There Is No Case For Freedom Of Movement Post Brexit - Keir Starmer
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- Опубліковано 23 вер 2024
- The Labour leader seems to be frightened to talk about Brexit and aspects of it, perhaps because of the reaction from people in the 'Red Wall' and the media. But when he says there isn't a case for bringing back freedom of movement, he is wrong.
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#brexit
#freedomofmovement
#immigration
#generalelection
Credit: BBC
Considering how I hate & detest what the Tories have done to this country, I am amazed by the degree of my distrust & lack of enthusiasm for Starmer's Labour taking over
I'm with you on that suspicion. Cur is just another Tory LITE. He has no empathy for the ordinary person, multi-millions should be banned from standing as candidates. And the NHS is not safe under Weasel Streeting.
Vote Tory if you think it will work out for you, it will not but you have a choice.
He is a scummy Blairite and a backstabber.
Labour seems to want to become the new tories, since the old ones are dying.
@@Speederzzz They don't have to become it. Cur and Weasel are already 100% true Light Blue.
The Brexit idiots thought removing freedom of movement wouldn’t affect them going to Europe 😂
EXACTLY
The very people who would normally retire to Spain or France etc are the very people who are now denied from doing so, unless of course they’ve got loads of money.
The British immigrants in Spain voted for Brexit, literally Turkeys who voted for Xmas!
@@HarryFlowerrsThat’s not factual. Most British immigrants, especially in Spain (and Gilraltar) voted to remain. At the latest when they realised that their UK pension could not be paid without a permanent residence in the UK.
So who wants to go to Europe? Fancy a walk through Paris right now? Take your own fire engine and police guard.
As someone who now lives in the EU, I find it amazing that the politicians and people of the UK seem to think that it's somehow up to them to decide about EU membership. The UK voted to leave and left. Nobody in the EU is in any mood to have a whinging and whining UK back anytime soon. The truth is that the ink wouldn't be dry on the treaty before the UK was looking for exceptions and op-outs.
Well thats English exceptionalism for you, the brexiters spoke their language, _"they need us more than we need them"_ and "we can have our cake and eat it"_ the English people are having to learn the hard way that they are not entitled to any more free lunches and borders have two sides, they will also have to learn what the EU peace project and stronger through unity mean and be enthusiastic supporters before they can join again.
There isn't any chance of an application for the EU members to turn down. Not for at least a decade. You're getting way ahead of yourself.
True, we want back in, we need to join Schengan and the Euro. Unfortunately it’ll be hard to convince people to do that.
@@ProsecutorZekrom And there's those pesky 4 freedoms too. 😉
Starmer hasn't got the balls to say it as it is, it was a mistake, we really screwed up.
True!
Britain has massmedia, an electoral system and an electorate that are not prepared to hear the truth.
One day, mayby, a politician with balls will be appreciated. But we haven't seen that day yet.
The EU was only ever a tactic for Starmer to shaft Corbyn.
The British people as a whole aren’t ready to be told that. Because that’s telling the millions of people who voted Leave in 2016 that they were wrong. People don’t like being told that they were wrong - especially when it’s true.
So. You think it's a good idea for a politician to tell a large share of the voters they were wrong. That'll work out well
@@timonsolus the other factor is that it's almost impossibly difficult for the UK to become a member of the EU again. Voters are looking for positivity and there can be none in this subject.
So it's okay for The SIr to change his mind when circumstances change but it's not okay for a country to do the same...🏴
You already have free movement with Ireland so why is there a big deal with freedom of movement? Also if Farage were to get power I hope not, I think he might attack Reform UK for Brexit and be more open to people.
Well said! 🏴
Yeah. Politics is like a high wire act for everyone except the Conservatives. Announcing free movement, however noble and good it would be, wouldn't best please brexiteers who labour are looking to entice to vote for them.
Vote him out on the fourth, so someone with a bit more sense might step up and do a better job. He's like Johnson, will do anything, and say anything to grasp power.
@@ecaeas4439 I agree, I want my politicians to just put sky high dreams in their manifestos, free ice cream and cupcakes for everyone!
This country has spent 9 years being the laughing stock of Europe yet we are to assume its easy to rejoin?
I live in an extremely safe Labour seat, but I'll probably give LibDem my vote purely to send a message on Europe.
@@IveNoIdeaEither …..and I will be doing the same because I think that our highest priority should be changing the electoral system so that it is representative
Nice, vote Tory 👌
Starmer is doing my head in at this stage,🤷♂️🤦🤦
Brexit - the solution to a problem that never existed
The problem existed for racists, (in their minds anyway)
I don't even blame boris, moggs, farage etc. They're liars. I blame the people that went out and voted to remove my families freedom.
No case for me to vote Labour.
They will vote the original: Farage.
@@peterebel7899: Farage, the architect of Brexit and all the misery that came from it.
@@timonsolus They don't worry.
The misery was generated by unelected bureaucrats, tyrannic imperialists, slave traders and the German car makers:
ua-cam.com/video/HUS0cBdFicI/v-deo.html
Enjoy your Tory Government
@@MurphyOCP-001 I can see that you clearly don't understand politics.
Essentially he is trying to protect the pro Brexit vote, but in doing so he is alienating the pro EU vote! Hasn't anyone told him that pro EU is now the majority!
They have but he needs the Tory vote to get Englands seats without that he gets nothing, hence they should be changing how the elections are run and change FPTP to proportional
No it’s not. Across Europe Eu scepticism is growing.
Nonsense lol @@robroots2492
No it isn't.
It is a question of distribution not pure numbers. no point in winning seats already won by bigger majorities if it means losing needed seats else where and missing out on a majority because the majority is not determined by vote share but by efficiency of vote share. In theory a perfect campaign is winning in every seat by 1 vote and you could probably do that with quite a bit less than 50% of the votes.
The man is deeply disappointing.
That’s what his wife said.
Wait!!!!!!
That’s hypothetical,isn’t it.
@@TheSuperPsychoKiller😂
He's exactly what we all thought he would be isn't he?
No freedom of movement for our people, we are now prisoners in our own country unless we are wealthy 😡🏴🇪🇺🇪🇺🏴
Yes, it's called being working class; I think you'll find a lot of people were in that situation BEFORE we left the EU.
The wealth bar was a lot lower at least. Now you're a much less desirable candidate for a European job vs another European because they have your visa to deal with
There is no possibility of my voting for a party that connives, colludes or acquiesces in Brexit.
Starmer doesn’t want my vote, he’s not getting it.
Ok who will?
@bm1617 Each to his own.
@@nicks4934 The logical answer is the Lib Dems, joining the SM is in their manifesto. I'm happy to say I will be voting for them on 4th July.
@bm1617 and you've learnt nothing, reform are the reason we're in this mess if Brexit hadn't happened, then the economy wouldn't be as half as a mess as it is today
That’s ok ,I’ll get mine.
We have 200k vacancies in the NHS how are we going to fill them ?
According to the Tories .... we'll get the long term unemployed and sick to do it.
They can also work weekends picking crops.
You could ask the EU to send over some EU migrants.
@@willywonkawhitecanemanThere is a significant shortage of health workers in Uganda. A Human Resources for Health Policy is in place to guide recruitment, deployment, and retention of health staff. In spite of this, shortages of health workers persist.
It would be trivial exercise to revise unilateral and nasty discrimination and double taxation imposed on migrant workers, it was pure malevolance and stupidity designed to placate the racists. The Tories wanted to smash the NHS and the care system and that was the way to do it. Reinstating Bursaries and upping the training is a very long term process taking perhaps 5 to 10 years, besides who would want to go into nursing, say, if you knew you were going to be screwed over if the Tories and or Fartrage got in not long after you started your career.
The hospitals are breaking down anyway.
Every time I accept the necessity of voting Labour, that man comes out with some new reason to question a decision made put of hard necessity.
Bloody FPTP
While I’ll vote Labour,Starmer is such a frustrating character.You almost need a Roy Keane type leader.Someone who’ll go after the Tories,tell them what they are,in much the same way they and the right wing media are constantly criticising him.He treated the head to head against Sunak like it was PMQs.He should have gone after Sunak from the off regarding the 2 grand tax hike,but he allowed Sunak to keep lying about it.Julie Etchingham,the presenter didn’t help,but Starmer should have been tougher.He’s just too cautious and unfortunately politics is a dirty business as the Tories are showing us.
There is a small chance that the Labour candidate can overturn my incumbent Tory MP, mainly because Reform are puttig up a candidate so I shall be voting Labour (I'd prefer to vote Green tbh). However I'm currently avoiding Starmer because he makes that decision much harder every time he opens his mouth.
I agree completely. I watched him speak at the national rejoin march and I am a Labour member who voted for him to become leader. I have little enthusiasm to vote for him when I see him say 'there is no case' to join the single market.
If I gave my grandchildren a wish list for Christmas it would be endless, if I gave them everything I would be giving them everything they wanted and ruining my finances, and therefore ruining myself, this is why I am voting Labour because I cannot bear the thought of another prison sentence under the Conservatives. Before any of you shout Boomer or whatever, I am a Labour voter, I was also very very enthusiastic about voting for Jeremy Corbyn, I remember Corbyns promises just before the last General election, I did think he was going over the top with promises that were hard to keep. Not a fan of Starmer, but we have to keep focused on getting Sunak or God forbid Farage away from the top spot. As much as I'd like to rejoin the EU, I think housing, education
and the NHS is top priority, there are also some great Labour M.Ps out there too. We cannot as a country afford to just give people everything they want, a vote for anyone other at the moment is either a Tory or Reform vote and I have wrestled with a Lib Dem over Labour vote myself. How am I personally affected by this current government, for one I am due for retirement in 3 years, ha, I should be so lucky, my partner is 11 years younger than myself, anyone here remember the sneaky law the Tories made about age gap couples and retirement. I am also a carer to my partner who has schizo effective dissorder evdn though I have agonising stenosis and have been waiting 4 years for treatment, I also lost a friend due to untreated cancer. 3 of my grandchildren were in important school years during covid and my daughter in law worked hard during all lockdowns and regularly had covid, her and my son could afford a mortgage but cannot even begin to dream about a deposit, it would be great if they could get a council place now that's anothet joke, the list is endless, so yes, Labour get my vote this time, this is the time to get the Conservatives out, if Labour let me down I'll never vote for them again, personally I think there is a possibilty we will rejoin the EU, it will be expensive and it's not as if we can just pop back in overnight. Think with your heads or else we will have years of hell with a Tory/Nigel shitshow, and we'll be waving goodbye to everything unless we're rich.❤
Starmer does not answer questions about Brexit
Starmer does not answer questions about immigration
Starmer does not answer questions about voting system
Starmer does not answer questions about constitutional reforms
Farage will answer those questions latest 2029...
I'm pleased to hear the tory party is going to get destroyed by Labour, but as a resident of Scotland, I will vote elsewhere.
Vote Reform UK
@@Gerry-d9pwhy would anyone vote for reform?
@@Gerry-d9p no
This is exactly the same for me.
@@Gerry-d9p 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🙄
It appears that there is much that Labour either aren't telling us or don't want to talk about, partly because of socio-political reasons and the very nature of Brexit, but mostly because of the rightwing press and the control that the Tories hold over the MSM.
It's like they're totally hand-tied or ham-strung. I get the sense that Starmer is just as frustrated as we are, if not more so.
You think that? Because the way I see it: he's telling people upfront what he actually thinks. I get that most people on this channel are leftists who hate the Tories and love Labour and hope for some miracle after they're gone. But did it ever occur to people that Labour are just as anti-EU as the Tories? Except they're more polite about it? As a foreigner this is how I see the 2 major UK parties in their relationship with us. They're playing a game of good cop, bad cop with us, but fundamentally they're the same, both anti-EU and both want to cherry pick EU membership benefits. I think the North of England is the best example of this: pro-left (generally) and pro-Brexit.
@@octavianpopescu4776 you're wrong. labour has always been and will always be pro EU. Brexit was predicated on 52% of the country being convinced that the tories are not to blame for the condition of the UK.
@@kieran10202 Then why don't they explicitly and openly say it? Like the SNP for example. There's no ambiguity there.
@@octavianpopescu4776 because the working class of england have been brainwashed over 50 years to trust the tories, and labour's current leader has decided to keep the current voting system rather than share power with other parties, so he needs those brainwashed voters and is humouring them.
@@kieran10202Labour was not pro-Europe on the day after the referendum, when Corbyn proposed an immediate Art.50 notice to the EU.
Labour was not pro-Europe in March 2017, when the MPs were whipped to support exit from the Single Market.
Labour wasn't pro-Europe in March 2019 when they were whipped to vote against ratification of a Withdrawal Agreement tailored to what Theresa May and her staff had heard Labour's representatives demand in public, joining forces with the ERG who hoped for a no-deal Brexit.
Labour was not pro-Europe after de Pfeffel Johnson was made leader for the Tories, and Labour refused cooperation with LibDems and Tory-rebels to unseat him as PM - even after the unlawful prorogation of Parliament.
Shying away from rejoin the EU and not putting it in there manifesto as the reason I'm Shying away from Labour. Rejoin the EU needs to be done and sadly the party to rejoin has only got 26 candidates in the General election. Thankfully though the Liberal Democrats has put rejoining in there's or though its a long term goal but I'd vote for that 👍
He is contradicting himself, there is no logic in his reasoning. He has been such a disappointment. Could anyone tell him that the majority of voters are against Brexit now?
The logic is that he's in the middle of an election where immigration is considered a key battleground issue. A lot of people are against Brexit in general but opening up the UK to freedom of movement is still a huge issue for a lot of the electorate (especially the 65+ bracket) and if Starmer endorsed it now it would just drive them straight back to the Tories or Reform. Anyone that's paying attention knows what he actually thinks but winning power now is more important than dying on the hill of EU membership.
@@Verity98765 Exactly! Sir Keir is not stupid, the UK can't unilaterally reverse Brexit. Until the UK decides as a whole to rejoin, we are not going to get FOM back.
Until there is a vote, you cannot start counting the votes. So the answer to your question is "No, and only an arrogant sob would try". You may wish to delete your post.
@@paullarneUK never had it so good when they were on the EU. They were rule makers and had veto powers. Now they have nothing and are rule takers
Give him until after the election! he cant say anything yet!.
I am fast coming to the conclusion that life will not change under Labour but will continue its downward spiral.
Lefties came to that conclusion years ago 😂
Starmer does not answer questions about Brexit
Starmer does not answer questions about immigration
Starmer does not answer questions about voting system
Starmer does not answer questions about constitutional reforms
Farage will answer those questions latest 2029...
But Freedom of Movement isn't just about people coming here (in a way that kind of self regulates), it is also about Freedom of Movement as a right which was taken off UK citizens, for many of us against our will. A Labour Government is going to have to face up to this, and it should be fighting to get those rights back. Hopefully a Lib Dem opposition will make Labour think again.
Your voters aren't prepared to pay the price for the right to work in Poland or retire to Portugal.
You must correct their view of themselves first, so they no longer despise Europe and Europeans, and so they prefer viewing Europeans as "us" and equals.
Will take time!
Starmer is going to be a big disappointment!
What do you mean, Going to be.
What evidence do you have that this will happen?
Nah. I don't think the people planning on voting for him are really expecting that much, to be honest. It's more that the alternatives are even worse.
The Tory’s last 14 years have been a HUGE disappointment
Not voting for Labour then. I hate politicians who put votes above what is right.b
This is why I won't be voting Labour.
Who you voting for to get us back into Europe?
@@chrissanders1027 The LibDems, Greens, Plaid, Aliance and the SNP anr pro EU and all support europeans core values of mobility and citizens rights. The LibDems have a long step by step process of returing to the EU.
The first step is european core values of wishing to work together, citizens rights and mobility.
www.libdems.org.uk/fileadmin/groups/2_Federal_Party/Documents/PolicyPapers/144_-_Rebuilding_Trade_and_Cooperation_with_Europe__2022_.pdf
@@chrissanders1027 Lib Dems. It's in their manifesto. That's why I'm voting for them
@@GranCanariaUncovered well they won’t gain power so they can offer the world , if they got in opposition with labour in power things could happen but it’ll take time .
Don’t tell me deform lol
He is bad news!
Totally illogical there's no rhyme or reason to this stance!!
It prevents the 2024 election becoming a rerun of the 2017 and 2019 ones. Plus, and here is the kicker, it's not really in the UK's gift to bring back FOM. That is all down to the EU. You can't campaign on something you know is undeliverable.
This is why many will not be voting Labour.
but many will, enough for a majority!
And many many many many will
Perhaps Sir Kwier might be toppled once Labour achieves a good majority, replaced by someone with vision.
@@johnjephcote7636 perhaps you might have cancer , fingers crossed
Which storm drain will you be chucking your vote down, then?
There is a very strong and compelling case for freedom of our movement and Keir Starmer knows it. I find it intensely infuriating that he maintains this position.
I think he means there’s no political case for the EU. They don’t have to let us back in and why would they before we’ve done our time and stand as a salutary lesson to others?
But polls on brexit say 65% of us want back in lets face it, the care sector needs it, farmers need it, the NHS needs it NHS dentistry needs it
So what are the millions that come in already doing over the years ? yes sitting on their arses.
Do you think all EU-countries want you back in?
Do you think the British, when answering such opinion polls, realize how demanding that process will be?
65% of EU citizens do not want you back. Get over it. Not to mention, you do not meet accession critieria
@@jmolofsson I think you're right in believing that the typical person in the street doesn't understand how difficult it would be for the UK to join the EU. Do they realise it means ten years of severe austerity to get the public debt level down enough? Of course not. The UK can't afford to try to join the EU.
Strange how each time Starmer speaks my determination not to vote for (New) Labour increases.
There's a moral case for it, a human case for it, a cultural case for it, a trade case for it, a security case for it, an opportunities case for it, an economic case for it, an educational case for it, an internationalist case for it.
He has taken NOT A SINGLE one of those cases on and shown it is not a case. He plays only one card - we voted get over it - but it is a malodorous lump of mouldy concrete, not an ace of hearts.
The political case isn't really there for it. That's the one that matters when labour are in an election campaign.
I travel the world and speak to people about Brexit and do you know what the intelligent ones tell me ? They tell me if people vote for something and realise it has failed it is 100% democratic to ask for another referendum just like if you make a business decision and realise it is making your business lose are you going to keep watching it lose? You definitely reverse your decision to rescue your business. I really do not know what's wrong with the UK. Brexit paralysed them and could not stand on their feet
@@derekmab7734 What is wrong is the fact that the British press has kept hammering on about this sensible, grown up attitude to political decision making as if it were the most heinous betrayal of democracy. Never mind that the referendum wasn't binding in the first place.
@@dlevi67 This might mean the press is benefiting from Brexit. Most likely tax evasion? If that's the case then no government would be able to do anything about rejoining because of the power of the media, unless the majority of people keep putting pressure on a government to rejoin.
@@ShitoryuGojuryu _There is a strong case, on many fronts, for joining the EEA, CU, and SM. There is absolutely no case for Britain returning to EU FOM_ Entitled exceptionalism through the roof, once again. For the umpteenth time: Single Market and Customs Union access is a privilege awarded to EU and EFTA members only. The EU will not bend over backwards and compromise the integrity (an alien concept for most UK politicians, I know) of the Single Market and Four Freedoms merely to facilitate the UK. Ever. That ship has sailed. The TCA works just fine for the EU and the UK lacks the leverage to change anything about it.
I'm not voting for Starmer, he's got no b*lls, he's just inviting all the problems brexit brought on the tories straight onto labour.
The LibDems, the Greens, the SNP or Plaid Cymru then. There aren't any other options.
I agree.I’m Labour so I’ll vote Labour,but I just wish Starmer would be honest about Brexit.Is he doing this to appease the REDWALL areas that were Labour,then voted Tory BECAUSE OF BREXIT? Is he scared to say ‘Yes I want Labour back in the EU’ for fear that they’ll turn their backs on Labour again and go and vote for say Reform UK? I still can’t make up my mind on Starmer,I really can’t!
@@GaryV-p3h to be honest the SNP are more in line with my thinking at the moment.
@@martinburn If I lived in Scotland I'd be voting for them, but here in Wales Plaid Cymru don't get enough of the share of votes so I will be voting Labour to keep the Tories & Reform out.
@@DerekHarrison-ue9vvWhatever he really thinks we can’t go back into the EU, so why even talk about it. We would need to change so many things politically and financially to be compliant and even then it would be up to all EU Countries to vote to allow us back. Its going to be many years before we can even apply.
Very disappointed that Starmer had said this. He has now definitely lost my vote in favour of LD’s or the Greens and my area can go Lab, Con or LD. Gain a few Tory votes but maybe lose moderate ones.
Don't be disappointed, be happy!
Loads of voters less interested in politics than you are will vote Labour, so the more people like you vote Greens, LibDems or PC, the better for Britain!
One day, you might even be strong enough to get FPTP abolished!
There's no case for me to vote Labour.
Disgusting. All to keep the Labour Brexit votes. I'm thinking of moving to the Lib Dems because I think that they're open to returning to the EU.
Ed Davey seems like a nice person.
I'm a Lib Dem voter but I think Labour offer more in this election
Same here. I'm so disappointed with labour now.
I've just been looking at tactical voting in my area and it seems I should vote LibDems for any chance of removing the Torys. Thing is, I don't even feel guilty about this any more. This man has single-handedly lost my support for Labour.
Well if that's all he wants I am glad I am not voting for him, his party will be full of brexit nutter voters just like tory how gross.
Beth Rigby from Sky news asked Sir Keir Starmer if he thought Jeremy Corbyn would be a good Prime minister?
'I was certain that Labour wouldn't win the 2019 General election' - The Saboteur Sir Keir Starmer
❤️🇬🇧
How did he sabotage him?
I am a labour member and I am also Pro European Union. I want us back in the EU as soon as is reasonably possible. If the Party Leader is saying these things to get Labour to win the election then I will wait. But if this is a permanent view then my membership will end as I want to have freedom of movement. for us and the people of Europe to come here to do the jobs that Brits don't want to do.
The thing is, there is zero chance eu will accept us back in the next 15-20 years. We need to stabilise our economy, restructure our parliament and the eu needs to forget that the uk was always the problem child who was only ever half committed. If we rejoin eu it will be at the cost of all fishing rights and we will have to accept to accept the euro. The eu is thriving without uk, while the uk crashes and burns.
Starmer proving yet again that he has NOTHING to offer Scotland.....
What does Scotland want from him ?
Starmer does not answer questions about Brexit
Starmer does not answer questions about immigration
Starmer does not answer questions about voting system
Starmer does not answer questions about constitutional reforms
Farage will answer those questions latest 2029...
Well except further devolution like trade talks where the SP has devolved responsibilities
Did the journalist ask starmer to be more specific about what case? In fact there is a democratic case for rejoining and that is the polls which are more than 60%
The problem is the outright lie that there is ‘no case’ for FoM
Until the EU-countries are convinced, all of them!, there *_is_* no case for Freedom of Movement for services, goods, capital and persons.
The British wanted control over that.
The EU-countries won't easily give up *_their_* control.
Hmm Lib Dems it is then
Cheers Keir for loosing more potential votes in Scotland 🏴
Yep he has pivoted to the Tory loving English Gammons ?
Labour Scotland is in no fit shape , The racist remarks from them & the snp killed that idea.
And those remarks are aimed at the Scottish race being white.
I won't vote for an anti-EU party.
Labour is not an anti-EU party
@@ftumschk almost as persuasive as "but Corbyn"
Most of Europe is anti EU 😂
Labour playing safety first. The accusation that they're ignoring the "will of the people" would be devastating. "No case for freedom of movement" could be interpreted as, "There is no official consultation which proves that the people are ready to go back to the EU and freedom of movement".
To be honest I do not care about EU rulers or EU whatever but what I do care about is my rights of freedom of movement in the EU that was taken away from me against my will and wishes.
Another reason not to vote for labour 🙄
I mean…he didn’t keep any of his leadership promises…
So is the play here to hope he’s lying about Brexit now too? 😂
Labour’s “hard Brexit” stance on Europe in its 2024 manifesto is far too strong, and one the party may come to regret.
Possibly!
But so was Labour's hard Brexit stance in Parliament 2017-2019.
@@jmolofsson I agree, though Keir Starmer argued for a second referendum until after the 2019 election. Once leader of the Labour Party, he changed his position and whipped his MPs to back David Frost’s (dreadful) Trade and Cooperation Agreement, December, 2020. Following the catastrophic premierships of Johnson and Truss, my (Tory) constituency is now marginal, Conservative/Labour, for the first time, but I intend to vote Green as the most progressive option, not least on Europe.
Idiotic from Starmer , EU rejoin vote would be 65 -35 in favour of rejoin , total stupidity
4 votes in the past 9 years, let's move away from this topic.
@@badgoogle9938You can move away from it if you want. I won't.
Rejoin is at 48% compared to 35%. Once it over 50% it will make a huge manadate to Rejoin which will probably happen when 13-17 years get the vote in 2028-30. At 49 years old I want to hear the voices of the next generation that currently have no Democracy.
@@YellowfinGrouper I had no opinion on it then, I have no opinion on it now. didn't vote on any on those occasions but calling for a revote every time it doesn't go your way is not a principle of democracy.
@@badgoogle9938 Actually redoing votes is entirely democratic. We redo the general election every five years allowing people to change their minds, governments to swap, and the direction of the country to change. Changing governments repeal decisions of their predecessors all the time. Having permanent decisions made by votes isn't smart, and ruling out polling an opinion on a topic just because a similar question was asked eight years ago is stubborn and self-defeating.
In a democracy, the people's will is heard, but how can you know the current will of the people, which may be different from eight years ago for many different reasons, without asking them? If the will of the people hasn't actually changed then a vote would confirm that and we will continue down the Brexit road. Parliament rejected May's and Johnson's Brexit deals because they were terrible for the country. The public should have had this opportunity as well, and as we didn't we should be entitled to change our minds.
Edit: even if we don't have a second vote on EU membership, shouldn't we at least be asked about the custom's union or the single market? This affects a lot of people, and as I recall not only were the details of these hardly discussed during the referendum campaign, but I think the main Leave campaign was fighting for a "soft Brexit" where these things remain unchanged. The "hard Brexit" we got in the end was largely ruled out as an option during the referendum - we were sold lies.
well he and his party can sod off
If Kier Starmer told me the sky was blue, I'd go outside and check.
What the majority of voters want is not freedom of movement but to make holidaying in Europe easier. It's not even 5 years since FOM ended.
How would they wish easier holiday making?
(Are they expecting the same ease from the United States?)
All move to Scotland. Very, very few Tories or Red Tories up there. Vote SNP 🏴
Except the SNP have Kate Forbes, it´s simply not true that they´re a left wing party as such.
@@Minimmalmythicistthe SNP also has the likes of Tommy Shepherd, who is most certainly left wing. I could list off countless Labour politicians (including Starmer) who are not left wing. You'd be struggling to find a party where your views aligned with that of every politician within it. Party policy is what matters.
Snp are nothing but robbers.
@@vanhooler358 You do know the Conservatives exist and their record is clear to see right? Who stole billions of tax payers money during the pandemic? Who partied under armed police supervision whilst thousands died?
Grow up or vote reform like an idiot, your choice.
Starmer does not answer questions about Brexit
Starmer does not answer questions about immigration
Starmer does not answer questions about voting system
Starmer does not answer questions about constitutional reforms
Farage will answer those questions latest 2029...
Just reverse Brexit…if we can that is! Brexit is the on e topic all parties SHOULD be talking about! The quality of politicians in the UK is nearly as bad as that in America!!
You can't reverse it, when/if the UK (or whatever format Britain is in the future) joins again the situation and conditions will be different.
Maybe the EU doesn't want you back.
Sure, just reverse Brexit 🤦♀️.
As of 2024, the UK fails to meet 50% of the accession criteria.
Do you homework and ask nicely again in 2070 (your 🇬🇧 level of suitability is on par with Turkey, and they have been waiting more than 40 years now).
Then we 🇪🇺 shall consider your application and maybe, just maybe, let you back if you hand over Gibraltar, the Elgin marbles, your fishing grounds, and what else we 🇪🇺 have on our wishlist.
Greetings from civilization 🇪🇺
@@EllieD.Violet Ouuuf Ellie, you're a very severe woman. 😅
@@EllieD.Violet
My “homework suggests that Brexit in conjunction with a corrupt Conservative government has pretty much destroyed the UK 🇬🇧
Perhaps you’re the one that needs to wise up on Brexit “benefits” , or are you purposely trying to engineer the total destruction of our country!
"Freedom of movement and residence for persons in the European Union is the cornerstone of EU citizenship, established by the Treaty of Maastricht in 1992." Because of Brexit, the UK voted democratically to not be part of that treaty anymore. The same is for the Dublin agreement and there is no way to go back, unless you are a member of the EU. During the negotiations, offers were on the table from the EU, but these offers have then been rejected because Britain preferred a hard Brexit. When Keir Starmer said that he wants to make Brexit work, already the EU made it clear "Or you are in, or you are OUT! No more cherries on that cake! Brexit means Brexit, OUT means OUT and OUT You are." Britain cannot have "Freedom of Movement" under the Maastricht agreement without being a member of the EU. So far, the only country to have that arrangement is Switzerland: "On 21 June 1999, the European Union (EU) and Switzerland signed the Agreement on the Free Movement of Persons (AFMP). The AFMP lifts restrictions on EU citizens wishing to live or work in Switzerland. The right of free movement is complemented by the mutual recognition of professional qualifications, by the right to buy property, and by the coordination of social insurance systems. The same rules also apply to citizens of EFTA member states." However, Britain wanted to have a hard Brexit and rejected this option during the negotiations. Now Brexit is done and dusted and there is no way to go back. Too little, too late! Not to forget that the UK recently increased the threshold to about £39,000 per year of income, to prevent foreigners to come to work in the UK. In that case, nobody in the UK needs to be surprised if the foreign work force will not be interested whatsoever.
Foreign food producers, foreign Students, foreign Tourists, foreign Medical staff, foreign Teachers and Professors, foreign Engineers, foreign Lawyers, Barristers and Solicitors, foreign Journalists, foreign Nurses, foreign Midwives, foreign Doctors, foreign Caretakers, foreign Fruit & Vegetable pickers, foreign Builders, foreign Hospitality workers, foreign IT workers, foreign Bankers, foreign Investors, foreigners Everyone & Anyone, just avoid Little Britain and go to other countries where they appreciate your work, your help to improve the economy and your money as foreigners.
but Switzerland is member of EEA (European economic agreement) and in the EU SM for trade but the UK not A member and 3 EFTA member are also member EEA and full EU SM so the fom is essential to EU SM to function for them and the EU membership also carry the 4 FOM of the EU SM but the voted for Brexit and out all of EU institutions and not have FOM without the other and labour leader cannot promise what he cannot deliver period oh the citizens having A referendum to join the EU is not up to them the UK had the right to leave the EU under Article 50 but cannot vote itself in the EU but the UK apply like any European nation who wants to join the EU but have to do as any new applicant under unde the Article 49 and go through and if accepted by the all 27 EU member states then will be give the green light to enter the process of Copenhagen criteria like anyone else then fulfill that Acquis in that process 35 of them then the EU commission have verify that they met the conditions of the 35 chapters one by one and if the EU commission feels they met all that then it will summit to EU council(EU sovereign elect head of states) but it will only take one EU member state to veto then its over and will go no further and it will end the process all together its amazing to us in the EU the citizens of UK think all it have to do is hold another referendum and they are in lie getting on bus the getting off the want to hub on bus again oh and there is Re-joining thing on applying to join the EU under Article 49 is available and the process of the Copenhagen criteria to after your application is accepted by all EU member states plus 3 EFTA members i hope the UK citizens will understand the EU is based on Rules and the Law that govern them and special treatment for any one including the who decided to leave their freewill being member before does not change that and you can check on the EU website for joining the EU and Article 49 i hope will learn that is the only way and no other short cuts. greeting from very proud European citizen and EU 27 .
@@henna6126 I totally agree with you. Well pointed out.
Britain managed to vote itself out, but won't be able to vote itself back in.
Not yet to talk about the criteria's that need to be fulfilled, before being able to join the EU/27 member states, i.e. "accepting the Euro €, requirement that a state has the institutions to preserve democratic governance and
* human rights, has a functioning market economy, and accepts the obligations and intent of the European Union."
Just a little reminder:
The UK's applications to join in 1963 and 1967 were vetoed by the President of France, Charles de Gaulle. While it was true that Britain's economy, like many others, was struggling to recover from the high cost of WW2, De Gaulle had personal as well as economic reasons for not wanting the British around the table.
During and after the Brexit referendum campaign, Britain has not stopped to display their hate against the EU as well as campaigning to leave the ECHR for the simple reason that it contains the word "Europe" in it..
The EU/27 member states certainly have reasons enough, to reject any future application for a UK candidacy as a future EU member state and it will not come as any surprise whatsoever.
Furthermore, one cannot join the EU like taking a bus, a taxi, a train, a plane when it suits the political and financial agenda and then tell the EU to f* off after having milked it financially for decades.
* Human Rights:
- isn't it the UK with its Tory government and their friends from the far-right business company Reform UK Ltd, who are campaigning to leave the ECHR and by doing so, are taking away the Human Rights of its population in Britain?
There already is the first hurdle and there are more of them i.e. not respecting international laws and by breaching them i.e. UNCHR Refugee Convention 1951 and its 1967 Protocol.
The UK would be well advised to join Belarus and Russia instead.
@@InTheSpotlight755 I may have missed it in your texts, which would be much easier to read with a few blank lines inserted here and there.
But while it was a genuine interest for neighboring EU-countries to agree with *Switzerland* on membership in the Single Market, the same cannot really be argued for Norway. Still, *Norway* managed to negotiate an agreement, together with Iceland and Liechtenstein, and is after almost 30 years quite happy with the arrangement.
Britain, situated between Ireland and Flanders, has more speaking for it than Norway in the periphery. The EU-countries won't be impossible, if only the UK understands what the nations on the other side of the Channel expect, and is prepared to meet those expectations.
The first step, however, is to stop confusing tourism (Schengen) with residency. Very few Britons have reached that stage yet.
It is disheartening to hear Labour's leadership confuse a time-limited residence permit for 18-30 years old with the right of residence, fundamental to the Single Market (with no other limitations than being able to make a living and _not_ being a burden on society).
@@jmolofsson During the negotiations, it was Norway who rejected any similar deal with Britain like Norway and Switzerland have with the EU. Then Britain rejected anything that could have made their stance easier, but they preferred a hard Brexit. It is like Donald Tusk kept saying: no more cherries on that cake. Even Angela Merkel kept warning Britain about its actions and its own future. In any case scenario there is not much one can do about it now. All to little, too late.
So frustrating, he focuses on Immigration for the freedom of movement. What about our poor young génération who have lost the chance to get expérience OUT of the UK. No Erasmus, tragic. The island will fill up and sink!! Its nature to have two way traffic, you breath in, you breath out😢😢
Rejoin the EU or sodoff.
You cannot rejoin the EU. The UK has a ton of work to do before that can become a realistic prospect and even then it is the EU and its members that make the decision whether the UK becomes a member or not.
I'm continually hoping that once The Labour Party get into power and establish themselves in their role of governing the UK, I truly hope that they will begin boldly and courageously addressing some of these uncomfortable and divisive issues, like Brexit, head on for the betterment of us all in the UK.
Starmer is making major mistakes, BRexit and Gaza just two. Given the state of the country that he'll be inheriting, even a strategic and political genius would be challenged. I don't put Starmer into this category so there may well be other major mistakes yet to come.
I am European and we will have to vote if we want you back!!! You left without asking….now stay were you are!!!
@keirstarmer may become only the second @UKLabour leader to lose my vote
The EU will never agree the UK joining the Single Market without the free movement as it is an inherent part of the package.
Goes without saying!
The European Union will also not agree on granting FoM for services, goods, capital and persons until the British have made up their mind. The British fickleness is an anathema!
Freedom of movement is not required for the one-way flow of people into the UK: that can be achieved much more easily by the UK making unilateral changes to its immigration policy. The unique and significant feature of the EU's freedom of movement is the reciprocity.
Exactly!
That's what control is for.
That's what made voters support Brexit, they said.
(And now they are revealed. Apparently, they voted not only to get rid of workers from Finland, Lithuania, Poland and Romania, but also to avoid seeing Hindus, Muslims and Christian Africans in nursing homes and on their streets.)
@@jmolofsson
Well, didn't work out that well, as neither India, or African countries are EU member states 🙄
Are we out? - yes. Can we rejoin soon? - no. When we can rejoin then Starmer will address this. What is the point of frothing about this in the next 5 years when we simply cannot regain SM membership? Tell me how we could regain SM status soon?
Never. Only as a member of Efta ( blocked by Norway) or full EU member (will take a decade or 2)
@@ab-ym3bfCorrection, as always: will take 2 generations 😊.
@@EllieD.Violet given the ever lowering life expectancy in the UK those 2 might converge 😁
@@ab-ym3bf Tsk tsk tsk 🤣
I'm cheifly canvassing for Labour because they champion renewables and do not want to leave ECHR. Other beige policies, not so much.
You mean policies like putting an end to the child benefit cap that is keeping 500k children in poverty, right? Because choosing to not tax the rich is just self serving politics!
If the skillsets aren't in Britain, two answers; train the indigenous population or bring in the people who already have them.
Here's a case for freedom of movement: we're all human beings.
Not a very good case, if you have nice things & a reasonable life, would you give it up to anyone who passes buy ?
@@vanhooler358 Yes.
@@vanhooler358 Ah yes, all the potholes and lack of houses and raw shit in rivers... That has to be due to all that foreigners abusing Brexit Britain. Not the far-right Tory fucktards unable to do anything but imposing division and hardship
Why is it ok for people to vote away my freedoms, but it's not ok to vote to get them back?
Starmer to afraid to say anything worthwhile, not so much the voice of hope, more the voice of blandness, you see before you a nan desperate to be PM but nothing else
I don't blame him for not wanting to talk about it. Words when they are in opposition - deeds when they are in government.
Why is it good for other countries to loose their skilled workers.
Is it possible to lose even more faith in somebody you had zero faith in in the first place? Keir Starmer is proving that under modern politics, that negative result is not only possible but mandatory.
I heard that he even spitefully shot down an EU proposal that would have given young people greater freedoms
You heard wrong, probably only use British news sources?
It wasn't even a proposal to the UK yet.
Put the following phrase in your favourite search engine, and you'll find it:
"Questions and answers on the Commission's proposal to open negotiations on EU-UK youth mobility"
It was a "recommendation" to the Council, which has to decide if they like the ideas.
It was intended for discussion between the EU-governments, and still is, but that discussion will maybe be downprioritized during Hungary's half year at the Council's rotating presidency.
Rejoining the customs union and EU is going to take 10, 15, 20 years. Its too soon for Labour to start this process, it will take time for the Brexiteers to be persuaded otherwise. Starmer is taking the right approach at this moment in time. He needs to play the long game.
We may not need to convince the Brexiteers, as the timescales also work for allowing the majority to “leave the electorate”.
Starmer is a closet Tory for slow learners.
However, he doesn't have a group of sycophants behind him. His MPs will reign him in and keep him more to the centre if not entirely centre left.
@@DrRusty5Starmer is insecure and surrounding himself with sycophants. There won't be any internal pressure 🙁
Thank god I managed to escape before the clientele at the Knuckledraggers Arms could destroy the rest of my future.
The single market is about to get an overhaul by potentially having a 5th freedom added (Innovation, Research & Education), and having a SM-wide legal system put in place. There would be no scope for allowing 3rd countries to join the SM, even if that were possible, while the SM is being overhauled for the 21st century. Any talk of the UK and the SM is just hot air. That's why Starmer can say "I won't be joining the SM"... of course he won't, and that's not up to him.
Starmer thinks he can appease the bigots. He's wrong and will regret it.
Agree with you entirely. He's just playing in Farage, and Reform's hands. It would then make it even easier for Reform to do the unthinkable, and win outright power at a future general election (in 2028 or 29).
But this is only if Reform win dozens and dozens of seats all over the country, at the forthcoming GE. If they don't (and I hope they don't), then they won't pose as big a threat to Labour, come the end of this decade.
The forthcoming GE is key to whether Reform UK go on become a major political force in British politics in the future; or whether they are just a 'fad' that's gripping the country now - but won't be in five years time.
The ball is firmly in Labour's court. It's just a question of what Starmer does with it over the course of the next four or five years.
If he and Labour stutter and stumble then Reform UK could potentially become huge in the future. If he doesn't cow tow to the far right, and goes on principles and what is really in the UK's best interests, then he and Labour should see off the threat of Reform UK.
I hope Labour have a contingency plan to get rid of Starmer if it all goes tits up, they need to behave like the Tories and change the leader before the next election otherwise they might be out in one term !!
But bringing back freedom of movement is hard and might upset brexiteers so instead let’s just conscript eighteen year olds for a year or two then force them to work those jobs unpaid. I’m sure that will go so much better. *Sarcasm*
Indeed. Why recruit more workers when you can push people til they collapse instead? 😡
I like very much my freedom of movement as EU citizens 😊
Perhaps he’s adopted this policy because EU governments don’t want the UK back in the EU. EU membership, single market membership etc are all in the gift of the EU and not a choice up to the UK. Too many ex remainers fail to understand. Another case of British exceptionalism
He's not saying there won't be a case, he's being very careful.
Honestly, apart from not being the tories (sometimes difficult to tell the difference) what is the point in labour? Scotland can do better than this fool.
...about time he grew a pair and made a real positive case for freedom of movement....with a fast robust case to return those not entitled to be here....
Vote lib dem
Why ?
@@vanhooler358 because they are the only party saying they would rejoin the common market so if that matters vote form them. Although obviously vote tactically
@@tmarrittthey didn’t say that at all. They will start working to rebuild a relationship with the EU, not rejoin. That’s broadly the comms from Labour.
The question of Freedom of movement is not with the UK, it's with the EU. We have no case, because we are the requestee not the guarantor. Starmer is right, we have no case for freedom of movement, becuase it's not in our power to bring it.
I'd call Starmer a weasel, but I'm quite fond of weasels.
I'm not a fan of Starmer, and I'm very pro EU, but i think his response to this question was fine. Saying "there's no case" is overstating it, but politically it makes sense to avoid saying anything that could be spun into signalling that he wants to take Britain back into the EU. These problems with labour shortages need to be addressed with good immigration policy, but that doesn't need to look like the EU's freedom of movement, and many EU member countries are also facing these problems despite having freedom of movement.
I want my freedom of movement back, it has been taken from me against my will, He is making my p**$ boil.
If England can change it's mind on Brexit then surely Scotland can change otsmd on staying in UK .or is brexit a once in a generation vote
Yes, now that GB left the EU there is no case for freedom of movement to be given to GB by the EU.
Every time he talks about freedom of movement and Brexit I lose enthusiasm for voting Labour. I know with FPTP there is no other choice. It is a deeply depressing situation and I feel no hope at all.
You need to prioritize your efforts.
Maybe start with a campaign for Proportional Representation?
NO, Re-join the EU No, Vote for Labour.
If Starmer said that we should Rejoin EU for 2024 Parliment the will be a huge attack like it was in 2019. It's better to either leave it next Parliment because if they do well it will be easier to have a strong mandate for Rejoining. This especially when people who are 13-17 today will be able to vote so they will be able to use their vote.
@@ImloyaltoScotlandonlyWhy am I a "brainwashed and propagandized"? That I'm in favor of Rejoing?
@@mynameisnobody5295my Labour candidate said much the same, it’s a political move to keep everyone happy, i disagreed people are seeing the mess the country is in by voting to impose economic sanctions on ourselves and it’s only going to get worse. The deluded will always defend their stupidity, yet many i know who regret voting leave would welcome another vote.
@@ImloyaltoScotlandonly I don't want a Tory and ReformUK in Government. It why I want reforming the voting system with a mix of Proportional Representation and Single Transferable Vote. The current system is broken as Tories won 43.6% of the vote for a large majority while Labour will probably have a simular majority. It's not good for a healthy Democracy.
@@ImloyaltoScotlandonlyyou will vote Alba or SNP anyway. What’s it to you Scotland person?
You can’t have a softer Brexit without it. There is a huge case for a softer brexit.
We cannot cherry pick..
The Swiss don’t like it either. And the EU remained them what they would have to give up to end it.
For the umpteenth time: *Single Market and Customs Union access is a privilege awarded to EU and EFTA members only* . The UK is neither and will never be able to 'renegotiate' access without consenting to the attached EU membership, if it should ever meet the necessary criteria. The EU will *not* bend over backwards and compromise the *integrity* (an alien concept for most UK politicians, I know) of the Single Market and Four Freedoms merely to facilitate the UK. Ever. That ship has sailed. FFs.
Yes, I'm afraid that whenever we discuss the EU in this country, one thing that is always ignored is the opinion of actual Europeans. And, of course, EU bureaucratic process.
Pretty spot on. We will have to accept common terms as a minimum and that’s going to involve giving up the pound, accepting Schengen, and likely changing our FPTP voting system to be more democratic. I can’t see this happing for at least a term or two (more like 10 to 15 years as a minimum)
@@col.hertford9855realistic
Starmer is being pragmatic. The EU has moved on from the circus of the UK leaving the EU and is focusing on its priorities. I am sure in time it will be open to discussions with the UK on areas of mutual benefit but a lot of damage was done with the dishonest way the Tory’s negotiated leaving. Unfortunately it’s going to be a long hard and slow journey as the EU have conditions to rejoin and they will want to see overwhelming majority of UK population wanting to rejoin before this is up for discussion. While the likes of the Tory’s and Farage have any influence unfortunately rejoining is dead because the EU will not be used as a political football in UK politics.
Starmer will win the coming election but only because the alternative doesn`t bear thinking about. Thank the god I don`t believe in I can vote SNP.
The British Labour Party was never happy about joining the EU from its inception as the EEC
As a matter of fact the big unions supported Brexit and Corben was a closit Btexiteer. So I'm not surprise with this.
If you think that voting Labour is going to change from Brexit? Then you're fooling yourself!
Starmer does not answer questions about Brexit
Starmer does not answer questions about immigration
Starmer does not answer questions about voting system
Starmer does not answer questions about constitutional reforms
Farage will answer those questions latest 2029...
He has seriously let Labour down on this topic. If he supports working people as he claims to, then he needs to leave the door open to freedom of movement and open trade with our neighbours.