The Collagen Claims Are Out of Control. Does it Work?
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2024
- 🌱 Use code MIC15 to get 15% off Complement Essential, my favorite multivitamin for plant-based and plant-centric eaters bit.ly/CompMIC
Something fishy is going on in the collagen anti-aging social scene on social media. Let's investigate and look at the studies on how to boost collagen.
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Annette Larkins Turns 81:
• ANNETTE LARKINS TURNED...
Collagen Basics:
www.oaepublish...
Collagen Length:
www.oaepublish...
No more than 3-4 amino acids peptides absorbed:
vivo.colostate...
Collagen Drop Aging Chart:
www.researchga...
2023 Meta: www.ncbi.nlm.n...
Study Claiming No Conflicts of Interest to Any Extent:
www.ncbi.nlm.n...
Harvard Collagen Articles:
nutritionsourc...
www.health.har...
COQ10 Containing Collagen Supplement Study:
www.ncbi.nlm.n...
Clean Label Project Lead, Cadmium:
cleanlabelproj...
Mad Cow Disease to Human Case Study:
www.neurology....
Concern of Mad Cow in Animal Feed:
efsa.onlinelib...
Study on Collagen Boosting IGF-1:
www.ncbi.nlm.n...
IGF-1 and Longevity:
onlinelibrary....
Amaranth Comparably High Glycine Ratio:
www.researchga...
Scurvy, Vitamin C, Collagen, Corkscrew Hairs:
www.discoverma...
Vitamin C and Collagen Gene Expression:
pubmed.ncbi.nl...
Vitamin C Supplementation Preclinical Review:
journals.sagep...
Kale Study:
www.ncbi.nlm.n...
Tomato Study 1:
onlinelibrary....
Beta Carotene Study:
karger.com/drm...
Intro/Outro Song: Sedução Momentânea by Roulet:
freemusicarchiv...
Dishonest marketing should be prosecuted by law. Absolutely disgusting.
Prosecuted*
@@justmillenialthings I appreciate that. English is not my first language. 👍
I found it so funny when everyone started preaching collagen all at once. Clearly effective marketing.
I have seen collagen scam creams back 20 years ago. It's a fad
Corporations are trying to see you a bunch of garbage and even play with your health. Live naturally and you will live a long and happy life 👉The Connections (2021) [short documentary]💖
Taking collagen makes you an UGLY person because they come from exploitation and murder of innocent animals!
But, hear me out: Have you heard about the 65 year old that started taking collagen and was crying because her wrinkles started melting off... ? 😅
😂😂😂😂
😅 In all seriousness though, those types of adverts, thinly veiled as “real people just sharing an anecdote” bother me so much. At least with television, you know when you’re watching a commercial.
Corporations are trying to see you a bunch of garbage and even play with your health. Live naturally and you will live a long and happy life 👉The Connections (2021) [short documentary]💖
Taking collagen makes you an UGLY person because they come from exploitation and murder of innocent animals!
😂😂😂😂
now THIS video has the best AD ever
Shaming one supplement and promoting the other one, come on…
I actually watch Mic’s ads, they are comical
[Love the sponsor sketch!] Posting often these days, Mic, and every one a banger, as the kidz say! I would not take collagen from vanity--or any other reason--as a middle-aged woman because I always assumed that my body can make the collagen it needs, given the right nutrients. Like, you can't build brain tissue from eating brains. Thanks for posting!
According to these crazy people, I must have been born legally blind because my mom didn't eat enough falcon eyeballs. Lol
@@suicune2001animal based folks with some of the most insane claims. "testicles for big balls health, liver for liver health, bulldicks for peepee health, kidneys for kidney health, chicken breasts for big boobs health, chicken legs for big booty health and cellulite+varicose+hemorrhoid prevention, sausage salami covered with pork gut skin for gastrointestinal health..." etc. salt was one of the most insane things they recommend only because popular specialists were against it. James DiNicolantonio lied 15g NaCl a day is safe and suggested drinking saltwater (5g in 500ml), Joseph Everett (What I've Learned profile on UA-cam) lied saying 40g NaCl a day is safe. i had stomach rupture following their advice. NaCl consumption increases risks of stomach cancer, irritations and ulcers, gastrointestinal perforations and ruptures, edema, kidney disease, neurological problems, arrhythmias, congestive heart failure and other types of cardiovascular disease, thyroid issues, bone deformities, dehydration etc. whole foods contain adequate quantities of sodium and chlorine naturally, not required to vaporise seawater for seasalt or dig in saltmines for rock salt
I remember one of my friend having concerns about me turning vegan (10 years ago!). She told me that I will age faster, my skin will have wrinles early and thing like that. She's a dietetician so she is a strong believer of that crap. Anyway, I didn't argue, I just told her "well, we will know in a couples of years"
She's still my friend today. I just turn 37, so I'm not old yet but I still have 0 wrinkle on my face. I look fresh and young ♥ I just use sunscreen, eat vegan and drink a lot of water. This is no sorcery.
She's 1 year older than me, but she looks 10 years older then me. I never said a word about it. I don't want to be mean. She has eyes... She's eating a lot less meat then before lol I wish she would go vegan, but she's oppinionated ...
At leats, it was easier to convince her to wear sunscreen.
I have the same, but more than one and yeah the resentment is real. I’m 51, veg for 11 yrs now and run circles around them
For decades I did not look my age either (vegetarian from 1989 to 2010, vegan from 2010 to present) but aging DID, eventually, catch up to me. I was around 53-55 when I started looking my age :D It's OK though because my turn at being a young woman was well and truly over and being youthful was now up to different generations.
The negative media around aging women is a feminist issue and it's important we embrace our age and model that for younger women. I love the safety, lack of harassment, extra time (retirement means your time is your own - even if you have less money but more 'seniors discounts'), independence and self-direction of being an old woman (plus the end of those monthly cycles
@@drunkvegangal8089 I agree, but there is an obvious lack of hormonal care and research for women who are over 50. A lot of the ageing you mentioned is from the loss of childbearing hormones too so while I feel diet and spiritual/mental health is paramount, so is getting the missing bridge that connects us to feeling strong and healthy, not so much wanting to look young. Recently, a lot of drs took back what they said about HRT being a bad idea, and now suddenly, they’re on top of it! 🤷♀️
@@marlajacques6947 I am continually working at being lessmjudgemental yet I see no objection to letting nature take its course. Awareness, supplementation and exercise goes a long way to addressing aging - but being old is not a disease.
HRT is not something I would personally do but I understand the health and vanity reasons some women and men choose this path. I wish you well :D
As always, follow the money. As Dr Greger likes to say, there's no Big Broccoli out there. Sadly people are desperate for someone to tell them the lies they want to hear. WFPB FTW 🥦🥗💚
Well, the broccoli producers certainly have a representatives working for them. The idea that only certain industries (usually the ones the UA-camr or commentator doesn’t like) are competing for business is a bit silly.
@@devonglide1830Be specific, exactly what organization is representing broccoli producers?
@@hardcoreherbivore4730 One specific example is the California Fresh Carrot Advisory Board, which oversees broccoli marketing efforts, and various agricultural cooperatives.
You act like the poor little vegetable farmers aren't buying and holding land, using trucking and distribution networks, buying chemicals for pesticides and ferts, or lobbying governments. I have no problem with competition or industry, but you guys sound so naive when you act like farms aren't big business and the billions of pounds of broccoli (or whatever produce) don't have large marketing networks and lobbying groups behind them.
@@devonglide1830nope!!!!!
@@devonglide1830 You’re a clown of the highest order.
“The Board acts under the authority of the CDFA and represents only the handlers (shippers) of carrots in California.”
Nothing about broccoli. 🤣
All those people making false claims and blatantly lying..... should be sent to prison.
Im turning 38 in september, people still think im like 25 or so XD Vegan for 20+ years
You look your age.
@@GarudaLegends wtf seriously? Stop lying to yourself, use some AI age guesser. Pretty sure you wouldn't say so if you didn't know ahead. In no way I would've guessed @RapunzelASMR is 38 by looking at her photo or videos
@@Anna-mv9ew Thanks Anna
@@Anna-mv9ew I was born in 86, so she does look her age. Lol. seen her video and she looks amazing. 38 is not old so relax. She is the few vegans who do not look way older than they are and look their age.
@@GarudaLegends you're experiencing anchoring bias and you're just wrong. I've run 15 random shots from her videos through facialage website and it gives 23, 25, 27, 28. The only one that gave over 30 was containing a glitch. So no, you're experiencing a bias due to information about age given prior to you trying to guess the age, and you seem to be unaware of your bias
Everybody here be not eating enough carbs worrying more about wrinkles then feeling there absolute best with lots of energy, Carbs FTW!! 💪💪💪
Carbs and natural sugars for the win! 💪💪
Whenever I watch these videos all I can think of is gratitude: I'm grateful to have the opportunity to be a vegan for the past 33 years. And grateful to have the understanding that aging is wonderful! (I'm in my 50s). With aging comes deep liberation.
❤ preach ❤
We make collagen. We don't eat it. 😂
Taking collagen makes you an UGLY person because they come from exploitation and murder of innocent animals!
All the collagen a cow makes we make too!
Yeah no. As we age we make less and less collagen, which Mic explained in the beginning of the video. While most people seem to be after the 'beauty benefits' that are linked to type 3 human collagen, we may have reason to want to boost our collagen production for health reasons, too. If we don't make enough collagen on our own, it is perfectly understandable to want to help our body synthesize new collagen via supplements.
Carnis who call veganism unnatural are awfully silent when it comes to hydrolyzed collagen peptides.
That's why I drink bone broth that I stew from cows that I'm only a few miles away from and ditch the powdered shit. Grass fed grass finished and all natural baby💪🏼
@@nomadfromkarlsruhe8259 This is in spite of a remarkably scant scientific support of bone broth consumption, and a bevy of known risks.
@@nomadfromkarlsruhe8259 🤮
@@CarecaRussopeople will do the most disgusting shit like drinking bone broth and eating testicles instead of going vegan 😂
People need to understand that aging is NORMAL and NATURAL. Wrinkles, sun spots, stretch marks, etc. show our lived experience. The pressure to try to combat visible signs of aging, especially for women, is out of control in our society.
Men are targeted, too. For balding and erectile dysfunction and low testerone. A ton of money is made from balding men.
Shout out to Auntie Annette Larkins.
She’s gorgeous.
Carrots- eat them 🥕
OMG, when you mentioned the cow brains, it triggered memories of my parents forcing is to eat them. They made an omelette with cow brains and stood by the table with a belt to make sure that we ate them. Every time, they looked away, I stuffed a portion in my pockets, then later threw it away. I washed my pants myself so my mom wouldn't know. I dont even know what theu were thinking. That's one childhood memory that always stands out. 🤢🤮
Wow I'm sorry!
One of your best debunks Mike great video
Veganism is a cult!
@@vrado441 veganism is the inevitable side effect of having empathy and a conscience and the intelligence to act upon them.
43 years for me.
Super healthy and sadly rarely met any other vegans to do cultish things with.
I think we just witnessed the greatest UA-cam ad of all time, boys. ANCHORS AWEIGH!!
Our bodies make collagen. ❤️
Here to say that biotin, not collagen, helps people with autoimmune disease who suffer a lot of tissue damage. I had micro hernias that left me immobilized for years. Being plant-based helped me so much as well but biotin was the missing piece to the puzzle for my autoimmune and hernia repair.
What dose do you take ? Based on what information ? Thank you for your testimony.
To follow the fellow acolyte’s curiosity; could you disclose the nature of the autoimmune disease? Initially confounded in dermatological conditions, but that’s open to interpretation to “tissue damage”.
Curiously, virtually all autoimmune disease disappears or is greatly mitigated by eliminating plant food. Even ms responds extremely well to removal of plant food. Like it or not, believe it or not, carnivore has astonishing power as an elimination diet.
I have been wanting information on this for 7 years. THANK U
Ha you can suggest videos whenever you want!
Woo! Go Annette Larkins!
The thumbnail is me!
The right side of the face, the left side of the face or the guy in the middle ?
Why people like to focusing on single stuff? High carb, low carb, protein this, protein that... like they're some magical solutions.
Great video. Collagen is just another snake oil supplement, and it’s disgusting on so many levels. That and bone broth. Ugh. Just have some broccoli, sweet potatoes, black beans, avocado…you’ll be fine.
I know somebody that has faithfully been taking the broth and collagen for 10 yrs and still looks haggard with wrinkles and complains about joint pain
I hope Complement reaches out to about that ad. That was the best marketing I’ve ever seen a youtuber do.
We needed this video. So much hyperbole about collagen. Thanks
Great video. It's ridiculous to think that collagen, a huge complex protein, gets absorbed in the intesines and transported to the dermis. It's also gross to think that the supplements come from various boiled animal parts. Also, great point about the benefits of vitamin C, which is easy to get from a variety of fruits and plants.
If I ate a lot of eyeballs would my sight improve?
I'm 34 years old but most people think I'm 22-28. 7 years vegan and I just quit drinking alcohol 5 months ago and quit smoking 8 years ago. I think I have genetically good collagen production and I eat very healthy. I get some sun but I try not to over do it.
Smart move on the alcohol. Liver disease sucks.
Congratulations! You are the first person on UA-cam to get me to actually watch an ad by their sponsor!
It should be pretty obvious that none of these supplements work. If they did EVERYONE would take them and we'd all be walking around smooth and plump into our old age.
I thought Dr. Greger just did a video where he was surprised to find out that collagen did make it into the bloodstream intact when consumed. Not broken down into individual amino acids
It doesn't mean your skin will look better or get any healthier
Pretty sure in the same series, it had no demonstrable benefit to humans eating it.
Veganism is a cult!
Seriously, Annette and chef Babette shame me, SHAME me.
One of your clips here sent me down a small rabbit hole involving oral hyaluronic acid supplementation. I don't mind looking my age but I'm tired of my skin literally hurting from being so dry. I asked my dermatologist and she said it would be a good idea to try
You missed a study.
There is a study (Miyab et al 2019) doing the rounds on social media that does compare the effects of collagen and another protein on skin health that found a much larger effect for collagen, but it was done in burn victims, not a very representative population for most collagen users. Also, they used bovine gelatin versus soy flour mixed into porridge, instead of pills that are less likely to differ in taste or texture. No influencer mentions these issues, though.
These types of endorsements/advertisements are so toxic, and they are everywhere! Thanks for breaking this down!
What I find interesting is, if you stop looking at stuff on the internet (instagram etc.), you stop looking at people as "hot/not" and become more drawn to real people and how they make you feel. Happens after a few days already. You become less picky, but in a good way.
I would really love to see a video on the petfluence experiment. I think you'd find it interesting considering it basically proves animal sentience. It's about teaching language with buttons and honestly it's wonderful how deep and personified each cat and dog is when they begin to express themselves with these buttons
Your videos are getting better and better! Love it
Your pirate break there made me think you were interviewing for Monty Python there 🤣
Call-A-Jin 🤣😂 killed me lmao
Thank you! Really loving your videos 🫶
Bro your ads are the best 😂😂
Thanks Mike! I was just wondering about this hot topic, so I appreciate you being up with the info trends!
Thanks so much for this vid!
How do you get natural vitamin D from sunlight if you’re slathering yourself in sunscreen? Do you really think that we were meant to completely avoid sunlight exposure?
I know collagen supplements don't work 😆 I watch these women at work stir it in their coffee 😆 I just roll my eyes 👀
I’m closer to 50 these days and it has become almost entertaining to see the /diet fads come and go…and it seems to always be made of some byproduct , try and sell you ANYTHING.
Good grief, I’m starting to like Mics sense of humor.
I love dr dray
Man the videos are always relevant and right on time. Another good one. What about bcaa and creatinine? I haven't looked to see if you've covered these already.... still watching this one...
Great deep dive and love the B12 cannons 😂
I love the Essentials skit.
Thanks Mike I really needed this.
Veganism is a cult!
@18:00 - that shows something there... Sun will get ya'
Beta-carotene is interesting - 4x wow
some mushrooms are said to stimulate collagen too - wood ear mushrooms, reishi and some others.
Then there's always things like Comfrey, birch bark, and turmeric which will all be helpful.
And then there's exercise, oc
DRAT, a word I don't use enough. Thanks, Mic!
one of your best ads yet!
Have you seen the cow that was crying because they were killing her friends so people could have less wrinkles?
I know you promote whole food supplements as opposed to isolating the supplements. Is Complement Essential made from whole foods? I took a quick look at their website and couldn't suss that out. It's also almost twice as much as something like Huel.
That the problem. With the internet , you just can’t trust it
Interesting video. ❤
When I see muslin women wearing a nicab (covers face and body), I always thought, I bet they have beautiful skin and hair. I am usually in my thoughts all by myself. LOL
Literally based in video advertisement I've ever seen.
People are so desperate to find that one magic thing to fix all their problems. But the reality is if you want to be healthy and age slower you have to eat healthy, exercise, sleep and use sunscreen. That’s hard to sell in a capsule though
I can attest to the sunscreen and sleep remedy! I also wear a sun visor and wear sunscreen on cloudy days too.
No Dr Dre jokes? Really Mic??
So, apparently autistic people tend to look younger. So that and healthy ish eating means I look 60 ish while I'm 78.
Anecdotal but Pacifica Vegan Collagen cream, which is made by fermentation so the same as animal collagen but vegan, has done wonders for my skin. My face looks better for sure. Wrinkles don't go away but they are more hydrated thus softer looking, if that helps.
Thank you, I've always wondered if that product was worth it
It's the hydration , not the collegen.
Bad puns are not vegan. Humans are animals. Animal suffering isn't vegan, and bad puns causes suffering.
As the very end of dis video shows you, someone is always trying to sell you something.
well, most vegans i know have skil like wrinkled paper. so yeah collagene helps.
No, I am not ok with Call-a-jin.
Yr a good actor, Mic.
It the only animal product in which I partake I'm not thrilled to say. GFCP are legit.
Isn't this how Clayface was made?
It's OK to grow old and even *GASP* to look your age! I'm 60 now and would not go back to 45 or even younger. We 60+ folks are the lucky ones who actually grow old and, for women, there are so many benefits (socially) as we age - safety in general and freedom from all the s3xu@l harassment I put up with as a young woman to name just two.
Embrace your age; think kindly, and be grateful, of your amazing body which has carried you through this unique and wonderful adventure called your life.
PS - if any anti-aging products actually worked the manufacturers would be uber-rich by now and the majority of people would be using such a product. Save the money you'd have spent on snake oil and go out and see our amazing world! (or whatever/whomever makes your heart sing).
as an indoor vegan nerd-gamer, i accidentally fell unto the solution to younger skin... no sun! I look 35 and I'm pushing 50 ! Of course, I'm wife-less and Kid-less but that's a good thing too. Thx for all the videos hombré ! and congrats on the 400k
💚💪☮️🌱
Nice AD. Haha you should write children books. Funny. 😂
I can't speak for others but as a person with CTD I can say after taking collagen, I get a really intense surge in skin and nail health appearance and texture. But it only lasts for a couple of days, even with continued consumption. I don't know if perhaps it's just me getting psychologically used to the effects or the effects actually reducing. Very similar results and story for those Glucosamine, Chondroitin and MSM supplements, too. I can't speculate what the effect really is, in professional terms, but as a layperson I suspected my body was perhaps becoming quickly habituated to presence of collagen in diet (and "deciding" to go lazy mode and stop converting it from other sources within days of taking these supps).
I don't know, all I can say is the effect is super intense and always comes back one sleep later after taking these supplements.
❤❤❤
Corporations are trying to see you a bunch of garbage and even play with your health. Live naturally and you will live a long and happy life 👉The Connections (2021) [short documentary]💖
my wife selenium :3
💚💚💚💚💚💚💚💯
I am an older American. Part of my exercise activities is the use of a rowing machine. Normally, I supplement with a turmeric mix and collagen. For about a month I was not able to row and did not take the collagen. I restarted rowing a week ago and my back creaked like an unoiled door. I quickly restarting the collagen and today while rowing everything was smooth, works for me.
Do you eat enough protein?
don't you think the lack of rowing could've caused you to stiffen up?
@@pattheplanter I think so. Most people eat more protein than they need and the extra is turned into fat. If you Google "Do Older Adults Really Need More Protein? New Scientific Studies" you get several references saying yes. Then you come to Miche, PhD and she says that Meta Analysis say no.
@@hannahmitchell87 Could be. Nothing wrong with exercise and supplements. I do know that I have arthritis in several joints and if I stop taking Turmeric(w black pepper and ginger) things get painful.
@@chrisconklin2981 If you are exercising heavily you probably need a lot of protein for repairs. Ypu could try eating a load more nuts and beans rather than collagen and see if you are still as fine as I am.
Caveat stupor.
Mike, I think your biases are showing a little bit in this video. Ok, so many of the studies were sponsored by industry. Two points about this: you can't just automatically dismiss a study on this basis. Such a study might turn out to have been legit. You have to actually dig into the study and find out how well it was done. Also, I think you said something like "many" of the studies were done by industry. But then that implies that at least a few were not. So then maybe focus more discussion/analysis on the ones that wereen't done by industry. What do such studies show?
You point out that some of the studies included other substances besides collagen, so we don't know if it was those other substances or the collagen causing the effects. Ok, but once again, if "some" studies were like this, presumably some were not. So once again, analyze just the latter and see what they show.
You point out the potentially harmful "junk" thrown into collagen supplements (brains, lead, etc.). Good point, but are there any such supplements that go out their way to avoid or remove the junk? Maybe mention this.
Lastly, you say that any positive effects on skin might be just due to the fact that collagen is protein, suggesting regular (and cheaper and potentially safer) protein powders might do the same thing. Fair point, but I've seen respectable people (Dr. Brad Stanfield, e.g.) point to studies that compared effects of protein powders to those of collagen, and collagen produced better results (one looked at the healing rates of burn victims). DId you look for any such studies?
Veganism is a cult!
I have to agree. I am vegan and even if collagen could miraculously make me look 15 years younger I would still not take it, as long as it comes from animals (as opposed to something like precision fermentation). But I think if you choose to talk about a topic, you need to try to be as unbiased and as fair as possible when evaluating evidence.
@@veka8946 Agreed.
@@veka8946 another nut job?
@@veka8946agreed. And I just take a vegan collagen boosting supplement. The main ingredients are glycine and hyaluronic acid. The will help your body produce its own collagen. Collagen peptides from animals anyways have to be broken down by the body - thus these animal based supplements only providing you with the necessary amino acid profile for collagen.
💯👍🎯
💚🐾🌱💚🐾🌱💚🐾🌱💚🐾🌱
Nic from @physionic says he’s taking collegen until proven otherwise. If Nic is in I’m in. I also take HMW hyaluronic acid … both cheap … if they keep my skin hydrated and youthful .. great .. if not ..just more amino acids. At 66 I have zero body wrinkles .. like to keep it that way (face hasn’t fared quite as well but not too wrinkly)
I also listen to Nic, and Brad Stanfield is on board. Hyaluronic acid taken orally is my other skin care supplement, with noticeable moisturizing effects.
B12
Ooh a gotcha ?
Millions of omnivores are deficient.
It costs pennies.
Not a vegan, but I did notice a slight skin complexion improvement taking some collagen peptide supplement. I've heard something about collagen peptides don't get fully broken down in the gut. In general i don't ascribe to " food camps". Perhaps there are vegan sources of compounds that the body can use to make collagen that are ultimately superior in improving skin complexion and even skin health.
I take glycine supplement. It's cheaper and it functions as a sweetener (1.5 as sweet as sugar) besides being vegan.
Normally the body builds protein from amino acids. If collagen is no exception (which I've seen no data for) you just need the right amino acids (plus Vitamin C, zink, ... in your diet to fold collagen in the right way).
Glycine is the limiting amino acid in most diets for collagen. Glycine is known to increase skin elasticity, thickness and hydration.
I have not seen comparison studies to collagen so far.
I think that's very strange because it's an obvious thing to test. But that's how it is.
👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌👌
Gross, dude. 🧸🌱💚💙
super sketchy
bro, you dont look too good. Eat meat.
He looks great!
I´m plant based for health reasons, not ethics. But I do supplement with a gram or two of collagen per day (the sources are disgusting) . I have no clue to if it is good for skin or hair, but having to cut my nails once or twice a week when taking collagen is a very obvious effect!
Way to make the distinction that you don’t care about the ethics surrounding animal consumption 🤣
Your definitely wrong on this one. Collagen saved my marriage. I am so thankful.
Because you sell it and made lot's of money and your spouse is now happy?
😂
How can collagen save a relationship?
Cope harder man.
Collagen is integral for the Immune System (Glutathione), Bone health, Hyaluronic Acid, etc. The body does not make enough, just like it doesn't make enough Cholesterol on an animal-restricted diet.
@@abominablesnowman3494 yea, and he's wrong.