"London is increasingly becoming a theme park version of itself." I can't vouch for London, but this is exactly what Edinburgh is becoming, so I can totally believe it.
I'm an American and live close enough to Disneyland that I could work there if I wanted to... I visited Edinburgh in 2019 and I didn't get the theme park vibe at all. Not that I had once visited in, say, 1959 and can compare it to its former self. It was nice, but I don't think you've lost any of the old charm.
@@comicus01 It's more obvious when you visit other places in Scotland with Castles (Stirling springs to mind) or visit other cities and find that Glasgow isn't filled with bagpiping buskers and shots selling souvenirs. I think Americans just assume Scotland is all folksy old country full of bagpipes and tourist shops. Glasgow is more like Philadelphia/Chicago (indeed they film a lot of US films there) and Scotland has a booming technology center, whether it's making more space satelites than anywhere else in Europe, being home to Dolly the sheep and a huge genetics industry, or being the home of the Grand Theft Auto series and a bunch of other tech firms that make it more like Silicon Valley than Epcot
@@CalvinsWorldNews Unfortunately Edinburgh was the only place I went in Scotland (I definitely hope to return one day)... I don't recall seeing any bagpipe buskers. I do remember seeing a lot of souvenir shops, but that doesn't bother me (the one that stands out is what struck me as possibly the largest Harry Potter themed store in the world, close to the entrance to Edinburgh Castle). I don't think there are too many places in the US that I would consider similar to Glasgow, lol. I liked Edinburgh overall. And I never once felt like I was somewhere in the US. It has its own character and feel to it. BTW, which US movies have been filmed in Glasgow? Haven't really heard of that as a filming location.
It demonstrates to others as well, that they are not the only culture that has history and laws which are still part of every day life despite us not seeing them.
For a number of years (way back when!) I lived in a Centrepoint Hostel on Smithfield (that's now fancy apartments with the penthouse selling for £6mil) I loved walking around the area in the early morning, I made friends with a number of traders who would occasionally allow me to take some meat for a discounted price...which was always appreciated and loved by the 50 folk who lived in the building. Though I will always remember the slightly disconcerting smell that occurred every Sunday morning, that was a mix of incense from St Barts the Great church, the bleach used to clean up the after all the butchering, and the lingering residual smell of the meat itself along with the odours from the nightclub Fabric.... It will be a shame when the market eventually moves...
@@mickysj3270 the hostel (or to give its proper name -Foyer-) was above the Club Gascon bar and restaurant next door the the Gatehouse of St Bartholomew's church. The restaurant weren't particularly keen on us living above them, (they thought we brought the value of the area down), apparently they complained about the noise frequently, the police/noise people came numerous times and it was their noise they heard in our flats, which made them get a fine. The family in the Gatehouse though always supported us saying they didnt hear a peep out of us...and wished the restaurant and its clients were more like us. That was just one of a number of issues we had over the time I was there....
@paintedpilgrim That's a vivid olfactory picture, but it's so true- in years past, every part of every town had it's distinctive odours. Now every town is just suffused with coffee, alternating with garlic. Could be worse, but utterly soulless.
@@phaasch most of the time they intermingled, one not seeming to crowd out the other .... though certain times of the year the excess incense gave you headaches, on particularly hot days the smell of meat if not cleaned up properly could be a little nauseating, but the same could be said after big nights at Fabric.....and folk wonder why the area is notoriously quiet at the weekend....
I read the piece in the FT and I suspect that the developers will have to offer better financial terms to the traders to get them to move; frankly, the traders don't need to go anywhere, but the developers always have time constraints and for them it's ultimately cheaper to pay-up. I too regret the loss of traditional markets in central London, my club usually hold their Christmas drinks in an adjacent hostelry to Smithfield, and I always find it somewhat eerie at that time of year, the sense of history is overwhelming. However, a new, larger Museum of London is to be welcomed, and should prove to be popular with the new and improved Farringdon station making access easier.
It is a shame the Poultry Traders are being hen-pecked by the corporation to accept unfavourable terms, it is really fowl for the history and tradition to be treated as such. I could squawk in anger and hope that the clucking corporation see sense and allow the traders to suckseed.
Great Giblets!, as an ex-Londoner (Plaistowe & East Ham), I bask in the irony of a situation where a site with a 1000 years of history with a Royal Charter to boot that is housed in a rather grand looking heritage listed building and is a thriving centre of old family businesses that still serve the community and is free for anyone to visit will be replaced with a museum full of staged history with little 'real life' atmosphere or hussle and bussle, that will be a faint representation of what is at the moment a living thriving real historical experience. Not to mention that this 'new' experience will probably cost you an arm and a leg (of lamb). Well, never mind, there will most likely be a sparkingly sanitized soulless supermarket selling spicy salami sausages as part of the new development by Egret & Egret & Wetlands Limited Incorporated PLC, that'll be 7.5 Million for a studio apartment, that's Pounds not Kilos.. thanks Drew
In fairness to the museum, it's free at the moment and I can't see that changing. I think the museum world has learned from the community backlash when Birmingham's much loved Science and Industry museum (which had been free since I were a lad) was closed and replaced with the dumbed-down "science experience" called Thinktank which costs well over a tenner to get in. It has good reviews on Tripadvisor but strangely they all seem to be from tourists visiting Birmingham rather than locals from the city, unlike other museums.
"Does anyone else find the vague language developers use frustrating?" They use 'weasel words' and yes, I also find them frustrating and not to be trusted.
Only a few days ago I randomly ran across mention of a listed building in London called "No. 1 Poultry", and was disappointed to learn that it's just called that because that's its address, not because it's the headquarters of a particularly confident chicken supplier. Also, I love that the poulterers are using one of England's ancient and arcane legal convolutions against modern real estate developers. I suspect the developers will get what they want in the end, because Her Majesty's Government seems to be historically keen on letting rich folks do whatever they want as a general thing, but it's satisfying to see them have to work for it.
@@Rose.Of.Hizaki Did the traders chicken out of the deal or turn turkey on it, ducking their duty? What's their grouse with the new wing of the Dagenham premises? What's stuck in their craw? What's ruffled their feathers? What's made them turn fowl and tell the developers to get stuffed?
The roads around there are named after what they used to sell (Milk Street and Bread Street are just off Poultry). 1 Poultry is an ugly building with a Tescos metro (chicken sandwiches are available)
I love those old covered markets. They should never ever be abandoned. They're so full of life. The problem with redevelopment in already desirable neighbourhoods is that these quirks they seek to redevelop are what made the neighbourhood desirable in the first place.
I can relate to your sentiments about the market moving. Here in Chicago, the wholesale produce market relocated several years ago. The buildings were redeveloped as flats. While it was great to see the buildings preserved, the area lost a lot of its character, as well as the excellent food stalls that existed alongside the market.
Thanks for this. I now live in New Jersey and it is difficult to find stories like this. I remember looking at apartments, sorry, flats in the Smithfield area after my divorce in the '70's. It was then quite a reasonable area cost wise (as was the Square Mile City in general) - because everyone was trying to get out of London whilst rail fares were still justifiable. I always loved the nooks and crannies of the City and on Sundays it was extremely quiet. My great Uncle had a nice place in the Barbican at the time but that place was not for me. My Grandfather was in the H.A.C. during WW1. Tell me, have all the little "Caffs" (mostly) run by Italian families vanished? Best, Pete.
Sadly yes, many of them struggled on, but the bulk have moved out. We used Attilio's (just opposite the Market) for donkey's years but about four years ago they just disappeared, seemingly overnight, one Christmas.
Yes. York has become a "theme park" as well as Beverley the County Town of East Yorkshire as both have great medieval churches. Most of the old family traders have been forced out of these towns.
And I guess this "stay of execution" also means another London curio: the 'early houses'; nearby pubs that serve the nightworkers of the market, will be able to hold on to that title just a little bit longer.
For my family Smithfield was an important place. My dad was a freelance greengrocer and went to Smithfield on a daily basis. His business grew into something that employed a few people. It was only until the congestion charge was introduced that he was forced to stop going to Smithfield and go to Spitalfields instead.
I used to work night shift in offices near the market. We would head to the pub for breakfast and a beer at 8am (which was equivalent to our evening) and there would be traders finishing their day doing the same. I guess it was the end of old London where the financial city and the market traders lived and worked in the same space
This situation and Jago's take on it at the end rather reminds me of a fairly recent video game called "Buildings Have Feelings Too". In it you go around finding old buildings from Britain's glorious industrial past and find new roles for them, like turning an old workhouse into offices, a music hall into a cinema, and so on. What brought this game to mind was the comments of several Let's Players who have tried it, particularly Many A True Nerd, who labelled it as "Gentrification Simulator". While cloaked in a heavy layer of classic British oldy worldy humor and charm, there's no denying a certain undercurrent of "out with the old, in with the new", and what old things you can't be rid of need to be made to conform with the new, sometimes whether they like it or not.
As usual it's all about the money. Traders as you'd expect want a good deal as they're being turfed out, developer's want to bleed everyone dry as per usual. The vague promise's, spin and downright lies of developers and for that matter council's and governments,is usually successful as it means they can't be pinned down factually. After seven years of a battle with Staffordshire Moorlands District Council we finally got planning permission in 2011 to self build our house, a previous design was turned down, due to the quote,bulk and massing being inappropriate for the site.
Tell my North American neighbors that a city location and businesses have histories going back before the Mayflower blows their minds. So much part of London, why turn it in to a theme park of its former self? Money I know is the answer; but is this just selling our history and culture. Hang in there chicken traders! Great video as always, thank you.
I rather agree with your general comment Jago about the idea of London being turned into something like a theme park. As an aside, back in the early 80's I helped organise a monthly squash competition for the company I was working at back then. We played at a club rather oddly based in the Spitalfields fruit & veg market building. There were certainly some interesting "aromas" when we arrived in the evenings after work !! 😎😱
I love Smithfield market and the surrounding areas. I hope it stays as it is. Things don’t always change for the better, especially in London. Great video as usual thank you.
As one who has worked with Smithfield traders, I reckon the Royal Charter is being pushed for all its worth to get more cash out of the developers. Private Acts of Parliament are eyewateringly expensive!
Another interesting entry in your non-tube related subjects. When I eventually get to visit London, you've given me plenty of ideas where to go. I hope you have a happy Parade Day on Friday. You didn't know that Friday is Parade Day? Well...what else would you do on...March Fourth ??? (Insert groan here!)
As someone that lives in a city with a very active market (Melbourne and the Queen Victoria market), London WILL lose something. When I worked in our CBD it was always great to go to the meat section and get the weeks meat and then the fruit and veg section next door. Your pictures of Smithfield meat vendors reminds me much of Melbourne. And ours is so popular.
I still remember slowly driving through Mud Salad Market (as Punch used to call it), the traditional Covent Garden, in my 1936 Morris 8 Series 1. It was a road for traffic but with people, porters, traders criss-crossing everywhere, one simply had to crawl, brake, crawl.
@@Vonononie all that’s still there’s. The biscuit stalls with the barrels/ boxes of different loose biscuits you buy by weight, the dairy vendors with huge displays of cheeses, creams, butters etc. fish or scallops freshly cooked. Yum. The meat/fish/poultry vendors, each yelling out special offers etc trying to get people to come and buy from them.
Thank you for this update in the markets, Jago. Very interesting. Curious to see where this goes in the future. And I couldn’t agree more with your view on London’s history & current building; I love the realness of the markets right in the middle of new developments. Not having it all too slick & fancy seems rather healthy to me. We need these hardworking families, who are bringing food to our tables, in clear eyesight 💪🏾😁
I have long appreciated the societal commentary aspects of Jago’s videos, providing social history, and the style of delivery of them, and this video, short though it is, is one of the best.
Thanks again for an informative vid. I lived very close to Smithfield for many years ( Golden lane estate) I share your views on what’s happening to our city, the same thing has happened in the west end. You are right London is turning into a theme park. Very sad
I did shift work for a while in Long Lane just near the market and we often went for a pint at 7am in the Bishops Finger which was frequented by traders in bloody overalls. This was before the market was completely gutted and rebuilt inside, with only the shell remaining, because it had become a health hazard. It was not a pleasant sight (nor smell), the road and pavements outside the front would be piled with carcasses and it was enough to turn people vegetarian.
Used to work just up the road at barbican. Meantime, I suspect the poultry sellers just want to feather their nests, are being egged on, and are playing chicken with the city of London.
Your observation of repurposing a historic (and functional) market as a museum that will undoubtedly have a display about "historic London food markets" is spot on. By the giblets, indeed.
14 miles from London! A great spanner in the works . Don't forget the disastrous moves of Covent Garden to Nine Elms and Billingsate to Canary Wharf .it's not as though we have a Paris style consolidated market like Rungis , just grubby out of the way places fated to shrivel away and disappear.
I have to say I am ever thankful for the peeps at St Barts who saved my life when I collapsed in Fleet St one saturday lol Later on I got to know some St Barts student nurses who persuaded me to become one myself.
Great video and thanks for mentioning the death of the two Firefighters. Just to confirm, the use of BA did not come about due this incident, in fact the two men that died were in B.A.(but sadly they got lost in the thick smoke in the maze of tunnels in the basement, ran out of Oxygen[early Proto sets] and were unable to signal that they were in difficulty).What did come about, and is still in use today (in a revised form to meet modern technology and equipment) is the use of Entry Control procedures, Guide Lines and Distress signalling Units.
Whilst I don’t like london losing its history I must admit it’s a nightmare when you’re trying to buy from there even just park your van up . Then panicking so that you get out before seven so you don’t get the congestion charge on your van so I can understand why they wanna move it .
I see the museum of London underground works most days from my thameslink train and they seem to be progressing well. The buildings above ground are a mess with some decayed beyond saving. The traders and their landlord won't spend anything so I'm happy to see them saved and added to London theme park world.
You're wrong about the breathing apparatus (BA) being introduced after the Poultry Market fire. There are photographs on the Museum of London's website of firefighters wearing Proto rebreather BA at that fire. LFB describe this as a ‘landmark fire in the history of London’ where as a result of this tragedy, improvements were made to the BA and procedures used by firefighters. These improvements were adopted all over the country and are still in use today. These improvements included using compressed air cylinders, and an automatic warning signal which sounds as the oxygen levels are running low. Also, BA boards were introduced, with tallies and systems to keep track of the location of the firefighters and the timings of when they entered the fire. A BA Controller would now have responsibility for managing these systems, ensuring firefighters did not run out of oxygen. Similarly, London County Council also sought special powers to be able to deal with fire precautions across all the central London markets. At the time of the fire the basements were a series of small rooms and corridors. The fire caused them to fill with thick, acrid smoke and so the firefighters felt like they were entering a labyrinth. This combined with a collapse of frozen meat packages and carcasses trapped Jack Fourt-Wells and Richard Stocking (both from Clerkenwell where my father served in the 1980s/1990s). Their colleagues were unable to find them before their oxygen ran out. They were wearing 'Proto' oxygen sets, which at the time were state of the art. Many attempts were made to resuscitate both men but tragically they were pronounced dead at the scene. In 1914, Siebe Gorman and Co introduced a totally new concept in breathing apparatus (BA). Designed for use in mines it was called Proto. It was a self-contained system, which consisted of a cylinder of oxygen and an air reservoir or breathing bag containing an absorbent, which removed the carbon dioxide; it was then mixed with a fresh supply of oxygen and reused. The kit included a separate mouthpiece through which to breathe, a nose clip and rubber goggles to protect the eyes. Although requiring special training, it was quickly adopted by LFB and issued to the Emergency Tender crews. The benefit of this BA was that several firefighters could work together as a team when wearing the sets. Over the years the Proto was modified on many occasions, with the final version, the MK V being introduced in the late 1950s, by which time all pumps (the basic fire engine) were equipped with three Proto sets.
Probably worth explaining - especially for viewers outside the UK - that LFB is London Fire Brigage. But thanks, an interesting and informative comment!
@@davidw1518 thanks, I forgot that one. LFB is one of only 3 fire brigades left in the UK as far as I'm aware of, the others are Cleveland FB and Peterborough Volunteer FB.
As a fireman in the mid-1960's I remember recharging the cylinders on Proto sets from large oxygen cylinders using a 2-man hand pump and using only distilled water as a lubricant for the pump pivots - very hard work it was.
Man, that's a pretty meat market. Hope the architecture may stay. (My town redeveloped it's slaughterhouse into a mixed use thingy, and after a rough start, it is beloved by the locals. It can work out, museum or not.. That said, some of the buildings were allowed to stay and be repurposed; hope this is the case here, too....)
Another great video Mr. H. 1. I think you’ll find it’s pronounced egret. 😉 2. Many cities are becoming theme park versions of themselves. Shame really but ‘the tourist pound’… you know. 3. Irony and cynicism are both good in my book. 4. Keep up the good work.
Jago nice one! You should probably make more videos about current affairs in London as well. As a Northerner I am by no ways involved but it's still interesting to me.
Jago, I would buy your gripe about the changes to London if they were planning to tear down all the market buildings and build some glass walled sky scraper or something similar. But they're keeping the buildings and moving a museum (about London!) into that same space. I think it sounds like a great plan. And I've been to that museum and about the only thing I wish were different about it would be for it to be bigger given just how much there is to say about London. The move will help with that! (and even afterwards, the museum could still probably grow to twice that size and be amazing). London is an amazing city, please don't worry about change and new things and places. Nobody will ever mistake it for Las Vegas. As a tourist I love that the UK has lots of old buildings and other historical places to go and visit, but honestly, they have also gone overboard on the grade listing and preservation of just about anything and everything that is "old". If you don't allow anything to be torn down or changed, you end up stagnating. And London is one hell of a dynamic place (thankfully). I see it here in the US as well. I'm glad we preserve some old buildings/places, but a lot of the times it's over used. Not everything has to be saved, or is even worthy of saving. I once saw a video on here about current NYC landmarks, such as the Empire State Building, that wouldn't exist if all these preservation laws had been in place in 1900 (the Empire State Building replaced a fancy old hotel). It's possible to create a beloved new landmark to replace the old one.
Hi Jago.. You have touched upon the City and it's shadowy presence in the background of London affairs. Any chance of an exploration of it's real history (How the Square Mile is not part of the UK or subject to the crown, you know that sort of thing)
Dagenham is hardly as attractive a location as Smithfield! Yes, it's a shame to move this genuine historic function away from the city but some years ago, the move of the fruit and veg market from Covent Garden to Nine Elms created a very good public space for shops and bars, the LT Museum and a great bar for the opera house in the Flower Market hall. The western end of Smithfield has been derelict for many years so the proposals may improve the area.
And loads of rich people will make loads more money as usual. Have youj been to NIne Elms it cost you a £5 just to drive in if you have to work in there just another con...
Back in the late 60s early 70s, one of the buildings opposite the meat market (possibly a former pub) was used to store archived medical records from Bart's Hospital.
The Oligarchs seem to be heading for the Maldives on a flotilla of private yachts just now. Don't think there'll be much open investments anywhere for a while 😀
I have no faith that the redeveloped market site will be the usual bland affair, with none of the character it currently has. And Dagenham Dock is a pretty soulless new location for the traders, and further out too. On the other hand, it's a pretty awful location now for a WHOLESALE meat market to be located, smack in the middle of the City's narrow streets, in antiquated buildings.
(Another) Good video from Jago. Long may they “be had by the giblets” 🤣, Very appropriate. I believe that giblets are now few and far between, I didn’t get any included with my chicken from “where every little helps.” Take care All.
Indeed they are, which I for one am most disappointed by. As a youngster, I was the only one in my family who would eat them (apart from the cat) and I miss them. I wonder what happens to them now.
Jago, another great video, thank you. Love your content. Just one point to clarify, if I may be so bold. The reason for said vagary in the language that you mention @1:14 is due to the fact that Studio Egret (pronounced the same as the bird) West are architects, not developers. The development, (as far as I know) is being lead principally by the museum of London and the city of London. Hope that helps. 😊
As much as I do agree that Smithfield shouldn't turn into a caricature of itself for the benefit of the few rich tourists that can afford whatever's in the new development, I do think it's fair to ask if the middle of the largest city in the country is really the most convenient place for a wholesale meat market.
My older brother once working as a security guard, was at a Christmas at Smithfield event. They had reindeer and emus. He said you had to be careful around the emus, because they were vicious like ostriches are. The market's problems should be sorted out, one way or another, because it's such a waste of good buildings.
3:06 - ‘Worshipful Company of Poulters’ - And I always thought it was ‘Poulterers’. Just shows that you learn something new every day (or in this case probably very old).
Good one Jago 👍 (Vague wording of planning descriptions allows developers to interpret meanings to suit situations -I've worked in local govt too long)
I like to hear of these peculiar things in London. Those of us who live far from London don't know about things like the meat, poultry and fish markets and stuff of that ilk. Certainly, the protection of a Royal Charter is completely absent almost everywhere else in England (don't know about the other Home Nations). More of this kind of thing please.
Cynical, Mr H? You? But surely not! Whatever the future of the market, this is a superb video. Now, have you seen my very recent comment about Uxbridge Station, in which I mentioned that I travelled to the City? Well, just north of this market lies the very place I travelled to. Such a small world, and I'm confident that all your viewers will appreciate that little gem. So, thank you, Mr H. Simon T
Originally coming from the area, I wonder why another old Royal Charter is being ignored here? Admittedly it's only about 800 years old or so, but Romford has a market established by Royal Charter. From what I remember it forbids the establishment of other markets over a wide area. Dagenham is within that area as I recall.
"Theme park London". How true. In fact it's "Theme park Britain" , now- force out the real life to the bleak perimeters, but keep the pretty exteriors, and fill them with yet more restaurants and coffee shops which, soon, no one will be able to afford to patronize. Or like Brighton, anything historic which cannot be bulldozed and built over can be enjoyed slowly rotting away until it collapses.
I utterly hate the idea of revoking a thousand years of practical application for no particular credible reason. Smithfield Market should be wholly preserved - not just the building, but the function as well.
I studied this for a module in uni, basically the points were that it was ineffective that London’s wholesale markets were all over the place (Billingsgate and Spitalfields),and Smithfield was so old that decades of retrofitting have ruined the building facade (the North side of the building is covered with hideous frozen bay loading doors.) the new site is out of the way of the tight London roads where the dozens of vans unloading cause terrible congestion, buyers and sellers can avoid congestion charge and morning traffic, has all the markets (meat, fish and veg) under one roof, is purpose built to modern market standards and is more accessible to buyers from the wider SE England. Finally, the Smithfield area is eerily quiet for central London during the day and is only busy at night with night clubs. A redevelopment, whilst preserving the building, is logically the way forward to me.
Dear sir. Very interesting indeed, and I’m about 400 miles away from London. Murphy’s law says a development in this matter will occur shortly. Kind regards from The Netherworlds.
I think (and I feel I'm not the only one) that Smithfield Markets would be a great bigger home for the London Transport Museum? Feel they could do with a bigger space, and the SM near Farringdon and City Thameslink stations appears to be a perfect spot -- and a beautiful building too (just like the one in Covent Garden, if not even more beautiful).
I really loathe what has been happening to London in the past decade. These developer's are destroying our heritage and I doubt many are even from London.
Well yes and no. The London I clearly remember from the 70's was frankly a bit of a dump. It may have lost some character but its now infinitely cleaner and generally more pleasant than it was. On the other hand some acts of vandalism have happened such as the appalling "walkie talkie" building which has to be one of the worst planning decisions in the world ever.
@@andywarne963 There's plenty more acts of vandalism, for instance the Disneyfication of the West End in general and steel and concrete barriers everywhere, some running the length of world famous bridges to discourage those inclined to drive up onto pavements and mow down people. Vandalism is also psychological
@@martinheath5947 Oh yes! Those steel barriers are completely ridiculous knee-jerk nonsense and should go. Who on earth came up with the notion that people who wish to mow people down will only ever do it on bridges!
it's good to know I can still visit, never have and was born in London and live just up the road. Unbelievable really - shame on me! And good on those meat men. Brilliant.
"London is increasingly becoming a theme park version of itself."
I can't vouch for London, but this is exactly what Edinburgh is becoming, so I can totally believe it.
San Francisco is another example of a working city that’s become an overpriced theme park. I’m sure there are many more we can think of!
I'm an American and live close enough to Disneyland that I could work there if I wanted to... I visited Edinburgh in 2019 and I didn't get the theme park vibe at all. Not that I had once visited in, say, 1959 and can compare it to its former self. It was nice, but I don't think you've lost any of the old charm.
@@comicus01 It's more obvious when you visit other places in Scotland with Castles (Stirling springs to mind) or visit other cities and find that Glasgow isn't filled with bagpiping buskers and shots selling souvenirs. I think Americans just assume Scotland is all folksy old country full of bagpipes and tourist shops. Glasgow is more like Philadelphia/Chicago (indeed they film a lot of US films there) and Scotland has a booming technology center, whether it's making more space satelites than anywhere else in Europe, being home to Dolly the sheep and a huge genetics industry, or being the home of the Grand Theft Auto series and a bunch of other tech firms that make it more like Silicon Valley than Epcot
@@CalvinsWorldNews Unfortunately Edinburgh was the only place I went in Scotland (I definitely hope to return one day)...
I don't recall seeing any bagpipe buskers. I do remember seeing a lot of souvenir shops, but that doesn't bother me (the one that stands out is what struck me as possibly the largest Harry Potter themed store in the world, close to the entrance to Edinburgh Castle). I don't think there are too many places in the US that I would consider similar to Glasgow, lol.
I liked Edinburgh overall. And I never once felt like I was somewhere in the US. It has its own character and feel to it.
BTW, which US movies have been filmed in Glasgow? Haven't really heard of that as a filming location.
@@comicus01 World War Z, Dark Knight Rises, The Flash, plus a bunch of others.
I love the tube based content, but I really dig these London oddities/curioso pieces, they’re so interesting!
His channel is EXCELLENT for this content. 👍
I agree.
"London is becoming a theme park version of itself". You are spot on.
Translation: we are going to build places you can’t afford to shop or live in.
The entire country will soon be a museum with actors taking the place of train drivers, policemen, factory workers. All the genuine jobs will be gone.
Mixed use aka ‘we will have a mix of shops, cafes and residencies, all aimed at the upper 20%’.
Unless you're Bo Jo of course
I kind of love it when really old laws get invoked and upheld, I don't know why, so good for the traders I guess.
It demonstrates to others as well, that they are not the only culture that has history and laws which are still part of every day life despite us not seeing them.
No no no! The traders don't have the developers by the giblets, they have them by the sweetbreads and parsons noses.
For a number of years (way back when!) I lived in a Centrepoint Hostel on Smithfield (that's now fancy apartments with the penthouse selling for £6mil)
I loved walking around the area in the early morning, I made friends with a number of traders who would occasionally allow me to take some meat for a discounted price...which was always appreciated and loved by the 50 folk who lived in the building.
Though I will always remember the slightly disconcerting smell that occurred every Sunday morning, that was a mix of incense from St Barts the Great church, the bleach used to clean up the after all the butchering, and the lingering residual smell of the meat itself along with the odours from the nightclub Fabric....
It will be a shame when the market eventually moves...
That must have been....... odorific
Wasn't the lindsey Hotel by any chance?
@@mickysj3270 the hostel (or to give its proper name -Foyer-) was above the Club Gascon bar and restaurant next door the the Gatehouse of St Bartholomew's church.
The restaurant weren't particularly keen on us living above them, (they thought we brought the value of the area down), apparently they complained about the noise frequently, the police/noise people came numerous times and it was their noise they heard in our flats, which made them get a fine. The family in the Gatehouse though always supported us saying they didnt hear a peep out of us...and wished the restaurant and its clients were more like us.
That was just one of a number of issues we had over the time I was there....
@paintedpilgrim That's a vivid olfactory picture, but it's so true- in years past, every part of every town had it's distinctive odours. Now every town is just suffused with coffee, alternating with garlic. Could be worse, but utterly soulless.
@@phaasch most of the time they intermingled, one not seeming to crowd out the other .... though certain times of the year the excess incense gave you headaches, on particularly hot days the smell of meat if not cleaned up properly could be a little nauseating, but the same could be said after big nights at Fabric.....and folk wonder why the area is notoriously quiet at the weekend....
I read the piece in the FT and I suspect that the developers will have to offer better financial terms to the traders to get them to move; frankly, the traders don't need to go anywhere, but the developers always have time constraints and for them it's ultimately cheaper to pay-up.
I too regret the loss of traditional markets in central London, my club usually hold their Christmas drinks in an adjacent hostelry to Smithfield, and I always find it somewhat eerie at that time of year, the sense of history is overwhelming.
However, a new, larger Museum of London is to be welcomed, and should prove to be popular with the new and improved Farringdon station making access easier.
It is a shame the Poultry Traders are being hen-pecked by the corporation to accept unfavourable terms, it is really fowl for the history and tradition to be treated as such. I could squawk in anger and hope that the clucking corporation see sense and allow the traders to suckseed.
Eggsactly. A feather in your cap for all your fowl wordplay.
The got offered a poultry amount
"Are they playing hardball...."
Chicken. Are the traders playing chicken with the corporation. My God, Jago. It was there for the taking!😄
@@D_B_Cooper don't egg him on for goodness sake. Oh and by the way, it's good to see you did survive that parachute jump after all.
Are they playing hard-boiled egg or just giving the bird to those lower in the pecking order? (Also, sausages.)
Great Giblets!, as an ex-Londoner (Plaistowe & East Ham), I bask in the irony of a situation where a site with a 1000 years of history with a Royal Charter to boot that is housed in a rather grand looking heritage listed building and is a thriving centre of old family businesses that still serve the community and is free for anyone to visit will be replaced with a museum full of staged history with little 'real life' atmosphere or hussle and bussle, that will be a faint representation of what is at the moment a living thriving real historical experience. Not to mention that this 'new' experience will probably cost you an arm and a leg (of lamb). Well, never mind, there will most likely be a sparkingly sanitized soulless supermarket selling spicy salami sausages as part of the new development by Egret & Egret & Wetlands Limited Incorporated PLC, that'll be 7.5 Million for a studio apartment, that's Pounds not Kilos.. thanks Drew
In fairness to the museum, it's free at the moment and I can't see that changing.
I think the museum world has learned from the community backlash when Birmingham's much loved Science and Industry museum (which had been free since I were a lad) was closed and replaced with the dumbed-down "science experience" called Thinktank which costs well over a tenner to get in. It has good reviews on Tripadvisor but strangely they all seem to be from tourists visiting Birmingham rather than locals from the city, unlike other museums.
"Does anyone else find the vague language developers use frustrating?" They use 'weasel words' and yes, I also find them frustrating and not to be trusted.
They use the vague language to hide the fact that they have nothing concrete (bad pun, sorry) to say.
@@atraindriver exactly, they don’t truly know who they’re going to sell it to after they build it, they can only hope the demand will be there.
Only a few days ago I randomly ran across mention of a listed building in London called "No. 1 Poultry", and was disappointed to learn that it's just called that because that's its address, not because it's the headquarters of a particularly confident chicken supplier.
Also, I love that the poulterers are using one of England's ancient and arcane legal convolutions against modern real estate developers. I suspect the developers will get what they want in the end, because Her Majesty's Government seems to be historically keen on letting rich folks do whatever they want as a general thing, but it's satisfying to see them have to work for it.
I mean, its no poultry amount that these traders are being offered to move on.
@@Rose.Of.Hizaki Did the traders chicken out of the deal or turn turkey on it, ducking their duty? What's their grouse with the new wing of the Dagenham premises? What's stuck in their craw? What's ruffled their feathers? What's made them turn fowl and tell the developers to get stuffed?
@@Rose.Of.Hizaki Maybe they're just not that eggcited about the proposed new location.
The roads around there are named after what they used to sell (Milk Street and Bread Street are just off Poultry). 1 Poultry is an ugly building with a Tescos metro (chicken sandwiches are available)
@@ZGryphon sadly, 1 Poultry got demolished to make way for a ghastly piece of postmodern tat.
I love those old covered markets. They should never ever be abandoned. They're so full of life. The problem with redevelopment in already desirable neighbourhoods is that these quirks they seek to redevelop are what made the neighbourhood desirable in the first place.
Yes,they turn them into lifeless yuppie-hutches sadly.
I can relate to your sentiments about the market moving. Here in Chicago, the wholesale produce market relocated several years ago. The buildings were redeveloped as flats. While it was great to see the buildings preserved, the area lost a lot of its character, as well as the excellent food stalls that existed alongside the market.
Thanks for this. I now live in New Jersey and it is difficult to find stories like this. I remember looking at apartments, sorry, flats in the Smithfield area after my divorce in the '70's. It was then quite a reasonable area cost wise (as was the Square Mile City in general) - because everyone was trying to get out of London whilst rail fares were still justifiable.
I always loved the nooks and crannies of the City and on Sundays it was extremely quiet. My great Uncle had a nice place in the Barbican at the time but that place was not for me. My Grandfather was in the H.A.C. during WW1.
Tell me, have all the little "Caffs" (mostly) run by Italian families vanished?
Best, Pete.
Sadly yes, many of them struggled on, but the bulk have moved out. We used Attilio's (just opposite the Market) for donkey's years but about four years ago they just disappeared, seemingly overnight, one Christmas.
They've nearly all gone, now, ousted by the chains. Just think, exactly the same Starbucks, whether it be Hoboken or Holborn. Globalism.
Yes. York has become a "theme park" as well as Beverley the County Town of East Yorkshire as both have great medieval churches. Most of the old family traders have been forced out of these towns.
Unspoiled urban cityscapes get gentrified. Because money doesn't like modernism in their backyard.
I've only visited York once on a primary school trip in about 1986. I suppose it's changed a bit since then.
Yeah. There are more chocolate shops in Bruges than there are grocery shops, too. Let alone things like hardware stores or car repair shops...
And I guess this "stay of execution" also means another London curio: the 'early houses'; nearby pubs that serve the nightworkers of the market, will be able to hold on to that title just a little bit longer.
For my family Smithfield was an important place. My dad was a freelance greengrocer and went to Smithfield on a daily basis. His business grew into something that employed a few people. It was only until the congestion charge was introduced that he was forced to stop going to Smithfield and go to Spitalfields instead.
I used to work night shift in offices near the market. We would head to the pub for breakfast and a beer at 8am (which was equivalent to our evening) and there would be traders finishing their day doing the same. I guess it was the end of old London where the financial city and the market traders lived and worked in the same space
This situation and Jago's take on it at the end rather reminds me of a fairly recent video game called "Buildings Have Feelings Too". In it you go around finding old buildings from Britain's glorious industrial past and find new roles for them, like turning an old workhouse into offices, a music hall into a cinema, and so on. What brought this game to mind was the comments of several Let's Players who have tried it, particularly Many A True Nerd, who labelled it as "Gentrification Simulator". While cloaked in a heavy layer of classic British oldy worldy humor and charm, there's no denying a certain undercurrent of "out with the old, in with the new", and what old things you can't be rid of need to be made to conform with the new, sometimes whether they like it or not.
As usual it's all about the money.
Traders as you'd expect want a good deal as they're being turfed out, developer's want to bleed everyone dry as per usual.
The vague promise's, spin and downright lies of developers and for that matter council's and governments,is usually successful as it means they can't be pinned down factually.
After seven years of a battle with Staffordshire Moorlands District Council we finally got planning permission in 2011 to self build our house, a previous design was turned down, due to the quote,bulk and massing being inappropriate for the site.
Tell my North American neighbors that a city location and businesses have histories going back before the Mayflower blows their minds.
So much part of London, why turn it in to a theme park of its former self? Money I know is the answer; but is this just selling our history and culture. Hang in there chicken traders!
Great video as always, thank you.
I rather agree with your general comment Jago about the idea of London being turned into something like a theme park.
As an aside, back in the early 80's I helped organise a monthly squash competition for the company I was working at back then. We played at a club rather oddly based in the Spitalfields fruit & veg market building. There were certainly some interesting "aromas" when we arrived in the evenings after work !! 😎😱
I love Smithfield market and the surrounding areas. I hope it stays as it is. Things don’t always change for the better, especially in London. Great video as usual thank you.
As one who has worked with Smithfield traders, I reckon the Royal Charter is being pushed for all its worth to get more cash out of the developers. Private Acts of Parliament are eyewateringly expensive!
Another interesting entry in your non-tube related subjects. When I eventually get to visit London, you've given me plenty of ideas where to go. I hope you have a happy Parade Day on Friday. You didn't know that Friday is Parade Day? Well...what else would you do on...March Fourth ??? (Insert groan here!)
As someone that lives in a city with a very active market (Melbourne and the Queen Victoria market), London WILL lose something. When I worked in our CBD it was always great to go to the meat section and get the weeks meat and then the fruit and veg section next door. Your pictures of Smithfield meat vendors reminds me much of Melbourne. And ours is so popular.
I have fond memories of walking around Victoria Market eating a freshly boiled corn on the cob dripping in butter
I still remember slowly driving through Mud Salad Market (as Punch used to call it), the traditional Covent Garden, in my 1936 Morris 8 Series 1. It was a road for traffic but with people, porters, traders criss-crossing everywhere, one simply had to crawl, brake, crawl.
@@Vonononie all that’s still there’s. The biscuit stalls with the barrels/ boxes of different loose biscuits you buy by weight, the dairy vendors with huge displays of cheeses, creams, butters etc. fish or scallops freshly cooked. Yum. The meat/fish/poultry vendors, each yelling out special offers etc trying to get people to come and buy from them.
Thank you for this update in the markets, Jago. Very interesting. Curious to see where this goes in the future.
And I couldn’t agree more with your view on London’s history & current building; I love the realness of the markets right in the middle of new developments. Not having it all too slick & fancy seems rather healthy to me. We need these hardworking families, who are bringing food to our tables, in clear eyesight 💪🏾😁
I have long appreciated the societal commentary aspects of Jago’s videos, providing social history, and the style of delivery of them, and this video, short though it is, is one of the best.
Thanks again for an informative vid. I lived very close to Smithfield for many years ( Golden lane estate) I share your views on what’s happening to our city, the same thing has happened in the west end. You are right London is turning into a theme park. Very sad
When Geoff and Jago release a video within half an hour of each other...
Yes, aren't Wednesday evenings wonderful for us UA-cam watchers.
Geoff who? What am I missing?
@@ModernHypnotherapy Geoff Marshall, he also does stuff on trains but modern stuff.
@@ModernHypnotherapy indeed, Geoff Marshall. If you like Jago's videos you'll probably like Geoff's as well. They're on a similar theme!
@@stephenholt4670 must admit Geoffs can get a bit dry at times.
"You're cynical!" Well, you did ask us to call you that, and who am I to argue? 😁Thanks for yet another fascinating and informative video - cheers!
I did shift work for a while in Long Lane just near the market and we often went for a pint at 7am in the Bishops Finger which was frequented by traders in bloody overalls.
This was before the market was completely gutted and rebuilt inside, with only the shell remaining, because it had become a health hazard. It was not a pleasant sight (nor smell), the road and pavements outside the front would be piled with carcasses and it was enough to turn people vegetarian.
I don't expect it was much better in that pub either mixed with the stale smell of tobacco thrown in too.
Used to work just up the road at barbican. Meantime, I suspect the poultry sellers just want to feather their nests, are being egged on, and are playing chicken with the city of London.
The traders don't see the forced move being a poultry matter.
Long may the market remain where it is.
Your observation of repurposing a historic (and functional) market as a museum that will undoubtedly have a display about "historic London food markets" is spot on. By the giblets, indeed.
14 miles from London! A great spanner in the works . Don't forget the disastrous moves of Covent Garden to Nine Elms and Billingsate to Canary Wharf .it's not as though we have a Paris style consolidated market like Rungis , just grubby out of the way places fated to shrivel away and disappear.
This is not a poultry problem, I wonder if the traders will chicken out of a confrontation? Unless they do, things may get rather foul.
I have to say I am ever thankful for the peeps at St Barts who saved my life when I collapsed in Fleet St one saturday lol Later on I got to know some St Barts student nurses who persuaded me to become one myself.
One may be tempted to state, a poultry offering when compared to your usual luxury length presentations.
Great video and thanks for mentioning the death of the two Firefighters. Just to confirm, the use of BA did not come about due this incident, in fact the two men that died were in B.A.(but sadly they got lost in the thick smoke in the maze of tunnels in the basement, ran out of Oxygen[early Proto sets] and were unable to signal that they were in difficulty).What did come about, and is still in use today (in a revised form to meet modern technology and equipment) is the use of Entry Control procedures, Guide Lines and Distress signalling Units.
well it certainly caught me by the giblets! nice one, Jago!
Whilst I don’t like london losing its history I must admit it’s a nightmare when you’re trying to buy from there even just park your van up . Then panicking so that you get out before seven so you don’t get the congestion charge on your van so I can understand why they wanna move it .
I see the museum of London underground works most days from my thameslink train and they seem to be progressing well.
The buildings above ground are a mess with some decayed beyond saving.
The traders and their landlord won't spend anything so I'm happy to see them saved and added to London theme park world.
You're wrong about the breathing apparatus (BA) being introduced after the Poultry Market fire. There are photographs on the Museum of London's website of firefighters wearing Proto rebreather BA at that fire. LFB describe this as a ‘landmark fire in the history of London’ where as a result of this tragedy, improvements were made to the BA and procedures used by firefighters. These improvements were adopted all over the country and are still in use today. These improvements included using compressed air cylinders, and an automatic warning signal which sounds as the oxygen levels are running low. Also, BA boards were introduced, with tallies and systems to keep track of the location of the firefighters and the timings of when they entered the fire. A BA Controller would now have responsibility for managing these systems, ensuring firefighters did not run out of oxygen. Similarly, London County Council also sought special powers to be able to deal with fire precautions across all the central London markets.
At the time of the fire the basements were a series of small rooms and corridors. The fire caused them to fill with thick, acrid smoke and so the firefighters felt like they were entering a labyrinth. This combined with a collapse of frozen meat packages and carcasses trapped Jack Fourt-Wells and Richard Stocking (both from Clerkenwell where my father served in the 1980s/1990s). Their colleagues were unable to find them before their oxygen ran out. They were wearing 'Proto' oxygen sets, which at the time were state of the art. Many attempts were made to resuscitate both men but tragically they were pronounced dead at the scene.
In 1914, Siebe Gorman and Co introduced a totally new concept in breathing apparatus (BA). Designed for use in mines it was called Proto. It was a self-contained system, which consisted of a cylinder of oxygen and an air reservoir or breathing bag containing an absorbent, which removed the carbon dioxide; it was then mixed with a fresh supply of oxygen and reused. The kit included a separate mouthpiece through which to breathe, a nose clip and rubber goggles to protect the eyes. Although requiring special training, it was quickly adopted by LFB and issued to the Emergency Tender crews. The benefit of this BA was that several firefighters could work together as a team when wearing the sets. Over the years the Proto was modified on many occasions, with the final version, the MK V being introduced in the late 1950s, by which time all pumps (the basic fire engine) were equipped with three Proto sets.
Probably worth explaining - especially for viewers outside the UK - that LFB is London Fire Brigage. But thanks, an interesting and informative comment!
@@davidw1518 thanks, I forgot that one. LFB is one of only 3 fire brigades left in the UK as far as I'm aware of, the others are Cleveland FB and Peterborough Volunteer FB.
As a fireman in the mid-1960's I remember recharging the cylinders on Proto sets from large oxygen cylinders using a 2-man hand pump and using only distilled water as a lubricant for the pump pivots - very hard work it was.
Jago, just as we get the Plague out of the way, the war comes along. great timing.
On my 1st visit to London in 97, I walked around and ended finding Smithfield. I had no idea it was a market but really liked the building.
Worldwide pandemic? Why does nobody tell me these things??
I sincerely hope Smithfield's stays!
Man, that's a pretty meat market. Hope the architecture may stay. (My town redeveloped it's slaughterhouse into a mixed use thingy, and after a rough start, it is beloved by the locals. It can work out, museum or not.. That said, some of the buildings were allowed to stay and be repurposed; hope this is the case here, too....)
Another great video Mr. H.
1. I think you’ll find it’s pronounced egret. 😉
2. Many cities are becoming theme park versions of themselves. Shame really but ‘the tourist pound’… you know.
3. Irony and cynicism are both good in my book.
4. Keep up the good work.
Ah yes, the traders have the city by the giblets. Nice.
Jago nice one! You should probably make more videos about current affairs in London as well. As a Northerner I am by no ways involved but it's still interesting to me.
Pandemic you say, I missed that.
Jago, I would buy your gripe about the changes to London if they were planning to tear down all the market buildings and build some glass walled sky scraper or something similar. But they're keeping the buildings and moving a museum (about London!) into that same space. I think it sounds like a great plan. And I've been to that museum and about the only thing I wish were different about it would be for it to be bigger given just how much there is to say about London. The move will help with that! (and even afterwards, the museum could still probably grow to twice that size and be amazing). London is an amazing city, please don't worry about change and new things and places. Nobody will ever mistake it for Las Vegas.
As a tourist I love that the UK has lots of old buildings and other historical places to go and visit, but honestly, they have also gone overboard on the grade listing and preservation of just about anything and everything that is "old". If you don't allow anything to be torn down or changed, you end up stagnating. And London is one hell of a dynamic place (thankfully). I see it here in the US as well. I'm glad we preserve some old buildings/places, but a lot of the times it's over used. Not everything has to be saved, or is even worthy of saving. I once saw a video on here about current NYC landmarks, such as the Empire State Building, that wouldn't exist if all these preservation laws had been in place in 1900 (the Empire State Building replaced a fancy old hotel). It's possible to create a beloved new landmark to replace the old one.
What no meet - meat joke. It was right there Jago!
He has no egrets.
Hi Jago.. You have touched upon the City and it's shadowy presence in the background of London affairs. Any chance of an exploration of it's real history (How the Square Mile is not part of the UK or subject to the crown, you know that sort of thing)
Dagenham is hardly as attractive a location as Smithfield! Yes, it's a shame to move this genuine historic function away from the city but some years ago, the move of the fruit and veg market from Covent Garden to Nine Elms created a very good public space for shops and bars, the LT Museum and a great bar for the opera house in the Flower Market hall. The western end of Smithfield has been derelict for many years so the proposals may improve the area.
And loads of rich people will make loads more money as usual. Have youj been to NIne Elms it cost you a £5 just to drive in if you have to work in there just another con...
That was interesting, I knew of the MoL plans but the Royal Charter is an interesting fly in the ointment!
Back in the late 60s early 70s, one of the buildings opposite the meat market (possibly a former pub) was used to store archived medical records from Bart's Hospital.
Developers. Don't we just love them! Oh well, plenty of new investment opportunities for the Oligarchs.
The Oligarchs seem to be heading for the Maldives on a flotilla of private yachts just now. Don't think there'll be much open investments anywhere for a while 😀
I must admit that I misread the title as "meat museums & malarkey" and thought "trouble with jerky?"
I have no faith that the redeveloped market site will be the usual bland affair, with none of the character it currently has. And Dagenham Dock is a pretty soulless new location for the traders, and further out too.
On the other hand, it's a pretty awful location now for a WHOLESALE meat market to be located, smack in the middle of the City's narrow streets, in antiquated buildings.
(Another) Good video from Jago.
Long may they “be had by the giblets” 🤣,
Very appropriate. I believe that giblets are now few and far between, I didn’t get any included with my chicken from “where every little helps.” Take care All.
Indeed they are, which I for one am most disappointed by. As a youngster, I was the only one in my family who would eat them (apart from the cat) and I miss them. I wonder what happens to them now.
Please keep us informed of further developments
It’s moving to the site in barking where the old power station was. We recently demolished the site ready for construction.
Jago, another great video, thank you. Love your content.
Just one point to clarify, if I may be so bold. The reason for said vagary in the language that you mention @1:14 is due to the fact that Studio Egret (pronounced the same as the bird) West are architects, not developers. The development, (as far as I know) is being lead principally by the museum of London and the city of London. Hope that helps. 😊
As much as I do agree that Smithfield shouldn't turn into a caricature of itself for the benefit of the few rich tourists that can afford whatever's in the new development, I do think it's fair to ask if the middle of the largest city in the country is really the most convenient place for a wholesale meat market.
My older brother once working as a security guard, was at a Christmas at Smithfield event. They had reindeer and emus. He said you had to be careful around the emus, because they were vicious like ostriches are.
The market's problems should be sorted out, one way or another, because it's such a waste of good buildings.
Damn those vicious mean emus, why can't they be nice and accommodating while they line up to be slaughtered
3:06 - ‘Worshipful Company of Poulters’ - And I always thought it was ‘Poulterers’. Just shows that you learn something new every day (or in this case probably very old).
Good one Jago 👍
(Vague wording of planning descriptions allows developers to interpret meanings to suit situations -I've worked in local govt too long)
I like to hear of these peculiar things in London. Those of us who live far from London don't know about things like the meat, poultry and fish markets and stuff of that ilk. Certainly, the protection of a Royal Charter is completely absent almost everywhere else in England (don't know about the other Home Nations).
More of this kind of thing please.
“Got them by the giblets” …..😅😂🤣.
Cynical, Mr H? You? But surely not! Whatever the future of the market, this is a superb video. Now, have you seen my very recent comment about Uxbridge Station, in which I mentioned that I travelled to the City? Well, just north of this market lies the very place I travelled to. Such a small world, and I'm confident that all your viewers will appreciate that little gem. So, thank you, Mr H. Simon T
I love smithfield and shop there regularly and i ask traders when they're moving and they say 'not for a long time yet'.
Nice break from the Tube. You’re spot on about London becoming a theme park of itself. Let’s build more unaffordable flats..
I do love the little oddities of London video, hope you do more of them
Nice video, thanks! I am firmly on the side of the poulters - I only hope the developers won't resort to fowl play.
LOVE this channel!
That is not a poultry affair! I wish the business get a fair deal frankly! Sigh!! I totally agree with you on what you said too!!
I'd love to see a video explaining Royal Charters in detail.
Originally coming from the area, I wonder why another old Royal Charter is being ignored here? Admittedly it's only about 800 years old or so, but Romford has a market established by Royal Charter. From what I remember it forbids the establishment of other markets over a wide area. Dagenham is within that area as I recall.
"Theme park London". How true. In fact it's "Theme park Britain" , now- force out the real life to the bleak perimeters, but keep the pretty exteriors, and fill them with yet more restaurants and coffee shops which, soon, no one will be able to afford to patronize.
Or like Brighton, anything historic which cannot be bulldozed and built over can be enjoyed slowly rotting away until it collapses.
This is wrong!... Very wrong!
When a man can't get a smoked chicken from Keevil & Keevil... He's tired of London!
Oh,and never mind egret or e-gret,special bonus point for use of the wonderful world malarkey 👍. Or is that mullarkey or even malachi?
I utterly hate the idea of revoking a thousand years of practical application for no particular credible reason. Smithfield Market should be wholly preserved - not just the building, but the function as well.
Dagenham is a long journey out, even by tube...Ultima Thule.
I studied this for a module in uni, basically the points were that it was ineffective that London’s wholesale markets were all over the place (Billingsgate and Spitalfields),and Smithfield was so old that decades of retrofitting have ruined the building facade (the North side of the building is covered with hideous frozen bay loading doors.) the new site is out of the way of the tight London roads where the dozens of vans unloading cause terrible congestion, buyers and sellers can avoid congestion charge and morning traffic, has all the markets (meat, fish and veg) under one roof, is purpose built to modern market standards and is more accessible to buyers from the wider SE England. Finally, the Smithfield area is eerily quiet for central London during the day and is only busy at night with night clubs. A redevelopment, whilst preserving the building, is logically the way forward to me.
Dear sir. Very interesting indeed, and I’m about 400 miles away from London. Murphy’s law says a development in this matter will occur shortly. Kind regards from The Netherworlds.
I was born there
You were born in the meat market? Why? (Apart from the obvious fact that your mum was there at the time.)
@@caw25sha We were on route to Barts. She did manage to sell them her placenta though.
You’d think the mid century remodeling of London by the Luftwaffe would be enough to let what survived stay
egret is pronounced like ee-gruht :) very good video btw
Egrets. I have a few, but then again, too few to mention...
Very interesting, thank you
So they refused the "Poultry" amount being offered? Couldn't they agree to meat them half way, or are they just hoping they'll chicken out?
I think (and I feel I'm not the only one) that Smithfield Markets would be a great bigger home for the London Transport Museum? Feel they could do with a bigger space, and the SM near Farringdon and City Thameslink stations appears to be a perfect spot -- and a beautiful building too (just like the one in Covent Garden, if not even more beautiful).
Most interesting, thank you.
I really loathe what has been happening to London in the past decade. These developer's are destroying our heritage and I doubt many are even from London.
The Shard was built with money from Saudis.
Destroying heritage and blighting the future
Well yes and no. The London I clearly remember from the 70's was frankly a bit of a dump. It may have lost some character but its now infinitely cleaner and generally more pleasant than it was. On the other hand some acts of vandalism have happened such as the appalling "walkie talkie" building which has to be one of the worst planning decisions in the world ever.
@@andywarne963 There's plenty more acts of vandalism, for instance the Disneyfication of the West End in general and steel and concrete barriers everywhere, some running the length of world famous bridges to discourage those inclined to drive up onto pavements and mow down people. Vandalism is also psychological
@@martinheath5947 Oh yes! Those steel barriers are completely ridiculous knee-jerk nonsense and should go. Who on earth came up with the notion that people who wish to mow people down will only ever do it on bridges!
It's Eeeeegret as in the white bird that looks much like heron awaiting it's final top coat of paint
I always smile at the end when he thanks his Patreons with a curious turn of simile. (Couldn't the name of that particular figure of speech though.)
Had a lecture at uni exactly about this
it's good to know I can still visit, never have and was born in London and live just up the road. Unbelievable really - shame on me! And good on those meat men. Brilliant.
Great video Jago