guys! Even the sponsor part was great 🤘❤️
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@@michal03966 TBH, UA-cam can be a toxic cesspool and so I just feel more comfortable being off camera. Thank you so much for watching!
Hi Kristi i´m Ulf from Sweden watching great and fun watching your reviews😊😊
@@ulfthereaper71 Hello Ulf from Sweden! We appreciate that so much.
@@KristiWright The new B&W 805 D4 would been a dream well well i for live quite happy with my M Audio Silver 300 6 G some more years i have the center C 350 all in white And Marantz sr 7012 for the 2 fronts i have the Xtz edge A 2 300 really happy with theXtz☺☺😎😎
Still using B&W Concept 90 CM1/CM2 combination that I purchased in the mid 90s. (Three way towers with a small footprint. 6" drivers in the bottom compartment face the back. White towers with black grills) Often wonder if an amp upgrade is in order. Currently using with a Denon receiver.
Still have mine. One thing I did find was that they needed a minimum of 100w RMS and a high current delivery to sound at their best. With them being only 86db efficient (B+W crossovers are power-sapping) more is always better where these are concerned.
@@mako1100 Using a Denon DRA-395 receiver. Often wonder if I should upgrade. Rated for 80W per channel, 8 ohm When I bought the speakers the store let me hear on their Krell system. Also heard the flagship 801 speaker. Other than lower end, I thought the Concept 90 compared well.
Looks : If you compare with Focal Kanta for looks, yes then the B&W might be better looking, but if you compare with a Focal Sopra, the Sopra wins hands down.
(I don't like that external tweeter of the B&W series and I've seen it breaks off very easiliy).
Sound : The B&W diamond tweeter is too shouty for me, the Beryllium tweeters of Focal (Kanta, Sopra and Utopia) sound more smooth.
Price : The Focal Kanta is cheaper here in Europe then the B&W 805D4, the Sopra 1 is slightly more expensive.
So I think a comparison with the Sopra would have been more fair.
I heard the 805D4, I heard the Sopra, and went home with Sopra and never regretted it.
I very much agree with your remarks about the shoutiness. Ultimately it came down between Dynaudio Heritage Special and Sopra no1 for me. Both are very impressive but in different areas. I pulled the trigger on the Dynaudios, as their top end was more to my taste and their tonality couldn't be matched.
Sopra's airiness was really impressive, Sopra no2 especially more so.
I just picked up some BW683’s. I just started listening to them today but believe I will have them for a while.
To answers Kristi’s question; I am looking forward to a better economy in the coming year as well as hopefully less crime and a victory in Ukraine.
I wish you both well and keep doing what you do.
Morgan
Happy to see the B&W Trilogy has come to a satisfying conclusion. WAY better than Rise of Skywalker 🤪
Was looking at the 28s and B&W.. settled on a like new modern self powered B&O “vintage” beolab9 and called it a day…2k$ later its all smiles not dealing with subs and amps
One thing I’m very sure of, and if money were no object, and based on all your speaker reviews, and with all the choices possible at the high-end level of audio, I still wouldn’t know where to start 😂
I would love to know how the Monitor Audio Gold 100 compares? Thanks for a great channel!!!
Great review. Thanks.
just got a pair of B&W 705 S-2 speakers -- (looking at them for awhile - and since new "S-3" is out I got for good price) Very detailed sound. "Tight" bass (if not tons of it) Pretty good for price I paid. I have Polk LSiM 703s - which for price I got them for Also Good. Are the B&Ws better than the Polks on digital tracks at higher volume? Yes - they are! But on my older (I grew up in 1960s) "analog" stuff the difference is not that much - the Polks are fine with that stuff.
I like the modern (and touch strange) look of the B&Ws too. Something "different" with the "tweeter on top" thing. I am now to point where it would take a lot of $$ to make appreciable difference.
only reason to buy a pair of these is because they are a beauty piece of furniture for a fancy living room. With respect to sound there are many other better options
Such as? (name at least 3 alternatives pls)
Good work (as always). What I'd be interested in is how you'd say these stack against the Concept 300's that were the reference for so long. Given the price differential, I bet its closer than you'd expect.
I don't know why people spend so much money on B&W when they could easily get a pair of Genelec 8361, which are calibrated to be neutral, and are $10k a pair, and you don't need an amplifier. (That is the 10 inch woofer). To compete against the 805 you would get the Genelec 8351, which is 8" woofer, and is about $8k a pair. You run the calibration software on those units, and flatten it against your room, and now you have what a recording engineer has; 99% accuracy. If you want punch, the B&W 801's are incredible, esp. with 1000 watts behind them. That chest thump is a special feeling. But most home stereo equipment is highly colored, and frankly silly. Flat speakers give you what was made in the studio.
Stop making sense!
Vandersteens blow away genelec.
@@raymaksimavicius4902 If a speaker is within +- 3 DB (or better) from low to high frequencies, it is flat, which is the objective with a studio monitor. It thus reproduces almost exactly what the mixing engineers intended. Home stereo equipment is notorious for coloration.
No speaker can "blow away" a highly accurate studio monitor. The only difference between the members of the Genelec family is how low you want to be able to reproduce. You pay a great deal more, and require a much larger cabinet volume and piston diameter if you want to get fidelity below 50 hz. The latest Genelecs have a microphone and software that allows you to compensate for your room quirks, and this is commonly used to further flatten the curve to the mixing engineer.
Unless you have a specially designed and equipped room, you will have odd resonances that will throw things off. Very few home units bother to fix this issue.
The B&W 801's have 16" woofers, and with 1000 watts driving, has that chest thump that is so satisfying.
The whole consumer hi-fi business is mostly nonsense, with crazy fetishes like fancy cabling, and other immeasurable, expensive niceties that allow the retailers to make a lot of money from gullible people.
The fact remains that the music is mixed on studio monitors from Neumann, Genelec, Focal, and others with modest piston diameters, because close-range monitors are much tighter coupled to the ear, and many times the engineers only need occasional verification with large diameter stuff for certain kinds of music.
If you go to B&H or Thomann, and look up studio monitors you will find that most of the products are close range. Every engineer i've seen interviewed has a similar configuration.
Maybe Vandersteen should pursue the studio monitor market. They may indeed have a wonderful product. But the monitors that exist today are awfully good, and so much better than the lousy speakers that people listen on (which are often their phones, or crappy bluetooth speakers, or car stereos).
Accuracy can be measured, and many consumer products are wildly inaccurate. If the bias happens to be to your taste, fine.
Please allow me my personal opinion as an aging engineer. The eternal problem when nearfield studio monitors are compared to hi-fi or high-end speakers. Nearfield studio monitors are monitoring speakers and have no real relevance in the living room. The Genelec are excellent speakers, but actually nothing for the living room. I know the Genelec 8351 from several trade fairs. This is my own personal opinion. Therefore, there are at least two categories of loudspeakers in a proper studio. Near-field studio monitors and a pair of good hi-fi speakers.
Whether these must necessarily cost several thousand dollars or even more, each studio must decide for itself. Of course, quality usually has its price. I own a pair of B&W in my living room. I grew up with Bowers & Wilkins. My very first time and experiences as a young little boy in a professional studio. There were Bowers & Wilkins speakers, what else? I also own a pair of Neumann Studio monitors next to inexpensive hi-fi speakers in a small hobby studio.
@@btsr2553 You are correct regarding near-field monitors and "a pair of good hi-fi speakers" as studio mainstays, but there are also mid-field and far-field monitors whose use is dependent upon the distance to the mixing board. I've heard many many great speakers during my 64 years as a hobbyist and enthusiast, and to me, the sound of a good pair of active studio monitors beats the sound of 95% of home speakers, including B&W. I've also compared passive speakers to their active counterparts and you can tell the difference in about 5 seconds...even when level matched. Just my opinion, of course.
Any suggestions for supporting amps and DACs? 22:47
I just look forward to a better year I lost my wife to Covid in January so just want to continue to move on. I still miss her so much 😢
I am so sorry for your loss. I truly wish the best for you. Hang in there!
I’m so sorry for your loss.
Jeff, my heart goes out to you. I hope you have family and friends to lean on during this difficult time.
Wishing you all the best. ❤
So sorry for your loss. I hope for continued healing.
I own Klipsch Forte 2 and NHT Model Four from many years ago. I think I've been looking at wrong price categories of speakers for my next audiophile journey, $8k and $16k, eh? Searching for end-game speakers, for a live music type Klipsch-phile, I am not sure if La Scala will be my final destination? Maybe open baffle speakers?
I like that it looks like you pulled your shirt out of the laundry basket and didn't even care to iron or hang it. You're every man's audiophile. Keep it up.
Another great review. I bought the 805 D4's and didn't like their sound in my room. I replaced them with La Scala AL5's, in part based on your prior comments about them. The La Scala's were much better. By the way, they throw a larger soundstage than did the 805's. But they do, as you say, not tolerate poor recordings. Of course, the 801 D4's are a whole different thing! But there is also the $38,000 part!
I have demo'd some B&W's at a high end store and could not have been less impressed. Their build quality was exquisite, but the sound was completely sterile and lifeless, and they were extremely inefficient. In the end, I found them to be all show, no go.
Sound is very subjective so its completly understandable the sound is not for everyone
@@andreasmoller9798 For sure. Anything that isn't an anechoic measurement of a speaker, or detailing data points about a speaker is subjective. I don't begrudge anyone who likes this speaker, and to be fair I have not heard THIS speaker, just other B&W's of this and higher price range and have always been extremely underwhelmed for the price you pay. Aesthetically they are near works of craftsmanship, if not art.
@@dlloyd6300 i use 702 s2 and love them and they have good amount of detail, but they are not neutral, but i will buy different brand next time, i will absolutly look into perlisten r7t they seem promising, if they sound good it will be win, becouse those speakers have serious spl output
@@andreasmoller9798 I hear nothing but praise for Perlisten, both measurements and subjective. Also a beautiful speaker. Certainly not cheap but I think fair for what you get. You're lucky to be able to dabble in such equipment 👍. Arendal and Paradigm also have some lovely offerings.
@@andreasmoller9798 My personal speakers are Klipsch RF7 III's. Certainly Klipsch is devisive in the community, and they may not be the best measuring speaker but oh the output levels without breaking a sweat, and the things that true compression driver tweeter can do. I find them to have the perfect level of detail without being too bright.
Now that 20222 is coming to an end and you two have experienced more products, can we expect to see some sort of update of what stack you and Kristi would purchase at the $1000, $2500 and maybe $4k price points? I'm curious what amps would be chosen in those price points....
Oooo I liked the new 365 day return policy for the headphones. I'm going to look into that.
Be sure to use our link so they know we sent you bit.ly/3CmKLL - thanks!
You're awesome Andrew, love the detailed reviews as always!
Thank you for introducing me to Lady Blackbird. So damn good.
She has to do a Bond cover someday.
@@techsamurai11 cover? She should be doing the next movie!
@@davidembrey4248Sorry, that's what I meant! 🙂
I'm not even a bowers fan, but was waiting on this review!
Hope you enjoy it! Stay tuned to the VERY end 😉
The focal evos are 21K btw.
Holy Smokes!! We did NOT know that. Last December when we reviewed them they were around 16K. At this new price, hell no. Gonna live that B&W life and fly somewhere nice with the leftover cash. First class both ways. :)
@@andrewrobinsonreviews That's "installing a front door" money! Wow.
Yeah some of these speaker price increases are insane and more are coming
Love the comparison to other speakers. I compare cars the same way, Corolla vs my Lexus. I think I understand your style of review better. I can afford QC50, 705 and 805. Would please let me know how far apart they are in sound quality?
The bush was epic 😂
We try and have fun.
was wondering why you haven't reviewed Ohm speakers? if you do do you think they would be good in a home theater set up.
speaker grills are just for protecting the driver when not in use
I always have to tell myself do I "need" these speakers. The constant need to upgrade even though I enjoy my fluance set up. Great video as always andrewand kristi! Hope yall enjoy the holidays
Always an important question to ask. Thanks for watching!
Morning guys!
Morning Luis, thanks for joining us.
Thanks for the great review Andrew. If I have a room with a large bookcase and the setup is such that I am limited to have my bookshelf speakers on the bookshelf (and therefore very close to the wall) do you think either these or even the B&W 705s will still be able to shine? Is there another bookshelf speaker you would recommend that may work well when placed on the shelf near the wall or do I need to seriously think about using another room for my proper listening setup?
Focal Kanta are not the same price as B&W 805D4 you’re thinking of Sopra and their build quality rivals 805
They are roughly the same price - bit.ly/3Dk0B8z
Not in U.K. (both £7k)
I’ve had my B&W 604 Series III for 20 years now and they’re still great. Would love to upgrade when in a bigger space one day
Can of worms alert ... Last speakers you'll ever own? Gird your loins for all of the outraged audiophiles who are about to tell you how vastly superior their "insert speaker brand here" speakers are ... It's just the nature of the audiophile beast.
You called it. 😂
Your reviews are so fun. I'm surprised the Polk R700s didn't come up, given that the Beolab 28s did.
Question:What’s your favorite speaker?
Answer: That’s easy to answer..THE NEXT ONE.
That's not even remotely accurate Carmine, don't be like that.
@@andrewrobinsonreviews Andrew..much like the video on the audiophile ladder of climbing the of ever more expensive gear ( I was at the Toronto Audiofest last weekend..listening to gear that cost more than the house I grew up in) there’s always next level or another improved model…BUT if these are your End Games speakers ..then congrats 🍾
Another great review of a great speaker.. there is to many great choices, my head is going to explode trying to decide!
To continue in remaining both cancer & Covid free in order to enjoy some live music.
Wishing you a healthy rest of the year and the same for the next!
I LOVE the B&W sound. It sounds the least fatiguing, 'pleasant' and laid back to my ears. And it plays modern Electronic music so damn well! One of the most versatile speakers out there and they don't get credit for that...Sadly, for myself, the one from them that I truly like (801) , which seems to be my holy grail speaker, is way too impractical and I will never buy it (too expensive, too heavy). I have to spend time researching alternatives now.
Question of the day: I look forward to find a partner to share my hobbies and life with, some day soon 😅😇😂
Companionship is so important. May you find someone who makes you smile soon!
Great review. I have 802D floor standing models, the model after the original 802 Diamond, and before the D2 that you mentioned owning, so I'm not surprised that you really like these. I think they're more neutral than my second generation "D" series. What I'm really impressed by is that the Denon amp/DAC combination unit that emerged as your favorite was so good driving speakers of this caliber (and presumably the Focal as well). $4,000 for an amp that good, plus a comparably excellent DAC, while not cheap, is really giving us some astonishing performance for the money. (My B&W's are driven by a McIntosh MC450, so probably a subtly different flavor to the sound).
First
Second
Thanks for tuning in!
Hi Andrew, love your reviews. I’m looking to buy 805 D4 as my front speakers. However couldn’t decide if they’d be adequate for 2-channel listening. Do you recommend these speakers for a 17x25x10 ft dedicated room, listening distance of abt 10-12ft?
Nah, too small for your room. I'd suggest some 804 D4's or even 803 D4's if you can accommodate and are set on B&W. You can take a look at other options like KEF Reference as well ;-)
Idk I had the 805D3’s in a little bit larger living room 20x25x10. I thought the 805’s sounded fantastic, I had demo’s a pair of Arendal 1723 speakers which are much longer and the 805’s were so much better and clearer, even in the bass area. I have now upgraded to the 803D3 and I can tell you they are more full sounding which is obvious with the two additional 7” bass drivers and larger midrange but, I totally think the 805D4 can work in that space, I don’t listen at super high levels either, for me if the clarity isn’t there at lower volumes, it’s not for me.
Bravo
Great review. My B&W Matrix 805s probably need replacement (not need, want LOL). I knew I'd probably go for the 805D4 and you just sealed it!!
Incidentally, showing my age, but I looked for years for a great pair of speakers when I was in my late teens and early to mid 20s. I listened to Spendor, Wharfedale, Quadral, Pro-Ac and a LOT of KEF. I was almost sold on the KEF Reference 104/2s around early 1992 but there was something missing.
Then I went to a B&W dealer and listened to the Concept 90, an innovative loudspeaker that was made of a bass column and a top that was a pair of bookshelf speakers which you could buy first, then add the column with the bass drivers later. I listened to the full version (the bookshelf speakers were called the CM1 and when mated to the matching rear-firing 4 bass driver (6.5 inch I think) column, the whole thing became the CM2.
It blew me away........... I had never heard anything so clear, with so much depth, so much neutrality and so much precision. A pretty average CD of the Brandenburg Concerti went from basically noise to a 3D musical picture. It lead me to buy my M805s - I also bought the matching (then) Matrix HTM (Vertical M805) centre speaker and I sorely regret not buying the Matrix 800 ASW Sub as well. Anyway, I've been nuts for anything B&W since - I have a Panorama 1 Sound-bar in my lounge-room which along with my TV is recessed into the wall, Matrix 805s paired to rears (Boston Accoustics VRS-Pro) and a Boston Acoustics PV1 Sub (the Boston Acoustic Sub is very well made but a bit of disappointment.
So Andrew and Kristi, WHEN I buy my 805D4s and the matching Centre Speaker, what Sub should I pair them with for a Home Theatre (the 805s will also be used to listen to Vinyl, CD, 24bit streaming, etc. via Apple Music. AND, if I replace the rears, what should I go for, 705s??
I would then plan to put the Matrix 805s, Matrix HTM Centre and VRS-Pros into my bedroom for an awesome second system.
Look forward to your response if you have time!!
In no way is there $9500 worth of materials or engineering in these speakers.
You're getting fleeced.
If you had to compare these to KEF LS50 Meta, what percent would you say these would be better by?
They are not comparable. The B&Ws are hands down better.