I'm the one who wrote about the grippy shelf liner. Here's one way it saved me. I'm 63. As you age your skin produces less oil. A lot less oil. When I wash my hands, they are dry as a bone and gripping ANYTHING is hard. I was having hell trying to hold my bow. I knew it shouldn't require such effort. It shouldn't be sliding out of control. I finally realized that I had nothing to allow my fingers and their ridges to give me friction. I also didn't want lotion residue on my instrument. I took a thin strip of liner and did a barber pole wind up as far as my right index first knuckle should lay. I didn't want anything bulky or so grabby that it hindered my movement. Just enough to keep the bow from sliding around. Worked like a charm. My whole right arm is now relaxed because I'm not squeezing so hard just to keep the bow in my hand. Plus I can now think about the wrist and finger adjustments needed for a straight bow! They are small but impossible if the bow feels like glass. It certainly looks 'rigged up' but I was raised by the depression generation so looks aren't a big deal. Watching your videos about shoulder rests and how you tweak them, like rubber bands, sponges etc. is what gave me permission to think outside the box. You said do what works for you. Absolutely magic words.
Hey Amytoth2585, I LOVE this idea, especially the barber pole description! LOL....I knew exactly what you were talking about. But still, I'd love to see a picture of your rigged bow. Can you sent me a little shot? (lora@reddesertviolin.com) I'd love to think about this for my older students as well. Heck....I'll probably need the same thing in 10 more years. And you are SO correct: if we feel like we are going to lose the bow, we will not be able to have a relaxed bow hold. Hope to hear from you.
Hooray! Enjoy your amazingly versatile chinrest! Wanna do me a favore, pretty please? Visit this link, and vote for Red Desert Violin. I"m a finalist in a contest and I need EVERY vote I can get! Please vote daily until February 8! THANK YOU! www.aweber.com/bigimpact.htm
You have perfectly demonstrated both the pluses and minuses of the Kreddle. The adjustability means one chin rest can do the work of many, saving buying and trying many in the search for one. But the fiddle factor is maddening, constantly tightening and loosening trying to find that perfect fit. Just when you get it, it shifts while you try to tighten everything down. Also very pricey as chin rests go. Still using mine. Tends to get a little sweaty and slippery when playing.
Hi Ralph, this is great feedback. Yes, it takes lots of adjustments.....but the fact that it has the CAPACITY for all those adjustments is actually a good thing. Once you find the setting you like, crank that puppy down....and it won't move. As for the sweat, I would recommend a little cover for it, because yes, the material it's made of could get a little slick. I consulted with 2 people for whome NO OTHER CHINREST WILL WORK. So this chinrest definitely fills a much-needed gap in the violin world
This chin rest changed my life. I was suffering from pain in my left shoulder because my neck is really long and even the tallest shoulder rest forced me to push my shoulder up to accommodate for the lost space. When I told my teacher about this, she recommended getting this (she too has a long neck like mine) and helped me adjust to it. Don't get me wrong, it definitely took a while to adjust to it. Ever since then, I've been able to play more comfortably and therefore practice longer.
good to know, I have a really long neck and had lots of pain when I played 20 years ago (part of what made me stop playing actually) now I started play again and search for a perfect chin rest and shoulder rest!
THANK you. This is the second time I watched it. As a beginner, teaching myself (with help from people like you I don't think I would even try) and while I don't know what comfortable is supposed to feel like, I think I'll know it when I find it. You answered a question I didn't know how to ask. I have a Fiddlerman Concert. I'm 5'6" or was, but I have the German no neck. I like how the chin rest has a bone grabber but something about it just always feels like it wants to pop away. Now I know why. It's to tall. I've been trying different shoulder rests and still, chinwise, I'm stretching my neck and head. My search continues but now I understand one problem. You can't fix it if you don't understand why it's wrong. Thank you again.
Amytoth2585, try this idea: WITH NO SHOULDER REST, place your violin on your collarbone. So the back plate (and maybe the chinrest clamp) will sit on your collarbone. From this basic resting on your natural "shelf", you will be able to figure out what chinrest is the best height. Too many people try to "jack up" their violin higher from underneath....using taller shoulder rests. But that is backwards. FIRST STEP is to fill the space between collarbone to jaw with just the violin and the chinrest. NEXT STEP is to find whatever shoulder rest gives you the stability you need. Keep me posted!
Thanks so much for the information. I just got my kreddle couple days ago . Unfortunately it didn’t work on me I mean ideally how violin resting on collarbone and chin rest on violin just doesn’t work , in my case I always need a support from shoulder rest ,I am glad it works for some people. Kreddle staffs are very helpful. I just emailed them so I could return it they replied right away . You just pay for the shipping to the address they provide then that’s it they will return the money .
Tùng Dương Ngô i live in California, USA. Sorry unfortunately I returned it and got the money back . You can try to play with a 🧽 sponge underneath the violin and use a grip or a piece of leather for not slippery, it’s way cheaper and it might work , the violin still resonance nicely . Hope it helps . Have a nice day . 😇
I’m curious to know if you have tried a smaller violin like a 7/8th or 3/4 if you have trouble with a full size? I’m not having a go at you and I hope I’m not being condescending. I genuinely wonder why. I’ve watched and thoroughly enjoyed and learn so much from heaps of your videos, sometimes more than once, and you do bring up your arm length often.
Hi Darleen! No offense taken thanks for being so polite! I do bring it up often, don't I? Well, here's the story: I never really thought of myself as "too small" for a full size...because I am on the cusp, so I never really gave it any thought until much later after I started teaching alot. It's just something I realized after I started teaching more, and started seeing the advantages and disadvantages of physique on the violin. By the time I realized it, I was a professional player, and the power of a full size violin was important, and I had an expensive violin that would be hard to sell in order to buy a smaller one. So I'd rather just complain about it than change to a smaller size! LOL But you see little children absolutely tearing it up on a full size.....so, it's not an excuse, but it is an impediment. There. That's the story. Happy Thanksgiving!
Red Desert Violin thank you for your reply. I’ve actually been worrying about my post so I’m relieved to get your reply. Thanks again for taking the time to do all of these really great videos!
Thank you for the very nice video! There's something that looks like a design or stain on your violin's varnish, right below the chinrest. Could you tell me what that is?
Hi Melodia, yes, that is a "patina" added by the maker of my violin. In the old days, violins were played without chinrests....causing wear and scarring to occur where the chinrest now sits. So, makers of modern violins often emulate this scarring on purpose....because it makes a violin look older, and face it....scars give us character....so it's just fake scarring. :-)
I am now finding my chin rest restrictive. I can't relax my head to the left because it jabs my jaw bone. I am compensating by squeezing my chin to hold. This is causing arm ,back and neck tension that results in twisted muscles that are stiff and painful sometimes. But !!! I don't really know what chin rests to try
Thank you for th the link you sent me to this chin rest. I have a long neck with bony collar bone and jaw. When I first put the violin up to my neck it feels secure but after a minute of playing I feel the violin starting to move out from my neck and off my collar bone in the direction that the scroll is when the violin is first place to the side of my neck . My chin feels like it is losing its grip on my chin rest. When I first place the the violin up to my neck it feels like my chin /jawbone is over the tailpiece and I am wondering if I would be better off with the chinrest clamp that comes down on both sides of the tailpiece than the one that has the chinrest to the side of the tailpiece. Any suggestions.
Chris, Kreddle makes a center-mounted chinrest, and you can position it in the center if you need to. YES, I think that sounds like a good idea for you. But also.....what shoulder rest are you using? Anytime someone describes their body like you did above, I think WOLF SECUNDO. YOu need to watch this video: ua-cam.com/video/gtPp9EF_jys/v-deo.html you will know immediately if this is something you should try.
Chris, I'm so sorry I have missed your comments, and didn't answer you. I hope you have found your dream set-up. If not, email me, and I'll try to point you in the right direction! (support@reddesertviolin.com)
What chin rest do you use? I''ve been playing for about 15 years... still no setup that works perfectly for me, every time, either sitting or standing. I've done shoulder pad no shoulder pad, center chin rests, side chin rests, you name it. One day I'll work it out! Thanks.
Hi Courtney, I use a Stuber chinrest. But do not go online and order one....they are fakes and they are not shaped the same. If you think you wanna try a Stuber, the only place you can get them is from Gary Frisch at www.chinrests.com. Good luck. If you tell me your body type and what bothers you most in violin set-ups, I might be able to steer you in the right direction. (Oh, and a VERY similar chinrest to the EDU which you can buy online is the Edu)
Red Desert Violin wow thanks! I have always (always even when playing violin) overcorrected with my left shoulder, leading to tenseness in the left side of my body. My instrument also does not feel secure on my shoulder. My left shoulder tenses up to raise my instrument. One of my earlier and favorite teachers always thought it was so weird that I was never tense anywhere else, including bow wrist, but my left shoulder changes to compensate for what I believe are incorrect playing angles, especially when playing on the lower strings. When playing in Orchestra over a period of time this leads to pain and soreness and also a lack of stability in where the instrument is on my shoulder. It really affects my technique because I’ve had moments where the setup is good and experience a certain level of freedom in playing, but it’s always temporary. I’m always trying to achieve that free feeling. The closest I’ve gotten to a comfy setup with freedom of motion is an SAS chinrest and a makeup sponge/cloth and no shoulder rest but this is sort of a slippery slidey situation and not best for orchestral playing. I’ve found a really low shoulder rest to be close to comfy - the VLM diamond augustin. This is probably most similar to playing with a sponge or pillow like I used to since it’s a very short shoulder rest and does not have much difference in height from one end to the other (a small “slope”, if you will). I have used an SAS with that but it’s a bit “too much”, I’ve modified a teka to be a little taller but there wasn’t enough grip on the cup (same with Kreddle on the cup type unfortunately). I’ve actually just ordered a few wave chinrests. I’m trying out 4 and am very excited about them. I’ll let you know how it goes. If you have any students who overcompensate with their left shoulder to bring the G and C strings closer to their bow arm and to keep the instrument at a better height and have fixed their problem I would love to know how. I also have my first student who has position problems just like I did but even worse! I’d love to know how you remedy these situations in students because he’s quite unhappy and it’s keeping him from practicing. Maybe we can DM or email if it’s not too much. Cheers!
I think it's a relatively new thing. (they aren't very expensive to order the additional plate if you think you might need it) So do you love your Kreddle?
Yeah I had ordered mine over a year ago. I wish mine was as contoured as the new ones! I'd love to try out the high contour plate, but I'm not going to order another one just for that. Other than that I do like the adjustability of it. I have a long neck so it's nice to have the ability to move this thing around to make it more comfortable.
Its a new thing, it just came out a couple of months ago with the new Kreddle cushion www.kickstarter.com/projects/399267759/kreddle-cushion-a-collarbone-rest-for-violin-and-vmaybe now it is not possible to order the plates separately, but Jordan is a quite helpful and flexible man, sure he will add the option in the future or even if you write to him now, he might sell and ship you only the plates (which by the way, there are 2 new models of chinplates :) )
The Stuber is ONLY side-mount. You could probably get a custom-made Stuber style with a center mount...but I'm not sure how it would perform. And if anyone could custom make one, it is Gary Frisch at Chinrests.com
A violin? Well, I know lots of big dealers here who are very reputable....and I believe they ship internationally. But as far as dealers IN India, sorry, I do not know!
Aye but violins and violas are not designed to have a bunch of junk clamped to them. When I see the chin rest and shoulder rest the first thing I think of is TRAINING WHEELS ON A BICYCLE. They are for absolute beginners who are simply unable to use the thing without them. But this isn't the main reason - rather they are to prevent little children from being injured. So, an experienced adult playing a little violin....
Well, with all our different body types, I think it's safe to say everyone is different. As you are aware, many successful professional violinists and violists use chin rests and shoulder rests, and they are not all just crazy losers. It's based on your body type, preference, and of course, the training you are had in your life.
I'm the one who wrote about the grippy shelf liner. Here's one way it saved me. I'm 63. As you age your skin produces less oil. A lot less oil. When I wash my hands, they are dry as a bone and gripping ANYTHING is hard. I was having hell trying to hold my bow. I knew it shouldn't require such effort. It shouldn't be sliding out of control. I finally realized that I had nothing to allow my fingers and their ridges to give me friction. I also didn't want lotion residue on my instrument. I took a thin strip of liner and did a barber pole wind up as far as my right index first knuckle should lay. I didn't want anything bulky or so grabby that it hindered my movement. Just enough to keep the bow from sliding around. Worked like a charm. My whole right arm is now relaxed because I'm not squeezing so hard just to keep the bow in my hand. Plus I can now think about the wrist and finger adjustments needed for a straight bow! They are small but impossible if the bow feels like glass. It certainly looks 'rigged up' but I was raised by the depression generation so looks aren't a big deal.
Watching your videos about shoulder rests and how you tweak them, like rubber bands, sponges etc. is what gave me permission to think outside the box. You said do what works for you. Absolutely magic words.
Hey Amytoth2585, I LOVE this idea, especially the barber pole description! LOL....I knew exactly what you were talking about. But still, I'd love to see a picture of your rigged bow. Can you sent me a little shot? (lora@reddesertviolin.com) I'd love to think about this for my older students as well. Heck....I'll probably need the same thing in 10 more years.
And you are SO correct: if we feel like we are going to lose the bow, we will not be able to have a relaxed bow hold.
Hope to hear from you.
Thank you for this video, I was afraid to take anything out of the box when it arrived, but you have explained away the mystery!
Hooray! Enjoy your amazingly versatile chinrest! Wanna do me a favore, pretty please? Visit this link, and vote for Red Desert Violin. I"m a finalist in a contest and I need EVERY vote I can get! Please vote daily until February 8! THANK YOU! www.aweber.com/bigimpact.htm
You have perfectly demonstrated both the pluses and minuses of the Kreddle. The adjustability means one chin rest can do the work of many, saving buying and trying many in the search for one. But the fiddle factor is maddening, constantly tightening and loosening trying to find that perfect fit. Just when you get it, it shifts while you try to tighten everything down. Also very pricey as chin rests go. Still using mine. Tends to get a little sweaty and slippery when playing.
Hi Ralph, this is great feedback. Yes, it takes lots of adjustments.....but the fact that it has the CAPACITY for all those adjustments is actually a good thing. Once you find the setting you like, crank that puppy down....and it won't move. As for the sweat, I would recommend a little cover for it, because yes, the material it's made of could get a little slick. I consulted with 2 people for whome NO OTHER CHINREST WILL WORK. So this chinrest definitely fills a much-needed gap in the violin world
This chin rest changed my life. I was suffering from pain in my left shoulder because my neck is really long and even the tallest shoulder rest forced me to push my shoulder up to accommodate for the lost space. When I told my teacher about this, she recommended getting this (she too has a long neck like mine) and helped me adjust to it. Don't get me wrong, it definitely took a while to adjust to it. Ever since then, I've been able to play more comfortably and therefore practice longer.
It's so great to have modern ergonomic solutions! What the heck did they do in 1912?! Glad this rest works for you!
good to know, I have a really long neck and had lots of pain when I played 20 years ago (part of what made me stop playing actually) now I started play again and search for a perfect chin rest and shoulder rest!
Thankyou! This is the most comprehensive tips on the different considerations for a chinrest.
You were so informative! Thank you for making this video.
Thanks, Tiffany. I appreciate that.
THANK you. This is the second time I watched it. As a beginner, teaching myself (with help from people like you I don't think I would even try) and while I don't know what comfortable is supposed to feel like, I think I'll know it when I find it. You answered a question I didn't know how to ask. I have a Fiddlerman Concert. I'm 5'6" or was, but I have the German no neck. I like how the chin rest has a bone grabber but something about it just always feels like it wants to pop away. Now I know why. It's to tall. I've been trying different shoulder rests and still, chinwise, I'm stretching my neck and head. My search continues but now I understand one problem. You can't fix it if you don't understand why it's wrong. Thank you again.
Amytoth2585, try this idea:
WITH NO SHOULDER REST, place your violin on your collarbone. So the back plate (and maybe the chinrest clamp) will sit on your collarbone. From this basic resting on your natural "shelf", you will be able to figure out what chinrest is the best height.
Too many people try to "jack up" their violin higher from underneath....using taller shoulder rests. But that is backwards.
FIRST STEP is to fill the space between collarbone to jaw with just the violin and the chinrest.
NEXT STEP is to find whatever shoulder rest gives you the stability you need. Keep me posted!
You are a lifesaver every time!!
Thanks so much for the information. I just got my kreddle couple days ago . Unfortunately it didn’t work on me I mean ideally how violin resting on collarbone and chin rest on violin just doesn’t work , in my case I always need a support from shoulder rest ,I am glad it works for some people. Kreddle staffs are very helpful. I just emailed them so I could return it they replied right away . You just pay for the shipping to the address they provide then that’s it they will return the money .
I'm glad they took good care of you. I also prefer to play with a shoulder rest. Good luck on your quest to find a good set-up!
Where are you? VN or US? I just hope I knew you 2 months ago so I can get it from you
Tùng Dương Ngô i live in California, USA. Sorry unfortunately I returned it and got the money back . You can try to play with a 🧽 sponge underneath the violin and use a grip or a piece of leather for not slippery, it’s way cheaper and it might work , the violin still resonance nicely . Hope it helps . Have a nice day . 😇
What's that beautiful shoulder rest you have on that violin? Has a upper hook like the Bon Musica, but looks much nicer in wood.
I’m curious to know if you have tried a smaller violin like a 7/8th or 3/4 if you have trouble with a full size?
I’m not having a go at you and I hope I’m not being condescending. I genuinely wonder why. I’ve watched and thoroughly enjoyed and learn so much from heaps of your videos, sometimes more than once, and you do bring up your arm length often.
Hi Darleen! No offense taken thanks for being so polite! I do bring it up often, don't I? Well, here's the story: I never really thought of myself as "too small" for a full size...because I am on the cusp, so I never really gave it any thought until much later after I started teaching alot. It's just something I realized after I started teaching more, and started seeing the advantages and disadvantages of physique on the violin. By the time I realized it, I was a professional player, and the power of a full size violin was important, and I had an expensive violin that would be hard to sell in order to buy a smaller one. So I'd rather just complain about it than change to a smaller size! LOL But you see little children absolutely tearing it up on a full size.....so, it's not an excuse, but it is an impediment. There. That's the story. Happy Thanksgiving!
Red Desert Violin thank you for your reply. I’ve actually been worrying about my post so I’m relieved to get your reply. Thanks again for taking the time to do all of these really great videos!
Thank you for the very nice video! There's something that looks like a design or stain on your violin's varnish, right below the chinrest. Could you tell me what that is?
Hi Melodia, yes, that is a "patina" added by the maker of my violin. In the old days, violins were played without chinrests....causing wear and scarring to occur where the chinrest now sits. So, makers of modern violins often emulate this scarring on purpose....because it makes a violin look older, and face it....scars give us character....so it's just fake scarring. :-)
@@RedDesertViolin Thank you so much for explaining that.
I am now finding my chin rest restrictive. I can't relax my head to the left because it jabs my jaw bone. I am compensating by squeezing my chin to hold. This is causing arm ,back and neck tension that results in twisted muscles that are stiff and painful sometimes. But !!! I don't really know what chin rests to try
Debbie, what type are you currently using, and what shoulder rest? (email me....I"m too slow on these comments)
Thank you for th the link you sent me to this chin rest. I have a long neck with bony collar bone and jaw. When I first put the violin up to my neck it feels secure but after a minute of playing I feel the violin starting to move out from my neck and off my collar bone in the direction that the scroll is when the violin is first place to the side of my neck . My chin feels like it is losing its grip on my chin rest. When I first place the the violin up to my neck it feels like my chin /jawbone is over the tailpiece and I am wondering if I would be better off with the chinrest clamp that comes down on both sides of the tailpiece than the one that has the chinrest to the side of the tailpiece. Any suggestions.
Chris, Kreddle makes a center-mounted chinrest, and you can position it in the center if you need to. YES, I think that sounds like a good idea for you. But also.....what shoulder rest are you using? Anytime someone describes their body like you did above, I think WOLF SECUNDO. YOu need to watch this video: ua-cam.com/video/gtPp9EF_jys/v-deo.html you will know immediately if this is something you should try.
Thanks for the link will have to try this one out .
What is the name of the shoulder rest you are using on your violin I like the shape of it especially the hook in the shoulder area.
Chris, I'm so sorry I have missed your comments, and didn't answer you. I hope you have found your dream set-up. If not, email me, and I'll try to point you in the right direction! (support@reddesertviolin.com)
What chin rest do you use? I''ve been playing for about 15 years... still no setup that works perfectly for me, every time, either sitting or standing. I've done shoulder pad no shoulder pad, center chin rests, side chin rests, you name it. One day I'll work it out! Thanks.
Hi Courtney, I use a Stuber chinrest. But do not go online and order one....they are fakes and they are not shaped the same. If you think you wanna try a Stuber, the only place you can get them is from Gary Frisch at www.chinrests.com. Good luck. If you tell me your body type and what bothers you most in violin set-ups, I might be able to steer you in the right direction. (Oh, and a VERY similar chinrest to the EDU which you can buy online is the Edu)
Red Desert Violin wow thanks! I have always (always even when playing violin) overcorrected with my left shoulder, leading to tenseness in the left side of my body. My instrument also does not feel secure on my shoulder. My left shoulder tenses up to raise my instrument. One of my earlier and favorite teachers always thought it was so weird that I was never tense anywhere else, including bow wrist, but my left shoulder changes to compensate for what I believe are incorrect playing angles, especially when playing on the lower strings. When playing in Orchestra over a period of time this leads to pain and soreness and also a lack of stability in where the instrument is on my shoulder. It really affects my technique because I’ve had moments where the setup is good and experience a certain level of freedom in playing, but it’s always temporary. I’m always trying to achieve that free feeling.
The closest I’ve gotten to a comfy setup with freedom of motion is an SAS chinrest and a makeup sponge/cloth and no shoulder rest but this is sort of a slippery slidey situation and not best for orchestral playing.
I’ve found a really low shoulder rest to be close to comfy - the VLM diamond augustin. This is probably most similar to playing with a sponge or pillow like I used to since it’s a very short shoulder rest and does not have much difference in height from one end to the other (a small “slope”, if you will). I have used an SAS with that but it’s a bit “too much”, I’ve modified a teka to be a little taller but there wasn’t enough grip on the cup (same with Kreddle on the cup type unfortunately). I’ve actually just ordered a few wave chinrests. I’m trying out 4 and am very excited about them. I’ll let you know how it goes.
If you have any students who overcompensate with their left shoulder to bring the G and C strings closer to their bow arm and to keep the instrument at a better height and have fixed their problem I would love to know how. I also have my first student who has position problems just like I did but even worse! I’d love to know how you remedy these situations in students because he’s quite unhappy and it’s keeping him from practicing. Maybe we can DM or email if it’s not too much.
Cheers!
Somday I'll get that violin chinrest, do you know the cost of that item? Thank you for your answer and your tips teacher ¡
The cost is $98, but currently, on sale (during the pandemic) for 25% off! That is a total bargain!
I had ordered the Viola Kreddle side mount and it only came with one chinrest plate.
Maybe it's something new, or maybe it's a Viola thing. :D
I think it's a relatively new thing. (they aren't very expensive to order the additional plate if you think you might need it) So do you love your Kreddle?
Yeah I had ordered mine over a year ago. I wish mine was as contoured as the new ones!
I'd love to try out the high contour plate, but I'm not going to order another one just for that.
Other than that I do like the adjustability of it. I have a long neck so it's nice to have the ability to move this thing around to make it more comfortable.
Its a new thing, it just came out a couple of months ago with the new Kreddle cushion www.kickstarter.com/projects/399267759/kreddle-cushion-a-collarbone-rest-for-violin-and-vmaybe now it is not possible to order the plates separately, but Jordan is a quite helpful and flexible man, sure he will add the option in the future or even if you write to him now, he might sell and ship you only the plates (which by the way, there are 2 new models of chinplates :) )
Good to know, Juan! THank you!
where can i buy this chinrest? i am living in costa rica
Go to www.Kreddle.com! Good luck!
The stuber one is it possible to be moved on the center? Or just side?
The Stuber is ONLY side-mount. You could probably get a custom-made Stuber style with a center mount...but I'm not sure how it would perform. And if anyone could custom make one, it is Gary Frisch at Chinrests.com
Is that an Erhu instrument hanging behind?
Good eye! Yes it is! (I cannot play it....it was a gift from my dad)
Yep!
Can you suggest 🎻 Ko buy in india
A violin? Well, I know lots of big dealers here who are very reputable....and I believe they ship internationally. But as far as dealers IN India, sorry, I do not know!
Aye but violins and violas are not designed to have a bunch of junk clamped to them. When I see the chin rest and shoulder rest the first thing I think of is TRAINING WHEELS ON A BICYCLE. They are for absolute beginners who are simply unable to use the thing without them. But this isn't the main reason - rather they are to prevent little children from being injured. So, an experienced adult playing a little violin....
Well, with all our different body types, I think it's safe to say everyone is different. As you are aware, many successful professional violinists and violists use chin rests and shoulder rests, and they are not all just crazy losers. It's based on your body type, preference, and of course, the training you are had in your life.