❗ MAKE SURE TO WATCH MY UPDATED VIDEO ON THIS TOPIC BELOW 📺 ua-cam.com/video/9118Hw8wZHA/v-deo.html UPDATE: Since I made this video Televes released an antenna combiner linked below that will not negatively impact reception: amzn.to/3zpj2XC
Sorry placed answer separate. Both reception problems just can only get channel 12 in bedroom which is 12.1,12.2,12.3,12.4,12.5,12.6. Living Room receives that & 5 different channels plus the extras for all the channels without turning antenna so no there is no reception problem has to be in house.
@@lisaa1134 Try using a powered splitter. If that doesn't work you are free to sign up for a consultation with me at the link below: antennamanpa.com/antenna-recommendations.html
There is a good way to combine different antennas without causing any interference, hook up each antenna to it's own HDHOMERUN device. Many smart TVs now have the HDHOMERUN app.
Antenna Man, I've watched several of your videos and just realized that there are no Um's or Ah's, you must know your stuff and prepare your dialog in advance, well done sir!
Hey Antenna Man love your reviews i’ve been getting over the air service since 2006 witch includes the conversion from analog to digital. Two years ago I started losing two stations.... I’m in 05356 at an altitude of 2000’ and pick up stations from Albany N.Y. my antenna faces south west I pick up NBC Fox WGBY and CBS but it constantly pixelates and drops out.... any suggestions. I have a Winegard 8700u and a Titan 7777 Pre-amp.
There is some good editing involved, but his delivery is good too. Short, concise, to the point, and a little bit of dry humor injected but not over the top. Thanks Antenna Man!
👍💯👍Dude you the man. My grandfather was trying to hook up two different antennas and he wasn't getting all the channels he wanted and now I can let him know why. I appreciate your insight and advice. Thank's for the information because I didn't know either what he was doing wrong. You have become my go to guy for everything about this subject so please keep up the AWESOME job and I will keep watching and sharing your video's with as many people as I possibly can and I wanted let you know you are really helpful and I hope you will continue to help people like us out.
Two network TV tuners (ie: Hdhomerun), each one connecting to a different antenna, which will be facing a different directions. This way all device on your network gets all channels.
You are brilliant sir! Your solution is definitely another (albeit slightly more costly) solution. I’ve got one (hdhomerun dms 10631cca) and have it running thru my Plex server. Great little device!
I just installed and am using a Winegard CC-7870 Antenna Coupler I bought on Amazon. Its doing a great job of interfacing my Clearstream 2V antenna facing northwest (that I am using for UHF channels in my area), and a homemade VHF Single Dipole antenna facing southeast tuned for channel 11 (28.1 inches in length, other VHF channels would benefit from their own calculated length). FULL DISCLOSER: The two antennas are shielded from each other and their signal direction by a distance of about 30 feet by using the house itself to isolate them, and then each antenna has a long run of RG6 Coax to the inside of the house where I am using the Winegard Combiner. Using a signal strength meter I have only noticed a 2-4% loss using this device, well tolerated for what its doing for me. Thank you Antenna Man for the wonderful and informative videos you have made. They have really helped us out here trying to cut the cord.
I am successfully combining signals from two antennas mounted in my attic. I am about 15 miles from one set of broadcast towers and 35 from another cluster. I believe that there is a key point to maximize the chance for getting a good result: Try to have the two antennas pointed in directions 90 degrees apart. This puts the main "beam" of one antenna in the "null" of the other. I am fortunate that in my situation that arrangement matches the compass directions of the two transmit antenna clusters.
@@dennisgarber I would expect the results to depend very much on the actual side lobes of the two antennas being combined. My pair of antennas happen to work well (and have for 26 years now). I oriented each antenna in isolation for "their" set of channels before combining them, so I suppose that might be a good practice.
I really hear you on that one. I had to move my antenna around five times until I finally found the sweet spot. That receives about 32 channels clearly all day.
Antenna Man, you have an amazing and uncanny ability to convey realistic, practical, and just plain common-sense information about HDTV reception via antennas. A potential "cut-the-cable" devotee should be required to watch a few of your videos so (s)he would understand that you cannot pick up signals that just aren't there, no matter where you put an antenna or how much amplification you use. Well done! Please keep up the fine work.
Just want to thank you because this video inspired me into purchasing the 4max when I saw this video. Your videos have been very informative in helping one do there research and providing multiple options to think about. I have had the 4max since December. The only problem is I still haven’t bought a ladder long enough to get to my roof. So it been hooked up in the living room. Thanks again
Thanks for checking in. I'm glad my videos helped you get better reception. Feel free to give a contribution at the link below as I spend A LOT of time making the videos and responding to these comments: antennamanpa.com/support.html
The way to do it is with microwave filters it’s what I do at a large hospital. I have two antennas. One gets the majority of channels, the other gets the one channel that’s in a different direction. Each channel gets it own microwave filter for the actual RF frequency of the station then I combine them with a RF splitter and send it to a amp for distribution. The problem is it’s not practical for the home owner to do this because of cost. Love your channel you are right on the money with your information.
Very good about explaining the ghosts effect. I combine two antennas and I received extra channels. ( using vertical and horizontal antenna) You mention about grounding. I completely ground everything and I gained a total of 13 extra channels. Given me a total of 43 channels. But I need to add that my antennas are on top of my 108 foot Tower that I used for my amateur radio. Thank you for keeping it real Rev Damon A Conn
I am a extra class amateur radio operator and I have a pair of 2 meter Yagi antennas phased together on a pole with a rotator. that work exceptionally well. At first after i built these antennas, both identical, they would not load up properly at all. Then an old timer ham told me to turn the top one bottom side up . He said that one antenna was cancelling the other out. I did as I was told and they load perfectly and have worked for twenty years. I must add that I was using these antennas for transmitting so it might not make a difference for receiving.
You can combine antennas, different metro areas would have "area specials" where the antennas were configured properly with each other. One was Tampa Bay Special for instance for Tampa, since WTSP used to be located in Holiday, FL, while the rest are in Riverview, so WTSP got its own antenna.
Back in the 70's I used to install antennas and we used what was called and area special which consisted of 4 antennas connected in a particular order using 300 ohm twin lead, that was supplied with the antennas, that were pre-cut to specific lengths. These antennas allowed every TV in the house to receive any channel and no rotor required. They worked great. If I recall they were made by Winegard.
When you receive plenty of Good Staions You do what the DEVO song says Whip it And Whip It Good But when you don't receive Any good station and your Pictures pixaleats Then you do what QUEEN sings Another One Bites The Dust Both songs are from 1980 The Analog years !
Thx Tyler! This is the most understandable, concise, and useful post I have seen on the subject. Rock on dude, you are a knowledgeable educator. Peace!
love this channel. I've had a combo roof antenna for a few years getting about 30 channels. This guy is gonna help me maximize the other towers nearby.
All my signals come from the "Towers" on top of South Mountain in Phoenix! 80 channels, some dupes but hard to beat. I use 1 of those figure 8 outdoor antennas.👍
I have two antennas pointed in different directions, 1 towards my local tower. The other is pointed towards a different country picking up their channels. I have no cross channel interference. I did make sure the cables going into the combiner were roughly the same length
I have a Lava HD 8008 in the attic and it does great. I used their splitter and every TV in the house gets a great signal. It comes out of the box multi-directional.
@2.00 - the ghosting picture example. The shock of watching an American antenna man 10,000 miles away talking about his local market and seeing a picture of a Melbourne, Australia news reader (Brian Henderson) and the even freakier scenario is that the TV studio is right next door to my apartment less than 500 feet away. Freaky man. Informative video by the way which is why I’m here.
I noticed that combining two antennas, you used different antennas with different cable lengths. I have had success using two of the same type of antennas (GE attic antennas) with the same length cable, in the same spot in the attic, pointed in different directions. Thanks for the videos.
This claim that matching identical antenna, identical cables, identical spots, and different directions, is something that needs to be tested like myth busters! Not only as to whether it works, but if any one or 2 of the 3 variables make a huge or small difference. I just bought a $79 Televes 560483 It worked great to combine a large attic antenna with an outside art piece antenna pointing 30 degrees apart. The televes balanced the signals and added them. No evidence of multipath. So, naturally, I am wondering if I wasted money. Most likely in my case I did not, because I was forced to use 2 antenna. I am also wondering if 30 degrees is not enough to create multipath or I got lucky, or if the tuners I tested or televes eliminated the multipath.
What would happen if you pointed identical antennas at the same tower and joined them with a combiner would the signal go up or would that cause issue. Gonna be an attic setup
If you have the right gear you can use an RF signal generator and a scope to precisely adjust the length of the two coax feeds to perfectly overlap the two signals. This is a major pain and won't help for reflection issues. i.e. if the multipath is somewhat unstable. Good chance you'll end up with a pile of extra coax on one of the feeds. Not the only way, but one way.
4:37 This is awesome solution for RV (or home) as you can use omni ant but have option to pop up or second directional as necessary. Also you can mount 2 cheap or DIY antennas in different directions and switch easy by indoor switch. ❤️ Great channel. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. 👍👍👍
I really like this channel, great videos! I think there maybe another way to incorporate 2 or more antenna. With a pc install multiple tv tuner cards, hook one tv tuner card to a beam pointed at one market and have it scan the channels it can get and with another hooked to another antenna pointed at another market.
All of my in market channels are UHF, but there are some out of market channels I would love to have that are high VHF. Glad there's a straight forward solution to this by using a VHF/UHF combiner. Also, that Stellar labs high VHF antenna model you reviewed seems like it will do the trick for tramsnitters about 50 miles away with no mountains in between.
Thank you for information. I have two antennas facing opposite directions. One toward Santa Barbara (west) local, the other toward L.A. (east) distance. Both have preamps. I have the splitter mentioned to switch between antennas. Only glitch is the TV set must be auto programmed for each antenna. Can't simply flip the antenna switch and expect the former programming to work. I'm still experimenting which is kind of fun. I'm 76 years old and when I was a young teen, my Dad and I loved to mess with crystal sets and antennas. BTW my antenna mount is about 8 feet above the roof line and I think I better run a guy wire as it's kind of shaky. Also couldn't drill through (tough mount) where they overlap to install a screw, so I spliced them together with one of the antenna mounts. Call it semi-stable.
You might benefit from this video. With the DTV box I use you can manually add channels so you wouldn't have to run rescans when changing direction. ua-cam.com/video/xgIqk8Py3Fc/v-deo.html
Only if you can get the phase of the two exactly right. Lots of coax length tweaking. They may still sell variable delays for this purpose which allow for fraction of a picosecond delay changes. More or less a trombone type device inside a sealed can which changes the length of the signal path via a mechanical adjustment. Not cheap.
"Maybe they'll be some...PBS station that you don't really watch and it doesn't really matter"! There you go again, knocking the only network that some of us
If you are going to use a "splitter backwards" you have to make sure: 1st, that the lengths of cable between the antenna and the splitter are exactly the same. 2nd, space the antennas a few feet apart so that they don't interfere with each other, 3rd, Use the same model antenna before combing..... Otherwise, you are absolutely certain to have ghosting or multipath issues. 📶
When combining 2 antennas (or any RF source for that matter) in the same frequency band with a simple RF combiner/splitter you have to make sure that both input signals have more or less the same Amplitude levels, otherwise the sideband of RF carriers on the stronger input will end up overlapping the adjacent RF carriers on the weaker input sinal. Try attenuating the stronger signal to the same amplitude level of the weaker signal before combining both. The resulting/combined signal can then be amplified
@@Pidalin That's correct. If you want to combine specific channels from antenna A with other specific channels on antena B, you should filter-out the unwanted/duplicate channels on both antenas (meaning, on Antenna A you should filter-out the channels that are already being picked up fine by Antenna B, and vice versa) - otherwise you will get multipath interference on the combined RF coaxial
@@miguelangeloconceicao738 It worked for me for some time when I was catching one multiplex with vertical polarization and rest of programs with standard horizontal polarization, when you have antenna in vertical polarization and there is only one transmitter with such polarization around, then you can just connect antennas together, horizontaly polarized signal is very weak on verticaly oriented antenna. We have transmitters with vertical polarisation only in two biggest cities which is like 200 km from each other so there is no interference. I heard that Slovaks changed all their transmitters to vertical polarisation for some reason, I guess such little country has problem with interferences from other countries, so that could be solution. We also have (here in Czechia) some problems with Polish transmitters, they have 100 kW transmitters literally on our border which is not kind from them, but it's good for people who like to catch foreign TV. Unfortunately Germans and Austrians made all transmitters very directional when they changed to DVB-T2 so catching their TV is almost imposibble now, but it solved interferences from their channels.
@@Pidalin question: two identical antennas, positioned one over the other on the same mast, pointing in the sane direction. if these signals are merged with a regular splitter, would it still have the 360 reception problem?
We appreciate the effort you put into your productions; keep up the great work Tyler. Regarding combining antennas. In addition to having the cables from each antenna exactly the same length, you need to make sure it is the exact same brand because the "velocity factor" varies from brand to brand. Just make up your cables from the same roll. '73 Bob
Thanks! As soon as I found your channel, I subscribed & started binging! You've got a *_ton_* of great info here. My wife & I have 2 phones, 3 computers, 2 smart TVs, & a dumb one. We've got cable & internet, but I can't actually get the one channel I watch, unless I hook up an antenna to the dumb flat-screen! With all the different services offered on various platforms, it's a confusing mess. Thanks for clearing up a lot of it. tavi.
I have 2 91xg's 90 degrees apart 4' separation 30' up same length coax combined with a $4 ideal splitter pick up Cleveland, Akron and Pittsburgh stations no problems with reception.
you help me out alot thanks so much ; i had a old 360 could not get much local i watch your channel and bought the clear stream double and now get 4 markets now again thanks
I'm glad my videos helped you get better reception. Feel free to give a contribution at the link below as I spend A LOT of time making the videos and responding to these comments: antennamanpa.com/support.html
The author gives some good info, but I would like to clarify a few things. Regardless of whether the signal is digital or analog, ghosting is caused by the reception of two out-of-phase signals. If a signal reflects off of a nearby tree, for example, this reflected signal will in turn recombine with the signal that reached the antenna by line of sight when it arrives at the antenna. The reflected signal has a longer path to travel, hence the out of phase reception. In the author's example, he mentions the two antennas being at right angles from each other, and if he has nearby trees or buildings, it is entirely plausible that this caused the out of phase condition. In any case, it is NOT the mere fact that two antennas are combined that is causing the problem, as long as they are equidistant from the station (read: mounted on a common mast). The same problem would be created if you use two different lengths of cable from the two antennas to the combiner. Combiners/splitters are lossy things, and you will lose at least HALF your signal power using them. The better choice (if you can find one) is a two-input signal amplifier. I have had great success combining a Stealth Hawk antenna with no reflector (receives on both broad faces - google it) for the direction(s) with nearer/stronger stations, and on the same mast, but 90 degrees rotated, a Gray Hoverman with no reflector (receives on both broad faces - google it) for the more distant/weaker stations. These are both designs available on the web to make your own antenna. I use a combiner with equal length feeder cables for now; but I am looking for a two input amplifier (I may build my own). BTW, who wants to waste time with an antenna rotation drive?
Not all have luck with multiple dipoles, although it's worth a try. I happened to luck out: built a Gray-Hoverman antenna with no reflector. So I pull in channels from both Needham and Springfield, opposite directions --> same antenna. This is possible only because digital broadcasts have error-correction. 13 years ago my setup would not have worked out. Going to be interesting through the repack of course, since the two markets are in repack phases 4 and 8. I may lose some channels, and maybe gain one or two. I'll definitely lose the channel moving to low-VHF.
I take it you are in Massachusetts. I am getting ready to set up a second antenna, a CM 3020 to face eastward to Needham/Wellesley. I have a Mohu Leaf indoor/outdoor aimed toward Hartford, CT area. I am undecided about how to combine the antennas.
Have you set up the Channel Master yet? You might haphazardly pull in Hartford, Springfield etc. off-axis. Usually it doesn't work, but you may be surprised. I'm high on a hill in metropolitan Sturbridge. Most everything comes in well again, but WCVB didn't come back. They used to be my second-strongest signal after channel 2.
Quite a few months later, I got a channel master 4221 and rebuilt the damaged elements. Though it's a 4-bay UHF design, the high-VHF reception is strangely good. I even pick up WVIT which I'm not supposed to get at all.
I have two UHF only antennas pointed about 100º apart plus a long range VHF only antenna pointing about 180º from one of the UHF antennas. Each channel I pick up is a different frequency, so no multichannel interference for me. I combine all three antennas with a Televes three antenna combiner that comes with a two port power inserter/distribution amplifier. The cool thing about the Televes combiner is that you can adjust the gain for each antenna separately. That comes in handy because one of the UHF antennas has a long cable run before it gets to the combiner. This antenna has a Channel Master pre-amp. I dial down the gain on the combiner for this antenna so as not to over amplify the signal going to the TV. Finally I use quad shielded RG6 cable to maximize signal transmission and minimize interference. This presents a slight problem with the combiner as it is not designed for the extra thickness of quad cable. However, it was fairly easy to modify the the way the quad cable is fed into the combiner. Over all, I am very happy with the way this system works.
@@dennisgarberYes. As of last summer (2023) , I was able to pick up adequate signal from Vancouver BC (100 miles) on the UHF antennas, and Seattle (60 miles) on the VHF antenna. My modifications to accommodate the quad coax cable was to replace the stock clamps with large fender washers, which I filed to fit the space for the cable attachments. The newest Televes combiner has female F connector points. My modifications are not nesessary for this newest version.
Grew up in Eden, Wi. Half way between Milwaukee and Green Bay, Wisconsin. SE corner. My Dad put up 40 ft tower, in cement, when we built home. Channel Masters best rotor, VHF fringe ant. Also separate UHF, parabolic, pointed, opposite, And we got both cities crystal clear in 70s. My Dad worked At les toll tv, Fond du lac, Wisconsin. Neighbors were impressed, able to get, 13 total channels! Dad sold a lot, of identical systems. Original rotor, from channel master, made it in till 1983! Tower erected 1970! Point is, Channel Master, made great equipment, back then. I wish some things haven't changed!
In the NTSC days I would put tunable traps on antennas as each station was a different strength and direction. I took the local station which was blasting away from 6 miles away took an antenna tuned to its wavelength pointed directly at it and then attenuated it by 100db it was a perfect signal as it also knocked down the noise by 100db. The other channels were all filtered and levelled. Nowadays with the ATSC system ghosting is not that big of an issue. I know a fellow living in an apartment building and his balcony faced the wrong way to point an antenna in the direction to get his favorite station. He managed to get the signal by pointing antenna at another building an caught a reflection. ATSC aeems immune to ghosting.
Please a demonstration of two antennas connected to a RF switch. I tried connecting two antennas and had the multipath problems. I use a splitter/combiner. I like the idea of using the switch. Most of my channels come from Raleigh NC, but the closest PBS channel is from Lumberton NC.
I thank you for your videos. Before i found your channel. I purchased that directional that you dont recommend. But i have it outside. Just above my roofline. Scanned and got 29 channels.
I have had two of those it does work good I get 59 channels but the cable connection at the base broke and the rotator and the other one the cable connection broke off on the amplifier box 🤦
Ghosting in the analog days was due to signal echo mostly because each signal arrived with a slight time delay. To be able to use both antennas, you need to have both antennas on the same pole with both antennas connected to the same plexer by 2 cable of the same lentgh this way, even though the antennas not facing the right direction stil get the signal, it is transported down the cable at the same time and speed as the other antenna.
Thanks, actually knew most of what you stated. Been messing with antennas over 50 years. It’s odd that after all that time that reception still works pretty much the same
My solution involved separate antenna cables,one to the tv antenna input the other to a hdmi tv tuner (mediasonic) to the hdmi input of the tv.Toggle on the remote input button to switch antennas.Remote convenience and eliminating some of the problems like rescanning ,filters,,multi path.abs switch wear and the separate tuner might improve the reception signal.
I live in a weak zone for reception. I'm very close to the Florida coast. I think if I lived more inland, my reception would probably be better. Been toying with ideas on trying to boost my signal.
In the old days we had "channel traps" which were just filters for specific channels. We had one antenna for channel 4 going through a channel 4 trap, an antenna for channel 6 going through a channel 6 trap, and a third antenna for the rest of the channels, These were combined on the antenna and then went down through the old 300 ohm twin lead to our television. *Everyone* in our area had multiple antennas on their roofs. There was simply no other way to get all of the channels except using a rotor which I don't recall anyone using.
Back 10 -15 years ago you could buy those traps from ChannelMaster, they were called JoinTenna. But they've replaced that product like now with a new "JoinTenna" that apparently does the notching automagically. I would consider this a 4th option.
A bi-directional broadband splitter can be used to combine the received signal from two antennas with the use of quality custom notch filters between each antenna and the splitter. We use them in the amateur radio and scanner world all the time for frequency isolation. You can purchase one or make one yourself. The frequency formulas can be found on the web.
Great video. Very informative. Yes, I know the mountain you are facing to the south. I live in Steel City, just a few miles from you. My friend in Bethlehem Township erected a figure 8 type outside antenna and he gets 54 channels, including 3, 6 and 10. No more cable bill. Barry
I am also a Bethlehem Township guy. Picking up 63 channels with a roof mounted unit. Targeting azimuth of 174 which works well but I am not picking up the Scranton channels as well. Was hoping I could just mount a second antenna
Thanks you for the informative video. I've yet to have any luck combining Two TV antennas. Someone at Channel Masters recently told me having the exact length of coax going to each antenna is important.
In there parts multipath interference is a common problem. In the old days I'd use an adjustable attenuator to eliminate ghosting. I suppose it might be interesting to try one here to see if it helps.
In spent hours tweaking the antenna direction to completely block out that religious channel, heaven forbid it spook the devil outta me! Thanks Antenna Man for the tips and great information!
Great vid, very informative. What if you have 2 markets in opposite directions and you use highly directional antennas, could that work to cut-out multipath? Is there any way to shield an antenna to make it even more directional, i.e. antenna blinders? maybe faraday shielding? Let's assume they both have vhf/uhf so first option is not possible.
I've seen remote-controlled A-B switches on various shopping sites; I expect to try one out. You could also aim the attic or outdoor antenna for the direction of the weakest stations and have a hand A-B switch and a bow-tie aimed in the direction of the strongest ones near each set. The idea would be a phased array that automatically selects the strongest direction for each channel and puts them all on the wire; I would think something like that would be a necessity for a large building with lots of users dependent on one antenna system.
That's fine when you are watching real time tv. Your antenna DVR will not be able to switch from a to b when it's recording shows when you are away from home or sleeping.
Another option based on option #3 (the video switcher solution). Buy two HDHomeRuns or Tablos and run them from two seperate antennas. If you combine this with Plex Media Server you can choose between the two antennas and also have it available to multiple TV sets. This of course is the most expensive option since you will need a streaming box (Roku, AppleTV, nVidia Shield etc) at every TV and the associated app. You will also need two antennas, two runs of coaxial cable, two grounding blocks, two HDHomeRuns or Tablos etc. Next option if you dont want to use a Tablo or HDHomeRun. Two antennas, two amplified distribution amps and switchers at each TV. The only main disadvantage is that you have to do a rescan. This is where the HDHomeRun or Tablo idea would be better. Boom no longer any concern with multi-path interferrance.
YKW? You might also be able to use two separate tuners (converter boxes) and be able to have one for one direction, and the other for the other direction!
Thanks for your explanations, I have watched several of videos, and you explain everything related to antennas very clear. just one question how do I ground and outside antenna or the best way to do it, thanks,
@@AntennaMan I just added an antenna to our conventional RV antenna with a Walmart splitter. Antenna I mounted high in a tree took over with 8 digital channels, I lost 20 digital channels the RV antenna was picking up. The 8 channels are different than the 20 channels. RV antenna is directional and can be rotated 365 degrees. No difference. Any suggestions.
I wish you would do a video on the antennas Direct 8 element bowtie antenna. It can be aimed in 2 directions. They have one on Amazon and you can buy an additional VHF add on for it as well. I have stations in 2 directions going into an HDHOMERUN Quatro. It would be nice to be able to get both.
The hdhomerun works great by taking antenna signal and converting it for your router to broadcast the signal through out the house on multiple devices.
Another option would be to use two antennas to connected to multiple digital receivers such as a HDhomerun, a media server such as mythtv can be setup to combine tuners from each antenna to watch or record all the channels received from each antenna on a single TV. The older HD homerun units even had inputs to each tuner.
I'm gonna have to do something like that soon. In my area, all of my TV channels were broadcasting from towers in the same general direction, but there's one station I watched a lot that moved the signal to halfway opposite direction of where my antenna is pointing at and therefore can no longer be picked up by that one antenna I have. Luckily I have some spare quality antennas laying around at home, so all I really need to do next is to get the splitter and perhaps some more knowledge on how to do this.
I just watched a video where a guy had two antennas one going in one direction and the other going in the other direction and he sounded very intelligent and they worked.Of course I dont know enough to explain how his worked.He did say to put the antennas at least 2-4 ft apart. They were on the roof and on same pole.All he used was a splitter.
Combining them like that can work for some people but if the signals are weak (like in my market) you will get multipath interference and lose channels.
There is always one more option that you forgot to mention there fuzz nuts. Try putting the one antenna on a much taller mount before going to all that trouble of getting 2 antennas. Taller always helps in a lot of other respects too and sometimes is cheaper.
Putting the antenna outside, larger, higher, is basic 101 stuff. If a person is using 2 antenna, it means that there are restrictions or opportunities which demand or allow the 2 antenna approach. You had me literally googling antenna fuzz nuts, because I never heard of this technology. I wanted to understand the type of nut before reading the rest of your comment. 😂 I then read the rest and saw a person pointing out the obvious, and realized that you were insulting the antenna guy as overlooking the suggestion of going high and larger. Of course, if installation danger, cost, regulations, and appearance were not any issue, we all would have 2 mile high antenna and a rotor and a televes smart comp, and at least 3 large antenna. In all setups, you first need to consider the restraining specifications. Then you get the biggest, most efficient solution to maximize your results.
Well, this was the only video that described my problem perfectly. But, I was hoping for a miracle gadget to hook up to the two antennas to make it work better. What I have found, though, is by pointing an antenna at the far away stations and disconnecting the cable from the second antenna that I was using to pick up local stations then I can get all the stations. Somehow, the disconnected cable seems to pick up the local stations okay but the signals go all wonky when hooked up to the second antenna. I've noticed that signal reception with two antennas varies from day to day depending on weather conditions and time of year. UPDATE - I found something that helps. I was using to equal model antennas - one for distance and one for local. I switched out the local antenna for a smaller, cheaper unit and that seemed to stop the interference and lost signals. Now I can watch the signals from 40 miles away and also those that are only 5 miles away.
I have another solution although it is kind of expensive. I have two dvr‘s and one antenna is attached to one dvr for now and the other to the second dvr to the west. Since I rarely watch live tv, this is a great solution for me. I live in Memphis TN but love your youtube vids. I am looking forward to your results on comparing tunersin dvr’s. The stand of pine trees seems to be a real issue for my old tivo premier.
Antenna Man I actually have two premier tivo’s. So I am thinking about getting a tablo or hdhomerun to help with my difficult vhf signals. One of my antennas is an old channel master that covers low and high vhf, as well as uhf. But right now I am using just one dvr and one outdoor preamplified antenna (not the channel master, it is in the attic and not currently in use). Now that the leaves are all back, I think I will have to go back to two dvrs and two antennas.
@@Billlakeview I live near you in Southaven and don't have any problems picking up any Memphis channels (except the low power 26 and 36 channels and subchannels) with my HD Stacker mounted in my attic with AT-PAA28 preamp. I have a large hill to the south of me so that I cannot pickup MPB from Oxford unless I turn the antenna in that direction and then I lose some of the Memphis channels. I have tried combining 2 antennas, but it didn't work for me. By the way, Tivo is supposed to be coming out with Roku and Firestick apps in the next couple months. I am not sure if it will work with the Premier or not. I am hoping that it will work with our Roamio OTA. I am also using the HDHomerun 4 channel that is kind of hit and miss with recording. Not as good as the Roamio, but better than nothing.
I tried to connect 2 power antennas to the splitter. This didn't work. I found out that you have to use a bi-directional splitter. Like this one, Channel Plus 2512 DC/IR Passing Splitter/Combiner, 2-Way
The main stations in our area are in two opposite directions 183 degrees apart so I built an antenna that picked up off either end with a center live element which h worked great.
My antenna that wasn't meant to last more than a year has lasted 8 years so far. The only problem that happened was due to the cheaper cable you mentioned that caused the rotor to stop working, which was taken care of with a new heavy duty cable and shortening the length to the smallest length possible of 50 ft. No complaints here, but thanks for the cable tip.
using a seperate tune box for different facing antenna connected to its own hdmi input gets this done for me. I am not combining signals just seperate antennas for each tuner box.
My preferred method is number four, to use a good directional antenna with a rotator. The only problem is getting the TV to scan and lock onto all the stations without having to rescan each time I turn the antenna.
The solution is the televes smartkom. I have been fortunate and I have been able to avoid tuners that do not have a channel add feature. How has the lifespan been for your rotors and what climate and shade, snow, sun per day, latitude, number of sunny days per year? I wonder if a plunger could be modified to keep the sun and rain away from the rotor to dramatically save the rotor? . Or some other less obvious trick.?
Yes, equal cable lenghts with a splitter ( w/2 clearstream 4's) on the mast works. I also have a seperate VHS directional to the Amps (Amplify Pro)dedicated coax/combiner. One RG cable to the distribution amp and many long runs to TVs. One antenna to Phila. and the other w/VHS to Harrisburg. Lancaster river valley based. Works well especially before the trees get full leaves.
❗ MAKE SURE TO WATCH MY UPDATED VIDEO ON THIS TOPIC BELOW 📺
ua-cam.com/video/9118Hw8wZHA/v-deo.html
UPDATE: Since I made this video Televes released an antenna combiner linked below that will not negatively impact reception:
amzn.to/3zpj2XC
Sorry placed answer separate. Both reception problems just can only get channel 12 in bedroom which is 12.1,12.2,12.3,12.4,12.5,12.6. Living Room receives that & 5 different channels plus the extras for all the channels without turning antenna so no there is no reception problem has to be in house.
Could the cable be the issue? If it could be why are we receiving the one channel? I think this is why I am stumped.
@@lisaa1134 Try using a powered splitter. If that doesn't work you are free to sign up for a consultation with me at the link below: antennamanpa.com/antenna-recommendations.html
@Moshe Luke why are you invading her privacy?? That's kinda creepy dude I wouldn't brag about it.
There is a good way to combine different antennas without causing any interference, hook up each antenna to it's own HDHOMERUN device. Many smart TVs now have the HDHOMERUN app.
Antenna Man, I've watched several of your videos and just realized that there are no Um's or Ah's, you must know your stuff and prepare your dialog in advance, well done sir!
I've been an OTA TV hobbyist for nearly 20 years
Hey Antenna Man love your reviews i’ve been getting over the air service since 2006 witch includes the conversion from analog to digital. Two years ago I started losing two stations.... I’m in 05356 at an altitude of 2000’ and pick up stations from Albany N.Y. my antenna faces south west I pick up NBC Fox WGBY and CBS but it constantly pixelates and drops out.... any suggestions. I have a Winegard 8700u and a Titan 7777 Pre-amp.
Excellent observation thank you his delivery is so good
Heavy editing :-)
There is some good editing involved, but his delivery is good too. Short, concise, to the point, and a little bit of dry humor injected but not over the top. Thanks Antenna Man!
👍💯👍Dude you the man. My grandfather was trying to hook up two different antennas and he wasn't getting all the channels he wanted and now I can let him know why. I appreciate your insight and advice. Thank's for the information because I didn't know either what he was doing wrong. You have become my go to guy for everything about this subject so please keep up the AWESOME job and I will keep watching and sharing your video's with as many people as I possibly can and I wanted let you know you are really helpful and I hope you will continue to help people like us out.
Two network TV tuners (ie: Hdhomerun), each one connecting to a different antenna, which will be facing a different directions. This way all device on your network gets all channels.
You are brilliant sir! Your solution is definitely another (albeit slightly more costly) solution. I’ve got one (hdhomerun dms 10631cca) and have it running thru my Plex server. Great little device!
I do not own a television. I watch Tyler because of his excellence in presentation. He could give lessons.
I just installed and am using a Winegard CC-7870 Antenna Coupler I bought on Amazon. Its doing a great job of interfacing my Clearstream 2V antenna facing northwest (that I am using for UHF channels in my area), and a homemade VHF Single Dipole antenna facing southeast tuned for channel 11 (28.1 inches in length, other VHF channels would benefit from their own calculated length). FULL DISCLOSER: The two antennas are shielded from each other and their signal direction by a distance of about 30 feet by using the house itself to isolate them, and then each antenna has a long run of RG6 Coax to the inside of the house where I am using the Winegard Combiner. Using a signal strength meter I have only noticed a 2-4% loss using this device, well tolerated for what its doing for me. Thank you Antenna Man for the wonderful and informative videos you have made. They have really helped us out here trying to cut the cord.
I am successfully combining signals from two antennas mounted in my attic. I am about 15 miles from one set of broadcast towers and 35 from another cluster.
I believe that there is a key point to maximize the chance for getting a good result: Try to have the two antennas pointed in directions 90 degrees apart.
This puts the main "beam" of one antenna in the "null" of the other. I am fortunate that in my situation that arrangement matches the compass directions of the two transmit antenna clusters.
Good point, I'll give that a try.
This totally makes sense! I wonder if it usually always works in practice, with the expected exceptions, or always.
@@dennisgarber I would expect the results to depend very much on the actual side lobes of the two antennas being combined. My pair of antennas happen to work well (and have for 26 years now).
I oriented each antenna in isolation for "their" set of channels before combining them, so I suppose that might be a good practice.
I really hear you on that one. I had to move my antenna around five times until I finally found the sweet spot. That receives about 32 channels clearly all day.
Antenna Man, you have an amazing and uncanny ability to convey realistic, practical, and just plain common-sense information about HDTV reception via antennas. A potential "cut-the-cable" devotee should be required to watch a few of your videos so (s)he would understand that you cannot pick up signals that just aren't there, no matter where you put an antenna or how much amplification you use.
Well done! Please keep up the fine work.
Just want to thank you because this video inspired me into purchasing the 4max when I saw this video. Your videos have been very informative in helping one do there research and providing multiple options to think about. I have had the 4max since December. The only problem is I still haven’t bought a ladder long enough to get to my roof. So it been hooked up in the living room. Thanks again
Thanks for checking in. I'm glad my videos helped you get better reception. Feel free to give a contribution at the link below as I spend A LOT of time making the videos and responding to these comments:
antennamanpa.com/support.html
The way to do it is with microwave filters it’s what I do at a large hospital. I have two antennas. One gets the majority of channels, the other gets the one channel that’s in a different direction. Each channel gets it own microwave filter for the actual RF frequency of the station then I combine them with a RF splitter and send it to a amp for distribution. The problem is it’s not practical for the home owner to do this because of cost. Love your channel you are right on the money with your information.
Very good about explaining the ghosts effect.
I combine two antennas and I received extra channels.
( using vertical and horizontal antenna)
You mention about grounding.
I completely ground everything and
I gained a total of 13 extra channels.
Given me a total of 43 channels.
But I need to add that my antennas are on top of my 108 foot Tower that I used for my amateur radio.
Thank you for keeping it real
Rev Damon A Conn
Well done! PBS is weak in our area. To maximize our reception we use a pre-amplifier. Works great.
I am a extra class amateur radio operator and I have a pair of 2 meter Yagi antennas phased together on a pole with a rotator. that work exceptionally well. At first after i built these antennas, both identical, they would not load up properly at all. Then an old timer ham told me to turn the top one bottom side up . He said that one antenna was cancelling the other out. I did as I was told and they load perfectly and have worked for twenty years. I must add that I was using these antennas for transmitting so it might not make a difference for receiving.
I like your channel, wish this was around like 20yrs ago playing with my antenna outside.
You can combine antennas, different metro areas would have "area specials" where the antennas were configured properly with each other. One was Tampa Bay Special for instance for Tampa, since WTSP used to be located in Holiday, FL, while the rest are in Riverview, so WTSP got its own antenna.
Back in the 70's I used to install antennas and we used what was called and area special which consisted of 4 antennas connected in a particular order using 300 ohm twin lead, that was supplied with the antennas, that were pre-cut to specific lengths. These antennas allowed every TV in the house to receive any channel and no rotor required. They worked great. If I recall they were made by Winegard.
2 TV Antennas got married.
The wedding was not so good.......
but the reception was Great !
*GROAN* LOL Good one.
Got that one loud and clear....
HA
When you receive plenty of
Good Staions
You do what the
DEVO song says Whip it
And Whip It Good
But when you don't receive
Any good station and your
Pictures pixaleats
Then you do what
QUEEN sings
Another One Bites The Dust
Both songs are from
1980 The Analog years !
Yes, but how was the wedding night??
Thx Tyler! This is the most understandable, concise, and useful post I have seen on the subject. Rock on dude, you are a knowledgeable educator. Peace!
Thanks make sure you're subscribed to my channel I'm working hard on a reception improvement video.
@@AntennaMan do you do work around Harveys Lake Pa
I've spent lots of time trying to get this information. Very kind of you... Thanks!
I just want to say thank you your advice!! The information is very useful! You saved me a lot of time.
Thanks again, have a great day!
love this channel. I've had a combo roof antenna for a few years getting about 30 channels. This guy is gonna help me maximize the other towers nearby.
thank you for this information. you explain things in a way that i can understand.
All my signals come from the "Towers" on top of South Mountain in Phoenix!
80 channels, some dupes but hard to beat.
I use 1 of those figure 8 outdoor antennas.👍
Dang that 80 channels would be nice.
@@VROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM 80 channels for free is amazing!
I have two antennas pointed in different directions, 1 towards my local tower. The other is pointed towards a different country picking up their channels. I have no cross channel interference. I did make sure the cables going into the combiner were roughly the same length
I have a Lava HD 8008 in the attic and it does great. I used their splitter and every TV in the house gets a great signal. It comes out of the box multi-directional.
@2.00 - the ghosting picture example. The shock of watching an American antenna man 10,000 miles away talking about his local market and seeing a picture of a Melbourne, Australia news reader (Brian Henderson) and the even freakier scenario is that the TV studio is right next door to my apartment less than 500 feet away. Freaky man.
Informative video by the way which is why I’m here.
I've used a 2way splitter for 2 antenna. Worked out for me
Me too. I get over 100 channels.
I noticed that combining two antennas, you used different antennas with different cable lengths. I have had success using two of the same type of antennas (GE attic antennas) with the same length cable, in the same spot in the attic, pointed in different directions. Thanks for the videos.
Yes, I've been told that's the trick.
This claim that matching identical antenna, identical cables, identical spots, and different directions, is something that needs to be tested like myth busters! Not only as to whether it works, but if any one or 2 of the 3 variables make a huge or small difference.
I just bought a $79 Televes 560483
It worked great to combine a large attic antenna with an outside art piece antenna pointing 30 degrees apart. The televes balanced the signals and added them. No evidence of multipath. So, naturally, I am wondering if I wasted money. Most likely in my case I did not, because I was forced to use 2 antenna. I am also wondering if 30 degrees is not enough to create multipath or I got lucky, or if the tuners I tested or televes eliminated the multipath.
What would happen if you pointed identical antennas at the same tower and joined them with a combiner would the signal go up or would that cause issue. Gonna be an attic setup
If you have the right gear you can use an RF signal generator and a scope to precisely adjust the length of the two coax feeds to perfectly overlap the two signals. This is a major pain and won't help for reflection issues. i.e. if the multipath is somewhat unstable. Good chance you'll end up with a pile of extra coax on one of the feeds. Not the only way, but one way.
You can also use notch filters before the combiner. They can be purchased in 5 channel increments. They are quite common in the CATV industry.
Also add notch filters to remove the signal from the antenna in the wrong direction for each channel that is lost to multipath.
good idea but those are expensive.
@@burblegobble Notch filters should still have been covered.
4:37 This is awesome solution for RV (or home) as you can use omni ant but have option to pop up or second directional as necessary. Also you can mount 2 cheap or DIY antennas in different directions and switch easy by indoor switch. ❤️ Great channel. Thanks for sharing your knowledge. 👍👍👍
very good video! well spoken and quick and to the point.
I really like this channel, great videos! I think there maybe another way to incorporate 2 or more antenna. With a pc install multiple tv tuner cards, hook one tv tuner card to a beam pointed at one market and have it scan the channels it can get and with another hooked to another antenna pointed at another market.
I have had good results with two antennas by using the exact matched lengths of RG6 from antenna to 2-way splitter.
I have too, it seems to help keeping each coax to the splitter as short as possible as well.
Different antenna?
All of my in market channels are UHF, but there are some out of market channels I would love to have that are high VHF. Glad there's a straight forward solution to this by using a VHF/UHF combiner. Also, that Stellar labs high VHF antenna model you reviewed seems like it will do the trick for tramsnitters about 50 miles away with no mountains in between.
Thank you for information. I have two antennas facing opposite directions. One toward Santa Barbara (west) local, the other toward L.A. (east) distance. Both have preamps. I have the splitter mentioned to switch between antennas. Only glitch is the TV set must be auto programmed for each antenna. Can't simply flip the antenna switch and expect the former programming to work. I'm still experimenting which is kind of fun. I'm 76 years old and when I was a young teen, my Dad and I loved to mess with crystal sets and antennas. BTW my antenna mount is about 8 feet above the roof line and I think I better run a guy wire as it's kind of shaky. Also couldn't drill through (tough mount) where they overlap to install a screw, so I spliced them together with one of the antenna mounts. Call it semi-stable.
You might benefit from this video. With the DTV box I use you can manually add channels so you wouldn't have to run rescans when changing direction.
ua-cam.com/video/xgIqk8Py3Fc/v-deo.html
Putting two antennas together gives you a lot more gain.Add a pre amp and pick up alot more channels.
Only if you can get the phase of the two exactly right. Lots of coax length tweaking. They may still sell variable delays for this purpose which allow for fraction of a picosecond delay changes. More or less a trombone type device inside a sealed can which changes the length of the signal path via a mechanical adjustment. Not cheap.
@1:48 had that idea a few years back, thanks for putting it to rest-in a good way :)
Every topic i look up, you have a video for. Well done sir
"Maybe they'll be some...PBS station that you don't really watch and it doesn't really matter"!
There you go again, knocking the only network that some of us
Two tuners SilconDust box for example. I am in the KickStarter ATSC 3.0 and you just gave me a great use for my current digital tuner box.
Thank you for the video, you answered a lot of my questions.
If you are going to use a "splitter backwards" you have to make sure:
1st, that the lengths of cable between the antenna and the splitter are exactly the same.
2nd, space the antennas a few feet apart so that they don't interfere with each other,
3rd, Use the same model antenna before combing.....
Otherwise, you are absolutely certain to have ghosting or multipath issues.
📶
When combining 2 antennas (or any RF source for that matter) in the same frequency band with a simple RF combiner/splitter you have to make sure that both input signals have more or less the same Amplitude levels, otherwise the sideband of RF carriers on the stronger input will end up overlapping the adjacent RF carriers on the weaker input sinal. Try attenuating the stronger signal to the same amplitude level of the weaker signal before combining both. The resulting/combined signal can then be amplified
when you just connect 2 antennas together without channel filters, you literally create 360° antenna, which is obviously bad idea
@@Pidalin That's correct. If you want to combine specific channels from antenna A with other specific channels on antena B, you should filter-out the unwanted/duplicate channels on both antenas (meaning, on Antenna A you should filter-out the channels that are already being picked up fine by Antenna B, and vice versa) - otherwise you will get multipath interference on the combined RF coaxial
@@miguelangeloconceicao738 It worked for me for some time when I was catching one multiplex with vertical polarization and rest of programs with standard horizontal polarization, when you have antenna in vertical polarization and there is only one transmitter with such polarization around, then you can just connect antennas together, horizontaly polarized signal is very weak on verticaly oriented antenna. We have transmitters with vertical polarisation only in two biggest cities which is like 200 km from each other so there is no interference.
I heard that Slovaks changed all their transmitters to vertical polarisation for some reason, I guess such little country has problem with interferences from other countries, so that could be solution. We also have (here in Czechia) some problems with Polish transmitters, they have 100 kW transmitters literally on our border which is not kind from them, but it's good for people who like to catch foreign TV. Unfortunately Germans and Austrians made all transmitters very directional when they changed to DVB-T2 so catching their TV is almost imposibble now, but it solved interferences from their channels.
@@Pidalin question: two identical antennas, positioned one over the other on the same mast, pointing in the sane direction. if these signals are merged with a regular splitter, would it still have the 360 reception problem?
We appreciate the effort you put into your productions; keep up the great work Tyler. Regarding combining antennas. In addition to having the cables from each antenna exactly the same length, you need to make sure it is the exact same brand because the "velocity factor" varies from brand to brand. Just make up your cables from the same roll. '73 Bob
Thanks! As soon as I found your channel, I subscribed & started binging! You've got a *_ton_* of great info here. My wife & I have 2 phones, 3 computers, 2 smart TVs, & a dumb one. We've got cable & internet, but I can't actually get the one channel I watch, unless I hook up an antenna to the dumb flat-screen! With all the different services offered on various platforms, it's a confusing mess. Thanks for clearing up a lot of it. tavi.
Thanks man...I had no idea about multipath interference, now I know...
This guy knows his sh#t for sure
I have 2 91xg's 90 degrees apart 4' separation 30' up same length coax combined with a $4 ideal splitter pick up Cleveland, Akron and Pittsburgh stations no problems with reception.
you help me out alot thanks so much ; i had a old 360 could not get much local i watch your channel and bought the clear stream double and now get 4 markets now again thanks
I'm glad my videos helped you get better reception. Feel free to give a contribution at the link below as I spend A LOT of time making the videos and responding to these comments:
antennamanpa.com/support.html
Dude THANKS! I picked up channel 3 from Charlotte NC and I live in valdese NC which is a 4 hour drive from me
WBTV did a repack and is visible within 85-90 miles. Mostly at night.
I've been enjoying your videos. I just switched to antenna TV. I use Philo for the cable stations saving me $60 a month.
But you need internet. It's the same thing. Some of us don't have internet nor want it.
@@joltjolt5060 I canceled the Philo I never watched it.
Living in mb and happy to see my hometown on the screen! Keep up the good work
What's your hometown?
@@AntennaMan Bethlehem.
Why did you move away? This is a great small city!
@@AntennaMan cost of living is so much cheaper in the south. I miss it but happy where i am.
The author gives some good info, but I would like to clarify a few things.
Regardless of whether the signal is digital or analog, ghosting is caused by the reception of two out-of-phase signals. If a signal reflects off of a nearby tree, for example, this reflected signal will in turn recombine with the signal that reached the antenna by line of sight when it arrives at the antenna. The reflected signal has a longer path to travel, hence the out of phase reception. In the author's example, he mentions the two antennas being at right angles from each other, and if he has nearby trees or buildings, it is entirely plausible that this caused the out of phase condition.
In any case, it is NOT the mere fact that two antennas are combined that is causing the problem, as long as they are equidistant from the station (read: mounted on a common mast). The same problem would be created if you use two different lengths of cable from the two antennas to the combiner.
Combiners/splitters are lossy things, and you will lose at least HALF your signal power using them. The better choice (if you can find one) is a two-input signal amplifier.
I have had great success combining a Stealth Hawk antenna with no reflector (receives on both broad faces - google it) for the direction(s) with nearer/stronger stations, and on the same mast, but 90 degrees rotated, a Gray Hoverman with no reflector (receives on both broad faces - google it) for the more distant/weaker stations. These are both designs available on the web to make your own antenna. I use a combiner with equal length feeder cables for now; but I am looking for a two input amplifier (I may build my own).
BTW, who wants to waste time with an antenna rotation drive?
you are straight up and that what i like about you if its good you say it if it sucks you tell it like it is
Not all have luck with multiple dipoles, although it's worth a try. I happened to luck out: built a Gray-Hoverman antenna with no reflector. So I pull in channels from both Needham and Springfield, opposite directions --> same antenna. This is possible only because digital broadcasts have error-correction. 13 years ago my setup would not have worked out.
Going to be interesting through the repack of course, since the two markets are in repack phases 4 and 8. I may lose some channels, and maybe gain one or two. I'll definitely lose the channel moving to low-VHF.
I take it you are in Massachusetts. I am getting ready to set up a second antenna, a CM 3020 to face eastward to Needham/Wellesley. I have a Mohu Leaf indoor/outdoor aimed toward Hartford, CT area. I am undecided about how to
combine the antennas.
Have you set up the Channel Master yet? You might haphazardly pull in Hartford, Springfield etc. off-axis. Usually it doesn't work, but you may be surprised.
I'm high on a hill in metropolitan Sturbridge. Most everything comes in well again, but WCVB didn't come back. They used to be my second-strongest signal after channel 2.
Quite a few months later, I got a channel master 4221 and rebuilt the damaged elements. Though it's a 4-bay UHF design, the high-VHF reception is strangely good. I even pick up WVIT which I'm not supposed to get at all.
I have two UHF only antennas pointed about 100º apart plus a long range VHF only antenna pointing about 180º from one of the UHF antennas. Each channel I pick up is a different frequency, so no multichannel interference for me. I combine all three antennas with a Televes three antenna combiner that comes with a two port power inserter/distribution amplifier. The cool thing about the Televes combiner is that you can adjust the gain for each antenna separately. That comes in handy because one of the UHF antennas has a long cable run before it gets to the combiner. This antenna has a Channel Master pre-amp. I dial down the gain on the combiner for this antenna so as not to over amplify the signal going to the TV. Finally I use quad shielded RG6 cable to maximize signal transmission and minimize interference. This presents a slight problem with the combiner as it is not designed for the extra thickness of quad cable. However, it was fairly easy to modify the the way the quad cable is fed into the combiner. Over all, I am very happy with the way this system works.
You bought the televes smart Kom 3 years ago. Is it still working well?
@@dennisgarberYes. As of last summer (2023) , I was able to pick up adequate signal from Vancouver BC (100 miles) on the UHF antennas, and Seattle (60 miles) on the VHF antenna.
My modifications to accommodate the quad coax cable was to replace the stock clamps with large fender washers, which I filed to fit the space for the cable attachments.
The newest Televes combiner has female F connector points. My modifications are not nesessary for this newest version.
Grew up in Eden, Wi. Half way between Milwaukee and Green Bay, Wisconsin. SE corner. My Dad put up 40 ft tower, in cement, when we built home. Channel Masters best rotor, VHF fringe ant. Also separate UHF, parabolic, pointed, opposite, And we got both cities crystal clear in 70s. My Dad worked At les toll tv, Fond du lac, Wisconsin. Neighbors were impressed, able to get, 13 total channels! Dad sold a lot, of identical systems. Original rotor, from channel master, made it in till 1983! Tower erected 1970! Point is, Channel Master, made great equipment, back then. I wish some things haven't changed!
In the NTSC days I would put tunable traps on antennas as each station was a different strength and direction.
I took the local station which was blasting away from 6 miles away took an antenna tuned to its wavelength pointed directly at it and then attenuated it by 100db it was a perfect signal as it also knocked down the noise by 100db.
The other channels were all filtered and levelled.
Nowadays with the ATSC system ghosting is not that big of an issue.
I know a fellow living in an apartment building and his balcony faced the wrong way to point an antenna in the direction to get his favorite station. He managed to get the signal by pointing antenna at another building an caught a reflection. ATSC aeems immune to ghosting.
Please a demonstration of two antennas connected to a RF switch. I tried connecting two antennas and had the multipath problems. I use a splitter/combiner. I like the idea of using the switch. Most of my channels come from Raleigh NC, but the closest PBS channel is from Lumberton NC.
Try this preamp. It separates the VHF and UHF inputs to limit the multipath interference:
amzn.to/2npMxqx
I thank you for your videos. Before i found your channel. I purchased that directional that you dont recommend. But i have it outside. Just above my roofline. Scanned and got 29 channels.
It's known to fail over time. Give it a few months
I have had two of those it does work good I get 59 channels but the cable connection at the base broke and the rotator and the other one the cable connection broke off on the amplifier box 🤦
Ghosting in the analog days was due to signal echo mostly because each signal arrived with a slight time delay. To be able to use both antennas, you need to have both antennas on the same pole with both antennas connected to the same plexer by 2 cable of the same lentgh this way, even though the antennas not facing the right direction stil get the signal, it is transported down the cable at the same time and speed as the other antenna.
Thanks, actually knew most of what you stated. Been messing with antennas over 50 years. It’s odd that after all that time that reception still works pretty much the same
I finally finished watching this thankfully, I learned a lot. Thanks! 😊👍🏻
Great to hear!
My solution involved separate antenna cables,one to the tv antenna input the other to a hdmi tv tuner (mediasonic) to the hdmi input of the tv.Toggle on the remote input button to switch antennas.Remote convenience and eliminating some of the problems like rescanning ,filters,,multi path.abs switch wear and the separate tuner might improve the reception signal.
I used a CHANNEL PLUS 2532 2-Way Splitter/Combiner in combiner mode and I added a bunch of channels. Nice picture on all the channels.
Love your channel. You helped me out so much.
I live in a weak zone for reception. I'm very close to the Florida coast. I think if I lived more inland, my reception would probably be better. Been toying with ideas on trying to boost my signal.
In the old days we had "channel traps" which were just filters for specific channels. We had one antenna for channel 4 going through a channel 4 trap, an antenna for channel 6 going through a channel 6 trap, and a third antenna for the rest of the channels, These were combined on the antenna and then went down through the old 300 ohm twin lead to our television.
*Everyone* in our area had multiple antennas on their roofs. There was simply no other way to get all of the channels except using a rotor which I don't recall anyone using.
Back 10 -15 years ago you could buy those traps from ChannelMaster, they were called JoinTenna. But they've replaced that product like now with a new "JoinTenna" that apparently does the notching automagically. I would consider this a 4th option.
Awesome stuff! You were right about the cable being bad, thanks!
A bi-directional broadband splitter can be used to combine the received signal from two antennas with the use of quality custom notch filters between each antenna and the splitter. We use them in the amateur radio and scanner world all the time for frequency isolation. You can purchase one or make one yourself. The frequency formulas can be found on the web.
Great video. Very informative. Yes, I know the mountain you are facing to the south. I live in Steel City, just a few miles from you.
My friend in Bethlehem Township erected a figure 8 type outside antenna and he gets 54 channels, including 3, 6 and 10. No more cable bill.
Barry
I am also a Bethlehem Township guy. Picking up 63 channels with a roof mounted unit. Targeting azimuth of 174 which works well but I am not picking up the Scranton channels as well. Was hoping I could just mount a second antenna
Thanks you for the informative video. I've yet to have any luck combining Two TV antennas. Someone at Channel Masters recently told me having the exact length of coax going to each antenna is important.
That's what I've been hearing as well but you may still get multipath interference.
In there parts multipath interference is a common problem. In the old days I'd use an adjustable attenuator to eliminate ghosting. I suppose it might be interesting to try one here to see if it helps.
In spent hours tweaking the antenna direction to completely block out that religious channel, heaven forbid it spook the devil outta me!
Thanks Antenna Man for the tips and great information!
Great vid, very informative. What if you have 2 markets in opposite directions and you use highly directional antennas, could that work to cut-out multipath? Is there any way to shield an antenna to make it even more directional, i.e. antenna blinders? maybe faraday shielding? Let's assume they both have vhf/uhf so first option is not possible.
Nobody knows more about anthennas than Tyler
I've seen remote-controlled A-B switches on various shopping sites; I expect to try one out. You could also aim the attic or outdoor antenna for the direction of the weakest stations and have a hand A-B switch and a bow-tie aimed in the direction of the strongest ones near each set. The idea would be a phased array that automatically selects the strongest direction for each channel and puts them all on the wire; I would think something like that would be a necessity for a large building with lots of users dependent on one antenna system.
I'll look into a remote A-B switch
That's fine when you are watching real time tv. Your antenna DVR will not be able to switch from a to b when it's recording shows when you are away from home or sleeping.
Another option based on option #3 (the video switcher solution).
Buy two HDHomeRuns or Tablos and run them from two seperate antennas. If you combine this with Plex Media Server you can choose between the two antennas and also have it available to multiple TV sets. This of course is the most expensive option since you will need a streaming box (Roku, AppleTV, nVidia Shield etc) at every TV and the associated app. You will also need two antennas, two runs of coaxial cable, two grounding blocks, two HDHomeRuns or Tablos etc.
Next option if you dont want to use a Tablo or HDHomeRun. Two antennas, two amplified distribution amps and switchers at each TV. The only main disadvantage is that you have to do a rescan. This is where the HDHomeRun or Tablo idea would be better.
Boom no longer any concern with multi-path interferrance.
YKW? You might also be able to use two separate tuners (converter boxes) and be able to have one for one direction, and the other for the other direction!
Thanks for your explanations, I have watched several of videos, and you explain everything related to antennas very clear. just one question how do I ground and outside antenna or the best way to do it, thanks,
That's a video I am currently working on. Make sure you're subscribed to my channel so you are notified when I post it next week.
@@AntennaMan I just added an antenna to our conventional RV antenna with a Walmart splitter. Antenna I mounted high in a tree took over with 8 digital channels, I lost 20 digital channels the RV antenna was picking up. The 8 channels are different than the 20 channels. RV antenna is directional and can be rotated 365 degrees. No difference. Any suggestions.
I wish you would do a video on the antennas Direct 8 element bowtie antenna. It can be aimed in 2 directions. They have one on Amazon and you can buy an additional VHF add on for it as well. I have stations in 2 directions going into an HDHOMERUN Quatro. It would be nice to be able to get both.
Thanks for the good information I appreciate it
I've got three in tennis hooked up together and one inside they're all on splitters they work good
The hdhomerun works great by taking antenna signal and converting it for your router to broadcast the signal through out the house on multiple devices.
Do you need internet for this to work?
Another option would be to use two antennas to connected to multiple digital receivers such as a HDhomerun, a media server such as mythtv can be setup to combine tuners from each antenna to watch or record all the channels received from each antenna on a single TV. The older HD homerun units even had inputs to each tuner.
Yes! At some point I will post a new video with this info.
I'm gonna have to do something like that soon. In my area, all of my TV channels were broadcasting from towers in the same general direction, but there's one station I watched a lot that moved the signal to halfway opposite direction of where my antenna is pointing at and therefore can no longer be picked up by that one antenna I have. Luckily I have some spare quality antennas laying around at home, so all I really need to do next is to get the splitter and perhaps some more knowledge on how to do this.
I just watched a video where a guy had two antennas one going in one direction and the other going in the other direction and he sounded very intelligent and they worked.Of course I dont know enough to explain how his worked.He did say to put the antennas at least 2-4 ft apart. They were on the roof and on same pole.All he used was a splitter.
Combining them like that can work for some people but if the signals are weak (like in my market) you will get multipath interference and lose channels.
In times gone by (no cable tv existed) everyone watched antenna TV and the rich people had a powered rotor antenna .
There is always one more option that you forgot to mention there fuzz nuts. Try putting the one antenna on a much taller mount before going to all that trouble of getting 2 antennas. Taller always helps in a lot of other respects too and sometimes is cheaper.
Putting the antenna outside, larger, higher, is basic 101 stuff. If a person is using 2 antenna, it means that there are restrictions or opportunities which demand or allow the 2 antenna approach.
You had me literally googling antenna fuzz nuts, because I never heard of this technology. I wanted to understand the type of nut before reading the rest of your comment. 😂 I then read the rest and saw a person pointing out the obvious, and realized that you were insulting the antenna guy as overlooking the suggestion of going high and larger.
Of course, if installation danger, cost, regulations, and appearance were not any issue, we all would have 2 mile high antenna and a rotor and a televes smart comp, and at least 3 large antenna.
In all setups, you first need to consider the restraining specifications. Then you get the biggest, most efficient solution to maximize your results.
Well, this was the only video that described my problem perfectly. But, I was hoping for a miracle gadget to hook up to the two antennas to make it work better. What I have found, though, is by pointing an antenna at the far away stations and disconnecting the cable from the second antenna that I was using to pick up local stations then I can get all the stations. Somehow, the disconnected cable seems to pick up the local stations okay but the signals go all wonky when hooked up to the second antenna. I've noticed that signal reception with two antennas varies from day to day depending on weather conditions and time of year. UPDATE - I found something that helps. I was using to equal model antennas - one for distance and one for local. I switched out the local antenna for a smaller, cheaper unit and that seemed to stop the interference and lost signals. Now I can watch the signals from 40 miles away and also those that are only 5 miles away.
I have another solution although it is kind of expensive. I have two dvr‘s and one antenna is attached to one dvr for now and the other to the second dvr to the west. Since I rarely watch live tv, this is a great solution for me. I live in Memphis TN but love your youtube vids. I am looking forward to your results on comparing tunersin dvr’s. The stand of pine trees seems to be a real issue for my old tivo premier.
What kind of DVRs do you have?
Antenna Man I actually have two premier tivo’s. So I am thinking about getting a tablo or hdhomerun to help with my difficult vhf signals. One of my antennas is an old channel master that covers low and high vhf, as well as uhf. But right now I am using just one dvr and one outdoor preamplified antenna (not the channel master, it is in the attic and not currently in use). Now that the leaves are all back, I think I will have to go back to two dvrs and two antennas.
@@Billlakeview I live near you in Southaven and don't have any problems picking up any Memphis channels (except the low power 26 and 36 channels and subchannels) with my HD Stacker mounted in my attic with AT-PAA28 preamp. I have a large hill to the south of me so that I cannot pickup MPB from Oxford unless I turn the antenna in that direction and then I lose some of the Memphis channels. I have tried combining 2 antennas, but it didn't work for me. By the way, Tivo is supposed to be coming out with Roku and Firestick apps in the next couple months. I am not sure if it will work with the Premier or not. I am hoping that it will work with our Roamio OTA. I am also using the HDHomerun 4 channel that is kind of hit and miss with recording. Not as good as the Roamio, but better than nothing.
That's how I got mine too in tennis to a two-way splitter it's been working just great for 10 years now I got like 40 channels
Thanks for the information. With your help, I was able change my setup and get some better channels.
I tried to connect 2 power antennas to the splitter. This didn't work. I found out that you have to use a bi-directional splitter. Like this one, Channel Plus 2512 DC/IR Passing Splitter/Combiner, 2-Way
The main stations in our area are in two opposite directions 183 degrees apart so I built an antenna that picked up off either end with a center live element which h worked great.
My antenna that wasn't meant to last more than a year has lasted 8 years so far. The only problem that happened was due to the cheaper cable you mentioned that caused the rotor to stop working, which was taken care of with a new heavy duty cable and shortening the length to the smallest length possible of 50 ft. No complaints here, but thanks for the cable tip.
using a seperate tune box for different facing antenna connected to its own hdmi input gets this done for me. I am not combining signals just seperate antennas for each tuner box.
Yes, this is a good solution I'll mention in an updated version of this video soon.
My preferred method is number four, to use a good directional antenna with a rotator.
The only problem is getting the TV to scan and lock onto all the stations without having to rescan each time I turn the antenna.
The solution is the televes smartkom.
I have been fortunate and I have been able to avoid tuners that do not have a channel add feature.
How has the lifespan been for your rotors and what climate and shade, snow, sun per day, latitude, number of sunny days per year? I wonder if a plunger could be modified to keep the sun and rain away from the rotor to dramatically save the rotor? . Or some other less obvious trick.?
Yes, equal cable lenghts with a splitter ( w/2 clearstream 4's) on the mast works. I also have a seperate VHS directional to the Amps (Amplify Pro)dedicated coax/combiner. One RG cable to the distribution amp and many long runs to TVs. One antenna to Phila. and the other w/VHS to Harrisburg. Lancaster river valley based. Works well especially before the trees get full leaves.