The 'Magic Fingers' Repair Technique
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- Опубліковано 6 жов 2024
- LER #395 - Two Android Internet TV Boxes - Both are dead. Can we fix them? Well sometimes you just need magic fingers!
*** DO NOT TRY THIS ON HIGH VOLTAGE CIRCUITS! ***
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Thank you
Richard
I had a notion about how to fix this, i just couldn't put my finger on it...
There is a resistor missing my friend look at back at the video it was there when you first started the repair more than likely the enable resistor great videos my friend keep them coming
That would make sense 🙂
The resistor going to pin 1 was always missing. See 12:20 point. My guess is their chip didn't need it so they did not populate it.
@@debochch That sounds about correct, as I mentioned I do not know the correct chip nor could I find the SMD code. I was using the same technique as recognising a 78xx voltage regulator, or knowing which is a mosfet gate pin, and spotting a dual op amp chip' SY8009 is almost 'generic' for these SOT23-5 and SOT26-6 buck controllers with 5V input. If the in/out/ground pins match and you can see a resistor network from pin 6 it will quite likely work. I did expect to see pin 1 pulled up to 5V and it wasn't. My finger did the rest. It's all familiarity, as I mentioned.
@@LearnElectronicsRepair Yep, at 13:10 there's a resistor next to the FB pin and at 13:15 it's gone.
Very perceptive. Nice call.
Real life repair work with no BS, excellent.
I have a very basic understanding of electronics. Your videos are amazing. Well produced, excellent narrative, clear explanation, all while showing real world diagnostics. Simply amazing!! Thank you for all of your content! I am working my way through your backlog and look forward to future uploads.
Cool to see that I'm not that weird for doing the ''magic fingers'' trick when trying to locate faults! (Had a fair bit of success with ''the trick''!) 😁
Well done Sir. My magic fingers have found several bad solder joints in exactly this manner. Pressing on a circuit board can cause enough of a flex to re-make a bad connection.
Very much enjoy your videos, Thank you. you tell a great story, love following along, got me a lab started, but have not done much yet
Sounds like you're ready to get to work! The gear ain't gonna work itself!
@@RK-kn1ud So true. My wife Told me that 'jobs won't do it themselves if you don't do it'. Of course with my logical way of thinking I quickly pointed out that dishes dry themselves if you just leave them after washing up... Turned out that was *not* the correct answer 🤐
Many people might not have even noticed the LED turning on, and then probably would have never figured out that your skin allowed an enable signal to the chip. Amazing detective work! Magic fingers indeed 😜
For all the others who arent native at english speaking and are elecronics-learners: the thing with the coil is spelled "buck regulator" and not book regulator. Hope I could save you some time looking it up
Ive had similar where the analogue logic in an 1980s audio power amplifier control circuitry led to maybe gates and the diodes were photosensitive. the unit would stay in protect if there were any light leaks through the fan holes and if you waved your hands around the back it would work. I had the honorific of golden hands as a result.
Great job! I tried repairing one of these and gave up. I just might pull it out of the scrap box and try again.
Nice. Let us all know how you get on with it 🙂
That little discovery bought a smile to my face at the end there!!
Nice job Richard. I fixed an almost identical (Different PCB) problem to yours with one of these boxes. Mine also had a dodgy wifi module. I had two, fixed both. As I said before, one had a crowbar diode and the other one, like yours didn't 🙂Aliexpress had the exact part that was needed luckily for me. Magic fingers 😆
Doubt this will fix it but may be worth a try as I did notice there' was a cap or resistor that was next to the faulty chip. The hot air probably pushed it off when you were removing the faulty chip. Might be worth a try? It looked like a cap but if it was a resistor it may be the culprit. I do love bodge wires though! Always fun watching your videos.
Yeap, I notice that too. It looks like a resistor and also we can see the trace goes to one of the enable pins, so you're most likely right.
I dont know if you saw that on the datasheet the top mark for that AN-SY8009 you chose was in fact following the same marking convention as the burned out chip! Great video, I am learning soooo much from your content!
I didn't look at it actually. There is something different with the enable pin on the original chip so I guess it is similar but not the same
@@LearnElectronicsRepair ..another possibility is that it actually is the corrct chip, or atleast would work on a undamaged board...
what i belive is happening is that it never turns on - it never gets a enable signal, either bcouse of board or chip dmg... many many chips has multiple functions not nessesarly used in a particular design, we can also se the board is designed for multiple versions, so likely thers a dmg somwhere on the board...but its loikely the devoce will work (the chip/thread dmg dont prevent the nessesary functions to work) ...
now thats a magic finger! it has somehow teach me a lot thankyou very much! GOD BLESS!
A friend came today with a broken wifi in-ear receiver which would only play on the right channel. Easy, probably a broken connection on the audio jack, as everything else works perfectly.
And... no, a quick check on the audio part shows no problems at all. Time to investigate. While taking the PCB out, I knocked a tiny push-button from its pads - nothing to do with anything audio.
Soldered it back, the receiver works on both channels. 26:25 is **exactly** my reaction :D
A little bit of luck involved there Richard but mostly your keen eyes and vast experience. Good job keeping yet another piece of tech out of landfill👍
Yeah definitely a touch of luck was involved 😉
Sometimes you need a pull down resistor. i had a multimeter that would almost never latch on. i found that with my fingers touching certain parts of the latching transistors it would always turn on. i added a resistor and not had a problem since.
nice work Richard, and done in an economical way for the customer too... hope it lasts! lol
i have the same exact box with disabled hdmi port might try to use this trick to enable it
Hurray it is alive😳😻🤗.
Your tip looks like a giant against the voltage regulator🤣🤣.
Good repair 👍🥳
Magic fingers indeed. Great job.
I encounter (and replace) a 6 pin version of the chip inside Xbox One controllers at least 10 times a week. They blow all the time, Rich.
There's 3 in each controller. 1 Buck, 2 Boost. If anybody has a stone dead Xbox controller, it's usually one of these. When it isn't, it's a shorted cap. (C33 being a culprit)
Thermal camera is on my list. One of those days :) So far I mostly had things fail open or fail shorted where they didn’t cause catastrophic trouble. Like a pre-regulator on a supply that’s supposed to generate between 200 and 1400 VDC. With preregulator gone it was stuck on 1400V, and things were getting toasty but not dead yet. Fingers and 1400V doesn’t mix though. That one elicited respect as it could push almost 20W at 1400VDC. Would be a bad day to touch it.
i remember once, i was repairing an lcd screen board, i had to stick my lips on it to make it work, and i eventually ended up detecting the fault using my lips haha
Great fun video, you are indeed a magician ! I think you have the right chip and there is actually a problem with the enable signal worth a quick look ?.....cheers.
I've used this technique on the south bridge of XBox 360s a time or two.
great job with the magic fingers touch :)
At 10:29 your chair farted again and it totally cracks me up every time I hear it 😂. Thank you for the video Richard!
That update button on the first board is the FEL button. This is bound to be an Allwinner/Sunxi based device.
ah, wrong. amlogic s805
Much appreciated! Thanks
Dios santo profesor! esto estuvo muy loco, dedos mágicos en efecto! por qué funcionó? los dedos estaban tocando ese pin? como supo que habia que poner resistor?
Nice job
Indeed we need that kind of finger time to time.
I had similar repairs, where the receptacle has broken away from the board. I epoxy the part to the board, then solder it.
Another satisfying video 👍
magic finger my friend! only works with the experience and knowledge to know what to do when the magic manifest it self. Then you apply the solution. two thumbs up!
Which is rather better than two fingers up LOL 😅
100% this sort of repair comes down to experience above anything else, and it's the one thing I can't teach, but hopefully I can give you guys the confidence to keep on doing this stuff and learn it for yourselves
Great video, as per usual. But in the end, what was the issue? Seems to me like you successfully bypassed the problem but… what was really wrong with this device, then?
The buck chip died, and that was the only problem it looks like. They sometimes just die - perhaps they are not derated well and work too hard, or just are chips that fail due to production or design issue. Enable was self inflicted (see other comments) it seems and even if not then no big deal enabling it permanently as shown
Awesome....love it❤
If the Android has a multilayer PCB, it may have a broken via that you are connecting by pressing on the chip. Your 100k then, effectively, bypasses the broken via. Just a thought from past experience.
Oh, wow, great fault finding.
I'm confused. He said his guessing almost worked, because the Enable pin is in the wrong position.
But regardless of that, the resistance of his finger got the device working. But what does the resistance have to do with the enable pin?
In the end he soldered a 100K resistor from the Enable pin to the 5V spot, so wouldn't it be safe to say the problem wasn't the chip he replaced with but the resistor that was in the way and not working properly?
In the first case i sometimes use the soultion to cut open the power supply and connect the cable directly to the board. You wouldnt be able to plug in and out anymore, but most devices are stationary anyways and like that there is no risk of it to happen again.
From my experience this is for a smaller solder tip. I usually do a mess with smds around if I use the big tip for such small components. Might depend on your hand stability and sight. I don't really require a microscope for this yet, but need more perception about what else I could touch if I use a bigger tip.
Use flux correctly and the big tip does a really good job as it has a higher thermal mass. But in the end all this comes down to personal preference, find a way that works for you and don't worry too much how others are doing it 😁
I use the hoof tips on surface mount all the time. I find that thinner solder wire is more help than tiny tips.
Ever see the trick where you lay down the solder paste or thin wire on the whole row of legs on a surface mount ic and just run it all over with the hoof? If you can get to where you don't make more than the occasional bridge it's way faster removing an occasional bridge vs soldering each leg one at a time.
Maybe there was a floating MOSFET gate on the enable pin in the Buck converter chip, that reacted to your finger.
Yes I think something like that, because the datasheet said to connect En to Vcc so it must be a high impedance input. The 100K resistor I selected is working well.
Surprised that 1st one booted with 5v since it said 12v-1amp on the bottom.. could be reason the soldering melted from over current?
Yeah you are correct, I just looked at the voltage on the power supply that the customer provided with it. I'll tell them it is the wrong one. Thanks
I saw this also. Maybe a month ago, it was faulty tv box in this channel, ant there was said (i think capacitor was faulty), that it is bad too low voltage for them
You accidentally knocked off the bottom resistor near that buck regulator… this is why using your finger the ic starts to work…. It might be the EN as 0.2v is too low for a logic 1…
could it be a bad resistor on the enable pin line, feeding 2v. instead of 5v ?
Does it need the remote to turn it on? I.e you're just knocking it out of standby by pulling up the enable pin?
You showed this box the middle finger 😂
Magic fingers indeed 😃
Yes i do find its much harder using the fine tipped
There is less heat at the fine tip but if you keep everything clean, use good flux and get the heat adjusted correctly it is possible, also depends on solder quality. I use a fairly fine tip for small smd stuff, the other day i removed a diode the size of the head of a pin. i'll be using the soldering iron to replace it once i find the correct rf pin diode with reasonable postage in small quantity. If you remove something that small with a big blunt tip the part can almost get lost in the solder blob on the tip.
Where i can buy an "magic finger" ?
Stoke-on-trent?
How much do you charge for magic fingers repairs?! :D Cool.
Good show Richard!. Question if I may. I have a 'smart' power bar that doesn't start up, and I believe that it is a similar device that has failed. I can't seem to nail down what type of device it is and the marking yeild no results. What would you do in a case like this? How would you determine what the component is, I mean other then observations like this is likely ground, +5, this is enable etc etc. How do you locate a replacement component that may not be the same device, but suit the application in the absence of any meaningful component data?
If your component isn't as very obviously burnt, I would start from the input of your device and trying to figure out why the input isn't reaching the output.
But do I have to have enough fur on my fingers to weave an afghan?
Hey, Richard: if you ever need a 54-year-old apprentice . . . :)
I have Android box bought bought it here in Canada what the problem is is you watch it and after a little while and it's random it seems the video cuts out and then it comes back in I've been trying to troubleshoot it for about 2 weeks now it's just a video drops out and pops back in it's not rebooting tried feeling around nothing seems to get hot and I thinking maybe the IC has to be refloated
All i can say is MAGIC video. 😁😁😁
Can you get oat cakes out there?
Errmmm. Nope. We have to smuggle a few dozen of them over in the suitcase whenever we visit the UK
Heya lol really magic fingers lol
Those little bastards are used on the ZX-UNO board 1.2V and 3.3V.
Reusing a broken connector is not something I would be comfortable with.
Hahaha, nice one
Bro lol 😆 love it
You make Euros? Where do you live?
Maspalomas, Gran Canaria. I'm originally from the UK, moved here in 2016 as I didn't agree with a particular vote in the UK and it seemed better to run than try fight it 🤐
Thats how you loose laptop Cpu place finger
Slightly misleading title
🤣
Magic fingers😮. That’s what my Mrs says too!!
That guy must use loads of those boxes in a hotel?? Anyway that was awesome. U going to leave it like that?
Yeah don't see why not. Probably put a bit of heat shrink over the resistor leg. The guy who brought them in sells them to Brits who don't want to watch Spanish TV, though really they should as it is a good way to learn the language, especially with the news channels as they are very visual and have text on the screen also so you can understand the context of what the presenter is saying in Spanish then pick out as many words as you can. I know people who have been here for 20 years and don't speak a work of Spanish apart from Por Favor, Gracias and Cerveza. These are usually the same sort of people who complain that foreigners move to the UK and don't even speak English. Go figure eh?
@@LearnElectronicsRepair The ultimate in hypocrisy!
@@LearnElectronicsRepair una cerveza por favor is all you need to know
@@nunosilva1821 Well it certainly goes a long way 😅
YOU SHOULD REALLY GET A CHEAP THERMAL CAMERA TO IDENTIFY THE HOTSPOTS QUICKLY.
THE FIRST BOX WAS AN EASY QUICK REPAIR. ITEM NEW IS $99. JUSTIFIABLE REPAIR. NOW....THE SECOND ITEM. $35 NEW ON AMAZON. BY THE TIME YOU INCLUDE TIME AND THE PART, ITS NOT WORTH FIXING.
You showed this box the middle finger 😂
You showed this box the middle finger 😂