Love watching u and Don work y'all magic on them bikes. That's why I sent my ecu to u to flash my 2018 zx14r and it run good and the map is great u sent me... keep the video coming I watch em like I watch tv lobe it...
Just a question cause im not gonna ride or haul my 08 10r from novascotia canada to you for tuning BUT......I have the woolich software for mine to which i started to get into but walked away from bikes for awhile(bought a house and dealing with my cancer)..Others im sure have the same software and maybe wanna come see you for tuneing so are your systems compatible to tune useing woolich and not your power commanders n such....More or less asking for others out there..
@@craig_sez8534 Our MorDefy software/hardware is not compatible with other software out there. Just like the others aren't compatible with each other. If you are switching tuning software, it is best to flash the ECU back to stock and start fresh. Otherwise it is possible to render your ECU useless.
My recent discovery of Brock’s UA-cam has been just a revelation. From seeing Brock’s exhaust on bikes and taking interest to the point of watching a video such as this from start to finish! My happy dream is very small…a 2021 Yamaha mt-09sp which has a cp3 triple motor. I’d like Brock to make me a special under bike exhaust that terminates right behind the right peg of the bike. I’ve seen Moore get a crazy tune on a 2020 I believe? Brock just explains the process a whole lot more…which really instills confidence in me. Or the common term….”just take my money plzzzzz!!!”
THANKS to BOTH of you taking the amount of time to "do", "record", "explain" and then edit this vid! Even with what DON explained is most likely less 10% of the work on a "flash" that goes into each bike!! Thanks again for allowing us to see this. See ya in the next one.
Wow, what an awesome video! You guy's flashed the ECU for my ZX14 several years ago.Along with that sweet "Alien Head Exhaust",and PC5, and I continue to have one Big Ass Smile! Happy Holiday, and Outstanding work gentlemen, Scott in Detroit
I don't have a bike and definitely no idea on Tuning.. but I just have to drop a comment of appreciation on the effort on making this video.. very professional, Informative and you can clearly see the love and enthusiasm for his Craft or may I say his Art. Not selfish on sharing information not unlike other tuners
taking the time to make a video like this is much appreciated. I feel like there are a lot more DIY'ers out there due to internet access and price of service continually rising. For a shop to take the time to show some install tips and tricks is amazing. Keep it up!
@Nick Santo - thank you for appreciating the time/effort. Don drove about 8 hours (each way), we shot videos for almost 8 hours, and then our amazing creative services manger edited the vid(s), created the time stamps, images etc. And our social media manager distributes accordingly. It's a big job and it takes a long time, but comments like yours make it easier.
@@BrockDavidson I do very light video editing and uploading to UA-cam so I definitely know how much time has to go into it. That's why I wanted to make sure you knew it was very much appreciated. Add in the fact that you are taking time out of your work day to make the content and sharing with us stuff that most tuners don't want to. Giving back to the community is huge in my book. Keep up the great work! Making a trip out to your shop is on my bucket list, lol...
Absolutely brilliant!!! Thank you Brock and Don, nothing else on the internet comes close to detailing what is really going on with a modern motorcycles ecu. You know both men are genius level both by the results and their ability to translate incredibly complex information into easy to understand basic lingo for the average consumer. Can't wait to see the true potential of the ZX unlocked with your combined talents!?
After watching this i had to get my ZX10R flashed. I was misled I needed a piggy back system, wrong as you can see in this video. As you can see that top end power is much improved. Even more but i will not bore you. Happy as hell with the bike thank you both. Next project ceramic bearings, saw that video too. Thanks guys.
Don "gul'dan" of world of warcraft; black magic wizardry. Absolutely mind blown at how informative and technical this stuff gets and sharing it with the public. (y)
Why does the bike only have approx 180HP? I am from the EU and any stock X10R measured by the motorbike magazines here has around 195-200HP. What am I missing?
Looking forward to the slip on vs full system breakdown to clear up the long standing consumer debate on if its worth it or not to go full system. Cant wait to see the midrange differences.. good vid fellas.
Dan must be really happy that two legends are actually working on his bike! Edit: this video runs way too rich on content quality 😉 thanks for taking the time to record and edit it!
One of my friends referred me to you. I’m gonna start saving my pennies so I can get the brocks performance done on my 2019 zx10r. I saw what your work did to his bike and it was mind blowing! I can’t wait to see what you can do to mine!!
@Jx3, welcome aboard! Your friend is correct - we can make your ZX-10R #stupidfast Check out our XDA Super Stock Champion, David Fondon, here: bit.ly/2QxP3JY
My 2014 has 23k miles on it and ive been eyeing this bike since it came out. Was waiting for someone to have flash results. Ghul flashed my 2014 and when i buy this bike this winter ill be getting his flash again.
@@Luckky-13 never dynoed the bike before hand but with his flash, 2 brothers shorty slipon (cat delete), stock air filter made 176hp. I bought a autotune after and I haven't had it dynoed since then. Im sure its about 180hp now.
That was great information. They totally explained the science in regards to ECU flashing. If your going to get your bike flashed, might as well get it done right.
Good day I'm glad I came across this video. I notice in your video the bike didn't start back up. What was the issue?..I believe I have the same problem with my bike , I'm getting fuel but no spark.
Here are our full system offerings: bit.ly/2WjWTq5 and Sprint Filter offerings bit.ly/3gRWzIL we are placing the finishing touches on our ECU flash, it will be in the store soon.
Hey brock , i notice on every dyno run it takes 5plus seconds for the throttle postion sensor to reach 100%. You fixed the topend but you missed down low. Example: you hold throttle at 10%=40mph your hand goes 100% instantly to start the pull the sensor instantly went to 45% then climb slowly to 100% about 4sec. I just rewatched gsxR1000 s2 ep7 ,a dyno pull close to the end it takes 2 to 3 sec to go 100% . Watch @ 20:03
We take the complexity out of it for you. Once you see what this bike does when it's finished, I believe you will appreciate the additional engineering that went into it.
@@BrockDavidson oh I don't doubt it. If I do ever collect as many bikes as I want to, I'll utilize your services. As it is, my bandit is making tons of grunt off idle and with pistons and cams makes enough for me on the top end, too. Any work on, say, BMW you do?
It does, but opening the throttle plates sooner doesn't necessarily mean the bike has that ability to ingest more air - but it does mean that whacking the gas wide open at lower RPM in higher gears results in a miss/sputter and even a stall if the rider does not intervene. We will fine-tune the opening rate to match the additional intake and exhaust mods as needed.
This is the beauty of these throttle-by-wire systems! The manufacturers can size the throttle bodies for additional power without worrying about affecting part throttle performance and low/mid range power. With this style system we can program the throttles to open enough to give us best power, but not so much that it hurts performance. Testing these settings are now a standard part of tuning these new "high tech" bikes. 1 to 1 throttle opening on this bike would be a disaster!!! :-)
The japanese manufacturers have been at this for over a decade. My Gixxer 2004 1000 is before drive by wire. It had the secondary throttle valves in the Keihins. The way they have done it on mine was to lean the fuel from over 9000rpm or so, particularly on full throttle. I always wondered why in laid over, and you could hear the valvetrain was just spinning, not driving and accelerating ie went noisy/rattly. They leaned it to the tune of 20-25%....can't imagine what the air/fuel ratio was.....but I must say they are pretty tolerant of a wide range of values ie combustion technology is amazing. The secondary throttle valves had some pretty weird mapping std, but at least they were open from that rpm up (at all throttle positions no less!). There are also gains to be made with the ignition timing, partiularly in the driveability range that he talks about in his other videos.
Thats wild. Theres gotta be someone else doing it tho..im sure he isn’t the only one who can force it to read his map vs the factory’s noise restriction maps but im sure its complicated and not just anyone can do it unless there a programmer aswell haha good stuff Brock really interesting how they have the ability to do that, funny how they would even keep the exhaust servo motor basically closed
So is the throttle restriction from factory in the ECU for protecting the motor or is there another reason for the factory to restrict that way? Are there any special considerations one has to take when derestricting their bike? My bike has carbs and just dumb computers being from 1983 so this beep boop fancy stuff is all new to me!
The throttle restriction is primarily for reduced emissions and noise abatement...mostly to appease California. The same engines are derestricted all of the world with no reduction in lifespan.
Don is a genius, I once met a guy that does this to truck and car ECU's, he could check barcode numbers on an ECU then rewrite it so there where sunstantial power gains
At the top you are running rich and you are bout to adjust that air fuel. Are your fan setup to simulate the ram air effect which would add more air at speed. Countering that rich condition at the top?
We don't have the means to truly mimic ram air effect in a static application - we would need a dyno in a wind tunnel. Fan's faking a constant 200+ mph at any/all rpm's and wheel speeds are nothing more than a morale boost to the dyno operator (and bike owner). If you notice our dyno room, all attempts are made NOT to force air into the inlets. We use data gathering at the race track to truly track ram air performance vs. ecu compensation - you would be surprised, Generally speaking: most Suzuki ECU's overcompensate with too much fuel, most kaws undercompensate - the BMW's do the best at getting it right. We will elaborate more once we get to the track.
Ida Pro decompiler will get you on the back end of the ecu. And see the instructions on how maps register. To view raw hex use WiNOLS. The one he showed is a basic Hex editor. S1000rr has 3000 maps😉😉.
Hey i have a quick question. First of i just received my brocks penta carbón full exhaust and i love it. Only thing is i need to get a servo buddy. But my question is should i or do i have to get a pcv and then flash my ecu? Or if I’m getting my Ecu flash i won’t need the pcv? Last one is i still would need a servo buddy no matter if i flash my ecu or not?
Hi good day hope all is well I live in Namibia Windhoek and I have a hayabusa 99 mobile with a 1400 kit on it I also only have stock ECU on it but had a power commander 3 on it that was stolen by a dealer but okay the bike did a 9.30 on 1/4 mil but hopefully want to upgrade it soon with power commander 5 or something better and stage 2 pro supercharger it I can please advice me on how to get started
I want as much tourq as possible down low on my s1000rr. not sure if a pipe and flash does this . it starts wheelstand at 5 thousand.. I'd like 3 or 4 at worse .. can you get that with pipe and flash. ???
This video is pure automotive porn. If the information contained in it could be turned in to a wallpaper, I would wallpaper entire house with it. Also from the outside. It's time for the bed now, so I am sure my brain is getting re-flashed overnight. Could not have come across any better thing to watch, that's for sure. My bike has to wait until winter with it's flash to make absolute max out of the dying riding season here up north... A million thanks for this baffling load of information and huge salute to you both gentlemen!
Any progress on cracking the ECU on the Kaw Z H 2 ? Already had the ECU done on my 2015 H 2 and 2020 H 2 SX SE, the latter this week. Will try the H 2 SX SE this Sunday.
Chris, we are not set-up to offer the Bren Tuning Flashes on our site. Give them a call, they will point you to exactly what you need as far as a flash. We offer PCV mapping to match our exhaust, Sprint Filter etc... through our Map Support Program: blog.brocksperformance.com/category/map-support/
I got a problem with my 2013 ecu. And looking for a new ecu.. I found 2012 ecu.. will it fit my bike bcoz as long as I know the 2013 got an ESD while 2012 doesnt
That's why the S1000RR has been the bike to beat, but even they are confronted with strict noise and emissions regulations that hamper the performance of their newest models.
@@BrockDavidson I saw that with the retarded dead spot, but is it about the tune, the cams, the pistons. As in what is making S1000RR and the Ducatti hit 198+Hp with a little tuning while the likes of Kawasaki are at 185ish after tuning? 15Hp is a big gain I believe.
@Meemo M -You can use the auto tune addition to map self-tune, but we find a properly created dynamic map works better. More info: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/how-can-brocks-get-mapping-so-close/
I just got the younger brother model of this bike same year a week ago... the zx-6r, same color storm gray. Wish I could afford the big bro version.. some day. My 2015 636 got stolen... Love my bike so far though. Still breaking her in, only 250 miles on it. So hard not to rip the throttle lol.. I'm trying to break her in properly so she will last me... I got a whole christmas list of mods and plans for her lol.
Great Question! For racing, we are mandated to use a non-glycol based coolant, because glycol-based coolants are toxic and difficult to clean up after a spill/crash. Does that make it better for street bikes?...not really, in fact it can cause great grief for your bike is ever subjected to freezing temps. These water-based coolants can do an excellent job of keeping your ride cool on a hot day, but if your bike is subjected to freezing temps, the water can freeze. What's the big deal? Your bike has 'freeze plugs' that will pop out in case the coolant ever freezes - once out, if you start your bike - as soon as it warms up, the frozen mixture will dilute your oil and possibly cause catastrophic engine damage. We learned this the hard way after trailering one of our race bikes from our heated facility in Ohio, to a race during freezing temps - there is no way to tell if you have this problem unless you view your oil and it's 'milky-looking' from mixing with water. We rode the bike to tech, made a run and had completely wiped out all of the crank and rod bearings by the end of the 1st run. It was an expensive mistake. We use standard antifreeze (usually the 50/50 premix) or we use #evanswaterbased coolant in our streetbikes here @brocksperf - or MoCool in our race bikes: brocksperformance.com/motul-mo-cool-radiator-additive-16-9oz/
@@BrockDavidson Thanks for the quick response. What about Evans Waterless Coolant? Another question, my motorcycle is tuned for 91 pump, can i run 93 pump which has 10% ethonol?
We have been testing the Evans waterless coolant with very good results: www.evanscoolant.com/vehicle-types/powersports/ - yes on the 93 with 10% ethanol (stay away from any more than 10%) - here is more info. on octane: blog.brocksperformance.com/throttle-nation-magazine-the-gas-factor-fuel-options-for-max-hp/
Hi, I'm having an issue with my 2014 zx6r, I can run it no problem with stock maps in ecu, but as soon as I do any kind of modification to the ecu with FT flash, it wont run, it start then the bike shuts off and give me code 39 (ecu comunicatio problem) even only deactivating the servo or any small modification, bike wont keep runing. Any idea what is wrong ? I did cycle the key
@@BrockDavidson thanks for getting back to me, we allready contacted ft ecu flash, they suggested that my issue would be coming for something else since they dont see anything wrong with the license or the software.
Hey Brock how are you? I have an 04 zx10r I took my bike to a shop and had a 08 intake cam installed along with a mail in ecu flash I'm running a 17 tooth sprocket on front and a 40 on the back. Before I had the work done I was running 17 and 39 and my bike had plenty of torque and power. Had no problems raising the front tire in 1st 2nd 3rd and sometimes 4th. Now it wont raise the front tire at all it seems I have lost all torque and alot of power on low and top end any suggestions on what I can do or what the problem is? Some else had the same setup and said that I would have to re degree my cam to 105...
Was falling asleep after riding for a bit and remembered I wanted to post this comment. I have a 2019 ninja h2 that I really have decided not to do much with for a bit of time but I wish I could remove the restrictions without doing anything excessive to the bike. I always check in on your videos but genuinely enjoyed this one having Don Guhl and the new 10 puts a great video and I love the detail explanation maybe one of you two can derestrict my h2 ???
@@BrockDavidson here in the Philippines,the 150cc thru 200cc are very popular,most ignition upgrades is to use a racing cdi and hi performance coils,but im not in favor of racing cdis' bcause there is no rev limiter,if were in the same place i would really like to have you tune my bike,im a bike enthusiast,i really love working on my 150cc bike😊
Great question. In a nutshell, the flash matches other non-restricted international models with slight enhancements. If the operator stays at a reasonable rpm for a reasonable time, there is no reason to expect a lack of longivity.
Does tuning in Full Power mode, Medium power mode and Low Power mode matter on 19-20 zx10? I have a tune in C85 via power commander 5, but my bike has not liked e85 in general the way it runs. I know c85 can only be run with c85 and X85 is okay to run with pump e85, but It’s been a hit or miss on pump in the streets. The dyno was amazing on c85 , but once I took it out to race (higher altitude) it did not even want to cruise. I definitely could’ve tuned on ECU alone , but I’m curious if the bike would adapt or feel better depending on the modes, tuning on just the ecu only or if the modes it’s just neutral all across and I can potentially run different fuels while tuning on ecu
No. Different modes are controlled primarily by the electronic throttle valve. AFR is AFR regardless of the mode you're in. What you just described is exactly why we do not offer e85 or c85 tunes at Brock's performance. They seem to work well for cars, but motorcycles are not smart enough to take full advantage... Unless you are at wide open throttle, where driveability does not matter.
@@BrockDavidson yea for more power/race. Do you know if adjusting timing is necessary for any e85/c85 tunes? I’m just trying to make mine work where I see everyone else on c85 near me is making amazing performance for straight line power. Mr12 is my last resort , I’ve tuned on it before and it works like a charm, but racing in Nevada 100+ heat, I’d much rather take advantage of e85 cooling benefits
Sudden hate for EFI and ECUs is still real and alive, I just felt it . . . 😒😁 Almost fell of my chair hearing all the B.S the tuner has to weed thru and out of the system . . . much respect for him and his work. I still remember him for cracking the ECU on the back then new VFR1200. I'ma go get my spare brain swapped in and swap out the burnt one after going thru this video. 😖🤪😵
was that wheel hp or crank hp? I have a 2019 krt and only did a akropovic slip on with cat delete and wanting to do a flash im the future. Im seeing some great knowledge between the both of you and might consider a flash from guhl but will I need to bring the bike to him or just the ecu and dyno tune it after to fix the afr readings from running to rich or to lean. Does elevation play a big part? I am 7ft above sea level.
We use a Dynojet Model 250 I rear-wheel dyno on the SAE scale. Elevation does play a big part, but the sensors on your bike tell the ECU what to do in regard to engine tune. This is why you can travel from Florida to Colorado without remapping.
Data is available from the ECU (OBD2) and we do use quite a bit of it in our testing. We use the PCV to tune fuel in conjunction with the tuning link function on the Dynojet model 250I, as we find it makes a far more precise map than fuel tuning through the ECU. The PCV is also friendlier to tune at the track, especially if wifi is not available or weak. For those who do not like PCV's, we have flashes available with no PCV required, but they are not able to be user-tuned: brocksperformance.com/brockflash-ecu-stage-1-f-with-fuel-tune-for-full-system-zx-10r-2019-must-send-us-your-ecu/
@@BrockDavidson okay, in that case, why do the engineers make it harder to crack the ECU's. Shouldn't they just make it easier for tuners to gain access to it. Why do it at all, the tuners are anyways gonna crack it somehow no matter how hard it is.
I just purchased an 06 zx14 with flies removed and PC5 installed, the throttle is very choppy at startup until it warms up. Can I just put it back to stock or it requires a tuning.
Hi, Brock! Awesome video as always! Could you tell me, please one thing. Is it any possible way to log ETV values without PowerCommander? Just tap into that grey wire and make a table Voltage vs RPM?
Yes. You use the dyno analog input sensor , connected to the bikes subthrottle sensor output and ground - then calibrate the blade open/closed on a 0V-5V scale...the PCV is much simpler ;)
If there is one person I would like to work with my bike on the dyno it would be Brock. Listen how after the rev limiter hits Brock immediately goes into letting the motor rest mode instead of letting it sit there and decelerate from 15,000 rpm with the dyno. I’m guessing he pulls in the clutch and uses the rear brake to slow down the dyno??? Or is there some kind of dyno brake??
Brock Davidson that’s awesome brock I’m still wanting my bike tuned, have a new full system waiting to be installed if I could find a tuner that really knows his shit. I’m in Ky not to awful far from you and would bring it to you in a heartbeat. This bike is my baby I looked for 2 years for a clean unmolested 04/06 R1 and this baby only had 715 miles on it absolutely mint. 5,000 miles now still stock being I want a competent tuner involved when I install it.
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Love watching u and Don work y'all magic on them bikes. That's why I sent my ecu to u to flash my 2018 zx14r and it run good and the map is great u sent me... keep the video coming I watch em like I watch tv lobe it...
@@tenminuteplease1330 the 2019 GSX-R is mechanically unchanged from our 2017 GSX-R1000 Gixzilla.
Just a question cause im not gonna ride or haul my 08 10r from novascotia canada to you for tuning BUT......I have the woolich software for mine to which i started to get into but walked away from bikes for awhile(bought a house and dealing with my cancer)..Others im sure have the same software and maybe wanna come see you for tuneing so are your systems compatible to tune useing woolich and not your power commanders n such....More or less asking for others out there..
Would it be possible to hit 200whp for the zx10r, sorry for the stupid figures just a guy with a dreamy vision
@@craig_sez8534 Our MorDefy software/hardware is not compatible with other software out there. Just like the others aren't compatible with each other. If you are switching tuning software, it is best to flash the ECU back to stock and start fresh. Otherwise it is possible to render your ECU useless.
My recent discovery of Brock’s UA-cam has been just a revelation. From seeing Brock’s exhaust on bikes and taking interest to the point of watching a video such as this from start to finish! My happy dream is very small…a 2021 Yamaha mt-09sp which has a cp3 triple motor. I’d like Brock to make me a special under bike exhaust that terminates right behind the right peg of the bike. I’ve seen Moore get a crazy tune on a 2020 I believe? Brock just explains the process a whole lot more…which really instills confidence in me. Or the common term….”just take my money plzzzzz!!!”
“Brock always has a way of explaining things so that I could understand”
-Forrest Gump
THANKS to BOTH of you taking the amount of time to "do", "record", "explain" and then edit this vid! Even with what DON explained is most likely less 10% of the work on a "flash" that goes into each bike!! Thanks again for allowing us to see this. See ya in the next one.
Wow, what an awesome video! You guy's flashed the ECU for my ZX14 several years ago.Along with that sweet "Alien Head Exhaust",and PC5, and I continue to have one Big Ass Smile! Happy Holiday, and Outstanding work gentlemen, Scott in Detroit
Just bought your S2B package can’t wait to install everything thanks for all the customer support all my bikes will have your products from now on!!
Don & Brock making motorcycles great again 🇺🇲
I don't have a bike and definitely no idea on Tuning.. but I just have to drop a comment of appreciation on the effort on making this video.. very professional, Informative and you can clearly see the love and enthusiasm for his Craft or may I say his Art. Not selfish on sharing information not unlike other tuners
Thank you. We try hard to present the best/most accurate info. possible at all times.
taking the time to make a video like this is much appreciated. I feel like there are a lot more DIY'ers out there due to internet access and price of service continually rising. For a shop to take the time to show some install tips and tricks is amazing. Keep it up!
@Nick Santo - thank you for appreciating the time/effort. Don drove about 8 hours (each way), we shot videos for almost 8 hours, and then our amazing creative services manger edited the vid(s), created the time stamps, images etc. And our social media manager distributes accordingly. It's a big job and it takes a long time, but comments like yours make it easier.
@@BrockDavidson I do very light video editing and uploading to UA-cam so I definitely know how much time has to go into it. That's why I wanted to make sure you knew it was very much appreciated. Add in the fact that you are taking time out of your work day to make the content and sharing with us stuff that most tuners don't want to. Giving back to the community is huge in my book. Keep up the great work! Making a trip out to your shop is on my bucket list, lol...
You both are a match made in heaven for the bike I don't even own...YET!
My mom owned but we sold it to someone in Egypt lol
Absolutely brilliant!!! Thank you Brock and Don, nothing else on the internet comes close to detailing what is really going on with a modern motorcycles ecu. You know both men are genius level both by the results and their ability to translate incredibly complex information into easy to understand basic lingo for the average consumer.
Can't wait to see the true potential of the ZX unlocked with your combined talents!?
This is the most informative way I've seen explaining tuning and mapping for bikes. Well done 👍
I have learned more about tuning ecus in this video than the books I've read and all the videos I've ever seen
Hey you guys hiring lmao I see you're in Dayton
I'm binge watching brock's videos and I don't even have a motorcycle license yet. god damn it.
Most of us don't lol
Love these videos Brock. That bike is strong for sure. Can't wait to see what the future holds.
I work in a mobile electronics shop and the posi-tap connectors are the next best thing to solder. Love those things.
My position 100%...but careful...the Internet doesn't agree 😉🤣🏁👍👍
After watching this i had to get my ZX10R flashed. I was misled I needed a piggy back system, wrong as you can see in this video. As you can see that top end power is much improved. Even more but i will not bore you. Happy as hell with the bike thank you both. Next project ceramic bearings, saw that video too. Thanks guys.
Excellent video. I definitely appreciate how informative you guys are with all the detail. Can't wait till you finish your part.
this had to be one of the most interesting videos i have ever seen
Noise abatement control. Key words. Nice to see the bit and byte level map code.
Don "gul'dan" of world of warcraft; black magic wizardry.
Absolutely mind blown at how informative and technical this stuff gets and sharing it with the public. (y)
This video is responsible for my subscription to the channel.
You just don’t get passion and enthusiasm explained like this anymore.
I’ll be picking up a 2019 ZX-10R after Jan 1 2019.
I most certainly want this configuration
A real builder/tuner.
Still don’t get why that EJR guy is even on YT?
Why does the bike only have approx 180HP? I am from the EU and any stock X10R measured by the motorbike magazines here has around 195-200HP. What am I missing?
The US Model must pass strict California noise and emissions regulations. They are more stringent than Euro 5.
@@BrockDavidson wow, I am very surprised that California has stricter norms than the EU. Thank you for the fast reply and keep up the cool videos! :)
Great video brock! Love these videos you have been doing! THUMBS UP@!
Looking forward to the slip on vs full system breakdown to clear up the long standing consumer debate on if its worth it or not to go full system. Cant wait to see the midrange differences.. good vid fellas.
Teaser alert from previous testing: blog.brocksperformance.com/brocknm/articlefiles/Landing_Page/3_ZX10R_Comparison_AH2_vs_Slipon_vs_Stock_Mid.jpg
Dan must be really happy that two legends are actually working on his bike!
Edit: this video runs way too rich on content quality 😉 thanks for taking the time to record and edit it!
One of my friends referred me to you. I’m gonna start saving my pennies so I can get the brocks performance done on my 2019 zx10r. I saw what your work did to his bike and it was mind blowing! I can’t wait to see what you can do to mine!!
@Jx3, welcome aboard! Your friend is correct - we can make your ZX-10R #stupidfast
Check out our XDA Super Stock Champion, David Fondon, here: bit.ly/2QxP3JY
My 2014 has 23k miles on it and ive been eyeing this bike since it came out. Was waiting for someone to have flash results. Ghul flashed my 2014 and when i buy this bike this winter ill be getting his flash again.
How much hp gain did you get with guhl flash on your 2014?
@@Luckky-13 Our reflash for the 2011-15 ZX10R is normally has gains of 9-14 hp peak and 19-24 hp near the rev limit.
@@Luckky-13 never dynoed the bike before hand but with his flash, 2 brothers shorty slipon (cat delete), stock air filter made 176hp. I bought a autotune after and I haven't had it dynoed since then. Im sure its about 180hp now.
That was great information. They totally explained the science in regards to ECU flashing. If your going to get your bike flashed, might as well get it done right.
I was told there’d be no math! Another awesome video Brock!
Glad you liked it!
Good day I'm glad I came across this video. I notice in your video the bike didn't start back up. What was the issue?..I believe I have the same problem with my bike , I'm getting fuel but no spark.
We must cycle the key on and off 3 times after the ECU is flashed, then they start right up.
Just got a 2020 Z900 in September.. What's it run for your pipe and a tune up
Here are our full system offerings: bit.ly/2WjWTq5 and Sprint Filter offerings bit.ly/3gRWzIL we are placing the finishing touches on our ECU flash, it will be in the store soon.
Hey brock , i notice on every dyno run it takes 5plus seconds for the throttle postion sensor to reach 100%. You fixed the topend but you missed down low.
Example: you hold throttle at 10%=40mph your hand goes 100% instantly to start the pull the sensor instantly went to 45% then climb slowly to 100% about 4sec.
I just rewatched gsxR1000 s2 ep7 ,a dyno pull close to the end it takes 2 to 3 sec to go 100% . Watch @ 20:03
This was a quick tune, simply to show the results of derestriction on a completely stock bike.
Brock, absolutely amazing video, love this stuff
Oh and I love u Brock and I love your vids we use your products a lot here in the middle east
All the complexity of these new bikes makes me appreciate the simplicity of my '08 even more.
We take the complexity out of it for you. Once you see what this bike does when it's finished, I believe you will appreciate the additional engineering that went into it.
@@BrockDavidson oh I don't doubt it. If I do ever collect as many bikes as I want to, I'll utilize your services. As it is, my bandit is making tons of grunt off idle and with pistons and cams makes enough for me on the top end, too.
Any work on, say, BMW you do?
Which BMW? We have done piles of work on the S1000RR since it came out in 2010: blog.brocksperformance.com/bmw-s1000rr-10-16-information-page/
@@BrockDavidson that's the one! will check it out, thx
Hello Sir Brock , thanks for your videos
welcome back my friend haha long time no see
looking at the TPS on the dyno, even after modifying the table, the throttle seems to open slow.
It does, but opening the throttle plates sooner doesn't necessarily mean the bike has that ability to ingest more air - but it does mean that whacking the gas wide open at lower RPM in higher gears results in a miss/sputter and even a stall if the rider does not intervene. We will fine-tune the opening rate to match the additional intake and exhaust mods as needed.
thanks for the reply. can"t wait for the next video
This is the beauty of these throttle-by-wire systems! The manufacturers can size the throttle bodies for additional power without worrying about affecting part throttle performance and low/mid range power. With this style system we can program the throttles to open enough to give us best power, but not so much that it hurts performance. Testing these settings are now a standard part of tuning these new "high tech" bikes. 1 to 1 throttle opening on this bike would be a disaster!!! :-)
@@GuhlMotors12345 yeah I didn't think about that at first. I have had some large throttle bodies that caused some driveability issues
@@randyschmidt19 Duc 749 ? I heard it suffered of it badly . . .
The japanese manufacturers have been at this for over a decade. My Gixxer 2004 1000 is before drive by wire. It had the secondary throttle valves in the Keihins. The way they have done it on mine was to lean the fuel from over 9000rpm or so, particularly on full throttle. I always wondered why in laid over, and you could hear the valvetrain was just spinning, not driving and accelerating ie went noisy/rattly. They leaned it to the tune of 20-25%....can't imagine what the air/fuel ratio was.....but I must say they are pretty tolerant of a wide range of values ie combustion technology is amazing. The secondary throttle valves had some pretty weird mapping std, but at least they were open from that rpm up (at all throttle positions no less!). There are also gains to be made with the ignition timing, partiularly in the driveability range that he talks about in his other videos.
Thats wild. Theres gotta be someone else doing it tho..im sure he isn’t the only one who can force it to read his map vs the factory’s noise restriction maps but im sure its complicated and not just anyone can do it unless there a programmer aswell haha good stuff Brock really interesting how they have the ability to do that, funny how they would even keep the exhaust servo motor basically closed
So is the throttle restriction from factory in the ECU for protecting the motor or is there another reason for the factory to restrict that way? Are there any special considerations one has to take when derestricting their bike? My bike has carbs and just dumb computers being from 1983 so this beep boop fancy stuff is all new to me!
The throttle restriction is primarily for reduced emissions and noise abatement...mostly to appease California. The same engines are derestricted all of the world with no reduction in lifespan.
Very educational vid. Thank you very much!
It will be interesting how close it gets to my Australian version, which is the euro version, after the full system and flash is done
Don is a genius, I once met a guy that does this to truck and car ECU's, he could check barcode numbers on an ECU then rewrite it so there where sunstantial power gains
At the top you are running rich and you are bout to adjust that air fuel. Are your fan setup to simulate the ram air effect which would add more air at speed. Countering that rich condition at the top?
We don't have the means to truly mimic ram air effect in a static application - we would need a dyno in a wind tunnel. Fan's faking a constant 200+ mph at any/all rpm's and wheel speeds are nothing more than a morale boost to the dyno operator (and bike owner). If you notice our dyno room, all attempts are made NOT to force air into the inlets. We use data gathering at the race track to truly track ram air performance vs. ecu compensation - you would be surprised, Generally speaking: most Suzuki ECU's overcompensate with too much fuel, most kaws undercompensate - the BMW's do the best at getting it right. We will elaborate more once we get to the track.
Good to see you guys back at it.....make a great team. 👍🏻👍🏻
Ida Pro decompiler will get you on the back end of the ecu. And see the instructions on how maps register. To view raw hex use WiNOLS. The one he showed is a basic Hex editor. S1000rr has 3000 maps😉😉.
If I mail my Ecuador’s in to be tuned. What will be missing out on by not sending the whole bike in to be put on the Dino?
Maybe this will answer? blog.brocksperformance.com/ufaqs/how-can-brocks-get-mapping-so-close/
Hey i have a quick question. First of i just received my brocks penta carbón full exhaust and i love it. Only thing is i need to get a servo buddy. But my question is should i or do i have to get a pcv and then flash my ecu? Or if I’m getting my Ecu flash i won’t need the pcv? Last one is i still would need a servo buddy no matter if i flash my ecu or not?
Hello Melvin - this FAQ should help you out: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/do-i-need-a-pcv-when-installing-a-brocks-performance-exhaust-system/
This was fascinating to watch, and your speaking in common terms helped a lot! 🌟🌟🌟🌟🌟
Glad it was helpful!
Brock, I'm on the cusp of picking up an '18 ZX-10R SE. Motor-wise, it's the same as this 2019, is that correct?
Correct.
That was a great awesome explanation and simplified .. thank you !!
Glad it was helpful!
Noob here and may be a moot question, but after this flash will it pass emissions test for yearly license renewals and street use?
It will not.
Hi good day hope all is well I live in Namibia Windhoek and I have a hayabusa 99 mobile with a 1400 kit on it I also only have stock ECU on it but had a power commander 3 on it that was stolen by a dealer but okay the bike did a 9.30 on 1/4 mil but hopefully want to upgrade it soon with power commander 5 or something better and stage 2 pro supercharger it I can please advice me on how to get started
I want as much tourq as possible down low on my s1000rr. not sure if a pipe and flash does this . it starts wheelstand at 5 thousand.. I'd like 3 or 4 at worse .. can you get that with pipe and flash. ???
drop one tooth on your front sprocket - gearing changes torque, pipes and flashes change horsepower.
What about zx10r gen 3?? Is it the same? I want to flash the ECU.
Get with @Mooremaffia: www.mooremafia.com/ecu-flashing-service
This video is pure automotive porn. If the information contained in it could be turned in to a wallpaper, I would wallpaper entire house with it. Also from the outside. It's time for the bed now, so I am sure my brain is getting re-flashed overnight. Could not have come across any better thing to watch, that's for sure. My bike has to wait until winter with it's flash to make absolute max out of the dying riding season here up north... A million thanks for this baffling load of information and huge salute to you both gentlemen!
Excellent, explained nicely 👌 Dave uk 🇬🇧
Before moving forward with bolt ons i'd like to see you play with injector balance and ignition timing.
check this out: ua-cam.com/video/dHe2Lklzr0c/v-deo.html
Any progress on cracking the ECU on the Kaw Z H 2 ?
Already had the ECU done on my 2015 H 2 and 2020 H 2 SX SE, the latter this week.
Will try the H 2 SX SE this Sunday.
It's available for pre order. Contact Bren Tuning Moto.
@@BrockDavidson Seriously ?
How does a pre-order work on that ?
Thanks, Chris
Chris, we are not set-up to offer the Bren Tuning Flashes on our site. Give them a call, they will point you to exactly what you need as far as a flash. We offer PCV mapping to match our exhaust, Sprint Filter etc... through our Map Support Program: blog.brocksperformance.com/category/map-support/
I got a problem with my 2013 ecu. And looking for a new ecu.. I found 2012 ecu.. will it fit my bike bcoz as long as I know the 2013 got an ESD while 2012 doesnt
Not out of the box. Guhl might be able to make it work - give Guhl Motors a call.
@@BrockDavidson how can I reach him sir?
Google
What makes them have such a big power difference to like a Beemer 4 cylinder? The S1k seems to be at 190 without much hustle wrt tuning.
That's why the S1000RR has been the bike to beat, but even they are confronted with strict noise and emissions regulations that hamper the performance of their newest models.
@@BrockDavidson I saw that with the retarded dead spot, but is it about the tune, the cams, the pistons. As in what is making S1000RR and the Ducatti hit 198+Hp with a little tuning while the likes of Kawasaki are at 185ish after tuning? 15Hp is a big gain I believe.
The Japanese only understand one thing....follow the rules thoroughly, completely and with integrity. And you are correct 15 hp is a giant gain.
Is the power commander still able to work flawlessly on these newer bikes? Or it's only capable of tuning open loop?
@Meemo M -You can use the auto tune addition to map self-tune, but we find a properly created dynamic map works better. More info: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/how-can-brocks-get-mapping-so-close/
So how long on average does it take to tune a bike
Do you need a power commder ? Or is tuning the ecu enough . Or should you just to both
blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/do-i-need-a-pcv-when-installing-a-brocks-performance-exhaust-system/
I just got the younger brother model of this bike same year a week ago... the zx-6r, same color storm gray. Wish I could afford the big bro version.. some day. My 2015 636 got stolen... Love my bike so far though. Still breaking her in, only 250 miles on it. So hard not to rip the throttle lol.. I'm trying to break her in properly so she will last me... I got a whole christmas list of mods and plans for her lol.
Was wondering what kind/brand radiator fluid you like to run in your motorcycles? Or recommend for street riding. Thanks.
Great Question! For racing, we are mandated to use a non-glycol based coolant, because glycol-based coolants are toxic and difficult to clean up after a spill/crash. Does that make it better for street bikes?...not really, in fact it can cause great grief for your bike is ever subjected to freezing temps. These water-based coolants can do an excellent job of keeping your ride cool on a hot day, but if your bike is subjected to freezing temps, the water can freeze. What's the big deal? Your bike has 'freeze plugs' that will pop out in case the coolant ever freezes - once out, if you start your bike - as soon as it warms up, the frozen mixture will dilute your oil and possibly cause catastrophic engine damage. We learned this the hard way after trailering one of our race bikes from our heated facility in Ohio, to a race during freezing temps - there is no way to tell if you have this problem unless you view your oil and it's 'milky-looking' from mixing with water. We rode the bike to tech, made a run and had completely wiped out all of the crank and rod bearings by the end of the 1st run. It was an expensive mistake. We use standard antifreeze (usually the 50/50 premix) or we use #evanswaterbased coolant in our streetbikes here @brocksperf - or MoCool in our race bikes: brocksperformance.com/motul-mo-cool-radiator-additive-16-9oz/
@@BrockDavidson
Thanks for the quick response. What about Evans Waterless Coolant? Another question, my motorcycle is tuned for 91 pump, can i run 93 pump which has 10% ethonol?
We have been testing the Evans waterless coolant with very good results: www.evanscoolant.com/vehicle-types/powersports/ - yes on the 93 with 10% ethanol (stay away from any more than 10%) - here is more info. on octane: blog.brocksperformance.com/throttle-nation-magazine-the-gas-factor-fuel-options-for-max-hp/
Hi, I'm having an issue with my 2014 zx6r, I can run it no problem with stock maps in ecu, but as soon as I do any kind of modification to the ecu with FT flash, it wont run, it start then the bike shuts off and give me code 39 (ecu comunicatio problem) even only deactivating the servo or any small modification, bike wont keep runing. Any idea what is wrong ? I did cycle the key
Please contact FTecu technical support. Sounds like an account access issue.
@@BrockDavidson thanks for getting back to me, we allready contacted ft ecu flash, they suggested that my issue would be coming for something else since they dont see anything wrong with the license or the software.
@@BrockDavidson could it be hardware related or it has to be a license or mapping issue ?
Why do you need a PCV if you reflashing the ECU?
blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/do-i-need-a-pcv-when-installing-a-brocks-performance-exhaust-system/
Hey Brock how are you? I have an 04 zx10r I took my bike to a shop and had a 08 intake cam installed along with a mail in ecu flash I'm running a 17 tooth sprocket on front and a 40 on the back. Before I had the work done I was running 17 and 39 and my bike had plenty of torque and power. Had no problems raising the front tire in 1st 2nd 3rd and sometimes 4th. Now it wont raise the front tire at all it seems I have lost all torque and alot of power on low and top end any suggestions on what I can do or what the problem is? Some else had the same setup and said that I would have to re degree my cam to 105...
Best advice would be to find an independent dyno to test your engine.
Was falling asleep after riding for a bit and remembered I wanted to post this comment. I have a 2019 ninja h2 that I really have decided not to do much with for a bit of time but I wish I could remove the restrictions without doing anything excessive to the bike. I always check in on your videos but genuinely enjoyed this one having Don Guhl and the new 10 puts a great video and I love the detail explanation maybe one of you two can derestrict my h2 ???
We did the same thing with your H2, just didn't video the process. Give Don a call, he will point you straight.
hi brock,can the ecu of a carburetor fed bike be tuned or flashed? really like your very informative videos! 👍 subscriber from the Philippines.
Yes, but most carbureted street bikes we not subjected to today's strict emissions and noise regulations.
@@BrockDavidson here in the Philippines,the 150cc thru 200cc are very popular,most ignition upgrades is to use a racing cdi and hi performance coils,but im not in favor of racing cdis' bcause there is no rev limiter,if were in the same place i would really like to have you tune my bike,im a bike enthusiast,i really love working on my 150cc bike😊
I have the same 2019 ZX10 same color as well. My concern is does an ECU flash take away from the bikes longevity?
Great question. In a nutshell, the flash matches other non-restricted international models with slight enhancements. If the operator stays at a reasonable rpm for a reasonable time, there is no reason to expect a lack of longivity.
@@BrockDavidson I thought in 2019 even the euro bikes are restricted as well...are they just less restricted?
I want to send my ECU to be flashed also but putting a generic map isnt as good as a custom one on the dyno.i have a 19 also.
@@2wheelsonly614 we are 'California' restricted... Even the European's aren't as extreme.
@@BrockDavidson thanks, makes sense. Last question..would you trust mail in ecu flash? No dyno.
With your flash on a 16 zx10r, do i still need to pay for dyno time?
No
@@BrockDavidson do i just include list of upgrades, send ecu, and you do the rest?
Fill out this form when you send your ECU in: brocksperformance.com/content/brocknm/PDFS/BrockFLASH_ECU_Service_Release_Form.pdf
Brock, have you or Don worked on any MV Agusta ECU's?
I have not. I don't believe Don has, but you could contact him and ask. Contact info. link in long description.
@@BrockDavidson Thank you
Fantastic content thank you 👍
Does tuning in Full Power mode, Medium power mode and Low Power mode matter on 19-20 zx10? I have a tune in C85 via power commander 5, but my bike has not liked e85 in general the way it runs. I know c85 can only be run with c85 and X85 is okay to run with pump e85, but It’s been a hit or miss on pump in the streets. The dyno was amazing on c85 , but once I took it out to race (higher altitude) it did not even want to cruise. I definitely could’ve tuned on ECU alone , but I’m curious if the bike would adapt or feel better depending on the modes, tuning on just the ecu only or if the modes it’s just neutral all across and I can potentially run different fuels while tuning on ecu
No. Different modes are controlled primarily by the electronic throttle valve. AFR is AFR regardless of the mode you're in. What you just described is exactly why we do not offer e85 or c85 tunes at Brock's performance. They seem to work well for cars, but motorcycles are not smart enough to take full advantage... Unless you are at wide open throttle, where driveability does not matter.
@@BrockDavidson yea for more power/race. Do you know if adjusting timing is necessary for any e85/c85 tunes? I’m just trying to make mine work where I see everyone else on c85 near me is making amazing performance for straight line power. Mr12 is my last resort , I’ve tuned on it before and it works like a charm, but racing in Nevada 100+ heat, I’d much rather take advantage of e85 cooling benefits
Thanks for the awesome content Brock
Sudden hate for EFI and ECUs is still real and alive, I just felt it . . . 😒😁
Almost fell of my chair hearing all the B.S the tuner has to weed thru and out of the system . . . much respect for him and his work.
I still remember him for cracking the ECU on the back then new VFR1200.
I'ma go get my spare brain swapped in and swap out the burnt one after going thru this video. 😖🤪😵
At a point will the factory "de-engineer the bikes" so that they cannot make the power that both you and Don are doing to these ECU's?
If a company is in the "fast bike" business, making slow bikes that are difficult to cure is not good for business.
was that wheel hp or crank hp? I have a 2019 krt and only did a akropovic slip on with cat delete and wanting to do a flash im the future. Im seeing some great knowledge between the both of you and might consider a flash from guhl but will I need to bring the bike to him or just the ecu and dyno tune it after to fix the afr readings from running to rich or to lean. Does elevation play a big part? I am 7ft above sea level.
We use a Dynojet Model 250 I rear-wheel dyno on the SAE scale. Elevation does play a big part, but the sensors on your bike tell the ECU what to do in regard to engine tune. This is why you can travel from Florida to Colorado without remapping.
@@BrockDavidson I left florida to Arizona lol
How come data logging from the ecu itself isnt possible and you are using a power commander?
Data is available from the ECU (OBD2) and we do use quite a bit of it in our testing. We use the PCV to tune fuel in conjunction with the tuning link function on the Dynojet model 250I, as we find it makes a far more precise map than fuel tuning through the ECU. The PCV is also friendlier to tune at the track, especially if wifi is not available or weak. For those who do not like PCV's, we have flashes available with no PCV required, but they are not able to be user-tuned: brocksperformance.com/brockflash-ecu-stage-1-f-with-fuel-tune-for-full-system-zx-10r-2019-must-send-us-your-ecu/
Does the manufacturer say it’s safe for the bike to make that much power?
The Euro models make about the same as our deresticted US models. We are simply removing restrictions the engineers of the engine wish didn't exist.
Brock Davidson Ok...thanks.
@@BrockDavidson okay, in that case, why do the engineers make it harder to crack the ECU's. Shouldn't they just make it easier for tuners to gain access to it. Why do it at all, the tuners are anyways gonna crack it somehow no matter how hard it is.
I just purchased an 06 zx14 with flies removed and PC5 installed, the throttle is very choppy at startup until it warms up. Can I just put it back to stock or it requires a tuning.
if the flies are removed, it will need to be tuned.
Brock aka “Mr. Free game!! 🙏🏽🙏🏽
Hi does mr. Don Guhl have motorcycle shop business in the philly area? I'm like 6 or so hours from Pennsylvania...
guhlmotors.com/
Hi, Brock! Awesome video as always! Could you tell me, please one thing. Is it any possible way to log ETV values without PowerCommander? Just tap into that grey wire and make a table Voltage vs RPM?
Yes. You use the dyno analog input sensor , connected to the bikes subthrottle sensor output and ground - then calibrate the blade open/closed on a 0V-5V scale...the PCV is much simpler ;)
@@BrockDavidson thank you, Brock!
Can i be apprentice?from ph here masters
This is just awesome, you’re the best.
Hey whatsup
Im asking about the Ktag or kess v2 master version do you use to tune the bikes?
If not do u have best way better than both devices?
We have both for use with older BMW's. What make/model/year are you trying to tune?
@@BrockDavidson i mean if the kess or ktag can be useful for motorcycles!?
@@adammassalha1224 if you are a highly-skilled programmer....possibly. If not, best of luck.
How much for a dyno tune on a 2001 gsxr 1000 ?
Check this FAQ: blog.brocksperformance.com/faq/do-i-need-to-physically-bring-my-bike-to-brocks-performance-in-ohio-for-a-performance-tune/
that top end throttle cut back is prolly the 186 speed limiter kicking in im thinking
Primarily noise abatement
One thing comes across with don and brock there HONEST in there way of business.again set them apart from others
how much dose it cost for remapping
brocksperformance.com/electronics-ignition/brock-ecu-flash/
Very interesting thank you from this old retread 🦅🇺🇸🦅🏍🏍🥇
If there is one person I would like to work with my bike on the dyno it would be Brock. Listen how after the rev limiter hits Brock immediately goes into letting the motor rest mode instead of letting it sit there and decelerate from 15,000 rpm with the dyno. I’m guessing he pulls in the clutch and uses the rear brake to slow down the dyno??? Or is there some kind of dyno brake??
I pull in the clutch and slow the drum with the dyno brake.
Brock Davidson that’s awesome brock I’m still wanting my bike tuned, have a new full system waiting to be installed if I could find a tuner that really knows his shit. I’m in Ky not to awful far from you and would bring it to you in a heartbeat. This bike is my baby I looked for 2 years for a clean unmolested 04/06 R1 and this baby only had 715 miles on it absolutely mint. 5,000 miles now still stock being I want a competent tuner involved when I install it.
When I get my 10r or h2 im coming to you brock.
Check this out: bit.ly/3aXtFTK
Mr Brocks don't mind ecu flash how do u keep your head so shinny 👌
Thanx for this video very interesting