Does Estonia know that you'll never leave France for them? Seriously though, it's super cool that you get direct access from both of these governments.
Honestly, Ian needs a hookup with some Asian governments. Setting aside Malaysia (which has a kinda boring list of issued small arms) and China (yeah, not gonna happen), places Indonesia, Taiwan, Japan, or Korea have made their own spin on assault rifles that honestly deserve some attention.
@@rustys.1070 I can make a laundry list of combat rifles I'd ditch for an M14. Granted, I can also make a laundry list of combat rifles I'd rather have. But all things considered, a well maintained M14 is a perfectly serviceable rifle at normal engagement distances.
In the US Navy I cut my teeth & qualified as a Marksman on the M14. From absolutely zero shooting experience to Marksman in one day on the range with a USMC instructor. He told me if I had one more day to train on the range he thought I'd qualify Expert. Very good rifle IMHO.
Nearly everyone that has been issued a M14 loves them and has nothing but good things to say of them. Most civilian owners also feel the same, and have no problems at all from this so called "problem child"
@@hytekrednekbama4400 The only major problem with it (relative to most of the other battle rifles of its generation) was the ridiculously long, convoluted, and expensive development process that meant it was borderline obsolete by the time that it started entering service large numbers. Other than that, it's a perfectly good rifle that it's fashionable to hate because 'Fudds' (whatever that actually means these days) are supposed to like it.
Some soldiers called it the 'musket' because of it's length compared to the new XM-16E1s/M-16s. Ironically 40 years later in Afghanistan, American soldiers thought the Afghans M-16A2s were excessively long compared to our M-4s.
There is a back story as to how Estonia ended up with 40k M-14’s. A certain ex US army Lt. Col. that was “consulting” the Estonian army after the fall of the Soviet Union was told the Estonian Army wanted anything but Soviet arms, and Germany was queasy about supplying G3’s. Clinton administration was going full bore with Operation Captain Crunch and literally hundreds of thousands of M-14’s were being crushed courtesy of the American Taxpayer. When he floated the idea of the US “donating” 40k M-14’s, the Estonians jumped at the idea, and thus the M14 became their standard service rifle.
"Anything but soviet" Dang, they had to be really ticked to replace existing arsenals like that. Or did the Russians take all their stuff home with them and that added to the resentment made them go full NATO?
Hm, bit of an exaggeration to say it became our "standard" service rifle. IIRC from my conscript time in the Guards Btn, the M-14 was in service as a "standard issue" rifle for less than three years and even then it was one of two "standard issue" rifles alongside Soviet AKs. There just weren't enough M-14s to go around if the worst happened and the reserve actually had to be mobilised, so some units still needed to train on the Soviet AKs. In the early 2000s, both the M-14 and the older Soviet rifles were pulled from standard service as the Swedish AK-4 and (a few years later) the Galil AR were obtained and entered service in sufficient quantities to meet the needs of the Estonian Defense Force. Finishing that transition quickly was an important requirement for joining NATO by 2004. The Soviet AKs were pulled from service entirely and were either gone or in permanent storage, while the M-14 remained in service as a ceremonial and DMR weapon. Mostly the former, meaning the Guards Btn (i.e, my unit) responsible for all the ceremonial duties had the most training and instruction involving the M-14, outside of the designated marksmen that went on foreign deployments with the professional military.
@@midnightslasher6049BF3 SV98 MENTIONED RAHHHHHHHHHHHH o and anyone noticed psa just dropped new m1a literally right as forgotten weapons uploaded this coincidence????😂
I definitely need more coffee; I read the title next to the thumbnail as "_Elbonia's_ Much Better Sniper"... which would be a completely different video.
If it works, only costs $15 per part, and it'd cost you $200 per part to make it yourself - it's not a bad idea to just go with the cheapo generic, commonly-available thing.
@@EtherFox I'm not sure; I think I'd want to do something clever like affix a self-adhesive moleskin pad to the upper curve, just to give a surface that's _not_ bare (or enameled) metal when you have to shoot it in the middle of winter, to minimize the chance of freezing your cheek to the riser.
TY Ian. I recall the history of the M-14 , an how it shafted the US out of the FN -NATO standard battle rifle, but maybe this is the best , last gasp of a job before scrapping. Many superior FAL designs have been scrapped since then too, so "back to the fire from whence ye came" is logical.
Gotta love modernizing in '08 ending in a tacticool M14 lol. I'm glad it got use out of the states so late in its life, it's a damn fine work horse of a rifle.
@@jic1Bullshit. All the other cold war rifles had to shoot 3-4 MOA groups. Even the wartime production Garands are more accurate at 4 MOA. The M14 was supposed to match that accuracy but it didn't because it sucks.
The Estonians would very much prefer to be clearly distinguished form the Elbonians. Despite a similar starting point, of systemic corruption and nepotistic spread of incompetence, the Estonians have made effective and impressive strides towards an actually working society. I had the good fortune of training two batches of them in the mid to late 90s, and I saw them serve in Bosnia and Kosovo. I can attest that I would rather have an Estonian have my back in combat than any of our central/western Europe allies.
Be fair to our Baltic friends! Ebonia is in the Caucasus, certainly, with Scott Adams mixing Armenian heads, Azeri stature, Dagestani dress, and AT&T attitudes. 😁
I've always really liked the M14 as a rifle never owned one but when i got to give them a go it was fun. Maybe it's the memory when I was a little kid of listening to My dad and his guys sitting around our house lamenting the loss of their M14's and complaining about their M16's.
I ran a TRW bolt in a Norinco receiver. Likely the best of two world - old style forged steel receiver at an affordable price with the precision of a lapped bolt. The upgrade from Norincos bolt was my single best upgrade - went from 3 MOA to shy above 1 MOA. Still an aweful rifle though but fun out of a gunsmith perspective. Sold it before the final upgrade (stainless Criterion barrel). At 1 MOA it's a $4000 rifle.
I might own that rifle lol. I bought a Norinco with a trw bolt in it. Gi wood stock and some sort of scope mount that I can't figure out the manufacturer
An addition: amongst all Chinese crap there is - Norinco steel forge are said to be made on old Springfield machinery with old school Springfield quality. Then Springfield switched to crapium. So it would be a good substitue if you can find any. Other Norinco M14 parts are crap - uneven steel quality, inch thread with metric profiles and all kinds of stupid shit.
@@Yungnarcolepsy Unlikely unless you live in Sweden (besides I sold mine with a full VLTOR kit). Norinco bolts are aweful. They dont lap but grind them, not uncommonly to dangerous headspace specs. So everyone caring about their eyes and cheek should replace with no delay. As TRW is the cream de la cream, I'd say many have upgraded their bolts to TRW. The most common mount is ARMS. If it looks like that but no markings, it is the knockoff of that, what it came with shipped from China.
The Chinese op rods are forged steel and the trigger group are comparable to gi as well. Only weak point in the pre 94 Chinese m14s were the bolt and some had spacing issues. But chrome lined barrels and the forged receivers are better than anything Springfield puts out.
Going from the TP1's scope to a Schmidt and Bender is a MASSIVE upgrade...too bad they weren't able to change the platform it was mounted on, but still.
I think it would be cool to see some choate machine and tool products reviewed. They are all but forgotten outside of some manufacturers and importers. They make some really decent gear and while some of the stovks are getting pricey for the lack of external features like picatinny rails out front ,they are simple and rugged and do a very good job . Their bolt action chassis's are very strong and rigid. They have some great "bubba parts" that require no modifications to the guns they go on. Most of their stuff is made of high density polymer overmoulded steel or aluminum.
For all the talk about M-14'ss having problems and breaking, I can only remember one extractor flying out in twenty years, and that was with a blank. No magazine failures at all, unlike the M-16 series rifles.
It does seem interesting how often weapons end up being 'This would have been amazing... If it had been deployed when they asked for development to start' or 'The core idea is great but the technology just wasn't quite there yet'. Then there's also the cases of 'They decided to reach for the sky and whilst they didn't make it, some of the innovations or quirks they developed to solve the lack are quite interesting'. But most painful of all and is the case seemingly with the M14... 'They developed a brilliant weapon and unfortunately completely screwed up the doctrine regarding it's use'.
18 днів тому+1
Another cool video from living guncyklopedia Ian. Happy new Year
I find it fascinating seeing arsenals evolve in smaller countries with much more modest budgets and minimal domestic production. You end up seeing things like M-14s getting second chances at life into the 21st century and seeing the different modifications to try and modernize them until much more modern equipment becomes available and that's just really interesting.
Thank you Dr. Ian for one more historical gun. Again, why Discovery Channel or History Channel don't make a show with this gentleman? He's the most qualified person to talk about gun history!!!
@0num4 you are correct, unfortunately! But he deserves his show on one of those channels, or other channels! But the people who control those channels prefer trash shows instead of good and educational purposes history! 👍
Ians father was actually a regular on the history channel series "tales of the gun" back in the 90s. I miss old history channel, but thankfully most of their OG content is easy to find online.
For the deflector's placement, my best guess is that in order to fulfill the role of a sniper's rifle, they wanted to make sure ejected shell casings weren't giving away the shooter's position; and so with the deflector positioned the way it is, the ejected casings likely get redirected into the dirt (or at least at a very sharp downward angle so they don't get seen popping up and reflecting sunrays out of an otherwise great sniper hide).
It's a pic rail first - so it was designed to be modular for whatever different scopes could ever be mounted to it. Different scopes with different lengths of pull, and different center locations. Estonia wasn't going to procure a custom, scope-specific mount when they could purchase and stock one that already exists.
There is a gun that i would love to see on this channel! The OTs-38 Stechkin. Maybe you already have a video on that? 🤔 It seems like an very odd revolver and cartridge! Maybe in wrong but it seems very interesting in my opinion :) btw love the channel and been watching for many years!
Nice Doctor Who shout out. But Ian films several videos on the same trip then intersperses them with other videos. He says it is for variety and to prevent people getting bored, I say it is for this "time travel" like effect.
Very cool video, Ian. I think Ukrainian troops were able to fing the optic on their own. NF, or something less pricy as bushnell or vortex etc. Just what can sustain recoil power. Thanks once again
There were still sealed steel "spam" cans full of brand new WW2 production 1911s when the GWOT began in 2001. They probably still have warehouses full of new 1903, 1917, and Garand rifles as well.
I in no way see the point of offsetting the scope mount rail and adding that brass deflector.... I have a M-14 (semi) and have never had any problems with any of the 'normal' scope mounts....
It was probably less about protecting the scope knob and more about preventing the brass from popping up,reflecting the Sun,and exposing ones' position,a theory someone else has put out.
I’d take one. I’ve been wanting an M14 but modernized where it has a pic rail on top for optics and either Mlok or quad rail handguard for other accessories. Would love to set one up for thermal and NV fun. I’ve been wanting to do a DMR set up for night time fun. Been leaning towards some sort of AR10 but can’t make up my mind. I definitely want a semi automatic rifle. Bolt actions are nice but I like having the option to dump a mag if need be without racking between each round.
As a long time Mini-14 user… I’d bet that brass deflector is in place to prevent ejected casings from chewing away at the windage turret on “tactical” scopes. I had a Nikon (RIP) tactical scope on my Mini. It was the same as their hunting scopes but with larger/taller turrets. These turrets would get the snot beat out of it by casings flying out of my ranch rifle at Mach 10. The Mini was clearly a bit overgassed at the time (I later found out Ruger did purposely to enhance reliability) this so I switched down to just irons to save my scope. Curious if these rifles suffered a similar problem… thus leading to the inclusion of a brass deflector.
That deflector plate seems fairly crude, and given the need from the the mounting holes to be drilled and tapped I am surprised it wouldn’t have been cheaper to make the a more complex deflector which could slide into the rail and then clip into place.
Forgotten Weapons is not totally blocked from ad revenue - I used to get ads on the majority of videos - it is that many of the subjects have run a foul of the algorithms... dislike for gun content. This is such a bare bones "description" video with almost nothing about function or manufacturing - it should definitely be monetized.
Ian has specifically stated in the past that he willingly demonetized his channel after a few incidents... so, this is probably UA-cam screwing with him again.
M-14 very reliable. I notice the handguard was not relieved in front of the receiver and was not floated off the stock so it looks like no accurizing done . US pulled them out got the mothballs off them and used them in afghan where nobody complained about them
Is there anywhere I can get started on reading up on the "older model US surplus is current year modernization" phenomena. I know its done all over but I have no idea about when or how it started and the intricacies of distribution of models.
Maybe one of those in between weapons of significant conflict abroad.. I always liked the look and function of the M14, made only partially famous by the "A-Team".
Just like Ian is "fluent" in French? lol The Finnish (Uralic) language group does not share much in common with other "Western" languages, even though it is written in Latin characters.
Ww1 called it wants its offset sniper scopes back, jokes aside its a pretty weird way to mount a scope to an m14 considering theres the sage (i think its called that) mounts
the reason for the deflector was to make sure the ejecting shells don't fly up and nail the scope, do I think its necessary? not really but I have never shot a m14 or more importantly a m14 tp2.
There were teething issues but every rifle has though. Main issue is that it really wasn’t that much of an improvement over the Garand yet required an entire redoing of industrial capacity to make it.
It's the development cycle really, made what should have been a low-budget, simple BM59-style Garand conversion into a long, expensive mess. Also you get a lot of 'I hate the M14 because Fudds'.
@@baneofbanesThe M14 was chosen after the trials, against the FAL BTW, because they lied about how much of the tooling used to make the Garand could also be used to make the M14.
@ yep. Damn shame really, for both rifles. The FAL is an excellent rifle, and you can convert the M1 Garand to basically be a M14 like the Italians did with with the BM59.
I have a rail for my M1A That sits centrally. It Connects at the barrel and again at the stripper clip mount. You do need to remove the stripper guide but who uses that with magazines anyway? My rail doesnt block the spent casings from ejecting properly although its likely a bit heavier than this rail
The M14, despite its flaws, is still a fantastic rifle system. Certainly much better as a precision rifle than a service/battle rifle. If it came to a tough decision I'd still take my M16A2, but only if I knew the 5.56mm cartridge would do the trick. Otherwise, the M14 would be my first choice.
No, no it's not. The M14 is an awful rifle system, because of its flaws. Even from a precision rifle standpoint, the amount of time, effort, and money that has to go into one to make it semi-viable makes it a nonstarter for anyone with access to anything better. You'd spend half-as-much money on a quality AR-10 and optic combination for a much more accurate and robust rifle system capable of sub-moa accuracy. What the M14 is, though, is a visually appealing rifle, and enjoyable operating system but lets not confuse those with being synonymous with "fantastic", because the M14 has never been and never will be "fantastic".
What flaws? I did RVN '66-'67 1st Mar Div 0311, from July '66 till about Feb. '67 I carried an M-14, it never let me down, Feb. '67 we got issued M-16's, after about a month we started to have "problems" with the M-16's a lot of us "procured" pistols of one sort or another, as back up weapons, so, what flaws did you read about some where as a "keyboard commando", that leads you to repeat this B.S. here?.
@boondocker7964 The very early M16s had teething issues, some not even due to any problems of the rifle itself but rather supply and training issues, some of which could be even called sabotage. The later versions of the rifle didn't have any of these problems. You didn't see any teething issues with the M14 you were issued because that was long past its teething phase.
Does Estonia know that you'll never leave France for them?
Seriously though, it's super cool that you get direct access from both of these governments.
Here i'm french, and I left France for Estonia x')
Honestly, Ian needs a hookup with some Asian governments. Setting aside Malaysia (which has a kinda boring list of issued small arms) and China (yeah, not gonna happen), places Indonesia, Taiwan, Japan, or Korea have made their own spin on assault rifles that honestly deserve some attention.
@@softcatmonster If only Singapore could hook things up with Ian, get him to do a gun review of the Ultimax 100 and the SAR21/BR21.
@@NelsonwmjSingapore is literally an authoritarian dictatorship....
@@softcatmonster Add Singapore to that list.
It's so cool that after all these years countries and armories are still inviting Ian to cover their history with firearms.
I'd guess the multiple positions of the brass deflector are to move it to allow for mounting different optics in different slots
I was thinking the same thing. Less about deflection effectiveness and more about optics mounting options.
@@bglenn2222yes if flip the scope in the mount front to back and move deflector back one hole that mount would fit
The best TP accessory was TP-toes. They let you sneak into position much more quietly... ^-^
HAH!
Arrrrg 😅!!!
Dad jokes 🤣🤣!!
Kudos!! That was a sneaky good one👍😆😆!
@@johnwhitley2898 You are welcome. I was giggling to myself a good bit before i worked up the nerve to post it. Glad i amused you. ^-^
Groan
I do not know why but I enjoy M14 content more than most other weapon content.
They truly are bad and forgotten weapons
@@rustys.1070 I can make a laundry list of combat rifles I'd ditch for an M14. Granted, I can also make a laundry list of combat rifles I'd rather have. But all things considered, a well maintained M14 is a perfectly serviceable rifle at normal engagement distances.
Maybe by 1950s standards
Debatably They kinda look like the most iconic or epitome of what “rifle” brings to mind 🤷🏻♂️
In the US Navy I cut my teeth & qualified as a Marksman on the M14.
From absolutely zero shooting experience to Marksman in one day on the range with a USMC instructor. He told me if I had one more day to train on the range he thought I'd qualify Expert.
Very good rifle IMHO.
I remember the M-14 from 1971. We actually really liked them. Didn't know that the Estonian got 40,000 of them!
Nearly everyone that has been issued a M14 loves them and has nothing but good things to say of them. Most civilian owners also feel the same, and have no problems at all from this so called "problem child"
@@hytekrednekbama4400 The only major problem with it (relative to most of the other battle rifles of its generation) was the ridiculously long, convoluted, and expensive development process that meant it was borderline obsolete by the time that it started entering service large numbers. Other than that, it's a perfectly good rifle that it's fashionable to hate because 'Fudds' (whatever that actually means these days) are supposed to like it.
Some soldiers called it the 'musket' because of it's length compared to the new XM-16E1s/M-16s. Ironically 40 years later in Afghanistan, American soldiers thought the Afghans M-16A2s were excessively long compared to our M-4s.
Truly terrifying gun when fired unlike the AR.
@@ChaNnArD-mDLol, terrifying… it’s a .308 for Christ’s sakes, not a 105mm.
I'm late, but I like Esti !
Hyvää on...
Te Soomlased tulete siia pidevalt odava õlu ja viina järel. Häid jõule ja head tulevat aastat muide!
There is a back story as to how Estonia ended up with 40k M-14’s. A certain ex US army Lt. Col. that was “consulting” the Estonian army after the fall of the Soviet Union was told the Estonian Army wanted anything but Soviet arms, and Germany was queasy about supplying G3’s. Clinton administration was going full bore with Operation Captain Crunch and literally hundreds of thousands of M-14’s were being crushed courtesy of the American Taxpayer. When he floated the idea of the US “donating” 40k M-14’s, the Estonians jumped at the idea, and thus the M14 became their standard service rifle.
"Anything but soviet"
Dang, they had to be really ticked to replace existing arsenals like that. Or did the Russians take all their stuff home with them and that added to the resentment made them go full NATO?
Thanks for this, I did not know that!
So, the M14s were essentially rescue dogs that were about to be euthanized?
Thats pretty clever on Clintons part. Very cheap way to shore up an alliance so close to Russia.
Hm, bit of an exaggeration to say it became our "standard" service rifle. IIRC from my conscript time in the Guards Btn, the M-14 was in service as a "standard issue" rifle for less than three years and even then it was one of two "standard issue" rifles alongside Soviet AKs. There just weren't enough M-14s to go around if the worst happened and the reserve actually had to be mobilised, so some units still needed to train on the Soviet AKs. In the early 2000s, both the M-14 and the older Soviet rifles were pulled from standard service as the Swedish AK-4 and (a few years later) the Galil AR were obtained and entered service in sufficient quantities to meet the needs of the Estonian Defense Force. Finishing that transition quickly was an important requirement for joining NATO by 2004. The Soviet AKs were pulled from service entirely and were either gone or in permanent storage, while the M-14 remained in service as a ceremonial and DMR weapon. Mostly the former, meaning the Guards Btn (i.e, my unit) responsible for all the ceremonial duties had the most training and instruction involving the M-14, outside of the designated marksmen that went on foreign deployments with the professional military.
throughout the years you have brought us all so much joy, thank you and have a happy and healthy new year Ian!
0:39 "We have AWP at home"
thats a funny looking sv98
@@midnightslasher6049BF3 SV98 MENTIONED RAHHHHHHHHHHHH
o and anyone noticed psa just dropped new m1a literally right as forgotten weapons uploaded this coincidence????😂
*"Meil on kodus AWP"
Or idk, финно-угор кылъёс пӧлысь мон удмурт сямен гинэ тодӥсько.
…but AWP is .338 Lapua Magnum AWM rifle not a M14 TP
@@danieljuno810 While the gun in Counter Strike indeed fires .338, that is actually not an AWP which actually fires .308.
I definitely need more coffee; I read the title next to the thumbnail as "_Elbonia's_ Much Better Sniper"... which would be a completely different video.
Most of us did
At least at first glance
The cheek riser doesn't help
many of us did that
Also guilty
I am glad I wasn't the only one.
Elbonia's "much better sniper" is a crossbow.
I am 90% sure that I have bought the same cheek riser off of Amazon
You know, Swiss mount, German scope - they saved some cents on the cheek riser.
If it works, only costs $15 per part, and it'd cost you $200 per part to make it yourself - it's not a bad idea to just go with the cheapo generic, commonly-available thing.
@@EtherFox I'm not sure; I think I'd want to do something clever like affix a self-adhesive moleskin pad to the upper curve, just to give a surface that's _not_ bare (or enameled) metal when you have to shoot it in the middle of winter, to minimize the chance of freezing your cheek to the riser.
@@seanmalloy7249 It looks like it's plastic.
@@seanmalloy7249 Powder coating works "just as well", and they'd be wearing 3 hole ski masks/balaclava's in winter.
the deflector is there to prevent the shell from hitting the scope's knob
Should have resolved that by instead selecting a scope that doesn't have genitalia.
I hate it when spent brass hits my knob too....
@jimmyrustler8983 you're obviously holding it wrong
If it looks stupid, but it works - it's not stupid.
@@StC-j5k And not wearing pants.
lived in estonia for 3 years recently. a better country with greater people you will seldom come across. brilliant place.
It's ok. I guess.
Great so see another video about Estonia
TY Ian. I recall the history of the M-14 , an how it shafted the US out of the FN -NATO standard battle rifle, but maybe this is the best , last gasp of a job before scrapping.
Many superior FAL designs have been scrapped since then too, so "back to the fire from whence ye came" is logical.
Gotta love modernizing in '08 ending in a tacticool M14 lol. I'm glad it got use out of the states so late in its life, it's a damn fine work horse of a rifle.
Yeah I sure love a shifting zero 5,7 MOA "DMR".
@@G-Mastah-Fash You mean like the majority of DMRs/sniper rifles that entered service before the '80s?
@@G-Mastah-FashM14s have never been 7 MOA rifles stop the cap
@@jic1Bullshit. All the other cold war rifles had to shoot 3-4 MOA groups. Even the wartime production Garands are more accurate at 4 MOA. The M14 was supposed to match that accuracy but it didn't because it sucks.
@@jic1
Least history revisionist M14 fanboy:
I am _never_ going to see "Estonia" and not think "Elbonia" first.
Thanks, Ian.
Same. I think the video editor does it on purpose.
It took me a full 30 seconds to realize it wasn't Elbonia.
The Estonians would very much prefer to be clearly distinguished form the Elbonians. Despite a similar starting point, of systemic corruption and nepotistic spread of incompetence, the Estonians have made effective and impressive strides towards an actually working society. I had the good fortune of training two batches of them in the mid to late 90s, and I saw them serve in Bosnia and Kosovo. I can attest that I would rather have an Estonian have my back in combat than any of our central/western Europe allies.
Be fair to our Baltic friends! Ebonia is in the Caucasus, certainly, with Scott Adams mixing Armenian heads, Azeri stature, Dagestani dress, and AT&T attitudes. 😁
I generally associate Elbonia with Albania.
Thank you😊
I've always really liked the M14 as a rifle never owned one but when i got to give them a go it was fun. Maybe it's the memory when I was a little kid of listening to My dad and his guys sitting around our house lamenting the loss of their M14's and complaining about their M16's.
M14 my beloved
Oh wow a TRW M14. So sad we can't buy the receivers here as long as no giggle switch was put on. I hate the rule once a MG , always a MG
I ran a TRW bolt in a Norinco receiver. Likely the best of two world - old style forged steel receiver at an affordable price with the precision of a lapped bolt.
The upgrade from Norincos bolt was my single best upgrade - went from 3 MOA to shy above 1 MOA.
Still an aweful rifle though but fun out of a gunsmith perspective.
Sold it before the final upgrade (stainless Criterion barrel).
At 1 MOA it's a $4000 rifle.
I might own that rifle lol. I bought a Norinco with a trw bolt in it. Gi wood stock and some sort of scope mount that I can't figure out the manufacturer
An addition: amongst all Chinese crap there is - Norinco steel forge are said to be made on old Springfield machinery with old school Springfield quality.
Then Springfield switched to crapium.
So it would be a good substitue if you can find any. Other Norinco M14 parts are crap - uneven steel quality, inch thread with metric profiles and all kinds of stupid shit.
@@Yungnarcolepsy Unlikely unless you live in Sweden (besides I sold mine with a full VLTOR kit).
Norinco bolts are aweful. They dont lap but grind them, not uncommonly to dangerous headspace specs.
So everyone caring about their eyes and cheek should replace with no delay. As TRW is the cream de la cream, I'd say many have upgraded their bolts to TRW.
The most common mount is ARMS. If it looks like that but no markings, it is the knockoff of that, what it came with shipped from China.
The Chinese op rods are forged steel and the trigger group are comparable to gi as well. Only weak point in the pre 94 Chinese m14s were the bolt and some had spacing issues. But chrome lined barrels and the forged receivers are better than anything Springfield puts out.
Smart, simple, utilitarian. A fitting upgrade for an M14.
Please do a video on the Irish Army’s platypus, turducken, FN FAL based DMR Rifle.
Going from the TP1's scope to a Schmidt and Bender is a MASSIVE upgrade...too bad they weren't able to change the platform it was mounted on, but still.
I think it would be cool to see some choate machine and tool products reviewed. They are all but forgotten outside of some manufacturers and importers. They make some really decent gear and while some of the stovks are getting pricey for the lack of external features like picatinny rails out front ,they are simple and rugged and do a very good job . Their bolt action chassis's are very strong and rigid. They have some great "bubba parts" that require no modifications to the guns they go on. Most of their stuff is made of high density polymer overmoulded steel or aluminum.
I had a choate side folder for an m1 carbine that I loved. I also put an ultimak rail on it with an aimpoint. I still regret selling that gun.
For all the talk about M-14'ss having problems and breaking, I can only remember one extractor flying out in twenty years, and that was with a blank. No magazine failures at all, unlike the M-16 series rifles.
It does seem interesting how often weapons end up being 'This would have been amazing... If it had been deployed when they asked for development to start' or 'The core idea is great but the technology just wasn't quite there yet'. Then there's also the cases of 'They decided to reach for the sky and whilst they didn't make it, some of the innovations or quirks they developed to solve the lack are quite interesting'. But most painful of all and is the case seemingly with the M14...
'They developed a brilliant weapon and unfortunately completely screwed up the doctrine regarding it's use'.
Another cool video from living guncyklopedia Ian. Happy new Year
I find it fascinating seeing arsenals evolve in smaller countries with much more modest budgets and minimal domestic production. You end up seeing things like M-14s getting second chances at life into the 21st century and seeing the different modifications to try and modernize them until much more modern equipment becomes available and that's just really interesting.
Last time I was this early, my wife left me
I don't care what these bots say, you were first.
Reverse Garand Thumb
Sorry my friend.
Wife also left me for constantly coming to early
Forget her find a blonde
Used many different rifles and I prefer the M14 pattern.
Thank you 🙏 it would be hard to miss target 🎯☝️with older type ☝️happy new year 🎈🎊🎆👋☮️
Last time I was this early, Ian was still huddled in the corner whispering something about “7.65 French Longue”
Thank you Dr. Ian for one more historical gun. Again, why Discovery Channel or History Channel don't make a show with this gentleman? He's the most qualified person to talk about gun history!!!
Unfortunately those TV networks are not interested in actual discoveries or history content. The days of Mail Call and Mythbusters has long passed.
@0num4 you are correct, unfortunately! But he deserves his show on one of those channels, or other channels! But the people who control those channels prefer trash shows instead of good and educational purposes history! 👍
@@0num4 I have noticed that Ian doesn't talk about aliens much. :)
@@LEXxTALIONS What did Ian do that was so horrible and evil that he deserves the production of a Discovery or History channel show inflicted upon him?
Ians father was actually a regular on the history channel series "tales of the gun" back in the 90s. I miss old history channel, but thankfully most of their OG content is easy to find online.
For the deflector's placement, my best guess is that in order to fulfill the role of a sniper's rifle, they wanted to make sure ejected shell casings weren't giving away the shooter's position; and so with the deflector positioned the way it is, the ejected casings likely get redirected into the dirt (or at least at a very sharp downward angle so they don't get seen popping up and reflecting sunrays out of an otherwise great sniper hide).
Considering someone else has mentioned that their M14 never had any issues with smacking their scopes,it might just be that.
It's a pic rail first - so it was designed to be modular for whatever different scopes could ever be mounted to it. Different scopes with different lengths of pull, and different center locations. Estonia wasn't going to procure a custom, scope-specific mount when they could purchase and stock one that already exists.
@@EtherFox The deflector is attached to the pic rail, it isn't the pic rail itself.
There is a gun that i would love to see on this channel! The OTs-38 Stechkin. Maybe you already have a video on that? 🤔 It seems like an very odd revolver and cartridge! Maybe in wrong but it seems very interesting in my opinion :) btw love the channel and been watching for many years!
I don't care what Ian thinks, if I see an M14, I'm clicking faster than a visually deprived fungus-infected zombie.
In contrast, the ONLY reason why I'll ever watch M14 content is just because Ian happens to post some...😂
Hell yeah brother. There's at least two of us!
@@miikkab9716You might even say it's the Last of You Guys, out there clicking for sources of sustenance and M14 videos
Which is ironic, because you'd have to be a fungus-infected zombie to honestly believe the M14 is a good platform.
@@DerekIcelord
good thing it's not illegal to be stupid 🤣
Anyone else get the impression that Ian has several clones..... He can't be everywhere at the same time?..... Or has he got a TARDIS
Nice Doctor Who shout out. But Ian films several videos on the same trip then intersperses them with other videos. He says it is for variety and to prevent people getting bored, I say it is for this "time travel" like effect.
Men will say ''Hell yeah'' to our guys at Estonia
Hell yeah
Hell yeah
Hell yeah
Very cool video, Ian. I think Ukrainian troops were able to fing the optic on their own. NF, or something less pricy as bushnell or vortex etc. Just what can sustain recoil power.
Thanks once again
Very cool rifle!
Nice video, Ian McCollum! Happy New Year birthday to me.
Love some early morning ian ❤
Next: a Chey Tac with a Tracking Point.
Military surplus is insane. I never could've guessed the us still had 40000 m14s in the 90s
There were still sealed steel "spam" cans full of brand new WW2 production 1911s when the GWOT began in 2001. They probably still have warehouses full of new 1903, 1917, and Garand rifles as well.
I enjoyed
I in no way see the point of offsetting the scope mount rail and adding that brass deflector.... I have a M-14 (semi) and have never had any problems with any of the 'normal' scope mounts....
It was probably less about protecting the scope knob and more about preventing the brass from popping up,reflecting the Sun,and exposing ones' position,a theory someone else has put out.
It might allow the use of the iron sights
Deflector might be moveable to protect scope turrets
I’d take one. I’ve been wanting an M14 but modernized where it has a pic rail on top for optics and either Mlok or quad rail handguard for other accessories. Would love to set one up for thermal and NV fun. I’ve been wanting to do a DMR set up for night time fun. Been leaning towards some sort of AR10 but can’t make up my mind. I definitely want a semi automatic rifle. Bolt actions are nice but I like having the option to dump a mag if need be without racking between each round.
As a long time Mini-14 user… I’d bet that brass deflector is in place to prevent ejected casings from chewing away at the windage turret on “tactical” scopes. I had a Nikon (RIP) tactical scope on my Mini. It was the same as their hunting scopes but with larger/taller turrets. These turrets would get the snot beat out of it by casings flying out of my ranch rifle at Mach 10. The Mini was clearly a bit overgassed at the time (I later found out Ruger did purposely to enhance reliability) this so I switched down to just irons to save my scope. Curious if these rifles suffered a similar problem… thus leading to the inclusion of a brass deflector.
What kind of Workshop does that? 🧐Glas is very cool!
Nice rifle.
ESTONIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! WOOOOOOOOOOO!
4:53 - The M14 has no problems 😇
The green one is definitely cooler *looking* though.
That deflector plate seems fairly crude, and given the need from the the mounting holes to be drilled and tapped I am surprised it wouldn’t have been cheaper to make the a more complex deflector which could slide into the rail and then clip into place.
Damn watching 40s after upload 😮
Boggles the mind, doesn't it? Now I'll be late for lunch.
OK no I won't, 5 minutes is just right.
Hope some day you get your hands on the m40a5 aka the coolest sniper rifle of all time
Ian can you do a video on the M14K please.
Woah... I got an ad before watching. Is forgotten weapons getting ad revenue now? That would be amazing news!
Forgotten Weapons is not totally blocked from ad revenue - I used to get ads on the majority of videos - it is that many of the subjects have run a foul of the algorithms... dislike for gun content. This is such a bare bones "description" video with almost nothing about function or manufacturing - it should definitely be monetized.
Ian has specifically stated in the past that he willingly demonetized his channel after a few incidents... so, this is probably UA-cam screwing with him again.
What are these "ad's" you speak of in the year 2024?
When are we going to finally see the open bolt Elbonian sniper SBR?
Estonia is an interesting place :D love it
I saw “Estonia’s much better sniper”, as well as an M14 in the thumbnail, and thought we were getting another Elbonia video.
Already loved Estonia for what I've seen in Tallin, but know they've got an M14? They just keep getting better
M-14 very reliable. I notice the handguard was not relieved in front of the receiver and was not floated off the stock so it looks like no accurizing done . US pulled them out got the mothballs off them and used them in afghan where nobody complained about them
No people absolutely complained about them. The EBR was a stop gap measure quickly replaced by better rifles.
I could use a deflector plate like that. My LRB M25 sends all the brass into my windage knob. I just wrapped it with a velcro strap.
01:49 what are those screws???
do you need a special split flathead for this?
seems very impractical
Is there anywhere I can get started on reading up on the "older model US surplus is current year modernization" phenomena. I know its done all over but I have no idea about when or how it started and the intricacies of distribution of models.
I keep forgetting the difference between Estonia and Elbonia 😂
I was reading it that way too.
Every time he posts an Estonian gun I make the same mistake.
Amen to that, poor Estonia is Elbonia at this point
Same.
Same
I thought the TP series was specific to the Italian models? Or is the TP indicative of 308?
The M14 might not be the best rifle even for its time, but you cant deny that it looks super cool.
Might not be the best rifle? When and where did you carry an M-14, and it gave you any problems?
Took me a full 30 seconds to realize that it was Estonia and not Elbonia.
Maybe one of those in between weapons of significant conflict abroad.. I always liked the look and function of the M14, made only partially famous by the "A-Team".
Every time Ian does a video on an Estonian firearm I get mixed up an think its Elbonian.
It's surprising that they left the 3-speed gear on it.
olympia gang yet again seething, m14 gang stays on top
I believe you failed to explain the thoughts and use of what seems to be an offset optics rail.
How the hell did they get B&T onboard about that?!
I bet Ian is already fluent in estonian.
Just like Ian is "fluent" in French? lol The Finnish (Uralic) language group does not share much in common with other "Western" languages, even though it is written in Latin characters.
@Williestyle-RobotechxMacross-x That was a joke and it went right over your head....
Ww1 called it wants its offset sniper scopes back, jokes aside its a pretty weird way to mount a scope to an m14 considering theres the sage (i think its called that) mounts
That's just for the EBR stock, isn't it? Not for an M14 using the original furniture.
So are these better than the M14 EBRs?
What's going on with that selector switch, it looks shaved down or deleted. The idea of firing a scoped m14 full auto is hilarious.
Most M14 rifles had the select fire parts replaced with semi auto only, and the selector hole was plugged or welded over.
ESTONIA MENTIONED 🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪🇪
I read somewhere there was a planned TP3 which could've been on an EBR chasis. Did you hear anything from the Estonians on this?
Iirc it got killed off when the new LMT R20 was picked as a replacement for all Galils, ak4 & the m14s
@@zoojuice7893 thanks for the info!
They took off the thing that goes up though
the reason for the deflector was to make sure the ejecting shells don't fly up and nail the scope, do I think its necessary? not really but I have never shot a m14 or more importantly a m14 tp2.
I dont know why but i read the headline as "Elbonia's ... " at first.
Didn’t you recently ask “what went wrong with the M-14?” Seems that it’s not such a bad rifle after all.
There were teething issues but every rifle has though. Main issue is that it really wasn’t that much of an improvement over the Garand yet required an entire redoing of industrial capacity to make it.
It's the development cycle really, made what should have been a low-budget, simple BM59-style Garand conversion into a long, expensive mess. Also you get a lot of 'I hate the M14 because Fudds'.
@@baneofbanesThe M14 was chosen after the trials, against the FAL BTW, because they lied about how much of the tooling used to make the Garand could also be used to make the M14.
@ yep. Damn shame really, for both rifles. The FAL is an excellent rifle, and you can convert the M1 Garand to basically be a M14 like the Italians did with with the BM59.
Ok for a moment I saw the picture and definitly tought it was an Elbonian service rifle.... My bad
Brave Elbonia gets a modern sniper rifle!
This looks pretty good for the Elbonian army
I read Elbonia in the title....
Other than the EBR, this is the nicest M14 I've ever seen.
40,000 M-14s given away!!! 😡😭😡
Yes the M-14 was so bad (according to Ian) that it showed up as the M-21 US Army sniper rifle.....
The Army is pretty good at finding new and interesting uses for failed systems.
What else would they use? "Take our battle rifle and put a scope on it" had been the US Army default for sniper rifles for many decades.
She’s a beaut 🎉
Let's be honest. You wouldn't want these rifles as a gift 🤣
Ya know, Ian.... if that'll fit in a bag, I'll be glad to throw you a few bucks for it when you get stateside
I have a rail for my M1A That sits centrally. It Connects at the barrel and again at the stripper clip mount. You do need to remove the stripper guide but who uses that with magazines anyway? My rail doesnt block the spent casings from ejecting properly although its likely a bit heavier than this rail
The M14, despite its flaws, is still a fantastic rifle system. Certainly much better as a precision rifle than a service/battle rifle.
If it came to a tough decision I'd still take my M16A2, but only if I knew the 5.56mm cartridge would do the trick. Otherwise, the M14 would be my first choice.
No, no it's not. The M14 is an awful rifle system, because of its flaws. Even from a precision rifle standpoint, the amount of time, effort, and money that has to go into one to make it semi-viable makes it a nonstarter for anyone with access to anything better. You'd spend half-as-much money on a quality AR-10 and optic combination for a much more accurate and robust rifle system capable of sub-moa accuracy. What the M14 is, though, is a visually appealing rifle, and enjoyable operating system but lets not confuse those with being synonymous with "fantastic", because the M14 has never been and never will be "fantastic".
What flaws? I did RVN '66-'67 1st Mar Div 0311, from July '66 till about Feb. '67 I carried an M-14, it never let me down, Feb. '67 we got issued M-16's, after about a month we started to have "problems" with the M-16's a lot of us "procured" pistols of one sort or another, as back up weapons, so, what flaws did you read about some where as a "keyboard commando", that leads you to repeat this B.S. here?.
@@zubdub2506
🙄🙈🤣👌
@@boondocker7964
He can't !
@boondocker7964 The very early M16s had teething issues, some not even due to any problems of the rifle itself but rather supply and training issues, some of which could be even called sabotage. The later versions of the rifle didn't have any of these problems. You didn't see any teething issues with the M14 you were issued because that was long past its teething phase.