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@@mhughes1160 bullet weight, diameter, and velocity are identical on paper, or at least very near identical..... I just want to see how they do against each other
Why are you still not listing the bullet weight and load of the rounds in these tests? Without those key pieces of information, these tests are meaningless and useless.
When you strike a knot another shot should be taken, the knot is much harder and will drastically effect the bullet. When using sand, place a piece of cardboard at the 2” and 4” mark which will give an indication of which penetrated further giving better data.
@@petesheppard1709 i was using a 2x4 as a target for my .22 with subsonics loaded, one round hit a knot and shattered into pieces while only putting a small dent in the wood. was impressive. normally, the subsonics fly straight through the 2 inches of wood like its butter.
It absolutely would. I dont think ive ever seen a pistol round go through the sandbox. Even if a round didnt go through a certain depth of clay you would be able to see the energy dump in it.
@@ap1s2k78 Yeah double tap has some wild rounds my 10mm loads from them (granted still pretty similar to.40) I think my 135g 10mm from them is 1600 fps. But the LCD 60g 2400 fps rounds are nasty.
10mm & 5.7x28 are the calibers that suffer most from "pudloading". A lot of the factory ammo is just painfully underloaded. Luckily, there are some high quality boutique rounds Buffalo Bore & Underwood (10mm), Vanguard & Elite Ammunition (5.7x28) or some good ole self rolls to solve that issue.
@@RNG-999 Yea I've shot some Double Tap 10mm & recently some weird 9mm. It's 165 total grains, with like a 115 Grain JHP & a 50 grain disk behind it. It was too weird not to try.
That's crap my man, they load them like that because that's what people buy..... because all the .45 and 10mm fan boys just like telling everyone they carry them bigger calibers and not actually shooting 750 foot pound loads out of a handgun. Yes .45 and 10 mm can be more powerful but the factory loads don't lie, people are actually buying loads that are below 9mm +p Buffalo bore has the spiciest of spicy loads but it's a small market.
@whatsmolly5741 I'm afraid you have no idea what you're talking about. People buy it because it's all they can afford, or because they simply don't know any better. Nobody buys a 10mm to shoot .40.
He chronographed the round he was using at the end, those 10mm rounds are definitely within 10mm spec with 180 grains hitting 1240fps avg putting out 616ft/lbs which is about what you’d get from standard underwood 10mm. Only their exotic line is packing more punch.
the clarity of your ballistics gel is getting more and more impressive! not sure why others do not appreciate the sandbox test, that's some legit testing methodology. its why the military uses sandbags, that stuff stops bullets hardcore.
For pistol rounds, I think the sand test should be dropped. We know 6-inches of sand will stop common pistol rounds. Rifle rounds are the only ones to stand a chance.
@@RNG-999stuff is still expensive, it being clearer showcases he’s either better able to maintain the supply of fresh gel for these vids or has gotten better at recycling used blocks and still having them be fairly clear. Could even be mixing and moulding them himself.
@@md_vandenberg his video on the .44spl and .44mag showed that (one or both?) of those went through the sandbox. but yeah, common semi-auto handgun calibers 6" sand sand will stop
.357 sig isn't even near the same power as the .357 mag or 10mm.... It genuinely irritates me when people compare it. It's like same power as .45ACP +P
Back when I was in the german navy I learned one complex lesson. 9x19mm is fine in a Uzi, 7.62x51 is ok in a G3 but better in a MG3 and when you want to make an impression you start with 76 (no dot!) mm and work your way up to AGM 84! I have to admit though, lightweight torpedos are hard to use on a gun range 😄
Ww2 US tankers, actually tied sand bags on their tanks to increase their survival against the very powerful panzers. Sand is a very good heavy bullet stopper.
They tested it during the war. It doesn't help. The added weight does cause more transmission and driveline problems though. They let the crews keep it though because it made them feel better.
There are many reasons that 9mm is the most popular handgun caliber in America... With modern bullets and modern loads 9mm is no slouch, Its pretty hot in +P and carries a projectile that's heavy enough to do quite a bit of damage and has enough penetration to get through light cover and still provide enough velocity to get the job done... Not to mention the size, weight, capacity, recoil, ammunition cost and availability and sheer number of options on the market that fire 9mm compared to 10mm...
A little unheard of to see someone walk away from one hit of 10mm like with 2 or three hits of the 9mm. The only thing that matters the most is penetration. Stopped bullets in their terminal ballistic stage is like a shitting fart vs a solid turd in your underwear when a 10mm comes to play. Oh, well can't tell some people anything & all their analysis articulates their desired outcome to keep mythical minds secure.
@@opinionsvary Caliber is the least relevant metric in penetration tests. The key relevant factors are velocity, energy, sectional density, and bullet construction.
@@opinionsvary I've heard enough interviews with people who have got shot 15 times with 45 and have shot people 30+ times with a 45 before putting them down. Its not about the rounds its about shot placement.
@@saltysaty8686 In my opinion: Take your best 9mm round against a 185gr 45 ACP +P of the same type of bullet. The human body is nothing like ballistics gel. Also 9mm really don't do well for stopping a armored vehicle operators when a bullet makes it inside the can. You may want to visit the hotel where Dillinger had a shoot out with the police & look around at all the FMJ damage the cops did. Suppose one were to have hit him in the lower abdomen or leg, it's beyond doubtful he would've escaped as he did. There was an account to where a 158gr 38 special LRN killed a uncaged bear on a rampage in a city once. Seriously doubt 9mm has what it takes but to stop women & children. 9mm is like a BB wish come true for a lot of people. If not for JHPs law enforcement wouldn't have gone that route if not for women on the force.
How about replacing the sandbox with some sort of clay that can show you the amount of energy on target and it can be measured by the width of the impact and the depth
I recall in the late 90's shooting into the rootball of a good sized tree that had been grubbed out with a bulldozer, range was about 50 yards and I was using my 338/06 AI shooting 200 gr speers for a fire forming load, I was able to dig the bullets out and evaluate their expansion. Clay would be a great test medium, not sure where Mr Banana man lives but clay is generally pretty easy to come up with....
You should take all the old steel plates and weld them to the protection screen you have. That way you have protection from anything coming back at you
I have no problem with the sandbox test its a kinda useless for pistol testing but am not so impatient that its a issue for me. The guy who criticises everything in the bathroom though his a good laugh👍
Love the videos. The humidity reminded of growing up in St. Louis. I now live in the desert in Utah, and a couple of days ago the humidity was only 9%. I'll take the dry heat any day.
I live in Louisiana so I know humidity. But when I go to west Texas it’s about 10 degrees hotter but no humidity and it feels a lot cooler! I much prefer low humidity!
The queen ant declares, "Your concrete spalling has ZERO effect on my relentless egg production! And, thanks to your sand box tests, I will move my chambers to 8 inches from the surface! AHAHAH HA HA!"🐜
@@timclaus8313 Here in Canada it is widely used for all game (moose, elk, deer, etc). Including Grizzlies. Modern ammos help too like Barnes 190grain, Buffalo bore, leverevolution and nosler.
@@heydaddy6817 Nothing wrong with any of the centerfire lever cartridges. They have range limits due to the bullet shape requirements for tube magazines, but with good bullet selection, they all perform well beyond what their paper ballistics seem to indicate.
@@mediocreman2 only very weak range ammo overlaps with 357 sig. once you get to Underwood, Buffalo bore, Double tap loads, 357 sig no longer hangs. 9x25 Dillon however is different story. Monster of a round that ACTUALLY competes with full power 357 mag
10mm factory loads are watered down almost to 40 cal. I Love the 10mm with hard cast loaded to spec, it may not go through the sand box but it would knock it around a bit lol. For the sand box you could try clay, dry ice, melons, meat or bone targets.
@@tonyromano6220High mass and relatively low kinetic energy means they wouldn’t destroy themselves going through the sand. Higher velocity may improve anti-armored personnel performance, but higher round weight improves penetration in general.
The fine particles of sand basically act like a solid version of hydro-shock. The low velocity means they don’t displace so much volume so fast they destroy themselves while their weight gives them enough momentum to keep going until they make it through.
Don't buy BuffaloBore, the owners are cucks. Underwood, DoubleTap, and Liberty make the best. The price of hand-loading is actually about equal to just buying from DoubleTap in-bulk.
@@anon-means-anon It's going to vary across different manuals. The manuals for years have been stepping down the actual loads for many cartridges. I use new Starline brass when I do Normal spec loads from the 80's when 10mm was 10mm.
That looks like M1152 NATO spec 9mm ammo. It's good stuff. I'd much prefer that over a 10mm due to the significantly lower recoil. I'd rather put 4 9mm on target than 2 10mm in the same amount of time. It's probably not ideal for Grizzly protection but the 9mm has successfully been used for that purpose, and hunting guides agree that something you can comfortably shoot is more important than missing with a hand cannon.
Dude... A high-powered 10mm round carries 80% more kinetic energy per shot than a 9mm, even these 9mm +P because they are just high-powered 9mm. 780 Ft-lbs vs 420 ft-lbs is 85%. Those two 10mm rounds had almost as much energy as four 9mm...
Really appreciate your content and channel. When the French invented smokeless powder in 1886 for the 8mm lebel cartridge the Germans started ballistics testing on every caliber/ bullet made and continued extensive testing up to about 1944. The Germans found that the 9mm in a pistol and a 7mm in a rifle caliber was the optimal performance for combat.
It would definitely punched through that second plate. I have seen .357 Sig punch through many targets that only Underwood 10mm could get through. They scorch when loaded hot and a good projectile is used. An Extreme Penetrator is one of my favorite. Extreme Defender will work for EDC otherwise.
@@Balticblue93 it really is a decent round. The bottleneck shape would make it feed well I would imagine in a carbine or SMG…. Wonder why no one has done that yet? Maybe they have and I’m not aware or it’s something obscure. I probably buy either 😂
Let's even up the score and get some +P 10mm. I've both and if I'm needing more horse power for some reason, I'm definitely grabbing my 10mm with my hot 180 grain loads.
My 10mm loads are 180g hollow point and about 700-750ft lbs of energy. With the stiffer spring in my glock it really roars and shows the truth of 10mm in its original spec
Yeah, I hear you on that humidity thing. We had some horrible humidity here in New Mexico the other week. It was a whopping 57% humidity, about an hour after it rained...
I’m a 10mm owner, have been for 34 years and though in a barricaded situation the 10mm would be the clear choice. I’d take the 9mm+p for the capacity, the damage to organs is very close so I’d prefer more rounds on target, less recoil.
@@XRakkgruntX Standard Glock 20 in 10mm is 15 rounds vs 17 rounds for a Glock 17. If that difference in capacity comes into play, you have bigger issues to deal with.
@@XRakkgruntX Here's my reason for 10mm: There are people out there with overactive adrenaline glands or who are hopped up on d_ru-gs. They don't know they've been un-lived, and can keep coming at you for a few seconds. Best to have impact energy. I'd go for .44 mag but I'm afraid that some DA would start calling me Dirty Harry to sway the jury in a self-defense prosecution.
Bro the sand is the great filter of high power bullets and I love it and I will be sad if it is gone, I love to see how much power it takes to go through it
That's misinformation...the best 9mm +p+ is NOT 357sig!!! The best 9mm +p+ (safe) will propel a 124/125 grain bullet at 1300 or so fps....357sig loaded properly can easily reach 1500 fps with the same weight bullet fun facts 👍
@TransformersHoarder 9mm+p++++ will likely blow your gun up and maybe take parts of your hand with it...if you feel the need to add that many pluses....maybe it's smarter to get a more powerful gun??? 🤔
When a shot hits near the edge of a piece of sheet metal, deformation of the edge reduces the ability to penetrate by absorbing some of the energy. Notice how the edge bet forwards opposite the force of impact.
Funny enough .45+P hits about as hard as base 10mm here. (185@1200) Also missing the proper 10mm loading.. The magic is and has always been the holy 200@1200.
@@lardomcfarty9866 I don't underload it, but realistically 9mm will never be able to keep up with 10mm - bigger bullet, more case capacity... I have loads that push a 180 gr. Speer Gold Dot to 1350 fps safely. Not bashing 9mm but it will never be 10mm.
Considering most 10 mm cartridges are loaded 40 caliber capacities or less, that 10 mm is not anywhere near its maximum knockdown power. I guarantee it
Just started the video- maxxed out 9mm will never beat properly loaded 10mm. You can cherry pick a 9mm load to beat a watered down 10mm that is nothing more than a .40s&w in disguise (powerwise), but then that's not a fair comparison. Factory 9mm from a 5" barrel maxxes out in the 500ft-lbs range of energy, while 10mm comes in at 800ft-lbs. Most of us know this...
If you want to keep the sand, maybe do a stack of USPS shipping boxes (PM Small FR's) filled with sand, that'd give you a series of 1&3/4ths thick boxes (still tape-able!) you could stack up to gauge penetration with increments.
I also enjoy the first few years of the KZ650, but your list had a lot of great bikes. I lean more towards the 1980s, Ninja 900, 600, FZ600, Seca 550, 500 Interceptor, etc. More "modern classics" than vintage.
Chasing your tail trying to compete with properly loaded 10mm. I know, done these experiments myself with custom hand loaded ammo. I tossed in .357 Sig into the mix as well, that's one caliber a lot of people sleep on if they want a real deal +P+ "9mm".
I kinda figured even particularly spicy 9x19 still wouldn't have the "authority" of 10mm. Still a lot of fun to watch! This channel and Tools & Targets are my favourites for cartridge performance. Additionally, I feel like if you retire the sand box, you should replace it with modeling clay!
No one doubts a 10mm has more stopping power. But, 1) Your accuracy will drop, and hits matter more than noise. 2) It's well over $1 per round for a decent 10mm which limits practice. 3) It's a far less common round, so good luck when supply dwindles or society breaks down.
"It's a far less common round," I hear this silly excuse all the time. The fact that there are less guns shooting it also means that the supply dwindles down slower. In the last couple of ammo shortages we saw that the first ammo to disappear from shelves were the most popular rounds. People buying uncommon guns were able to find ammo for their guns on shelves after the common calibers had already run out. The .41 magnum, 5.7x28mm, .357 SIG, etc. people were having an easier time in the early stages of the shortages than 9mm, .45 acp, 38 spl people. What this tells us is that if you cared so much about supply dwindling then you'd buy multiple guns in a variety of calibers.
For all the comments on 10mm being underloaded, check out the listing from Lucky Gunner. He has a full length data sheet on every 10mm offering that he's tested. You can very quickly figure out who's selling .40 cleverly disguised as 10mm and who has the full power stuff. He even has a video on the subject.
If you can get your hands on it. Winchester Ranger T-series 9x19 127gr +P+. Pure evil. Also noticed their .45 acp rounds are hot too. 230 gr at 920 fps, (almost +P), and the +P is at 990 fps. Winchester doesn't mess around with their Range line. (I have a buddy that's a Winchester distributor, so we get this stuff to shoot all the time).
Could you make the sand box thinner? I think it's a good test, but you've got one that's a really tough barrier to overcome. A thinner box of sand will still represent while giving more rounds a better chance.
+P+ 9mm vs something would be really cool to see the results. I use +p+ in my AR9 and have always been interested in seeing it's performance vs another PCC caliber.
Love the video, great style and very entertaining. Good stuff to see comparing 9 vs 10. The thing I think needs to be compared more often isn't 9 vs 10, it's 10 v .40 in typical handguns. I am not sure 10mm out of a 4.6 is getting the legs to be anything other than .40 that costs more. The difference between .40/10mm out of my Glock 40 is really significant, and ballistic data shows 10mm really picks up at 5" or longer barrels.
Why it looks burnt in the gel. When the squishy stuff goes back to shape, it raises the pressure. It's called *adiabatic heating*. Molecules in hot gasses are farther apart and less dense (that's how hot air balloons work). If you squish the molecules together, rapidly, they they heat up, like an air compressor or diesel engine. The opposite is when uncompressing a gas. When you spray canned air on your hand, the gasses take energy from you (feels cold).
Thanks for doing a thin steel test! I’m buying a shipping container (slightly thicker than 1/16” walls) and was wondering whether it would happen to block normal handgun calibers. I’m going to say no, unless it was something really light like a .380 auto or .22lr. Luckily I’m not buying it for ballistic protection anyway.
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I would be VERY interested to see .380 +p vs standard 9mm ammo. On paper, they're nearly identical.
This wood knot be a fair comparison IMO . LoL 😂
@@mhughes1160 bullet weight, diameter, and velocity are identical on paper, or at least very near identical..... I just want to see how they do against each other
@@PotatoeJoe69 wood 🪵 knot 🪢
LoL 😂
Why are you still not listing the bullet weight and load of the rounds in these tests? Without those key pieces of information, these tests are meaningless and useless.
When you strike a knot another shot should be taken, the knot is much harder and will drastically effect the bullet. When using sand, place a piece of cardboard at the 2” and 4” mark which will give an indication of which penetrated further giving better data.
Yep. I saw that knot and went, 'Oh no'.
Agreed. Knots equal retest.
@@fritzd2116 Unless they have worked with wood, folks don't realize just how hard knots are.
@@petesheppard1709 i was using a 2x4 as a target for my .22 with subsonics loaded, one round hit a knot and shattered into pieces while only putting a small dent in the wood. was impressive. normally, the subsonics fly straight through the 2 inches of wood like its butter.
Would not be difficult to use wood blocks with very small or no knots. Couple bucks more per dozen...
If you pull the sandbox, a clay block would be a cool alternative.
Good idea!
This is something I'd be for as well. I don't mind the sandbox at all. But, replacing it with a clay block for pistol rounds would be interesting.
It absolutely would. I dont think ive ever seen a pistol round go through the sandbox. Even if a round didnt go through a certain depth of clay you would be able to see the energy dump in it.
Yess...would be really impressive because no handgun round can make it through the sandbox! It´s always just a hole on the front!
Hoo Tee Who uses clay blocks in his videos, it's pretty cool to see some of the damage certain caliber bullets cause
unfortunately, other than underwood and Buffalo-Bore, most 10mm is underloaded by factories, basically performs like 40sw.
Yup I can get rounds for my .40 that perform almost like 10mm too. Double tap 135 grains at 1450fps is cooking.
@@ap1s2k78 Yeah double tap has some wild rounds my 10mm loads from them (granted still pretty similar to.40) I think my 135g 10mm from them is 1600 fps. But the LCD 60g 2400 fps rounds are nasty.
Been loving these Extreme Defenders from Underwood. 1700 fps and 115 grains
I really wanted to be the "Um, Akshuyally" guy but you're right and I hate it.
@@jordanfreeman4170 I literally EDC that DoubleTap 135gr controlled expansion round, lol. Gets 1650 FPS out of my 4.67" ported barrel.
10mm & 5.7x28 are the calibers that suffer most from "pudloading".
A lot of the factory ammo is just painfully underloaded.
Luckily, there are some high quality boutique rounds Buffalo Bore & Underwood (10mm), Vanguard & Elite Ammunition (5.7x28) or some good ole self rolls to solve that issue.
I EDC 10mm and I use DoubleTap. They have the best prices with the best performance. All the way up to 800 ft-lbs if you want.
@@RNG-999 Yea I've shot some Double Tap 10mm & recently some weird 9mm.
It's 165 total grains, with like a 115 Grain JHP & a 50 grain disk behind it.
It was too weird not to try.
I reload 9mm so powder is always the same weight. Never under loaded.
That's crap my man, they load them like that because that's what people buy..... because all the .45 and 10mm fan boys just like telling everyone they carry them bigger calibers and not actually shooting 750 foot pound loads out of a handgun.
Yes .45 and 10 mm can be more powerful but the factory loads don't lie, people are actually buying loads that are below 9mm +p
Buffalo bore has the spiciest of spicy loads but it's a small market.
@whatsmolly5741 I'm afraid you have no idea what you're talking about.
People buy it because it's all they can afford, or because they simply don't know any better.
Nobody buys a 10mm to shoot .40.
10 mm is supposed to be 200 gr bullet at 1200 fps per original loading. If your load doesn't do that, then it's no 10 mm, just a 40 S&W equivalent.
Lots of folks have chronoed the original 200gr Norma loads. They run about 1100 fps. 1200 was always optimistic
He chronographed the round he was using at the end, those 10mm rounds are definitely within 10mm spec with 180 grains hitting 1240fps avg putting out 616ft/lbs which is about what you’d get from standard underwood 10mm. Only their exotic line is packing more punch.
Keep in mind that he was using a compact 10mm, not a full sized 10mm with the longer barrel.
I run 165g @ 1700 fps....... it's screaming!
@fatalvenomX that's what I get out of my plinking rounds, cause the Berry plated bullet is only rated for 1250 fps
the clarity of your ballistics gel is getting more and more impressive! not sure why others do not appreciate the sandbox test, that's some legit testing methodology. its why the military uses sandbags, that stuff stops bullets hardcore.
For pistol rounds, I think the sand test should be dropped. We know 6-inches of sand will stop common pistol rounds. Rifle rounds are the only ones to stand a chance.
"The clarity of your ballistics gel"... He just bought it from Midway USA. They sell clear ballistics gel in various forms.
@@RNG-999stuff is still expensive, it being clearer showcases he’s either better able to maintain the supply of fresh gel for these vids or has gotten better at recycling used blocks and still having them be fairly clear. Could even be mixing and moulding them himself.
@@md_vandenberg his video on the .44spl and .44mag showed that (one or both?) of those went through the sandbox. but yeah, common semi-auto handgun calibers 6" sand sand will stop
@@RNG-999 in some of the previous videos it's not that clear
Would like to see a match-up between 3 calibers. 357 sig, 357 mag., and 10mm.
.357 sig isn't even near the same power as the .357 mag or 10mm.... It genuinely irritates me when people compare it. It's like same power as .45ACP +P
Those are cartridges. Not calibers
Factory .357sig is very close to factory .357mag.
357. Mag will win
This
You hit that knot on the 6x6. Not surprised that it didn’t go through that. I’ve had knots completely seize up power tools/saws.
Use books or magazines pre soaked
Hard, but not especially cohesive to the normal wood.
+p 9 against real 10 mm, is no contest. I have both, love both. But it is like shooting 308 against 300 mag. And yes I have those too.
What's more powerful? 308 or 300?
@@charlescarmichael1124 300
@@joygamesinteractive I have a 308. AR10 platform. Is it close? Or massive difference?
@@charlescarmichael1124big difference
@@charlescarmichael1124 they made AR for 300 win mag. you cannot fire that without compensator
9mm for hoods, 10mm for woods
Back when I was in the german navy I learned one complex lesson. 9x19mm is fine in a Uzi, 7.62x51 is ok in a G3 but better in a MG3 and when you want to make an impression you start with 76 (no dot!) mm and work your way up to AGM 84! I have to admit though, lightweight torpedos are hard to use on a gun range 😄
Ww2 US tankers, actually tied sand bags on their tanks to increase their survival against the very powerful panzers. Sand is a very good heavy bullet stopper.
12" will stop a 50cal.
They tested it during the war. It doesn't help. The added weight does cause more transmission and driveline problems though. They let the crews keep it though because it made them feel better.
@@Charon-5582it definitely did something against rounds.
@Golgi-Gyges sandbags don't help much against 88mm rounds. If the round was going to go through 3 inches of steel it will go through a sandbag too.
@@Charon-5582 "... don't help much..."
THE BUTTERFLIES KILLED THE CATERPILLARS!!!
They ate wormy!
😢😫
Well, yes…but no.
I love this man's sense of humor lol
This is definitely the funniest banana ballistics video I’ve seen so far.
There are many reasons that 9mm is the most popular handgun caliber in America... With modern bullets and modern loads 9mm is no slouch, Its pretty hot in +P and carries a projectile that's heavy enough to do quite a bit of damage and has enough penetration to get through light cover and still provide enough velocity to get the job done... Not to mention the size, weight, capacity, recoil, ammunition cost and availability and sheer number of options on the market that fire 9mm compared to 10mm...
10mm is still impressive even though you weren't using full power loads and bleeding velocity with the 20C.
I’ll agree the 20c bled some of the velocity, but these are the hottest I could load before getting a Glock smile on the cases
A little unheard of to see someone walk away from one hit of 10mm like with 2 or three hits of the 9mm.
The only thing that matters the most is penetration. Stopped bullets in their terminal ballistic stage is like a shitting fart vs a solid turd in your underwear when a 10mm comes to play.
Oh, well can't tell some people anything & all their analysis articulates their desired outcome to keep mythical minds secure.
@@opinionsvary
Caliber is the least relevant metric in penetration tests. The key relevant factors are velocity, energy, sectional density, and bullet construction.
@@opinionsvary I've heard enough interviews with people who have got shot 15 times with 45 and have shot people 30+ times with a 45 before putting them down.
Its not about the rounds its about shot placement.
@@saltysaty8686 In my opinion: Take your best 9mm round against a 185gr 45 ACP +P of the same type of bullet. The human body is nothing like ballistics gel. Also 9mm really don't do well for stopping a armored vehicle operators when a bullet makes it inside the can. You may want to visit the hotel where Dillinger had a shoot out with the police & look around at all the FMJ damage the cops did. Suppose one were to have hit him in the lower abdomen or leg, it's beyond doubtful he would've escaped as he did.
There was an account to where a 158gr 38 special LRN killed a uncaged bear on a rampage in a city once. Seriously doubt 9mm has what it takes but to stop women & children.
9mm is like a BB wish come true for a lot of people. If not for JHPs law enforcement wouldn't have gone that route if not for women on the force.
How about replacing the sandbox with some sort of clay that can show you the amount of energy on target and it can be measured by the width of the impact and the depth
I recall in the late 90's shooting into the rootball of a good sized tree that had been grubbed out with a bulldozer, range was about 50 yards and I was using my 338/06 AI shooting 200 gr speers for a fire forming load, I was able to dig the bullets out and evaluate their expansion. Clay would be a great test medium, not sure where Mr Banana man lives but clay is generally pretty easy to come up with....
You should take all the old steel plates and weld them to the protection screen you have. That way you have protection from anything coming back at you
Good idea. He could even just zip tie them using the bullet holes, if he doesn't wanna weld them.
@TheDarkSkorpion didn't even think of that, that makes the job even easier
bro please the sandbox test is filler at this point please include a more realistic test it is a handgun caliber... if 5.56 can't like whyyy
Agreed, the sandbox is stupid and boring
If 5.56 can't 😂
@@stanpotter7764 bro i swear i don't understand like for real if 5.56 can't go through sand why in the hell are you wasting time with handgun calibers
4:27 put it in the box of complaints ig
@@PChelpism It needs to be like half or maybe 2/3 the size 🤷♂️
I have no problem with the sandbox test its a kinda useless for pistol testing but am not so impatient that its a issue for me.
The guy who criticises everything in the bathroom though his a good laugh👍
Love the videos. The humidity reminded of growing up in St. Louis. I now live in the desert in Utah, and a couple of days ago the humidity was only 9%. I'll take the dry heat any day.
Fellow Utah resident and dry heat any day over heat and humidity.
Utah here too, and I agree 💯
I live in Louisiana so I know humidity. But when I go to west Texas it’s about 10 degrees hotter but no humidity and it feels a lot cooler! I much prefer low humidity!
The queen ant declares, "Your concrete spalling has ZERO effect on my relentless egg production! And, thanks to your sand box tests, I will move my chambers to 8 inches from the surface! AHAHAH HA HA!"🐜
My uncle finally succeeded in getting rid of our ant problem. He had to go through divorce court.
🤣🤣
LoL
"aunt"
🤭
That's a crab problem.
that Queen 👑 ant would make a great Merch character
Battle of the lever actions. 30-30 vs 35 rem vs 45-70
Add the 32 Win Special
30-30 is the GOAT
@@heydaddy6817 That cartridge has brought home a lot of game for 130 years.
@@timclaus8313 Here in Canada it is widely used for all game (moose, elk, deer, etc). Including Grizzlies. Modern ammos help too like Barnes 190grain, Buffalo bore, leverevolution and nosler.
@@heydaddy6817 Nothing wrong with any of the centerfire lever cartridges. They have range limits due to the bullet shape requirements for tube magazines, but with good bullet selection, they all perform well beyond what their paper ballistics seem to indicate.
Man, your voice is the very best UA-cam has on offer.
Come on that first shot with the 9 + p hit a knot in the wood block you should do that shot over😮
The humor is great lmao. Dope video!!
Try 357sig vs 10mm...i think youd be surprised
There's been some good videos already. Both are underloaded, unfortunately, but the .357 SIG is no slouch and 10mm only performs slightly better.
@@mediocreman2 exactly 💯..357sig and 10mm overlap in power/energy
@@mediocreman2 only very weak range ammo overlaps with 357 sig. once you get to Underwood, Buffalo bore, Double tap loads, 357 sig no longer hangs. 9x25 Dillon however is different story. Monster of a round that ACTUALLY competes with full power 357 mag
10mm factory loads are watered down almost to 40 cal. I Love the 10mm with hard cast loaded to spec, it may not go through the sand box but it would knock it around a bit lol. For the sand box you could try clay, dry ice, melons, meat or bone targets.
The 44 Special and 45 Colt both made it through the sand in the sand in the box test.
Why?
@@tonyromano6220High mass and relatively low kinetic energy means they wouldn’t destroy themselves going through the sand.
Higher velocity may improve anti-armored personnel performance, but higher round weight improves penetration in general.
The fine particles of sand basically act like a solid version of hydro-shock. The low velocity means they don’t displace so much volume so fast they destroy themselves while their weight gives them enough momentum to keep going until they make it through.
@@fatalvenomX Thanks for the explanation. Mine was mostly (educated) guesswork.
Da fuck is the brand of ammo? I would have used 124g for the 9mm +p.
The 10mm ammo needs to me hand loaded to old Norma spec, or needs to be from Underwood for these tests.
Don't buy BuffaloBore, the owners are cucks. Underwood, DoubleTap, and Liberty make the best. The price of hand-loading is actually about equal to just buying from DoubleTap in-bulk.
Glocks are hard on brass with full power loads
@@jasonshults368 Not all of them, depends on the Gen.
He said he loaded them right under getting pressure signs in another comment.
@@anon-means-anon It's going to vary across different manuals. The manuals for years have been stepping down the actual loads for many cartridges. I use new Starline brass when I do Normal spec loads from the 80's when 10mm was 10mm.
9mm+P vs 38 Super would be an interesting test!! I'm curious how that would turn out
That looks like M1152 NATO spec 9mm ammo. It's good stuff. I'd much prefer that over a 10mm due to the significantly lower recoil. I'd rather put 4 9mm on target than 2 10mm in the same amount of time. It's probably not ideal for Grizzly protection but the 9mm has successfully been used for that purpose, and hunting guides agree that something you can comfortably shoot is more important than missing with a hand cannon.
Dude... A high-powered 10mm round carries 80% more kinetic energy per shot than a 9mm, even these 9mm +P because they are just high-powered 9mm.
780 Ft-lbs vs 420 ft-lbs is 85%. Those two 10mm rounds had almost as much energy as four 9mm...
"You'll still have an ant problem" *Laughs in flamethrower and molten aluminum*
I was also unaware you had a camera in my bathroom
I wasn't. We all know what you do in there. Patreon has it's benefits.
@@TheDarkSkorpion you're right. I should really get paid for my digital japanese toilet asmr
Shoot the +P in the center of the metal plates like you shot the 10mm.
the 9 wouldve gone thru, too.... if the point of impact was in the center. as opposed to the corner where the metal framing added resistance.
Really appreciate your content and channel. When the French invented smokeless powder in 1886 for the 8mm lebel cartridge the Germans started ballistics testing on every caliber/ bullet made and continued extensive testing up to about 1944. The Germans found that the 9mm in a pistol and a 7mm in a rifle caliber was the optimal performance for combat.
.357 Sig would have been closer probably…. They might as well have called it “9mm magnum”. 😂
It would definitely punched through that second plate. I have seen .357 Sig punch through many targets that only Underwood 10mm could get through. They scorch when loaded hot and a good projectile is used. An Extreme Penetrator is one of my favorite. Extreme Defender will work for EDC otherwise.
@@Balticblue93 it really is a decent round. The bottleneck shape would make it feed well I would imagine in a carbine or SMG…. Wonder why no one has done that yet?
Maybe they have and I’m not aware or it’s something obscure. I probably buy either 😂
Let's even up the score and get some +P 10mm. I've both and if I'm needing more horse power for some reason, I'm definitely grabbing my 10mm with my hot 180 grain loads.
That's one nice box of compaints!
😂😂
That’s the most realistic evil queen ant drawing! Awesome comparison video. Thank you 😊
9mm shot into knot of wood
Wood you knot?
My 10mm loads are 180g hollow point and about 700-750ft lbs of energy. With the stiffer spring in my glock it really roars and shows the truth of 10mm in its original spec
The guy on the sh*tter. Hilarious😂
Yeah, I hear you on that humidity thing. We had some horrible humidity here in New Mexico the other week. It was a whopping 57% humidity, about an hour after it rained...
Out of curiosity, I'd liek to see you hit the center mass of the 1/8" with the 9mm +P
I'd still take a 10mm over a 9mm. Impact energy is something few people talk about, and it's very important.
Nah, ill take more capacity, smaller weapon profile and less recoil.
I’m a 10mm owner, have been for 34 years and though in a barricaded situation the 10mm would be the clear choice. I’d take the 9mm+p for the capacity, the damage to organs is very close so I’d prefer more rounds on target, less recoil.
@@XRakkgruntX Standard Glock 20 in 10mm is 15 rounds vs 17 rounds for a Glock 17. If that difference in capacity comes into play, you have bigger issues to deal with.
@@Daniel-qe8qe - Glock 20 carries 15 rounds.
@@XRakkgruntX Here's my reason for 10mm: There are people out there with overactive adrenaline glands or who are hopped up on d_ru-gs. They don't know they've been un-lived, and can keep coming at you for a few seconds. Best to have impact energy. I'd go for .44 mag but I'm afraid that some DA would start calling me Dirty Harry to sway the jury in a self-defense prosecution.
Bro the sand is the great filter of high power bullets and I love it and I will be sad if it is gone, I love to see how much power it takes to go through it
+P+ 9mm, vs 10mm vs 45 Super. The world needs to know.
I say keep the sand . For one, it's your channel two it's a real-world barrier that has to be worried about.
The best 9mm +P++ is no doubt 357 Sig. Would love to see a match against 10mm
That's misinformation...the best 9mm +p+ is NOT 357sig!!! The best 9mm +p+ (safe) will propel a 124/125 grain bullet at 1300 or so fps....357sig loaded properly can easily reach 1500 fps with the same weight bullet fun facts 👍
@@kevinrichardson8859 maybe I should’ve said best 9mm +P++++ is 357 Sig.
@TransformersHoarder 9mm+p++++ will likely blow your gun up and maybe take parts of your hand with it...if you feel the need to add that many pluses....maybe it's smarter to get a more powerful gun??? 🤔
@@kevinrichardson8859 stuff goes right over your head all the time, doesn’t it…….
Maybe you don’t know that 357 Sig is a 9mm projectile?
I love the sand box test. So little can get thru it & that sand bags work better than anything else to protect you.
Instead of getting rid of the sand test why not use different thicknesses to see how each caliber can make it through.
When a shot hits near the edge of a piece of sheet metal, deformation of the edge reduces the ability to penetrate by absorbing some of the energy. Notice how the edge bet forwards opposite the force of impact.
Funny enough .45+P hits about as hard as base 10mm here. (185@1200)
Also missing the proper 10mm loading.. The magic is and has always been the holy 200@1200.
10mm underwood or buffalo boar hard cast
Everything is better with a plus!
And even better with 2 +
My suggestion: Replace the sandbox with fabric (like sheets or denim) or copy paper so you can count the layers they penetrated if they get stopped.
9mm guys are already crying and stomping their feet. KNOT FAIR!!! (pun intended)
Don't you guys always make the excuse that the 10mm is underloaded?
@@lardomcfarty9866 I don't underload it, but realistically 9mm will never be able to keep up with 10mm - bigger bullet, more case capacity... I have loads that push a 180 gr. Speer Gold Dot to 1350 fps safely. Not bashing 9mm but it will never be 10mm.
@@WHEELGUNNER1 I know, 10mm is a great round. I don't have one yet, but I definitely want one. Has actual practical advantage over 9mm în some cases.
@@lardomcfarty986610mm was cut down for a reason. The standard rounds are still below spec. Blame the feds for being wimps
Your editing is top-notch. And you're hilarious. Thanks!
Knots are harder than the wood around it.
As always excellent reviews, thanks a lot.
Considering most 10 mm cartridges are loaded 40 caliber capacities or less, that 10 mm is not anywhere near its maximum knockdown power. I guarantee it
He said in some other comment "these are the hottest I could load before getting a Glock smile on the cases" so they outta be pretty hot still.
Just started the video- maxxed out 9mm will never beat properly loaded 10mm. You can cherry pick a 9mm load to beat a watered down 10mm that is nothing more than a .40s&w in disguise (powerwise), but then that's not a fair comparison. Factory 9mm from a 5" barrel maxxes out in the 500ft-lbs range of energy, while 10mm comes in at 800ft-lbs. Most of us know this...
If you want to keep the sand, maybe do a stack of USPS shipping boxes (PM Small FR's) filled with sand, that'd give you a series of 1&3/4ths thick boxes (still tape-able!) you could stack up to gauge penetration with increments.
45 Super vs 10mm pls
That was really funny vid. And box of complaints was great 😂😂😂
There is a reason why people are carrying the 10mm with real 10mm ammo in the woods for protection against bears.
In Alaska and maybe parts of Montana and Wyoming….. Doesn’t make much sense in 99% of the lower 48
I also enjoy the first few years of the KZ650, but your list had a lot of great bikes. I lean more towards the 1980s, Ninja 900, 600, FZ600, Seca 550, 500 Interceptor, etc. More "modern classics" than vintage.
What about +P+ 9mm ?
Ricky from IBM
+p+ 9mm is a whole nother level! 🔥
Chasing your tail trying to compete with properly loaded 10mm. I know, done these experiments myself with custom hand loaded ammo. I tossed in .357 Sig into the mix as well, that's one caliber a lot of people sleep on if they want a real deal +P+ "9mm".
If you like your fingers I would suggest you reconsider +P+ out of a Glock...or real .10mm loads out of a Glock.
@@midgepfeffer711 Shot many Ranger T series 127gr +P+ out of a G17, was never an issue. The unsupported barrel claims were with .40's mostly.
@midgepfeffer711 a service duty pistol would have no problem with it
I kinda figured even particularly spicy 9x19 still wouldn't have the "authority" of 10mm. Still a lot of fun to watch! This channel and Tools & Targets are my favourites for cartridge performance. Additionally, I feel like if you retire the sand box, you should replace it with modeling clay!
8mm mauser vs 308!
More like 303 vs 8mm Mauser vs 7.62X54R vs 7.7X58 Japanese vs 7.5X54 French vs 30-06 M2
@@donwyoming1936see he gets it
@@donwyoming1936 As long as the test is with Norma 8mm. At least that is up to a military loading for heat.
You're a GEEK !! In a good way that is. I enjoy your commentary. Thanks for the videos.
No one doubts a 10mm has more stopping power. But, 1) Your accuracy will drop, and hits matter more than noise. 2) It's well over $1 per round for a decent 10mm which limits practice. 3) It's a far less common round, so good luck when supply dwindles or society breaks down.
this sounds like a comment a bear would make 🤔
Devils advocate: in the early days of COVID 10mm was easier to get than 9mm. The price argument and the accuracy argument are legitimate.
"It's a far less common round," I hear this silly excuse all the time. The fact that there are less guns shooting it also means that the supply dwindles down slower. In the last couple of ammo shortages we saw that the first ammo to disappear from shelves were the most popular rounds. People buying uncommon guns were able to find ammo for their guns on shelves after the common calibers had already run out. The .41 magnum, 5.7x28mm, .357 SIG, etc. people were having an easier time in the early stages of the shortages than 9mm, .45 acp, 38 spl people. What this tells us is that if you cared so much about supply dwindling then you'd buy multiple guns in a variety of calibers.
@@areyoutheregoditsmedave Hahaha. You got me!
@@gabek1381 Fair enough friend
Don't get rid of the sand box. Use several thinner boxes to see how far it goes
Try a 9x19 +P+
For all the comments on 10mm being underloaded, check out the listing from Lucky Gunner. He has a full length data sheet on every 10mm offering that he's tested. You can very quickly figure out who's selling .40 cleverly disguised as 10mm and who has the full power stuff. He even has a video on the subject.
9mm +p has my vote
Puts too much wear on pistols
Like the way you just do the testing, no bs lead in. Great video
Sandbox would be cool if it was multiple thin boxes lined up. 1” thick max per box, the cubes are always going to be holding too much sand.
Do 9+p vs 45. I'm curious to see the results. And now. Banana ballistics has a new tone with that curvature. 😂
Your work in this video made me more impressed with my Kevlar vests. Thanks.
I like the sand box, but if your going to do that, open it up and recover the round each time to see distortion.
Handgun cartridges are often still just that unfortunately. But the 10mm does have a little extra spice for those shields.
I'm not against the current sand test. The 44spl.and 45 colt both made it through.
Your videos remind me why the Geneva Convention exist 😂
How about some underwood extreme defender tests. Those solid coppers will surprise you!
That 65grain 357sig is supposed to be going over 2000fps!
If you can get your hands on it. Winchester Ranger T-series 9x19 127gr +P+. Pure evil. Also noticed their .45 acp rounds are hot too. 230 gr at 920 fps, (almost +P), and the +P is at 990 fps. Winchester doesn't mess around with their Range line. (I have a buddy that's a Winchester distributor, so we get this stuff to shoot all the time).
Could you make the sand box thinner? I think it's a good test, but you've got one that's a really tough barrier to overcome. A thinner box of sand will still represent while giving more rounds a better chance.
+P+ 9mm vs something would be really cool to see the results. I use +p+ in my AR9 and have always been interested in seeing it's performance vs another PCC caliber.
Love the video, great style and very entertaining. Good stuff to see comparing 9 vs 10.
The thing I think needs to be compared more often isn't 9 vs 10, it's 10 v .40 in typical handguns. I am not sure 10mm out of a 4.6 is getting the legs to be anything other than .40 that costs more. The difference between .40/10mm out of my Glock 40 is really significant, and ballistic data shows 10mm really picks up at 5" or longer barrels.
Let’s see some 277 fury projectiles into ballistic gel. No one else has done that. Love the work 🤙
Garand Thumb did
This video is officially funnier than SNL. It is settled science.
Why it looks burnt in the gel. When the squishy stuff goes back to shape, it raises the pressure. It's called *adiabatic heating*. Molecules in hot gasses are farther apart and less dense (that's how hot air balloons work). If you squish the molecules together, rapidly, they they heat up, like an air compressor or diesel engine. The opposite is when uncompressing a gas. When you spray canned air on your hand, the gasses take energy from you (feels cold).
Thanks for doing a thin steel test! I’m buying a shipping container (slightly thicker than 1/16” walls) and was wondering whether it would happen to block normal handgun calibers.
I’m going to say no, unless it was something really light like a .380 auto or .22lr. Luckily I’m not buying it for ballistic protection anyway.
It's been like a mid to high 90's steam bath here in Columbia County NY lately.