The Woodhead 'Hell Hole' Tunnels. A brief history
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- Опубліковано 4 лис 2023
- In this video we cycled to the Woodhead railway tunnels along the Longendale trail. A former disused railway line. The Woodhead tunnels were known as hell holes to the railwaymen that worked steam locomotives through them. The Woodhead tunnels were part of a railway line that was one of the initial cross pennine routes. Trans pennine route. The tunnels were blasted out of rock and the Navvies that dug them had a difficult time. Plagued by Cholera and industrial injuries. Later in 1953 a third trans pennine tunnel was dug and this was Woodhead 3. The line was electrified and employed the class 76 locomotives. I tell a story of seeing the British rail class 76 locomotives at Reddish depot in Manchester. As a trainspotter this line holds a special place for me. The Longendale chain of reservoirs can also be seen. A feat of Victorian civil engineering. The longendale trail is now a cycle route. We see photos of old steam locomotives in this railway history vlog.
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The Smiths cover by Dean 'Sensory Triggered' Other music by Dean
dean is the next manchester music legend
The ending music sounded like a cover of the Dream Academy cover, lol
Or the Smiths 😉
Heard this at the beginning, and came to the comments to find this!
Did you catch Rick Astley and Blossoms covering the Smiths at Glastonbury? Depending on your point of view, it was either pure heresy or a brilliant live set.
Just a little railway anecdote from me. I'm a designer for a construction company, about 8 years ago we were doing some roof refurbishment at Manchester Central. I was in their archive room looking for drawings from the 1980s roof replacement when it was the Gmex. I had been in there for about an hour going through hanging drawings and not having much luck when I came across some cardboard tubes. I pulled out a rolled up drawing from a tube and rolled out the drawing on a table. When I realised what I was holding, every hair on my body stood on-end. It was a hand-drawn detail drawing about ten feet long drawn on canvas and dated 1860, it was the Trafford Street viaduct drawing, not a copy, the actual thing drawn by hand nearly 160 years ago! There were dozens of them there for all of the local railway infrastructure. These things should be on display in the science museum, not in a dusty back room of an exhibition centre.
My mum spoke of similar experiences of when she was starting out as an electrical protection engineer. The drawings weren't as old, but were still huge, hand drawn on fabric. She said it felt like a privilege to touch them. I don't believe any of the circuits and switches they detailed are still in use in those forms anymore...
I didn't know there where these buildings in Manchester or old drawings....or, did you find drawings by the local Indians?
How much do you want for it? 😀
@@bethanybrookes8479I worked for what was the the old Midlands Electricity Board in Birmingham prior to privatisation and nearly all our plans were drawn on what we called “linens”. Drawings on waterproof coated cloth. Every circuit had its own linen copied from a master kept in the local control room. One per circuit.
Believe it or not the reason for them was Health and Safety as well as circuit identification. The idea being that if an engineer or team took out a linen to work on a particular circuit, then no one else could feasibly work on that particular circuit without contacting the engineer or “Authorised Person” who held the linen. Given the length of many circuits, HV (11kv) and LV (415v) this was a real possibility some days.
Any new joints or repairs were hand drawn by the engineer with notes about cable sizes, types etc and all dated and signed off. When the linen was returned the master copy and a new copy were updated by the drawing office. Long winded process but it kept us all safe and there was actually a long drawn out fight with the company (by then owned by Eon) who wanted to replace them with printed paper copies at the time.
Nowadays its done by instant updates via the ipads and tablets with which every authorised craftsman is issued.
The linens themselves though were a work of art and when I qualified as an “authorised” craftsman (able to switch and work on HV as well as LV circuits) as you say it was a privilege to even touch them let alone update and put your name on them.
@@beendoneagainObviously not for sale! These are working archives of the railroad corporation owning and using those buildings, needing them every time they upgrade, maintain or replace those buildings . Problem is that they may be getting sloppy in maintaining those records between jobs done every 50 or 100 years .
Additionally, when you guys were congregating around tunnel 3 gates, the surface below you was divided into six parallel 'tracks'. These are the concrete ducts for the individual high voltage cables; the cables are laid inside & then the ducts filled with sand. Then a concrete cap layer is poured. Six ducts for 3-phase parallel feeders, the same as the pylon lines. Incidentally, all of the rock in that area is largely sedimentary, which is why it appears as thick layers. The further north you go, up into the Lakes area, the layers get thinner, forming slate & shale.
thankyou for explaining those 6 parallel tracks are for buried HV cable, I was puzzled as to whether the tracks were some kind of artist impression of the rail tracks and that didn't quite add up - so thankyou!
I figured so, but thanks for the details
Yes Bobbalus, I noticed those too. 2 sets of Three Phase.
@notwenjohn6852 Correct, sir. They don't run a seventh cable (earth), even though an earth cable is strung between pylons (it's the cable that links the very tops of the pylons). The earth function is carried out by the (in most cases) double layer, opposing wrap steel wire or band armouring. Some HV cables also have a semiconducting layer that detects any possible arcs & sensing devices at either end of the cable runs can operate tripping equipment to isolate the cable. I used to work in a power cables manufacturing plant, so I've got shedloads of info like this! 😂
As a Guard at Rotherwood, I thought that I had worked the last train out to Godley because of flooding at Howden. We had to be dragged back to Rotherwood by a pair of class 31. However, they did restore the line in my absence and continued to run trains. Such was the feeling for this wonderful and unique railway. The depot at Rotherwood was like one big family. I suspect that I am close to being the last surviving traincrew member.
The depot closed on Saturday 18 July 1981 and as a twenty-six year old, I was officially made redundant on my wedding day. The class 76 locomotives were formerly class 26 and number 20 is in York Museum. They did bounce about a bit but they were powerful and could power 1,436 tons of coal up the bank with ease, unlike the diesels that progressed at walking speed up there.
The Woodhead tunnel was bone dry and lit throughout, the standard bulbs were at one point replaced with fluorescent strip lights. The scenery is stunning round there.
The navies who worked on the original tunnels weren't paid in cash but in tokens to spend in the Tommy Shop, it sold inferior goods and food and this was the origin of the Sheffield saying "Tommy Rot" for anything considered to be rubbish. The prototype loco, of which there was only one, was loaned to Holland because they used the same 1500 volt three wire system. It was the Dutch who named the first 26 class "Tommy " because of their admiration for the British army and the locomotive, which they loved.
Later, the six co-cos that were built, were sold to Holland for passenger services. Reddish was the repair depot, mainly the locos were based at Rotherwood and Guido Bridge. Sheffield was the city where the Great Central Railway began, previously it was named The Manchester Sheffield and Lincolnshire Railway.
The BBC has a documentary named "Locomotives Must Not Enter The Potato Shed "in its archives and is worth watching. They travel with driver Walt Hibberd over to Manchester.
Great information there, cheers.👍
What a fun day out and so interesting and so much information.from N.Z. thank you
@johngrant5448 A superb post ...thanks so much for the info and your effort Mon Ami it is much appreciated ✌️🏴
"The potato shed" I was trying to remember that memorable documentary as this one started. I need to watch it again
Great bit of history, thanks for the share.
my dad AND my grandad were both train drivers, and i often heard the two of them discussing the difficulties of driving this route. my dad did both steam and diesel. he also taught nee drivers. i was tremendously proud of him.
Did you mean NEW drivers ?
Nice to see your enthusiasm for the place of my railway birth, so to speak. Heartbreaking to see all the overgrowth that has crept in. I too had a'near miss' with the line, but mine lasted over 4 years....
I had another one of a different kind, November 79; 2 of us had been spare on Saturday morning and it started to snow. And snow some more. So we were detailed to take a class 25 with mini snow ploughs fitted, to 'do a few trips to Hadfield and Glossop to keep things clear for the units'. OK, no problem, be finished before last orders (this was when pubs closed at 3pm until 5pm each day), early finish then a beer.
Arriving at Hadfield, told crossover was unusable due to packed snow. Need to go to Woodhead to cross over and return.
Got to Woodhead, same thing. 'Go to Dunford' was plan B. Arrange to pick up signalman on way back as he couldn't drive home as it was by then.
Arrive at Dunford. Same script. 'Go to Penistone'.
And so it went.
Woodburn Junction was where the deed was done. Far side of Sheffield. All right, off back we go.
All well until Dunford west. The signals were on 'black oil', i.e. no light at all (colour light sigs but the expression was still prevalent).
Waited and saw snow pile up to platform level.
Repaired to Stanhope Arms for liquid sustenance and whatever solids they had.
Followed path to their door and sunk 5 feet into a snow drift. Got out fairly dry. Brush off and into pub. (First encounter with what became Peperami years later, at this time called 'Chewbilee'). And a few bottles of Guinness.
Suitably refreshed, went back to loco. Throwing snowballs at the signal and hitting the red aspect, the thing lit up again- the power had coincidentally come back on that instant.
So, got the road, driver put me in the chair. 'Give it a run, says he, as I shut off at 60. Go up to 70. 'Give it a bloody run lad!'.
Right then. Up to 85 now. Line speed 60. Just over the summit I shut off. And got on the brake, hard.
'Don't forget we're supposed to pick the bobby up at Woodhead!' says I.
When the station came in to sight, we were still doing over 45 miles per.
No way would we stop. But. The depth of snow was our saviour. The bobby saw what was going to happen, and got into the stone waiting shelter out of the way.
We hit the drift with a huge bang, a massive wall of snow going off like a bomb.
I thought the windows would come in, or dent the cab front.
It was the only thing that stopped us anywhere like where we needed to.
We only did the one trip that day.......
I walked through the tunnel after the line was closed in 1981, if I remember correctly there were still a few lights in the tunnel, but I don't recall any signal being lit. It was some time later another friend told me the 1500DC over head power was kept live to prevent the theft of the copper. On a map the tunnel looks straight, but it isn't so very quickly it got very dark. Being a modern tunnel it was dry. So glad I did the walk before National Grid took it over.
Glad you just missed me falling off my bike 😅 haha. It was lovely to meet you all on the trail. Georgina xx
Georgina XXX
It looks like you had decent sunny weather back then! (Roll on summer ‘24) beautiful countryside ✅😎🙏
I worked with a driver at Buxton that used to be a fireman at Gorton shed, and he told me of an incident that he had in that No1 tunnel. He was a young fireman on a freight train bound for Sheffield from the Manchester area, and they were having more than great difficulty working hard through the tunnel, eventually almost suffocating and lying on the cab floor to try and get the 'freshest' air with wet rags on their faces. The loco was slipping like hell, but they managed to struggle through to the Penistone end. They found out that the guard at the rear of the train had had his handbrake hard on, not familiar with the uphill gradient in the tunnel. He got a right good ticking off! Apparently, back in the late 1800s there was a signal box inside No.1 tunnel, but conditions were so bad, that it got abandoned after ten years of use. Great video Martin, anyhow. The three of you, Martin, James and Roy, the (definitive) Zero crew! Many thanks.
Fascinating. A few decades ago there was some controversy about exhuming the bodies of dead navvies in a churchyard in Tintwistle, the locals were concerned about dormant disease such as cholera spreading. The lives of those navvies were extremely tough, they really were unsung heroes, you're narrative did them proud.
Saying that a lot of the injuries were caused by drunkeness; a lot of navvies were given multiple pints of beer by their employers as a quick way to get calories, so quite right not to blame them for all the consequences of that
@@stalfithrildi5366 I'm guessing they also gave them beer because who would even do their jobs sober? Digging long tunnels through mountains was a dreadful way to make any kind of living in the 19th century. They might have lacked in education, but the navvies weren't stupid, and they'd have known that their lives were cheap and deaths would be brutal. I'd be drunk as much as I could too, in their place.
My late father a BR signalman on the SR told me as a kiddy about the signalbox halfway up the original tunnels nicknamed "Hell's Box" because of the heat and rubbish that collected and the seas of huge rats that fed off the passing trains droppings like grain trains not locked up tightly would bring in veritable waves of the damned things. Also maintaining the various signal oil lights was a positive nightmare where signalman as part of their duty would start off from the box heading up, coming back down at the top end on the other bore then down to the bottom and back up to the box hence why even at night this box was never single manned as half a signalman's shift would be taken in by doing the signal lamps. I think the lamps became electric at some point but them pesky rats just loved the wiring insulators for building nests so flagging and lamp duty was a common duty requirement to keep the 24 hour running line operational.
My father was the signalman at/near Woodhead back in the 1960s, quite a while before I was born. He's been dead for quite a number of years now, but I from what I remember he used to enjoy the work, except during the depths of the winter. Interesting to see the area - thank's for the video!
I have heard that there was a signalbox in one of the single track tunnels. I bet that would these days give the Health and Safety officers a fit!
A long time ago I watched a Fred dibnah program on his work as a steeple jack. He used to say a lot of those drunk to numb the pain in their hands from swinging a hammer all day. It resonated with me at the time as a lot of my grandads generation would carry hip flasks and have whiskey in their coffee daily for the same reason. I dont think today we can appreciate what life was like.
July 1981 I was 14 years old, and us kids spent so much time hanging around the local railyards and track lines. Change was overtaking that era, wasn't it ? My cousin had a welding job in the local yard and I thought I'd end up there working with him, but the yard closed in '85 and that was the end of that. Thanks for another fun adventure Martin, James and Roy.
Myself and a bunch of friends walked through the "new" tunnel just after the line closed in the early 80s when all the track and infrastructre was still in place. The new tunnel was on a slight curve and rose slightly towards the Dunford bridge end. At the centre of the the tunnlel there was a large "control room" its purpose unknown, this was on the right side looking towards Dunford bridge..
At the Dunford bridge end the types of locos and consits of the last few trains and the crews was chalked on the tunnel walls.
We had a couuple of pints in the pub next door to the tunnel then walked back through. I only wish i had taken my camera to record it all.
The victorian bores at that time took high voltage power lines under the moores and there was a 2 foot gauge narrow gauge railway used to maintain and service the power lines etc....
The control room likely controlled the ventilation fans and monitored the fire/smoke alarm system.
According to some of the other comments it was a signal room known as hells box due to the heat and smoke that gathered in there
Well said 👏. You are not being rude or disrespectful showing other people's pictures. Its actual a compliment. It helped put a view of times gone by. Allowing many to see it, rather than how things are nowadays. Keep up the good work 👏 🙌 👍
It's insane that the cycle route wasn't somehow integrated into one of the tunnels. Would be fantastic.
Great idea - it would be like the underground sections of 'Two Tunnels Greenway' cycle/walk route near Bath but three times longer
These days it would get H&S into panics about injury & indemnity.
@@petergeorgedirector4 There are other examples. I'm sure it's not beyond the wit of man to do. H&S would just mean it was done properly I'd hope.
@@EternallyDisappointed
Aye, caught me in despondent mood! Must be positive - you're right, mountains have been moved before!
I understand that 1&2 are in a poor state of repair, which is why NG moved into 3 a couple of years ago. It probably wouldn’t be impossible to route a cycle path through 1 or 2, but would cost a fortune.
One of the benefits of the 1500 Volt DC electrification was that locomotives could use regenerative braking, putting energy back into the overhead line when braking. This mean that trains travelling downhill, and slowing, could put energy into the contact wire to assist pulling trains up the hill. This also decreased wear on the brake pads/discs/shoes.
I can't be sure but I think timetables were organised to take maximum benefit of this.
We used brake shoes. They were curved steel brake blocks that were applied to the tyre. The advantage with these was that they kept the tyre clean and they would warm the wheels through friction if they were partly applied. This had obvious advantages over today braking systems. Also, the locos were fitted with sand boxes that blew sand onto the rail to prevent wheel slip in bad conditions. There was a regenerative braking system on the 76s that allowed us to put the power back into the overhead on falling gradients. Therefore, in the 60s it cost one shilling to take a train to Manchester.
And so it does with the more modern 750 V dc stock on third rail, but there is a limitation that it only works if there is a balancing demand on the section connected to the same substation. Same drawback on the old 1500 V dc one, albeit longer sections within which balancing demand/regenerative supply could happen. Nowadays, under 25 kV ac there is regenerative braking on stock like the 80x units and they are not limited to short sections. Obviously, the shorter the distance between them results in less thermal loss, but in principle it can go all the way back up to the national grid feed. Modern power electronics with variable frequency ac traction motors which can become alternators had a lot do with that being developed (both for dc and ac supply systems - they all use variable ac motors now).
@johnkeepin7527 Do you know, in all the days that I did my job of actually operating my train, after doing all the training that was required, passing my entrance exam that lasted for three hours of questioning, with a 95% failure rate, never once in my twenty years did I need to consult a member of the public nor any armchair expert who tried to over complicate every aspect of a professional job.
Yes I remember a ( late ) neighbour of mine, telling me as a kid, of the incredible regenerative braking that made the line extremely fuel efficient.
@johnkeepin7527 pretty much every unit since the networkers are actually AC units regardless of the power source as the networkers (465/466) were the first to be fitted with AC traction gear rather than the previous much bulkier DC traction equipment. Preceeding the 465s was the class 457 units that were used to test the equipment and make sure that no interference problems arose from their use (the southern region uses AC for the track circuits, so interference from the AC equipment on the new units would have been a rather bad thing! ). They tested the same on the anglia route I think it was by putting a pantograph car in and renumber it as 316999.
These days any modern unit with AC 25kv or 750v DC equipment can be fairly easily adapted to either or both (the first 350s were both as they originally were meant to be 450s).
It's so easy to forget the underlaying hardships when we see these tunnels and buildings today. Thank you Martin for the historical photos and perspectives you add to give context for a period many will never understand nor could have lived in with their "give me, selfish, ungrateful, it's all about me" modern attitudes.
Who knew watching a video of a plug hole in a canal a few years ago would bring me this much entertainment cheers lads!
Alan 👍
so true , its also how i came across martin :)
Imagine running one of those tiny open-cabbed steamers through a 3-mile tunnel in the 1840s... To us, it's the ultimate heritage road operation, but back then it was a trip through a smoky hell - especially before the second tunnel opened. They'd think we were crazy to want to experience that.
Great video!
Many thanks again Martin, James and Roy for another bit of our regional history. I just wanted to mention a little bit of Woodhead history that I have come across. Randall Kay Williams (1846 - 1898) aka the King of Showmen was travelling by road from Manchester to Sheffield in December 1876 with his convoy of (horse drawn) show equipment. At Woodhead he was held up in the snow for 6 days, nearly running out of hay for the horses. Whilst stranded there he noticed the trains travelling freely through the tunnels and decided that from hence forth he would travel by railway all over England. He had to negotiate a reasonable fair with the railway company who wanted to charge him 9 pence per mile and he argued for 6 pence per mile. It took him 20 years to achieve 6 pence per mile for travelling showmen. He died in 1898 and is buried at Weaste Cemetery, Salford.
Seven of these locomotives were purchased by the NS (dutch railways) after the line closed. There was a shortage here, and the NS uses a 1500V system. They are known here as the series 1500. Wikipedia: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NS_Class_1500 i even recall one or 2 being restored back into British Rail colors and returned to the UK a few years ago. There is also still one or two in NS livery left in the railway museum in Utrecht in The Netherlands.
The first of the 76's was "Tommy" which I believe helped the Dutch in the post war chaos.
They were the larger class 77's that had been built for passenger work.
The Class 77s were sold to the Dutch when the passenger service stopped. The class 76s were used on the coal trains over from Wath until the line closed
MOSI have/had Ariadne and the cab of Hector
@@LeslieGilpinRailwaysAll seven Class 77's were sold to the Netherlands State Railways in 1968, having been out of use for about six months beforehand. One was cannibalised for spares, but the others entered service, and some lasted until 1986.
What a hard hard time those men faced building these bridges. What an amazing video. Thank you Martin , James and Roy.
Great job Martin. So many questions I have about this area you have answered, keep recording history many will thank you for it in the future
Great memories of Woodhead station as a mere youth.
Very interesting video thanks. I used to live 200 yards from a railway station when I was a young kid up til they closed it in the early 60s I played for hours on the lines and buildings. There was a freight engine driver who used to blow the steam from his lines as we walked past and it used to really frighten us as 9-10 year olds. Looking back, I can honestly say that those days were some of the happiest and most carefree days of my life and I still think of them even now. Great memories evoked. Thanks.
Very good video! I'm an "old man" of 71 years in the States, very interesting learning a few key new words from the video and comments such as "navvies" etc. Always good to keep learning. Hard to believe that they tore down those stone buildings near the tunnel entrances, not sure why I say that as they have done the same thing locally years ago in Portland, Maine tearing down a rail station with a nice clock tower to put in a shabby strip mall of stores.
I think they needed to be demolished to accommodate the line for the new tunnel. Still a pity as they looked spectacular.
Thanks Martin for a very enjoyable and informative video. This is one of the few videos where I've enjoyed the comments almost as much as the main feature, so thanks to all the commenters for the color you added to the story. Cheers from the USA.
We are glad Roy has been at this for so long and constantly comes to the rescue with fantastic photos, thanks Roy.
I used to work at the farm called The Lodge opposite Woodhead Bridge near Crowden back in the spring and summer of 1983. The row of cottages at 10.50 were originally railway workers cottages, one of which was still occupied by an old chap back then. I remember sitting in his kitchen one cold March day having a cup of tea brewed with a kettle boiled on his coal fired range. The last time I was up there was when the Tour de France came through in 2013.
Great to see such friendship and connection between you chaps. Much needed these days.
I grew up in Dunford Bridge. We used to play in all those tunnels and culverts. Also been in the main train tunnel. If you don't mind getting your feet wet (and if it still exists) there is an underground route from the moors above Dunford Bridge down to the river Don. Passing directly under the Stanhope Arms Pub, you could hear people in the pub talking, we used to make ghost noises in the tunnel, Hehe. There used to be a few derelict buildings too we used to explore.
Didn't the Stanhope Arms close more recently and become some kind of hostel?
Great info about Woodhead tunnels. Respect to the builders and users of the tunnels. Shame it’s not possible to walk the route that so many toiled to build. Once again…Great video
I live in the states but it was very interesting to see the landscape and the old tunnels there and to hear the story behind them. Very beautiful area. Thank you for sharing.
Such a beautiful Old Stone tunnels. Thank you for sharing and for the history as well
Another great video guys, looks like a fun day out (great banter) and glad the the free eBike is getting used by the whole team! 🙂 Really interesting hearing about and seeing the tunnels and the related stories. Also another disused railway line on the list to come and cycle. Thanks again!!
Excellent video as always Martin.
Visited Reddish depot a couple of years after it had closed.
Was a sad sight indeed, dereliction was everywhere.
I walked the Woodhead tunnel about 30 years ago. A group of us from a car club (Triumph Tr's) were staying at the Stanhope Arms in Dunford Bridge and the landlord took us all down to Woodhead where he opened the metal fencing with a socket set to let us inside and then we walked the full length back to the pub which was literally the other side of the road to the tunnel exit.
Which one did you walk through ?
@@MartinZero I think it was the larger tunnel simply because I remember it being pretty large inside. There were no tracks down, it was just stone under foot. It took us a good couple of hours to get through.
Another great VLOG Martin, James and Roy many thanks for making and sharing.
Cheers Martin and the gang another great look in to the past keep them coming , always cheers me up the banter you all have 👍
I miss being up north. Thanks for the videos!
Went to the Lake District not so long back, and got chatting to a guy in a bar, he worked on northern rail and was in charge at looking at the feasibility of reopening the line, the ideas are still floating around so wouldn’t be out of surprised if the line was to reopen
Thanks Martin, Roy and James for a fantastic video on this trail, one of my favourites which I have walked and cycled many times. I remember seeing the trains running over the Sheffield side near Wortley back in 1980. Great banter and excellent history.
A great video. I just love industrial archaeology, and forgotten railways have been everywhere I've lived, and I've walked and cycled every mile. Thanks for sharing this.
Hi Martin. The high voltage pylons & insulator nests behind the fence, just before the Woodhead Tunnels, is known as a sealing end compound. It's where the bare overhead lines are converted to insulated underground cables. The joints between the two types of cables are protected in sealed joint enclosures. The compound will also contain some safety switching mechanisms & monitoring equipment.
Thanks for the helpful info! Any thoughts on why it was easier to run HV lines through a tunnel instead of just continuing the series of pylons up and over the mountains?
@markleyva3108 Cost & logistics. The pylon heights approaching the hills would need to get incrementally higher to obtain sufficient ground clearance over the hill tops. This would require much sturdier, wider base pylons & deeper, more significant foundations. Much easier to run some cables through a pre-existing tunnel, with minimal route diversion at either end. Much less maintenance & easier inspection, too.
The power lines could have continued over the ridge, it was just a convenient and cheap solution to use the existing BR tunnel. However, National Grid should have constructed their own smaller dedicated cable tunnel and left the rail tunnel intact for trains. At the time of installing the cables NG, to their credit, stated that the tunnel can also be used for trains, as the high voltage cables are safely and securely attached to the side walls of the tunnel.
@clivebroadhead4381 The general cost comparison between underground & overhead transmission infrastructure is relatively similar. The cost difference between the cable types alone, however, is that underground cables are more expensive. They have to have a larger CSA (cross-sectional area) to better dissipate heat at its specified load & significant insulation to withstand high voltages. Also, as the voltages get higher, several cables will be required per phase on parallel circuits & may need liquid cooling. Overhead cables, by comparison, need no insulation, can have smaller CSA as their heat can be dissipated in free air, but need a high tensile steel core. In this particular instance, it seems that the availability of the tunnels & thus negating the requirement to construct a major trench facility tipped the budget in favour of the underground route.
The song 'Navigator' by the Pogues really says it all about the men who built these tunnels, and other similar ones & the canals that were the transport infrastructure of Victorian Britain!
The canals and the bridges, the embankments and cuts,
They blasted and dug with their sweat and their guts
They never drank water but whiskey by pints
And the shanty towns rang with their songs and their fights.
Navigator, Navigator rise up and be strong
The morning is here and there's work to be done.
Take your pick and your shovel and the bold dynamite
For to shift a few tons of this earthly delight
Yes to shift a few tons of this earthly delight.
They died in their hundreds with no sign to mark where
Save the brass in the pocket of the entrepreneur.
By landslide and rockblast they got buried so deep
That in death if not life they'll have peace while they sleep.
Navigator, Navigator rise up and be strong
The morning is here and there's work to be done.
Take your pick and your shovel and the bold dynamite
For to shift a few tons of this earthly delight
Yes to shift a few tons of this earthly delight.
Their mark on this land is still seen and still laid
The way for a commerce where vast fortunes were made
The supply of an Empire where the sun never set
Which is now deep in darkness, but the railway's there yet.
Navigator, Navigator rise up and be strong
The morning is here and there's work to be done.
Take your pick and your shovel and the bold dynamite
For to shift a few tons of this earthly delight
Yes to shift a few tons of this earthly delight.
“Still seen and surveyed” isn’t it?
Super informative and so interesting plus fun guys lol. Thoroughly enjoyed watching. Top marks!!
What a great video Martin. I love your enthusiasm and knowledge.
I remember a tv series back in the 70s about the navvies building the tunnel. A young Jack Shepherd was in it. I can't remember the title but the actors portrayed the hard labour involved very well.
As a child my bedroom window overlooked the wath branch of the woodhead route , none stop coal trains , I would watch them attach two banking engines on the rear then the two class 76 on the front thirty plus coal wagons and two class 76 on the rear would move off to climb the 1 in 40 worsborough bank , I went to reddish and guide bridge to see them lined up after the line closed , before woodhead was completed the electric locos that had been completed were trialed on the London Liverpool st Shenfield lines which was also 1500v DC .
Fantastic video. Love learning about trains and their tunnels. The castle was incredible. I so enjoyed that. Thanks for taking me along. Please take care
Now that was a fantastic video. Wonderful history and three good friends, taking the piss out of each other, bravo.
As a child, up to when my Dad got a car in about 1973, I was a regular passenger through the Woodhead tunnels, with my parents to visit our numerous relatives in Sheffield. I have memories of being hauled both by steam in the early to mid sixties and by those class 76 locos in the late 60s onwards. I used to love seeing the awe-inspiring 'electric train' approach the platform in Manchester; everything sounded so powerful and new!
Excellent video once again Martin. The real deal and with true respect to the men that toiled to achieve great and magnificent things. Brilliant.
The bunker type structure in the hillside i believe were used for storing the explosives for use in the tunnelling process. The Class 76 locomotives were first used on the Liverpool Street to Shenfield services before going on to the Woodhead route.
Very interesting Martin, thank you very much for videoing and sharing with us all.
Another bloody good video. Keep them coming with all the history, detail and joy, I look forward to new ones popping up.👍
Great scenery! And you fellows are real characters. Thanks for the history. It is strange that that difficult rail line wasn't considered enough to keep open; Manchester to Sheffield seems like it would be very important. Being American, I don't really "get" train-spotting, though I do remember as a child going to see the Flying Scotsman when it was touring the States. Pretty nifty, that.
The tour de Hadfield has more viewers then the tour de France😂😂😂. I was hoping Timmy would be in a childs trailer with a tiny Tim helmet and googles😂😂😂❤ Thank you Martin and crew.
Really, really enjoyed this one. Fascinating as usual. Well done. Cheers
The attention to detail of the sound and effects is great and it added a lot to this video. Great work!
Great video, as a child of east Manchester (grew up in Levenshulme right next to the Fallowfield loop line) and a lover of the hills around Glossop, the Peak District and the Woodhead, this line has always held a fascination for me and its such a loss economically as well as socially that this line no longer exists... but I live in hope that one day it will be restored...
A question for Martin or anyone else for that matter, have you ever come across and photos of videos of the inside of Woodhead tunnels No1 and No2? There are videos and photos of tunnel No3 but I have never found anything showing the other tunnels, tunnel No1 was notorious for collapses and the crosscuts and shafts would be of great interest.
Once again thanks Martin et al for taking the time and effort.
I wonder why they didn't send the transmission lines through the small tunnels and leave it possible to re-use the large tunnel for trains again..
Thanks a bunch for yet another great video..👍
Great little vid - love Woodhead stuff - thanks guys!
Before the line closed totally, the power lines ran through No's 1 and 2 tunnels. There was a narrow gauge railway too running through.
It seems a narrow gauge line still is visible on de Dumford Bridge end from No 1 on Google Street View
That was so interesting! They really must have been crazy closing that line, especially as the new tunnel was only 30 yrs old.
It was opened in 1954, and conveyed regular passenger trains only until the beginning of 1970. What is more, the Government gave the money to the LNER in 1947, when the country was recovering from six years of war. The cost ran into a few million.
Another great video, a good tribute to the men and boys who built those tunnels. Keep up the great work, Martin and the gang 👍
wow what a lovely video showing some of the local history thank-ou for a great video
Great video. It's a shame they closed that third tunnel. All the work that went into building those tunnels. Loved the old pictures.
The rock is called millstone grit and is a sedimentary rock hence the layered appearance. There are numerous quarries in Derbyshire where it was quarried and turned into millstones manufactured on site. The stones were not used for fine quality flour as there was too much grit coming off the stones but OK for probably animal feed. Great rock for climbing as the roughness ensured a good grip though at the expense of grazed knuckles. The holds were not so defined and much use was made of hand jams in horizontal and vertical cracks. I used to wear breeches made of moleskin cord in my early years and this material was like armour. It was joked that if they got wet you could stand them up in a corner at home to dry off as the material was so stiff. Blacksmiths, iron workers and the navies probably wore trousers of the same material because it was good protection, along with clogs in lieu of modern day safety footwear.
Brilliant, as ever, thanks Martin et al. 🙌
Hi Martin this video is great, brings back so many memories of me & my late mum & dad going to Woodhead to watch the trains coming out of the tunnel heading towards Manchester it was freight back then. I always remember it being freezing & wet! but I was mad on trains & tunnels so I didn't mind but my mum & dad did. Bless em. ❤😊 Thank you. 😢
Great video. There's something really rather sinister about those tunnels, isn't there? I have seen photos of the other end, and that looks like one of those places that is eerily silent all the time. Bleak and lonely doesn't cover it.
Someone made an 'OO' gauge model railway of these tunnels, watercourse and all. It's brilliant, but even that feels oddly melancholy. Worth looking for, though.
Thank you, Martin, James, and Roy, for another quality video. Nice one. 👍👍👍
I still think you should come out here and do the mill tours in Manchester, New Hampshire in the US! And yes, that is where the power goes underground. A little different than how we do it in the USA, but pretty similar. That is actually what I do for a living.
Very strange you mentioned this, I live on a street called New Hampshire Close, originally from Manchester UK, I was showing my daughter New Hampshire in US and we spotted Manchester, dropped the Google pin and landed on a lovely old Mill which I thought was interesting and like copying the Mills of Manchester UK. Strange world.
@@geoffcarlton4047 At one point, Manchester, New Hampshire had the largest woolen mill in the world. It was named after the English city of Manchester, in the hopes it would some day become as successfull.
absolutely wonderful lads you 3 make my day. thank you.
Lovely, awesome stuff as always cheers guys for your time to put this content out there 😊
The class 76 and 77's are one my favourite engines just because of how unusual they are. There is still one survivor 76 in the museum in York. I still commute on some of what's left of the line, there's still some bits you can see along the route such as old track beds and paths, pantograph poles, sidings and former junctions, forgotten buffers in the trees and so on. The history of the engineering and area is fascinating. It all went before my time (I'm nearly 30), but I've forever had an interest in it and the 76s and 77s.
There is one at MOSI Manchester
@@MartinZero I remember that now yeah. Its the named prototype 76 that's in York I think. The partner and I tried to go last year and the train depot and stuff bit was all closed for refurbishment so we didn't get to see it or the other stuff they had. Need to go back and re-visit.
I walked the section from Crowden to the tunnel mouth a couple of years ago and was surprised how few artifacts remain from such a relatively recent closure compared to others which were closed in the 60s or earlier.
@ShikiKiryu
26020 (76020) is in York museum.
The prototype 26000 Tommy was cut up.
I knew one was, but wasnt sure which of the few. Thanks for clarifying c: @@IN_THIS_DAY_AND_AGE
Great video Martin. I believe the shafts have all been capped now. There used to be one on the new tunnel. I saw it about 20 years ago and someone had painted a picture of a 76 on the wall of it
In one of the pictures you showed of the old tunnels there appears to be some kind of tower on the hill was that an air shaft for the old ones
Cheers
Russ
Oh, thought I'd buried my trainspotting memories! I remember going to Reddish Depot when they were scrapping the 76s.
Great video. Thanks
Absolutely brilliant video Martin
I can remember the coal trains on the line in about 1975. I think the mostly went to Fiddlers Ferry power station.
The old tunnels look so small, hardly any space between engine and tunnel must have been a terrible trip to do.
Nice to see Roy's photos of the newer tunnel👌👌
Great video, well done
The eastbound tunnel was all uphill as well.
Always love your videos Martin, especially calling out remembering the toil abd sacrifices made to build these tunnels, real people forgotten to time
Keep it up all , Thanks.
Another great video. Thanks guys.
Fascinating story. I would have liked a little more drone footage of the area but I'm, sure you were on a truncated timetable. Not sure where your from but my Father was from Yorkshire, Dewsbury specifically. I've been trying to discover which Coal mine my grandfather toiled most of his life in before being hurt in a cave-in. Unfortunately, I lost my dad in recent few years and even more recently his brother who still lived in the old country. Being in America makes it very difficult to seek out more information. Thank You and I look forward to more stories.
It was hailed as Britains first all electric main line with express and local passenger trains and freight trains all being electrically hauled , the new woodhead tunnel was an engineering marvel , it would all last only twenty seven years .
It was only the first main line with overhead electrification. The Southern had third-rail DC
electrification, and the Brighton line was electrified as early as 1933.
@@andrewtaylor5984 yes but the southern third rail was almost exclusively passenger traffic and the NE had both third rail and overhead systems primarily for freight .
@@mickd6942It was only the first overhead electric main line.
@@andrewtaylor5984 yes for freight local and express passenger ie ALL hence Britains first all electric main line which is exactly how it was publicised by British Railways although it was originally an LNER project .
@@mickd6942 OK. There is a difference between the first electric main line and first all-electric main line.
Thanks fellas. Fascinating stuff as always.
Cheers boys - another interesting and entertaining journey. You deserve the brew! Please keep 'em coming. Best wishes from the Rhondda.
Another interesting video. As someone who does a bit writing (history non-fiction) I sympathise with you about photos and the copyright traps. It's so difficult to find Creative Commons photos - at least good ones - and I am always fearful of getting tangled in one of those unscrupulous traps as some photographers are very aggressive of copyright and try to milk it for what they can.
7 of those woodheadline E locomotives ended up in the Netherlands as NS 1500 series. Why most of the mainlines are 1500volt DC overhere. And due a reorgansation NS (nederlandse spoorwegen) were short of some locomotives and needed them fast. 6 were in service from 1970 to 1986 1 was a parts bin. The 1501 (27003 uk number) is in the railway museum in Utrecht. 2 went back to the uk the 1502(27000) has there original colors and is at Midland Railway, Butterley. the 1505 (27001 )is in the NS colors in Manchester Museum of Science and Industry. the others were scraped in 1986 and 1987.
It was 27005 which was cannibalised for spares.
Brilliant banter. 5 star.
Thanks for the video. I used to go train spotting way back in the day. Loved trains and I still do. It was very interesting to hear your Lancashire accents once again after 55 years. I left Thelwal when I was 28 years old and never went back. Since then I have lived in the western United States and I haven't ever gone back to that neck of the woods since. I saw my birthplace and familiar surrounding towns on your map, Stretford Manchester., and that brought back memories. You're a different generation but you are just like my mates I had back then.
The chapel is called St James's, there are graves of the workers who died building the original tunnels, these graves are marked with small headstones with initials and a date on them. Seems to be some renovation work going at the chapel of late, its a nice walk over there up to a quarry and then onto Black hill. 🐾🐾🐾😊
I visited the chapel last summer and had a look around the small graveyard. I had been told the navies were buried in the field behind the church. Where about are the headstones you saw with the initials and dates? Cheers
Great video guys, many thanks ! The plight of these workers can hardly be overestimated 😲
Great potted history and a super trek with some great mates.
13:00 If there ever is a valid reason to reopen the route, I don't think that the power line is an obstacle to doing so. As far as infrastructure goes, power lines are fairly easy to move. I don't know about your power utility in England, but mine is always building new lines and upgrading / dismantling old ones. Given the amount of expertise that our utility has, it is quite a routine job. More often than not, its just cheaper to move a power line than it is to try to build other infrastructure around it.
The cost of removing the power line installation (which is considerable) and taking the power over the Pennines would be considerable and there would be significant objections to the visual impact. The old tunnels are just not suitable for use being wet and apparently in a dangerous condition. In addition clearances for 25 kV OLE are not adequate. It has been talked about and cost estimated but the answer seems to be no.
As the main traffic was power station coal it could be argued that the power lines are doing the same job and are therefore the direct replacement.
There are no plans to reopen the Woodhead line.
It could probably be done, as there is a DC link to France called Eleclink, which was installed in the channel tunnel. However one big problem is power supply interruption, it is a critical piece of infrastructure to provide power from East to West, and I'm not sure how resilient the grid would be without this link
@@MattJBaugh That's one lesson we learned the hard way in Québec during the 1998 ice storm. At one point, there was only a single dangerously overloaded power line powering Montreal. Since then, they've built an entire ring around the island and added a lot more inter-regional redundancy.
What's all this filming? We'll have no filming here. These are local tunnels, for local people. There's nothing for you here.
Do you have the precious things?
What’s with being a dick?!?
British people complaining about their locality being ruined by foreigners, what a hypocrite, ya toothy drunk bastard.
😂😂😂😂😂😂
😂😂
Thanks for this vid, and uncovering some of the wealth of history in this area. Back in the 70sand early 80s I lived near Sheffield and used to deal in antiques. One day, a couple brought in a near unique item, a genuine navies pick and shovel, they used to keep their tools polished and would often carve traditional Irish motifs on the handles, and this pair were a prime example and had been in the owners family throughout. We placed them with one of the better auction houses and they made £2,100, the owners were delighted. Also at this time I did some work as at the Abbeydale Industrial Hamlet, another fascinating place to visit, in this area, history is laid out all around us.
Love your video. Thanks so much and yous had a good time too. I remember the bo-bo’s as a child in father’s car as we drove parallel with the line. So glad I’m a pampered menial not a 19th century navvy