Thanks Vlad, your vids have changed my mind about EAA. I've always (and still do) privilege the galactic & extra-galactic photons to hit my retinal and nervous system directly through the eyepiece, but I've come to appreciate that EAA has its own place in astronomy too. Cheers from 49.81° N, M
Thanks, Vlad! I'm an oldster visual amateur who was overwhelmed by all the astrophotography tech. I swore I'd never try to get into the photography side. I want to really see the image with my eyes. BUT! You've demonstrated how easily one can make very good images with minimal tech. And M57 is one of my favorite objects to observe. So, ive ordered the ZWO 122 and downloaded the Sharpcap software. Thanks to you I will be having some fun experimenting! Your content is always interesting. Never boring.
Thanks for the video. I've been considering trying EAA for a while. I have a 5" go-to SCT and a Windows laptop so all I need is the astro camera. The ASI 224MC is on sale today for $150 some places. The ASI 178MC is $250 on sale.
Hi Vlad, is there a camera you would recommend for EAA, priced between the ASI224MC and ASI294MC. I'd be using it on my Celestron 5SE, and perhaps my 4" refractor. If you'd still recommend the ASI224MC for a beginner (which I am!), then please say so...
Well if your talking new prices, the only one I'd recommend is the ASI 533MC Pro. Still $800. You can easily get a used 294MC pro for less than that though.
Well, I already had it focused for the camera before I started recording the video. I did have footage that I was going to include that showed how to center the object, and how to focus but decided to leave out that portion since the video was already too long. Lol. If there is interest I can post it as a basic SharpCap tutorial.
@@AVTAstroyeah I think you need to do a little video on how to focus. I got myself a little starter cam (ASI585) and when popping its nose into the diagonal, there is quite a bit of focus twiddling as the chip is deeper inside that my EP lens. What do you do to focus the camera? It seems possible - just a lot of twiddling looking at the screen. Wonder if one of those bahtinov masks would help? (But then I have a floppy dew shield on and presume it has to be precisely centered? Quite excited to try this EAA stuff. (Wifey was impressed with your slide off observatory btw - particularly the bit where the camera rises through the roof! I got clearance to build one 😮. I do like my 2” EPs and can’t see a flipper at moment.
I've watched again to pick up details of your description. You really got me to 1 step beyond visual. If I use a 6.3 reducer on my 8" sct, do I need spacers to get focus? Also what if I use a 2" diagonal? My 8 SCT won't focus a 2" diagonal.
Well an SCR should focus with just a 2" diagonal. If your talking about using the f/6.3 reducer with a 2" diagonal then it may not focus. But you would not want to use the f/6.3 reducer with a 2" diagonal anyhow. A 2" diagonal will easily get you the MAX FOV possible out of an SCT. There is absolutely ZERO reason to use the f/6.3 reducer for visual if you have the correct eyepieces.
@AVTAstro You're right that the 2" diagonal makes no difference in fov, IF i'm using just 1.25 eps, or the ASI224mc camera. But I have a 2" diagonal because I have some 2" WF eps, which DO give me better fov with a 6.3 reducer. I've been talking with my supplier, and they're setting me up with proper spacers (cheap) so I can focus with the Baader click-lock 2" diagonal in the train, with or without the reducer. It's just a "visual" thing. Not relevant to EAA. The camera can be used straight through. Apparently, your Meade focuses with the 1.25 diagonal...with or without the 6.3 reducer. My Celestron C8 f/10 probably will, too. Cheers!
You did not understand me correctly. A 2" diagonal is beneficial on an SCT if your using 2" eyepices. Adding a .63 reducer with your 2" diagonal and eyepices unfortunately does not give you any advantage at all. With the .63 reducer you are going to have fairly severe vignetting the wider the eyepice. Essentially the rear opening on an SCT is just not large enough to get a wider FOV than what a 2" 30mm 82*(or equivalent other eyepiece that about maximizes the FOV of the 2" formfactor). So again to clarify, unless you sticking to 1.25" eyepieces a .63 reducer is not required at all.
Great video, between you and another youtuber, I have purchased a 8-inch evolution, a t178 camera, a 6.3 focal reducer that's on its way. I noticed you don't talk much about back focus and the need to put extensions and things to get the proper back focus. But this video shows that you are getting some good images without it. So you feel for casual EAA that it's okay not to put all the extensions needed to get on the proper back focus? Thanks
Well that was kind of yhe point of the video. I wanted to show that all the technical detail, is just that technical stuff that for EAA makes little diffrance with a small sensor size camera. If you using a full frame sensor, then yes you would need all the proper spacing IF using a field flattener. If there is no flattener then then there is no spacing needed as long as your getting to focus. Like I said in the video using a diagonal like I was is certainly not ideal, but even with that I was having a great time doing EAA on that night and feel like I was getting great results!
@@AVTAstro And just to make sure I am reading rite, you are saying if I use the 6.3 focal reducer, I will probably need the spacing using the 178 camera correct? Or should I first still see if I can achieve focus?Should I try to focus in day like you advised on telephone pole or tree? thanks.
@@AVTAstro I took my set up out last night. did alignment using the camera, and tried to pull in andromeda, with and without the focal reducer, I could not see anything and played around quite a bit with gain and exposure and boost effects. Then tried livestacking and I had a warning bar come up at the top telling me not aligned, no frames were stacking. I was pretty happy though with some jupiter and saturn viewing so I know I am going to have some growing pains....Let me know if you have any suggestions on correcting alignment. I aligned using wifi, sky safari pro 6. I have never used the hand controller yet...thanks again!
Thanks a lot. Very useful. I have 8" SCT but never tracks!! I am still taking my time and enjoy visual astronomy. Do you reckon a modern ZWO (with large censor) would give me decent basic DSO photos? Even without tracking nor auto guiding? If yes then which astronomy camera you recommend? Many many thanks.
OK thank you again. Appreciate your support. Not sure why my AltAz Celestron Goto 8" SCT never tracks!! Though I take it to Bortle 1 skies, tripod alignement and auto aligner... etc :(
Apologies I am asking too much, what if I take only short exposures? Like 6s or 8s max? I have done this before with my current 8" SCT. 10 sec single frame and got very good image using a mobile phone!! I think using limited short exposures and a ZWO can get me something with the aid of Sharpcap live stacking?? Thanks a lot again
Even a 1sec exposure will show star trails.... Your phone cameras lens focal length is probably under 10mm. Your SCT focal length is 2000mm. You do the math at how much more accurate the tracking needs to be;)
I have been hesitant to wade into the AP pool because of the inherent cost. I have friends that are $15,000 into AP with various scopes and cameras. This would seem to be a good starting point. I have an 8" Meade SCT, an AVX mount, and a ES80ED Triplet that I can use to get started. Which would you suggest to start with?
I would start with the ES80ED on the AVX. Wide FOV and very forgiving on the tracking! And no you do not need to $15k to do AP. But that can easily be said for any hobby. Some people can go to Walmart, buy a $30 fishing pole and be plenty happy catching a fish. Some people need a $70k fishing boat and $15k of fishing wear to be happy catching the same fish.... 😎 This video is showing people that the $30 pole equipment exists for AP!!!
How do you like this simple eaa method vs say the evscope? I have a 6” SCT which is good for planetary but not so much for DSO as you know and trying to decide if getting a camera and laptop to swap into the diagonal when I want to “see” what the eye can’t would be the way to go OR go with an used unistellar (equinox or equinox 2)
Truth be told, your 6" SCT with a decent camera will give you much better results then the all-in-one EAA scope. It is a lot more work to set it up and get everything working though.
@@AVTAstro - thanks. I’m more interested in pure eaa so not as worried about the best picture quality so seeing your video made this look pretty easy but for me the ease of use of one of the smart telescopes is what makes me interested in them. As easy as you make it look here I guess there’s the swapping from eyepiece to camera, laptop, & chair and table as well as the sharpcam app so not as fast or easy as the smart scopes. More to think about. Thanks for the reply. Enjoy your videos and channel!
To do Sharpcap you need something with at Windows on it, so most tablets will not work. I will say that around here you can usually pick up a used laptop at a pawn shop for the price of a cheap tablet.
Part 2 of this video is live! It's a brief demonstration of how to use Sharpcap to easily get great images! ua-cam.com/video/176TFPtzIXM/v-deo.html
Thanks Vlad, your vids have changed my mind about EAA. I've always (and still do) privilege the galactic & extra-galactic photons to hit my retinal and nervous system directly through the eyepiece, but I've come to appreciate that EAA has its own place in astronomy too.
Cheers from 49.81° N,
M
Great to hear! I too prefer pure visual for the most part, but EAA just lets you go so much deeper into DOS's!
Thanks, Vlad! I'm an oldster visual amateur who was overwhelmed by all the astrophotography tech. I swore I'd never try to get into the photography side. I want to really see the image with my eyes.
BUT! You've demonstrated how easily one can make very good images with minimal tech. And M57 is one of my favorite objects to observe. So, ive ordered the ZWO 122 and downloaded the Sharpcap software. Thanks to you I will be having some fun experimenting!
Your content is always interesting. Never boring.
Very cool, I hope you have fun with EAA! I see EAA a lot closer to visual then astrophotography. 👍
I just started doing planetary imaging and EAA and found that the ASI585MC to be excellent for both.
Very cool! I'm sure that these newer ASI cameras are even better than what I showed in this video.
@@AVTAstro The 585 has a larger sensor but can still attain a high frame rate for planetary.
Thank for posting this video. Very usefull for me, and not to long.
You're welcome! Thanks for the feedback. Trueth be told I had more footage that I decided to keep out to keep the video length down... LOL.
Thanks for the video. I've been considering trying EAA for a while. I have a 5" go-to SCT and a Windows laptop so all I need is the astro camera. The ASI 224MC is on sale today for $150 some places. The ASI 178MC is $250 on sale.
Very cool, I'd hop on those deals👍
Utilizing EAA makes it easier to share the hooby with others.
Quite true!
Hi Vlad, is there a camera you would recommend for EAA, priced between the ASI224MC and ASI294MC. I'd be using it on my Celestron 5SE, and perhaps my 4" refractor. If you'd still recommend the ASI224MC for a beginner (which I am!), then please say so...
Well if your talking new prices, the only one I'd recommend is the ASI 533MC Pro. Still $800. You can easily get a used 294MC pro for less than that though.
Can you see to focus in SharpCap if it is off a bit? I liked the way you just dropped the camera in - same focus as EP?
Well, I already had it focused for the camera before I started recording the video. I did have footage that I was going to include that showed how to center the object, and how to focus but decided to leave out that portion since the video was already too long. Lol.
If there is interest I can post it as a basic SharpCap tutorial.
@@AVTAstroyeah I think you need to do a little video on how to focus. I got myself a little starter cam (ASI585) and when popping its nose into the diagonal, there is quite a bit of focus twiddling as the chip is deeper inside that my EP lens. What do you do to focus the camera? It seems possible - just a lot of twiddling looking at the screen. Wonder if one of those bahtinov masks would help? (But then I have a floppy dew shield on and presume it has to be precisely centered? Quite excited to try this EAA stuff. (Wifey was impressed with your slide off observatory btw - particularly the bit where the camera rises through the roof! I got clearance to build one 😮. I do like my 2” EPs and can’t see a flipper at moment.
I've watched again to pick up details of your description. You really got me to 1 step beyond visual.
If I use a 6.3 reducer on my 8" sct, do I need spacers to get focus? Also what if I use a 2" diagonal? My 8 SCT won't focus a 2" diagonal.
Well an SCR should focus with just a 2" diagonal. If your talking about using the f/6.3 reducer with a 2" diagonal then it may not focus. But you would not want to use the f/6.3 reducer with a 2" diagonal anyhow. A 2" diagonal will easily get you the MAX FOV possible out of an SCT. There is absolutely ZERO reason to use the f/6.3 reducer for visual if you have the correct eyepieces.
@AVTAstro You're right that the 2" diagonal makes no difference in fov, IF i'm using just 1.25 eps, or the ASI224mc camera. But I have a 2" diagonal because I have some 2" WF eps, which DO give me better fov with a 6.3 reducer. I've been talking with my supplier, and they're setting me up with proper spacers (cheap) so I can focus with the Baader click-lock 2" diagonal in the train, with or without the reducer. It's just a "visual" thing. Not relevant to EAA. The camera can be used straight through. Apparently, your Meade focuses with the 1.25 diagonal...with or without the 6.3 reducer. My Celestron C8 f/10 probably will, too.
Cheers!
You did not understand me correctly. A 2" diagonal is beneficial on an SCT if your using 2" eyepices. Adding a .63 reducer with your 2" diagonal and eyepices unfortunately does not give you any advantage at all. With the .63 reducer you are going to have fairly severe vignetting the wider the eyepice. Essentially the rear opening on an SCT is just not large enough to get a wider FOV than what a 2" 30mm 82*(or equivalent other eyepiece that about maximizes the FOV of the 2" formfactor).
So again to clarify, unless you sticking to 1.25" eyepieces a .63 reducer is not required at all.
@AVTAstro This is a visual astronomy discussion and I'm sorry I started it in an EAA setting. My bad for going off topic.
Great video, between you and another youtuber, I have purchased a 8-inch evolution, a t178 camera, a 6.3 focal reducer that's on its way. I noticed you don't talk much about back focus and the need to put extensions and things to get the proper back focus. But this video shows that you are getting some good images without it. So you feel for casual EAA that it's okay not to put all the extensions needed to get on the proper back focus? Thanks
Well that was kind of yhe point of the video. I wanted to show that all the technical detail, is just that technical stuff that for EAA makes little diffrance with a small sensor size camera. If you using a full frame sensor, then yes you would need all the proper spacing IF using a field flattener. If there is no flattener then then there is no spacing needed as long as your getting to focus. Like I said in the video using a diagonal like I was is certainly not ideal, but even with that I was having a great time doing EAA on that night and feel like I was getting great results!
@@AVTAstro YT Thank you sir and thanks for all your great videos!
@@AVTAstro And just to make sure I am reading rite, you are saying if I use the 6.3 focal reducer, I will probably need the spacing using the 178 camera correct? Or should I first still see if I can achieve focus?Should I try to focus in day like you advised on telephone pole or tree? thanks.
With an SCT you will be able to reach focus just fine even with the .63 reducer.
@@AVTAstro I took my set up out last night. did alignment using the camera, and tried to pull in andromeda, with and without the focal reducer, I could not see anything and played around quite a bit with gain and exposure and boost effects. Then tried livestacking and I had a warning bar come up at the top telling me not aligned, no frames were stacking. I was pretty happy though with some jupiter and saturn viewing so I know I am going to have some growing pains....Let me know if you have any suggestions on correcting alignment. I aligned using wifi, sky safari pro 6. I have never used the hand controller yet...thanks again!
Thanks!
Glad the video was helpful! Thanks a lot for the Super Thanks!
@@AVTAstro are you on CloudyNights? Would really appreciate you looking over my little saga
Sure am. I'm on there as AVT-Astro. Send me a PM on CN I'd be glad to take a look!
Thanks a lot. Very useful. I have 8" SCT but never tracks!! I am still taking my time and enjoy visual astronomy. Do you reckon a modern ZWO (with large censor) would give me decent basic DSO photos? Even without tracking nor auto guiding? If yes then which astronomy camera you recommend? Many many thanks.
Sorry to say but tracking is a must. Otherwise all you will capture is star trails.
OK thank you again. Appreciate your support. Not sure why my AltAz Celestron Goto 8" SCT never tracks!! Though I take it to Bortle 1 skies, tripod alignement and auto aligner... etc :(
Apologies I am asking too much, what if I take only short exposures? Like 6s or 8s max? I have done this before with my current 8" SCT. 10 sec single frame and got very good image using a mobile phone!! I think using limited short exposures and a ZWO can get me something with the aid of Sharpcap live stacking?? Thanks a lot again
Even a 1sec exposure will show star trails.... Your phone cameras lens focal length is probably under 10mm. Your SCT focal length is 2000mm. You do the math at how much more accurate the tracking needs to be;)
I have been hesitant to wade into the AP pool because of the inherent cost. I have friends that are $15,000 into AP with various scopes and cameras. This would seem to be a good starting point. I have an 8" Meade SCT, an AVX mount, and a ES80ED Triplet that I can use to get started. Which would you suggest to start with?
I would start with the ES80ED on the AVX. Wide FOV and very forgiving on the tracking! And no you do not need to $15k to do AP. But that can easily be said for any hobby. Some people can go to Walmart, buy a $30 fishing pole and be plenty happy catching a fish. Some people need a $70k fishing boat and $15k of fishing wear to be happy catching the same fish.... 😎
This video is showing people that the $30 pole equipment exists for AP!!!
How do you like this simple eaa method vs say the evscope? I have a 6” SCT which is good for planetary but not so much for DSO as you know and trying to decide if getting a camera and laptop to swap into the diagonal when I want to “see” what the eye can’t would be the way to go OR go with an used unistellar (equinox or equinox 2)
Truth be told, your 6" SCT with a decent camera will give you much better results then the all-in-one EAA scope. It is a lot more work to set it up and get everything working though.
@@AVTAstro - thanks. I’m more interested in pure eaa so not as worried about the best picture quality so seeing your video made this look pretty easy but for me the ease of use of one of the smart telescopes is what makes me interested in them. As easy as you make it look here I guess there’s the swapping from eyepiece to camera, laptop, & chair and table as well as the sharpcam app so not as fast or easy as the smart scopes. More to think about. Thanks for the reply. Enjoy your videos and channel!
Glad that the videos are helpful! In regard to simplicity, then yes, the EAA scopes are no contest better!
I no longer have a laptop, suppose I could buy a cheaper tablet, would that work?
For EAA any laptop really. For AP you need much more processing power, 16GB minimum.
To do Sharpcap you need something with at Windows on it, so most tablets will not work. I will say that around here you can usually pick up a used laptop at a pawn shop for the price of a cheap tablet.
@@AVTAstro Like an old Windows 7, will that work?
Not sure about Windows 7. I use Windows 10. But you can check the Sharpcap requirements to be sure.
Yup.
Cool!
Thanks!
Thanks so much for the Super! Much appreciated!