Brits and Europeans hate when Americans do THIS!
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- Опубліковано 29 лис 2024
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I'm Scottish and in my opinion, no matter what Country you ancesters moved to, you will always be Scottish. The Real Land of the Free. It's the only Country with Free Roaming.
@@Jamienomore You can't be something if your family hasn't been there for centuries and you couldn't find it on a map. Never mind seen square sausage or understand the average Glasweigan. I could have an African or Chinese person in my lineage, doesn't make me African or Chinese. Americans are Americans. They should be proud of that and not another country.
@@Jamienomore If you spend any time in another country, even ine that has a big Scottish diapsora - USA, Canada, Oz - then you understand in a way that you never understand from movies or social media, that people in those countries think in a different way than you are used to. And many of their basic assumptions are completely different, and some of their values are different. Not just different, but on a different spectrum from how those things are understood in Scotland.
So no, people with ancestry from Scotland are not Scottish. You will meet second generation people who do “get” Scotland, through a certain amount of enculturation by one or both parents. But beyond that, no.
Most people are very much moulded by where and when they live.
It even works with people who emigrate in early adulthood. If you have ever seen a Canadian coming back to his granny’s hielan’ hame in Coatbridge or Leith after 20-30 years (someone who now has a tartan-bedecked bar in his basement in Ontario) they can come down to earth with a hard bump.
The past really is a different country. And so is another country.
@@Atom.Storm. Aye I dunno what they're on about honestly cause I'm Scottish and the common view has always been "if you pay Scottish taxes you're Scottish" lol It's also why a fair portion of Scots didn't like Sean Connery enough to give him a statue because he moved away from Scotland to avoid paying taxes here (as a fun fact). We don't go dubbing Americans "Scottish", we're more than likely to fold our arms and hold a laugh in to see if they mention their apparent family tie to William Wallace (which is weirdly common, even though the bloke did not have any children)
I am reminded of the famous "I am 25% Italian, 50% Irish, and 25% German. If I visit Europe, will they be surprised about my mixed heritage? Will I be considered from Ireland rather from Italy and Germany since I am 50% Irish?"
The answer?
They see you as American!
Right, unless you are unfortunately racialized contra to the default type according to your nationality "Where are yOu ReAlLy from?" We take lived cultural markers of your nationalit(ies) as definitive and don't care about ancestry. After all we Europeans were the first to try to make racism a "science", but if you look "European" it's pretty much all the same. To make it very clear, I'm generalizing, and I'm neither endorsing, nor minimizing, nor excusing bigotry.
@@mariepierrenarr7784correct. While making a statement like “I love British comedians like Fern Brady, Rhod Gilbert, Colin Murphy and Al Murray” is technically correct, they’d tell you that they are (respectively) Scottish, Welsh, Irish and English.
I'm Scottish, have lived here my whole life, used to work in a tourist office and had an American man on his first trip to Scotland accuse me of not being Scottish because I didn't know his clan's history... I also had another American get mad at me for not knowing "Ian from Inverness" because "if you've been there surely you know him" (there's about 60,000 people up there). I also had yet another American (who'd also never been to Scotland till this trip) complain to me that he'd spent a fortune buying a whole wardrobe with his clan's tartan, then went to the bar in his hotel and was the only one wearing tartan. "How am I supposed to know who anyone is? And how will they know who I am?" he whined at me. I had to explain that Scots only tend to wear tartan and kilts on very rare occasions (school leaving dances and weddings for example). He got mad and said "I'm Scottish I know how this works even if you don't." then registered a formal complaint with the hotel for them being disrespectful to Scots like him 🤷♀ Later that day he came in to complain a small cafe didn't have wifi. This was 15 years ago, most cafes didn't have wifi yet. My own ancestry is Scottish and Irish on both sides and have an Irish surname. But I'm Scottish, not Irish.
The Scots came from Ireland in about 800AD and displaced the originals (called Picts - painted faces- by the Romans)...
That last guy's going to be spitting if he finds out that if his folks moved to the US during the early Scottish diasporas they probably never even saw tartan in their entire lives!
Those Americans were really arrogant. I hope you told them off for being so rude.
"How will they know who I am?" Well, they'll know he's the guy that whatever retailer sold him all the tartan gear saw coming a mile away, that's for certain.
@@alanmon2690The Scoti, who came from Ulster, didn’t displace the Picts, they integrated with them and the other tribes in Scotland at the time.
For a country that seems to be patriotic so much you're soon quick to claim you are from another country
America has it's own identity but sadly anyone ony the left of their political spectrum is terrified of celebrating it. Shame.
That 'patriotism' always seems so insecure, doesn't it? Few other places seem to need to fly their flags, everywhere - or pledge allegiance to it, every day at school. The rest of us don't need to shout about it - we KNOW deep down within us.
@@wessexdruid7598 I saw a picture of an American suburb and every home had two flags hanging outside their house. Every single one. Scottish people are fiecely proud of our country and none of us see the need to wave a flag.
I don"t know why either. Maybe to remind us of our hard-fought independence from England which, incidentally, Scotland has been trying to achieve for hundreds of years and still is unable to do.
@@hollycossin5614 Scotland last had a referendum in 2014 - and the majority of Scots chose to stay. England, Wales and Scotland were first united _under a Scottish King._ So perhaps stop talking for others? It comes over as very American.
My great-grandparents were Polish. They immigrated to England. But I'm English. I'd never claim to be Polish or Polish-English.
Grandfather was Polish. Grandmother German. Never once gave a second thought to saying I was anything other than English/British.
Great grandparents were German and Irish. Myself and everyone after them born in London, England. My Male Grandparents Fought for the UK in WW2 (Against Nazi Germany as 1st generation Commandos). I don't even say i am English unless i am being specific, i prefer "British", whilst the term has a lot of negative history attached to it... i find it silly that people on these small group of islands are fighting over little corners.
My family are Welsh, and have been forever and a day. I'm the 1st born in English, and I'm English.
❤ from Northeast England ❤️
My best friend at school was the son of a Polish pilot in the RAF in WW2.His dad never went home after the war due to the communist takeover. My friend had a fully Polish name,but he was born here and his parents were naturalised British. His dad had a strong Polish accent but was indignant when asked his nationality “I’m British” he would say “I fought for this country, it’s my home. I’m proud to be British” I was proud of him too.
I hear you and I agree but when we Black Brits born and bred say we are English because it’s actually a nationality people disagree.
It's interesting that some (a gross generalisation) 'Scottish-Americans' would not feel very at home in modern Scotland, which is fairly liberal, progressive nation and which typically elects left-of-centre governments.
I'm french, my ancestors came over in 1066.
😂
Why not push it out to Nordic (the ancestors of the Normans). In for a penny…
Hey, cousin! Me too!!! 😂😂😂
Me too. Also I speak passable French and have been to France three times. Can I have an EU passport M Macron?
Well, excrement howdy! Thank you for mending our rotten ways on our side of the Pond!
I don’t understand why Americans can’t just say for example, “my grandparents were Scottish, from Ayrshire, so I have some Scottish roots’……it makes much more sense and opens up discussion.
Exactly, or just say "I'm of Italian descent" or similar.
Right ? As you say, that _opens_ a conversation (for instance I might respond "Oh yeah ? I used to go on day trips to Largs in northern Ayrshire and was sick on the beach there once cuz of too much ice-cream"... ehm... just to pull an example from thin air :).
Ultimately, they (usually) _don't_ mean it as if they're claiming actual Scottish-ness, it's just a short-hand to people from the US. But like a lot of short-hand, people outside your group likely don't know what you mean and may even totally misunderstand you.
Every English speaker knows what "I have Scottish ancestors" means though.
@ exactly 👍🏻
Part of the problem is that Americans love to shorten / simplify language, but this often is done at the expense of clarity.
I think this is exacerbated by online communication which is often shortened or simplified.
@@bganonimouse2754 perhaps that’s part of it these days but honestly, I’ve met very few Americans who were verbally succinct or didn’t like to talk….a lot! I think there is an arrogance (perhaps culturally) from some American travellers, that they need to be seen as knowledgeable and better informed than others, even when they clearly aren’t. It’s a shame because the whole point of exploring their heritage is to listen and learn, not to assume they have all the answers before even touching down on Scottish soil.
I was seven when I was brought from NL to Scotland by my Dutch parents. Till I was about twenty I called myself Dutch. I could still speak it accentlessly, we spoke it at home. Then I took a temporary job in Den Haag and found I had no idea how people thought and what was normal behaviour. In no time I started to pretend not to speak Dutch as it avoided misunderstandings. On my return to Scotland I felt relief as I saw the first sandstone tenements as I passed through Hamilton🙂 Since then I've understood I'm Scottish, not Dutch. So, it can take less than a generation to switch national identities.
You can be both, though!
@@814912 I am. I'm a dual national. My parents lost their Dutch nationality by becoming British but I was a minor when they did it. I was in my 30s, way past conscription age, when I became aware of that.
But, in reality, I've as clear an understanding of life here in Scotland as most native born people and not much idea of how NL ticks. That might well have been a bit different if we'd lived with other Dutch immigrants to Scotland but I never met one of those till adulthood. South Asian immigrants can bring their kids up to be much more Indian, say, than I am Dutch. But, that only goes so far - young Glaswegians of Indian origins have Glasgow accents as strong as Glaswegians with Scottish great grandparents have.
What Americans who think they're Scottish get wrong, is - you are what you are culturally, not by descent.
the key word is can. Not must.
I’m Scottish but moved to NL at age 14 (ja ik spreek Nederlands ook 🤣). I came back when I was 21. I never found it that different tbh but I did move from Edinburgh to Amsterdam also being Scottish I picked up Dutch in about 18 months going from not a word to level of native speaker with an Amsterdam accent because what we speak on the east coast is the oldest form of English still In existence and massively influenced by Dutch and Fries. ‘De’ je’ ‘ken’ ‘wifey/wijfje’ are all still used and there are others too.
I did however when I was about 20 start to question myself as to wether I was still Scottish or am I Dutch. It’s interesting to hear something similar but the nationalities reversed.
I bet one of the biggest culture shocks was the size of the F’n Dutch 🤣. The first thing I notice when I come back from visiting is that I can once again see over peoples heads and im the size of an actual adult 🤣 I’m not even small at 5’10
@@boxtradums0073 7 years old and 14 are very different ages at which to move language and country. It's interesting that even you found yourself wondering which country you fitted into.
I was born in '43, north of the Rhine - If I was a few years younger I think I'd be inches taller. At a little under 6 foot, when I moved from Argyll to Glasgow I towered over most Glaswegians, most of whom had been drinking lead contaminated water from infancy onwards. That's long since dealt with of course.
I'm Australian of Scottish descent, definitely wouldn't call myself Scottish that's an American thing.
You as an Australian dont need to claim it as we see Australians as extensions of ourselves anyway.
@boxtradums0073 good to know, coming over next year to see where my 2× great grandparents came from the Isle of Skye. They arrived in oz in 1855, guessing because of the clearances?
@@alwynemcintyre2184 Aussies and Kiwis aren’t looked upon as any different than us because of the constant migration between our respective countries, Canada to but not to the same degree. We all grew up watching ‘Neighbours’ and ‘home and away’ mate. Prisoner cell block H too “what’s the matter love?”
🤣
There you go, “…of XXX descent…” and all’s well! I
My Norman ancestors treated my Saxon, Scots and Irish ancestors pretty badly. A thousand years down the line though, I've forgiven myself.
No, in these super-"woke" times you should be seeking compensation from yourself 😂
As an English woman this is something I've never understood about some Americans who say they're Scottish, Irish or whatever when they've never even so much as visited these places.
You never hear any of them say they're English though.
@ - Ha! You read my mind. I was just this minute on the verge of editing my post to add that very same thing. My step Mum is American, love her to bits but don’t understand her need to say she’s Polish despite never having visited there or indeed knowing anything much about the country itself. It’s lead to conversations I’ve had with her several times over the years as to why you don’t hear of Americans calling themselves American English. She’s not really been able to give me clear answer on that. Would love for any Americans out there to be able to explain that to me.
Yes, you’re right, but a lot of English do this as well…my great grandmother was Scottish, I couldn’t give a fig about that..
@@Theroadlesstaken Probably because if you aren't Irish, German, Italian etc it is implied that you are of English descent?
Or it is V common for British Empire to be more associated with English than British, maybe it fell out of favour to be associated as English alligned rather than just American.
@@nigellee9824 - My Grandad was Scottish. He settled in England after fighting in WWII. I don’t consider myself Scottish because of that though.
And ...for the amount of Americans I have met whose ancestors were on the Mayflower makes me think that it must have been a much larger ship than we have been led to believe.😊😊
Or they bred like rabbits.
I've seen some claiming to be related to William Wallace, saying they look just like him because they've seen his photo 🤣
Probably one of those Disney cruise liners.
@Troubleatmill-h6d TBF people were smaller back then.. 😄
@@davidcramb5793 NO! Ho ho ho!
I am a German-Amercian dual citizen because my father is American and my mother is German. I was born in Germany and lived most of my life in Germany. I only lived in the USA for about four years as a child. I almost have no contact with my American relatives and I see myself mostly as a German. I do not understand how people whose Great-grandparents or relatives farther back came to the USA from Germany can still call themselves German especially if they do not even speak one single word of German. Also, their ancestors' culture and language are different from mine because it has changed significantly in the last 100 or 200 years.
I was once asked to interpret for a Mennonite patient at an American hospital. I might as well have spoken Mandarin, and her speech didn't sound anything like German to me,
It's particularly offensive when a visiting American tells a black person (whose family have been in Ireland for several generations) that they couldn't possibly be Irish. They as a white American must be more Irish than the black Irish citizen in front of them who was born there!
Even worse, some will call them "African-American". Er - nope!
People mix up ethnicity with nationality for some reason.
Probably 'cause they are not too bright.
As we say in scotland " their heid is up their own arse"
Phil Lynott woulda loved being called an African American haha the Black Irish may not be as well known as the Black Americans or anywhere near as numerous but u stand tall dude and school the ignorant o7
@@andrewjoyner4133”ethnicity” by definition also includes ‘cultural group’ so even if your entire family was born and raised in another country but you were born and raised in Ireland you are still ethnically Irish.
@@boxtradums0073 Fair enough but I was talking about it in terms of race. Like if I was born and raised in India for instance I would not be Indian as such. I would be an Indian national but that is a different thing.
Don't want to bring this down, but remember back in the early 90s, just after St Paricks Day, some Americans I was chatting to online were proudly saying they were Irish and didn't understand why I took exception to them drinking shots/cocktails in an "Irish" bar that were named the Car Bomb, a Bloody Sunday and the like. They thought that was just a laugh.
i had the same experience in a bar in Pensacola about 10 years ago. They thought it quirky and couldn't understand why something related to The Troubles (which still affects people today, lets not pretend) was offensive.
Should we make up a cocktail called the 911??
The girl was so right [7.30] about the Plastic Paddies who spoke loudly about things they weren't close to understanding.
@@Castropc Well a couple of flaming Sambucas in high ball glasses did pick up a Twin Towers nickname here for a while.
And I got hit for a donation in an IRA pub in London I and a friend unwittingly went into. But we haven't forgotten the fundraising in parts of the US.
Everyone has 4 grandparents, 8 great grandparents and 16 great great grandparents and 32 great great great grandparents. When Americans say 'I'm Irish", I do wonder how much of the family tree gets forgotten. Okay, the same can be said for Brits, but I don't claim to be Norwegian just because my grandfather's mother's mother once had a picnic there!
Yes, I'm English. I know that one of my great great grandparents was Irish. I also know that at least another three of them were English. I have no solid knowledge of the origins of the remaining twelve. I do know that all eight of my great grandparents, all four of my grandparents, both of my parents, and myself were all born in England though. That gives me a solid enough heritage without needing to make claims on the 1/16th of my heritage that I know to be different. It's merely an interesting curiosity to me. :)
Yes, its strange the way some people privilege the ancestors they want to. By the time you get to great great grandparents its quite possible you dont actually share any of their DNA so the claim may have no biological basis in fact.
I knew that on my mother's side I had a Huguenot connection, and that one branch had been traced back to Normandy. but my son had a DNA test done and the mitochondrial part, that is the bit he got from me, was quite strong on Scandanavia and Northern France. I've actually had good friends from Schleswig-Holstein and one from Sweden who have all said I look like I came from their countries. I would like to know more, but mostly I want to know about the mystery recent North African part. I had thought I was bog standard Brit, and envied my friends' bit of Spanish, or Italian or Dutch for example.
@@CRINOTHarguments about ancestry between the ‘native’ peoples of these islands is stupid because we are all on some level a combination of most if not all of them. When it comes to the intra British isles ancestry it’s culture that truly defines you. Things like accents/dialects, art, history and sense of humour that demarcate us all. Scottish and English senses of humours are for the most part very similar but the Scottish sense of humour is a bit more rebellious and we get a bit more leniency with things like swearing and being more direct than English people typically
Some people are just ignorant. I don't get men who have Clan ancestry, go spend a fair bit on a kilt and other related items but don't do any actual research. Then you get the guy showing up an event and the kilt is on backwards. How do you have enough interest to go buy a kilt but you've never seen anyone wearing one or can't tell that the pleats never go at the front? Related are the guys who buy the female kilt, generally only worn by women who do Scottish country dancing. This kilt is much longer and overlaps the other side but guys show up with those too, though usually for fairs and accompanied by random leather upper clothing and possibly a sword - cosplay in other words.
In regards your family tree comment, surprisingly around a third of White Americans have ancestry that comes from mostly one region in Europe or the British Isles. Maybe surprising is wrong. America was made up of ethnic groups until around WWII when the pledge of allegiance was introduced to begin creating a national identity. Much of American expansion was done by ethnic groups who then built small towns dominated by one group or another. In some places whole counties were German, Irish etc. It wasn't until the 1950s that most families had a car and could easily move about which allowed the creation of suburbs and a breakdown of those ethnic groups that had formed blocks in the cities and towns.
While living in Australia, at a party a man said, when he heard me speak with my English accent, that he shouldn't be talking to me. I asked why, and he said that he was Irish. "Why does that stop you?" i replied. "Because I am Irish and you are English". When I said I could not get his point, he got a bit irate and asked if I knew about the "Troubles". "Of course I do, we have bombs going off and bomb scares quite often" (This was the early 1980s at this point), but that does not mean the English and the Irish don't get on. I told him my next door neighbours when I grew up were Irish catholics from Cork and we were English Protestants and they were our best friends, that my friends at college were Irish, from Tralee, and my flatmate was from Ireland as well and indeed my husband was half Irish through his father. I asked whether he had actually been to England or Ireland and the answer was no, but his father had been a member of the nationalist political party. So this guy had been indoctrinated by his father to continue the hate.
The Irish diaspora don't so much harbour a grudge as cherish it.
@@andyleighton6969 Irish Alzheimers - when you forget everything but your grudges.
my FIL was Irish, from Eire, because he and his brothers and also his two sisters joined the British armed forces in the war he got British citizenship, on bringing his little English family to NZ in the early '60's he became an All Black (that's our rugby team) supporter because this was his new country now
Precisely proving that hatred is something that you learn. Glad you were able to point out all the nice people from all walks of life that you had met and were friendly with.
@@garyrowden7150 "from Eire" you say. Do you know that, "Eire" means "Ireland"?
All of it. Not just a bit of it.
In my experience Americans like to cherry pick their nationality based on their view of how "romantic" that nationality appears to them. It's not not popular, it seems, to claim to be English. If you come across an American with 1 pair of great-grand parents who were immigrants from Ireland or Scotland, and 3 pairs of great-grand parents who were immigrants from England, the will almost certainly claim to be of Irish or Scottish descent.
To be charitable, I think this is partly down to how English immigration (and subsequently English culture, language, ethnicity etc.) formed the initial basis for the US as a 'white Anglo-Saxon protestant' (WASP) nation. As such, Americans tend to view mainstream 'white' American culture, primarily English in its underpinnings, as a sort of default; anything a bit more 'romantic' or 'unusual' in a person's family tree - even if only a minority of said tree - therefore gets prioritised as it simply seems more interesting than the assumed default of white/English.
It is ultimately somewhat disingenuous though, and part of me does wonder how many of them do it to appear as part of some sort of oppressed minority or something (i.e. I may be obviously white, but I'm actually Irish-American and my ancestors were treated awfully by the English and by Americans once they came here!). Same sort of mentality that compels some Americans to insist they're actually 1/16th Cherokee or whatever because they have high cheekbones I suppose haha.
at Glenfinnan , we actually met an American woman who DIDN'T claim direct descent from Robert the Bruce... I know, we were shocked
Truly a wondrous unicorn! I hope they also didn't claim to be a Laird?
I love to shock Scots by not claiming to have even a drop of Scottish blood- according to 23 and me I am 100 % European (86 % Eastern, 2.9 % Southern, 2.3 % western- French and German, 5% Ashkenazi, and 2.3 % undefined Euro)
@@michellemaine2719less shock more relief tbh 🤣
@@ianbarkham5080 An old guy who used to work at the Burns museum in Alloway had a good response to those (very often American) visitors who claimed to be descended from “Robbie” (aaargh!) Burns.
“Oh aye? Fancy that. Well, you’ll be pleased to know you’ve got a helluva lot of relatives here in Ayrshire - damn near hauf the county’s descended frae him, one way or another.”
The key point tends to be those proclaiming themselves to be of a nationality is them proceeding to lecture and give grief to those who are actually from those places. An unpleasant example of this was a black server who was from Ireland happening to mention her hometown to a US customer who was outspoken about being 'Irish' he reacted angrily saying that she was a liar as there were no black people in Ireland. He felt so strongly about this that he brought in a co-worker who was actually from Ireland to debunk her claim - only for it to turn out that the co-worker was from the same hometown and they got to have a nice chat while showing up the misplaced confidence of the self-proclaimed 'Irish'. Living in Scotland for most of my life, you get this kind of misplaced confidence that some blood from generations back gives far too many US folk the right to tell you your own business and attack you if you dare to contradict their ignorance. This is what tends to really rile people up - a sense of belonging is fine, using it as a stupid stick to beat others with is not.
Yeah, this is one of my issues too. By definition their idea of "Scottish" is _historical_ (maybe even centuries out of date) whereas _actual_ Scottishness is a living, evolving identity that encompasses that history _and_ the 21st century reality.
A sense of belonging is all very well and good but people like the example you cite have a sense of entitlement.
They never went through key moments in history we went through. Imo you dont know what it is to be ‘Scottish’ if your ancestors weren’t here for the world wars. Scotland lost 20% of its male population in ww1 and it left a profound legacy. That was the moment where we started to turn from the most vicious and blood thirsty peoples of these islands into arguably the most anti war. Remember our moniker in India ‘devils in skirts’ seems strange that we were known as that to today’s Scot’s.
@@anonymes2884 Yes many families who celebrate cultural from ancestors would find these habit unknown in the current modern country. Things change and what your grandparent say about their old country could no longer be relevant.
Too right and this can happen very fast. I'm German living in the UK. I often explain how in Germany there are two versions of the word "you", and how important it is to choose the right one to be polite. Then I go back for a visit, and in the last 15 years the more formal version seems to have almost died out. Just one small example. @Zygon13
The American husband of a friend used to make a big thing about being Scottish, which grated because my husband genuinely is Scottish, from Scotland. I'm English. When we pointed out to the American that his surname was extremely, extremely English in origin, he was totally put out. I don't think he actually knew if he had Scottish blood, it just seemed more interesting than claiming English heritage. (And he knew absolutely nothing about Scotland except kilts and bagpipes, the stereotyping that you mentioned definitely pisses people off).
Scottish or Irish heritage has much more 'street cred' than English - some sort of underdog thing or distancing ones self from colonial oppression.
@@AllanTheBanjo I say, old chap! That's coming it a tad strong, don't you know. I'm 110% English and very down with the young people on the streets. Tut, tut!
@@robinholland1136 Ah so you're one of those who've been oppressing the rest of the world all this time! (spoken as an English immigrant to Scotland with Welsh parents)..
@@AllanTheBanjo I think you're right. I suspect they regard the English as the enemy during the War of Independence even though it was actually Great Britain so no-one wants to claim English ancestry unless they can trace it back the Mayflower. At this point a lot of Americans will have ancestors from multiple other countries so they can just pick and choose the coolest one!
@@AllanTheBanjo If you're seeking colonial reparations, you'll need to get to the back of the queue...it's rather long. 😄
I remember a comment by a Scot who said a US tourist said he wasn't Scottish because his name didn't start with Mc.
I had a similar experience with an American workmate when I worked for IBM. They said I couldn't possibly be Scottish, because my surname sounded Jewish? My surname is Goldie, a reasonably well known Scottish surname that can be traced back to the 7th century.
So by that logic McDonald's are Scottish and shouldn't sell burgers but haggis instead
@@maxb148 Or Irish. And seeing as the McDonald brothers came from Irish parents and Maccies go through more spuds than any other company on the face of the planet, we'll give them a free pass on that one.
One thing I would love to have explained is why, in Chicago, "Irish" cops, celebrate St Patricks Day (Its definitely not St Patty and and St Paddy is dubious), by dressing in Scottish Kilts and playing Scottish Great Pipes as Ireland has the Uilleann pipes which sound and look different.
Because police depts tend to have pipe bands, not uilleann pipe bands or violin bands. The Irish Army itself has a pipe band and they wear kilts in a solid mustard colour which has been tradition for over a century.
I don't think i've ever heard an American refer to themselves as being English. My Irish Dad met my English Mom on a visit to England. Even though half of my family still live in Ireland and i've been there many times, i still class myself as being English because i was born here.
Same here
Probably because they think English is a language and don't connect it to a place!
It's to do with inheriting grievance, they could be 15/16 parts English and one part Irish and they would say they are Irish to feel persecuted.
@@mickstephensonOr a response to actual discrimination? Was thinking, in the UK people who grew up in England don't typically identify as Scottish or Welsh, or even French or German, irrespective of where their ancestors came from, but we DO have Irish, Jewish and Romani communities that are much more protective of their own culture and roots, and one difference is the social attitude towards these groups
In the US I know there has been a lot of prejudice directed at the Italian community, for example
@@WIDGI The amount of Americans that cannot differentiate England with "Britain" is both astounding and depressing at the same time.
amazing the increase in people claiming to be Scottish American after Braveheart was released
Which was mostly made up anyway!
Even more after Outlander.
Americans seem to get all their history from Mel Gibson movies... -.-
Great topic, it always used to laugh how many Americans would tell me, when visiting the Highlands, that they are "Scottish" yet its their first time visiting 😂😂😂😂
Yes, we find it crazy over here that people call themselves "Scottish" because of some tenuous family history.
I hope this video has shed some light on both sides of the subject! :)
In my view you are Scottish, Welsh, English etc only if you were born in that country - be proud of it.
@@clivewilliams3661 I would go further, an immigrant can claim to be English or British, if you live and intend to continue to live in that country and take the responsibilities and duties of said descriptor. I can't speak for Scottish or Welsh.
@@clivewilliams3661 But my son ,who was born in England of English parents, never agreed with Brexit and counted himself as European .
He has been able to obtain an Irish passport because his grandfather ( my father) happened to be born in Dublin in 1908 when my grandfather ,born in Germany in 1870, happened to be working in Ireland for a couple of years and whilst there his English wife went into labour. So he is of dual nationality.
The Irish Government will consider an application for anyone whose parent or grandparent was born in Ireland to be eligible for the passport and citizenship.
I won`t bother ,I call myself English .
@@stephenlee5929 If you are an immigrant then you probably weren't born in the country you now live in. This topic is about those that identify with another country even they weren't born there and their only connection goes back generations.
Though it may always have been understood what people from the US are trying to state when the claim to be Scottish etc, it is often the arrogance that goes along with the proclamation that becomes an issue. As they will often follow up of claims as to what the country is like because of stories heard from their parents/grandparents/great-grandparents, which completely disregards how countries evolve. I am Scottish, I was born in Scotland, I grew up in Scotland but then I moved to England when I was 20 and though I briefly moved back I have spent most of the last thirty years living in various parts of England. I have never really lived in a Scotland with a fully active Scottish parliament, I haven’t been fully immersed in the Scottish way of life for the majority of my adult life but on my many trips back home I’ve noticed changes and many of them.
When someone from the US claims to be Scottish, they are doing so without the understanding that the Scotland that they only know of no longer exists. There is likely a chance that they will not have the understanding of how non, standard Modern English languages have been treated in the UK until relatively recently…there is a chance that they might not even know that there languages other than English spoken in the UK.
When I make a claim on my Scottishness, it’s with a longing heavy heart that knows I have missed so much of its growth, a hope to return when the timing is right and the knowledge of the feeling of Scottish land beneath my feet, Scottish air in my lungs, Scottish rain soaking through my clothes, a Scottish wind at my back and Scottish midges eating me alive on Summer evenings. My dna is almost 70% Scottish and Irish (with the other 30% being English and Welsh).
How many of these ‘Scottish Americans’ have ever even heard the word Hogmanay let alone know any of its traditions? How many of them even know that the song they sing at the stroke of midnight indicating the start of a new year, is a traditional Scottish song that was written down by Robert Burns? How many of them know that the US tradition of Trick or Treating is derived from the Scottish Hallowe’en tradition of Guising? There is far more to being Scottish or from any other country than the knowledge that you have ancestors from there and (in the case of Scotland) you can claim to have been part of a specific clan and the use of the tartan associated with it (which the whole specific tartan for a specific clan thing came about in the Victorian era and so in actual fact is younger than the US). The way that those from the US often put it across, makes it appear that they don’t understand the difference between nationality and heritage.
We're let off the hook in Wales simply because most Americans don't even know Wales exists!! You should do a video on Prince Madoc, there's a story in Welsh folklore that he sailed to America about 300 years before Columbus, but I know there are some who think it's actually true and even think there's evidence of Welsh settlers there, I remember watching an interesting documentary about it.
Well they got down to Argentina 😊
Don't go to the Finger Lakes in upstate New York, then. That place is WELSH!
Thomas Jefferson was apparently a big proponent of that theory. His family originally came from Gwynedd I believe.
@@markjones127 The probably think you come from New South Wales Australia. So many of them hear Brits and think they are Aussies.🤣
Until now- Welcome to Wrexham has lifted the lid on your lot. Dragons painted with the stars and stripes are on the way.
Nobody, NOBODY in Scotland would mind if an Englishman with a Scottish granny scored a hattrick for Scotland
Even more so if the hat trick was against the Auld enemy.😂
Harsh, but true.
People do forget that English and Scottish people do regularly move because we’re on the same island and have children born in each other’s countries. The same with the Welsh. In theory, Michael Owen, who was a very good footballer of years ago, could’ve played for Wales because he was born there, even though his parents were English.
I really don't think Americans as a whole realise how preoccupied their culture is with race and ethnicity compared to other countries.
And i don't necessarily mean in a bigoted way, just they think about it as a concept way more than average.
I wouldn't assume individual Americans are being bigoted when they obsess about ethnicity, but I think it is in part a consequence of historical bigotry, including segregation laws which included the idea that 'one drop' of African blood made you not-white. But when Americans say 'we're Scottish', I am left wondering if they are ignoring a chunk of their ancestry (and why) or if by some strange coincidence all of their relatives only fell in love with people whose ancestors came from the same place. How likely would that be without a bit of xenophobia?
I watched a documentary a few years ago on the history of the KKK. Spoiler alert - it was founded by poor white Americans of Scots & Irish heritage. The actually Scottish journalist was meeting with a pseudo-Scottish American racist who confidently shared his view that the Scots/Irish were ethnically distinct and superior. He seemed put out that the contemporary Scot wouldn't agree.
It's almost as if they can't bear to think of themselves as "just" Americans.
The American Meghan Markle announced she was 43% Nigerian. Presumably she meant racially but no evidence has yet been presented for this claim, even after the Nigerians requested it.
7:19 Yeah, as a Scot I guess that's one issue for me. It sometimes feels like "theme park Scotland" - people from the US claiming to be "Scottish" mean misty mountains, lochs, kilts, clans, highland games etc. They _don't_ mean council estates, problems of deprivation, having a lot of your politics dictated by another country etc. Being (actually) Scottish isn't _just_ about the romantic history (most of which is _also_ more nuanced and complex anyway e.g. don't tell the yanks and _really_ don't tell the English but a lot of the "history" surrounding tartan, including clans having their own distinct patterns etc., was mostly made up in the 19th century by two con-men brothers from the south-east of England :) - seriously, google "Vestiarium Scoticum" to get started). It isn't a hobby, it's a nationality held by real people, not EPCOT centre "cast members". Embracing only those surface aspects trivialises the human reality. Not only are they kind of appropriating a culture, they're only taking the "fun" bits y'know ? They're claiming the privilege without paying their dues.
Only they're _usually_ NOT doing that, as i've come to fully understand only in the last 10 years or so. It's _mostly_ just that old adage about the UK and US being "two countries separated by a common language" - like "fanny" etc. it's just the same words meaning different things. I.e. it's absolutely _not_ "nefarious" but to us it's _at best_ odd and inaccurate so I guess my request would be, use it in the US among yourselves by all means BUT maybe bear in mind _when you're here_ that to us it means something else. Have a bit of respect for the culture you profess to be so fond of in other words and just say "I have Scottish ancestry" instead - 3 extra words which clear everything up. Oh and while you're at it, _please_ stop using "England" as a synonym for "the UK/Britain" :).
I'm English and even I hate it when Americans use British and English interchangeably.... that being said, I've heard English people do it which annoys me even more because they should know better.
I'm English but with Scottish and Irish ancestry.
I always just refer to myself as "A Scotsman who had the misfortune of being born in England"
@@davem12dim17 If you don't feel any wish to be English, any attraction to it, then it becomes illogical to say you are.
James Connolly - Irish, born in Scotland.
Lord Kelvin the physicist, and Tommy Sheppard (SNP figure) - Scottish, born in Ireland.
Joe Strummer - Scottish, born in Turkey.
Eric Liddell (Chariots of Fire athlete) + Rory Stewart - Scottish, born in China.
Alexander McCall Smith - Scottish, born in Matabeleland.
Ian Hamilton Finlay (artist/sculptor) - Scottish, born in the Bahamas.
*PM Bonar Law - Scottish, born in Canada.
Kiefer Sutherland, Canadian, born in England.
*PM Tony Blair - English, born in Scotland.
Robert the Bruce, the Queen Mother, Tilda Swinton, Rod Stewart, Ian Fleming, John Prebble (historian), Robert Cunninghame Graham (early socialist), Brigit Forsyth (actress), PMs William Gladstone, Alec Douglas-Home, Lord Rosebery (Archibald Primrose), and Scottish nationalists Lesley Riddoch, Angus Robertson, Craig Murray, Mike Russell, Iain Macwhirter - Scottish, born in England.
100% - the treating of Jacobites with the same level of mythology as American Patriots really winds me up
@@vaudevillian7 But the Scottish tourist industry can be just as guilty - I remember taking some American relatives to Culloden and the Scottish guides mentioned the Glencoe Massacre. They acted like the victims were a bunch of completely innocent rural folk - rather than a bunch of sheep stealing bastards who were a thorn in the side of their neighbours for years. Obviously that doesn't excuse the massacre but it puts it a bit more into context - and that's before you take into account the political aspects. Needless to say the American relatives lapped it up.
I was born in Ireland and have Irish and Scottish family. I only refer to myself as Irish though. I could say I’m Irish/Scottish/Danish and a few other areas in the Iberian peninsula. Although I think it’s a good thing to be proud of your heritage and want to understand your people’s culture, I have had some negative experiences with Irish Americans in the US. Actually last month a woman in Pooler Georgia started a conversation with me when she heard my Irish accent, then proceeded to try to talk about politics and give me an Irish history lesson. She had no idea who I was or what side of the political divide I stood on but carried on regardless. I was on vacation so couldn’t be bothered getting into all that nonsense and walked away. It’s almost as if there’s a desire to prove they’re more Irish than the Irish actually born and bread on the island of Ireland.
*bred
@ thanks for the correction. Give yourself a round of applause 👏🏻
I used to work for a bloke who did tours around Scotland. Had one group from NYC last year who said to me that they were surprised that we had roads and car's as they were under the impression we went about on horse and cart in dirt tracks. My gasted was flabbered.
I'm English, so were my parents and their parents. I know that some of my ancestors were Irish, and some, several centuries ago were French, but none of that affects my identity. I am a product of my upbringing, and all the influences that shaped who I am. I don't think it matters where your family originates from, it's how you conduct your life and interact with other people that's important.
But then came 2016, and some people caught a mania for gatekeeping who was a "real" (insert nationality here).
That's the thing. Most white Brits today would think it unremarkable to have ancestors from 3+ generations ago from different parts of Europe, and away from very rural farming communities, you'd fully expect most people to have at least one great-grandparent from a different part of the UK.
We're an Island nation, and there's been immigration and emigration over centuries. That a person's ancestors had been in Scotland or Ireland for a few generations before moving to America doesn't mean that their more distant ancestors weren't from Scandinavia or continental Europe.
Australia is much younger than the USA and has a huge mix of ancestry, often within only a couple of generations.
About a quarter of Australians have at least one parent who was born overseas.
I have never heard of people claiming to be their heritage if they were not born there except as a nickname, ie a guy called ‘Woggy’ because his parents were born in Greece.
@@craigwheaton4195 yes, my son and his family have lived in Oz for the past 15 years - we visit regularly for a month or so - I've never come across Australians claiming to 'be' from anywhere else -they're all Australians.
I get the nickname thing - it's not said in a derogatory manner - they'll say, Jock, Mick, Pom etc... but just a tongue in cheek recognition of someone's nationality if they are first generation immigrants with an accent. Once you have an Aussie accent, you are one of them.
On married at first sight Australia there was a couple and the woman kept going on about how she was from southern Italy and her husband's parents wouldn't like her because they were from northern Italy...THEY WERE ALL 100% AUSTRALIAN. Like two to three generations removed.
@@witwicky5565 That exception should tell you something about the program you're watching.
Same with NZ. Never heard it.
The last census showed 30% of Australians were born overseas and about 50% had a parent who was born overseas
I spared my neighbours the cost of a gene test by visually identifying them as neanderthal in heritage. Not a word of thanks.
Just wondering if you meant to post this comment on the video about American versus British humour? 😉
Thank you, just given me my giggle for the day!
@@ceejay0137 I wouldn't like to make light of my neighbours extraordinarily long arms. Adjusting the car seat so they can reach the pedals is a frustration that I witness daily. Mother's side of the family apparently. I believe the other side is predominantly Welsh Italian. It is actually a thing, hence all the good coffee shops in Wales before coffee were fashionable.
😂🤣
Well, unless they are from sub saharan Africa you would be correct; the rest of us do all have about 2 or 3% neanderthal DNA. Always nice to tease a racist by pointng out that black Africans are the only 100% pure homo sapiens on the planet.
I fully agree but when we Black Brits born and bred say we are English because it’s actually a nationality, people disagree.
I wouldn't and those who disagree are both wrong and racist. I'm sorry.
I have sympathy. That's not fair. Ukrainian kids can blend in if they can lose their accent but some people will never accept black Brits as English.
It's culture COS players, the plastic Paddies etc that set my teeth on edge.
Why does it bother you?
@@michaelme1548, I think it's because they are culturally appropriating our heritage and making a mockery of it. For instance, St Patrick's Day is first and foremost a religious festival, celebrating the man who brought Christianity to Ireland.
@@gillianrimmer7733 This
@@gillianrimmer7733 Okay. I hope it is some consolation that it stems from a desire to connect with their family history, at least it seems it does to me. Everyone messes up other people’s culture from a distance. I’m from Texas and people get things wrong about it all the time, even people in other parts of the US.
But texans dont have texas as the nationality. Its a bit of a bigger deal than a states culture. Texas has a massive latino culture and peoples is that what you meant? Idont think that's what you meant to be honest.
I'm British and was working in New Jersey 20 years ago. The comedian Michael Rapaport was performing standup in my hotel and was going through the audience "nationalities". He asked if there were any Irish in and a group of women called out near the stage. He asked where they were from and they said Dublin. He said, "Oh! You're really Irish. You'd better hope no one from Liverpool is in.". He picked the first English city he could think of thinking English vs Irish, but Liverpool was a pretty bad choice. I'm from Liverpool and the city has a strong Irish heritage. To be fair, the colleagues who were with me were mostly from Manchester (30 miles from Liverpool) and their laugh in my direction showed the distinction went over their heads as well.
Manchester also has a large Irish immigrant population (maybe not as big as Liverpool) dating from the 1800s
About 25% of my family tree is Irish from when they arrived in the 1840s
@@philjameson292 I still work in Manchester and visit the US quite often. This channel is good for highlighting the similarities and differences.
That was a really interesting take on something that does drive British people mad about how *some Americans claim to be Scottish/Irish/Welsh/English.
I can see that within the US the term 'of heritage' is implied, and that it is something people are rightly proud about their family history, and some of the customs or foods they partake in/of because of that.
However, it's important that people whose connection to a country is beyond their own experience don't assume they know all about that culture, and what it is like to be from that place.
My feeling is that if your grandparents grew up in a different country, and you grew up hearing their first hand experiences, and your parent grew up in what was essentially a german (or whatever) household, you can claim your heritage strongly, but that if the first hand experience is further back than that, your connection is almost reduced to 'theoretical' rather than 'real world' - despite the specific foods you might enjoy, or customs you might celebrate.
Does this young woman HAVE to shout at us ?
We are neither deaf, nor educationally challenged.
We don’t need shouted at particularly with details of a very questionable ancestry company.😢
@@margaretmckay-os1sz Then do you have to watch her videos? Perhaps you could turn your volume down? I saw no evidence of the audience being treated as educationally challenged ...... she is speaking to two distinct audiences, and so explains everything for each group. What is obvious to a US viewer is not necessarily so to a UK viewer, and vice versa.
Love your reply and this video.
I was born in Scotland to Scottish parents.
We moved to England when I was a toddler. So l have a very English received pronunciation accent. Mum ensured that Scottish food and language and customs were followed.
I felt like I was Scottish
Aged 18 I moved to Scotland for university. It took me a long time to realise that the Scottish identity I had was based on the Scotland my mum grew up in. I didn't have the shared current language and customs that had developed over the last 25 to 30 years.
My Scottish friends said that I was English, which at the time I found really hurtful, but now I understand.
My four years living in Scotland were awesome experiencing the mid to late 90s Scotland.
I did my dna with ancestry and it came back 100% Scottish! We have traced back through the parish registers to the 1700s and 1800s
I think the worst thing, is when they think their ancestry automatically gives them a deep understanding of all the cultural friction and historical bad blood that still exists below the surface, between the Celtic Fringe and England, or often worse between sub-sections within those Celtic cultures.
For the most part, all that stuff is low level, most don't take it too seriously and it's generally saved for the rugby or football pitch, or as friendly banter between mates. It can boil over into real anger and violence on occasion though, and I've seen a couple of instances of "Irish/Scottish/Welsh" Americans blundering into that sort of thing, completely unaware of the can of worms they're opening by dredging up some historical massacre, some highly divisive figure from history or some other dark chapter from the past that they've read about.
@@julia2julesYour friends were racist. All exclusion is automatically racist. In the indyref phone ins, Alex Salmond got a caller who was born in Dundee but had a Manchester accent from much of childhood there after her dad had moved with work, and had experienced Anglophobic racism just because of assumption from her accent.
When I lived in The USA this used to frustrate me. Especially when the Irish didn't even know the difference between Northern and Southern Ireland. Then they didn't know anything about The geography of the UK. " I just love the British accent." As opposed to recognizing all the differences in English Irish and Scottish accents, sorry to ramble on but why not just say My parent or Grandparent came from 'wherever.' Ironically people who become American citizens are and should be proud to just say they are American.
It's a very strong American stereotype, sadly - to pretend to know more than you do, then double down when someone corrects you, rather than listen or learn.
Ouch! “Southern Ireland” is a bit cringey, that name was only official for a single year in the early 1920’s. Quite a few Irish would take offence to that - imagine calling Wales “Western Britain”.
As someone who spent many years working in the tourist trade in Stirling I met many lovely Americans but what always got me was how many of them could trace their heritage to Robert the Bruce. Good old King Robert died in 1329. Unless you are an expert genealogist or from a titled family it's very difficult to trace family history beyond the late eighteenth century, as you are looking at old church records by that point and they were usually not very detailed.
I do think that traditions which became less important to Scots, were continued in USA and Canada until much more recently and sometimes they seem to be a little twee to us modern Scots ( although I personally enjoy a good Highland Game😅). I think sometimes we resent the implication that we are stuck in the past when actually we have an incredible history of innovation and invention. I remember when the Roslin Institute cloned Dolly the Sheep and there were American comedians saying ' who knew Scotland had scientists?' You felt like saying ' no need to thank us for the penicillin 😂'.
On my first visit to the US (to a ski resort), when they heard my accent a few people told me they were Scottish, because e.g. a great-grandparent came from Scotland. I thought this was daft at the time, and still do - one of my great-grandfathers came from Ireland, but I've never considered myself Irish. I also have forbears from the low countries, but I've never claimed to be Dutch.
and I don't claim to be Jewish, but folks have often assumed I am just because my surname is, and there are several posts here that argue from surname assumptions.
I'm Scottish. My family were both German and Irish but I am SCOTTISH through and through! But hey, doesn't everybody want to be Scottish? 🤣🤣🤣
I'm german, born and raised. My ancestors were from Lithuania, Germany, Poland, Tchechia and Croatia. A very wild mix. So, I must be Scottish 😉😂
The fact that Americans find it necessary to hyphenate their ethnicity suggests that there's a need among US citizens to divide themselves. African-American, or Latino-American, or Asian-American suggests people don't want to integrate. Aussies don't do this, nor do Canadians, or even most S Africans. My London grandsons have parents born in Kenya and USA. They consider themselves English, even though they are light brown.
yeah, I've put a main comment discussing this exact point
There is an unspoken hierarchy based on ethnicity. Much of it based on the fact that people immigrated in waves from different countries. Each group was pretty much treated like crap by the groups that came before. This created a lot of ethnic/cultural pride within each community because for each group, it was them against the people who were already here and giving them a hard time.
The USA divides us. Have you seen the way they separate the latest voting for the president election? The powers that be won’t stop.
Most South Africans divide themselves by tribe and the English and Afrikaners separate themselves too.
I always specify that I have Scots-Irish and French ancestry. I'm not Scottish, Irish or French. I'm American. It just makes more sense to me to say it this way.
My great-grandfather is actually American and came to the UK in about 1890. I consider myself to be British but with American ancestry, I don't consider myself to be American.
And - you wouldn't expect to go to the USA and have people fawn over you, because you're 'American'... It's like 'so what? You're the same as the other 330M of us..'
You have American Indian roots then? That would be interesting.
The problem boils down to what you say at 1:30 "Within the country". American have this bad habit of bringing their within the country habits abroad and expect everybody to accept/adhere to them. Abroad, things might have a very different value and sensitivity. Being desrespectful of that is literally the opposite of "god forbid, try to relate to you."
Do any ever call themselves "English American"??
Dual nationals usually refer to themselves as British-American but I don’t think anyone calls themselves that based on heritage.
I've heard that the Amish refer to other Americans as "English." Some of the MAGA folk have taken to calling themselves "Anglo-Saxons," which is almost the same thing.
Its fine to say where your heritage is from, but it just rubs people the wrong way when you have someone who has never been here claim that they know the place and the culture better than you, someone who is actually from the country you are claiming to be from. Even worse when you correct them on something they've claimed and start going off about how they care more about the country and culture than anyone from there.
I think part of the reason it rubs us Scots, the Irish and Italians so badly is that we are fericely proud of our culture's, and it is that the Americans who often and loudly claim to be scottish, irish or itallian are often the most out of touch and ignorant of the place they claim to be from and love
Deftly handled, Kalyn!
I have strong feelings on the subject, and have never heard it addressed so well.
I never understood why some Americans claim to be Irish American, Italian American as if they are so ashamed to be American that they feel the need to dilute it.
Just be Americans. Full Stop.
Dear Girl Gone, why is it that I never hear Americans say they are English when its the largest demographic in the US?
British is more commonly used by Americans, because many see English as a Language not as a Nationality.........which is true but not as well.
One does not speak British, they speak English and one is not English if they are from Scotland, but even Scottish are British in sense.
I asked myself the same question. Still pondering... 😊
They do, they just dress it up as being able to trace their ancestry to the Mayflower because it's the closest thing to aristocracy they have.
Because they want to feel special, and feel like they're the victim of big bad England. Conveniently forgetting that Scots and Irish were also big colonisers and Scottish immigrants founded the KKK and most plantations in NI. But nope, it's DAE ENGLAND BAD
I have a theory that by claiming to be Scottish or Irish they think they are identifying with a repressed minority, and it's easier when there are obvious cultural synbols like tartan or the shamrock. We English don't have the same obvious identity. Can you imagine an American walking off a plane dressed as a morris dancer or wearing a bowler hat?
Last person that was American that claimed to be German I quickly shut them down. I just said 'Du bist gutt ja?' Waited. asked 'Nien?' Waited a bit more then said 'Du nicht deutsche'. (Note I learnt German at 9 years old so my spelling and diction is terrible). However they very quickly learnt they were not German. :)
As a Scot, I often get the impression that Americans expect us to be impressed or feel especially drawn to them because they have Scottish ancestry. I get that it is important to them that they had a Scottish great-grandma but if you live in Scotland so do the vast majority of people you know so, not to be mean but we really don’t care. Anyone is welcome to visit, we love showing off our country and are generally a pretty friendly bunch but having a Scottish ancestor isn’t going to get you special treatment and making too big a deal of it comes across as a bit tryhard and, ironically, very stereotypically American.
I think if they were a bit more specific and said 'my great-granny was from X' where X is a particular town or region of Scotland, then it would be more interesting, and gives you a chance of having a conversation about it. If they just say 'I'm Scottish', I'm not sure what I'm supposed to do with that information.
Maybe this is my experience but the only not special treatment but contrast in treatment I've found is Scottish hostility to Southern vs. Northern English. I'm from Yorkshire and have found a vast difference in how some Scots treat me vs. Some of my mates from the Home Counties.
American…..” hi can I get a coffee”? Britain serving them…. “Best you don’t, customers aren’t allowed behind the counter, if it is acceptable to you I will “get” the coffee as that’s my job” ……
It’s regarded as having ended on 9/11 2001. But up until that day, Irish bars in cities like NYC and Boston used to keep jars on the bars. Where patrons could demonstrate their 'Irishess' by donating to 'the cause'. - this money was then sent to Ireland to finance terrorism - and indirectly to England to finance bombing campaigns on the Mainland. Some was spent on weapons that were shipped as well.
After 9/11 this practice was quite loudly challenged by a number of people and supposedly has come to an end. The open collection part at least.
Something happened on 9 November, 3 years ago?
Its's all a matter of how far you go back in time. For instance at the end of the last ice age there were no people in Britain (or trees for that matter) which means that all British people (and trees) are immigrants.
I've heard American's say 'I'm Irish' and 'I'm Scottish' when they are referring to where their family came from originally. However I don't think that I've ever heard 'I'm English' though.
I have, a lot, but I’m on several genealogy Facebook groups.
Those that say they've English heritage always claim some Royal or famous aristocrat as an ancestor.
Nobody ever says they were descended from one of the 30,000 (or so) English who were transported as criminals to the colonies before the War of Independence.
I've had at least 3 arguments with people claiming to be 'direct descendants' of Anne Boleyn - who famously had one child - Queen Elizabeth Ist, the Virgin Queen.
That is true- I had that thought whilst watching this. Clearly being English isn't seen as anything special. 😂😂😂
I had an Irish Grandfather and a Scottish grandma and grandad who settled in England. I was born in England, and would never claim to be anything other than English, even though I have Irish and Scottish cousins.
I lived in Scotland for 3 years, but I was always the 'English relative.
I would never think to describe myself as Irish or Scottish.
Culturally, we are all so very similar anyway - no more differences that you wouldn't find between the different regions of England.
That's because of historic connotations dating back to War of Independence and the perception that the English oppressed everyone. Claiming Scottish or Irish heritage implies a connection to similarly oppressed peoples from the British motherland.
I had a ridiculous argument with an American acquaintance a few years ago who insisted on describing themselves as 'Scotch'...
Was that because they had a 40% alcohol content?
Like nails on a chalkboard.
Silly egg.
Malt or Blend?
In the north American census' and immigration and travel documents they referred to Scots as 'Scotch' so perhaps they had seen it on old documents.
i get the idea that in the usa saying you're irish/scots/italian helps build connection with other americans that share common ancestry, but that doesn't correlate with the behaviour we see in our native countries when they try to tell us they are that actual nationality and know more about our own country than we do, when they clearly don't. i kinda feel you really brushed off that example you put up from the scot, and totally missed the point of our annoyance over it.
Scottish tartan shops LOVE Americans who claim they're Scottish.😂
Of my four grandparents, 3 were English and 1 was from Yemen. The only time I think about the 25% is when people would ask where I was from. I'd say the English city and nearly every time they'd follow up with "Yeah, but where are you really from?" This was because I'd inherited some of the Yemeni colour. Can't be a proper Englishman unless you're pasty white. Got annoying real quick.
I've met a lot of Americans who say they are "Irish Catholic". I don't know anyone in Ireland who would say that.
I've never met an American who says they are "Irish Jewish" or "Irish Buddhist", or "25% Irish, 30% Jewish, 40% Buddhist and 5% Catholic"
I remember seeing another UA-cam item about this subject. A German American goes to Berlin on holiday and claims that he must "look so German" as everyone speaks to him in German 😂
I have a friend who had four Irish grandparents but she's Scottish. A work colleague was German, her husband originally Iraqi now British, but their children were adamantly Scottish. All born and bred Scots and far more Scottish than the US tourists. The only US person I accept calling himself Irish is so close as to be eligible for an Irish passport.
I love ❤️ Scotland 🏴 its such a beautiful part of the UK 🇬🇧 here filled with great areas to check out! I enjoy watching your videos, Kayln, and Happy Sunday to you!
Problem, solution and everything in between presented in a very clear and well tempered manner.
It's a joy to watch your videos Kalyn
There are many Americans who claim to be American Scottish, Irish, Italian etc but none claim to be American English!!! When the majority of the initial settlers came from England!!
If you are born in the US you're American.
Using the same concept many British can say they are Viking, Roman , or Saxon! Simply silly.
Your approach is correct 👌
You probably tell people you're American eventhough you also have a British passport 😊
Maybe we should all claim to be African 😀
TBH as a Scot, I don't blame people from not claiming English heritage 😂😂😂
Ha ha ha! I get that 😆👌
Eamonn da Valera was born in the US, and it saved his life because during WW1 it made it too diplomatically awkward to execute him for being in the Easter Rising. But he was Irish not American, he spent much of his saved life as PM or president of the Irish state.
I'm not quite sure what your point is? AFAIK he was half Irish, born in New York (thus eledgable for US citizenship) but went back to Ireland at a very very young age. I presume that he also got Irish citizenship at somepoint and I 100% don't blame him identifying as Irish since that would have been the life that he knew.
Just tell them you're a Belgian. That usually shuts them up.
They don't know where Belgium is. 🙂
🤣
so where do the "French" fries come from???
@@Mabinogion The best potato 'frites' are, definitely, to be found in Belgium. An absolute favourite of mine is moules frites, accompanied by a very cold Belgian beer. Feeling hungry now . . .
My four Paternal 1st Great Grandparents were born and raised In England, the Netherlands, Germany and Ireland respectivly.
I was born and raised in England.
Therefore I am an English Brit, with British, Dutch, German and Irish paternal ancestry.
No idea why this difference is so difficult to comprehend for Americans.
I've met at least three Americans who claim they are Irish.....all of which had never been to Ireland.
It's the side effect of this that is most annoying. Seeing Americans aggressively correcting actual natives is what sucks. Being told that you are less in touch with your heritage than the 'insert nationality here - American' is just rude and arrogant.
I'm from Scotland. I once participated in an online arguement about the architecture of medieval European castles. It was me, an Englishman, an Irishman, a Spaniard, A Frenchman and German Vs this one American who was convinced he was right.
Turned out he had never been to Europe and he based his "expert opinion" on having viewed Robin Hood Prince of Thieves on multiple occasions.
We all like to find excitement in our lives and heritage is part of it. The biggest laugh on Americans is they claim the fashionable lineage mostly in US which is Scottish and Irish when really they are the ( "nasty") English lineage more as to be English is to be the equally "nasty" British - 1776 and all that revolution.
What Americans do not realise or perhaps even understand, is that the British include Irish Scottish and Welsh along with English and the "British" person is very often a mongrel of all combinations of the British Isles! Due to hundreds of years of intermarriage between the countries of UK. An example for you, is the soon to be ex- president Biden, - he claims strongly that he is
"Irish" American when he had 1 gran Irish, when in fact his lineage is more English! Of course he was trying to get the Irish- American vote ! 😂😂
Not to mention the president elect, who goes on about his mother from Scotland - where 10% of the population signed the largest petition ever received by the Commons, to deny his entry to the UK.
@danmayberry1185 I am not a Trump supporter, but the fact is, his MOTHER was Scottish, so there is a strong lineage.
Irish are not classes as British.
Britain is the island that consists of England, Scotland and Wales.
Ireland was part of the United Kingdom from 1801 to 1921, but it was never a part of Britain.
@@bubba842 Not quite right, the people of Northern Ireland want to be known as British, so it's clarified as "the British Isles and Northern Ireland"
I always found it a bit sinister when he banged on about being Irish - especially after Obama was put through the mill to prove he was adequately American. I get that it's politics, and appealing to the "Irish American" vote makes sense, but it is also popular with the racists.
Perhaps more problematic were his regular 'I'm Irish' reminders when there were dealings with the UK Government, and how he knew everything he needed to know about the UK government based on what his Irish Grandfather told him. Most of us had grandparents who fought in against Germany, but it would be a massive failure of diplomacy to bring that up ahead of a meeting with Angela Merkel. Can you imagine the scandal if one of our PMs made a passive aggressive reference to the Japanese treatment of prisoners of war ahead of a G8 meeting?
Whilst it's weird to not identify yourself as American when you're abroad (we can tell!), I understand the want to look into your ancestry and acknowledge it. What really, REALLY grates is the Americans who assume they know more about the country and culture they "identify" with than people from there when they've never been and never looked into it. The presumption that they know better because someone has told them they're 6% (insert country here) is so arrogant!
Or they saw a Hollywood film based on something historical that happened in the country they're identifying with and claim it as gospel truth. Completely missing that Hollywood took an 'artistic licence' approach to the film changing c90% of the actual events to make it "more interesting" or "more appealing" to a US audience... Then there's the ones who read a fictional book and decide the story is a factual account of what happened.
I do find that some Americans (not all!) like to correct people of the country they're visiting/discussing on the history of that person's country because they learnt X at school/read it in a book (often fiction)/saw a film about it so they know better...
What annoys me about Americans is those Americans who pretend their Irish because their great, great, great grandfather is from there and so decide to half joking half seriously take a dislike against English people despite most English people having atleast one Irish grandparent or great grandparent and DNA wise are a lot more Irish than them. You dont have the same issue with Australians, they're just happy being Australian.
Americans think that the USA isn’t a colonial empire
To me this is just weird....
Claiming to belong to a country you've never been to is just bizarre - and possibly offensive to people who are of that nationality
Saying that is offensive to members of all peoples who have suffered dispersal and clearance atr0c1t1es. Jews, Palestinians, Chagossians, many Native American peoples in the US, and of course Scots and Irish.
If the connection is as close as a parent, you can have a lot of practical ties of family life to the country.
My father is Welsh, but I was born in and grew up in England. I wouldn't even dream of telling a Welsh person that I was 'Welsh'. One set of my great grandparents were Dutch. Am I Dutch? English-Dutch? Dutch-British? Absolutely not!
That's just silly.
Your affinity was to England, you did not feel Wales the principal tie in your background. By aspects of character that fit their affinities or by how their life goes, someone else with exactly the same family tree as you can find Wales the dominant bond and be Welsh.
I was born in South Africa and moved to the uk when I was 6 ish, I wouldn’t immediately tell someone I’m South African, I’m British first and if they ask for more detail I’d say I was born in South Africa.
Then there are Americans who are identifying with a country their parents have never been to. It sounds a bit weird considering how much Americans love America.
I used to play in an Irish punk rock band, we were a punk band, from Ireland. Whenever we played in the states people assumed we were Americans who were going to play Dropkick Murphy's style Oirish music. In this context they took "Irish" to mean culturally Irish, rather than actually from Ireland. When people realised that the band was actually from Ireland, they all told us they were Irish too (despite none of them ever actually having been there). It was all very silly, but I didn't find it annoying, people were nice.
Side note, it does seem like if they're 1/16th Irish or Italian, that's what they identify as, Spanish, German, British, Polish, French, Dutch, etc doesn't seem to be considered cool for some reason.
There does seem to be an obsession with descent. I see often on Wikipedia with biographies of celebs/actors/musicians that there's a sentence in the form of "X is of Scottish, Irish, and Spanish heritage" when it has little to no bearing on their career or beliefs. And can they truly claim they're Scottish without being able to say "There's been a murder" or declaring hatred of the English?
This is something that made me chuckle a few years ago. I am more than half Irish by ancestry. My father is (Northern) Irish, he was born in Belfast, he has an Irish accent, his parents were from both the North and South of the country. My mother is also a quarter Irish. I even lived for a year in Antrim as a child.
I was speaking to a Canadian at work. He had some Irish ancestry (I think his great grandparent was Irish or something). For some reason he was convinced that he was more Irish than I am because "Belfast isn't in Ireland".
Sigh. I just nodded politely and changed the subject.
Do I consider myself Irish? Not really. I was born in England and for the most part have lived here all my life.
An American in YT comments yesterday was ridiculing me because I said Northern Ireland had St Patrick's Day as a Bank Holiday - and he believes they're not Irish. And that Ireland only started celebrating St Patrick's Day after the US did, in the 1990s. _Sigh..._
There are of course plenty of people in Belfast who don't think it is in Ireland, but I think they would understand that people who describe themselves as Irish would generally be of the opinion that Belfast is in Ireland.
@@katrinabryce Politically, yes. My own family who live there are Unionists and are quick to point out that NI is in the UK, and rightly so. But I don't think any of them would try to argue that NI isn't part of the island of Ireland - I had the daft arguments as a kid that the Irish are better than the English etc so it was clear their opinion on that score!
@@katrinabryce They think it is not in the ROI, but the UK - but most, in my experience, don't think of themselves as other than Irish.
The reason we don’t understand naming your ancestors home origin, is that we would only really go back one generation so I’m English/Irish since my father is from England and my mother from Ireland, we don’t consider our selves linked to our grandparents country in the same way we are linked to our parents not to say we don’t appreciate where they are from.
Watching 'Irish' Americans run into Irish Twitter and claim to be more Irish is deeply funny
'Tubers like GeorgeM probably wouldn't have a channel without those guys!
For an American to say I'm Scottish when his/her parents aren't from there just descendants of Scots, a bit like me, English saying I'm Saxon, Norse or Norman, they are there somewhere. My name is actually of old Norse origin.
Although the US is a melting pot many Americans assume that European nations are somehow homogenous and frozen in amber from when their ancestors left, but before and since many people have moved to and from various European countries from all around the world. My ancestors (including very recently) are from Jamaica, so ultimately West Africa (predominantly Ghana, Nigeria and Mali for me), Scotland, England, Norway, Italy and Finland - but I’m just British and wouldn’t think of calling myself anything else. So there’s definitely a lot more nuance to it all.
@@vaudevillian7 I don't think that's purely a US trait, but something that is common to a lot of immigrant populations. For example, British of Indian descent may cling to customs and mores passed down from the immigrating person while Indian society has moved on.
English, Scottish, Welsh and Irish are also ethnicities as well as nationalities. Therefore you can use them in both scenarios to describe yourself. Culturally each country is quite distinctive and so many people identify specifically to where they live.
But most Americans are mixed.
Okay, so an America tells me he is Scottish. That's annoying, even if he tells me he has Scottish heritage... just as annoying. Also, I'm not interested in that. What I might be interested in is him being American. Scotland is half an hour up the road, America is half a world away... THAT is interesting. So, just save telling people you are Scottish for your American friends... please.
This makes sense.
Unless your 'Scottishness' brings some interest to the table (conversation).
A family recipe for Haggis, maybe.
A family design for a Haggis Trap, you have built, maybe brought here to test out.🤔🤔😁😁
Chances are unless both of their parents were born and bred in Scotland that they're not fully descended from Scottish stock anyway. I've never heard an American say they're Scottish anyway, or Irish, or Italian, and I've met quite a lot. They might say Italian American or Irish American, but either way what they're really doing is getting to create a bond between you and them based on something you might have in common to continue the conversation. I don't think they're going to be thinking what will be most interesting to you, only very self centered and egotistical even thinks that they should.
I love that episode of The Sopranos where they visit Italy and the storyline for Paulie Walnuts trying to tell disinterested locals about his local heritage is v funny ..
I visited America and I met a guy who ran an Irish themed pub, he said he was Irish, I asked him where Ireland he was born, he said he had never ever been to Ireland, it's utterly bizarre.
He was American born and bred, and a liar.
You have not mentioned his parents and if there were practical ties of family life to Ireland through them. If you don't know that was not the case, its rac1st to say liar
@@conscienceaginBlackadder I did did ask him and he said it was his great grand parents who came from there, but the fact remains, he was not from Ireland nor had he ever visited Ireland, he was born and bred in America, calling himself Irish was a lie, even if his parents came from Ireland, it would still be lie.
He had never ever even visited any other country, all he knew was America.
@Dubjaxfilms It was not a lie for Eamonn da Valera and James Connolly, both diaspora-born names from the Irish independence time, before they visited Ireland for their first time. Da Valera was born in the US, Connolly in Scotland.
@@conscienceaginBlackadder Yeah, but they lived there.
The guy I met had not even been there.
BTY, I was at DaValera's state funeral in Dublin, which is where I was born.
@@Dubjaxfilms So I'm referring to them in the early part of their lives before they lived there or had been there. Connolly in particular grew up in Edinburgh and made his own adult choice to relocate to Ireland because he already identified it as home.
I am Scottish, live in Scotland but travel a lot to the US. I personally like Americans who tell me they are part Scottish. It’s not an issue and am happy they identify with Scotland. Have had many nice conversations with American Scots and others. We are better together than apart.
0:50 the argument that "in America we say im Scottish as shorthand for having Scottish ancestry, so people in Scotland should just know that and accommodate it" is super arrogant in its own right. Here in Europe if we say "I'm Scottish" or "I'm Italian" the only thing that means is that you either live in, or were born in, that country. When an American comes here as an outsider the onus is on them to adapt to the culture they are visiting. Not every single person in that country to accommodate their American cultural and linguistic baggage. Yes, it's good to meet eachother on middle ground where possible, but you as the visitor are the one who chose to start this cultural exchange. The random Scottish person you meet while in Scotland didn't. So when you tell them you, a born and bred American, are Scottish then it's not their fault if they can't be bothered to untangle the meaning and just get confused or upset instead. Especially for countries like Scotland and Ireland, who have a long history of having their culture both oppressed and appropriated by a more powerful country. That's likely to stir up some very deep feelings. And it's not up to them to work around those feelings. If you upset a local by saying something unwittingly irritating, that's on you to work out
Wrong and arrogant. A school bully rac1st attitude does not speak for everyone in Europe. It does not speak for
James Connolly - Irish, born in Scotland.
Lord Kelvin the physicist, and Tommy Sheppard (SNP figure) - Scottish, born in Ireland.
Joe Strummer - Scottish, born in Turkey.
Eric Liddell (Chariots of Fire athlete) + Rory Stewart - Scottish, born in China.
Alexander McCall Smith - Scottish, born in Matabeleland, Zimbabwe.
Ian Hamilton Finlay (artist/sculptor) - Scottish, born in the Bahamas.
Bonar Law - Scottish, born in Canada.
Kiefer Sutherland, Canadian, born in England.
Tony Blair - English, born in Scotland.
Robert the Bruce, the Queen Mother, Tilda Swinton, Rod Stewart, Ian Fleming, John Prebble (historian), Robert Cunninghame Graham (early socialist), Brigit Forsyth (actress), PMs William Gladstone, Alec Douglas-Home, Lord Rosebery (Archibald Primrose), and Scottish nationalists Lesley Riddoch, Angus Robertson, Craig Murray, Mike Russell, Iain Macwhirter - Scottish, born in England.
I think Europeans tend to not do that so much because it would have been exhausting to keep track. I live in Vienna and if you go back two or three generations literally everybody has a family member with migration background. On my mother's side my great grandparents are from Bohemia and Moravia, on my father's side my grandmother was born in Serbia. I don't feel that I'm Chech or Serbian. I'm Austrian.
It’s cultural. I have encountered this down here from Americans and I find it common. Maybe the American obsession with race/origin compared to other nations is only that Americans are much more vocal about it. By comparison many Australians as a whole while aware of family history seem much less concerned with it or perhaps it’s simply less vocal. What many do find strange is the attitude by some Americans that American society and culture is an improvement on the rest of humanity. That upsets some and alienates many outside the U.S.
Interestingly when I talk about my own nationality and heritage it always as an Australian never as an Australian of Serb-Scot background. My parents immigrated here in the 1940’s/1950’s. My mum was Scottish and was very proud of her heritage and ancestors but was very understated about it, unless someone said she was English then she was quick to correct them. My father was Serbian and was proud of his origins too but was again quite understated about it.
I was working in a London primary school 20 years ago when a new child came into the school. She was born in NYC, as were her parents, who came here to work. She was 6 years old and very friendly and confident. She introduced herself as being half Scottish, half Irish and half Polish!!!
I was in a my local. An American couple come in. He's telling me he's the clan chief of clan McEever. He asked me if I had attended a kirking of the tartan? I said I hadn't heard of it, he laughed said how could I be Scottish then.
I goes home, embarrassed by this American. Looks up kirking of the tartan, it was invented ten years ago by Americans for tartan week. Then I check Clan McEever cos despite being a 52 year old scot, I've never heard the name. It was invented 30 fricking years ago.
Our culture is being destroyed by idiots like clan chief McEever! 🏴🏴🏴🏴
Regarding food / culture and Americans identifying as Italian, Irish, etc.
One of the weirdness about this I’ve seen is that the countries in Europe has moved on, changed, modernised.
But Irish American, German Americans, etc being “Irish” or “German” but it’s more the culture of their great grandparents. Stuck in the past.
Being Irish in America means something very different than being Irish in Ireland.
Being Irish in America (in my experience), is being fairly conservative, very religious, often right-leaning…
The Americans I’ve met proudly being “Irish” with “Irish values” would be slightly shocked to be in Ireland.
Well, we can all agree Guinness is the best though 😂
It’s perfectly OK to for an American to say to another “I’m Scottish“ as a short form from I’m of Scottish ancestry. NOT OK to say that to a Scot (or to any other Brit for that matter). That’s not what the term means here.
Everyone who claims that only one meaning, their meaning, of a national term applies anywhere is arrogating all the politically diverse folks around them + making assumptions