Many thanks for the Video, I've been considering getting a collective , your review answers lots of questions for me, will be going for the non Throttle model I'm new to Helicopters , like you said its a lot of extra money for something you do on the ground . Regards Julian.
Nice and thorough review, lots of useful info. I'll definetly consider the Alpha left grip also as I fly DCS with the Alpha right and it's great. I appreciate the breakdown and heads up on the plus base.
Great review. I have the same Constellation stick grip. I found the 4 way hat was difficult to manipulate left and right too. The great thing is, you can swap the different hat switches with each other. They pull off (with a little force). I swapped the square one with the one with the knurled curve. Perfect as a trim now.
So your huey issue is the same with any throttle axis. I believe Virpil chose to mimic the proper method in the event ED/Belsimtek come back and model the axis properly or give the option to do so. Seems like it would've been best to also have an option to remove that idle/off lock so that when flying a helicopter with a throttle over travel spring (e.g. R22/R44) you can utilize that extra space as the over travel spring despite not having a FFB component nor physical mechanical spring to represent that control. None the less, great review. Looking at their plus collective with new uh60 grip coming out for both sim gaming and better training for my real world helicopter flying.
You have some screws holding the case plates of the collective and you could change them with longer variants if needed and then attach there some metallic sheets that would go backwards and you then put some counter weights on them without any need of "metallurgical" work.
You should upload your older out of date videos on the throttles as these controls still get sold on ebay on the second hand market and it would still be useful for people to assess if you put them on UA-cam. Keep up the good work!
Thanks for a very thorough, considered and honest review. I have some old diving weights sat in a cupboard and I'm thinking of making a counterbalance bracket so it will hold position without any clamping force. I'll let you know how I get on.
@@HavocCompanyClan Well, I think you're going to like this report! The result has been fantastic! I designed a simple bracket from which to hang a diving weight. It fits over the outer face of the box with a hole for the big Virpil Controls plastic collar and bolt. The correct counterweight for my setup (UH60 grip) is approx. 1kg. which hangs 200mm behind the collective axle. My son (awesome lad) fabricated it and machined all the holes perfectly so it fitted exactly. The two compression bolts that give the clamping force on the collective axle are nipped up just enough to ensure there is no play (about a 1/8 turn each) and there is absolutely no stiction force whatsoever. The force required to move the collective with my fingertips is microscopic and if i let go of it there is no movement whatsoever. It stays rock solid still. We also designed and built a bracket and sliding block arrangement so that I can remove the whole collective from my swivel chair just by lifting it out of the bracket, so no risk of damage by forgetting it's there and swivelling the chair around .
I just wanted to say that the way a real UH-1 and the OH-6's and the Hughes 500's does work. the dark ring is the lock out you push up with your thumb, not a button. just wanted to let you know. you hold it up so you can twist the throttle off if you have a miss start. You use your right hand to push the starter and the left to control the throttle.
I would guess the throttle portion is more modeled after the twist grip on something like the Hind, (and possibly Mi-8, I don't remember) where there is no idle detent like on the Huey, the black handle also looks pretty similar to the hind. Great review!
early version Virpil gear might be on the 2nd hand market, people might be interested (i'm not), i think you should publish those videos if they are finished. Actually I might watch those videos to get a feel for the quality of the Virpil gear, and also to get a feel for how honest and accurate your reviews are. Helps me make future decisions
Around the 50 minute mark you're flying the Mi-8 I believe. You're super close to the power line and have great control! Are you in VR as I've heard people say it's incredibly hard to do stuff like that without it.
Gotta say, I was really looking forward to Virpil entering the market with this, but the initial price kept me off, and I instead went for the K-51 collective. Having heard of issues with the Virpil from various people now I am glad I did. It might not be perfect but it has functioned solidly, I haven't had to adjust the clamp a single time since I got it about 3-4 months ago (and this includes taking it off of the rig, flying to another country with the collective just crammed into a carry on bag, mounted to a friend's rig, then the same thing in reverse), everything just functions well and feels good on it. The only "issue" I've had has been self caused, basically I want to at some point DIY a new head for it, and since it's simple 3D printed plastic I stripped one of the screw holes taking the panels off and putting them back on again multiple times... But that's one out of 8 screws and doesn't change how the thing feels in the least... So yeah, might not be modular, and the bits you touch are 3D printed plastic, but it has Virpil electronics inside, a very good mechanical design IMO, great metal construction for the majority of it, dead simple to use, and cost 200€ + 50€ shipping (didn't end up having to pay VAT or customs, lucky me I guess), versus, uh, checking Virpil Controls EU... 423.97€ before shipping, VAT included (no throttle base, Ka-50 grip). Good deal, and enough controls for all DCS helis so far, though Apache will of course be a struggle, until I make my DIY one.
You can tape one side and fill the stripped hole with some good epoxy. Once it starts to harden, drill a new hole for the screw. You can wait for it to fully harden before drilling too, depends on your epoxy.
Great, thorough review. Not in the market for a collective, but TBH I think the price is too much. I also think they could move away from uncommon cable connections too.
Thanks for the in depth review. I was kinda stumped with the DCS throttle operation as well.....thought the Virpil was initially faulty.. You explained it well. I think its up to DCS to fix the throttle mapping in the UH-1 as there are other sims out there that it may work closer as designed. Of course I havent tried any yet. Might try some tonite to see if this is the case. When tightening the screw to get balance I found the stiction issue was annoying so I fitted a damper. I then loosened the screws but then got minor stiction from the damper as well.....doh! But it did have a nice weighty smoothe feel to it. Good review.
I think if you mount it as close to 90 deg at operating range it will eliminate the minor stiction feeling I was getting. My angle was a bit too acute and didn't take advantage of the full travel to get high resolution feel. But as I mentioned it was nice and close to the real feel with smooth action.
Damn that's twice my reply didn't work. I used a cheapie motorcycle steering damper and bolted it to the chair. To mount on to the collective I used a Smallrig tripod clamp with a three eighth or quarter inch bolt into the clamp just below the throttle grip. I found them both on e-bay and am-azon. Search for them at a-zon as it looks like I can't put a link here.....or even mention their name. The reply above was supposed to follow this one.
Thank you for the honest review. I tried to link a picture for an easy and cheap solution for the fallback problem. Ofc it got blocked because of the link (which i understand). If the author can see the post with the link, might review it and either approve it here, or just share it with the others. Thx
@@HavocCompanyClan I dont know if there is an "elastic mod". My solution is an elastic shoelace. My rig is very similar to yours (or at least the collective mounting), with a properly attached shoelace you can almost perfectly ballance out the collective in any position.
i got the plus in the end and if you calibrate the twist axes, in the virpil software with out pressing the button to unlock the throttle you can get it to work in DCS with half the axes.
@@HavocCompanyClan I see what you mean about the drop if to lose im going to 3d print something to counter balance it would you like me to send you the file
Wow, just ordered the plus about a week ago (backordered). I'm only using DCS helicopters and that's too bad they don't implement correct throttle. I just emailed them to see if I can exchange it and get the non-plus. Wish I had seen this before I ordered the plus. Hope I'm not too late. Thanks for the detailed review.
So.. Virpil could not edit my order due to their web ordering system. I would have to cancel and reorder everything, losing my place in the queue as well as my holiday discount! Prices went back up right after new years. So I opted to keep my current order. Doing the math, the plus is costing me around $50 more than the non-plus (with the holiday discount). Currently the two are $120 difference! I can live with that.😆
Amazing review. I may purchase a collective finally based on this review. Is it possible to do a brief video showing your control keybinds in DCS for the helicopters? I am debating which grip to buy and it would be nice to see how you mapped the DCS functions to the buttons on your Cyclic grip and on your Collective grip.
@@HavocCompanyClan Thanks. After looking up the controls layout for the AH-64D Apache ... I think I will follow your example and go with the Alpha-L for the collective on my order. I fly in VR and need as much mapped to the hotas as possible.
Hello there, I´m using the VPC Rotor Plus TCS. How did you set the increasing the RPM with your throttle twist on your collective? I can use my collective normally, but I am not able to set increasing/decreasing RPM with my collective. Thanks in advance 🙂
Is it possible to set the throttle axis up so the rage of motion when you click it past the idle detent would be a button press that could then be assigned to the page up command? I did this with my CM3 throttle to use for the idle/cutoff command for the hornet. I tried it for the huey so the start procedure would work and it seems to work correctly. I don't have a VIRPIL collective yet though so I can't try it.
I would like some advice ..... I should buy the VIRPIL VPC TCS Plus collective ..... and I should combine a Handle ..... I am undecided whether to combine the handle (a) VPC Hawk-60 or the handle (b) VPC Constellation ALPHA-L (in anticipation of future use of space simulators). Do I think choice (b) is more versatile? What do you think? Looking forward to your dispassionate advice, greeting
Why buy the VIRPIL VPC TCS collective and not the VPC TCS Plus collective to be combined with the Alpha-L handle? Would you be kind enough to give me an explanation as I cannot understand your choice? Thank you in advance@@HavocCompanyClan
@@aldofaro9984 because the twist throttle axis (the difference between plus and non plus version) , is 1. badly implemented 2. only used for 2 seconds when spooling up your helicopter, so it is not worth the extra money
Just to be sure, the Mi-24P at least has separate throttle bindings for the throttle levers (which you're not supposed to touch) and the collective throttle. You need to bind the collective one. And of course, make sure that the throttle axis is actually functioning and showing output based on the throttle position, as HCC said.
Awesome, detailed review; a comparison with the WinWing would be cool, but as you said: not gonna happen, as you have to pay for that yourself (although if you send WinWing THIS review, they would probably send you a unit). Anywho: concerning the lack of DCS implementation in the way of engine start/cutoff, you should be able to do it this way? With virtual buttons and adjusting ingame axis? ua-cam.com/video/tG3dRJ0Ryfc/v-deo.html
Just want to thank you for this great review even it’s 2 years old.
Love your work and contributions to the sim community.
thanks
Thank You, you saved me $120.00.
this was the best average joe like me review I've watched so far well done i watched till the end
thanks
top notch review
Many thanks for the Video, I've been considering getting a collective , your review answers lots of questions for me, will be going for the non Throttle model I'm new to Helicopters , like you said its a lot of extra money for something you do on the ground . Regards Julian.
good choice
Nice and thorough review, lots of useful info. I'll definetly consider the Alpha left grip also as I fly DCS with the Alpha right and it's great. I appreciate the breakdown and heads up on the plus base.
Found the link for this vid in a reddit thread. Thanks for your input!
Great review. I have the same Constellation stick grip. I found the 4 way hat was difficult to manipulate left and right too. The great thing is, you can swap the different hat switches with each other. They pull off (with a little force). I swapped the square one with the one with the knurled curve. Perfect as a trim now.
So your huey issue is the same with any throttle axis. I believe Virpil chose to mimic the proper method in the event ED/Belsimtek come back and model the axis properly or give the option to do so.
Seems like it would've been best to also have an option to remove that idle/off lock so that when flying a helicopter with a throttle over travel spring (e.g. R22/R44) you can utilize that extra space as the over travel spring despite not having a FFB component nor physical mechanical spring to represent that control.
None the less, great review. Looking at their plus collective with new uh60 grip coming out for both sim gaming and better training for my real world helicopter flying.
You have some screws holding the case plates of the collective and you could change them with longer variants if needed and then attach there some metallic sheets that would go backwards and you then put some counter weights on them without any need of "metallurgical" work.
Thanks my friend, That´s exactly the review I was looking for. 👍
Finally a actually Review & not a festival of opinion based on 5 minutes of gameplay
Great, comprehensive review. Thanks.
Super detailed and super useful. Thanks for taking the time.
thanks
You should upload your older out of date videos on the throttles as these controls still get sold on ebay on the second hand market and it would still be useful for people to assess if you put them on UA-cam. Keep up the good work!
I have never removed any of my older out of date videos, they are all available on this channel, look to the bottom of this play list
Thanks for a very thorough, considered and honest review. I have some old diving weights sat in a cupboard and I'm thinking of making a counterbalance bracket so it will hold position without any clamping force. I'll let you know how I get on.
Yes please report back on how you get on with the weights, best of luck
@@HavocCompanyClan Well, I think you're going to like this report! The result has been fantastic!
I designed a simple bracket from which to hang a diving weight. It fits over the outer face of the box with a hole for the big Virpil Controls plastic collar and bolt. The correct counterweight for my setup (UH60 grip) is approx. 1kg. which hangs 200mm behind the collective axle.
My son (awesome lad) fabricated it and machined all the holes perfectly so it fitted exactly. The two compression bolts that give the clamping force on the collective axle are nipped up just enough to ensure there is no play (about a 1/8 turn each) and there is absolutely no stiction force whatsoever. The force required to move the collective with my fingertips is microscopic and if i let go of it there is no movement whatsoever. It stays rock solid still.
We also designed and built a bracket and sliding block arrangement so that I can remove the whole collective from my swivel chair just by lifting it out of the bracket, so no risk of damage by forgetting it's there and swivelling the chair around .
I just wanted to say that the way a real UH-1 and the OH-6's and the Hughes 500's does work. the dark ring is the lock out you push up with your thumb, not a button. just wanted to let you know. you hold it up so you can twist the throttle off if you have a miss start. You use your right hand to push the starter and the left to control the throttle.
I would guess the throttle portion is more modeled after the twist grip on something like the Hind, (and possibly Mi-8, I don't remember) where there is no idle detent like on the Huey, the black handle also looks pretty similar to the hind. Great review!
just ordered the plus think I will call them and change my order ty for saving me money
early version Virpil gear might be on the 2nd hand market, people might be interested (i'm not), i think you should publish those videos if they are finished. Actually I might watch those videos to get a feel for the quality of the Virpil gear, and also to get a feel for how honest and accurate your reviews are. Helps me make future decisions
I am not sure where those videos are, they were done over 2 years ago, but I will see if I can find them
Around the 50 minute mark you're flying the Mi-8 I believe. You're super close to the power line and have great control! Are you in VR as I've heard people say it's incredibly hard to do stuff like that without it.
not using VR just a normal screen
@@HavocCompanyClan thanks!
Pretty fair review. Thumbs up!
Gotta say, I was really looking forward to Virpil entering the market with this, but the initial price kept me off, and I instead went for the K-51 collective. Having heard of issues with the Virpil from various people now I am glad I did. It might not be perfect but it has functioned solidly, I haven't had to adjust the clamp a single time since I got it about 3-4 months ago (and this includes taking it off of the rig, flying to another country with the collective just crammed into a carry on bag, mounted to a friend's rig, then the same thing in reverse), everything just functions well and feels good on it. The only "issue" I've had has been self caused, basically I want to at some point DIY a new head for it, and since it's simple 3D printed plastic I stripped one of the screw holes taking the panels off and putting them back on again multiple times... But that's one out of 8 screws and doesn't change how the thing feels in the least...
So yeah, might not be modular, and the bits you touch are 3D printed plastic, but it has Virpil electronics inside, a very good mechanical design IMO, great metal construction for the majority of it, dead simple to use, and cost 200€ + 50€ shipping (didn't end up having to pay VAT or customs, lucky me I guess), versus, uh, checking Virpil Controls EU... 423.97€ before shipping, VAT included (no throttle base, Ka-50 grip). Good deal, and enough controls for all DCS helis so far, though Apache will of course be a struggle, until I make my DIY one.
You can tape one side and fill the stripped hole with some good epoxy. Once it starts to harden, drill a new hole for the screw. You can wait for it to fully harden before drilling too, depends on your epoxy.
Great, thorough review. Not in the market for a collective, but TBH I think the price is too much. I also think they could move away from uncommon cable connections too.
Almost 1hour 😱thank you
Trying to do a proper review, not like a lot of youtube "reviews" that are nothing more than adverts
Thanks for the in depth review. I was kinda stumped with the DCS throttle operation as well.....thought the Virpil was initially faulty.. You explained it well. I think its up to DCS to fix the throttle mapping in the UH-1 as there are other sims out there that it may work closer as designed. Of course I havent tried any yet. Might try some tonite to see if this is the case. When tightening the screw to get balance I found the stiction issue was annoying so I fitted a damper. I then loosened the screws but then got minor stiction from the damper as well.....doh! But it did have a nice weighty smoothe feel to it. Good review.
Have you any details on how you mounted the damper on this ? I was thinking of maybe trying a damper mod myself
I think if you mount it as close to 90 deg at operating range it will eliminate the minor stiction feeling I was getting. My angle was a bit too acute and didn't take advantage of the full travel to get high resolution feel. But as I mentioned it was nice and close to the real feel with smooth action.
Damn that's twice my reply didn't work. I used a cheapie motorcycle steering damper and bolted it to the chair. To mount on to the collective I used a Smallrig tripod clamp with a three eighth or quarter inch bolt into the clamp just below the throttle grip. I found them both on e-bay and am-azon. Search for them at a-zon as it looks like I can't put a link here.....or even mention their name. The reply above was supposed to follow this one.
Super review
Thank you for the honest review. I tried to link a picture for an easy and cheap solution for the fallback problem. Ofc it got blocked because of the link (which i understand).
If the author can see the post with the link, might review it and either approve it here, or just share it with the others. Thx
by any chance is it the elastic mod?
@@HavocCompanyClan I dont know if there is an "elastic mod". My solution is an elastic shoelace. My rig is very similar to yours (or at least the collective mounting), with a properly attached shoelace you can almost perfectly ballance out the collective in any position.
@@jozsefveverka7398 yeah that is the same one I saw online
Nice video,thanks!
Hello, thanks for the video! Great content- has this problem being resolved in DCS Huey?
i got the plus in the end and if you calibrate the twist axes, in the virpil software with out pressing the button to unlock the throttle you can get it to work in DCS with half the axes.
yes I am well aware of this, sadly it means you only use about half of the travel, I would like to mod my twist to remove the lock out
@@HavocCompanyClan I see what you mean about the drop if to lose im going to 3d print something to counter balance it would you like me to send you the file
throttle control/money: sorry, I'm ready to pay off that sum just to have that 3 seconds pleasure ^^ :) THnka for the video btw ;) ;)
Wow, just ordered the plus about a week ago (backordered). I'm only using DCS helicopters and that's too bad they don't implement correct throttle. I just emailed them to see if I can exchange it and get the non-plus. Wish I had seen this before I ordered the plus. Hope I'm not too late. Thanks for the detailed review.
So.. Virpil could not edit my order due to their web ordering system. I would have to cancel and reorder everything, losing my place in the queue as well as my holiday discount! Prices went back up right after new years. So I opted to keep my current order. Doing the math, the plus is costing me around $50 more than the non-plus (with the holiday discount). Currently the two are $120 difference! I can live with that.😆
@@redtailpilotWhat do you think of it? Is the plus at all useful?
Concerning the throttle axis. It works as intended for me in the mi-8 in DCS. Throttle does not move until I get past the detent as its supposed to.
there is no detent on the real mi-8 throttle, and we loose about 50 of twist of we only calibrate half the axis
Amazing review. I may purchase a collective finally based on this review. Is it possible to do a brief video showing your control keybinds in DCS for the helicopters? I am debating which grip to buy and it would be nice to see how you mapped the DCS functions to the buttons on your Cyclic grip and on your Collective grip.
I use the CM2 grip for the cyclic and the Alpha-L for the collective, busy at moment
@@HavocCompanyClan Thanks. After looking up the controls layout for the AH-64D Apache ... I think I will follow your example and go with the Alpha-L for the collective on my order. I fly in VR and need as much mapped to the hotas as possible.
thank you for that man
Hello there, I´m using the VPC Rotor Plus TCS.
How did you set the increasing the RPM with your throttle twist on your collective?
I can use my collective normally, but I am not able to set increasing/decreasing RPM with my collective.
Thanks in advance 🙂
I guess just bind it in the analog axis tab against throttle, tho u only do this at start-up as all helis use automatic RPM gov in the engine
@@HavocCompanyClanok, I'll try. Thank you 😊
Are the friction clamps just metal on metal? Or do the have a Micarta or Nylon liner that can be replaced?
Outer part is metal , bearing part is nylon
Is it possible to set the throttle axis up so the rage of motion when you click it past the idle detent would be a button press that could then be assigned to the page up command? I did this with my CM3 throttle to use for the idle/cutoff command for the hornet. I tried it for the huey so the start procedure would work and it seems to work correctly. I don't have a VIRPIL collective yet though so I can't try it.
Nope , this was one of the first things I tried
Yes it possible. That's what I use for the Huey.
I would like some advice ..... I should buy the VIRPIL VPC TCS Plus collective ..... and I should combine a Handle ..... I am undecided whether to combine the handle (a) VPC Hawk-60 or the handle (b) VPC Constellation ALPHA-L (in anticipation of future use of space simulators). Do I think choice (b) is more versatile? What do you think? Looking forward to your dispassionate advice, greeting
I would buy the VIRPIL VPC TCS collective NOT the plus one + the Alpha-L grip as it is a more flexible option
Why buy the VIRPIL VPC TCS collective and not the VPC TCS Plus collective to be combined with the Alpha-L handle? Would you be kind enough to give me an explanation as I cannot understand your choice? Thank you in advance@@HavocCompanyClan
@@aldofaro9984 because the twist throttle axis (the difference between plus and non plus version) , is 1. badly implemented 2. only used for 2 seconds when spooling up your helicopter, so it is not worth the extra money
@@HavocCompanyClan Hello from Canada. After months of searching, THIS is answer I have been looking for. Thank you so much!
I wanted to use the throttle but none of the helicopters I had use it at all. They just gone straight to Governor on.
How can I set the throttle axis at DCS MI-24P or MI-8 in the control settings? If I twist nothing happens. Any ideas why this is?
did you calibrate the throttle axis ?
Just to be sure, the Mi-24P at least has separate throttle bindings for the throttle levers (which you're not supposed to touch) and the collective throttle. You need to bind the collective one.
And of course, make sure that the throttle axis is actually functioning and showing output based on the throttle position, as HCC said.
Will the Vipril SharkKa50 grip work with the Apache?
yes, but the alpha-L grip is probably better suited
👍
What vr headset do you used?
I do not use a VR headset , just a normal screen + Trackir
For the idle, what about adding a virtual detent?
A virtual detent , I did not try that. I did however try using axis to button binding, which did not work well at all
Awesome, detailed review; a comparison with the WinWing would be cool, but as you said: not gonna happen, as you have to pay for that yourself (although if you send WinWing THIS review, they would probably send you a unit).
Anywho: concerning the lack of DCS implementation in the way of engine start/cutoff, you should be able to do it this way? With virtual buttons and adjusting ingame axis?
ua-cam.com/video/tG3dRJ0Ryfc/v-deo.html
Not ofent u here a local Belfast lad on the old youtube.
You could tune the throttle...
no idea what u mean
@@HavocCompanyClan You can tune any axis in DCS. You could also use the lock button as the page up button.
@@bryanbishop2377 how did that go for you on your virpil throttle ?
@@HavocCompanyClan I did it on the Warthog throttle to achieve the correct afterburner detent position. The same technique should work for you.
@@HavocCompanyClan I should make a UA-cam video about it...🙄
Isn't the throttle modeled after Russian helicopters, like the Mi-8 and the Mi-24P?
nope, modelled after the UH-1H (huey)
Did they send you that for free?
No, I am just a Virpil customer like every one else and I paid for this with my hard earned coin
@@HavocCompanyClan I know mate, I was taking the piss. You mentioned it a few times...
Stick on lead wheel weights. That throttle in DCS looks like it was designed by FJS in X-plane