I have the Reblitz, Ingrec and Forss book on piano tuning and regulation but there is nothing more useful than seeing someone giving a clear and easy to follow explanation and demonstration on setting up a grand. Thankyou!
I am the same way. I learn fastest when I see a real life example of someone doing the work and hear the result. So much of my skills that are marketable now have come from seeing a few minutes of someone working at the factory, or a video clip here or there.
So by doing that, you're stopping the repetition lever sooner in the stroke so it's held lower by the drop screw and you're making sure you clear the jack out from the hammer by having enough aftertouch... Interesting. I think more drop will help for sure, but I don't like to have a lot of drop because it makes it feel a little heavier, but I would probably just lower let-off and drop a little. That's how I tend to regulate Yanahas. I find that let-off does not have to be super close in order to play a good PPP. But I think your adjustments might help with bobbling or double striking. I usually focus on the strength of the spring, good checking that is as high as I can get it, and making sure let-off isn't too close. I don't like the idea of more key dip if I can avoid it, because less can make the piano seem lighter and I think most players like that? Thanks for commenting!
@@saltlakepianoservice Thank you for your thoughtful reply - i thoroughly enjoyed this series with Josh and Hyrum :). I will do some testing with the drop vs let-off sweet spot! Checking/backcheck adjustment can be tricky for me as even a slight nudge seems to make large differences despite how thick and relatively rigid the backcheck wires are, and then getting back is no easy task as it is all trial and error by feel as opposed to screws or notchings. I was wondering about slight dip increase/restoration re the bobbling (affected from the lever "centre" pivots), but yes i enjoy a smooth light action, consistently smooth above all else, where too often the double-strike also seems to be in large part caused by excessive bumpiness. Wish there was a high tech material invented for knuckles/rollers that need way less maintenance. I feel the bumps of escapement far too much and i don't think i am over-obsessing or that sensitive? 😆 🤔
@@saltlakepianoservice Thanks for the tip - micro-teflon is literal high tech material ;) Just wish some synthetic leatherette ultra-non-stick shape-memory knuckle material existed for fabrication. I have done all the deep tissue massaging, reshaping, powder-infusing knuckle work, checked pins and felts for snug but not swollen fit, checked distances and alignment, checked the let-off again by ear this round via sound from soft strikes ie matching as much as i can but the bumps throw me off.. as far as i can tell from my limited experience, the bumping and bobbling fix seems to be limited by a combination of: A) relationship between the max height of strings and how minimal let-off distance i can achieve without reducing hammer size or taking action apart, and the bottom-roller/knuckle diameter, as all are in decently good condition. I dont want to change string height as that will be a ton of work with other factors, too much for me to handle right now. As things are, it seems no matter how smooth the knuckles surfaces, the jacks get ”stuck" as everything is a bit large lol 😆 (not stuck from alignment, but they kind of have to push off and away no matter what, possibly causing the bumps to be really felt and the bobbling hammers). and B) backchecks and hammer tails are not perfect enough, at least in the manner of adjustment i find much difficulty in incrementally small adjustments seeming to have huge effect. So i think my rep spring adjustments are affected as well / hard to gauge somewhat. (i have set them currently for fast soft repetition without getting stuck too often, not terribly fast ie backchecking not that high but acceptable for me) Luckily it is a Renner action in an SF10 from 1979 still all original parts afa i can tell.. so no tugging at rep.springs as they are screw-adjusted! - Maybe i have to get the hammers shaved down a bit? Unless there is a way to get rid of bumpiness without going the let-off/drop screw route?? I know it probably needs to be seen in person by a good tech to really assess, so i hope i described this well and that it is common enough an issue as i encounter some level of this on all actions, just usually not so severe after adjustments are already performed.. One of the better techs in town quoted me 10-12 hours to go through thoroughly or about $3200+tax in labour which would be reasonable if he thought the issue likely solvable in the long run, but he wasn't sure and it is on the high side not for his services but for me personally to risk a possible but not confident solution. He would not change the action for altered string height either, describing reasons :). Figured i would carefully try myself, as a sensitive player, for the learning experience if nothing else gained
I have the Reblitz, Ingrec and Forss book on piano tuning and regulation but there is nothing more useful than seeing someone giving a clear and easy to follow explanation and demonstration on setting up a grand. Thankyou!
I am the same way. I learn fastest when I see a real life example of someone doing the work and hear the result. So much of my skills that are marketable now have come from seeing a few minutes of someone working at the factory, or a video clip here or there.
This is the best series on UA-cam.
What if i increase drop screw distance while minimizing letoff - could that compensate for the bobbling ? (while maybe also extending dip a bit).
TY😊
So by doing that, you're stopping the repetition lever sooner in the stroke so it's held lower by the drop screw and you're making sure you clear the jack out from the hammer by having enough aftertouch... Interesting. I think more drop will help for sure, but I don't like to have a lot of drop because it makes it feel a little heavier, but I would probably just lower let-off and drop a little. That's how I tend to regulate Yanahas. I find that let-off does not have to be super close in order to play a good PPP. But I think your adjustments might help with bobbling or double striking.
I usually focus on the strength of the spring, good checking that is as high as I can get it, and making sure let-off isn't too close. I don't like the idea of more key dip if I can avoid it, because less can make the piano seem lighter and I think most players like that? Thanks for commenting!
@@saltlakepianoservice Thank you for your thoughtful reply - i thoroughly enjoyed this series with Josh and Hyrum :). I will do some testing with the drop vs let-off sweet spot!
Checking/backcheck adjustment can be tricky for me as even a slight nudge seems to make large differences despite how thick and relatively rigid the backcheck wires are, and then getting back is no easy task as it is all trial and error by feel as opposed to screws or notchings.
I was wondering about slight dip increase/restoration re the bobbling (affected from the lever "centre" pivots), but yes i enjoy a smooth light action, consistently smooth above all else, where too often the double-strike also seems to be in large part caused by excessive bumpiness. Wish there was a high tech material invented for knuckles/rollers that need way less maintenance.
I feel the bumps of escapement far too much and i don't think i am over-obsessing or that sensitive? 😆 🤔
@@Li-yt7zh Try micro Teflon powder rubbed into the knuckles where it contacts.
@@saltlakepianoservice Thanks for the tip - micro-teflon is literal high tech material ;) Just wish some synthetic leatherette ultra-non-stick shape-memory knuckle material existed for fabrication. I have done all the deep tissue massaging, reshaping, powder-infusing knuckle work, checked pins and felts for snug but not swollen fit, checked distances and alignment, checked the let-off again by ear this round via sound from soft strikes ie matching as much as i can but the bumps throw me off.. as far as i can tell from my limited experience, the bumping and bobbling fix seems to be limited by a combination of:
A) relationship between the max height of strings and how minimal let-off distance i can achieve without reducing hammer size or taking action apart, and the bottom-roller/knuckle diameter, as all are in decently good condition. I dont want to change string height as that will be a ton of work with other factors, too much for me to handle right now. As things are, it seems no matter how smooth the knuckles surfaces, the jacks get ”stuck" as everything is a bit large lol 😆 (not stuck from alignment, but they kind of have to push off and away no matter what, possibly causing the bumps to be really felt and the bobbling hammers).
and B) backchecks and hammer tails are not perfect enough, at least in the manner of adjustment i find much difficulty in incrementally small adjustments seeming to have huge effect. So i think my rep spring adjustments are affected as well / hard to gauge somewhat. (i have set them currently for fast soft repetition without getting stuck too often, not terribly fast ie backchecking not that high but acceptable for me)
Luckily it is a Renner action in an SF10 from 1979 still all original parts afa i can tell.. so no tugging at rep.springs as they are screw-adjusted!
-
Maybe i have to get the hammers shaved down a bit? Unless there is a way to get rid of bumpiness without going the let-off/drop screw route?? I know it probably needs to be seen in person by a good tech to really assess, so i hope i described this well and that it is common enough an issue as i encounter some level of this on all actions, just usually not so severe after adjustments are already performed..
One of the better techs in town quoted me 10-12 hours to go through thoroughly or about $3200+tax in labour which would be reasonable if he thought the issue likely solvable in the long run, but he wasn't sure and it is on the high side not for his services but for me personally to risk a possible but not confident solution. He would not change the action for altered string height either, describing reasons :).
Figured i would carefully try myself, as a sensitive player, for the learning experience if nothing else gained