TESLA TURBINE TESTING
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- Опубліковано 5 жов 2024
- This is our 375 pound , 13 blade, 30 inch diameter Tesla turbine. The blades are 10 gauge spaced with 14 gauge spacers between the plates. Final top speed was 1900 RPM. The nozzle is a 3/32 throat converging diverging nozzle with chocked flow using 70 CFM of compressed air. Rotational kinetic energy can be calculated for those interested. A seal between the casing and the rotor was installed to test the importance of a labyrinth seal. Findings indicate the seal is critical to increase torque. It was noted that without the seal air was not exiting through the center discharge above 500 rpm, but instead was avoiding the discs completely and exiting between the outer diameter and the side of the casing. Although this test was using a home made seal, similar to a labyrinth seal, the clearance was found to be .005 to .035 inches allowing considerable leakage to continue, but but a vast improvement to the previous .125 inches before installation of the gasket ring.
Great work man you got this, i would next refine the fitting and hoses, maybe some ptfe lined alternatives for less air turbulane and resistance. I think polishing the discs and the inside of the turbine housing may also help.
That’s pretty impressive accelerating a mass that large that fast. My calculations give 225 seconds for the 375lb 15in radius disc stack. With 1900rpm final that gives about 247,328Joules of kinetic energy and thus total change in kinetic energy from stop. That gives an average of 1kW of work done changing the disc stack over the 225seconds of acceleration. Now since I can’t see the RPMs at each moment I can’t calculate peak output at any one time as it was probabaly seeing much higher power outputs at the lower end and tapered off towards the high end yielding an average of 1kW. Either way, still impressive.
Your calculations are spot on.
So. Like roughly 60kw gen set? Depending on feed rate and demand?
@@dekonfrost7 60 kW would be awesome. And I’m sure under the right fluid supply conditions this bad boy would do that no problem.
Creating a laminar flow to the air inlet might improve efficiency.
Less space between the exhaust output and bearing will help reduce wobble
There is not wobble.
With something that heavy and large diameter you need to balance the rotor and shaft better. I can hear the vibration making the bearings get hot and groan.
What you are hearing is the actual balancing bars used to balance the rotor. There is no vibration whatsoever. It has been nearly p[erfectly balanced.
@@ourhouseisfull11 thank you I have no idea what balancing bars you're referring to as I haven't really studied the self balancer system enough to understand how it works.
Good stuff! Early in the RPM range it almost sounds like a single cyl engine, or an engine that is missing a cyl. I wonder if this design would benefit from the addition of multiple hose ports?
I'm imagining the Wankel engine design, where there are three combustion ports in triangular-ish geometry. It may also help with the noise as the frequencies may cancel each other out
no. You are hearing some balancing welds on the exterior edge of the rotor as they pass the nozzle on startup.
I'm a bit skeptical of anyone who doesn't think anything could ever possibly improve the results they got. It's excellent I'm sure but I'm pretty sure that you can decrease the amount of lateral force exerted on the rotor by placing opposing nozzles on opposite sides of the discs. No matter how perfectly you balance the rotor and how perfect the bearings, especially with air bearings, getting up to speed is crucial to getting the rotor to oscillate inside the vortex you're creating. By diverting half the intake to another nozzle on the opposite side of the disc you will get the rotor to get grabbed by the vortex and balance itself quicker...in fact you can even break it down into four intakes from four opposing directions. This will reach a balancing vibration much quicker but the question is "Is it worth all that trouble when you can just wait a split second and this single nozzle turbine will balance itself...?"
@@captainKedger Tesla was after cheap simplicity with his design. The economy was from not utilizing expensive machine tools and still achieving mass produced power production at scale. That he did. He not anyone else saw micron accurate CNC machining if 40 ton rotors. That are millions of dollars. Or that the construction of which would be in only a few places in the world. Tesla a better man then we know not just a technical person or engineer but his human qualities were extraordinary
I know this particular machine is not designed for this, but I'd be very curious to see a TT this size, run in reverse. It should be able to pull a hard enough vacuum to desalinate a decent amount of salt water without expensive and wasteful RO filters.
Hi Don: SO I asked a question on balancing in a reply about Teslas patents. I will ask a gain here. How did you balance that beast? But I had another question that you may have an answer for. If the unit is going to be used to generator AC electrical power, how do you govern the speed as load picks up and drop off? If its a grid tie unit, i understand. But if its stand alone, governing speed for AC output seems problematic to me. Seems like a DC out put to a battery bank with a DC to AC inverter might fix the governing issue while speed of response to battery voltage isnt as critical as frequency in AC. ??? My guess is that you have already worked this out... But I havent seen or I missed your comment on it.
The process of rotor balancing in Tesla's day was to say the least, a guessing game. Technology is now advanced to the point of a science and less of an art form.
Many ways to govern the speed of a system. But it is a lot easier to use A/C to generate and then rectification to convert all variable Hertz A/C into D/C of any desired voltage. The D/C can then be converted with precision into 50 or 60 hertz A/C for standard household appliances. Storage in an off grid system is essential. So this just makes funneling everything into one battery system and using one inverter to back feed the entire household easier. If hooked up directly to a grossly over sized battery bank no other regulation is required. The battery bank serves as an electronic governor when sized appropriately. 269-685-1340 if you prefer to speak with me directly.
@@ourhouseisfull11 each time an energy source is converted to a different energy (IE: AC to DC, DC to AC, rectify up or down, generated power to stored power in a battery, battery to live power..... there are significant losses. IN many cases, 10% -50% each time its changed. So IM not a big fan of changing power forms more then necessary. On the matter of speed governing of the unit vs frequency output (ie 50-60 hz or dc), response time needs to be pretty quick. IM curious how "pretty quick" applies to a Tesla Turbine. ?? Have you considered speed governing controls??? Are they in application? Lastly.... you have developed some pretty big units. IS there an advantage to the bigger units? IM speaking in diameter? I was under the thinking that over 12 inches diameter had no real advantage and actually centrifugal forces on materials were an issue on bigger units. It would be my idea that greater horse power was found in expanding horizontal along the shaft axis not vertical in diameter. . but you went vertical with diameter. What did you find in those results?
Do you think an electric turbo would work with this?
If this is used in generator in hydropower plants, this way more faster can generate much electricity
Man what kind of hp is this making
I’m looking for someone to build a Tesla turbine for me and I was hoping you might be interested.
Thanks
Tom Martens
Ow mi. Looks Verry good this is something That's gonna power a house looking forward to the road of victory, i wil subscribe to your channel, keep the shiny side up
Thanks for the sub
I want to buy... do you produce to sell? Tks
That is a good job, Do you have the Turbine for sell?
Do you have a large source of steam currently?
@@ourhouseisfull11 I have a large source of steam. I'm also looking to create a boundary layer turbine that incorporates heat transfer and very large for megawatt production. lets talk.
@@jamesforbes6588Can we cooperate?
If seems to me such a lot of air is wasted getting this thing up to speed. Could a preload help get it to operating rpm and then use the air for more efficiency.
Tesla turbine was designed to make steam, not use it , saw similar heater in 1977 very low amp draw on electric motor.
I respectfully disagree. I think you may be thinking of a rotary steam generator. This is a large rotor in a casing with holes drilled into the rotor to cause cavitation boiling of water on demand. The Tesla turbine was always intended to be a steam turbine generator and uses steam or other pressurized heated gas as a prime mover.
@@ourhouseisfull11 how did they coup with the very high r.p.m. bearings? 1900 what did they use? wheres the generator this steam motor ran?
@@johnmccabe4436 Don't forget tesla also discovered AC energy which is produced by spinning an electric generator to produce a switching magnetic field. A generator is anything that can produce power (turning or moving power as well). Tesla always wanted to fly and airplane motors sucked at the time. He was planing to use a steam turbine to power his plane. He tried to sell it as a power unit for cars, trucks and tractors. That is why in his demo to investors he hooked it up to regular motors and demonstrated the torque it could produce.
@@excitedbox5705 just FYI, Tesla did not discover AC. AC was well known about before his time, just no one had figured out any practical usage of it. This is the bulk of what Tesla invented. He invented the first practical system of transmitting alternating currents with low loss, including the corresponding alternators dynamos generator. He, and coincidentally Ferrari in Europe at the same time, did invent the basis for the first and still pretty much arguably the best alternating current motors, again for the practical application of alternating currents, that were up until this point well known about but thought “impractical” and also ignorantly thought to be “too dangerous to use”.
Anything recent?
is it in over unity?
375 pounds that was humming. wonder how big a gen it would turn with that torque from all that weight behind the revolutions.
wouldn't know where to start with the math as far as static resistence.
anyhow, cool tool.
No.
@@ourhouseisfull11 add teslas cold steam in a vaccume to the turbine and you will get over unity. any way WOW nice work :)
@@AkaMrJay This unit is using a supersonic nozzle and requires 2+ Atmospheres of differential pressure in order to fully expand the air/steam. Cold steam can not achieve chocked flow in any nozzle and is therefore unusable as a source. However, the latent heat can be extracted through a Gibbs spontaneous reaction when saturation is achieved with air. This pulls the latent heat of 940 Btu from the water without using additional energy, the same as negative atmospheric cold steam would have achieved. Heat of vaporization is still extracted. This allows compression with air or (pure steam) to be compressed to 2 + atmosphere allowing for supersonic extraction in a C/D nozzle. Ironically, in the supersonic converging diverging nozzle, the expansion can be continued easily below -7 psig allowing full expansion and conversion of the latent heat of vaporization into kinetic energy. This can then be extracted using any turbine capable of impulse collection of kinetic energy. Cold steam is not practical.
@@nikola.tesla.r.and.d.centre sounds like Don could use your expertise, ego...
@@nikola.tesla.r.and.d.centre You can not achieve supersonic flow through any orifice until you have achieved mach 1 at the throat of the nozzle or straight pipe. This requires 2 times atmospheric pressure to achieve. If you are using cold steam..... you are less than 1 atmosphere of pressure in the heated water. So you can not have twice the atmospheric pressure and can not achieve supersonic flow. This is rocket science. But this can be easily verified by any number of qualified individuals. I respectfully disagree.
I have the same idea with the automatic transmission car part, search it on UA-cam and saw your videos with seam on your chanel ...nice work
I'm trying to generate some electricity with steam.... and not kill my self in the process 😂😂😂... Wold you be so kind to help me with some answers about efficiency since you got 4 working strategies
What is the most efficient way of converting steam to power
1. Car piston engine?
2. Automatic transmission part?
3. Tesla turbine?
pelton turbine inside of a round casing with a central discharge similar to a Tesla Turbine. Have fun. Be safe.
@@ourhouseisfull11
Or that pelton turbine 🎉🎉🧠🧠🧠
But on the other hand... I had a new ideea, one that doesn't involve a high pressure and high temperature steam reservoir (which is a ticking time bomb)
A stirling engine
It's much safer than steam, the efficiency is only 25% compared with steam, but it's better than nothing... And no one has to die if something explodes.
The high pressure part of the engine, it's much more compact than the high pressure reservoir part of the steam, and much safer overall
@@ourhouseisfull11
I thought a lot in the last month 🙂 🙂 🙂 and came up with a better idea
Why no load on the motor?
Shouldn't the nozzle be tangential to the circle/edge? I'm not an expert so correct me if im wrong.
There is an audible sweet spot that is between 23 to 28 degrees tangential to the edge of the arc radian.
Why is that thing so noisy? Might want to read up on what Mr. T said about noise. Solid back disk, or no?
Properly designed TTs run up to 60k rpm on less than 10 psi.
Got to ask urself what's the trade-off? When you spend $50 for an 8 min vidio? I thought you were promoting lower cost's for self- production of electric?
respectfully, you don't know your but from a hole in the ground.
How was this balanced and is the noise and indication of balance problems?
This is precision balanced. You are hearing the balancing weights which are added to the face of the outer edge of the disk. As it rotates these thin bars are passing the nozzle airjet and hence the sound is created. This was rotating 1800 rpm without being bolted down. It was just sitting on the skid . If we had a slight imbalance this would have been walking accross the floor.
What's the disc thickness and spaces between them?
in this turbine the spaces are .0625 inches and the discs are also .0625 inches in thickness.
Do you sell any steam generator setups?
Yes, on a semi frequent basis we sell out some of our test modules.
How many amps does it produce at top speed?
Because we are using room temperature compressed air, the maximum with this induction motor being used as a generator is only 7500 watts. But we could double this with a permanent magnet generator. and we could potentially double that again if we were supplying high temperature air / steam mix at 500 F @ 50 psi or saturated or super heated steam of 50 psi or greater. We will be doing more testing later. At this time we were only concerned with testing the performance differential with and with out a labyrinth seal against the rotor.
@@ourhouseisfull11 maybe I missed something, but does 625 amps @ 12v DC sound correct?
@@vinny9988 Other way around. This is a induction motor. When energized above the rated speed of the motor it becomes a generator. We wire it up for 240 volts and when we energize it at full speed of the turbine (over the rated speed of the motor it produces 32 amps @ 240 volts.) But obviously we are using more wattage for compressed air than we are getting back from the turbine. But it is an excellent way to check input v.s. output efficiency using cold compressed air. Steam or hot gas under pressure will have a much higher efficiency. These are primarily heat engines, No heat ..... no performance. Here is an example of the same pressure with different heat and moisture levels. ua-cam.com/video/l5cKPCrvX5M/v-deo.html
@@ourhouseisfull11 I'm on the same page. I just wasnt sure what voltage and amps you were getting. Now that I know its 240v @ 32 amps, that is rather impressive. I hope to see this as a completed steam setup, with a boiler capable of keeping up full steam. Keep up the good work
@@vinny9988 I do have the boiler to run it. That will be the next playtime. similar to the 22 inch we built previously. But this one should have much higher efficiency with the labyrinth seal.
ua-cam.com/video/q3_wnLB8bn0/v-deo.html
How much torque this thing produce?
The rotational Kinetic Energy of this rotor at 1800 rpm is 203,575 newtons. It took 3 minutes and 30 seconds for the rotor to obtain this amount RKE. Therefore it must have gained 969 newtons per second. That is the same a .969 kilowatt hours in 210 seconds. 3600 seconds per hour divided by 210 seconds = 17.14 units of .969 kilowatt hours = 16.61 kilowatts per hour output.
Keep in mind this is 72 degree F (cold compressed air 64.88 kJ/kg ) (for steam this is 2676 kj/kg) So the projected maximum output of this unit on steam is actually about 4 times this....... or about 66 kilowatts per hour. This is not the efficiency we had hoped for. But it has real potential usefulness. During this compressed air run it was noted that a water cooled compressor set at 80 psi delivered 70 cfm to the nozzle at a total cost of 27 kilowatts per hour. This gives us a calculated real efficiency of the turbine of 61.5 % not taking into account the waste heat which was recovered from compression.
During the test the compressor waste heat output was measured. Water was pumped at a rate of 170 gallons per hour (1500 pounds per hour) inlet temperature was 72 F outlet temperature was 104 F = 48,000 btu / hour = 14 kwh of heat energy. This gives us a total COP of 1.13 if we do not consider the weight of the 100 hp screw compressor rotor, receiver tank and heat exchangers. This adds an additional weight of 3000 pounds and an additional 96,000 btu heat differential. If we count that heat energy then the COP increases to 2.15. This is still less than some commercial heat pumps but impressive over unity for 100 year old technology.
@@ourhouseisfull11 impressive indeed, and sometimes the old stuff was far more superior than today's standard as it seems that many ppl are after clout. Thanks for you contribution. And thanks for the descriptive reply. I posted a link to Teslas' last paper. I'm sure you have read it. I'll be a regular here.
not tesla torque is enough 1kwh
Emil. This system rotor weighs over 150 kg and is over .76 meters in diameter with a maximum rotational speed of 2000 rpm in less than 3 minutes. If you are so damned smart, then you should be able to calculate the rotational kinetic energy RKE of the systems and the amount of energy necessary to excellerate this very heavy system to these speeds in the given time. You have the video. The calculations are known physics and not subject to your opinions in any way shape or form. This unit produces over 60 kilowats per hour. Your statement is embarassingly ignorant.
Good work but has it ever produced power.
Yes, i have sold them to smaller solar thermal generating businesses that extract and treat fracking water. The steam is a byproduct and they have several smaller turbines that produce electricity which is used to boil more fracking water for purification.
@@ourhouseisfull11 wonder what would happen if it drove a cavitation boiler….