@@drivenimagecustoms6108 Its factual. Polypropylene has a low surface energy and even with sanding it doesn't raise it enough for paint to make a good bond and it will fail. PP requires a surface modifier to raise the surface energy to the point where paints and fillers reliably stick.
sanded or not, raw plastic needs to be cleaned with hot soapy water and scotch brite,then with clear rubbing alcohol,then soapy water again.Then you need to apply an adhesion promoter.let dry then primer/sealer/paint and it will be a good bond.If it is not cleaned with the alcohol to pull out all the mold release agents,it will not stick and will peel off.30 years in the auto painting world has taught me this.
Hi! Thanks for the feedback. This video was posted in 2016, so we can't change the music now. But, we haven't used this music since 2017. Check out our newer videos; I'm sure you'd enjoy them!
Yes, it will. Be sure to properly clean the part with 1000 Super Prep or 1001-4 EcoPrep Plastic cleaner and scuff it with a gray scotchbrite or similar pad before applying the adhesion promoter and you shouldn't have any adhesion problems.
I am trying to paint polyethylene hard hats. I need the paint to be durable enough to add and remove vinyl decals without coming off. The durability is so poor. Would this prevent that?
Nope. Unfortunately nothing will help on PE. Its the nature of the beast. The surface energy of PE is such that paint, adhesives, etc do not stick well to it at all and nothing, despite some wild claims by some, will really help improve paints adhesion to PE.
You're welcome. It does stink. A LOT of people want to paint PE parts...ATVs, kayaks, etc and so far, nobody has come up with anything reliable, with the exception of the instructions here: www.polyvance.com/atvpainting.php But it must be followed carefully and you wouldn't want to do that to a hard hat, I wouldn't think, due to the blasting with 80 grit aluminum oxide blasting media.
So what's the story with polyurethane (PUR)? I hear use it, then I hear don't use it and then I hear it doesn't matter. I'm painting my Jaguar and the bumper cover is polyurethane and I'll need an answer soon. And what about filler prep? Yeah, the music's good too!
Apparently polyurethane needs to be welded together with a soldering iron. I think you can use fibreglass matting and resin and hardener. I would send the back internal part. Scuff up like mad. Then fibreglass. Or my favorite way because it works for me: I cut pieces of copper wire and using the soldering iron I push gently on the copper so it melts nicely into repair. Looks like stitching but then I paste the plastic back over the join. If you can't see the copper and a little biuld up like a metal weld? It's Damn strong! I hope it helps? Cheers
@@dragan3290 As it turns out, you don't use adhesion promoter with poly (PUR). If you do use it, it won't hurt anything, it just doesn't help at all. Think I ended up just using the flexible bumper repair with a little FG cloth (I was filling two holes where I removed a badge, 1/2" and 1/4"). May have used a little bondo to finish filling and then a hi fill surfacer (similar to Featherfill). It came out just fine, can't ever tell there were 2 good size holes there once.
@@flyurway oh yeah! Awesome! I'm glad it worked out for you. I hate working with plastic because half the time I can't find out what kind of plastic? Where do I get filler rods in Australia? Cheers 🙂👍👍👍
@@dragan3290 Not filler rods, didn't weld it. I used 2 part epoxy for plastic body panels. Don't know what you have down under but I buy it at any automotive/paint supply, our Walmarts usually have it too.
@@flyurway oh ok. Yeah in Australia. We only get crap. Literally! I have ordered tools from the states because I can't get here! Sorry mate I tend to ramble sometimes. Last week 2 hours sleep every night! I must've misread your comment. Anyway.,cheers
Hello! This video was posted in 2016, so we can't change the music now. But, we haven't used this music since 2017. Check out our newer tutorials! Thankfully, all of our tutorial videos have manually added captions, so you could mute the video and still follow along.
And we have absolutely NO IDEA how he prepared either side! Complete propaganda. Plastic Adhesion promoters are used because of the various plastic release agents used to separate plastics parts from plastic molds! This video demonstrates exactly NOTHING! Prep a Toyota or similar, bumper with soap water scuff etc, on half and the SAME on the other half and add this adhesion promoter, then make this video, then I might think this is a decent product! This video shows EXACTLY NOTHING!
Perhaps, before being an "expert" on adhesion, you should educate yourself on the science of "surface energy." Here is a helpful link by 3M: www.3m.com/3M/en_US/bonding-and-assembly-us/resources/full-story/?storyid=1d2481ca-5c8c-455d-952d-5ed90e04e8a7 It (chlorinated polyolefin in this case) modifies the surface of the plastic to increase the surface energy which allows paint to wet out properly on TPO and polypropylene plastics; this change gives the paint a better surface to bond to. In this case, two samples were prepared identically, with the exception of no adhesion promoter on the one side. Adhesion promoter has nothing to do with release agents, it has to do with altering the molecular structure of the substrate to change its surface energy. If you clean the substrate properly, all release agents should be removed BEFORE applying anything to the surface, including adhesion promoter. A clean surface does not change the surface energy of the substrate, but it does remove contaminants that would inhibit adhesion by not allowing the coating to properly engage with the substrate, no matter what the substrate is. The substrate in the video is polypropylene, which is the same material most bumpers are made of, including MOST Toyota bumpers (a few are urethane and do not require adhesion promoters). So in terms of accuracy of the test, this is good representation of the "real world" situation. If someone chooses not to use adhesion promoter on olefin based plastics, its not a matter of IF you will get a paint failure, but when...but ultimately its the painters choice and adhesion promoter is a very inexpensive bit of insurance that your paint will stick.
Thats a really good analogy, actually. Although they are not interchangable, the way a self etching primer works on metal, is similar to how adhesion promoter works on plastic.
It's an unsanded part though, would love to see a sanded part, then run the test again.
you get the same results.
@@scottb7600 doubt it.
@@drivenimagecustoms6108 Its factual. Polypropylene has a low surface energy and even with sanding it doesn't raise it enough for paint to make a good bond and it will fail. PP requires a surface modifier to raise the surface energy to the point where paints and fillers reliably stick.
@@scottb7600 oh yes, you're right about PP. I stand corrected 👍
sanded or not, raw plastic needs to be cleaned with hot soapy water and scotch brite,then with clear rubbing alcohol,then soapy water again.Then you need to apply an adhesion promoter.let dry then primer/sealer/paint and it will be a good bond.If it is not cleaned with the alcohol to pull out all the mold release agents,it will not stick and will peel off.30 years in the auto painting world has taught me this.
I have an HDPE kayak. Will this work to bond top coat?
I'm planning to paint my eyeglasses frame, should I use adhesion promoter before painting?
I would say no. Most glasses frames are made of acrylic or other similar plastic and would only require you to sand them to get paint to stick.
background music is annoying
Hi! Thanks for the feedback. This video was posted in 2016, so we can't change the music now. But, we haven't used this music since 2017. Check out our newer videos; I'm sure you'd enjoy them!
What’s your source of music? Now I want to buy polyvance products
Thanks! The background music is "Jerked Around" from the Getty Images music library.
Feel free to call us if you have any questions about anything!
Will this help the paint stick to the interior trim of my car it’s plastic
Yes, it will. Be sure to properly clean the part with 1000 Super Prep or 1001-4 EcoPrep Plastic cleaner and scuff it with a gray scotchbrite or similar pad before applying the adhesion promoter and you shouldn't have any adhesion problems.
@@scottb7600 alright thank you I’m about to start painting it today
I am trying to paint polyethylene hard hats. I need the paint to be durable enough to add and remove vinyl decals without coming off. The durability is so poor. Would this prevent that?
Nope. Unfortunately nothing will help on PE. Its the nature of the beast. The surface energy of PE is such that paint, adhesives, etc do not stick well to it at all and nothing, despite some wild claims by some, will really help improve paints adhesion to PE.
well that's disappointing. thanks for the quick reply though
You're welcome. It does stink. A LOT of people want to paint PE parts...ATVs, kayaks, etc and so far, nobody has come up with anything reliable, with the exception of the instructions here: www.polyvance.com/atvpainting.php But it must be followed carefully and you wouldn't want to do that to a hard hat, I wouldn't think, due to the blasting with 80 grit aluminum oxide blasting media.
These hard hats are not for work, they are for football games. So, this may be an option after all. I'll keep this in mind. Thanks for the replies!
could i use plastic magic instead of filler prep before putting flex filler
Yes, you can use Plastic Magic or Filler Prep before using Flex Filler.
the music is epic
How many coats of adhesion promoter do you spray before applying basecoat.
We usually just apply one medium wet coat and allow it to flash off before moving on.
I plan on refinishing the grille of my car would this be recommended beige or after a filler primer . I’m newish to this stuff
This would be used before a filler primer.
Most grills are ABS and do not require adhesion promoter, but do require a nicely sanded surface.
Does it work on aluminum?
No. Its for olefin based plastic only.
Can I spray it one day and paint the next ?
Yes. The "window" doesn't close with Plastic Magic and Filler Prep.
could this help with painting over non-paintable silicone?
No, it won't.
can i use this under clear???
Sure!
possibly. it would depend on the substrate, but the adhesion promoter can give the substrate a spotty appearance occasionally.
So what's the story with polyurethane (PUR)? I hear use it, then I hear don't use it and then I hear it doesn't matter. I'm painting my Jaguar and the bumper cover is polyurethane and I'll need an answer soon. And what about filler prep? Yeah, the music's good too!
Apparently polyurethane needs to be welded together with a soldering iron. I think you can use fibreglass matting and resin and hardener. I would send the back internal part. Scuff up like mad. Then fibreglass. Or my favorite way because it works for me: I cut pieces of copper wire and using the soldering iron I push gently on the copper so it melts nicely into repair. Looks like stitching but then I paste the plastic back over the join. If you can't see the copper and a little biuld up like a metal weld? It's Damn strong! I hope it helps? Cheers
@@dragan3290 As it turns out, you don't use adhesion promoter with poly (PUR). If you do use it, it won't hurt anything, it just doesn't help at all. Think I ended up just using the flexible bumper repair with a little FG cloth (I was filling two holes where I removed a badge, 1/2" and 1/4"). May have used a little bondo to finish filling and then a hi fill surfacer (similar to Featherfill). It came out just fine, can't ever tell there were 2 good size holes there once.
@@flyurway oh yeah! Awesome! I'm glad it worked out for you. I hate working with plastic because half the time I can't find out what kind of plastic? Where do I get filler rods in Australia? Cheers 🙂👍👍👍
@@dragan3290 Not filler rods, didn't weld it. I used 2 part epoxy for plastic body panels. Don't know what you have down under but I buy it at any automotive/paint supply, our Walmarts usually have it too.
@@flyurway oh ok. Yeah in Australia. We only get crap. Literally! I have ordered tools from the states because I can't get here! Sorry mate I tend to ramble sometimes. Last week 2 hours sleep every night! I must've misread your comment. Anyway.,cheers
Good hell! What is with that head banging crap in the foreground for an educational video about?!
Hello! This video was posted in 2016, so we can't change the music now. But, we haven't used this music since 2017. Check out our newer tutorials!
Thankfully, all of our tutorial videos have manually added captions, so you could mute the video and still follow along.
View this video on on our website for more information: www.polyvance.com/video/products-and-tools/adhesion-promoter-why-it-is-important
I liked the video but hated the intro music.....So disconcerting.....
thats the best thing about it. eff the norm.
Music was the best part!
Extreme.
GREAT video. HORRIBLE UNNECESSARY MUSIC. CAN IT.
What a fucking flawed test.
And we have absolutely NO IDEA how he prepared either side! Complete propaganda. Plastic Adhesion promoters are used because of the various plastic release agents used to separate plastics parts from plastic molds! This video demonstrates exactly NOTHING!
Prep a Toyota or similar, bumper with soap water scuff etc, on half and the SAME on the other half and add this adhesion promoter, then make this video, then I might think this is a decent product!
This video shows EXACTLY NOTHING!
Perhaps, before being an "expert" on adhesion, you should educate yourself on the science of "surface energy." Here is a helpful link by 3M: www.3m.com/3M/en_US/bonding-and-assembly-us/resources/full-story/?storyid=1d2481ca-5c8c-455d-952d-5ed90e04e8a7 It (chlorinated polyolefin in this case) modifies the surface of the plastic to increase the surface energy which allows paint to wet out properly on TPO and polypropylene plastics; this change gives the paint a better surface to bond to. In this case, two samples were prepared identically, with the exception of no adhesion promoter on the one side.
Adhesion promoter has nothing to do with release agents, it has to do with altering the molecular structure of the substrate to change its surface energy. If you clean the substrate properly, all release agents should be removed BEFORE applying anything to the surface, including adhesion promoter. A clean surface does not change the surface energy of the substrate, but it does remove contaminants that would inhibit adhesion by not allowing the coating to properly engage with the substrate, no matter what the substrate is.
The substrate in the video is polypropylene, which is the same material most bumpers are made of, including MOST Toyota bumpers (a few are urethane and do not require adhesion promoters). So in terms of accuracy of the test, this is good representation of the "real world" situation. If someone chooses not to use adhesion promoter on olefin based plastics, its not a matter of IF you will get a paint failure, but when...but ultimately its the painters choice and adhesion promoter is a very inexpensive bit of insurance that your paint will stick.
Blah blah blah
Does this work similarly to a self etching primer?
Thats a really good analogy, actually. Although they are not interchangable, the way a self etching primer works on metal, is similar to how adhesion promoter works on plastic.