Proxmox can handle P+E cores together just fine, as long as you don't max out the system, then it has a stroke. Hyper-V supposedly handles them fine as well (I have not tested). With the broadcom acquisition, I could really care less about labbing Vmware at this point. However, I would not want this if it were a Xeon, and there is absolutely no workload I'd want to run that needs more than 12 logical cores and 96 GB of RAM, which the MS-01 can support. A lot of homelabbers also want to use quicksync with Plex, as it does great. I have an MS-01 on order, but it hasn't shipped yet, and I'm going to replace my entire cluster with one MS-01.
While from technical standpoint MS-01 has no competitors, I think Chinese IT products are unsafe to use on a secure server network (even for homelabbers). Would be happy to see some feature parity from someone like Asus.
I appreciate your videos, but honestly what would set you apart is actually showing the difference of runnning the hypervisors with the efficiency cores on and off. Even something as simple as a single VM using all the cores for some blender test.
Hi @VirtualizationHowto - Just wanted to message and thank you for your vid, at 7:30 in your video. Just setting up an MS-01 for a NAS-related video and completely missed how to kill the secure boot to ensure USB boot for UnRAID. Massively appreciated bud! 10/10 content man
Thanks for the review. I was wondering if the RAID 0 on two or more nv2 SSD can almost double/triple the speed of READ/WRITE using intel software based raid(interl rapid storage technology). I think you did not cover this part in the video. Bst,
I am hoping Minisforum come out with a better version of MS-01, just like you said, more memory. I am unsure if they will come out with Xeon processor, it will be just too expensive to attract the majority not unless processors price drops.
I bought one a few days ago. Unfortunately, delivery has not been scheduled until March. I'm probably a completely atypical user, because I've ordered an Oculink card for the internal PCIE port and hope to be able to cover my gaming needs as well as my server applications.
There is no such thing as perfect. Everybody has their own thing that they want from their rig - but for me, this one is nearly perfect and for the price it will eliminate bucket load of devices. 3 of those if failover mode will do it's magic eliminating quite few power hungry servers.
@@VirtualizationHowto I installed ESXi 7.03n follow your video. ESXi 7 recognized 2 NIC. However, when i plug in the Network jack and setup static IP. I cannot ping out or receiver any network communication. There is 2 light on the NIC. I'm using default BIOS setting. How did you get your NIC to work?
I recently purchased a mini from venus series with an i7 gen 12 and it comes with 2 Intel nics. It is venus series. Installed esxi 8.02 on nvme. The bios on the venus is much more basic but does support virtualization. I am not sure I would recommend as a reliable home lab setup eventhough I got it to work. My super micro custom build is still going strong since 2019. I do like the idea of a smaller and quiter system. Running and installing VMs on nvme is amazing fast.
I currently have a SuperMicro SYS-5028D-TN4T with a Xeon D-1541 that I am using as a VMware home lab server that I keep running most of the time with various VMs running. I really wonder if this could be an upgrade to that. I’d like something newer that is quiet, small but beefy, reliable and won’t break the bank. Have you done some good VMware testing with this? Any suggestions? I do have a couple NUCs that I’ve tried but they have tended to crash or freeze up. Would be interested in seeing some testing of this box you have with VMware workload.
@njgtguy thank you for the comment and I have the exact same use case as you. I currently have 4 of the Supermicro SYS-5028D-TN4T servers that I have been looking to replace for some time now. I do think the MS-01 is a strong contender. I am going to do some burn in tests on the ms-01 with a few workloads and see if these are stable long term. Will keep you posted. Also, be sure to create a VHT Forum thread on this topic as it would be great to have a thread there with potential home lab upgrades for 2024: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community
the most important is more and more memory - I have Ryzen 7 5800H in my Beelink with 64GB RAM and CPU is at 5% in average while memory is at 80% with the VMs and CTs I have. ECC is not that crucial like the amount of RAM
Thanks for the video. I just ordered mine today (13900H barebone). Intel's site says 96gb memory but Minisforum says 64gb. Does anyone know which is correct? I ordered 96gb before noticing Minisforum's says 64! Haha. I hope I got it correct! LoL. I got a 990 Pro for the boot drive but haven't decided on the other drives and if I'll need a different graffics card. I've been having trouble finding graffics cards that are available and what sizes fit if anyone has advice on that too. Thanks for the fun video!! Jason
96GB does work according to ServeTheHome website review ( maybe video too ). The graphics cards are half height so that is going to be tuff to find. I'd watch as many video's and read as many forum posts as you can on the MS-01. Good choice. Make sure that NVMe, U2 switch is in the correct postion.
@@sbme1147 Thank you for your help. Earlier tonight I also read an issue with the speed of the memory I purchased. I ordered the Mushkin 5200 but another person said they had to go with 5600. I'm hoping I'm ok :-)
I have a very beefy server at home, but i never use it. The specs of this unit that he reviewed would be perfect for home use.@@paulmacgiollacaoine8619
I can't say anything about the hardware itself because I am still waiting for my order, but If I knew about the long shipping times I would never order the MS-01! At first there were some delays because of chinese new year hollidays, now it seems there are some problems with the power supply at the factory. I'm not sure if to believe anything Minisforum says at this moment Be aware, since they charge you the full amount on day one of your order and you wait MONTHS for the order to arrive.
@seanwoods1526 awesome, glad that resolved it for you too. Hey if you don't mind and want to write this up on the forum so it can be indexed by Google, would be great to share your experiences: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community Thanks again!
Something I would like to see related to this machine is how to provide Emby and Plex access to the processor transcoding. I tried a couple of tutorials that I found, but the Linux vm wouldn’t boot after I made the changes.
A Xeon would be great but when you consider the wattage difference between these processors and most Xeons I'm guessing the cooling in this box makes that conversation a non-starter.
fck xeons. it would be x2 price for what. just put AMD there and u will have max 128GB DDR5 with ECC for free. there are max 64gb per stick available anyway, for such small form factor.
@buldezir thank you for the comment! I got an interesting reply back to that very question from someone at minisforum: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community/mini-pcs/does-the-minisforum-ms-01-support-bifurcation-with-the-pci-e-slot/paged/2/#post-699
Thanks a lot, the best review about ms01) i would like ms02 with 7945hx)) 16 cores 32 threads. So, looking for new mini server for esxi 8.0 and cant decide between beelink gtr7, hx99g hx100g or build one with bd790i and pdu inside... def not ms01, bye bye intel with crappy eff cores
@urukan70 Thank you for the comment! Although I haven't tested it personally, I definitely think the UM780 would be a great little machine for a lab server. Hit me up on the forums if you want to chat about it further: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community. Thanks again!
I have one now for a few months and have Proxmox running on it with several Linux and Windows VM and multiple containers, and it runs perfect. Couldn't be happier. Will buy 2 more this year and create a 3 node cluster with High Availability between the 3 nodes.
@002six thank you for the comment! See my written post here where I detail power: www.virtualizationhowto.com/2024/01/minisforum-ms-01-review-best-home-server-mini-pc-early-2024/
Rather than a Xeon, I was thinking more like the C3000 series of Atom processors for lower TDP, QuickAssist and ECC memory support. That fits the home lab market better than a Xeon, IMO.
@gearboxworks I do think a Ryzen CPU would be an awesome alternative for this form factor with the other hardware it includes. It will be interesting to see what Minisforum has up their sleeve.
Yes you are correct. However, the hybrid Intel CPU is the same. The server line is the Xeon. Another advantage of the Ryzen is that it is uniform processors, so you don't have to worry about the side effects of the Performance cores vs Efficient Cores.
@VirtualizationHowto - Are you sure we are talking about the same CPU? The 2017 and later Atom CPUs do not have a hybrid architecture. And from the Intel's C3000 datasheet it is "64-bit server system-on-chip." Maybe you are unfamiliar with it? BTW, I learned about the Atom for Embedded Servers from Patrick over at ServeTheHome Also and it is what iXSystems puts in their higher end boxes for TrueNAS. I tried to include some links to the data sheet and ServeTheHome articles, but UA-cam did not seem to like that. IMO, the Atom it's the perfect chip for a Homelab server given its feature set. I know you want a Xeon and 256GB RAM so you can run, and heat, a small city, and with power draw to match. But I want less heat and less power draw, and I don't need to run enterprise workloads at home!  P.S. A little over a year ago I discovered your videos here on UA-cam when I realized that people were putting out the kind of content I cared about here on UA-cam and it wasn't just "influencers" who are just well-known for being well-known. So want to thank you for making the kind of content that helped me discover professional UA-cam!
@@VirtualizationHowto - I think UA-cam keeps deleting my comment, so I'll make this short. I think you are thinking of a different CPU than I am. The 2017 and later Atom are an embedded server CPU and do not have a hybrid architecture. If you are not familiar with that series try googling "Intel Atom C5000 Product Brief" and take a look at the specs. To me, it seems that given its server-focused features and low power draw it would make the perfect CPU for a home lab server.
It doesn't but is anyone still creating new systems that include them? Don't you just want a bunch of drive connections (or connectivity to an external enclosure) and then run something like UnRaid/TrueNAS?
I've got 3 coming that will be my new VM compute cluster, replacing some old HP EliteDesk 800 G2 machines. Waiting patiently to ship at the end of March, and happy to see all the tips/tricks with these as possible before they arrive!
Proxmox can handle P+E cores together just fine, as long as you don't max out the system, then it has a stroke. Hyper-V supposedly handles them fine as well (I have not tested). With the broadcom acquisition, I could really care less about labbing Vmware at this point. However, I would not want this if it were a Xeon, and there is absolutely no workload I'd want to run that needs more than 12 logical cores and 96 GB of RAM, which the MS-01 can support. A lot of homelabbers also want to use quicksync with Plex, as it does great. I have an MS-01 on order, but it hasn't shipped yet, and I'm going to replace my entire cluster with one MS-01.
Does Proxmox support intel rapid storage technology?
While from technical standpoint MS-01 has no competitors, I think Chinese IT products are unsafe to use on a secure server network (even for homelabbers).
Would be happy to see some feature parity from someone like Asus.
Minisforum has been making appearances at tech conferences and getting reviews from LTT and Gamers Nexus. At least they are out in public.
Brandon Lee 😱same name as the Actor and Son Of Bruce Lee
I appreciate your videos, but honestly what would set you apart is actually showing the difference of runnning the hypervisors with the efficiency cores on and off.
Even something as simple as a single VM using all the cores for some blender test.
This.
Hi @VirtualizationHowto - Just wanted to message and thank you for your vid, at 7:30 in your video. Just setting up an MS-01 for a NAS-related video and completely missed how to kill the secure boot to ensure USB boot for UnRAID. Massively appreciated bud! 10/10 content man
Thanks so much @nascompares! Glad this was helpful!
Thanks for the review. I was wondering if the RAID 0 on two or more nv2 SSD can almost double/triple the speed of READ/WRITE using intel software based raid(interl rapid storage technology). I think you did not cover this part in the video. Bst,
I am hoping Minisforum come out with a better version of MS-01, just like you said, more memory. I am unsure if they will come out with Xeon processor, it will be just too expensive to attract the majority not unless processors price drops.
Absolutely great video, I think this would be a great home lab environment, that isn't a space hog or if you don't have the room for a rack
I bought one a few days ago. Unfortunately, delivery has not been scheduled until March. I'm probably a completely atypical user, because I've ordered an Oculink card for the internal PCIE port and hope to be able to cover my gaming needs as well as my server applications.
There is no such thing as perfect. Everybody has their own thing that they want from their rig - but for me, this one is nearly perfect and for the price it will eliminate bucket load of devices. 3 of those if failover mode will do it's magic eliminating quite few power hungry servers.
Love your video. I would love to see the performance with P+E enabled or E disabled.
Nice video. Did ESXi recognize the NICs out of the box ?
Yes it does, both 10 gigs and 2.5 gigs as they are Intel-based.
@@VirtualizationHowto Thanks
@@VirtualizationHowto I installed ESXi 7.03n follow your video. ESXi 7 recognized 2 NIC. However, when i plug in the Network jack and setup static IP. I cannot ping out or receiver any network communication. There is 2 light on the NIC. I'm using default BIOS setting. How did you get your NIC to work?
I recently purchased a mini from venus series with an i7 gen 12 and it comes with 2 Intel nics. It is venus series. Installed esxi 8.02 on nvme. The bios on the venus is much more basic but does support virtualization. I am not sure I would recommend as a reliable home lab setup eventhough I got it to work. My super micro custom build is still going strong since 2019. I do like the idea of a smaller and quiter system. Running and installing VMs on nvme is amazing fast.
Beardon Lee! Loving the beard 🔥
@jacobburgin826 thanks!
I currently have a SuperMicro SYS-5028D-TN4T with a Xeon D-1541 that I am using as a VMware home lab server that I keep running most of the time with various VMs running. I really wonder if this could be an upgrade to that. I’d like something newer that is quiet, small but beefy, reliable and won’t break the bank. Have you done some good VMware testing with this? Any suggestions? I do have a couple NUCs that I’ve tried but they have tended to crash or freeze up. Would be interested in seeing some testing of this box you have with VMware workload.
@njgtguy thank you for the comment and I have the exact same use case as you. I currently have 4 of the Supermicro SYS-5028D-TN4T servers that I have been looking to replace for some time now. I do think the MS-01 is a strong contender. I am going to do some burn in tests on the ms-01 with a few workloads and see if these are stable long term. Will keep you posted. Also, be sure to create a VHT Forum thread on this topic as it would be great to have a thread there with potential home lab upgrades for 2024: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community
Did vSphere allow SRIOV support for the 710 Nics?
Hey, do you have that server rack inside your office? How loud are those?
It is not loud at all compared to my other equipment.
the most important is more and more memory - I have Ryzen 7 5800H in my Beelink with 64GB RAM and CPU is at 5% in average while memory is at 80% with the VMs and CTs I have. ECC is not that crucial like the amount of RAM
You may optimize arc min & max if you use zfs
@zyghom, definitely good point, it seems like RAM is the commodity you can't have enough of
Thanks for the video. I just ordered mine today (13900H barebone). Intel's site says 96gb memory but Minisforum says 64gb. Does anyone know which is correct? I ordered 96gb before noticing Minisforum's says 64! Haha. I hope I got it correct! LoL.
I got a 990 Pro for the boot drive but haven't decided on the other drives and if I'll need a different graffics card.
I've been having trouble finding graffics cards that are available and what sizes fit if anyone has advice on that too. Thanks for the fun video!! Jason
96GB does work according to ServeTheHome website review ( maybe video too ). The graphics cards are half height so that is going to be tuff to find. I'd watch as many video's and read as many forum posts as you can on the MS-01. Good choice. Make sure that NVMe, U2 switch is in the correct postion.
@@sbme1147 Thank you for your help. Earlier tonight I also read an issue with the speed of the memory I purchased. I ordered the Mushkin 5200 but another person said they had to go with 5600. I'm hoping I'm ok :-)
Good video, i want one of these but they are pretty pricy..
What would your preference be? I'm looking for a home server to run proxmox on for learning purposes.
I have a very beefy server at home, but i never use it. The specs of this unit that he reviewed would be perfect for home use.@@paulmacgiollacaoine8619
I can't say anything about the hardware itself because I am still waiting for my order, but If I knew about the long shipping times I would never order the MS-01!
At first there were some delays because of chinese new year hollidays, now it seems there are some problems with the power supply at the factory.
I'm not sure if to believe anything Minisforum says at this moment
Be aware, since they charge you the full amount on day one of your order and you wait MONTHS for the order to arrive.
Does proxmox really come along with P and E Cores? Heard that it will crash under load?!
I am a little skeptical myself as well. I plan on doing more testing with Proxmox on this hardware to have a good answer on that.
@@VirtualizationHowtoThis is the question I'm most interested in as well.
@CraftComputing did a video on this very topic about a month ago. Turns out Proxmox does work with P & E cores if configured correctly.
@@Chris.Wiley. Yeah, saw it
@VirtualizationHowto what did you do about the TPM error that shows in your video.
honestly just disabled it in the BIOS. These Mini PCs even though they have a TPM, it is not the enterprise spec that ESXi looks for.
@@VirtualizationHowto Thanks for the reply. I was just about to do that..
Go close this loop disabling the TPM in the advance settings resolved the issue.
@seanwoods1526 awesome, glad that resolved it for you too. Hey if you don't mind and want to write this up on the forum so it can be indexed by Google, would be great to share your experiences: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community Thanks again!
Something I would like to see related to this machine is how to provide Emby and Plex access to the processor transcoding. I tried a couple of tutorials that I found, but the Linux vm wouldn’t boot after I made the changes.
wouldn't a potential MS-02 with a xeon lose the igpu and therefore the ability to leverage sr-iov for the gpu?
A Xeon would be great but when you consider the wattage difference between these processors and most Xeons I'm guessing the cooling in this box makes that conversation a non-starter.
The next Xeon D would work.
Good points, some of the Xeons in recent servers are even touting water cooling needed. They are definitely power hungry.
I installed esxi version 8.u2 but i cant access the disks , any idea ?
fck xeons. it would be x2 price for what. just put AMD there and u will have max 128GB DDR5 with ECC for free. there are max 64gb per stick available anyway, for such small form factor.
@buldezir thank you for the comment! I got an interesting reply back to that very question from someone at minisforum: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community/mini-pcs/does-the-minisforum-ms-01-support-bifurcation-with-the-pci-e-slot/paged/2/#post-699
get your camera focus game up to industry standards
Thanks a lot, the best review about ms01) i would like ms02 with 7945hx)) 16 cores 32 threads. So, looking for new mini server for esxi 8.0 and cant decide between beelink gtr7, hx99g hx100g or build one with bd790i and pdu inside... def not ms01, bye bye intel with crappy eff cores
Esxi is for homelabs is dead
This looks really cool.
A really interesting solution? But what about MINIS FORUM UM780 XTX with DDR 64 and 1TB nvme,? Does support virtualization?
@urukan70 Thank you for the comment! Although I haven't tested it personally, I definitely think the UM780 would be a great little machine for a lab server. Hit me up on the forums if you want to chat about it further: www.virtualizationhowto.com/community. Thanks again!
I have one now for a few months and have Proxmox running on it with several Linux and Windows VM and multiple containers, and it runs perfect.
Couldn't be happier. Will buy 2 more this year and create a 3 node cluster with High Availability between the 3 nodes.
I am thinking about pfsense box in this
Bro, you related to Bruce Lee?
Focus!
RIP ESXi 💀💀
how many watts does it consume when idle?
@002six thank you for the comment! See my written post here where I detail power: www.virtualizationhowto.com/2024/01/minisforum-ms-01-review-best-home-server-mini-pc-early-2024/
Rather than a Xeon, I was thinking more like the C3000 series of Atom processors for lower TDP, QuickAssist and ECC memory support. That fits the home lab market better than a Xeon, IMO.
@gearboxworks I do think a Ryzen CPU would be an awesome alternative for this form factor with the other hardware it includes. It will be interesting to see what Minisforum has up their sleeve.
@@VirtualizationHowto - Hmm. Isn't the Ryzen mostly a gaming-optimized CPU, vs. a server CPU? Honest question.
Yes you are correct. However, the hybrid Intel CPU is the same. The server line is the Xeon. Another advantage of the Ryzen is that it is uniform processors, so you don't have to worry about the side effects of the Performance cores vs Efficient Cores.
@VirtualizationHowto - Are you sure we are talking about the same CPU? The 2017 and later Atom CPUs do not have a hybrid architecture.
And from the Intel's C3000 datasheet it is "64-bit server system-on-chip." Maybe you are unfamiliar with it?
BTW, I learned about the Atom for Embedded Servers from Patrick over at ServeTheHome Also and it is what iXSystems puts in their higher end boxes for TrueNAS.
I tried to include some links to the data sheet and ServeTheHome articles, but UA-cam did not seem to like that.
IMO, the Atom it's the perfect chip for a Homelab server given its feature set. I know you want a Xeon and 256GB RAM so you can run, and heat, a small city, and with power draw to match. But I want less heat and less power draw, and I don't need to run enterprise workloads at home! 
P.S. A little over a year ago I discovered your videos here on UA-cam when I realized that people were putting out the kind of content I cared about here on UA-cam and it wasn't just "influencers" who are just well-known for being well-known. So want to thank you for making the kind of content that helped me discover professional UA-cam!
@@VirtualizationHowto - I think UA-cam keeps deleting my comment, so I'll make this short. I think you are thinking of a different CPU than I am. The 2017 and later Atom are an embedded server CPU and do not have a hybrid architecture. If you are not familiar with that series try googling "Intel Atom C5000 Product Brief" and take a look at the specs. To me, it seems that given its server-focused features and low power draw it would make the perfect CPU for a home lab server.
Does it come with any RAID controller?
It doesn't but is anyone still creating new systems that include them? Don't you just want a bunch of drive connections (or connectivity to an external enclosure) and then run something like UnRaid/TrueNAS?
You’re kidding, right?
Nice review!
But man, what a price even for a barebone!
Better buy yourself components or a second hand server. for that price
I've got 3 coming that will be my new VM compute cluster, replacing some old HP EliteDesk 800 G2 machines. Waiting patiently to ship at the end of March, and happy to see all the tips/tricks with these as possible before they arrive!
@AndrewWells527 thank you for the comment! Awesome, keep us posted on how it goes with the new cluster.
vendor lockin and lack of due diligence is what i saw here
@shephusted2714 thank you for the comment! Are you referring to vendor lockin with the hardware or with VMware that was used for testing?
@@VirtualizationHowto you can do better on both, objectively speaking