I own an Excavation Company, I've work with the earth every day for 35 years, as well as digging and forming foundations. I'm also planning to build an Earthship inspired home. My plan is to use Rammed Earth instead of tires. I plan to dig trenches for the Rammed Earth walls and concrete footers, pour the concrete footers in the trenches, then use Excavator with compactor plate to compact layers of low P I soil mixed with about 10% cement to top of walls and cap with concrete. Then trench behind walls to place bituminous sheets on back of wall to seal of moisture, add perferated drain pipe in sock and backfill behind wall with crushed concrete gravel, then Clay Cap. After back wall side walls and wing walls are done, dig the dirt out from interior side of walls to depth of below intended floor slab. Now front wall can be built and so on. This enables earth forming earthen walls with very little hand labor making what could take months take only a few days.
@@matt-justice It would be more time and labor compacting layers instead just pouring a Concrete Wall. If I didn't own the equipment and already have employees I maybe would just pour concrete. I would be willing to conduct this experiment on someone else Dime first if there's any takers! LOL
Makes sense! I’m always calculating either renting equipment for this, or hiring it out... totally different I guess when you own the machines. Keep thinking I should buy a Case 580 or 410G for a short while to use on projects instead of renting, just haven’t pulled the trigger. I’m in Maine if you’re closeby! Lol Be happy to, gotta hire someone as it is that thinks I’m nuts ;)
Doing just that here in Nevada north of Reno-Sparks off of Pyramid Highway. My modified version utilizes compressed earth block which we will be making on site. Hope you get your project going soon!
It’s a trade, Earthships are meant to be done with tons of family/friend helpers, the COLLECTIVE COMMUNITY is the priority, otherwise u r right, 7 months of pounding not worth it.
I certainly don't have that many friends who can take time off work to come and do the tyre pounding. My thought was, if I was go that way it would have to be a workshop.
One caution here, the back wall is a key part of the solar heat "battery" in an earthship that helps stabilize the temperatures inside ( absorbs heat from sun hitting it, then releases that heat when sun goes down and temp inside starts to drop). The thermal mass of the wall is key to this, and you do not want to use an insulating material for that back wall or else you will lose the thermal battery process. So, ICF and timber should be crossed off your list.
@@nathancasey6579 Nope, concrete is a very good thermal mass when it is more than 4" thick, which is why the ICF walls are not good thermal masses. A solid 8" concrete wall, or thicker, would work very well. It would also be much more expensive than traditional materials sourced for the thermal mass walls (used tires, ertc.)
@@tmckmusic8584 With cob, even with a good wrap, footer, drainage behind it etc, if somehow it retained excessive moisture or water, it could lose structural integrity very quickly. It's very structurally sound but only when it remains dry.
@@helenjones568 the color of any surfaces exposed to the inside is important to the buildings temperature regulation especially during the day, but paint doesn't store the energy for a significant period of time and it is the energy storage properties that the OP was concerned with.
We you there in the middle of summer on a hot day? This is when off-gassing would be the most noticeable. My friends have been in Earthships in Taos on hot days and the tire/petroleum smell is unbearable. I have read several articles that claim that tire off-gassing in Earthships is a non-issue, but tires do contain: "benzene, mercury, styrene-butadiene, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, and arsenic, among several other chemicals, heavy metals and carcinogens". I think that Mike Reynolds is a brilliant guy and a saint for pioneering this style of architecture, but it would be a shame to find out that residents of tire-wall structures develop serious health problems years down the road. Not trying to hate, just after the truth and want everyone to be safe, happy and healthy. This is a real concern and deserves some research and analysis. Your concerns are justified Matt, even if you are not sure why tire walls don't sit well with you. Thanks for the video! ~S
I'm thinking that the same rubber diaper you wrap the roof in, loop it back around and block the tires off from the interior as well. Maybe locking in the offgassing would help?
@@daniluchisonalthough the process should be slower, off gassing doesn't completely stop when the tires are buried certain materials in tires naturally break down when they are near room temperature and some of the byproducts of that process are toxic.
Hyperadobe and superadobe are also an awesome substitute for a tire wall that maintains some of the same properties as the tire wall. And is DIY friendly if you don’t mind the labor.
I don’t know what the answer is but I think you are asking the right questions. Earthships have been around from the 70s. For me there are three questions all having to do with making the model scaleable. 1) adapting building technology to make them faster and less labor intensive to build? 2) adapting to urban and suburban landscapes? 3) figuring out ways to adapt some of the concepts to existing structures?
Just be sure that the wall you are going to build can hold up against the massive amount of earth you put behind it. The idea with the tires is not only about thermal mass but also as a counterforce to hold back the tons of dirt behind them
I have been exploring the same problems, on a hillside dig out for your building walls tapered or stepped back like a retaining wall, then dig back 8 or 10 ft for thermal mass, with a backhoe, insulation on back of the trench and on top of mass waterproof cover, put a french drain into water storage for drainage , fill with larger rocks filter fabric then gravel, could be done with 1 or 2 guys and a excavator pretty quick, basically it's like a walk out basement with a greenhouse
I've used that same analogy as an argument in favor of poured concrete walls. It's essentially a walk-out basement with patio doors all across the front wall. Another upside is this should easily meet code in a lot more locations than some of the more exotic materials and methods used with earthships.
Most of the materials in an earthship that weren't being recycled back when they were first built - tires, cans, bottles, etc - do get recycled now, and I have some concerns about having a bunch of toxic tires in my walls. Thanks for coming up with an alternative.
Ever thought of using something called, "Hempcrete", it's basically ground up hemp fibers and lime mixed together, that when cured is stronger than commercial concrete and roughly 3 ~ 6 times lighter than commercial concrete, too. It's something to think about if you don't want all the extra out-gassing from concrete (has radioactive elements; uranium, radium and radon gas being emitted). Another thing to think about is mitigating any radon gas build up in the winter or when it rains really heavily in your area where you're building. Put a communication and mitigation system in under your flooring to protect yourself, also helps keep your floor dry, so you're not losing thermal mass the hard way.
Thank you for this, it answers so many issues I have with other alternatives to tyres. I'll be checking availability of hemp fibre in my area. Exciting
@@jonothandoeser Weed and hemp while they're in the same family and species, the subspecies is different. Hemp has 0.3% delta THC or less, while marijuana has at least 9.0% or more. Translation, you won't get high smoking hemp unlike marijuana.
Just came across this. As a general contractor with engineering background, Ive been brainstorming these same methods. While I understand the advantage of the tire wall, its extremely labor intensive, and as you yourself mentioned it isnt as appealing to many. Ive been considering a hybrid build between metal containers and earthship, although I do recognize that this would likely compromise some of the benefits of an earthship. I have also considered cmu concrete filled wall. I think that would behave similarly to the tire wall in retaining heat etc. Anyway….like the conversation going on
@@matt-justice ….I can understand why they do what they are doing with what would be considered a true earthship. However if one can stand back and look at the larger picture they might see that it would be better to appeal to the masses and begin a foundational change in how we build, as opposed to hold fast to a line that makes sense but will put most people off. This is a win the battle but lose the war scenario in my personal opinion. We downsized our entire lifestyle 8 years ago with extreme changes in how we lived, worked, and prioritized things. Just recently have converted part of our traditional ranch home over to solar. It was really an experiment for us to see and live with it personally. We are moving to yet another phase that will likely be a 5 year process. Its all been good though. No more credit cards. No new cars. Now, simplify our cost of living itself
The tire wall can be strapped down and filled with any light weight insulator like vermiculite or even recycled plastic pellets, or sand, which doesn't need compacting, where it's readily available.
@@Jagueyes1 …..but this would negate the point of the tire wall. They are doing it to gain thermal mass, so insulation fill would eliminate this advantage.
Why not go with cheaper more sustainable EarthBag tubes, or bags and rebar? Its got much mass, hurricane (wind) proof, fire proof, rot proof, bullet proof and EarthQuake proof?
@@oakmountaingod What about going down in the ground Like Mike Oeler did. He dug his by hand, but you could use an excavator. Then you make a wall and backfill. Put an insulated roof on it. I don't think tires have much value in a cold climate. I was not talking about tires. Tires are disgusting.
@@oakmountaingod What is your location? Hot cold Wet dry? Severe codes, mild codes? Do you want to spend a lot or a little? What are the top two that you are considering? Often the way the Indians did it and the way the pioneers did it at your location will give you some clues about what is appropriate.
I have a friend in British Columbia who built a tire house herself. She also did not want to pound dirt forever, so she figured if she just cut the sidewalls of the tires and packed them with a flat plate compactor, it would save time and make the stack easier. Although her community is completely off grid because they built their hydro system (enough to power 5-7 homes), she could have just built a box and heat with unlimited power. Also the reason for all the tires is to give the necessary depth in ground to make the ventilation work naturally. As far as the roof loading goes, have some trusses built to tolerate x amount of earth cover. Lastly, how much solar gain do you expect (location, orientation to solar, heat storage type internal material, concrete, Trombe wall, so on. If you need help in that arena, (my 40 year hobby job is designing solar systems for clients at no charge, sort of a retirement job).
Im working on my plans for my earthship as well. I am not going to be using tires either because of the labor and gasses. Im going with the concrete pour with a backside pour of aircrete. That would give you a nice thick thermal mass wall. Excellent structural support and its fire proof, water proof, its an insulator and inexpensive to make. It can be poured or made into blocks. The blocks can also be cut with a hand saw. You should definitely look into aircrete 😊
Have you looked at tire bales? They’re big bricks of crushed and banded tires that you can stack and then spray cement over, and then earthen plaster that. There’s a gentleman from Colorado Springs that built an earth ship with them and they worked beautifully for him.
Earth bags! Use polypropylene bags, put in a mixture of sand and clay with some moisture, pack the bag down and let it dry until it becomes a brick. Between the layers of bags you insert two lines of barbed wire
I've been thinking about this as well, and what I've decided on is use the basic earth ship shape. I , however, would slope towards the front like a Chinese greenhouse (highest part of the house is the back wall). Instead of tires, you use Hesco barriers. If they're strong enough to be used as retaining walls and as protection from explosives; it's strong enough to use instead of dirt packed tires. Then pour aircrete in vertical forms to put a smooth face on the interior walls like stucco. You can berm the exterior walls. It's fast and strong. For the parallel support beam in the middle of the house, pour concrete footers for vertical posts and a giant glu-lam (or similar) beam that spans the entire width of the house. The very front gets a rubble foundation.
Gabion cages in layman's terms. I've had the same idea. Gunnite could also work as a coating...basically swimming pool walls shot into place...no forms needed unless you're after a flat vertical finish. Otherwise, I'd like to basically do exactly what you're suggesting with the design.
@@luclaflamme4712 The other responder was correct when he said the laymen term is gabion cages. I've seen smaller and larger cages in use - anywhere from 2'x2'x2' upwards to meters long per side. The size of the individual squares determine the size of aggregate used, if you want to leave them exposed. You can often see the larger cages stacked on top of each other on highways where they're used to catch rocks in rockslide areas. You can also use geo-fabric to line the inside of the cages if you want to used dirt/sand like you'd see in Allied bases in Iraq and Afghanistan. I saw walls 3 to 4 meters tall, when I was over there. The whole point of the idea was to put up the bones in a super short period of time, so I'd most likely hire out since you'd want heavy equipment to do the job. The cheaper in the long term option would be to buy a used mini-excavator and DIY; since you'd have something for future digging on your homestead.
They are now building the global model earthship with slope towards the front to keep the roof exposed to the south. The sunlight melts the snow better and keeps the water from freezing better.
There is a person here in Taos who plans to shred tires and compact them in 3' x 5' blocks. Keep in mind that one of the earthship concepts is re use/ up use of existing materials.
If the focus is time, this is a good question. Tire pounding is very labor intensive. Once done they are incredibly strong though so it’s not easy to replace the tire walls.
2'x2'x6' Concrete bin blocks are available nationwide from landscaping and construction companies. Companies like 48Barriers will sell them new or as used road barriers. No forms to build or gabbion cages to make. No waiting for concrete to dry. Stack them in place just like a retaining wall. Waterproof and back fill the same day maybe. Blocks with decorative stone imprinted facing are available. If you want to recycle tires, use them to build the road, or driveway of your property. Cut the sidewalls off, lay on the ground in a grid like circular honeycomb, fasten together with air powered nail gun and then fill with crushed stone or recycled concrete and gravel. The road will be well drained and you will never have potholes or ruts up there in Maine. You might even try the wall less tires for the walls of the house. No trying to hammer dirt around and under the sidewalls of the tires. Just grab an pneumatic tamper and get with it. If you have drainage or erosion issues on the property you can lay out all the cut off sidewalls in the problem area, cover with some gravel and then dirt and grass. The sidewalls and gravel will slow down runoff and allow it to seep into the soil.
This is a really interesting idea. Fast build, extremely strong, low-tech, and it looks like around $7,500 for a 100'x10' wall. That's pretty enticing. I suppose shipping is a significant problem/cost as each block is 3,300 lbs and most flatbed trailers are good to 48,000 lbs. It would take 3-6 loads to haul that 100'x10' wall. And I expect this would face code challenges just like tires, rammed earth, etc.
yes tires are rubber and they are insulators NOT conductors- its the packed adobe/dirt inside that is the mass- but the rubber keeps the heat from getting into the dirt- thus tires don't provide much mass! you can use anything even frame with an exterior sheathing that is water proof- they do make waterproof below grade plywood.. the only mass that really absorbs the heat is IF that mass sees the sun- and that north wall doesn't! and standard hollow cinder block is not mass- you want the heavy cement blocks filled with concrete. its the floor and some of the interior walls that see the sun in an earthship! unless you put a clearstory in the back of the roof. also NEVER use the slopping south glass! huge overheating issues plus water leakage and a loss of quarantee from the glass manuf.. the only time to do sloping glass is when your in the lower southern US latitudes. where the sun is higher in winter. also put an appropriate overhang above the south glass- draw up the sun angles -on your south elevation to find out when the glass will be shaded- via a sun chart. also never use exposed wood on the south side around the glass- it will degrade in a few years and leak. always isolate the greenhouse from the living space (via tight windows and doors) or else you'll get insects, mold, etc. inside the house. and the cans and bottles are really just for decoration or as fillers - they do nothing as mass. never put your open top cistern- like some of the early earthships- inside the house- kids/pets could drown in it!!! never make your cabinets/doors out of pallet wood- it looks shitty and warps so it doesn't seal. you can use brick venear or a 2-3" thick concrete plaster over frame walls for interior mass- but again it needs to see the sun or be very close to the warm south side of the house.. and add a big overhang on the east and west porches if you have porches. www.bendsolarhomes.com
Poured foundation, no doubt about it. If your lot is accessible, it's the best way. The bank will loan money on a house built with standard practices, and you'll have resale value just like any other home. If you're in a remote location, dry stacked block makes good sense. If you live in a third world country, then tires and cans it is. The earthship design concept is superb. Building with garbage will not save the planet. Why do it?
Matt I live in Alaska and am formally from the Colorado region. I have often wondered instead of using rammed earth why not use a slurry compound to fill the tires like a earthen mud slurry with cement additive for strength. Or if your going to use ICF forms do a double wall back to back on the forms. Then you would have a 8 inch concrete wall that has a styro foam insulating slice in the middle. Let me know if you have any ideas on this bunch of random thoughts
Hey, I'm in the northeast as well and I'm going through the same angst about the tires. I love the idea of using the trash, tires and I've also heard the tire off gassing is no issue once they're essentially enclosed. But, it's the time consumption, the earth pounding and I've also thpught about the massive precast blocks you see a lot of landscape companies use for containing bulk wood chips, ground cover, mulch, etc. I think those would be a fantastic alternative but I'm not sure of the cost factor of if building a precast block of similar proportions using hempcrete (7 times lighter and way more efficient r value) I don't know but great video and I do believe we're on the cusp of this concept building being the future. Self sustaining is key, off-grid just sounds like a camping trip, I know this is the future because it's intelligent and the building industry itself most likely wants no part of this. This world itself is built on consumerism, throw it away after it's used up.
I feel like you are missing the point of the tires. He is building with existing materials. Tires are great because you are using something that is littering the entire work. Every inch. I recently bought a property, and what do you know, less than a mile away, a huge pile of tire just sitting off the road someone dumped.
Mr. Reynolds nickname is the garbage warrior. His intent is to build homes with recycled materials. My intent is to build an economical home that is low on energy use. I am not going to pay a team of laborers to hand pound the tires just so I can say I am using a tire wall. I do not have a team of 50 people volunteering for this. In my opinion he is looking for alternatives. Worm boy that is how a design is improved.
OverLordMauS He has been building homes for 50 years. Do you honestly believe if chemicals were an issue people wouldn’t put it out there? There is no off gassing as long as the tires are completely covered by earth. Taos uses outside walls, not living quarters, where the tires are exposed.
The other issue is time. It takes forever to pound the number of tires needed for a reasonably sized home. The work party with a huge number of people has been Reynolds solution but that isn’t easy in many areas. Traditional barn raising didn’t take so many people.
I helped build one pounding tires with a sledge hammer. It gave me a back ache. A friend used a 30 lb pneumatic tamper which made it a lot easier and sped it up. Coated the inside walls with insulating spray foam, then plaster.
I'm in the process of designing my own home, I really want to use a lot of sustainable materials, super insulated/high thermal mass etc. I think I came up with the same thoughts, using tires is not really the way to go for most people. Unless you have access to a very close tire dump I don't think I would go all that extra work for actual minimal return. Tire walls is very unnecessary, also the amount of layers of plaster work really adds to an unbelievable amount of labor. Material handling doing cob or any plaster/stucco is hard work and incredibly slow. I would only choose that if you had a tractor with a bucket, and maybe even a tiller to do all the mixing. I'm thinking about using forms that use metal roofing materials as the outside/inside material, basically permanent forms. Would save lot of labor. Maybe a woodchip/soil/straw/concrete mix as the infil, would need to be tested. Aircrete looks awesome, but to get it perfect would require a ton of testing.
I’m pretty sure there are forms out there that are made of insulation board with metal reinforcing bars in between them. If you’re not against the idea of using foam insulation board. Then you have a little bit of insulation on either side of your wall. Have fun with your design process! And best of luck with your local building department. Sometimes they’re a little stuck in their ways.
I don’t trust tire walls in an earthquake so I built my earthship with 4 concrete reinforced walls (the walls facing the earth berm were engineered with 5/8 rebar). The south facing wall acts as a trombe wall and it works very well. I put stucco on the south side of that wall and thin brick on the inside. If I were to use tires I would secure them to each other with fasteners and then fill them with rebar reinforced aircrete. I saw the double decker freeways in SF after they collapsed onto each other so I have a keen respect for earthquakes.
Funny thing, I’d trust a tire wall more than concrete in an earthquake. I don’t want to use tires because of time, labor, and off gassing but the tires are very heavy and strong. The rubber is just enough natural flexibility to navigate an Earthquake. Concrete is rigid and likely to crack.
You can make hesco barriers, use terrestrial Earth with a bag of Portland cement per 5x5x5 cube. You have to buy the wire in the landscaping cloth, using it for structural walls I would include wire every foot so the basket maintains a square shape or whatever shape you intended to be. Mix it with the Portland, fill it, Tamp it, put your next 5 ft section on top of it 4x4x5, then use your bond beam... Then you just use stuck on the outside and the wire that is already on the barrier three-by-three square is a perfect anchoring point for your chicken wire. Are you basically doing is waterproofing the outside. With that much mass mass, it's going to be far more than any tires that packing, having the Portland cement will make stabilized earth. All you need really is a backhoe and you can have your walls done in a few days... Or you can pack tires it's up to you 🤷
One of the down sides of tires Citys/counties can say after a certain amount on your property they represent hazardous waste... And they can give you X amount of time to remove them Now all of a sudden you'll have to haul them off and pay the hazardous fee per tire
Knowing how to discuss your personal life with "experts" is the largest problem in this entire process. I just remind them...public health and safety is for the public not the private.
ICF cures at a higher strength due the insulated forms holding in the heat and moisture. With rebar in every core or every foot vertical and horizontal it can hold back backfill for a buried wall.
That's a great idea but, what about all the material needed for the mass? If you have "insulation" via the ICF, you're blocking the convection heat from going back into the home when it gets cold! ICF is great for building and it's strong but, I believe that we need alternatives for the tires so we can benefit from the convection. I like the ideas above using sandbags filled with earth or sand or a combination of things. Very strong if multiple layers are used and you can do everything yourself quicky without breaking your back by "beating" tires! : ( ha! ha!
I feel it would be very helpful if someone would be willing to go through these comments and organize them a bit. I spent a lot of time reading the comments as we are seriously thinking about building one as well. Personally, I'm not worried about tires gasses, but I'm not going to pound tires at age 45. Straw bales have great insulation value, but don't have the thermal mass. I like tire bales, but am concerned about selling my house at some point. If a bank won't finance it, then it becomes a worse investment and maybe that is what has been preventing these from becoming more popular. Honestly, I'm leaning towards concrete or cement block walls with using earthship principles to minimize heating and water bills here in North Dakota. After reading many comments I don't see a better idea for the average person. Professional builders use concrete walls for basements here in North Dakota. Do we think they who do this for a living don't know what they are doing? Time is money. and what about resale value? Are you going to live there forever? I'm thinking concrete or cement block wall with insulation and water barrier in the correct places to create the thermal mass.
You just summarized all the points after having traveled to Taos and staying in these. They’re so awesome, but most places we want to live with our families require a bit of modification. The die hards get their panties in a bunch over it, but after leukemia last year, I can tell you the most important thing is living your life with your loved ones however you want. Time is most important, not whether cans tires bottles or concrete and rebar. :)
Compression strength of a CSU block, I think is about 3,000psi. You can look up beam loads on any local building code site, universal building code for US also has rood load specs , an engineer should spec this number with the roof load and snow load requirements for your area
Pretty well read every comment and some great info from experience here on one site, that is great. So did you figure out what to use? I'm looking at many of the afore mentioned methods but am also no sold on tires as a vessel. Rammed earth is a option but it needs a vessel to hold it. Eathquakes will compromise most rammed earth structures. I've looked at ICF, and now NEXCEM blocks which may be the answer but also like hempcrete blocks but want to get going getting my off grid location build going soon. Nexcem are great for outer insulation especially if taken to R-28 specs but I'm looking for inside thermal mass as used in rear walls of earthships. I have a idea for Nexcem and will get back to this if my idea is a viable option. Thanks for this video, it brought some great different ideas to one location. Cheers
@@maodonimega Hydraform Compressed Earth Block is comprised of soil, water, and cement, which is then compressed using hydraulics into bricks. Personally I feel standard cement would be stronger, but not as 'green.' I rather imagine it would last about as strong as adobe brick, but of course I'm no expert. I'm sure it'll be fine. Using earth to hold back earth. What could possibly go wrong?
Sounds like the best option!!!! Ive done a lot of research and been in the construction industry a long time , thermal mass is where its at , and rammed earth has stood the test of time all around the 🌎
@@maodonimega I never received this response - sorry I didn't comment back! Hydraform compressed earth blocks are made by compression with on site soil that can be mixed with cement or lime based materials. hydraform.com/
I'm not smart or anything but I definitely have this burning desire to build an earth ship of my own one day. I love how it is designed Mike Renolds right? Well I love to read comments on what I am watching ☺️
Caged Rock Gabbions stacked with rio-bar through the middle into some footings below the cages, then coat each face for protection or even leave the inside bare for aesthetics if you like that sort of thing.
I love the Gabion cage (wire mesh baskets filled with rocks) idea. I'm hoping to build a shipping container cabin, buried on three sides and the top. I believe the three sides should be gabion cages, as I really don't want to use any concrete or cement and this seems to be a very low impact solution. Gonna take awhile to sift and pull and load all of the rocks, but they'll be local and easy.
Wes Carnegie If you were in the Sunshine Coast Australia I’d give you a hand. I think it’s a good idea, but I’d suggest a hard bottom underneath them for water to seep and flow to and out away from the shipping containers, perhaps into a submerged ferrocrete water tank nearby?? Just an idea :)
Agree 100% with you regarding the tire not being so appealing. There is a video about burying two shipping containers under ground. Look for "earth-cooled shipping container underground ca home" this concept is very close to your last option which was the umbrella. Did you finally decide on an ideal idea to replace pounding tires?
Could you fill a shipping container with tamped earth as the back wall? You'd need to cut a whole in the top to fill it. It would have a large footprint, but would it be structurally sound? Is the backwall meant to protect against vertical or horizontal pressure, or both?
I was just thinking the same thing, and wondering if rocks/boulders were more my style. My daughter is allergic to rubber, and I hate the smell of tires (which I hear you saying didn't seem to be an issue, but I wouldn't want to chance it) I read they will work, then I saw your video on the suggestions.
I’ve seen people build houses out of hay bails. I don’t know if it would be strong enough but it could be a option in combination with other support. NOTE - I’ve never done it so I have no clue lol
I've done it (helped build them). Not a great solution for higher-humidity regions and you have to be pretty fanatical about preventing moisture from getting into the walls, and making sure it has a way to get out. Otherwise it's prone to rot/mold.
Hay bale can only be used for above grade projects, usually on tall basement foundation walls and under very wide eves/roof, it needs to be kept very dry or bad things. Earthship is a partly below grade project, half underground so as far as I know it isn’t possible to keep it dry enough in an earthship to use hay bale walls safely.
I've been considering tire cutter to cut one sidewall off of each tire, instead of pounding dirt for a year and filling it with Aircrete (Portland cement mixed with foam made from soap) , letting it dry and picking it up and stacking it like a brick. I've been watching a lot of videos on aircrete and it has excellent R valued and its very lite and strong!
I agree w finding suitable alternatives, and I am in the same position. I am near the conclusion of a gravity wall, dry stacking raw limestone quarry blocks, 2'x2'x5' at $50-$60 each and18 to a truckload. The biggest expense is delivery followed by frontloader rental to unload and stack.. A minimal crew, done in 2-3 days. 100 blocks will give you 4 rows of 25 blocks providing a footprint 80x20x8' tall, around $6k. There are 3-4 surfaces to chose from.. few pics on internet, but frequently used in landscape walls and retaining walls.
Hi Raymond, I tried to source retaining wall blocks for this, but since I’m in the sticks delivery was more than the cost of the blocks! It was over $2k per delivery, looks like it’ll end up being cheaper just to pour a wall.
@@matt-justice i found in previous off grid builds, that was always an issue from start to finish. I bought a military 6x6 surplus truck m931a2 locally for $1,500 that vould haul anything i needed with a pintle hitch equipment trailer. All it cost me was fuel and i got to keep the truck.. it saved me from rental delivery fees and in inclimate weather it was the only thing that got through and got everything else unstuck. Best tool i have ever owned.. and not a bad toy either.
So true but, many of the Earthships are now built with metal roofs so they can capture water. We plan on building our home in the Pacific NW so we're not worried about water... so we're going to hire an engineer for our earth-bermed home... including the roof!
@@BowenOrg Good idea. I would capture water from our roof areas too, but Colorado won't let us. I tend to overbuild things (even before being a building inspector) I did build an engineered floor system at our cabin exactly to plan but I agreed with the engineering. Good luck and enjoy!
@@sinksalot8860 Dear SinksALot.... thanks for the feedback... I would file lawsuits against the State of CO because it states in all legal definitions of real estate ownership that the owner "owns everything straight up and straight down, contingent upon whether or not the mineral rights and "ground" water rights have been sold!" Everyone has the legal right to collect rain water! Governments DON'T own rain water... no matter what "BS" they give you! Dittos to you! : )
Similarly, I too went to Taus, I too stayed in an earthship and I too decided life is too short to pound tires for 18mo+... a guy in Australia used a jumping jack rigged to a back hoe that really sped up the process ~5min per. But I'm looking at formed rammed earth. Tires are really just steel/ rubber reinforced rammed earth.
I was also thinking AirCrete as an alternative to a tire wall. Its relatively easy to purchase mix, can even be delivered to site, cheaper, and much much quicker. You could probably make a 30 inch backwall out of this, line it, and then pile earth in behind? this is all theory though. has anyone else used Aircrete, and if so, is it strong enough to be a load bearing wall?
last thing I read on Aircrete was that it wasn't allowed for structural loads in most areas, thats one of those things thats still too new and many inspectors aren't familiar with. Also one of the big concepts of Aircrete is it's insulating properties, you don't want that for your "thermal battery" because it's a lower mass which means it holds less heat.
The tire and dirt wall at the back is not only 'instead of a foundation', it serves 3 important purposes; - protects from the worst weather in winter (mimics an underground home) - provides air conditioning in the summer (via 15 - 20 ft tubes) - mainly it serves as a HEAT reservoir in the winter, to be able to use only solar to bring the temps up from 58F to 70F in the winter, because it mimics being underground or partially buried. So, I don't think eliminating the dirt BERM completely is an option IMO. But I have been thinking of other alternatives to tires to fill the berm of dirt with. I believe that I still need the berm (15 - 20 feet long), I just don't think I will have the work force necessary to pound 750? tires. I was wondering if just doing the first few courses in tires, then the rest with cedar wood stacked or even bricks or hempcrete bricks to fill in the rest.
I saw a video on UA-cam where someone built a earthship with large bales of tires . At the time of construction He got the bales for free . ( since then He said there's a nominal charge for them )
I'm late to the party, but I only learned about earthships a month ago. I've been researching ever since. A fast, less material/labor intense approach is something I've been considering. Did you decide on an option? Earth bags, for a wall, concrete as a motor, to also create the thermal mass wall, was a thought I had, but I am just starting the planning.
I'm curious to hear an update on this video. Did you reach any conclusion on an alternative to the tire wall? I like SOME of the ideas of the Earthship, but have my own goals for building it, and the tire wall isn't something I'm interested it. I'd like to build mine in Michigan and want to merge some of the best ideas of Earthship with a barndominium concept. I'm looking for a small temperature-controlled living space surrounded by what would essentially be a large structure/half-greenhouse, half-barn to have a moderate environment to grow a garden and keep a workshop area, and garage access to the living structure without going completely outside. An update on anything you learned could be good.
Steel drums welded together and filled with water. Water has about twice thermal storage capacity as concrete/rock for the the same weight and steel has more thermal conductivity than rubber so it would be a more efficient building.
Interesting idea. Would you cover the outside (or the side in contact with the earth) with a rubber membrane of some sort? How do you waterproof or prevent condensation in cold climate?
@@clearasmud1945 I would think that condensation wouldn’t happen because when the air is cold, the drums would be warmer from the heat stored in the water.
Matt you should check out building with tire bails. It's just as cheap as building with normal tires but without pounding a ton of dirt. Just look up "earthship with tires bails" and you'll find some examples, I'm in colorado and quite a bit of people have built with that method.
Tire bales. There is ZERO issue with off-gassing. We shotcreted over the bales, and then adobe'd the interior wall. I have yet to smell any rubber in any earthship that I've visited. Check out my bermed-earth tire-bale home on UA-cam. Tire bales were stacked in one day with a skid steer. They are about 5'x5'x2-1/2' High, and weigh about a ton each.
I’ve been thinking about this as well. The lego hemp block with lime seems to be the best performance product atm, but could it be used in place of tires?
While listening i thought of the heavier duty milk cartons filled with rock and stacked - a carton is $12.00 or so around here you might wire them together with Galvanixed wire OR line the sides with road paper and fill them with a mix of sand, gravel, 2 inch rock and concrete (rebar thru the holes in the sides right at the top of every other course???) prep one layer and pour - Repeat - in the end you can run electricity by cutting plastic for metal conduit or you can run the conduit before you pour ( i guess the $12.00 a pop for the strong crates is the killer)
There are 4 by 3 by 3 foot concrete blocks that are used for temporary retaining walls. All you need is a forklift to install them. You would need to figure out a way to make them permanent.
@@JohnnyArtPavlou yes. I work at a factory. We use them for bunkers to store raw materials. There’s a lot of material leaning against those blocks. I’m not sure how to make them permanent. Maybe rebar and concrete.
Pounding 1,000 tires is likely the main reason why the Earthships need a large crew of volunteers to build one. All the videos seem to employ about 40 "students" and "interns" running around installing systems and pounding tires.
I’m just watching a video about tire bails. They have the same thermal mass as earth rammed tires... without the crazy amount of work. So that’s a thought. 👍
Still.... they "might be" very dangerous to your health! FYI: Architect Mike now has cancer! No "BS!" Don't know if it's from the tires or from something else!
@@BowenOrg Mike is getting pretty old, and older people tend to get cancer. I think that those factors are much bigger than the tires which are coated in plaster and don't off gas.
Matt I completely agree….. I love the earth ship concept, but the thought of beating dirt by hand into old tires seems beyond labor intensive. Obviously if someone has no resources that would be the way to go, But I assume for people like you and me time is money. Another idea for that tire wall would be to use tires as a sort of form for concrete. Obviously lumber forms Can get expensive. Using the tires themselves as a form to fill with concrete would be a great way to cheaply form a concrete wall…… you could also implement rebar throughout tire concrete wall for added rigidity.
I think one of the hardest elements of Earthships to get comfortable with is the tire wall. I feel your pain. But they’ve endured for good reason. They lend themselves to certain criteria and none of the suggested alternatives in the video or comments, and I’ve read them all for interest, fulfil them all. Mostly what is forgotten here is 1. Green credentials Mike’s solution is astounding in this regard and most of the proposed alternatives are appalling. 2. Thermal Mass Also referred to as the thermal battery. Earth is not the best material but pretty good, and Earthships have proven to work admirably. Tire, Straw and Hemp bales just won’t be as good. There will likely be a compromise somewhere in order to reduce labour time. The old saying that good things require time and effort comes to mind. I’d be interested to know if you’ve decided on a solution and what that is.
I don’t know how to price them but what about those large concretes bin blocks, also called V lock blocks? They are a huge thermal battery, very sturdy, readily available, and you could probably get the whole wall stacked in a day or two with heavy equipment.
one key point is that tires release cancerous fumes which could ultimately (long run) be a major issue. There are not enough data gathered on the side-effects of all these materials being used. There are alternatives to create "solar heat battery", simply visit Greece, Serbia other old civilizations where homes were built and to this date are functional. The same goes with cans and other trash being used to build.
Where I live rock is in abundance, so I have been thinking about dry-stacking big rectangular slabs of stone from local querry. And then finishing it off inside with some form of plaster. That would give a nice thermal mass, I guess. Because of heat conducting properties, I would avoid wood for the back wall.
Smart man ! I doubt if many are aware of what your saying ...I love the appearance on slopes but don't think I'd care to have it in my living room ... Plus expansion/compression difference may not work to carry a stable roof ..but I still like the idea
You probably don't want insulation on the back wall because you want the low winter sun to hit it and permeate into the dirt behind as a thermal battery. Concrete might be more expensive but it's not too bad compared to the concrete pour for a standard house basement and it's a major part of the house.
I want to build a cinderblock earthship in east texas. If you did cinderblock's and sand for the back wall, does that mean no earth burm behind it? I like the earth burm for heat transfer. If i put in an earth burm, would i need a moisture barrier?
Perhaps a mudbrick mixture poured into the tyres would save the 7mths of ramming. Each tyre becomes essentially a rubber encased mudbrick block. It worked well at Bunjaree Earth Cottages (wattle cottage) where my son was involved in the build in about 2003.
How about concrete form walls for the interior and exterior walls with enough space between to insert tire bales? The spaces around the bales could be filled in with gravel. This would give sufficient thermal mass and would seal off the interior spaces from possible off gassing of the tires.
Use a shipping container as your back wall, they are usually 8 ft wide. You can get 10, 20, or 40 footer, all steel and strong. Fill it from the top full of gravel or soil. They are not that expensive and you get an instant back wall.
@@matt-justice Just paint it with tar, while the tar is still sticky wrap it with black plastic (viscqueen) lumber yards carry the thick stuff. You can get rolls that are 20 ft x 100 ft. If you go slow you could paint a 40 ft container with tar using a roller in a day by yourself, paint top first, cover with plastic, let it overhang about a foot all around, then do the sides, tape seams with duct tape. Those containers are painted with paint to resist salt water. Also if you put a good base of gravel at the bottom, you wouldn't have to worry about water pooling at the bottom and rusting the bottom. Good luck.
@@matt-justice Sorry, I was thinking of burying the whole container, just put tar and plastic on the side that's going to be buried, or covered with soil otherwise you will smell tar and plastic everytime you go in the building. You want to keep that plastic away from heat, because it smells when it gets hot.
I like the earthship concept, but I too have been looking for alternative ways to get the same benefits. I think a block or concrete wall would be the easiest and best.
I built a passive solar Adobe in 1978-80. After a lot of research I built a “regular” Adobe with a greenhouse that covered the south side of the house. I insulated the stem wall about two feet below grade. We were at about 7500 feet in west central NM and had below zero temps in the winter. The greenhouse provided about 95% of our heat and an air tight wood stove with about a half log on cold nights provided the rest. I installed elect. baseboard heaters but they were never needed. We had brick floors on sand that added to the thermal mass and felt like they were heated. The greenhouse pulled cool air in at floor level and circulated warm air back into the house. The system was simple and worked far better that I had hoped it would. We were on a well and septic system and could have gone off grid if we wanted. In winter we opened the doors to the greenhouse when we left for work and by the time we got home the house was comfortable. There were solar overhangs that kept the summer heat from building up. It was simple with no added tech besides the greenhouse. It worked far better than my expectations and I have been surprised that their have not been more examples of low cost greenhouse sunrooms and thermal mass as primary heat sources. We had electricity because it was easier that photovoltaics and we only had to guarantee to use $60 a month. We never went over. I love the idea behind earthships but I think you can achieve close to zero impacts and self sufficiency in simpler ways.
OK, friend here's my take: junk tires are almost free, It's the pounding that ruins the scenario. Solution: Using cut-off saw with metal blade cut one sidewall off each tire. Lay out the row of tires to your string line. Fill by shovel or front loader on a backhoe, sprinkle water if it helps pack it or lowers dust. Add back of tire dirt so the top of tire is equal to the level of the dirt support behind. In this fashion the wall goes up as the support dirt grows behind it. All packed down by l'il ol' me on my backhoe "Mo"
Used tire off gassing is not an issue after some 30,000 miles, as all the off gassing has already occurred. There's basically nothing left off gas by that time.
Could you buy used 20gal drums and fill with dirt? Seems similar to tires in terms of thermal mass. Could get polyethylene or stainless? If there are vendors for used drums that might work…. New to the earthship concept but have also been wary of tires. Beyond offgassing, worried about decomposition into soul.
Hello Matt, like you I have been interested in earthships for years, my wife and I have actually traveled to Taos, NM and spent a weekend in an earthship in freezing conditions and were unbelievably impressed with their comfort level, overnight low was 7 degrees F, inside never got below 70 degrees F, since then I have wanted build a small one, but like you I also didn't want to pound tires and thought that hyperadobe earthbags or tubes would be a good alternative to the tires, because I was also interested earthbag construction having watched many videos on that type of building, examples would include youtube channels like Cal-earth institute in Hesperia,Ca, Tiny shiny homes, and mylittlehomestead, I plan on constructing a small one 120-180 sqft, in the high desert area near Paledale, Ca, to test the method, sorry for the long comment
Incorporating earth integrated design, water recycling, natural ventilation, and passive solar energy is definitely a way to go. But yes using tires is a terrible idea for multiple reasons. Besides being labor-intensive and not mass-produced as earth-bricks or stone, it is a total health issue. Check this out: hackingtheearthship.blogspot.com/2015/01/tire-off-gassing-research.html Good luck to everyone who is trying to live in a sustainable way and thinks of future generations! Anya
what about plastic icb totes stacked two or three tall? you can still fill them with dirt for the thermal mass and the plastic should hold as water weighs more than soil and then fill in the cracks between the totes with clay and bottles? this is my current plan as i do not want to pound 1200 tires in either
I would use sharpen stakes of rebar to attach the layers together and to attach the first layer to the ground I would also try to get some good glue that would glue them together I think that PL800 would do it ..but I have yet to try it
My husband and I are also thinking about building an earth ship, however we don't want to pound tires all day long either, and idk if I could do it. However we're thinking about using straw bale's to make an earth ship home. Like a cob house, but with straw bale's, walls would still be 2ft thick then. And you wouldn't have to insulate because that's what the bails do. Anyway what do you think about straw bales?
I was considering that as well, but while straw bales are excellent at insulation, they don't have the thermal mass that keeps these homes warm all night.
@@stevensauvageau8827 what's the difference between insulation rate, and thermal mass? I was also considering building the back wall, down in the ground, then lining the dirt back wall with strawbales. Then there's no wind. I currently live in southern VA, on the NC line, by Roanoke rapids NC. However we're selling our land, and buying at least 10 acres in Missouri! No zoning laws! And buying raw land, we're going to go completely off grid, cheaper then traditional utilities and no monthly payments! However the house itself, and the land itself, we're looking for a lot full of timber, so we can harvest and sell the wood as needed, so around the house won't have a lot of light, however enough because we are also going to make some pastures, we just don't want to be seen from the road. So trees in the front of the property and opening as you travel back. So I'm wondering if it's possible to dig down into the ground, then do straw bale's, so the actual retaining wall, would be the ground itself. And the straw would be for insulation purposes only. Of course built on top of a concrete slab, with proper drainage under it. I know it's possible. I think. 😂, Built like an earthship, glass windows in the front. All recycled water. And solar of course. A cook stove and either fireplace or Wood stove for heat in the winter.
@@allnaturalhomesteaders The idea is that your building faces south so the sun only comes in during the winter when you need the heat. the tire wall (thermal Mass) absorbs the heat and then releases it when the sun goes down. If you used an insulating medium you would not end up saving that heat and have to heat your home at night. It's a thermal battery.
When considering alternatives, I initially thought about filling the tires with foamcrets. Like you.. I don't find pounding tires an attractive enterprise..besides being too old and broken to do any such thing... We are probably going to go with form filled concrete and stone, tho concrete rendered straw bales has been discussed.
well I am right now also thinking about it. I am from poland and there is a polish company that is making some interisting stuff they call DOM3E they are doing some lego bricks ou tof Perlite- very simple to build and fast and the price is also okay- and perlite is somehow a littlbit more ecofriendly and has some nice properties. what do you think about it?
Fill the cells of the blocks with closed cell foam insulation, water proof outside & inside surface of block with drylock or other waterproof coating, just a thought.
I'm thinking precast concrete walls such as a double tee would be a great alternative ... But expansion may be a real issue if the building is very big ... Interlocking into the back fill would help mechanically stabilize the wall and the fill .these could be ordered and set in no time at all ..
I think that structural 3d printing, especially using carbon-negative cement, would be ideal for an earthship. anything that can knock down the massive labor costs and speed up the process is a good thing. I;d love to see someone give that a shot.
@@satleet I have started it. It's in progress right now. It's going slowly and there are unexpected delays but that's probably the same for most construction projects.
![Matt Justice [Certified Saunas]](http://yt3.ggpht.com/5fekforIjWJ-bs0u7FKkMirmQWURZRXtX4i_wPGV7l6LNMzSaXu-fC7apHag8R7H2jYAcycV=s48-c-k-c0x00ffffff-no-rj)
I own an Excavation Company, I've work with the earth every day for 35 years, as well as digging and forming foundations. I'm also planning to build an Earthship inspired home.
My plan is to use Rammed Earth instead of tires. I plan to dig trenches for the Rammed Earth walls and concrete footers, pour the concrete footers in the trenches, then use Excavator with compactor plate to compact layers of low P I soil mixed with about 10% cement to top of walls and cap with concrete. Then trench behind walls to place bituminous sheets on back of wall to seal of moisture, add perferated drain pipe in sock and backfill behind wall with crushed concrete gravel, then Clay Cap. After back wall side walls and wing walls are done, dig the dirt out from interior side of walls to depth of below intended floor slab. Now front wall can be built and so on. This enables earth forming earthen walls with very little hand labor making what could take months take only a few days.
Love the idea!! This seems like more work/time/expense than just having a wall poured though?
@@matt-justice It would be more time and labor compacting layers instead just pouring a Concrete Wall.
If I didn't own the equipment and already have employees I maybe would just pour concrete.
I would be willing to conduct this experiment on someone else Dime first if there's any takers! LOL
Makes sense! I’m always calculating either renting equipment for this, or hiring it out... totally different I guess when you own the machines. Keep thinking I should buy a Case 580 or 410G for a short while to use on projects instead of renting, just haven’t pulled the trigger. I’m in Maine if you’re closeby! Lol Be happy to, gotta hire someone as it is that thinks I’m nuts ;)
@@matt-justice Im North of Dallas, Im also an Heavy Equipment Dealer. www.dirt.contractors , www.texashe.com
Doing just that here in Nevada north of Reno-Sparks off of Pyramid Highway. My modified version utilizes compressed earth block which we will be making on site. Hope you get your project going soon!
Definitely agree pounding tires for 7 months didn’t sound appealing but I love the idea of an earth ship
It’s a trade, Earthships are meant to be done with tons of family/friend helpers, the COLLECTIVE COMMUNITY is the priority, otherwise u r right, 7 months of pounding not worth it.
I second your sentiment. I'm fascinated, but I've been looking for a video exactly like this.
I'm just glad am not alone.
I certainly don't have that many friends who can take time off work to come and do the tyre pounding. My thought was, if I was go that way it would have to be a workshop.
For earthships become nationwide built ; they have be economically fast build; hempcrete blocks might be answer outside earth sandbags
One caution here, the back wall is a key part of the solar heat "battery" in an earthship that helps stabilize the temperatures inside ( absorbs heat from sun hitting it, then releases that heat when sun goes down and temp inside starts to drop). The thermal mass of the wall is key to this, and you do not want to use an insulating material for that back wall or else you will lose the thermal battery process. So, ICF and timber should be crossed off your list.
So would Concrete wall be crossed off then too? Ben Kaan
@@nathancasey6579 Nope, concrete is a very good thermal mass when it is more than 4" thick, which is why the ICF walls are not good thermal masses. A solid 8" concrete wall, or thicker, would work very well. It would also be much more expensive than traditional materials sourced for the thermal mass walls (used tires, ertc.)
Why not cob?
@@tmckmusic8584 With cob, even with a good wrap, footer, drainage behind it etc, if somehow it retained excessive moisture or water, it could lose structural integrity very quickly. It's very structurally sound but only when it remains dry.
@@helenjones568 the color of any surfaces exposed to the inside is important to the buildings temperature regulation especially during the day, but paint doesn't store the energy for a significant period of time and it is the energy storage properties that the OP was concerned with.
We you there in the middle of summer on a hot day? This is when off-gassing would be the most noticeable. My friends have been in Earthships in Taos on hot days and the tire/petroleum smell is unbearable. I have read several articles that claim that tire off-gassing in Earthships is a non-issue, but tires do contain: "benzene, mercury, styrene-butadiene, polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, and arsenic, among several other chemicals, heavy metals and carcinogens". I think that Mike Reynolds is a brilliant guy and a saint for pioneering this style of architecture, but it would be a shame to find out that residents of tire-wall structures develop serious health problems years down the road. Not trying to hate, just after the truth and want everyone to be safe, happy and healthy. This is a real concern and deserves some research and analysis. Your concerns are justified Matt, even if you are not sure why tire walls don't sit well with you. Thanks for the video! ~S
I'm thinking that the same rubber diaper you wrap the roof in, loop it back around and block the tires off from the interior as well. Maybe locking in the offgassing would help?
Tires don’t off gas if the are completely covered by earth. The off gasing happens on the outside walls but you can also cover them all.
@@daniluchison believe this hahaaha
@@daniluchisonalthough the process should be slower, off gassing doesn't completely stop when the tires are buried certain materials in tires naturally break down when they are near room temperature and some of the byproducts of that process are toxic.
@_____ the tire thing actually is primarily described as being more of a waste reduction strategy rather than a rational cost saving measure.
Hyperadobe and superadobe are also an awesome substitute for a tire wall that maintains some of the same properties as the tire wall. And is DIY friendly if you don’t mind the labor.
I don’t know what the answer is but I think you are asking the right questions.
Earthships have been around from the 70s.
For me there are three questions all having to do with making the model scaleable.
1) adapting building technology to make them faster and less labor intensive to build?
2) adapting to urban and suburban landscapes?
3) figuring out ways to adapt some of the concepts to existing structures?
Just be sure that the wall you are going to build can hold up against the massive amount of earth you put behind it. The idea with the tires is not only about thermal mass but also as a counterforce to hold back the tons of dirt behind them
this is why EB tire walls are not even vertically straight, a straight brick wall would be hardly able to hold a green roof AND the wall behind
I have been exploring the same problems, on a hillside dig out for your building walls tapered or stepped back like a retaining wall, then dig back 8 or 10 ft for thermal mass, with a backhoe, insulation on back of the trench and on top of mass waterproof cover, put a french drain into water storage for drainage , fill with larger rocks filter fabric then gravel, could be done with 1 or 2 guys and a excavator pretty quick, basically it's like a walk out basement with a greenhouse
I've used that same analogy as an argument in favor of poured concrete walls. It's essentially a walk-out basement with patio doors all across the front wall. Another upside is this should easily meet code in a lot more locations than some of the more exotic materials and methods used with earthships.
Most of the materials in an earthship that weren't being recycled back when they were first built - tires, cans, bottles, etc - do get recycled now, and I have some concerns about having a bunch of toxic tires in my walls. Thanks for coming up with an alternative.
Ever thought of using something called, "Hempcrete", it's basically ground up hemp fibers and lime mixed together, that when cured is stronger than commercial concrete and roughly 3 ~ 6 times lighter than commercial concrete, too. It's something to think about if you don't want all the extra out-gassing from concrete (has radioactive elements; uranium, radium and radon gas being emitted). Another thing to think about is mitigating any radon gas build up in the winter or when it rains really heavily in your area where you're building. Put a communication and mitigation system in under your flooring to protect yourself, also helps keep your floor dry, so you're not losing thermal mass the hard way.
Totally agree - this would be a great application for a very broad/wide hempcrete wall!
Thank you for this, it answers so many issues I have with other alternatives to tyres. I'll be checking availability of hemp fibre in my area. Exciting
@@886jules1 Hempcrete will not have the load bearing capability to take the weight of the roof.
Stoner
@@jonothandoeser Weed and hemp while they're in the same family and species, the subspecies is different. Hemp has 0.3% delta THC or less, while marijuana has at least 9.0% or more.
Translation, you won't get high smoking hemp unlike marijuana.
Just came across this. As a general contractor with engineering background, Ive been brainstorming these same methods. While I understand the advantage of the tire wall, its extremely labor intensive, and as you yourself mentioned it isnt as appealing to many. Ive been considering a hybrid build between metal containers and earthship, although I do recognize that this would likely compromise some of the benefits of an earthship. I have also considered cmu concrete filled wall. I think that would behave similarly to the tire wall in retaining heat etc. Anyway….like the conversation going on
Thanks! Agreed, some folks are offended… the real intention is to learn more and explore more ideas. No one way has to be right or wrong…
@@matt-justice ….I can understand why they do what they are doing with what would be considered a true earthship. However if one can stand back and look at the larger picture they might see that it would be better to appeal to the masses and begin a foundational change in how we build, as opposed to hold fast to a line that makes sense but will put most people off. This is a win the battle but lose the war scenario in my personal opinion.
We downsized our entire lifestyle 8 years ago with extreme changes in how we lived, worked, and prioritized things. Just recently have converted part of our traditional ranch home over to solar. It was really an experiment for us to see and live with it personally. We are moving to yet another phase that will likely be a 5 year process. Its all been good though. No more credit cards. No new cars. Now, simplify our cost of living itself
The tire wall can be strapped down and filled with any light weight insulator like vermiculite or even recycled plastic pellets, or sand, which doesn't need compacting, where it's readily available.
@@Jagueyes1 …..but this would negate the point of the tire wall. They are doing it to gain thermal mass, so insulation fill would eliminate this advantage.
Why not go with cheaper more sustainable EarthBag tubes, or bags and rebar? Its got much mass, hurricane (wind) proof, fire proof, rot proof, bullet proof and EarthQuake proof?
Labor?
@@jakebredthauer5100 how is that more labor intensive than pounding tires?
@@oakmountaingod What about going down in the ground Like Mike Oeler did. He dug his by hand, but you could use an excavator. Then you make a wall and backfill. Put an insulated roof on it. I don't think tires have much value in a cold climate.
I was not talking about tires. Tires are disgusting.
@@jakebredthauer5100 I agree with you on that 100%. I am looking into alternatives for tires because I won't use them.
@@oakmountaingod What is your location? Hot cold Wet dry? Severe codes, mild codes? Do you want to spend a lot or a little? What are the top two that you are considering? Often the way the Indians did it and the way the pioneers did it at your location will give you some clues about what is appropriate.
I despise pounding tires! It's really hard!
I have a friend in British Columbia who built a tire house herself. She also did not want to pound dirt forever, so she figured if she just cut the sidewalls of the tires and packed them with a flat plate compactor, it would save time and make the stack easier. Although her community is completely off grid because they built their hydro system (enough to power 5-7 homes), she could have just built a box and heat with unlimited power. Also the reason for all the tires is to give the necessary depth in ground to make the ventilation work naturally.
As far as the roof loading goes, have some trusses built to tolerate x amount of earth cover. Lastly, how much solar gain do you expect (location, orientation to solar, heat storage type internal material, concrete, Trombe wall, so on. If you need help in that arena, (my 40 year hobby job is designing solar systems for clients at no charge, sort of a retirement job).
Im working on my plans for my earthship as well. I am not going to be using tires either because of the labor and gasses. Im going with the concrete pour with a backside pour of aircrete. That would give you a nice thick thermal mass wall. Excellent structural support and its fire proof, water proof, its an insulator and inexpensive to make. It can be poured or made into blocks. The blocks can also be cut with a hand saw.
You should definitely look into aircrete 😊
Have you looked at tire bales? They’re big bricks of crushed and banded tires that you can stack and then spray cement over, and then earthen plaster that. There’s a gentleman from Colorado Springs that built an earth ship with them and they worked beautifully for him.
Earthbags would work, reinforced with rebar and buttresses, great thermal mass and solid as a rock
Earth bags! Use polypropylene bags, put in a mixture of sand and clay with some moisture, pack the bag down and let it dry until it becomes a brick. Between the layers of bags you insert two lines of barbed wire
I've been thinking about this as well, and what I've decided on is use the basic earth ship shape. I , however, would slope towards the front like a Chinese greenhouse (highest part of the house is the back wall). Instead of tires, you use Hesco barriers. If they're strong enough to be used as retaining walls and as protection from explosives; it's strong enough to use instead of dirt packed tires. Then pour aircrete in vertical forms to put a smooth face on the interior walls like stucco. You can berm the exterior walls. It's fast and strong. For the parallel support beam in the middle of the house, pour concrete footers for vertical posts and a giant glu-lam (or similar) beam that spans the entire width of the house. The very front gets a rubble foundation.
Gabion cages in layman's terms. I've had the same idea. Gunnite could also work as a coating...basically swimming pool walls shot into place...no forms needed unless you're after a flat vertical finish. Otherwise, I'd like to basically do exactly what you're suggesting with the design.
I like the idea of Hesco barriers. Any examples of this being done somewhere ? What would you fill up the Hesco with ? Sand ?
@@luclaflamme4712 The other responder was correct when he said the laymen term is gabion cages. I've seen smaller and larger cages in use - anywhere from 2'x2'x2' upwards to meters long per side. The size of the individual squares determine the size of aggregate used, if you want to leave them exposed. You can often see the larger cages stacked on top of each other on highways where they're used to catch rocks in rockslide areas.
You can also use geo-fabric to line the inside of the cages if you want to used dirt/sand like you'd see in Allied bases in Iraq and Afghanistan. I saw walls 3 to 4 meters tall, when I was over there.
The whole point of the idea was to put up the bones in a super short period of time, so I'd most likely hire out since you'd want heavy equipment to do the job. The cheaper in the long term option would be to buy a used mini-excavator and DIY; since you'd have something for future digging on your homestead.
They are now building the global model earthship with slope towards the front to keep the roof exposed to the south. The sunlight melts the snow better and keeps the water from freezing better.
There is a person here in Taos who plans to shred tires and compact them in 3' x 5' blocks. Keep in mind that one of the earthship concepts is re use/ up use of existing materials.
If the focus is time, this is a good question. Tire pounding is very labor intensive. Once done they are incredibly strong though so it’s not easy to replace the tire walls.
2'x2'x6' Concrete bin blocks are available nationwide from landscaping and construction companies. Companies like 48Barriers will sell them new or as used road barriers. No forms to build or gabbion cages to make. No waiting for concrete to dry. Stack them in place just like a retaining wall. Waterproof and back fill the same day maybe. Blocks with decorative stone imprinted facing are available. If you want to recycle tires, use them to build the road, or driveway of your property. Cut the sidewalls off, lay on the ground in a grid like circular honeycomb, fasten together with air powered nail gun and then fill with crushed stone or recycled concrete and gravel. The road will be well drained and you will never have potholes or ruts up there in Maine. You might even try the wall less tires for the walls of the house. No trying to hammer dirt around and under the sidewalls of the tires. Just grab an pneumatic tamper and get with it. If you have drainage or erosion issues on the property you can lay out all the cut off sidewalls in the problem area, cover with some gravel and then dirt and grass. The sidewalls and gravel will slow down runoff and allow it to seep into the soil.
This is a really interesting idea. Fast build, extremely strong, low-tech, and it looks like around $7,500 for a 100'x10' wall. That's pretty enticing. I suppose shipping is a significant problem/cost as each block is 3,300 lbs and most flatbed trailers are good to 48,000 lbs. It would take 3-6 loads to haul that 100'x10' wall. And I expect this would face code challenges just like tires, rammed earth, etc.
yes tires are rubber and they are insulators NOT conductors- its the packed adobe/dirt inside that is the mass- but the rubber keeps the heat from getting into the dirt- thus tires don't provide much mass! you can use anything even frame with an exterior sheathing that is water proof- they do make waterproof below grade plywood.. the only mass that really absorbs the heat is IF that mass sees the sun- and that north wall doesn't! and standard hollow cinder block is not mass- you want the heavy cement blocks filled with concrete. its the floor and some of the interior walls that see the sun in an earthship! unless you put a clearstory in the back of the roof. also NEVER use the slopping south glass! huge overheating issues plus water leakage and a loss of quarantee from the glass manuf.. the only time to do sloping glass is when your in the lower southern US latitudes. where the sun is higher in winter. also put an appropriate overhang above the south glass- draw up the sun angles -on your south elevation to find out when the glass will be shaded- via a sun chart. also never use exposed wood on the south side around the glass- it will degrade in a few years and leak. always isolate the greenhouse from the living space (via tight windows and doors) or else you'll get insects, mold, etc. inside the house. and the cans and bottles are really just for decoration or as fillers - they do nothing as mass. never put your open top cistern- like some of the early earthships- inside the house- kids/pets could drown in it!!! never make your cabinets/doors out of pallet wood- it looks shitty and warps so it doesn't seal. you can use brick venear or a 2-3" thick concrete plaster over frame walls for interior mass- but again it needs to see the sun or be very close to the warm south side of the house.. and add a big overhang on the east and west porches if you have porches. www.bendsolarhomes.com
What's wrong with earthbags or rammed Earth?
Poured foundation, no doubt about it. If your lot is accessible, it's the best way. The bank will loan money on a house built with standard practices, and you'll have resale value just like any other home. If you're in a remote location, dry stacked block makes good sense. If you live in a third world country, then tires and cans it is. The earthship design concept is superb. Building with garbage will not save the planet. Why do it?
Matt I live in Alaska and am formally from the Colorado region. I have often wondered instead of using rammed earth why not use a slurry compound to fill the tires like a earthen mud slurry with cement additive for strength. Or if your going to use ICF forms do a double wall back to back on the forms. Then you would have a 8 inch concrete wall that has a styro foam insulating slice in the middle. Let me know if you have any ideas on this bunch of random thoughts
The trick would be to figure out how to fill the top rim of the tire, so there isn't an air pocket there ready to collapse under pressure.
What about using a 3-4” hole saw to drill holes in the side wall facing up to let the concrete/slurry not form air pockets?
Gabions - rocks stacked in wire mesh.
Hey, I'm in the northeast as well and I'm going through the same angst about the tires. I love the idea of using the trash, tires and I've also heard the tire off gassing is no issue once they're essentially enclosed. But, it's the time consumption, the earth pounding and I've also thpught about the massive precast blocks you see a lot of landscape companies use for containing bulk wood chips, ground cover, mulch, etc. I think those would be a fantastic alternative but I'm not sure of the cost factor of if building a precast block of similar proportions using hempcrete (7 times lighter and way more efficient r value) I don't know but great video and I do believe we're on the cusp of this concept building being the future. Self sustaining is key, off-grid just sounds like a camping trip, I know this is the future because it's intelligent and the building industry itself most likely wants no part of this. This world itself is built on consumerism, throw it away after it's used up.
Did you ever end up building your earthship inspired office? If so can you do a follow-up video of how it went. What worked/didn't work?
I feel like you are missing the point of the tires. He is building with existing materials. Tires are great because you are using something that is littering the entire work. Every inch. I recently bought a property, and what do you know, less than a mile away, a huge pile of tire just sitting off the road someone dumped.
Mr. Reynolds nickname is the garbage warrior. His intent is to build homes with recycled materials. My intent is to build an economical home that is low on energy use. I am not going to pay a team of laborers to hand pound the tires just so I can say I am using a tire wall. I do not have a team of 50 people volunteering for this. In my opinion he is looking for alternatives. Worm boy that is how a design is improved.
Tires smell bad and release toxic chemicals into your home. They shouldn't necessarily be building materials
OverLordMauS
He has been building homes for 50 years. Do you honestly believe if chemicals were an issue people wouldn’t put it out there?
There is no off gassing as long as the tires are completely covered by earth.
Taos uses outside walls, not living quarters, where the tires are exposed.
Well said.
The other issue is time. It takes forever to pound the number of tires needed for a reasonably sized home. The work party with a huge number of people has been Reynolds solution but that isn’t easy in many areas. Traditional barn raising didn’t take so many people.
I helped build one pounding tires with a sledge hammer. It gave me a back ache. A friend used a 30 lb pneumatic tamper which made it a lot easier and sped it up. Coated the inside walls with insulating spray foam, then plaster.
I'm in the process of designing my own home, I really want to use a lot of sustainable materials, super insulated/high thermal mass etc. I think I came up with the same thoughts, using tires is not really the way to go for most people. Unless you have access to a very close tire dump I don't think I would go all that extra work for actual minimal return. Tire walls is very unnecessary, also the amount of layers of plaster work really adds to an unbelievable amount of labor. Material handling doing cob or any plaster/stucco is hard work and incredibly slow. I would only choose that if you had a tractor with a bucket, and maybe even a tiller to do all the mixing. I'm thinking about using forms that use metal roofing materials as the outside/inside material, basically permanent forms. Would save lot of labor. Maybe a woodchip/soil/straw/concrete mix as the infil, would need to be tested. Aircrete looks awesome, but to get it perfect would require a ton of testing.
I’m pretty sure there are forms out there that are made of insulation board with metal reinforcing bars in between them. If you’re not against the idea of using foam insulation board. Then you have a little bit of insulation on either side of your wall. Have fun with your design process! And best of luck with your local building department. Sometimes they’re a little stuck in their ways.
I don’t trust tire walls in an earthquake so I built my earthship with 4 concrete reinforced walls (the walls facing the earth berm were engineered with 5/8 rebar). The south facing wall acts as a trombe wall and it works very well. I put stucco on the south side of that wall and thin brick on the inside. If I were to use tires I would secure them to each other with fasteners and then fill them with rebar reinforced aircrete. I saw the double decker freeways in SF after they collapsed onto each other so I have a keen respect for earthquakes.
Funny thing, I’d trust a tire wall more than concrete in an earthquake. I don’t want to use tires because of time, labor, and off gassing but the tires are very heavy and strong. The rubber is just enough natural flexibility to navigate an Earthquake. Concrete is rigid and likely to crack.
You can make hesco barriers, use terrestrial Earth with a bag of Portland cement per 5x5x5 cube. You have to buy the wire in the landscaping cloth, using it for structural walls I would include wire every foot so the basket maintains a square shape or whatever shape you intended to be. Mix it with the Portland, fill it, Tamp it, put your next 5 ft section on top of it 4x4x5, then use your bond beam... Then you just use stuck on the outside and the wire that is already on the barrier three-by-three square is a perfect anchoring point for your chicken wire. Are you basically doing is waterproofing the outside. With that much mass mass, it's going to be far more than any tires that packing, having the Portland cement will make stabilized earth. All you need really is a backhoe and you can have your walls done in a few days... Or you can pack tires it's up to you 🤷
One of the down sides of tires
Citys/counties can say after a certain amount on your property they represent hazardous waste...
And they can give you X amount of time to remove them
Now all of a sudden you'll have to haul them off and pay the hazardous fee per tire
Knowing how to discuss your personal life with "experts" is the largest problem in this entire process. I just remind them...public health and safety is for the public not the private.
ICF cures at a higher strength due the insulated forms holding in the heat and moisture. With rebar in every core or every foot vertical and horizontal it can hold back backfill for a buried wall.
That's a great idea but, what about all the material needed for the mass?
If you have "insulation" via the ICF, you're blocking the convection heat from going back into the home when it gets cold!
ICF is great for building and it's strong but, I believe that we need alternatives for the tires so we can benefit from the convection.
I like the ideas above using sandbags filled with earth or sand or a combination of things. Very strong if multiple layers are used and you can do everything yourself quicky without breaking your back by "beating" tires! : ( ha! ha!
@@BowenOrg do you know if plastic bags used for super Adobe or dirt bags etc release toxic fumes?
I feel it would be very helpful if someone would be willing to go through these comments and organize them a bit. I spent a lot of time reading the comments as we are seriously thinking about building one as well. Personally, I'm not worried about tires gasses, but I'm not going to pound tires at age 45. Straw bales have great insulation value, but don't have the thermal mass. I like tire bales, but am concerned about selling my house at some point. If a bank won't finance it, then it becomes a worse investment and maybe that is what has been preventing these from becoming more popular. Honestly, I'm leaning towards concrete or cement block walls with using earthship principles to minimize heating and water bills here in North Dakota.
After reading many comments I don't see a better idea for the average person. Professional builders use concrete walls for basements here in North Dakota. Do we think they who do this for a living don't know what they are doing? Time is money. and what about resale value? Are you going to live there forever? I'm thinking concrete or cement block wall with insulation and water barrier in the correct places to create the thermal mass.
You just summarized all the points after having traveled to Taos and staying in these. They’re so awesome, but most places we want to live with our families require a bit of modification. The die hards get their panties in a bunch over it, but after leukemia last year, I can tell you the most important thing is living your life with your loved ones however you want. Time is most important, not whether cans tires bottles or concrete and rebar. :)
Instead of vigas some kind of posi strut bowstring trusses can be considered for the roof and back wall load bearing as well
Excellent idea, thank you. Have you purchased some from any reputable manufacturers/builders you'd recommend?
That's the only link I would recommend so far: ru.scribd.com/document/176999705/Truss-Solutions-for-Curved-Roofs :)
Compression strength of a CSU block, I think is about 3,000psi. You can look up beam loads on any local building code site, universal building code for US also has rood load specs , an engineer should spec this number with the roof load and snow load requirements for your area
Pretty well read every comment and some great info from experience here on one site, that is great. So did you figure out what to use? I'm looking at many of the afore mentioned methods but am also no sold on tires as a vessel. Rammed earth is a option but it needs a vessel to hold it. Eathquakes will compromise most rammed earth structures. I've looked at ICF, and now NEXCEM blocks which may be the answer but also like hempcrete blocks but want to get going getting my off grid location build going soon. Nexcem are great for outer insulation especially if taken to R-28 specs but I'm looking for inside thermal mass as used in rear walls of earthships. I have a idea for Nexcem and will get back to this if my idea is a viable option. Thanks for this video, it brought some great different ideas to one location. Cheers
My wife and I are building an earthship style with Hydraform Compressed Earth Block...
Can you please explain what this is?
@@maodonimega Hydraform Compressed Earth Block is comprised of soil, water, and cement, which is then compressed using hydraulics into bricks. Personally I feel standard cement would be stronger, but not as 'green.' I rather imagine it would last about as strong as adobe brick, but of course I'm no expert. I'm sure it'll be fine. Using earth to hold back earth. What could possibly go wrong?
@@ZachsMind thank you for the explanation. In answer to your question...water ingress?
Sounds like the best option!!!! Ive done a lot of research and been in the construction industry a long time , thermal mass is where its at , and rammed earth has stood the test of time all around the 🌎
@@maodonimega I never received this response - sorry I didn't comment back! Hydraform compressed earth blocks are made by compression with on site soil that can be mixed with cement or lime based materials. hydraform.com/
I'm not smart or anything but I definitely have this burning desire to build an earth ship of my own one day. I love how it is designed Mike Renolds right?
Well I love to read comments on what I am watching ☺️
Caged Rock Gabbions stacked with rio-bar through the middle into some footings below the cages, then coat each face for protection or even leave the inside bare for aesthetics if you like that sort of thing.
I love the Gabion cage (wire mesh baskets filled with rocks) idea. I'm hoping to build a shipping container cabin, buried on three sides and the top. I believe the three sides should be gabion cages, as I really don't want to use any concrete or cement and this seems to be a very low impact solution. Gonna take awhile to sift and pull and load all of the rocks, but they'll be local and easy.
Wes Carnegie If you were in the Sunshine Coast Australia I’d give you a hand. I think it’s a good idea, but I’d suggest a hard bottom underneath them for water to seep and flow to and out away from the shipping containers, perhaps into a submerged ferrocrete water tank nearby?? Just an idea :)
Agree 100% with you regarding the tire not being so appealing. There is a video about burying two shipping containers under ground.
Look for "earth-cooled shipping container underground ca home" this concept is very close to your last option which was the umbrella. Did you finally decide on an ideal idea to replace pounding tires?
Could you fill a shipping container with tamped earth as the back wall? You'd need to cut a whole in the top to fill it. It would have a large footprint, but would it be structurally sound? Is the backwall meant to protect against vertical or horizontal pressure, or both?
@@scottabergman if you cut a hole in the shipping container it isn’t structurally sound anymore.
I was just thinking the same thing, and wondering if rocks/boulders were more my style. My daughter is allergic to rubber, and I hate the smell of tires (which I hear you saying didn't seem to be an issue, but I wouldn't want to chance it) I read they will work, then I saw your video on the suggestions.
Go with either continuous tube or individual bag type earthbags. The pros to this method far outweigh the cons. Do yourself a favor and look into it.
I’ve seen people build houses out of hay bails. I don’t know if it would be strong enough but it could be a option in combination with other support.
NOTE - I’ve never done it so I have no clue lol
I've done it (helped build them). Not a great solution for higher-humidity regions and you have to be pretty fanatical about preventing moisture from getting into the walls, and making sure it has a way to get out. Otherwise it's prone to rot/mold.
Hay bale can only be used for above grade projects, usually on tall basement foundation walls and under very wide eves/roof, it needs to be kept very dry or bad things. Earthship is a partly below grade project, half underground so as far as I know it isn’t possible to keep it dry enough in an earthship to use hay bale walls safely.
Rammed earth wall would work very well and it’s really fast especially if you have a skid steer that can lift it up there
I've been considering tire cutter to cut one sidewall off of each tire, instead of pounding dirt for a year and filling it with Aircrete (Portland cement mixed with foam made from soap) , letting it dry and picking it up and stacking it like a brick. I've been watching a lot of videos on aircrete and it has excellent R valued and its very lite and strong!
You lose most of the thermal mass.
I think you’d significantly reduce the structural integrity of the wall using this method.
I agree w finding suitable alternatives, and I am in the same position. I am near the conclusion of a gravity wall, dry stacking raw limestone quarry blocks, 2'x2'x5' at $50-$60 each and18 to a truckload. The biggest expense is delivery followed by frontloader rental to unload and stack.. A minimal crew, done in 2-3 days. 100 blocks will give you 4 rows of 25 blocks providing a footprint 80x20x8' tall, around $6k. There are 3-4 surfaces to chose from.. few pics on internet, but frequently used in landscape walls and retaining walls.
Hi Raymond, I tried to source retaining wall blocks for this, but since I’m in the sticks delivery was more than the cost of the blocks! It was over $2k per delivery, looks like it’ll end up being cheaper just to pour a wall.
@@matt-justice i found in previous off grid builds, that was always an issue from start to finish. I bought a military 6x6 surplus truck m931a2 locally for $1,500 that vould haul anything i needed with a pintle hitch equipment trailer. All it cost me was fuel and i got to keep the truck.. it saved me from rental delivery fees and in inclimate weather it was the only thing that got through and got everything else unstuck. Best tool i have ever owned.. and not a bad toy either.
If I’m busting out the limestone I’m going full EarthPyramid.
Load bearing for earth sheltered roof is almost as important as footings. Engineering will protect your investment. (Retired building inspector).
So true but, many of the Earthships are now built with metal roofs so they can capture water. We plan on building our home in the Pacific NW so we're not worried about water... so we're going to hire an engineer for our earth-bermed home... including the roof!
@@BowenOrg Good idea. I would capture water from our roof areas too, but Colorado won't let us. I tend to overbuild things (even before being a building inspector) I did build an engineered floor system at our cabin exactly to plan but I agreed with the engineering. Good luck and enjoy!
@@sinksalot8860 Dear SinksALot.... thanks for the feedback... I would file lawsuits against the State of CO because it states in all legal definitions of real estate ownership that the owner "owns everything straight up and straight down, contingent upon whether or not the mineral rights and "ground" water rights have been sold!" Everyone has the legal right to collect rain water! Governments DON'T own rain water... no matter what "BS" they give you! Dittos to you! : )
Similarly, I too went to Taus, I too stayed in an earthship and I too decided life is too short to pound tires for 18mo+... a guy in Australia used a jumping jack rigged to a back hoe that really sped up the process ~5min per. But I'm looking at formed rammed earth. Tires are really just steel/ rubber reinforced rammed earth.
That man had the correct idea with pounding and stacking - I saw the video as well...wow!
The only issue would be if the rammed wall would be strong enough to contain the massive amount of dirt behind the wall!
Do you have the link to the video? I've tried searching for it without success.
Don’t forget rubber and steel reinforced.
Did you find an answer to this? What about using aircrete or hempcrete for the back wall?
I was also thinking AirCrete as an alternative to a tire wall. Its relatively easy to purchase mix, can even be delivered to site, cheaper, and much much quicker. You could probably make a 30 inch backwall out of this, line it, and then pile earth in behind? this is all theory though. has anyone else used Aircrete, and if so, is it strong enough to be a load bearing wall?
last thing I read on Aircrete was that it wasn't allowed for structural loads in most areas, thats one of those things thats still too new and many inspectors aren't familiar with. Also one of the big concepts of Aircrete is it's insulating properties, you don't want that for your "thermal battery" because it's a lower mass which means it holds less heat.
Aircrete probably can’t take these structural loads. It’s a great insulation.
The tire and dirt wall at the back is not only 'instead of a foundation', it serves 3 important purposes;
- protects from the worst weather in winter (mimics an underground home)
- provides air conditioning in the summer (via 15 - 20 ft tubes)
- mainly it serves as a HEAT reservoir in the winter, to be able to use only solar to bring the temps up from 58F to 70F in the winter, because it mimics being underground or partially buried.
So, I don't think eliminating the dirt BERM completely is an option IMO.
But I have been thinking of other alternatives to tires to fill the berm of dirt with. I believe that I still need the berm (15 - 20 feet long), I just don't think I will have the work force necessary to pound 750? tires. I was wondering if just doing the first few courses in tires, then the rest with cedar wood stacked or even bricks or hempcrete bricks to fill in the rest.
I saw a video on UA-cam where someone built a earthship with large
bales of tires . At the time of construction He got the bales for free . ( since then He said there's a nominal charge for them )
I'm late to the party, but I only learned about earthships a month ago. I've been researching ever since. A fast, less material/labor intense approach is something I've been considering. Did you decide on an option? Earth bags, for a wall, concrete as a motor, to also create the thermal mass wall, was a thought I had, but I am just starting the planning.
a lot to think about! did you ever find out any answers or ever build thee project you mentioned?
I'm curious to hear an update on this video. Did you reach any conclusion on an alternative to the tire wall?
I like SOME of the ideas of the Earthship, but have my own goals for building it, and the tire wall isn't something I'm interested it.
I'd like to build mine in Michigan and want to merge some of the best ideas of Earthship with a barndominium concept. I'm looking for a small temperature-controlled living space surrounded by what would essentially be a large structure/half-greenhouse, half-barn to have a moderate environment to grow a garden and keep a workshop area, and garage access to the living structure without going completely outside.
An update on anything you learned could be good.
Steel drums welded together and filled with water. Water has about twice thermal storage capacity as concrete/rock
for the the same weight and steel has more thermal conductivity than rubber so it would be a more efficient building.
Interesting idea. Would you cover the outside (or the side in contact with the earth) with a rubber membrane of some sort? How do you waterproof or prevent condensation in cold climate?
@@clearasmud1945 I would think that condensation wouldn’t happen because when the air is cold, the drums would be warmer from the heat stored in the water.
Matt you should check out building with tire bails. It's just as cheap as building with normal tires but without pounding a ton of dirt. Just look up "earthship with tires bails" and you'll find some examples, I'm in colorado and quite a bit of people have built with that method.
Tire bales. There is ZERO issue with off-gassing. We shotcreted over the bales, and then adobe'd the interior wall. I have yet to smell any rubber in any earthship that I've visited. Check out my bermed-earth tire-bale home on UA-cam. Tire bales were stacked in one day with a skid steer. They are about 5'x5'x2-1/2' High, and weigh about a ton each.
I’ve been thinking about this as well. The lego hemp block with lime seems to be the best performance product atm, but could it be used in place of tires?
While listening i thought of the heavier duty milk cartons filled with rock and stacked - a carton is $12.00 or so around here you might wire them together with Galvanixed wire OR line the sides with road paper and fill them with a mix of sand, gravel, 2 inch rock and concrete (rebar thru the holes in the sides right at the top of every other course???) prep one layer and pour - Repeat - in the end you can run electricity by cutting plastic for metal conduit or you can run the conduit before you pour ( i guess the $12.00 a pop for the strong crates is the killer)
There are 4 by 3 by 3 foot concrete blocks that are used for temporary retaining walls. All you need is a forklift to install them. You would need to figure out a way to make them permanent.
Interesting idea… The blocks that come with a little triangular ridge all around so they kind of lock together?
@@JohnnyArtPavlou yes. I work at a factory. We use them for bunkers to store raw materials. There’s a lot of material leaning against those blocks. I’m not sure how to make them permanent. Maybe rebar and concrete.
@@NickRedstar Cool. I think I’ve seen them or very similar blocks called “bin blocks.”
Pounding 1,000 tires is likely the main reason why the Earthships need a large crew of volunteers to build one. All the videos seem to employ about 40 "students" and "interns" running around installing systems and pounding tires.
Bails of hay or straw, some wood framing for support and your choice of stucco or siding material. Fast build, economic and excellent R Value.
I’m just watching a video about tire bails. They have the same thermal mass as earth rammed tires... without the crazy amount of work. So that’s a thought. 👍
Still.... they "might be" very dangerous to your health!
FYI: Architect Mike now has cancer! No "BS!"
Don't know if it's from the tires or from something else!
@@BowenOrg Mike is getting pretty old, and older people tend to get cancer. I think that those factors are much bigger than the tires which are coated in plaster and don't off gas.
Matt I completely agree….. I love the earth ship concept, but the thought of beating dirt by hand into old tires seems beyond labor intensive. Obviously if someone has no resources that would be the way to go, But I assume for people like you and me time is money. Another idea for that tire wall would be to use tires as a sort of form for concrete. Obviously lumber forms
Can get expensive. Using the tires themselves as a form to fill with concrete would be a great way to cheaply form a concrete wall…… you could also implement rebar throughout tire concrete wall for added rigidity.
I think one of the hardest elements of Earthships to get comfortable with is the tire wall. I feel your pain. But they’ve endured for good reason. They lend themselves to certain criteria and none of the suggested alternatives in the video or comments, and I’ve read them all for interest, fulfil them all. Mostly what is forgotten here is
1. Green credentials
Mike’s solution is astounding in this regard and most of the proposed alternatives are appalling.
2. Thermal Mass
Also referred to as the thermal battery. Earth is not the best material but pretty good, and Earthships have proven to work admirably. Tire, Straw and Hemp bales just won’t be as good.
There will likely be a compromise somewhere in order to reduce labour time. The old saying that good things require time and effort comes to mind.
I’d be interested to know if you’ve decided on a solution and what that is.
I don’t know how to price them but what about those large concretes bin blocks, also called V lock blocks? They are a huge thermal battery, very sturdy, readily available, and you could probably get the whole wall stacked in a day or two with heavy equipment.
one key point is that tires release cancerous fumes which could ultimately (long run) be a major issue. There are not enough data gathered on the side-effects of all these materials being used. There are alternatives to create "solar heat battery", simply visit Greece, Serbia other old civilizations where homes were built and to this date are functional. The same goes with cans and other trash being used to build.
Where I live rock is in abundance, so I have been thinking about dry-stacking big rectangular slabs of stone from local querry. And then finishing it off inside with some form of plaster. That would give a nice thermal mass, I guess.
Because of heat conducting properties, I would avoid wood for the back wall.
I had the same thoughts. I was thinking CEB compressed earth brick or air Crete. ICF is also interesting option
What about using Gabion wall cages? You could consider rammed earth for the separating walls too.
Smart man ! I doubt if many are aware of what your saying ...I love the appearance on slopes but don't think I'd care to have it in my living room ... Plus expansion/compression difference may not work to carry a stable roof ..but I still like the idea
You probably don't want insulation on the back wall because you want the low winter sun to hit it and permeate into the dirt behind as a thermal battery. Concrete might be more expensive but it's not too bad compared to the concrete pour for a standard house basement and it's a major part of the house.
I want to build a cinderblock earthship in east texas. If you did cinderblock's and sand for the back wall, does that mean no earth burm behind it? I like the earth burm for heat transfer. If i put in an earth burm, would i need a moisture barrier?
Perhaps a mudbrick mixture poured into the tyres would save the 7mths of ramming. Each tyre becomes essentially a rubber encased mudbrick block. It worked well at Bunjaree Earth Cottages (wattle cottage) where my son was involved in the build in about 2003.
How about concrete form walls for the interior and exterior walls with enough space between to insert tire bales? The spaces around the bales could be filled in with gravel. This would give sufficient thermal mass and would seal off the interior spaces from possible off gassing of the tires.
Use a shipping container as your back wall, they are usually 8 ft wide. You can get 10, 20, or 40 footer, all steel and strong. Fill it from the top full of gravel or soil. They are not that expensive and you get an instant back wall.
Great idea, what do you do about preventing rust? Or just don't worry about it...
@@matt-justice Just paint it with tar, while the tar is still sticky wrap it with black plastic (viscqueen) lumber yards carry the thick stuff. You can get rolls that are 20 ft x 100 ft. If you go slow you could paint a 40 ft container with tar using a roller in a day by yourself, paint top first, cover with plastic, let it overhang about a foot all around, then do the sides, tape seams with duct tape. Those containers are painted with paint to resist salt water. Also if you put a good base of gravel at the bottom, you wouldn't have to worry about water pooling at the bottom and rusting the bottom. Good luck.
@@matt-justice Sorry, I was thinking of burying the whole container, just put tar and plastic on the side that's going to be buried, or covered with soil otherwise you will smell tar and plastic everytime you go in the building. You want to keep that plastic away from heat, because it smells when it gets hot.
Shipping containers can't hold soil loads.
Keep them above ground.
I like the earthship concept, but I too have been looking for alternative ways to get the same benefits. I think a block or concrete wall would be the easiest and best.
I built a passive solar Adobe in 1978-80. After a lot of research I built a “regular” Adobe with a greenhouse that covered the south side of the house. I insulated the stem wall about two feet below grade. We were at about 7500 feet in west central NM and had below zero temps in the winter. The greenhouse provided about 95% of our heat and an air tight wood stove with about a half log on cold nights provided the rest. I installed elect. baseboard heaters but they were never needed. We had brick floors on sand that added to the thermal mass and felt like they were heated. The greenhouse pulled cool air in at floor level and circulated warm air back into the house. The system was simple and worked far better that I had hoped it would. We were on a well and septic system and could have gone off grid if we wanted. In winter we opened the doors to the greenhouse when we left for work and by the time we got home the house was comfortable. There were solar overhangs that kept the summer heat from building up. It was simple with no added tech besides the greenhouse. It worked far better than my expectations and I have been surprised that their have not been more examples of low cost greenhouse sunrooms and thermal mass as primary heat sources. We had electricity because it was easier that photovoltaics and we only had to guarantee to use $60 a month. We never went over. I love the idea behind earthships but I think you can achieve close to zero impacts and self sufficiency in simpler ways.
@@bobprickett2223 You need to post this on the main comment section not in a reply so everyone can see it. Good comment.
What about Rammed Earth Wall?
OK, friend here's my take: junk tires are almost free, It's the pounding that ruins the scenario. Solution: Using cut-off saw with metal blade cut one sidewall off each tire. Lay out the row of tires to your string line. Fill by shovel or front loader on a backhoe, sprinkle water if it helps pack it or lowers dust. Add back of tire dirt so the top of tire is equal to the level of the dirt support behind. In this fashion the wall goes up as the support dirt grows behind it. All packed down by l'il ol' me on my backhoe "Mo"
Used tire off gassing is not an issue after some 30,000 miles, as all the off gassing has already occurred. There's basically nothing left off gas by that time.
Could you buy used 20gal drums and fill with dirt? Seems similar to tires in terms of thermal mass. Could get polyethylene or stainless? If there are vendors for used drums that might work…. New to the earthship concept but have also been wary of tires. Beyond offgassing, worried about decomposition into soul.
Look up hyperadobe. We’re planning on using that in our earthship .
Hello Matt, like you I have been interested in earthships for years, my wife and I have actually traveled to Taos, NM and spent a weekend in an earthship in freezing conditions and were unbelievably impressed with their comfort level, overnight low was 7 degrees F, inside never got below 70 degrees F, since then I have wanted build a small one, but like you I also didn't want to pound tires and thought that hyperadobe earthbags or tubes would be a good alternative to the tires, because I was also interested earthbag construction having watched many videos on that type of building, examples would include youtube channels like Cal-earth institute in Hesperia,Ca, Tiny shiny homes, and mylittlehomestead, I plan on constructing a small one 120-180 sqft, in the high desert area near Paledale, Ca, to test the method, sorry for the long comment
Incorporating earth integrated design, water recycling, natural ventilation, and passive solar energy is definitely a way to go. But yes using tires is a terrible idea for multiple reasons. Besides being labor-intensive and not mass-produced as earth-bricks or stone, it is a total health issue. Check this out: hackingtheearthship.blogspot.com/2015/01/tire-off-gassing-research.html
Good luck to everyone who is trying to live in a sustainable way and thinks of future generations!
Anya
what about plastic icb totes stacked two or three tall? you can still fill them with dirt for the thermal mass and the plastic should hold as water weighs more than soil and then fill in the cracks between the totes with clay and bottles? this is my current plan as i do not want to pound 1200 tires in either
I would use sharpen stakes of rebar to attach the layers together and to attach the first layer to the ground I would also try to get some good glue that would glue them together I think that PL800 would do it ..but I have yet to try it
My husband and I are also thinking about building an earth ship, however we don't want to pound tires all day long either, and idk if I could do it. However we're thinking about using straw bale's to make an earth ship home. Like a cob house, but with straw bale's, walls would still be 2ft thick then. And you wouldn't have to insulate because that's what the bails do. Anyway what do you think about straw bales?
Front walls maybe, but I wouldn't build the back retaining wall out of anything like that.
I was considering that as well, but while straw bales are excellent at insulation, they don't have the thermal mass that keeps these homes warm all night.
@@stevensauvageau8827 what's the difference between insulation rate, and thermal mass? I was also considering building the back wall, down in the ground, then lining the dirt back wall with strawbales. Then there's no wind. I currently live in southern VA, on the NC line, by Roanoke rapids NC. However we're selling our land, and buying at least 10 acres in Missouri! No zoning laws! And buying raw land, we're going to go completely off grid, cheaper then traditional utilities and no monthly payments! However the house itself, and the land itself, we're looking for a lot full of timber, so we can harvest and sell the wood as needed, so around the house won't have a lot of light, however enough because we are also going to make some pastures, we just don't want to be seen from the road. So trees in the front of the property and opening as you travel back. So I'm wondering if it's possible to dig down into the ground, then do straw bale's, so the actual retaining wall, would be the ground itself. And the straw would be for insulation purposes only. Of course built on top of a concrete slab, with proper drainage under it. I know it's possible. I think. 😂, Built like an earthship, glass windows in the front. All recycled water. And solar of course. A cook stove and either fireplace or Wood stove for heat in the winter.
@@allnaturalhomesteaders The idea is that your building faces south so the sun only comes in during the winter when you need the heat. the tire wall (thermal Mass) absorbs the heat and then releases it when the sun goes down. If you used an insulating medium you would not end up saving that heat and have to heat your home at night. It's a thermal battery.
When considering alternatives, I initially thought about filling the tires with foamcrets. Like you.. I don't find pounding tires an attractive enterprise..besides being too old and broken to do any such thing...
We are probably going to go with form filled concrete and stone, tho concrete rendered straw bales has been discussed.
As anyone thought about filling the tires with HempCrete? :)
Would a rammed earth wall work for the thermal mass concept in the earthship?
Are people testing for the leaching off degrading tires in the earth water table and air in the earth ships?
well I am right now also thinking about it. I am from poland and there is a polish company that is making some interisting stuff they call DOM3E they are doing some lego bricks ou tof Perlite- very simple to build and fast and the price is also okay- and perlite is somehow a littlbit more ecofriendly and has some nice properties. what do you think about it?
Fill the cells of the blocks with closed cell foam insulation, water proof outside & inside surface of block with drylock or other waterproof coating, just a thought.
What about slip forming a cement wall with rocks backed by polyisostyrene as a thermal break?
I'm thinking precast concrete walls such as a double tee would be a great alternative ... But expansion may be a real issue if the building is very big ... Interlocking into the back fill would help mechanically stabilize the wall and the fill .these could be ordered and set in no time at all ..
I heard that in Belgium they built an Earthship using earth bags instead of tires.
Can you mix water with the dirt to make it the consistency of concrete pour each row of tires let dry then repeat
I think that structural 3d printing, especially using carbon-negative cement, would be ideal for an earthship. anything that can knock down the massive labor costs and speed up the process is a good thing. I;d love to see someone give that a shot.
What about concrete-stabilized, flexible-form rammed earth? I'm starting an earthship build in a couple of months using this technique.
have you started your project by any chance? how did it go? i want to do something similar
@@satleet I have started it. It's in progress right now. It's going slowly and there are unexpected delays but that's probably the same for most construction projects.