Great interview and useful information. Basically, get 20-40 g high leucine protein per meal, 3-5 meals a day, including one meal before bed, and you will optimize your gains.
Absolute facts. 30 to 50 grams of qual protein esp at the first meal, hard and varied training, lots of rest and water. What will happen to your body will be Amazing. AND how you will feel will be even better :) Be healthy everyone !
I would NOT recommend taking anything but Water before sleep. Your (Circadian Rhythm) is more important than anything. I eat my fist meal at 8:00AM. 2nd meal at 11:000AM. follow by my workout around 12:30pm. After my workout 3rd Meal around 2:30pm and last big Meal before 6:00pm. The End.
I agree, you should not be eating RIGHT before bed. Period. But, I would NOT recommend doing what you are doing. At all. First of all, although this is a controversial issue, you are eating too many times during the day. It is almost conclusive, almost, that it is not in your benefit to eat the moment you wake up. Completely unnecessary. Actually, there's only two ways to stimulate MTOR, exercise and protein. I am assuming you aren't in your 20's, where basically you can eat anything and build muscle from hormones. You have built a physiological habit, that I would recommend you look into changing. Everything cannot be discussed here in a meaningful way, but the goal is to build muscle (or retain ATLEAST) as you age, while slowing the aging process in a sense (fasting) to optimize health. SO, if your main goal is to build muscle, you can absolutely do it effectively, albeit slightly slower of process, but eating adequate amounts of protein, even in a smaller window of time during the day, on the days you fast, or longer fasting window, you exercise fasted on those times to stimulate MTOR the same way, while reaping the numerous benefits fasting brings. Best of both worlds really. Obviously, opinions are like rear ends, everyone has one. There are so many things to consider. There is a balance between getting as much nutrient dense foods, in a smaller window of time, fast, exercise, and hopefully balance the whole situation out. Caloric restriction is fairly conclusive as well. We have learned too many things up until this point in time about health. It is trying to marry the two sides that will most likely bring maximal results. Not eating 24/7. Not under eating and compromising nutrients over a super long period of time (months/years) either. Your feeding window is almost 12 hours? This is quite a big window. Chop it down. 14 hours fasted, like you are is absolutely a good start, BUT, it has shown (pretty conclusively as well) that the real benefits kick in around 16 hours. Some experts even say a little longer. Just a thought. There are some serious Body builders who know this. Old men body builders. I feel people get wrapped in "gains" to the detriment of their health possibly in other ways long term. And even if they want to get built, you can still do it while capitalizing on all the knowledge we have on fasting and caloric restriction for short periods of time. Remember, Protein AND exercise can stimulate MTOR.
Full proteins contain 9 essential aminoacids that aren't produced in the body, one of them regulates the sleep cycle. The smartest thing for both gains and the quality sleep is to take 40-60mg of casein (slow protein) right before going to bed.
Great talk guys!!! In Brazil, the typical diet is composed by 4-6 meals; a breakfast with some protein (dairy and/or egg), no protein at mid-morning snack, good amount of protein (100g steak) at lunch, no protein at mid-afternoon snack, some protein at dinner, and no protein at evening. We are trying to establish a new pattern with at least 4 meals with 40g of protein or even the 6 meals with 20-25g of protein in each one; both strategies with focus on post-workout and pre sleep time. This seems to be better to muscle gains! Cheers,
Really liked this podcast. I would just say that the thank you notes Jorn mentioned 1,5g per kg and 4-5 meals a day, I think he could have reiterated "at least" for optimal results :) I have a question though... If for bodybuilders the difference between 20gr vs 40gr of protein was slightly higher than for general population can we agree that this optimum total protein intake would be higher? And if so, the 1,5g/kg would also increase due to better body composition (lower bf, higher lbm for the same bw)? And due to the increased need for nutrients PWO in where you found the 20gr vs 40gr difference wouldn't it be better to have a slight higher protein intake then and then lower? Also, since slightly higher before bed due to greater fasting period things could be this way... Say: Meal 1: 25gr Pre Workout: 25gr Post Workout: 35gr; Meal 4: 25gr Meal 5: 25gr Meal 6: 35gr due to all the notions shared?
The first and last paragraph totally matches my assessment. I have another question regarding your second paragraph.... Although it revealed that 20gr and 40gr between groups was not different, the higher lbm group had an higher percentage of protein utilization with 40gr compared to the lower lbm group correct?
Well done, again that was amazing! I might have to go back to Scandinavia if I want to maximize my brain gainzzz haha. Greetings from Switzerland, Will Janssens
So the concept of "all your protein in one daily meal" eg warrior diet/IF, is basically bunk? even if total protein is matched, is it better to have 3x50gm vs 1x 150gm?
He explained in a recent interview from Jeff Nippard that this applies mostly to fast protein such as Whey. Eating meat takes time to digest and reaches the muscle tissue slowly, therefore this shouldn't be that much of a problem. However there's no way to measure it, you'll lose a little bit for sure.
I always get confused of calculating the amount of protein. when it says 20 grams of protein, is it equal to about 100 grams of chicken breast? Btw this is an awesome video.
Hey, what if some one is eating only carbs with a bit of fat on last meal for higher quality of sleep. Is it good idea to add a bit of bcaa to incerse MPS over night?
Michau studies have shown that the GI tract functions are intact during sleep, so the protein absorption and digestion of 40g during the night is as effective as in day time.
Hmmm. Then according to what Jorn said about leucine and this video: ua-cam.com/video/dwJASNFy9XQ/v-deo.html we can choose to have muscles or live a long life. That sucks!
Bonemass is for sure vey important...together with Mitochondrial health...and this things to have allways in Focus WITHOUT overdoing!! is important....and movement is the Basic to increase Bonemass togehter with a good Nutrition of course
Great interview and useful information. Basically, get 20-40 g high leucine protein per meal, 3-5 meals a day, including one meal before bed, and you will optimize your gains.
Min 30g protein per meal every 4 hours is optimal.
Absolute facts.
30 to 50 grams of qual protein esp at the first meal, hard and varied training, lots of rest and water.
What will happen to your body will be Amazing.
AND how you will feel will be even better :)
Be healthy everyone !
I would NOT recommend taking anything but Water before sleep. Your (Circadian Rhythm) is more important than anything. I eat my fist meal at 8:00AM. 2nd meal at 11:000AM. follow by my workout around 12:30pm. After my workout 3rd Meal around 2:30pm and last big Meal before 6:00pm. The End.
I agree, you should not be eating RIGHT before bed. Period. But, I would NOT recommend doing what you are doing. At all. First of all, although this is a controversial issue, you are eating too many times during the day. It is almost conclusive, almost, that it is not in your benefit to eat the moment you wake up. Completely unnecessary. Actually, there's only two ways to stimulate MTOR, exercise and protein. I am assuming you aren't in your 20's, where basically you can eat anything and build muscle from hormones. You have built a physiological habit, that I would recommend you look into changing. Everything cannot be discussed here in a meaningful way, but the goal is to build muscle (or retain ATLEAST) as you age, while slowing the aging process in a sense (fasting) to optimize health. SO, if your main goal is to build muscle, you can absolutely do it effectively, albeit slightly slower of process, but eating adequate amounts of protein, even in a smaller window of time during the day, on the days you fast, or longer fasting window, you exercise fasted on those times to stimulate MTOR the same way, while reaping the numerous benefits fasting brings. Best of both worlds really. Obviously, opinions are like rear ends, everyone has one. There are so many things to consider. There is a balance between getting as much nutrient dense foods, in a smaller window of time, fast, exercise, and hopefully balance the whole situation out. Caloric restriction is fairly conclusive as well. We have learned too many things up until this point in time about health. It is trying to marry the two sides that will most likely bring maximal results. Not eating 24/7. Not under eating and compromising nutrients over a super long period of time (months/years) either. Your feeding window is almost 12 hours? This is quite a big window. Chop it down. 14 hours fasted, like you are is absolutely a good start, BUT, it has shown (pretty conclusively as well) that the real benefits kick in around 16 hours. Some experts even say a little longer. Just a thought. There are some serious Body builders who know this. Old men body builders.
I feel people get wrapped in "gains" to the detriment of their health possibly in other ways long term. And even if they want to get built, you can still do it while capitalizing on all the knowledge we have on fasting and caloric restriction for short periods of time. Remember, Protein AND exercise can stimulate MTOR.
Full proteins contain 9 essential aminoacids that aren't produced in the body, one of them regulates the sleep cycle.
The smartest thing for both gains and the quality sleep is to take 40-60mg of casein (slow protein) right before going to bed.
Great talk guys!!!
In Brazil, the typical diet is composed by 4-6 meals; a breakfast with some protein (dairy and/or egg), no protein at mid-morning snack, good amount of protein (100g steak) at lunch, no protein at mid-afternoon snack, some protein at dinner, and no protein at evening.
We are trying to establish a new pattern with at least 4 meals with 40g of protein or even the 6 meals with 20-25g of protein in each one; both strategies with focus on post-workout and pre sleep time. This seems to be better to muscle gains!
Cheers,
Great video and information, btw, didnt know Keanu Reaves knows that much about nutrition.
Great podcast as always. Thank you.
Really liked this podcast. I would just say that the thank you notes Jorn mentioned 1,5g per kg and 4-5 meals a day, I think he could have reiterated "at least" for optimal results :)
I have a question though... If for bodybuilders the difference between 20gr vs 40gr of protein was slightly higher than for general population can we agree that this optimum total protein intake would be higher? And if so, the 1,5g/kg would also increase due to better body composition (lower bf, higher lbm for the same bw)?
And due to the increased need for nutrients PWO in where you found the 20gr vs 40gr difference wouldn't it be better to have a slight higher protein intake then and then lower? Also, since slightly higher before bed due to greater fasting period things could be this way... Say: Meal 1: 25gr Pre Workout: 25gr Post Workout: 35gr; Meal 4: 25gr Meal 5: 25gr Meal 6: 35gr due to all the notions shared?
The first and last paragraph totally matches my assessment.
I have another question regarding your second paragraph.... Although it revealed that 20gr and 40gr between groups was not different, the higher lbm group had an higher percentage of protein utilization with 40gr compared to the lower lbm group correct?
Jorn Trommelen alright Sir. Thank you, will re listen to take away those points.
Awesome interview!
How can the grams not relate ti bodyweight? A 250 lb guy needs the same as a 160 lb guy? Isn't there a rule of 0.7-1.0 gr per kg of bodyweight?
I think Dr. Donald Laymann says under 20g protein in one meal has no real affect to proteinsyntesis, and recommends 30-40g protein in one meal.
Well done, again that was amazing!
I might have to go back to Scandinavia if I want to maximize my brain gainzzz haha.
Greetings from Switzerland,
Will Janssens
Thanks a lot for that great podcast! I really appreciate it! - Charles
Charles Ruffieux - Plant Based Biohacking thank you!
So the concept of "all your protein in one daily meal" eg warrior diet/IF, is basically bunk?
even if total protein is matched, is it better to have 3x50gm vs 1x 150gm?
Not necessarily bunk, but if you are looking to optimise MPS its more optimal to distribute the protein
He explained in a recent interview from Jeff Nippard that this applies mostly to fast protein such as Whey. Eating meat takes time to digest and reaches the muscle tissue slowly, therefore this shouldn't be that much of a problem. However there's no way to measure it, you'll lose a little bit for sure.
I always get confused of calculating the amount of protein. when it says 20 grams of protein, is it equal to about 100 grams of chicken breast? Btw this is an awesome video.
Yes. 20gr of protein equals to 100gr of chicken, 75gr of red meat or 3 large eggs.
So much fuckin knowledge ! Following this guy !
Thanks
Too much mtor activation??
Hey, what if some one is eating only carbs with a bit of fat on last meal for higher quality of sleep. Is it good idea to add a bit of bcaa to incerse MPS over night?
Why not whole protein pre-bed?
Cuz it take's more time to digest and maybe better option to use just bcaa powder and let my gastrointestinal system time to have a nice break
Michau studies have shown that the GI tract functions are intact during sleep, so the protein absorption and digestion of 40g during the night is as effective as in day time.
Hmmm. Then according to what Jorn said about leucine and this video: ua-cam.com/video/dwJASNFy9XQ/v-deo.html we can choose to have muscles or live a long life. That sucks!
isnt that guy a vegan though?
muscle mass is associated with INCREASED longevity
Bonemass is for sure vey important...together with Mitochondrial health...and this things to have allways in Focus WITHOUT overdoing!! is important....and movement is the Basic to increase Bonemass togehter with a good Nutrition of course
Seems that what this guy says contradicts almost everything Prof Donald Layman says! Go figure!