Thanks for sharing this. I did trial subscriptions on both Amazon Music HD and Qobuz and did an A/B test on my high-end sound system playing through my Bluesound Vault 2i. My ears preferred the Qobuz stream over Amazon and it sound fuller and had better low-end response over Amazon. I’ve listened to both services in my car on a Burmester sound system. Qobuz won hands down. It all depends on your priorities in life. I’m sticking with Qobuz and it sounds better to me on my sound systems. I do like Amazon’s algorithm for generating auto fill music but I prefer the quality of Qobuz.
Professor, this was a fantastic video. You cut through all the hype and cut to the chase. I watched a number of these type of videos but you nailed it in such a concise package. Thank you! Could you please comment on Wim Hulpia's comment below? He says that even the basic Tidal (their "HiFi") is not lossless. Thank you again Professor!
Lossless is a theory. A reality is when the trumpet sounds artificial nasal and the cymbals sound floaty fuzzy buzzy instead of metallic sparkly shimmery. Let's keep it real and talk about the SOUND
You are awesome. Finally some honesty about these companies. Your mastering in reason studios was an eye opener. Can't smash that subscribe button hard enough! Looking forward to the next video! Cheers from Berlin!
@@TheRealAudioProfessor Just wanted to correct you about “lossless” as CD Quality. Technically it’s not lossless since the Master was most likely 24 bit and truncated into 16 bit with added dithering. That’s why “high res” makes sense to keep at 24 bit for the consumer. The files size per album is about 200 mb extra if the sample rates are at 44.1/48. As far as the marketing for “high res” that’s a completely another story. Most people can’t tell the difference between 24 or a truncated 16 bit Audio file
Awesome video. I’ve been suckered into the Apple ecosystem and had a free trial of Apple Music that I enjoyed. Now that I’ve bought a DAC and quality headphones I’ve been debating on which service but this video has sold me on Apple Music 👍🏼.
Hey, like you, I have been sucked into that Apple product world. What kind of Dax do you have for your headphones? Fairly new to the headphone game have a pair of senhiesser something and a basic pair of jbl
@@fredleeman8186 I purchased a Schiit Modi 3 for DAC and a Magni 3 amp for the headphone (Philips Audio). Seems pretty good so far but am also a newbie to all this.
@@1607trojan thank you for replying. I also am new to this. Any little bit of info I can gather helps I’m just trying to get some good listening in. Thank you again.
Just a couple of minutes back I watched the GoldenSound video about MQA and as an Tidal owner I can confirm the fact that some Masters sounded a little bit strange i slould say… now that i found you guys and i have more knowledge I leaving Tidal for FLAC… thank you for makeing these videos, this comunity of audiophiles is great, it s a new passion for me and exciting the same time be cause in parallel i m learning sound engineering and all of this is great stuff… thank you!
Great video. Some have a problem with Apple's upsample and downsample output on Mac's unless physically matching the bitrate for each song played. I can't hear a difference. I do hear a difference in the quality of a 24bit/96kHz stream vs a CD played on the same surround sound deck.
Sadly nothing about how the services are tested. White Sea Studio did a Nulltest with one of his masterd songs on all of this streaming services and explained the differences in his video and also discovered wich services are lossless and wich not.
it's true but still all in the mind and head and theory, that's why they bring in "super-hearer" a.k.a. moi. A few things to clear the air. Recording is LOSSY, always. Without living music, all music will shrivel and die. 2. all the theories and bullshit about MQA etc., means nothing until you have a super-hearer show you the three seconds of trumpet, plucked bass, wood flute, or whatever that proves it. FORGET theories and SHOW 3 second clips. I have no time to show clips but I help describe for you what to compare and then it will be obvious MQA is fraud. Don't get mad, Tidal came from nowhere in Norway against an elitist corrupt record industry and did an amazing job of lying to slip inside, they have a 2 year grace period of paying artists more per track and adapting to earn our trust before we give the 20 richest billionaires more of our money. But facts are facts, amazon sounds CLEARLY better to a super-hearer like me, for now. So what? We have to support the right music ecology.
This guy just poked fun at me for knowing about Lossless audio quality. And you’re not a professor at this. Professors don’t say.” Feel free to publicly humiliate people in the comments” or whatever. I think that’s wrong. Thanks for making me feel bad about myself Mr “professor “😔😔
Correct me if Im wrong, but if utilizing a lossless streaming format and a bluetooth conection to your stereo speakers or earbuds you are losing everything gained from lossless. Ive also heard that the operating system in Windows, and Apple will reduce the lossless transmision even if the source is wired to your stereo. So whats the point of a lossless streaming app when it can never match the quality of a cd???
Hey brethren you’re correct about lossless not being utilized over Bluetooth connections, in the case of a computer(I have windows) I have the Modi Multibit DAC and it switches the sample rates automatically according to format of said song/file. Depending on your DAC or if you have one you’d have to switch sample rate according to the song.
I'm interested in buying and downloading hi-res files, but I don't want streaming. That is, I want to pay per download, and not pay per month. Is there a service for that?
I’ve had Tidal for years because of the 1/2 off student rate and because their artists are reportedly paid more / stream. It really bums me out that their hifi+ tier is bs. Glad I never paid for it.
The only reason I’m going to switch to Tidal is that the Hifi family plan is 5,72 USD for 6 people in my region. I used Spotify and apple music before.I can’t listen to lossless on my windows pc using iTunes.
One thing you kind of got wrong was your claim of Tidal offering lossless streaming at the HiFi-tier. Every track that is playable in MQA is only playable in MQA. Even when selecting the supposed "cd quality" option on a track with the master badge, you are still hearing the MQA-version of the track. It just lacks the format metadata / flagging so it doesn't do the unfolding, but regardless is still lossy. In any case I'm glad people are waking up to the fact that MQA is a huge sham. If they hadn't claimed it was lossless or "better than lossless", whatever that means, there would've never been any controversy. Now that the claim has been objectively debunked I cannot fathom how some still try to push MQA being lossless. For an example, the infamous ex-audio engineer Amir of ASR was arguing way back when the topic was blowing up in multiple forum posts that MQA is "perceptually lossless", whatever that means, and that "mathematical losslessness" isn't desirable. The fact that even audio professinonals were pushing for MQA and blatantly arguing in bad faith just goes to show how corrupt the hifi-industry is.
Tidal: 19.99 (not even hi-res)(STILL LOSSLESS THO) Deezer: 14.99 (overpriced CD QUALITY) Apple Music (alac Codec) (not a widely supported codec in terms of a wide range of devices) Amazon Music: 9.99 (support's high Res 24-bit) (flac codec) (flac is open-source so it is supported everywhere) Qobuz: 12.99
Every track labeled as "master" on Tidal will play as mqa in their "Hifi Plus" tier. So lossy, fake hi-res like you said. But... when subscribing to their "Hifi" tier, these tracks will NOT be lossless. You are still getting the same mqas but this time they are processed : 1. the last 8 bits are chopped of (containing the "folded" hi-res frequencies above 24kHz) leaving you with a 16bit file that can no longer "unfold" This means the physical flac file that was either a 16/44 flac (1), 24/44 flac (2) or 24/48 flac (3) will now be a 16/44 flac (1+2) or a 16/48 flac (3). 2. if the flac is a 16/48 flac (3) it is downsampled to a 16/44 flac. This means ALL mqa flacs are converted to 16/44. This gives some interesting results : You expect lossless audio in their "hifi" tier BUT (1) 16/44 mqas coming in a 16/44 flac will remain unchanged. So when playing these in the "hifi tier" on an mqa dac, the dac will still show "mqa 44.1" ! So lossy ! (2) 24/44 88 176 352 mqas coming in a 24/44 flac will become 16/44 flacs. The dac will still show "mqa 44.1", "mqa 88.2", "mqa 176.4" or "mqa 352.8" giving you the impression you are getting the full mqa, but you are NOT, the unfolding bits are no longer there, mqa is unfolding "air" (nothing!). So still lossy here ! (3) 24/48 96 192 mqas coming in a 24/48 flac will become 16/44 flacs. The downsampling from 48 to 44 causes the mqa signal bitstream to be damaged, the mqa dac can no longer recognize it and will show "pcm 44.1". This is NOT a lossless pcm44.1 file since it was created by downsampling the a lossy mqa file. So the only time you are getting a lossless file from Tidals Hifi tier, is when you are playing a track that is NOT labeled master. This means, even Tidals "hifi" tier is NOT lossless.
@@geopietro All tracks that are labeled "master" in Tidals "Hifi Plus" tier are downsampled to 16/44 for their "hifi" tier. So those are lossy even on a non mqa dac. Only those that are labeled "hifi" in Tidals "hifi plus" tier will still be lossless in their "hifi" tier. Since Tidal offers mostly mqas, even their hifi tier offering mostly downsampled mqas cannot be called lossless.
@@geopietro Liars pay the price but licensing and record industries gave tidal very few tightropes to walk except lying, give them a chance later. Yes I'm paid to evaluate 450 year old violins with my ears and amazon is better. But so incredible tidal walked the minefield to get here. They HAD to lie. What they do next will define their soul. Disclaimer: for now amazon sounds better.
Any news/updates on Apple music about its lossless audio/dolby atmos playing in PC? Android Simulator seems to have it's limitation, and Cider still has problem to play apple music in full capacity. iTune is hopeless in Windows.
Oh no. A professor. I haven't watched yet but I'm a super-hearer with perfect pitch called in to value Guarneris. I haven't heard anything yet so I'm neutral and will let you know what I think after I hear the video.
Three-way tie between apple amazon tidal for lossless. NO NO NO. Tidal is doing some kinda secret stuff to their music which I call celery salt. It's grainy, opens up other flavours while getting in the way and putting its own fingerprint. Mids echo. Basses and mids are hollow. Trebles are grainy airy but have breathing room to show real texture (while unfortunately suffering more from the grainy than the detail they gain by doing so.) The whole thing has a very subtle mild electro-hollowness. We can compare to amazon which is opposite. The grainy superreal floating details of tidal which help you smell the wood of a flute or guitar, are gone. But so is the hollow grainyness. If it's just words it's a wash but if it's ears, I'll take amazon every day over electro-buzzy-floaty-fake 2d timbres. This isn't so 100% that Tidal won't sound better for some things, but it's like a fake 90's receiver where you hit a buttton for sound stage like "cathedral", "amphitheatre", "club", etc., and on every track Tidal hit the button for "hollow echo secondary school cafeteria." DISCLAIMER: I get Tidal perqs all the time and I don't agree to 20 billlionaires like Jeff ruling the planet. But STOP already, Tidal invest your money to better sound and we'll all support you. Also UI and AI for tracking tastes. OK that's not my speciallty, superhearing is. Someone is a liar in the lossless thing and idk the science but amazon sounds a LOT bettter, don't fight me. Give me 3 seconds A/B of Miles Davis with timestamps, adios.
Something that has never been explained, to me. As CDs are recorded at 16-bit 14.1, what is the source of the 24-bit music that these services are streaming? Are they just upsampling?
AMU definitely has a 20% discount for Prime members ($8.99/mo.) and goes even further down to $7.40/mo. when paying yearly. That's actually cheaper than Spotify, with **far** better audio quality on AMU.
If u get it working amazon is great it's difficult for me in Belgium I have to activate it on usa site and it doesn't work on xbox because 'country associated with account not supported' it's a mess but sounds better than deezer
I am using Tidal,but only the Hifi Tier,because for me CD Quality is good enough and Tidal has a huge Libary of Music.But i agree wit the MQA Thing.In my Opinion it is complete Trash.I don't like what its doing with the Music.I compared it with the Hifi Option back and forth and MQA always sounds not good to my Ears.Deezer has a Lack of some Bands i like and Apple has no Option to play Lossless Music over my Windows PC.Spotify is a NOGO for me,because there is no HiFi Option.
So help me out here. If I want to download a hi-res version of say Day& Age by The Killers (widely available on several sites) by the band has ever only officially released the CD. Where do these sites/services get their copies of the original lossless masters? I'm mean, I have Blu-rays of Pink Floyd Animals and Jethro Tull Aqualung, and they sound amazing. But they were official/remastered releases, ya know?
Apple music has a 24bit/44.1khz file. That would most likely be the highest quality version. Only thing is you can't buy it. Just looking now it seems to be a 2017 remaster?
Note for those considering apple music! Their lossless option is only available if you use the apple music app on an apple device. If you're using a windows pc or an android phone you're SOL no matter that you're paying the same subscription price either way. Why? Because F consumers, that's why.
Truly thanks, but this offers no real scientific, studio, or sonic comparisons. It's a bunch of talk. White wave has taken this on. I'd go check out his video. It ACTUALLY does comparisons using measuring and deciphering technology. I have no affiliation to white wave btw, I just like seeing dudes shutup and get their hands dirty in "science".
Loved your review but I wanna mention one fact which I have learned by listening to CD same songs on cd sound wayyyyy better than that of Amazon music HD and even my wife can easily tell in a blind test that CD clearly sounds way better than Amazon HD so what are your thoughts on it?
Different master. Cd quality is the highest quality you will ever need. High res lossless is over what almost any human can hear and even if you can it's not going to be much better. Also streaming services can have different versions to the cd one
Yeah now listen to Tidal after. Keep in mind your CD is sending sounds from a different pathway from your Amazon, being a budding scientist like you are, you need to reveal all those details when you say things like that to the Mob.
A lot of it depends on how you are streaming, If you have a good quality CD player, amplifier and speakers, but are streaming from a phone or laptop without a good quality external DAC, you may not be getting CD quality sound from your stream at all, and you may also be getting noise from your laptop, etc. Bluetooth also degrades the sound quality if you are using that, and wifi not as good as if your Internet is plugged in as it were ...
From my experiments, high resolution streaming on Qobuz (on a stereo bluesound system with subwoofer) is not the same as purchasing the same track and streaming it locally from NAS drive. The purchased version from Qobuz sounds much better than the streamed version on Qobuz. Actually, my Spotify streaming sounds better than qobuz streaming, but not better than purchased qobuz version. So I use Spotify to discover music and if I like a track or album, then purchase it on Qobuz store.
Discovery is all about how you find it easier. Just be warned you can miss your fave part of your fave song so easily because as hard as it is to describe differences, there was a time when they said 720p was beyond humans, and now we get 8k.
Tidal Hi-Fi also includes: Dolby Atmos, Sony 360 Reality Audio, and 450K+ videos. Let us know when the "Audio Professor" streaming music service launches since you trashed every single service. Pessimistic much?
Lol. So do all the others. They just don’t rip you off as well. Sorry you prefer lossy high resolution for more money. Apple Music is superior in every way. Keep drinking that Kool Aid!
OMG what does Dolby Atmos, Sony 360, and videos have to with anything?.. why are you butt-hurt? Seriously nothing he said was wrong at all and kept to the subject... Tidal sucks, period. I had Tidal for a long time, but got very sick of it's "masters" sounding no different to Spottily and NOT CD quality by any stretch. Anyone with quality, resolving speakers can hear it. Did you read the title, as in what the video was actually about? "High Resolution and Lossless Music"... He's talking about 'bits' (ones and zeros) not sound-stage.
@@nicholasgilbert4227 My interest is in surround sound. I have a 5.1 surround setup with two Adam A77X monitors, three Adam A7X monitors, and a sub out of a Focusrite 18i20 3rd gen interface. I can clearly hear the difference between Spotify and Tidal. It's actually Spotify that doesn't sound as good as Tidal when you hear it through a calibrated system.
@@TheRealAudioProfessor Oh wow, another Apple fan boi. Sorry I upset you Professor Pessimist. Maybe you should rethink putting your "public face" on UA-cam since you don't seem to be any good at making friends or public relations on the world wide stage. It's no big deal though, it's only the world watching you sabotage yourself.
@@andynonimuss6298 if your interest is in surround why are you here? Calibrated or not is entirely irrelevant if the source is lacking.. lol I've done comparisons between tidal and CD i own and the difference is there. Even though it shouldn't be. Anyway, again you're missing the point, the subject matter here is HighRes and lossless audio. Not surround. Do you go to a Car video and complain it didn't mention bicycles?
they all suck for one reason or another. Tidal is the most rip off. Qobuz doesn't have enough techno/electronic music. Bandcamp has good selection. Amazon HD music has a ridiculously annoying interface. Apple sucks at making recommendation or suggesting similar songs; it just gets stuck on the artist without continuing to play related music, like UA-cam Music does and is actually pretty good at. Deezer electronic selection sucks, and it's minimalistic interface is stupid. Spotify has the best algorithm, but the quality is only pretty good, without CD quality. Soundcloud is best for electronic music, though quality is only subpar. Mixcloud has great selection, but extremely annoying to use. 1001tracklists is great, free, same quality as most lossy ones, and is free. Tidal sounds about as good, if not worse than, SoundCloud. Apple for me is the best price, but has a lot of shortcomings. Apple is too revenue focused.
Apple has no hi res music they are sending lossy AAC to your device you need ATV to get lossless music otherwise your are getting 350 kbps AAC lossy apple refuses to enable Lossless audio through airplay 2 for whatever reason.
Did you just insinuate that TIDAL isn't high quality? Well, well. So why did WHAT HI-FI call TIDAL the best high quality streaming service 5 years in a row?
I have the Tidal top tier and the file format (according to the app) is: "16 bit 44,1KHZ FLAC" for high and "24 bit 44,1-88,2KHZ FLAC" and sometimes MQA for Master/Max quality. There is a noticeable sound quality improvement versus Spotify and YT Music on my Bose QC ii (wired) playing off a Samsung S10+ (I know, not ideal). Can you comment? Should I still change apps and switch to Qobuz (I do not want to support The Big Four)?
@@sanji663 For mobile use, it's what's there. At home I have a Marantz and Jamo setup. I considered an attachable dac from Audioquest but haven't gone down the rabbit hole. Also slightly inconvenient but still doable.
Here I am, no theories or professor, a paid super-hearer who evaluates 16 million dollar violins. LOSSY as F. Every recording is a loss, and I would also add, an add. In the end you can do ear training but your soul has the answers and red carpet. You will KNOW when what you hear gives you joy.
Bluetooth doesn't have enough bandwidth for High-Rez Audio, but you mentioned "lossless" (CD quality) specifically and I think that *might* be possible via Bluetooth. But bear in mind that Amazon and Apple can both stream *better* quality than lossless, usually, and you can't get that with Bluetooth.
I love it when I do a UA-cam search, one one of my friends' videos comes up! Well done Lorne.
The only thing I would disagree with in this whole video, is in regards to your ex wife's lawyer. He seemed alright to me.
Dang, i knew elementary kids were not to be online but what i can i say……
Lies again? Teddy Bear AMWF Car
Thanks for sharing this. I did trial subscriptions on both Amazon Music HD and Qobuz and did an A/B test on my high-end sound system playing through my Bluesound Vault 2i. My ears preferred the Qobuz stream over Amazon and it sound fuller and had better low-end response over Amazon. I’ve listened to both services in my car on a Burmester sound system. Qobuz won hands down. It all depends on your priorities in life. I’m sticking with Qobuz and it sounds better to me on my sound systems. I do like Amazon’s algorithm for generating auto fill music but I prefer the quality of Qobuz.
Same here. Qobuz does sound 10 times better
Great explanations, super simple for someone new to the scene like me to understand... and love the humour!
Professor, this was a fantastic video. You cut through all the hype and cut to the chase. I watched a number of these type of videos but you nailed it in such a concise package. Thank you! Could you please comment on Wim Hulpia's comment below? He says that even the basic Tidal (their "HiFi") is not lossless. Thank you again Professor!
Lossless is a theory. A reality is when the trumpet sounds artificial nasal and the cymbals sound floaty fuzzy buzzy instead of metallic sparkly shimmery. Let's keep it real and talk about the SOUND
You are awesome. Finally some honesty about these companies. Your mastering in reason studios was an eye opener. Can't smash that subscribe button hard enough! Looking forward to the next video! Cheers from Berlin!
Thanks so much for the kind words!
@@TheRealAudioProfessor Just wanted to correct you about “lossless” as CD Quality. Technically it’s not lossless since the Master was most likely 24 bit and truncated into 16 bit with added dithering. That’s why “high res” makes sense to keep at 24 bit for the consumer. The files size per album is about 200 mb extra if the sample rates are at 44.1/48.
As far as the marketing for “high res” that’s a completely another story. Most people can’t tell the difference between 24 or a truncated 16 bit Audio file
Get his ballz outta your mouth son. Internet is full of over confident experts.
Thank you for the upfront reviews. Truly appreciated
I wish you reviewed audio equipment. Your no BS assessment is great.
Awesome video. I’ve been suckered into the Apple ecosystem and had a free trial of Apple Music that I enjoyed. Now that I’ve bought a DAC and quality headphones I’ve been debating on which service but this video has sold me on Apple Music 👍🏼.
Luckily you have chosen the best option. Qobuz, Deezer and apple music is definitely the best.
Hey, like you, I have been sucked into that Apple product world. What kind of Dax do you have for your headphones?
Fairly new to the headphone game have a pair of senhiesser something and a basic pair of jbl
@@fredleeman8186 I purchased a Schiit Modi 3 for DAC and a Magni 3 amp for the headphone (Philips Audio). Seems pretty good so far but am also a newbie to all this.
@@1607trojan thank you for replying. I also am new to this.
Any little bit of info I can gather helps I’m just trying to get some good listening in. Thank you again.
I think you should mention how difficult it is to get Apple HiResLossless? They tend to push everyone to using a limited AirPlay because … Apple.
Just a couple of minutes back I watched the GoldenSound video about MQA and as an Tidal owner I can confirm the fact that some Masters sounded a little bit strange i slould say… now that i found you guys and i have more knowledge I leaving Tidal for FLAC… thank you for makeing these videos, this comunity of audiophiles is great, it s a new passion for me and exciting the same time be cause in parallel i m learning sound engineering and all of this is great stuff… thank you!
Very informative and concise. Thanks.
Deezer is 8.99 if you purchase it yearly I believe and I think 11.99 per month for the Lossless stream.
BEST REVIEW AWARD ACTIVATED!!!! Great job. Comprehensive and TRUTH…. Anyone that disagrees just enjoys lying to themselves. GREAT JOB 🤩🤩🤩🤩
Knowledge provided= 0%
Nagging over rude comments= 100%
Love your style
You deserve subscribers in 6 digits
The way this guy preempted the trolls in this video is hilarious 😆
Amazon is 7.50 if you buy it annually and a Prime member. Best value for me. ;)
Dr. Evil has put a smile to my face 😄
Thank you for a clear and quick explanation
Great video as always!
Tidal is according to the reports adding hi res lossless flac in the coming months.
Great video. Some have a problem with Apple's upsample and downsample output on Mac's unless physically matching the bitrate for each song played. I can't hear a difference. I do hear a difference in the quality of a 24bit/96kHz stream vs a CD played on the same surround sound deck.
Deezer is the only option if you have to use it with Google Home but still want hifi audio in your PC or phone.
Great explanation Thanks for this!
Thanks for an honest review
Tidal are now lossless and offer the best quality audio for a lower price
I thought we'd get review on sound quality. We didn't get that in this video
Sadly nothing about how the services are tested. White Sea Studio did a Nulltest with one of his masterd songs on all of this streaming services and explained the differences in his video and also discovered wich services are lossless and wich not.
it's true but still all in the mind and head and theory, that's why they bring in "super-hearer" a.k.a. moi. A few things to clear the air. Recording is LOSSY, always. Without living music, all music will shrivel and die. 2. all the theories and bullshit about MQA etc., means nothing until you have a super-hearer show you the three seconds of trumpet, plucked bass, wood flute, or whatever that proves it. FORGET theories and SHOW 3 second clips. I have no time to show clips but I help describe for you what to compare and then it will be obvious MQA is fraud. Don't get mad, Tidal came from nowhere in Norway against an elitist corrupt record industry and did an amazing job of lying to slip inside, they have a 2 year grace period of paying artists more per track and adapting to earn our trust before we give the 20 richest billionaires more of our money. But facts are facts, amazon sounds CLEARLY better to a super-hearer like me, for now. So what? We have to support the right music ecology.
This guy just poked fun at me for knowing about Lossless audio quality. And you’re not a professor at this. Professors don’t say.” Feel free to publicly humiliate people in the comments” or whatever. I think that’s wrong. Thanks for making me feel bad about myself Mr “professor “😔😔
Correct me if Im wrong, but if utilizing a lossless streaming format and a bluetooth conection to your stereo speakers or earbuds you are losing everything gained from lossless. Ive also heard that the operating system in Windows, and Apple will reduce the lossless transmision even if the source is wired to your stereo. So whats the point of a lossless streaming app when it can never match the quality of a cd???
Hey brethren you’re correct about lossless not being utilized over Bluetooth connections, in the case of a computer(I have windows) I have the Modi Multibit DAC and it switches the sample rates automatically according to format of said song/file. Depending on your DAC or if you have one you’d have to switch sample rate according to the song.
I'm interested in buying and downloading hi-res files, but I don't want streaming. That is, I want to pay per download, and not pay per month. Is there a service for that?
Very useful, thanks!
I’ve had Tidal for years because of the 1/2 off student rate and because their artists are reportedly paid more / stream. It really bums me out that their hifi+ tier is bs. Glad I never paid for it.
brilliant video
Same conclusion as what I have tested… the only thing I would add is the app… I would like the Spotify app with Amazon and even Apple ;)
New pricing structure for Tidal as of April 2024. No more $20/mo.
The only reason I’m going to switch to Tidal is that the Hifi family plan is 5,72 USD for 6 people in my region. I used Spotify and apple music before.I can’t listen to lossless on my windows pc using iTunes.
You can listen to lossless now 😁
@@Haydos Using iTunes? I would definitely try it, still have my apple music.
@@jahmesz3303 No it's a different app now. You can get it on the windows store. Also you can find a guide if your PC is not supported to fix it.
none of it is lossless, WAKE UP
ua-cam.com/video/ieqUM667j8M/v-deo.html
i prefer analog vinyl sound of all of streaming
Spotify or youtube music all need an equalizer app to sound decent on my Chromecast w/ google tv, without it they'll sound crap.
Deezer is the best 💜
One thing you kind of got wrong was your claim of Tidal offering lossless streaming at the HiFi-tier. Every track that is playable in MQA is only playable in MQA. Even when selecting the supposed "cd quality" option on a track with the master badge, you are still hearing the MQA-version of the track. It just lacks the format metadata / flagging so it doesn't do the unfolding, but regardless is still lossy. In any case I'm glad people are waking up to the fact that MQA is a huge sham. If they hadn't claimed it was lossless or "better than lossless", whatever that means, there would've never been any controversy. Now that the claim has been objectively debunked I cannot fathom how some still try to push MQA being lossless. For an example, the infamous ex-audio engineer Amir of ASR was arguing way back when the topic was blowing up in multiple forum posts that MQA is "perceptually lossless", whatever that means, and that "mathematical losslessness" isn't desirable. The fact that even audio professinonals were pushing for MQA and blatantly arguing in bad faith just goes to show how corrupt the hifi-industry is.
Tidal: 19.99 (not even hi-res)(STILL LOSSLESS THO)
Deezer: 14.99 (overpriced CD QUALITY)
Apple Music (alac Codec) (not a widely supported codec in terms of a wide range of devices)
Amazon Music: 9.99 (support's high Res 24-bit) (flac codec) (flac is open-source so it is supported everywhere)
Qobuz: 12.99
Every track labeled as "master" on Tidal will play as mqa in their "Hifi Plus" tier. So lossy, fake hi-res like you said.
But... when subscribing to their "Hifi" tier, these tracks will NOT be lossless. You are still getting the same mqas but this time they are processed :
1. the last 8 bits are chopped of (containing the "folded" hi-res frequencies above 24kHz) leaving you with a 16bit file that can no longer "unfold"
This means the physical flac file that was either a 16/44 flac (1), 24/44 flac (2) or 24/48 flac (3) will now be a 16/44 flac (1+2) or a 16/48 flac (3).
2. if the flac is a 16/48 flac (3) it is downsampled to a 16/44 flac.
This means ALL mqa flacs are converted to 16/44.
This gives some interesting results : You expect lossless audio in their "hifi" tier BUT
(1) 16/44 mqas coming in a 16/44 flac will remain unchanged. So when playing these in the "hifi tier" on an mqa dac, the dac will still show "mqa 44.1" ! So lossy !
(2) 24/44 88 176 352 mqas coming in a 24/44 flac will become 16/44 flacs. The dac will still show "mqa 44.1", "mqa 88.2", "mqa 176.4" or "mqa 352.8" giving you the impression you are getting the full mqa, but you are NOT, the unfolding bits are no longer there, mqa is unfolding "air" (nothing!). So still lossy here !
(3) 24/48 96 192 mqas coming in a 24/48 flac will become 16/44 flacs. The downsampling from 48 to 44 causes the mqa signal bitstream to be damaged, the mqa dac can no longer recognize it and will show "pcm 44.1". This is NOT a lossless pcm44.1 file since it was created by downsampling the a lossy mqa file.
So the only time you are getting a lossless file from Tidals Hifi tier, is when you are playing a track that is NOT labeled master.
This means, even Tidals "hifi" tier is NOT lossless.
Wim, when playing Tidal's "HiFi" on a non-mqa equipment, is it still not CD (lossless) quality? Thank you!
@@geopietro All tracks that are labeled "master" in Tidals "Hifi Plus" tier are downsampled to 16/44 for their "hifi" tier. So those are lossy even on a non mqa dac.
Only those that are labeled "hifi" in Tidals "hifi plus" tier will still be lossless in their "hifi" tier. Since Tidal offers mostly mqas, even their hifi tier offering mostly downsampled mqas cannot be called lossless.
@@WimHulpia Thanks. I dumped Tidal for Amazon. Thank you.
@@geopietro Liars pay the price but licensing and record industries gave tidal very few tightropes to walk except lying, give them a chance later. Yes I'm paid to evaluate 450 year old violins with my ears and amazon is better. But so incredible tidal walked the minefield to get here. They HAD to lie. What they do next will define their soul. Disclaimer: for now amazon sounds better.
@@PartyMusic775 Thank you.
Any news/updates on Apple music about its lossless audio/dolby atmos playing in PC? Android Simulator seems to have it's limitation, and Cider still has problem to play apple music in full capacity. iTune is hopeless in Windows.
So who is the best?
I just compared a "Hi-fi" audio track on deezer with UA-cam. Exactly no difference, measured ant everything... What a joke.
Drank the MQA cool aid and my comment today is: Screw Tidal
you are the best
Lol, I did check to see if it was an old vid
Looks like Tidal listened and is giving the higher level service at the cheaper price.
Oh no. A professor. I haven't watched yet but I'm a super-hearer with perfect pitch called in to value Guarneris. I haven't heard anything yet so I'm neutral and will let you know what I think after I hear the video.
OK can we explain LOSSLESS means after you record it. WHEN you record it you already lost.
UA-cam has random people uploading things with all kinds of stuff like their pet EQ profiles.
Three-way tie between apple amazon tidal for lossless. NO NO NO. Tidal is doing some kinda secret stuff to their music which I call celery salt. It's grainy, opens up other flavours while getting in the way and putting its own fingerprint. Mids echo. Basses and mids are hollow. Trebles are grainy airy but have breathing room to show real texture (while unfortunately suffering more from the grainy than the detail they gain by doing so.) The whole thing has a very subtle mild electro-hollowness. We can compare to amazon which is opposite. The grainy superreal floating details of tidal which help you smell the wood of a flute or guitar, are gone. But so is the hollow grainyness. If it's just words it's a wash but if it's ears, I'll take amazon every day over electro-buzzy-floaty-fake 2d timbres. This isn't so 100% that Tidal won't sound better for some things, but it's like a fake 90's receiver where you hit a buttton for sound stage like "cathedral", "amphitheatre", "club", etc., and on every track Tidal hit the button for "hollow echo secondary school cafeteria." DISCLAIMER: I get Tidal perqs all the time and I don't agree to 20 billlionaires like Jeff ruling the planet. But STOP already, Tidal invest your money to better sound and we'll all support you. Also UI and AI for tracking tastes. OK that's not my speciallty, superhearing is. Someone is a liar in the lossless thing and idk the science but amazon sounds a LOT bettter, don't fight me. Give me 3 seconds A/B of Miles Davis with timestamps, adios.
LOL I like this guy in his conclusions.
Am a Tidal user
Something that has never been explained, to me. As CDs are recorded at 16-bit 14.1, what is the source of the 24-bit music that these services are streaming? Are they just upsampling?
presumably, they get the audio files straight from the studios, whether it's 16 bit or 24 bit audio. although super audio cds exist.
Great info but Amazon Music unlimited is $10.99 a month and no discount for prime members.
It is 8.99/m for me as a prime member.
@@ForzaManny Yes you are correct but man I think it should be at least $6.00 for prime members….. $10.99 for regular costumers is ridiculous too.
AMU definitely has a 20% discount for Prime members ($8.99/mo.) and goes even further down to $7.40/mo. when paying yearly. That's actually cheaper than Spotify, with **far** better audio quality on AMU.
Ex wife’s lawyer hahah that was hilarious
If u get it working amazon is great it's difficult for me in Belgium I have to activate it on usa site and it doesn't work on xbox because 'country associated with account not supported' it's a mess but sounds better than deezer
Your the only one ever to rate amazon first and tidal last
I am using Tidal,but only the Hifi Tier,because for me CD Quality is good enough and Tidal has a huge Libary of Music.But i agree wit the MQA Thing.In my Opinion it is complete Trash.I don't like what its doing with the Music.I compared it with the Hifi Option back and forth and MQA always sounds not good to my Ears.Deezer has a Lack of some Bands i like and Apple has no Option to play Lossless Music over my Windows PC.Spotify is a NOGO for me,because there is no HiFi Option.
Amazon Music unlimited is amazing
New flash: it's all the same, proved by hackers streaming the bytes.
@@PartyMusic775 please just leave. You have no idea what you are talking about 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
It seems more like he's engaging in prejudice
Agreed! Channel sucks….
Napster offer lossless.
So help me out here. If I want to download a hi-res version of say Day& Age by The Killers (widely available on several sites) by the band has ever only officially released the CD. Where do these sites/services get their copies of the original lossless masters? I'm mean, I have Blu-rays of Pink Floyd Animals and Jethro Tull Aqualung, and they sound amazing. But they were official/remastered releases, ya know?
Apple music has a 24bit/44.1khz file. That would most likely be the highest quality version. Only thing is you can't buy it. Just looking now it seems to be a 2017 remaster?
@@Haydos Super! Thanks for the reply. 👍
@@jasonwurster387 hope that helps. I have access to all the streaming services so I'm here if you have any questions.
Note for those considering apple music! Their lossless option is only available if you use the apple music app on an apple device. If you're using a windows pc or an android phone you're SOL no matter that you're paying the same subscription price either way. Why? Because F consumers, that's why.
total opposite actually
Good 👍 sir
Tidal should also have dolby atmos, right
Yes but it's almost always a bad version of the song.
Using an Android device. Don't worry Apple Music is better on Android for some reason.
Truly thanks, but this offers no real scientific, studio, or sonic comparisons. It's a bunch of talk. White wave has taken this on. I'd go check out his video. It ACTUALLY does comparisons using measuring and deciphering technology. I have no affiliation to white wave btw, I just like seeing dudes shutup and get their hands dirty in "science".
Loved your review but I wanna mention one fact which I have learned by listening to CD same songs on cd sound wayyyyy better than that of Amazon music HD and even my wife can easily tell in a blind test that CD clearly sounds way better than Amazon HD so what are your thoughts on it?
Different master. Cd quality is the highest quality you will ever need. High res lossless is over what almost any human can hear and even if you can it's not going to be much better. Also streaming services can have different versions to the cd one
Yeah now listen to Tidal after. Keep in mind your CD is sending sounds from a different pathway from your Amazon, being a budding scientist like you are, you need to reveal all those details when you say things like that to the Mob.
@@PartyMusic775 what?
@@PartyMusic775 different pathways. What drugs are you on 🤣. Also why say tidal. Tidal it garbage. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
A lot of it depends on how you are streaming, If you have a good quality CD player, amplifier and speakers, but are streaming from a phone or laptop without a good quality external DAC, you may not be getting CD quality sound from your stream at all, and you may also be getting noise from your laptop, etc. Bluetooth also degrades the sound quality if you are using that, and wifi not as good as if your Internet is plugged in as it were ...
U loss me 😅
Audio professor lol you spelled amateur wrong
SAD I AM LIKE 406…
Im kind of baffled how much music amazon is missing from its catalogs... its honestly pathetic for how big of a company they are.
Buy they have all the songs that I can't find anywhere else😅
Your ex wife's lawyer , don't tell me you hooked up with her on the rebound ? I really hope it's not to soon , sorry
Kool aid lmao
so basically we dont get anything wth . but spotify is like bad af in comparison ahaha xD .
From my experiments, high resolution streaming on Qobuz (on a stereo bluesound system with subwoofer) is not the same as purchasing the same track and streaming it locally from NAS drive. The purchased version from Qobuz sounds much better than the streamed version on Qobuz. Actually, my Spotify streaming sounds better than qobuz streaming, but not better than purchased qobuz version.
So I use Spotify to discover music and if I like a track or album, then purchase it on Qobuz store.
Discovery is all about how you find it easier. Just be warned you can miss your fave part of your fave song so easily because as hard as it is to describe differences, there was a time when they said 720p was beyond humans, and now we get 8k.
How dare you insult Deezer
Tidal Hi-Fi also includes: Dolby Atmos, Sony 360 Reality Audio, and 450K+ videos. Let us know when the "Audio Professor" streaming music service launches since you trashed every single service. Pessimistic much?
Lol. So do all the others. They just don’t rip you off as well. Sorry you prefer lossy high resolution for more money. Apple Music is superior in every way. Keep drinking that Kool Aid!
OMG what does Dolby Atmos, Sony 360, and videos have to with anything?.. why are you butt-hurt? Seriously nothing he said was wrong at all and kept to the subject...
Tidal sucks, period. I had Tidal for a long time, but got very sick of it's "masters" sounding no different to Spottily and NOT CD quality by any stretch. Anyone with quality, resolving speakers can hear it.
Did you read the title, as in what the video was actually about? "High Resolution and Lossless Music"... He's talking about 'bits' (ones and zeros) not sound-stage.
@@nicholasgilbert4227 My interest is in surround sound. I have a 5.1 surround setup with two Adam A77X monitors, three Adam A7X monitors, and a sub out of a Focusrite 18i20 3rd gen interface. I can clearly hear the difference between Spotify and Tidal. It's actually Spotify that doesn't sound as good as Tidal when you hear it through a calibrated system.
@@TheRealAudioProfessor Oh wow, another Apple fan boi. Sorry I upset you Professor Pessimist. Maybe you should rethink putting your "public face" on UA-cam since you don't seem to be any good at making friends or public relations on the world wide stage. It's no big deal though, it's only the world watching you sabotage yourself.
@@andynonimuss6298 if your interest is in surround why are you here?
Calibrated or not is entirely irrelevant if the source is lacking.. lol
I've done comparisons between tidal and CD i own and the difference is there. Even though it shouldn't be.
Anyway, again you're missing the point, the subject matter here is HighRes and lossless audio. Not surround.
Do you go to a Car video and complain it didn't mention bicycles?
😂
😆
they all suck for one reason or another. Tidal is the most rip off. Qobuz doesn't have enough techno/electronic music. Bandcamp has good selection. Amazon HD music has a ridiculously annoying interface. Apple sucks at making recommendation or suggesting similar songs; it just gets stuck on the artist without continuing to play related music, like UA-cam Music does and is actually pretty good at. Deezer electronic selection sucks, and it's minimalistic interface is stupid. Spotify has the best algorithm, but the quality is only pretty good, without CD quality. Soundcloud is best for electronic music, though quality is only subpar. Mixcloud has great selection, but extremely annoying to use. 1001tracklists is great, free, same quality as most lossy ones, and is free. Tidal sounds about as good, if not worse than, SoundCloud. Apple for me is the best price, but has a lot of shortcomings. Apple is too revenue focused.
Apple has no hi res music they are sending lossy AAC to your device you need ATV to get lossless music otherwise your are getting 350 kbps AAC lossy apple refuses to enable Lossless audio through airplay 2 for whatever reason.
Not true! I have Apple Music and it works easiest with IOS device. My Yamaha receiver and streamer shows me the data/file.
Wasn't joe rogan right about the jab?
Who exactly is on their 4th 5th 6th vax here?
If not your against the science 😅
Did you just insinuate that TIDAL isn't high quality? Well, well. So why did WHAT HI-FI call TIDAL the best high quality streaming service 5 years in a row?
Geeee, I WONDER WHY? Also, Qobuz is by far and away the best service for high quality, with no MQA bullshit
😂
I wouldn't call. Flac For lossless At least not the ones you'll find on the Pirate Bay. it simply doesn't sound like original CD
great review ! super clear, thank you,
I have the Tidal top tier and the file format (according to the app) is:
"16 bit 44,1KHZ FLAC" for high and
"24 bit 44,1-88,2KHZ FLAC" and sometimes MQA for Master/Max quality.
There is a noticeable sound quality improvement versus Spotify and YT Music on my Bose QC ii (wired) playing off a Samsung S10+ (I know, not ideal).
Can you comment? Should I still change apps and switch to Qobuz (I do not want to support The Big Four)?
Lmao
Changing from your phone to ANYTHING else would be a bigger step in sound quality.
@@sanji663 For mobile use, it's what's there. At home I have a Marantz and Jamo setup.
I considered an attachable dac from Audioquest but haven't gone down the rabbit hole. Also slightly inconvenient but still doable.
@The Audio Professor so with Apple Music streaming through bluetooth in my car via aftermarket radio is the music still lossless or just through usb?
Here I am, no theories or professor, a paid super-hearer who evaluates 16 million dollar violins. LOSSY as F. Every recording is a loss, and I would also add, an add. In the end you can do ear training but your soul has the answers and red carpet. You will KNOW when what you hear gives you joy.
Bluetooth doesn't have enough bandwidth for High-Rez Audio, but you mentioned "lossless" (CD quality) specifically and I think that *might* be possible via Bluetooth. But bear in mind that Amazon and Apple can both stream *better* quality than lossless, usually, and you can't get that with Bluetooth.
@@OldMister got you... I went with tidal and using a topping unit and DSP for source in my car.