As a teenager the DMS replaced my 277 route RT In London, hated them! Hated the boring box shape, hated the coin machine, hated never knowing if it would breakdown,again!
I just about tolerated riding on a DMS. I didn't like the internal decor of blue seat moquette with green stripes grey wall panelling and white ceilings. Yes they were clean and bright colours matching that used on the Merlin and Swift single deckers. But it led to a colder environment. Almost tartan style seat moquette, burgundy and sung yellow ceilings used on Routemasters and the XA/XF was a pleasant colour scheme as was green and the cream ceilings used on RTs and RF/GS single deck types. The RM/RT both gave me a thrilling experience in all aspects engine sounds and all and I couldn't get the same feeling from a DMS. It is only my opinion I'm not just taking a swipe at the type. I've travelled on worse!
I Use to Drive for a Bus company that had, bought 3 Dms's for School Runs,& Service work, Once I got the hang of Driving them,l loved driving them! I totally agree with you, that you, that they earned a bad rap from London Transport! Great Upload!
We had them on our school route in SE London. The 124 and 124A used to run from Catford/Forest Hill area to Welling, straight past Crown Woods school, which at the time (1972ish) was the largest comprehensive in the country with over 2500 pupils. A couple of weeks before the DMS came into service, we had one parked in the school car park, so that everyone could have a practice at putting 2p in the machine at 3:30. Of course, when they came into service, most of the kids cramming onto the bus at school out time just squeezed past the turnstile!
The 124 was my local route (at the Forest Hill end). I remember taking my dog up to Bexley Hospital (to run on Dartford Heath, not as a patient!) on the Sunday afternoon extension on the 124A. The current 124 is a pale imitation of what was once a very frequent route.
@@ROCKINGMAN Yes, I started on the 37s (I hated that route) and transferred as quickly as I could to the 53s. There were some great characters at the garage but I didn't get on with the garage manger - or Parrish - the inspector who couldn't wait to book anyone up at the common.
Sutton garage (A) had the re-engineered ones from about 88 onwards with the Iveco engine. They flew but suffered from severe body judder when stationary in traffic. The upgrade gave them a distinctive final drive (?) whine. I hated it when the MCWs replaced them.
I think that's the problem with a lot of the re-engined buses including the Cummins engined RMLs. The engine and drive wasn't totally matched and could cause a lot of stress to the transmission. When I was type trained on the RMLs at London Central, my instructor told me not to use the holding gears or change gear if it was a slow bus as it would damage the gearbox.
Think my fav livery was the CMB light blue and white. Great video. I still hold fond memories of them as trainers with LCBS. They ran well and as a mechanic I found them easy to work on. AN's could be shall we say pigs.
I came across them as open top with Big Bus in central London back in 99 and recall one with a Voith gearbox easily audible. Perhaps that's the form I'd want to preserve one in. That red one featured here sounds really good.
Great mini documentary. Love vintage buses, especially LT types. XA's and XF's were nice, a rear engine bus that still looks 50's. Have mixed views on the DMS. Early styles were not bad but as the years wore on they became less interesting and scruffy. Hated the B20, an after thought, with ugly rear. Was aware of the Mancunian and thought how smart they were and similar to the DMS. Didn't know Ralph Bennett was the inspiration for the DMS. Remember the DMS from new 1970 at Abbey Wood for old RT/RM route 177. The seat moquette was also used for Swift/Merlins (I think), 1967 stock and a modernised RF. ABC bus book I have states that some DMS' had Rolls Royce engines. Was this true? Seems DMS' interior inspired new bus Metro-Scania MD class. DMS' returned to Woolwich in the 90's with Metrobus. Remember seeing DMS 1 (EGP 1J) on route through Woolwich in early 80's. Must have been from Catford. Could you do LT's MD/MS class?
Glad you liked it. Yes there were a few DMS' with Rolls Royce engines fitted as a bit of an experiment. I will have to do some research on the Metro Scanias first!
@@JakeSCOC Again mixed views on the MD. I always think a true London bus has to be designed by LT. MD's were not, but LT was already having trials with the single deck one in 1970 (VWD 451H) I think. Look forward to that one if you do it.
Great love for the DM/DMS here. This one was lucky enough to ride on brand-new ones, on their day of introduction on various routes as a kid. Southend Transport's livery was this one's favourite, outside of London.
Thanks for the video. I used to get these to school from the age of 11/14. I remember the first day of service on my local route and I went for a 3p test run. They replaced RMLs. In the 3 years that I travelled on them, I never saw one broken down or had a breakdown on a journey. I used to love the rear seat, for the warmth in winter ( not so good in summer) and the sensation of turning right or left at a junction, always felt like you were on a fairground ride. Many years later I was acquainted with EnsignBus and still got to go and see them. Two of the buses I travelled on to school , one ended up in Dover docks and the other I was very surprised to see in Hong Kong. I think looks wise they have faired well, they still look modern today.
I've never actually filmed the cab of DMS550 which I didn't realise until you commented. I will have to sort that out for a future video. And at the time the upper deck was being restored and had no seats. Again, I can sort that out now it's nearly done.
As child and later a professional bus driver I’ve always loved the DMS I went on the first ones in 71 on the 220 from White City to nans and grandads in Hammersmith on the 91 Fulham to Hammersmith and on the later B20s on the 220 to school in Fulham ,sorry but LT and sad to say the Union didn’t help strapping 2 tons of extra equipment I ask you a turnstile on a bus 😮it’s hardly ever worked as a school kid the driver let us sit on it 😂,if I ever meet you I could go on for hours about this bus mate 😊,if I was offered a DMS or an RM the DMS would win for me ,my favourite livery was the mid seventies white upper deck windows LT livery but WMPTE a close second. I would love to drive one too ,I could go on but my finger hurts 😂😂 All the best mate and thanks for a great channel Mark. 😊😊👍🏻😃
I worked at Southend Transport in 86/87 and we had Some ex-LT DMS's (I recall DMS's 820/822/1849/926/1008/1015 and 1029) which were sturdy buses but as I was a Conductor horrid to conduct on our 1 Southend-Rayleigh and 3A Southend-Canvey . We operated the former Culture Bus 614 and on at least 1 occasion a DMS was used by us in London on the route-64 on the scrolls (As 614 not on the scrolls) 2 hours running time on the circular route with 1.5 on Saturdays in them days. Retrobus of Northfleet still have 1 they use on PH's 🙂
I used to drive them at Kingston bus, I think they were brought out off the driver training department. We also had the MCW Metrobus. At the time we used to say Oh no I've got a DMS. Looking back, given the chance today I would prefer the DMS
Hello Jake, thank you for a very interesting video. I admit that I have a fondness for the LT RT type buses as I travelled to and from school on them in the 1960s, and during your video on the DMS s noticed one displaying the destination Forest Hill route 194 my route , and going the other way to Croydon Airport (London’s first international airport before Heathrow). The route 194 buses were based at Elmers End garage ( ED ). Whilst I lived in London I did get a ride on FRM1. I left Elmers End, and London, in the early 1970s before ED closed. Before London, I travelled on the first Maidstone & District Leyland Atlantean buses in Kent to school in the very late 1950s. Pity so few DMS s made it into preservation. Just found photos of the last days (Oct 1986) of ED garage with RT1702 (12), DMS2577 (194 Croydon Aiport), LS1 (12A) and RM911 (12) 😥
Hi i'm viatron from Sheffield again, I remember one bus operator in South Yorkshire who had London DMS-style double deck Leyland Fleetline were S.Y.P.T.E. via being based on this design. But they were bought new from both British Leyland & M.C.W. subjecting to they weren't bought second hand unlike many other bus operators such as like G.M.P.T.E. in Manchester or W.M.P.T.E. in Birmingham for instance, plus these ones for S.Y.P.T.E.were something as a one off fleet via there is only one preserved at the South Yorkshire Transport Trust at Eastwood in Rotherham still in a very bad condition & I hope it will be finally restored to it's original coffee & cream livery of S.Y.P.T.E. in the near future. Thanks for your co-operation on this very special London Transport DMS-type double deck bus subject from David Viatron Esquire of crookes in Sheffield. So see you on a DMS bus today so HOLD VERY TIGHT PLEASE! DING! DING!..
Hi David. Yes I have to admit I forgot to put those into the video. Very similar except they had a low driving position (no power steering) and no shroud at the back.
Absolutely loved DMSs. though rode very few in London! I'm from the West Midlands, so the WMPTE examples were the first I encountered, though I soon got to ride on those of Stevensons, Midland Red East/Midland Fox, Midland Red North and many others, including Ensign themselves on the London 62! Total classic, showing just how out of touch LT was in the seventies!
The Alexander L type Daimler Fleetline was the most common double decker on the Scottish Bus Group fleet nearly every SBG company bought a fleet of them
My husband says you are right to say they are unjustly criticised. Our council(Chesterfield), when it was allowed to run buses, bought 16 of then second hand, so they cannot be that bad! I probably have happy memories of riding on them . . . But,I won't go into that!
A couple of these took me to school in Aylesford in Kent all the way through the mid 90s. The same buses were still going into the early 2000s so they can’t have been that bad!
My favorite livery of DMS is the one in Citybus Hong Kong ages ago, with a lovely looking dolphin drawn on the sides of the bus. It was a special livery for the Ocean Park service which is still hosted by Citybus in nowadays. It looks very cute that the people on the upper deck is riding on the dolphin! There was another livery by Citybus Hong Kong that looks similar to the one I have mentioned, but with a big bird on the side of the bus. It was used to advertise the new aviary in Ocean Park at that time. Sadly that the aviary is closed for years and both liveries are no longer on the Citybus Hong Kong anymore!
The best user of DMS in HK is definitely the now defunct CMB, supplementing the huge fleet of Fleetlines of different lengths and heights. While being shorter, they were more flexible and hence suitable for the terrain of Hong Kong Island.
As a conductor at NX I always preferred the ill-fated MD (Metropolitan Scania) and it was a bit of a let down when they were sent off to Plumstead and replaced by DMs and even RMs. As a kid I can remember the turnstiles on the DMS and SMS were almost always out of order - their only useful purpose was the metal barrier serving as a foot rest for weary drivers and passengers!
I lived in Abbey Wood in 1981. One morning I noticed all the buses were MD's. I rode around seraching the new buses and couldn't work out what had happened. I now know The old AM and AW garages had closed and a new one at Plumstead took in all the MD's from NX and PM. My world wasn't the same without my beloved Routemaster. I actually found it upsetting.
I remember Coventry / West Midlands transport operating in the 70s a small number of Fleetlines with double entrances, although I recall them only initially having both entrances in operation and soon it was always roped off (rather posh bit of purpose built rope I recall) and I believe they were eventually rebuilt as single entrance. Were these ex MCW DMS or were they a batch of double entrance fleetlines built to order to try out double entrance but quickly abandoned due to the "criminality" of West Midlanders?
Western, Clydeside, Highland Scottish took quite substantial batches along with independent operators such as Graham of Paisley and the Ayrshire Bus Owners group A1.
Always thought the Ensignbus blue and silver suited them and going back further DMS 1933's special livery for the 50th anniversary of LT was a good one.
These were always used on my school bus route until their replacement with MCW Metrobus mk1’s. I’m biased, but of course my favourite livery was SYPTE / SYT.
This was one type of bus I wish was seen a lot more in Leeds, was only around the early 90s when my home city had a fair few by a couple of small independents like Aireline. I would love to think how one would look in Black Prince colours in reality. I have a model of a DMS which I hope to do in that livery at some point.
WMPTE went for them but then again they were big Daimler Fleetline operators anyway. Their's were early single door conversions where the semi bulkheads that surrounded the centre exit door were retained and I think a double seat was mounted longitudinally, this resulted in the new panels having a slightly smaller window. Later conversions had the semi bulkheads removed at it was realised they were not load bearing and could be removed completely, giving the appearance that they had never been dual door in the first place as a standard window could be utilised. Don't forget the DMS.s also had a raised driving position.
I have a nice transparacy I took of a DMS at Midland Red Works (I cannot recall if it was for Midland Red / NBC. or a subcontract overhaul for LT (mid 1983 year)
Problems in London - overhaul (not Aldenham style compatible) lack of spares time came in the 1970s as the DMS were due for first light garage overhauls so had bits robbed out of others (the same was happening to RTs in fairness)
Sourcing the original types of AFC units would be nice. I Say different as the early DMS issued Pink Card Tickets, compared to later (and some SMS ?) buff tickets off a "cheese roll" of Lon don Trans port ticket blanks- setright sized. (I have 22 cheese rolls in a shed I have lost the key to)
Ah happy childhood memories of DM/DMS around East & North East London . LT just could not adapt to the different maintainance regime required & your never going to get the LT half cab enthusiasts to like them.
@@JakeSCOC @simonflynn168 DMS steering was superior to the WMPTE steering, which was retro fitted with AutoSteer (or Auto VEER!) air assisted power steering.
@@fatscottie1997 ah yes the famous Autoveer! I've only ever driven one bus fitted with it and to be honest, it was OK. Must've been a particularly good one as I've heard the horror stories. Something that was a good idea on paper but not in practice...
rode on DMS to from school FROM 1973- 1976 they had their good points and bad points that was not the bus fault it was down to bad maintenance shortage of spares . some DMS were used by low cost units set up when private companies used them on LT tender routes NB for EG had some when they became Kingston Bus , Also Metrobus Cityrama Bexleybus Suttonbus they were good workhorses
The DMS was a great bus ...it just wasn't a Routemaster in LTs eyes ....Birmingham operated over a 1000 Fleetlines in similar conditions to London and absolutely swore by them ...
Big Bus did have its roots in Maybury's Tours that were done on own account and for other tour package operators. Cityrama came - and went - but i think again the owning people had an earlier coaching operation heritage, even so some of the operators (in London) seemed more "second rate" than others. Even Grey-Green with Eastender Bux (Dix) seemed not the greatest compared to the new (Scanias?) on the 24., maybe it was an unfortunate use of the brown.orange.white livery
Seems odd that you don't deal with Ensignbus in more detail, especially as they ran a lot of these DMS buses when they took over many routes to the east of London and out into Essex.
The Question isn't weather the DMS was better or worse than the RM or RT,..because they are not comparable. .the question is were they better or worse than the MCW Metrobus? out of the two i've only driven the Metrobus, as the DMS's were on their last legs when i passed my test, i think the Metrobus was more successful,..🚌🚌🚌🚌
As a teenager the DMS replaced my 277 route RT In London, hated them! Hated the boring box shape, hated the coin machine, hated never knowing if it would breakdown,again!
I used to work for Chesterfield Transport in the 80's we had 16 DMS's they were as good as anything else.
I just about tolerated riding on a DMS. I didn't like the internal decor of blue seat moquette with green stripes grey wall panelling and white ceilings. Yes they were clean and bright colours matching that used on the Merlin and Swift single deckers. But it led to a colder environment. Almost tartan style seat moquette, burgundy and sung yellow ceilings used on Routemasters and the XA/XF was a pleasant colour scheme as was green and the cream ceilings used on RTs and RF/GS single deck types.
The RM/RT both gave me a thrilling experience in all aspects engine sounds and all and I couldn't get the same feeling from a DMS.
It is only my opinion I'm not just taking a swipe at the type.
I've travelled on worse!
The original headlamp layout on the DMS (closer together) reminds me of the front end of a 1972 Stock Tube Train
Yes 100% now you mention it.
Nice one 👍👍👍
As far as I'm concerned the DMS looks better than the RM any day...
Love the B20 with the 'chimneys' :)
OJD192R and OJD232R were still operating for Morley's of Whittlesey in 2005, right up until their demise that year.
Loved deeply by the late Jill Vinee. Remember her at Norbiton in the late 80s. She the odd dime want to swap a Metro for a DMS
@@johnrafferty8087 What a great choice to have. Metro or DMS!
I Use to Drive for a Bus company that had, bought 3 Dms's for School Runs,& Service work, Once I got the hang of Driving them,l loved driving them!
I totally agree with you, that you, that they earned a bad rap from London Transport! Great Upload!
We had them on our school route in SE London. The 124 and 124A used to run from Catford/Forest Hill area to Welling, straight past Crown Woods school, which at the time (1972ish) was the largest comprehensive in the country with over 2500 pupils. A couple of weeks before the DMS came into service, we had one parked in the school car park, so that everyone could have a practice at putting 2p in the machine at 3:30. Of course, when they came into service, most of the kids cramming onto the bus at school out time just squeezed past the turnstile!
The 124 was my local route (at the Forest Hill end). I remember taking my dog up to Bexley Hospital (to run on Dartford Heath, not as a patient!) on the Sunday afternoon extension on the 124A. The current 124 is a pale imitation of what was once a very frequent route.
@@ROCKINGMAN Yes, I started on the 37s (I hated that route) and transferred as quickly as I could to the 53s. There were some great characters at the garage but I didn't get on with the garage manger - or Parrish - the inspector who couldn't wait to book anyone up at the common.
Sutton garage (A) had the re-engineered ones from about 88 onwards with the Iveco engine. They flew but suffered from severe body judder when stationary in traffic. The upgrade gave them a distinctive final drive (?) whine. I hated it when the MCWs replaced them.
I think that's the problem with a lot of the re-engined buses including the Cummins engined RMLs. The engine and drive wasn't totally matched and could cause a lot of stress to the transmission. When I was type trained on the RMLs at London Central, my instructor told me not to use the holding gears or change gear if it was a slow bus as it would damage the gearbox.
Think my fav livery was the CMB light blue and white. Great video. I still hold fond memories of them as trainers with LCBS. They ran well and as a mechanic I found them easy to work on. AN's could be shall we say pigs.
That's interesting to hear from a mechanical point of view. Thank you commenting.
I came across them as open top with Big Bus in central London back in 99 and recall one with a Voith gearbox easily audible. Perhaps that's the form I'd want to preserve one in. That red one featured here sounds really good.
Must have sounded amazing with a Voith in the back? This one in the video is DMS550 and she's a lovely old bus.
Great mini documentary. Love vintage buses, especially LT types. XA's and XF's were nice, a rear engine bus that still looks 50's. Have mixed views on the DMS. Early styles were not bad but as the years wore on they became less interesting and scruffy. Hated the B20, an after thought, with ugly rear. Was aware of the Mancunian and thought how smart they were and similar to the DMS. Didn't know Ralph Bennett was the inspiration for the DMS. Remember the DMS from new 1970 at Abbey Wood for old RT/RM route 177. The seat moquette was also used for Swift/Merlins (I think), 1967 stock and a modernised RF.
ABC bus book I have states that some DMS' had Rolls Royce engines. Was this true? Seems DMS' interior inspired new bus Metro-Scania MD class. DMS' returned to Woolwich in the 90's with Metrobus. Remember seeing DMS 1 (EGP 1J) on route through Woolwich in early 80's. Must have been from Catford. Could you do LT's MD/MS class?
Glad you liked it. Yes there were a few DMS' with Rolls Royce engines fitted as a bit of an experiment. I will have to do some research on the Metro Scanias first!
@@JakeSCOC Again mixed views on the MD. I always think a true London bus has to be designed by LT. MD's were not, but LT was already having trials with the single deck one in 1970 (VWD 451H) I think. Look forward to that one if you do it.
Great love for the DM/DMS here.
This one was lucky enough to ride on brand-new ones, on their day of introduction on various routes as a kid.
Southend Transport's livery was this one's favourite, outside of London.
Thanks for the video.
I used to get these to school from the age of 11/14.
I remember the first day of service on my local route and I went for a 3p test run. They replaced RMLs.
In the 3 years that I travelled on them, I never saw one broken down or had a breakdown on a journey.
I used to love the rear seat, for the warmth in winter ( not so good in summer) and the sensation of turning right or left at a junction, always felt like you were on a fairground ride.
Many years later I was acquainted with EnsignBus and still got to go and see them.
Two of the buses I travelled on to school , one ended up in Dover docks and the other I was very surprised to see in Hong Kong.
I think looks wise they have faired well, they still look modern today.
Glad you liked it and it brought back these happy memories.
As always an enjoyable video, but unfortunately for me there was a lack cab footage and interior footage like upper deck and stairs etc,
I've never actually filmed the cab of DMS550 which I didn't realise until you commented. I will have to sort that out for a future video. And at the time the upper deck was being restored and had no seats. Again, I can sort that out now it's nearly done.
As child and later a professional bus driver I’ve always loved the DMS I went on the first ones in 71 on the 220 from White City to nans and grandads in Hammersmith on the 91 Fulham to Hammersmith and on the later B20s on the 220 to school in Fulham ,sorry but LT and sad to say the Union didn’t help strapping 2 tons of extra equipment I ask you a turnstile on a bus 😮it’s hardly ever worked as a school kid the driver let us sit on it 😂,if I ever meet you I could go on for hours about this bus mate 😊,if I was offered a DMS or an RM the DMS would win for me ,my favourite livery was the mid seventies white upper deck windows LT livery but WMPTE a close second. I would love to drive one too ,I could go on but my finger hurts 😂😂
All the best mate and thanks for a great channel
Mark. 😊😊👍🏻😃
I worked at Southend Transport in 86/87 and we had Some ex-LT DMS's (I recall DMS's 820/822/1849/926/1008/1015 and 1029) which were sturdy buses but as I was a Conductor horrid to conduct on our 1 Southend-Rayleigh and 3A Southend-Canvey . We operated the former Culture Bus 614 and on at least 1 occasion a DMS was used by us in London on the route-64 on the scrolls (As 614 not on the scrolls) 2 hours running time on the circular route with 1.5 on Saturdays in them days. Retrobus of Northfleet still have 1 they use on PH's 🙂
Thanks for sharing your memories. I heard that the DMS wasn't very popular in Southend.
I used to drive them at Kingston bus, I think they were brought out off the driver training department. We also had the MCW Metrobus. At the time we used to say Oh no I've got a DMS. Looking back, given the chance today I would prefer the DMS
Hello Jake, thank you for a very interesting video. I admit that I have a fondness for the LT RT type buses as I travelled to and from school on them in the 1960s, and during your video on the DMS s noticed one displaying the destination Forest Hill route 194 my route , and going the other way to Croydon Airport (London’s first international airport before Heathrow). The route 194 buses were based at Elmers End garage ( ED ). Whilst I lived in London I did get a ride on FRM1. I left Elmers End, and London, in the early 1970s before ED closed. Before London, I travelled on the first Maidstone & District Leyland Atlantean buses in Kent to school in the very late 1950s. Pity so few DMS s made it into preservation. Just found photos of the last days (Oct 1986) of ED garage with RT1702 (12), DMS2577 (194 Croydon Aiport), LS1 (12A) and RM911 (12) 😥
Hello Doug. Glad you liked the video and found it interesting. Some nice memories you have there. I might have to do another special on FRM1...
Hi i'm viatron from Sheffield again, I remember one bus operator in South Yorkshire who had London DMS-style double deck Leyland Fleetline were S.Y.P.T.E. via being based on this design. But they were bought new from both British Leyland & M.C.W. subjecting to they weren't bought second hand unlike many other bus operators such as like G.M.P.T.E. in Manchester or W.M.P.T.E. in Birmingham for instance, plus these ones for S.Y.P.T.E.were something as a one off fleet via there is only one preserved at the South Yorkshire Transport Trust at Eastwood in Rotherham still in a very bad condition & I hope it will be finally restored to it's original coffee & cream livery of S.Y.P.T.E. in the near future. Thanks for your co-operation on this very special London Transport DMS-type double deck bus subject from David Viatron Esquire of crookes in Sheffield. So see you on a DMS bus today so HOLD VERY TIGHT PLEASE! DING! DING!..
Hi David. Yes I have to admit I forgot to put those into the video. Very similar except they had a low driving position (no power steering) and no shroud at the back.
Absolutely loved DMSs. though rode very few in London!
I'm from the West Midlands, so the WMPTE examples were the first I encountered, though I soon got to ride on those of Stevensons, Midland Red East/Midland Fox, Midland Red North and many others, including Ensign themselves on the London 62!
Total classic, showing just how out of touch LT was in the seventies!
The Alexander L type Daimler Fleetline was the most common double decker on the Scottish Bus Group fleet nearly every SBG company bought a fleet of them
Passed my test in one of these back in 1986 (KUC936P)
My husband says you are right to say they are unjustly criticised. Our council(Chesterfield), when it was allowed to run buses, bought 16 of then second hand, so they cannot be that bad! I probably have happy memories of riding on them . . . But,I won't go into that!
@@MelanieRuck-dq5uo 🤣
A couple of these took me to school in Aylesford in Kent all the way through the mid 90s. The same buses were still going into the early 2000s so they can’t have been that bad!
I been waiting for the next instalment of classic bus history ❤❤❤❤
It was inept LT fitters with the not invented here mentality. Operators snapped them up and got decades out of em
My favorite livery of DMS is the one in Citybus Hong Kong ages ago, with a lovely looking dolphin drawn on the sides of the bus. It was a special livery for the Ocean Park service which is still hosted by Citybus in nowadays. It looks very cute that the people on the upper deck is riding on the dolphin!
There was another livery by Citybus Hong Kong that looks similar to the one I have mentioned, but with a big bird on the side of the bus. It was used to advertise the new aviary in Ocean Park at that time. Sadly that the aviary is closed for years and both liveries are no longer on the Citybus Hong Kong anymore!
Citybus has had some amazingly colourful liveries over the years.
The best user of DMS in HK is definitely the now defunct CMB, supplementing the huge fleet of Fleetlines of different lengths and heights. While being shorter, they were more flexible and hence suitable for the terrain of Hong Kong Island.
As a conductor at NX I always preferred the ill-fated MD (Metropolitan Scania) and it was a bit of a let down when they were sent off to Plumstead and replaced by DMs and even RMs. As a kid I can remember the turnstiles on the DMS and SMS were almost always out of order - their only useful purpose was the metal barrier serving as a foot rest for weary drivers and passengers!
I was a conductor at NX in the 70s and never had a duty on one of those DMS's
I lived in Abbey Wood in 1981. One morning I noticed all the buses were MD's. I rode around seraching the new buses and couldn't work out what had happened. I now know The old AM and AW garages had closed and a new one at Plumstead took in all the MD's from NX and PM. My world wasn't the same without my beloved Routemaster.
I actually found it upsetting.
@@rondobson9774 If I remember rightly, the DMs replaced the MDs around 1979/80.
I remember Coventry / West Midlands transport operating in the 70s a small number of Fleetlines with double entrances, although I recall them only initially having both entrances in operation and soon it was always roped off (rather posh bit of purpose built rope I recall) and I believe they were eventually rebuilt as single entrance. Were these ex MCW DMS or were they a batch of double entrance fleetlines built to order to try out double entrance but quickly abandoned due to the "criminality" of West Midlanders?
Western, Clydeside, Highland Scottish took quite substantial batches along with independent operators such as Graham of Paisley and the Ayrshire Bus Owners group A1.
Always thought the Ensignbus blue and silver suited them and going back further DMS 1933's special livery for the 50th anniversary of LT was a good one.
1933 Special 100% yes. Very classy.
Did my training and passed my test on an LT DMS. Passed 1st time so it must have been an OK bus.
These were always used on my school bus route until their replacement with MCW Metrobus mk1’s. I’m biased, but of course my favourite livery was SYPTE / SYT.
This was one type of bus I wish was seen a lot more in Leeds, was only around the early 90s when my home city had a fair few by a couple of small independents like Aireline. I would love to think how one would look in Black Prince colours in reality. I have a model of a DMS which I hope to do in that livery at some point.
How about a Quickstep liveried DMS? I thought their livery was very smart as well.
@@JakeSCOC Good idea, I never actually thought about that! 👍
WMPTE went for them but then again they were big Daimler Fleetline operators anyway. Their's were early single door conversions where the semi bulkheads that surrounded the centre exit door were retained and I think a double seat was mounted longitudinally, this resulted in the new panels having a slightly smaller window. Later conversions had the semi bulkheads removed at it was realised they were not load bearing and could be removed completely, giving the appearance that they had never been dual door in the first place as a standard window could be utilised. Don't forget the DMS.s also had a raised driving position.
fun fact one DMS (DMS763) still survives out in hong kong, but is in poor condition
I have a nice transparacy I took of a DMS at Midland Red Works (I cannot recall if it was for Midland Red / NBC. or a subcontract overhaul for LT (mid 1983 year)
What's my favourite livery? I think I would go for London Transport red.
Plain red? Yellow doors? White stripe or white top? Shillibeer or Chocolate Box? Even the LT livery has a lot of selection. 😉
Problems in London - overhaul (not Aldenham style compatible) lack of spares time came in the 1970s as the DMS were due for first light garage overhauls so had bits robbed out of others (the same was happening to RTs in fairness)
Sourcing the original types of AFC units would be nice. I Say different as the early DMS issued Pink Card Tickets, compared to later (and some SMS ?) buff tickets off a "cheese roll" of Lon don Trans port ticket blanks- setright sized. (I have 22 cheese rolls in a shed I have lost the key to)
Ah happy childhood memories of DM/DMS around East & North East London .
LT just could not adapt to the different maintainance regime required & your never going to get the LT half cab enthusiasts to like them.
I used to travel on them a lot but noticed they were disappearing slowly 😮
I remember as a kid when West Midlands pte had dms fleetlines most drivers said they were better then the ones that West Midlands had
Might be down to the power steering? The original Fleetline could be a heavy bus to steer when loaded.
@@JakeSCOC @simonflynn168 DMS steering was superior to the WMPTE steering, which was retro fitted with AutoSteer (or Auto VEER!) air assisted power steering.
@@fatscottie1997 ah yes the famous Autoveer! I've only ever driven one bus fitted with it and to be honest, it was OK. Must've been a particularly good one as I've heard the horror stories. Something that was a good idea on paper but not in practice...
I went to school every day on the 157 route I’d buy one
Was the London Busses in History Post Busses?
Cause they Red like Phone boxes or mail boxes
😊😊No Good in The Summer ? ( With a Full Load Going Up Hill ) EX Sidcup Garage !
rode on DMS to from school FROM 1973- 1976 they had their good points and bad points that was not the bus fault it was down to bad maintenance shortage of spares . some DMS were used by low cost units set up when private companies used them on LT tender routes NB for EG had some when they became Kingston Bus , Also Metrobus Cityrama Bexleybus Suttonbus they were good workhorses
I think it was early 1980s when CK of Cardiff got a few DMS for services to compete with Cardiff Corporation.
The DMS was a great bus ...it just wasn't a Routemaster in LTs eyes ....Birmingham operated over a 1000 Fleetlines in similar conditions to London and absolutely swore by them ...
@@briankay4713 I totally agree with you Brian
Always thought the DMS was a good looking bus.
Mainly the shape.
Big Bus did have its roots in Maybury's Tours that were done on own account and for other tour package operators. Cityrama came - and went - but i think again the owning people had an earlier coaching operation heritage, even so some of the operators (in London) seemed more "second rate" than others. Even Grey-Green with Eastender Bux (Dix) seemed not the greatest compared to the new (Scanias?) on the 24., maybe it was an unfortunate use of the brown.orange.white livery
I think the DMSs were good old motors. Maidstone & District bought a number of seconds hand DMSs.
Used to ride on ex London DMS on trips Basildon swimming baths
NIBs was owner
Nelson independent buses
Personally my opinion was the main thing wrong with the DMS was London Transport itself.
Seems odd that you don't deal with Ensignbus in more detail, especially as they ran a lot of these DMS buses when they took over many routes to the east of London and out into Essex.
Interesting video. It's Daimler Monoc Standee by the way. There were more Leyland engined DMSs than Gardner.😄
Thanks. Glad you found it interesting. I never knew or have heard that version but it does make sense. LT codes could be a little cryptic at times eh?
Would have to say the westmindlands Pte blue and cream made them look good
D2629 thx629s the chocolate box was mt favorite
Good choice
wonder how many met there fate at barnsley yards
100's I expect - bar the ones that were exported.
Never had a ride on a DMS or DM
The Question isn't weather the DMS was better or worse than the RM or RT,..because they are not comparable. .the question is were they better or worse than the MCW Metrobus? out of the two i've only driven the Metrobus, as the DMS's were on their last legs when i passed my test, i think the Metrobus was more successful,..🚌🚌🚌🚌
It's a good question. I've driven both and found the Metrobus much more comfortable and forgiving if I'm honest.
Dms at Lut hindley deport 80s
Dms buses were not reliable they broke down a lot.
An ugly ,noisy metal box on wheels and unreliable.
But better than the plastic of today's bus world?