Thank you. I was trying to compare these two systems myself. Now I don't need to thanks to your comprehensive overview. You ask for feedback; I watched at 1.75x as I found the pace of the video to be too slow otherwise. Thanks again and keep up the great work :)
Cheers Andrew. Please be aware that Brewzilla GEN 4 is coming soon. I have a video that shows the differences here:- ua-cam.com/video/eiCBcWa6GSo/v-deo.html
David...I always enjoy your work. I know that your are a longtime GrainFather advocate so I appreciate your openmindedness. Thanks for a great side by side comparison.
Nice video David! I have watched many of your videos in the past, and they have helped me as a brewer. I purchased a Robobrew based on price point and have been very satisfied. Please consider posting a video of a brew day on your Robobrew. Looking forward to more informative videos and great recipes. Cheers!
Great review David, I ended up getting the 65 litre Robobrew/ Brewzilla, I've brewed over 50 brews, no issues so far. brew day with no chill method is 4 hours start to finish, cold water in, hot wort into cube. Cheers,
Thank you for the well-made comparison video! I've had the opportunity to brew on both RoboBrew and Grainfather so I can share my opinion as well: My conclusion seems to be the same as yours: The major difference is the controller unit, and the difference is huge. With that said, the price difference is so big that certain quality improvements must be expected from the Grainfather. Personally I prefer my brewing session to be as manually controlled as possible, so RoboBrew fits my needs perfectly. To me homebrewing is a recreational pursuit, where the small things like checking temperature and adjusting flow rates etc. are something I really enjoy. The RoboBrew controller unit can be programmed with up to 6 steps (temperature+time), but personally I quickly switched to manual mode and never looked back. The placement of the controller on RoboBrew, as you mentioned, is quite annoying compared to Grainfather. You will actually have to lay flat on the ground to be able to read it properly if it's placed on the floor. I guess a little bit of exercise during the session doesn't hurt... One difference I think you forgot to mention is the stainless steel ball valve tap on the RoboBrew. This has many uses in my opinion, and Grainfather for some reason doesn't have this. I have yet to find another compact brewery that doesn't include a tap. Another important difference is the placement of the temperature probe. Grainfather has done a smart thing by placing it a bit higher up on the side, while RoboBrew (and pretty much every other economy-class brewery) has it mounted to the bottom. Having it further up removes the possibility of the probe getting insulated with debris, and guarantees a correct reading through the whole process. All in all I was expecting the RoboBrew to feel a lot more cheap compared to Grainfather. It does not, meaning the value for money is very good.
Hi Carsten, Thank you much appreciated. Good to see our findings are aligned! Its not that I forgot the tap more than I showed it in video footage but didnt mention in verbally. I did have a comment on it in my first script but decided to leave it out to keep the flow of the video going. I had quite a tough job with footage as my gimbal kept failing!
@@DavidHeathHomebrew All good, the video would need to be 2 hours long to cover all the details. Like the height of the sparge arm, where Grainfather's low arm makes it really hard to remove the glass lid without detaching the arm. I'm looking forward to see all the improvement ideas that videos like this will trigger from the community!
Great video, thanks! I use the Robobrew false bottom under the Grainfather grain basket. There is a small gap between the wall and the false bottom which allows a little bit of hops to collect on the Grainfather filter, but it also does catch a lot of debris. I may try to put an extra silicon gasket around the Robobrew false bottom to check the fit.
Hi David, in regard to the lack of small batch capability on the RoboBrew, Kegland sell the two bits of pipework as spare parts ($10 each in Australia). These can be cut down to a shorter length without damaging the threaded section on the bottom pipe or the clip on the upper pipe. The shortened pipework is then used like the one sold for the Grain father. I have the 35L Robo and the only criticism I have is that the controller starts counting the step time as soon as the previous step finishes rather than when the new step temperature is reached.
Hi David, another great video! I agree with your comments about both systems so I have decided to buy the camlock upgrade, the valve and the false bottom from Kegland and fit them to my Grainfather. Now I know the lid is interchangeable that will be on my list too! I measured the false bottom and it should fit - if not I am waiting for the Lauter helix to become available from the same supplier. I am fitting the Robobrew valve in place of the product outlet because I hate lifting the Grainfather up and tipping it to get water out plus if ever the pump fails I will be able to quickly disconnect it and drain safely! This video was so timely! Hopefully version 3 of the Grainfather will take this on board! Cheers
Although its not recommended by the manufacturer, the counterflow chiller in the GF can be used to recirculate back into the main vessel, cooling it down quickly for post boil hop additions
This video just made me so happy that I chose to get the robobrew instead of paying more for the grain father. My only knock is the top screen, for me it's given a false illusion that the grain bed is covered with water while mashing and recirculating and I've lost significant efficiency because of this. When I took it out during the mash the top of the grain bed was above the water level, even though the screen (when in) was submerged.
Great to hear. In regards to the top screen positioning is important to avoid the point you made. Push it down flush to the grain and then raise it a slight amount.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew yeah mate I just dont use it now.. it's not essential and gets in the way because I like to stir every now and then, especially if doing a step mash or any time I raise the temp during mash in/out
Many thanks for this. I'm looking to make the transition to mash brewing and as well as providing a product comparison, it allowed me to clearly understand how a unit of this type is used.
Great presentation. I absolutely love my grainfather controller and being able to Bluetooth it with my phone. This is probably the biggest advantage I can see. The grainfather filter always seems to get blocked, love the idea of a bottom plate filter.
Good comparison thanks Dave. I like the easy of using my phone and cfc chiller the Grainfather offers. It also seems that if the pump fails, the GF would be easier to replace.
Good side by side comparison, although I don't recall you mentioning the valve on the bottom of the Robobrew vs not having one on the Grainfather. I use it to gravity fill my fermenter which I find handy but then again with the CFC on the Grainfather that wouldn't be necessary.
The truth had been told. After watching the whole video i must admit my trusty monk is a pretty big bang for the buck actually. Thanks for the vid David, one day i might buy a g30. Cheers
Thanks for your very informative video David! I have recently ordered a grainfather(still waiting for it as the post is a bit slow at the moment) then I saw this video. I must admit initially i doubted my purchase and wished i had bought a brewzilla instead. On reflection though I believe i made the right choice for the following reasons: - The bluetooth controller(even though there are outstanding issues) - Cfc - Positioning of the controller - A tried and true product in the market - Being close to one of the head offices gives me confidence of good support😀 - Cheap and easy options to give upgrades - I still don't trust the robobrew electronics.... At the end of the day I look forward to many years of homebrew on my gf system! Thanks again David!
Both of these systems are good. There are just pros and cons in comparing them. There is quite a price difference, so thats the thing to consider vs the extras on the GF. The electrics are very similar on both of these if you open them up.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Very true there are pros v cons. Interesting regarding the electronics! Overall I'm still glad I went for the gf even with the extra cost. As you said you need to make the decision for yourself and what you want out of the system. Cheers mate!
A great comparison, I would like the automation and auto access to the 20,000 Brewsmith recipes, but in practice I only brew 8-10 different ale types, so not really a big deal, and not worth $400 extra
Great review, David. Thank you so much! Trying to make up my mind here on which system (including BIAB) to purchase and that video just added a lot to my thinking process Lol. Glad that we've now got Robobrew here in Norway (I live in Stavanger). Many thanks and already looking forward to watching other videos of yours.
I went through many months deciding between new electric systems. I considered both of these but in the end, I chose neither. I ended up choosing the Clawhammer electric system. It seemed to be the best of all worlds. It's a complete BIAB system that I couldn't be happier with and in my opinion it gave me more options, and also the price what excellent for all the equipment they include. Its an option I would recommend for anyone looking into an all-electric system.
Hi David. Thanks for the superb videos, watching them has been very enjoyable and added positively to my homebrewing thinking in quite a big way. I held back on buying a GF and think I was a bit uncomfortable with the price and felt I could not justify it based on my needs. The Robobrew 3 however is a no-brainer for me and I now have a unit on order. I never really felt that I needed a Connect Controller and are more inclined to do things manually so the difference in price point which centres quite a bit around the Connect Controller is probably a waste of money for me personally. Your video has assured me of the quality of the Robobrew 3 which perhaps was not quite there with the version 2 and dissuaded me from purchasing the version 2 unit.
Out of curiosity, have you had a chance to look at the Klarstein line of all in one brewing systems? They have a rather large range and I was curious to find out how they stack up to Grainfather or Robobrew.
I have tested earlier versions that had the same issues as the Bulldog but nothing current yet. These are sold under various brands with small differences like Ace and Brewster Beacon, Brewcat and so on. They could have moved on. The earlier versions of the Robobrew were much the same but that has improved greatly, perhaps some versions of this have improved also. I've seen people say the Brewster Beacon is a good version. I hope to try it at some point.
Great video.. I must of missed the fact about the robobrew having a drain spout whereas the grainfather doesn't.. I myself have a klarstein.. I chose that system due to more wattage than both systems you reviewed, Also it was cheaper than both.. Keep the videos coming there very well done and very informative.. Cheers from Wisconsin!!
Great video. I appreciate the effort you put into this. I will be buying the Robobrew due to cost factor, I wish it had a better controller with the ability to link to a phone app. I believe you can use the chilling coil on the Robobrew as a CFC also.
Great to hear thank you. You can use the immersion chiller supplied in a couple of different ways and at extra cost there is a full CFC also...well worth getting!
Hi good review. I've thinking of buying a G30 but I wonder if you know if there is a new updated model in the works? The G30 is still a couple of years old now.
Thanks. Actually the G30 is 7 years old. There are two new models coming from GF very soon. I will have videos about them. I am being sent two test units next week.
Good review! I've been using a Grainfather with the old controller for a few years, never bothered with the upgrade to the new controller, as running it fully manual isn't exactly hard work. In this respect I don't see the Robobrew controller as much of an issue in use. What does appeal is the price, compared to the Grainfather I could buy 2 Robobrew units and easily do a parallel double brew day with an IPA in one and a Scotch Ale in the other, for example. Or double up on one recipe I have that has an 80% beer tax on it (the one my mates love and keep coming around to drink).
Hi David. Thanks for another great video - I’ll be looking forward to your future brews using these systems. I live in Australia and bought a GF connect about a year ago for $1150AUD. At the time there was a lot of quality control issues with the RB - and legal issues over here between companies making and marketing them. That seems to have worked out now and the RB has been through a lot of R&D since then and appears to be a much better product now. Two issues I still have with the RB is that you have to supply hoses and fittings for the chiller, and, the RB chiller is still made of stainless steel - I understood copper is a better heat exchange material than stainless steel. Maybe you can show how to connect the RB chiller pipes, and, do a comparison between chilling times! :-) Thanks again. Cheers.
Thanks Jeff. Yes things have certainly evolved in this time. The problem with copper is many are alarmed by the potential health issues. This has caused a shift in the market with SS being introduced by many suppliers. It is not as good but it pleases many. Yes I agree that the RB should at least come with chiller fittings.
David Heath Thanks David for your response. Fair enough people are concerned about potential health issues with copper - I understand. I’m sure if I had a RB I could rig up some hoses, but agree, they really should have some type of fitting attached. Keep on brewing and keep those videos coming - I really get excited each time I see a new David Heath video. Cheers. Jeff
Great review. The most objective I have seen so far. No wasted time and straight to the point. Excellent. Muy bueno. By the way, could you make a video showing how to mash or brew with the Robobrew? We will appreciate it very much. Thank you
Hi, thank you. The Robobrew is now sold as the Brewzilla. I have many videos on my channel that show its use. Here is a quick start guide:- ua-cam.com/video/HxLJau-hBTs/v-deo.html
I've lost my Grainfather grain basket handle, do you know if the Brewzilla handle will work on the Grainfather basket? It's substantially cheaper for a "simple bar" of metal! Edit : It does indeed fit and works! need a very small "tweak" to get into the basket, but once in there it feel solid and it has a nice hookable shape compared to the original handle.
G’day David ! I really enjoy your videos and this is a good balanced and honest review. I have recently bought the Robobrew gen 3 and have had 2 reasonably trouble free brews on it so far. I also noticed that you recently joined the Robobrew Brewzilla facebook page, welcome to the darkside :)
Well done David. Thought I was dead set on the Grainfather , but you have given us reasons to give the Robobrew another look. Simple things like the lid and unit handles, the notched tube handle and the cam lock... makes you wonder why they are missing from something as high end as the Grainfather is. When adding a cam lock to the Grainfather- do you then lose the safety valve feature? I am giving it all another thought, but I must say it’s the higher position of that controller and its incredible features that still have me leaning towards the Grainfather. The ready to go counter flow chiller is another big plus. Thanks again David. Happy Brewing.
Thanks Richie. The choice between these is full of pros and cons! I guess you could do a camlock conversion and keep the safety feature but you would be doing it differently to others. You can close off the valve instead during the boil to make sure there are no accidents though. Yes the controller and CFC are really a large parts of the process and should not be put aside if the cost is a non issue for you.
Great comparison of features. I've been looking at the Brew Monk and also the Robobrew so this was really interesting to see the Robobrew compared to one of the 'Big Guns'. One thing I've wondered is if you could just use a BIAB bag in the Robobrew so have the bag open at the top and the wort recirculating through the top? It does seem a bit strange (at least to me) that the grain baskets with these all in ones only have mesh bottoms as opposed to having mesh sides and bottoms which you do see on some of the high end US systems like the Clawhammer electric kettles. There is probably a scientific/use reason for that though, maybe the re-circulation pump would just clog all of the time. Thanks for the video.
Thanks James. Actually I wondered exactly this when I first started using all in one systems. I did some testing and got very similar results back from using a bag and a grainbasket. The Robobrew (now really the Brewzilla) also has a sister product called the Digiboil, that is a uncirculated BIAB brewer. Ive used that a fair bit and it also works well for what it is. I used it in this video:- ua-cam.com/video/jWx_Bh2jBlQ/v-deo.html
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Glad I wasn't the only person curious about this and interesting that you got pretty much the same results from the experiment. Good to know also that that method 'does work' should people have a fault or defect with the brew basket. Thanks for the reply David, much appreciated.
Great video! I am still on the fence as to which to system to buy but this helped a bit. I do like the controller and counterflow chiller on the grainfather though i am not certain it is worth the extra $. Having done 6 brews or so using the manual stovetop method which was a pain and not very accurate i think i could go with either of these for my first all in one electric system
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thanks i ended up getting the robobrew 3.1.1 after a demo at my local brew store. For the price of the grainfather i was able to get the robobrew, brewtech brew bucket brewmaster edition and a grainfather sparge water heater.
David, Great video. I have on occasion felt you were a bit biased toward the Grainfather line of products, and I am happy to feel wrong about my assumptions now. There are a few items that may be of interest to you about the Robobrew versions of old. (For reference I own 2 robos and a GF, although I don't have the BT controller version) The pipework used to have the same system as the grainfather, as well as the malt screens having silicon. Even the 3.0 robobrew I received right before the 3.1 came out (grrrr) had silicon for the top screen, but not the bottom. Even older models had silicon everywhere. The camlock addition was new to the 3.0 line, 2.0 and older were identical to the Grainfather in that regard. While the pump is indeed fully manual, the elements can be left fully "on" and the system will control them as it needs to, I think the switches are just there as a safety measure for the most part (I could be wrong about the reasons I dunno...) No argument at all regarding the position of the Robo controller... they really should consider a more accessible controller for us floor brewers. I use my Robo on a milk crate and that's still a bit too low to save my back. The extra screen at the bottom of the malt pipe is new to the 3.0 line, and some users have stated it's more trouble than it's worth. Personally I couldn't say, I haven't used it. Last thing, you mentioned wanting a false bottom, consider using the False bottom from your Robo in the GF, it'll fit. You could also use the Robo's malt pipe since I believe the only reason it's smaller is to accommodate the false bottom. If you prefer the GF pipework and screen I suspect you could probably interchange those as well.. i haven't tried but it all looks to fit together nicely enough.. ok that's all I have.. Again, fantastic vid!
Brand new to all this and was getting lost, amazing that you picked out the pros and cons as well as educating me on the process, excellent job! Think I’m gonna go for the brewzilla
I think you would have difficulty trying to fit the bluetooth connect to the robobrew, the reason being is the robobrew has dual heating elements, hence the double switch, the controller uses either heating element depending on the temp selected, if under a certain temp it uses the smaller element and both for boiling, whereas the grainfather has a dedicated low/full power element which is controlled by the pid. hope this makes sense.
Thanks David for this video, about mash thickness, brewfather formula is grain kilos x 2,7 +3,5 for brewzilla I see you use grain kilos x 3 + 6,75, what is the reason for this difference?
Hi Peter, you can add 9kg but this is not advisable as the efficiency will go down. I would suggest 7.5kg is about right as a maximum. Best to do a reiterated mash for strong beers in any brewing system. Check this out:- ua-cam.com/video/C-7NiGZgKyQ/v-deo.html
This comparison was quite nice. I was wondering if you knew about future generations coming out on either for the grainfather or robobrew 3.1.1? I know the g70 came out and the 65l brewzilla were released, but I'm looking into the smaller version between the two and do not want to purchase them if a new version is going to be released soon.
Yes it can if you use the app. Many including myself are not using the app though due to all the issues. I would not say it's much of an advantage really.
Thanks for this, do you know if the robobrew false bottom fits the GF? Not a massive fan of the small filter on the GF when using hop pellets as I find it clogs up the filter even after wirlpooling.
Great video. I was wondering if the small batch pipework from the Grainfather fits on the Robobrew? Also, I find the false bottom doesn’t fit well and there’s a gap around it that let crap go through. Is there a way to improve that? Maybe by installing a silicone gasket from the grain basket?
Thank you. I will be trying various parts from each and seeing what works and what doesnt. No sooner did I film this video and a friend borrowed the Robobrew for the weekend!
David Heath Hey David, just saw your new video about the false bottom, do you have a gap around it that let stuff go through? Also, did you have a chance to test the small batch pipework on the robobrew basket?
Thanks for a very good video. I have today the Bulldog brewer 30 L (same as Cobra) - how would you rate the quality of Robo Brew and Grainfather vs that one - I'm considering to buy a new system.
Thanks Bjorn. I would put it below both of them in terms of quality and reliability. Though right now (and for some time) the GF software is very buggy still. I have a more recent guide series here:- ua-cam.com/play/PLeY07JqsrXM8qdQcqQnMGB2T5h9PLpt_Z.html
Really good honest comparison. Seems the GF has been beaten at its own game by something cheaper. Surely they should put the price down of this old system now?
Great video, really helpful. I also do small batches.. can you explain why the BrewZilla couldn't handle them? You mentioned small pipework, but I was struggling to work out what that meant in practise. (What is the smallest batch size either could handle?
Thank you. You can do 15L batches in both by standard and in some cases lower. Gf have a “small batch pipework” product that allows 10L. Brewzilla doesnt have this but some users have bought the standard pipework and cut it in half to mimic this. Cheaper also :)
I like that controlebox unit on the GF is on top. And not on the bottom like the Robobrew clones. . I hope that Grainfather will come out this year with there 50 Liter EU version that has double stronger pumps,camlock,wifi,more handles, and thicker isolated stainless steel. And most of all a affordable € price. Thanks for the comparison between the 2's.
@@mzmagister No more info yet. Grainfather doesn't want to provide any more detailes yet. I'm really hoping that it will be this summer or this year for the 230 EU version. . This would not be any good news for Speidels bm50 sales than hi hi lol. I think that the choice for me would be between the brewzilla or the new grainfather 50 liter. The prices between the 2 is very important to me. I dont want to sell any of my kidneys for just a brew kettle. That why i lost interest in all of Speidels overpriced products. Without my liver and kidneys i cannot drink. I need them. So the prices must be ride for the gf50.
Thanks for another informative video. I have a couple of questions regarding the general brew time for these systems. I currently brew 12L BIAB (14.5l pre boil)on a gas stove and takes around 3.5 - 4 hours. With these systems if the mash water had been set on the delayed timer, from start of mash to end of clean up what would be the average brew day for a 19L batch ? Do you feel much time would be saved by doing full volume/no sparge for a 12L - 15L brew using extra grain to adjust for lower efficiency? Or do you feel the systems wouldn't work well for this method? Thanks
Hi Dave, I don’t think you will save much time compared. The key advantage of all in one systems is greater efficiency, ease of temp control, convenience and flexibility of volume. You can also brew anywhere with a water supply and power.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew hi, thanks for your response. It's definitely the ease of taking the brewing to the man cave that will please the Mrs..My main concern is the possible increase on the time. I have read various forums suggesting grain father brew days between 4-7 hours. On a UK volt system do you think 4 hours would be achievable from start of mash to clean up with a 19l batch? Thanks
You can contact me here. You may find these videos helpful:- ua-cam.com/video/fzcnyyvWAYA/v-deo.html and ua-cam.com/video/LCocmYRTsiw/v-deo.html and ua-cam.com/video/cSebtK23nFw/v-deo.html and ua-cam.com/video/-iGgxs6QjPY/v-deo.html
I had to experiment with a dry yeast(processed), the result wasn’t pleasant but I got a good reaction which showed that the yeast was still alive. I have a few questions if you don’t mind Sir Seeing that bakers yeast and yeast for beer/wine are of different purposes are the steps towards making this yeast’s the same? Do they have different foods that ought to be fed to the yeast while they grow. I used cassava flour and sugar, because I wanted something that is high in carbohydrate.
Yes, yeast is yeast but yeast selection is vital for the best result. Luckily these days yeast of all varieties are available to all. Beer yeast is best grown using malt, often dried malt extract.
Great objective comparison. I'd love to know what the difference is in mash temps are within the grain bed. At a guess the dimensions could have an effect on this but not sure. Keep up the good work David.
Hi David, Thanks for the video...appreciate the review..one of the things I do dislike about the GF is the screw on fittings over the camlocks from robo. Any chance you know a good place to buy the parts to convert the GF? I’m a US guy and it seems like over here fittings are NPT whereas I understand the GF fittings are BSP fittings so I’m having trouble here finding this conversion to do it properly. Thanks in advance.
Good question! I guess I would buy the GF but modify it with improvements in line with Robobrew. Pretty expensive route though. I am looking at how you could use the GF controller with other brewing systems. If that works then perhaps my answer will change.
David, Seeing the robobrew has no silicone gaskets for grain basket, I'm wondering if the grainfather really needs them either? I might try a batch without them and see. Your thoughts? Cheers John V
Is there any issues with programming the Robobrew when the unit is placed on the floor which I believe most users do so they can easily remove mash basket
So the Robobrew is a decent competitor to the Grainfather. I already have the Grainfather but if I was in the market today I might have gone for the Robo instead considering the huge price difference. Though it does seem inconvenient to have the controller down by the floor, without any connectivity. I mostly use my phone for controlling the GF when I brew but having the interface on the controller easily accessible is nice.
Hi, Its pros and cons really. Only people can decide what matters and what suits them the best. I would not want to be without my GF but equally I am happy with the RB as an extra brewing system for the price involved.
I like that controlebox unit on the GF is on top. And not on the bottom like the Robobrew clones. . I hope that Grainfather will come out this year with there 50 Liter EU version that has double stronger pumps,camlock,wifi,more handles, and thicker isolated stainless steel. And most of all a affordable € price. Thanks for the comparison between the 2's.
Normal Guy i seriously don’t. i bought a sparge water heater, kegerator, 2 fermonsters and two kegs for money saved.bluetooth controls are a non issue for me.
Have a robo gen 2. Works great, efficiency around 79-80 . Don't mind pushing buttons on the machine rather than off Bluetooth .The way I see it, you pay for the extra Bluetooth technology with recipes etc. But hey its not hard to research and be a little more hands on.
David, Have you got any experience (direct or otherwise) of the latest Bulldog system, the 'Bulldog Master Brewer'? I'm currently looking to invest in an all-in-one system and finding it very difficult to choose between the robobrew, grainfather and Bulldog Master Brewer. My main issue is the lack of information available on the Bulldog system.
Hi, Yes I have. Whilst this is a step up from their past offerings it is also a step up in price. For less money you can buy a Robobrew brewzilla or for a bit more a Gf. I think both of these offer a better experience and value for money. I have a more detailed buyers guide coming in 2-3 weeks.
Thanks for the feedback David, it's very much appreciated. I'd be curious to know what you consider to be the main downsides of the Master Brewer (apart from the obvious, the controller). I'm particularly attracted to the ease of sparging when bought with the matching water heater (which you can just plug and pump), available for £580. Which would only put it £100 more than an equivalent robobrew set-up (UK prices) and £200 less than an equivalent GF set up. I await you next video with bated breath :) Thanks again.
This video really confirmed my choice of brewing system. I have the grainfather, with that I found that the heat delay timer to very useful. Thanks for you insight it helped me immensely. Pierre
Hi David - thanks for another excellent video. Do you find the lack of PID in the Brewzilla controller causes any issues with overshooting mash temperatures or other problems with temperature control? Would it be worth the trouble to add a PID-enabled controller to the Brewzilla? Grateful for your thoughts as always!
Thanks David, if I'd have known about the RoboBrew, I think I'd have purchased it instead of the Grainfather. The things that I don't like about the Grainfather are; the silicone seals on the grain basket, it takes everal attempts to get them right unless the basket shell is heated up, a real pain in the ass; the glass lid is awkward to remove when it's hot; I've had the pump and the pump filter clog up when using hop pellets, I now use the Mangrove Jacks hop spider, for hops or pellets, because I don't have any faith in the Grainfather filtration system; I don't like the grainfather recipe web-site, I have tried to enter some recipes from books, and it's not at all easy, so I don't find the automatic bluetooth recipes are much use to me, I brew on the fly from Camra's Brewing British Ales Book; However the counterflow wort chiller is just brilliant. I hope that GF will introduce a filtration system similar to the Robobrew version, most other things are probably issues that can be modified by myself.
Thanks for your feedback Eve. With the silicone seal you can leave it off or what I do is just make sure the inner walls are wet before I try adding it. A spray bottle works. Yes the glass lid...wear gloves! Not a bad idea for brewing in general anyway. You can blow the filter out pretty fast by attaching a bicycle pump to the cfc wort out end. Afew pumps and problem solved usually. GF are revamping the recipe creator website, worth trying again soon I should think.
Thanks for theadvice Kerry, but is starsan any more lubricating than water? I have tried water and it doesn't work on my GF, as I have already said the only way to be sure with mine is to leave the shell in the heating water before adding grain.@@kerryhales8736
Thanks for theadvice David, but is starsan any more lubricating than water? I have tried water and it doesn't work on my GF, as I have already said the only way to be sure with mine is to leave the shell in the heating water before adding grain.
I think it should be easy if you want to do that. The heating element is just powered by a mechanical relay I guess, the pump is also a relay, the termistor has to be adjusted to have the same resistance profile as the grainfather controller would expect otherwise the temperatures would be off.
Really excellent review David. I have the Grainfather and love it but if I ever get another system I think I would go for the Robobrew because of the price
Dear David, thank's a lot for Your wonderful videos and well thought out informations! I decided to go for a brewzilla 35l V3.1 and just ordered one. Since You have both systems: Did You ever try if the the micro pipework of the Grainfather fits the brewzilla as well? I would love to be able to do small batches and gain a little more flexibility.
Thanks Frank. Sadly not. There is a cheaper work around though. Buy an extra normal pipework from Kegland. Cut this down by about 40-50%. You now have small batch pipework. I am yet to try this.
Thats going to be a problem as heating elements are welded on all systems that I have seen. Its unusual for them to fail without being abused or used in a wrong way.
This is an intelligent and well-produced video. I'm new to homebrewing and find your approach outstanding.
Thank you Dirk, much appreciated :) Practise has helped I think. Hope you enjoy my other content also :)
Thank you. I was trying to compare these two systems myself. Now I don't need to thanks to your comprehensive overview. You ask for feedback; I watched at 1.75x as I found the pace of the video to be too slow otherwise. Thanks again and keep up the great work :)
Thanks Andrew, glad you found it useful. Speed wise people seem to vary opinion wise but there are always solutions :)
Simply excellent! I am thinking of replacing all my old heath-robinson kit and this video is going to help my decision enormously. Many thanks!
Great to hear, Cheers 🍻🍻🍻
Check out the more upto date comparisons too though on my channel.
The Brewzilla being almost $1000 cheaper than the GF here in Oz, it's a no brainer for me. Great comparison vid, appreciated.
Thank you, I am glad it helped :)
if I could rate the quality of this video, I'd give it 10/10. This was a huge help - thanks
Great to hear Felix, plenty more on the channel :)
A great unbiased comparison. Thank you very much for taking the time to put this together.
Glad you found it useful Mark. Thank you :)
Thank you for doing this video.
I am thinking of buying one of these systems. Your video was very informative.
Cheers, Andrew
Cheers Andrew. Please be aware that Brewzilla GEN 4 is coming soon. I have a video that shows the differences here:- ua-cam.com/video/eiCBcWa6GSo/v-deo.html
David...I always enjoy your work. I know that your are a longtime GrainFather advocate so I appreciate your openmindedness. Thanks for a great side by side comparison.
Thanks David. Brewing is brewing. Ive used all sorts of equipment over the years. It was great to find a budget system that works this well.
Nice video David! I have watched many of your videos in the past, and they have helped me as a brewer. I purchased a Robobrew based on price point and have been very satisfied. Please consider posting a video of a brew day on your Robobrew. Looking forward to more informative videos and great recipes. Cheers!
Hey, many thanks glad you enjoyed it :) Yes I will :)
Great review David, I ended up getting the 65 litre Robobrew/ Brewzilla, I've brewed over 50 brews, no issues so far. brew day with no chill method is 4 hours start to finish, cold water in, hot wort into cube.
Cheers,
Cheers Ben, yes they are well priced yet very solid. Glad you found this useful :)
Been watching lots on your channel, you explain everything so well, thankyou for all the advice, Cheers
Thanks Ben, much appreciated
Thanks for providing such quality, unbiased information on what is a very common question at the moment. Really helpful. Keep up the good work David!
Much appreciated, thank you :)
Thank you for the well-made comparison video!
I've had the opportunity to brew on both RoboBrew and Grainfather so I can share my opinion as well:
My conclusion seems to be the same as yours: The major difference is the controller unit, and the difference is huge.
With that said, the price difference is so big that certain quality improvements must be expected from the Grainfather.
Personally I prefer my brewing session to be as manually controlled as possible, so RoboBrew fits my needs perfectly. To me homebrewing is a recreational pursuit, where the small things like checking temperature and adjusting flow rates etc. are something I really enjoy. The RoboBrew controller unit can be programmed with up to 6 steps (temperature+time), but personally I quickly switched to manual mode and never looked back.
The placement of the controller on RoboBrew, as you mentioned, is quite annoying compared to Grainfather. You will actually have to lay flat on the ground to be able to read it properly if it's placed on the floor. I guess a little bit of exercise during the session doesn't hurt...
One difference I think you forgot to mention is the stainless steel ball valve tap on the RoboBrew. This has many uses in my opinion, and Grainfather for some reason doesn't have this. I have yet to find another compact brewery that doesn't include a tap.
Another important difference is the placement of the temperature probe. Grainfather has done a smart thing by placing it a bit higher up on the side, while RoboBrew (and pretty much every other economy-class brewery) has it mounted to the bottom. Having it further up removes the possibility of the probe getting insulated with debris, and guarantees a correct reading through the whole process.
All in all I was expecting the RoboBrew to feel a lot more cheap compared to Grainfather. It does not, meaning the value for money is very good.
Hi Carsten, Thank you much appreciated. Good to see our findings are aligned! Its not that I forgot the tap more than I showed it in video footage but didnt mention in verbally. I did have a comment on it in my first script but decided to leave it out to keep the flow of the video going. I had quite a tough job with footage as my gimbal kept failing!
@@DavidHeathHomebrew All good, the video would need to be 2 hours long to cover all the details. Like the height of the sparge arm, where Grainfather's low arm makes it really hard to remove the glass lid without detaching the arm. I'm looking forward to see all the improvement ideas that videos like this will trigger from the community!
Haha very true :)
Great video, thanks! I use the Robobrew false bottom under the Grainfather grain basket. There is a small gap between the wall and the false bottom which allows a little bit of hops to collect on the Grainfather filter, but it also does catch a lot of debris. I may try to put an extra silicon gasket around the Robobrew false bottom to check the fit.
Yes, that will work if it becomes an issue. Personally I use the original filter and the false bottom. This covers things nicely.
Really great comparison David. I'm currently considering both of these systems - this has been really helpful :)
Great to hear, many thanks for your feedback.
We needed this
Thanks for sharing your thoughts
Appreciate the time you put in
I had actually already ordered a Robobrew
Cheers
Thanks Andy. Whatever people choose I hope it is based on having the right information :)
Brilliant video David, thank you for the useful information, you've enabled me to really make my mind up which brewing system to get!
Great to hear Matt :)
Mr Heath, the best comparison I’ve seen. Well done mate!
Thank you Dakota :) Much appreciated :)
Hi David, in regard to the lack of small batch capability on the RoboBrew, Kegland sell the two bits of pipework as spare parts ($10 each in Australia). These can be cut down to a shorter length without damaging the threaded section on the bottom pipe or the clip on the upper pipe. The shortened pipework is then used like the one sold for the Grain father. I have the 35L Robo and the only criticism I have is that the controller starts counting the step time as soon as the previous step finishes rather than when the new step temperature is reached.
Thanks for the insight David, I was thinking along these lines myself :) Yes that is true on the controller but easy to predict after some use.
Hello David, Awesome video comparison of Robobrew and Grainfather. Thanks very much. Cheers Elmar
Thanks Elmar :) Plenty more on the channel about these two systems.
Nice video, I have a G30 and I use a false bottom and a hexcoil beneath it. Works great
I bought them from a firm in Italy
Great, it certainly is a great way to go.
Not sure I understand the issue of small batch brewing on the Robobrew unit, but enjoyed the content as it was presented very well - thanks
Thanks. Its not so much an issue. There is just not a ready to go solution. People have cut down replacement pipework with good success though.
Hi David, another great video! I agree with your comments about both systems so I have decided to buy the camlock upgrade, the valve and the false bottom from Kegland and fit them to my Grainfather. Now I know the lid is interchangeable that will be on my list too! I measured the false bottom and it should fit - if not I am waiting for the Lauter helix to become available from the same supplier. I am fitting the Robobrew valve in place of the product outlet because I hate lifting the Grainfather up and tipping it to get water out plus if ever the pump fails I will be able to quickly disconnect it and drain safely! This video was so timely! Hopefully version 3 of the Grainfather will take this on board!
Cheers
Thanks Ken :) If you use the kegland false bottom then you will also need the grain basket from them. I am yet to try this though but I will soon.
David Heath is this because of the added height?
Ken FOWLER Yes, the RB grain basket is a little shorter for this reason. I will best testing things like this and how they work soon
David Heath I’m just going to use it for small batches until the Lauter helix is back in stock ( it’s good Kegland in in Australia ;) )
Although its not recommended by the manufacturer, the counterflow chiller in the GF can be used to recirculate back into the main vessel, cooling it down quickly for post boil hop additions
Sure it can but its slow compared to a cooling spiral.
Absolutely complete and informative video. Thank you so much!
Cheers Jonathon :)
This video just made me so happy that I chose to get the robobrew instead of paying more for the grain father. My only knock is the top screen, for me it's given a false illusion that the grain bed is covered with water while mashing and recirculating and I've lost significant efficiency because of this. When I took it out during the mash the top of the grain bed was above the water level, even though the screen (when in) was submerged.
Great to hear. In regards to the top screen positioning is important to avoid the point you made. Push it down flush to the grain and then raise it a slight amount.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew yeah mate I just dont use it now.. it's not essential and gets in the way because I like to stir every now and then, especially if doing a step mash or any time I raise the temp during mash in/out
Yes sure no worries there.
Many thanks for this. I'm looking to make the transition to mash brewing and as well as providing a product comparison, it allowed me to clearly understand how a unit of this type is used.
Great to hear Graham. Plenty more on my channel that I hope you will find useful :)
I appreciate your unbiased view. Great video
Thanks John :)
Great presentation. I absolutely love my grainfather controller and being able to Bluetooth it with my phone. This is probably the biggest advantage I can see. The grainfather filter always seems to get blocked, love the idea of a bottom plate filter.
Thanks Brett. I agree on both points :)
Good comparison thanks Dave. I like the easy of using my phone and cfc chiller the Grainfather offers. It also seems that if the pump fails, the GF would be easier to replace.
Thanks Marvin. Yes :) Pump wise I guess time will not be so different really.
Good side by side comparison, although I don't recall you mentioning the valve on the bottom of the Robobrew vs not having one on the Grainfather. I use it to gravity fill my fermenter which I find handy but then again with the CFC on the Grainfather that wouldn't be necessary.
Many thanks. Yes the tap is a useful addition, I thought that I did mention it? Hmm
@@DavidHeathHomebrew There's a good chance you did and I probably missed it.
Others have said it all. I agree. Excellent work, thank you.
Many thanks Jan :)
i own a brew monk, and far broke to buy either, why am i even watching this. Probably just addicted to the channel
No worries, as long as you are happy with it :) Great beer can be made without much outlay :)
The truth had been told. After watching the whole video i must admit my trusty monk is a pretty big bang for the buck actually.
Thanks for the vid David, one day i might buy a g30. Cheers
There are more up to date systems out there already compared to the G30. An upgrade has to be close.
Thanks for your very informative video David! I have recently ordered a grainfather(still waiting for it as the post is a bit slow at the moment) then I saw this video. I must admit initially i doubted my purchase and wished i had bought a brewzilla instead. On reflection though I believe i made the right choice for the following reasons:
- The bluetooth controller(even though there are outstanding issues)
- Cfc
- Positioning of the controller
- A tried and true product in the market
- Being close to one of the head offices gives me confidence of good support😀
- Cheap and easy options to give upgrades
- I still don't trust the robobrew electronics....
At the end of the day I look forward to many years of homebrew on my gf system!
Thanks again David!
Both of these systems are good. There are just pros and cons in comparing them. There is quite a price difference, so thats the thing to consider vs the extras on the GF. The electrics are very similar on both of these if you open them up.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Very true there are pros v cons. Interesting regarding the electronics!
Overall I'm still glad I went for the gf even with the extra cost. As you said you need to make the decision for yourself and what you want out of the system.
Cheers mate!
I really enjoy your Videos David. Thanks for your time and effort..🍻🍻🍻
Thank you Welshie :) Much appreciated :)
A great comparison,
I would like the automation and auto access to the 20,000 Brewsmith recipes, but in practice I only brew 8-10 different ale types, so not really a big deal, and not worth $400 extra
Fair enough 🍻🍻🍻
Nice review David, I have a grainfather for single brews and bought a Brewzilla 65L for double batches. Both perform their jobs well.
Thanks Tony, great to hear. The 65L isnt available here currently but I will give it a try when it does. Good to hear its working well :)
Great review, David. Thank you so much! Trying to make up my mind here on which system (including BIAB) to purchase and that video just added a lot to my thinking process Lol. Glad that we've now got Robobrew here in Norway (I live in Stavanger). Many thanks and already looking forward to watching other videos of yours.
Many thanks James.
I went through many months deciding between new electric systems. I considered both of these but in the end, I chose neither. I ended up choosing the Clawhammer electric system. It seemed to be the best of all worlds. It's a complete BIAB system that I couldn't be happier with and in my opinion it gave me more options, and also the price what excellent for all the equipment they include. Its an option I would recommend for anyone looking into an all-electric system.
Clawhammer is not available here, glad to hear that you are enjoying it though :)
thanks for the help.... now I see a couple more options on the market! oh the choices!
Choice is always good :)
Thanks for the video looking forward to all grain brewing when I get one of these systems.
Thank you, glad you found it useful
Thank you David! Your delivery style is very straightforward.
Glad you found it useful, many thanks for your feedback :)
Hi David. Thanks for the superb videos, watching them has been very enjoyable and added positively to my homebrewing thinking in quite a big way. I held back on buying a GF and think I was a bit uncomfortable with the price and felt I could not justify it based on my needs. The Robobrew 3 however is a no-brainer for me and I now have a unit on order. I never really felt that I needed a Connect Controller and are more inclined to do things manually so the difference in price point which centres quite a bit around the Connect Controller is probably a waste of money for me personally. Your video has assured me of the quality of the Robobrew 3 which perhaps was not quite there with the version 2 and dissuaded me from purchasing the version 2 unit.
🍻🍻🍻
Thanks David. Great comparison video.
Many thanks John, great to hear :)
Out of curiosity, have you had a chance to look at the Klarstein line of all in one brewing systems? They have a rather large range and I was curious to find out how they stack up to Grainfather or Robobrew.
I have tested earlier versions that had the same issues as the Bulldog but nothing current yet. These are sold under various brands with small differences like Ace and Brewster Beacon, Brewcat and so on. They could have moved on. The earlier versions of the Robobrew were much the same but that has improved greatly, perhaps some versions of this have improved also. I've seen people say the Brewster Beacon is a good version. I hope to try it at some point.
Great video.. I must of missed the fact about the robobrew having a drain spout whereas the grainfather doesn't.. I myself have a klarstein.. I chose that system due to more wattage than both systems you reviewed, Also it was cheaper than both.. Keep the videos coming there very well done and very informative.. Cheers from Wisconsin!!
Many thanks Wally, as long as you are brewing then all is good 👍 :)
Yessir!
Great video. I appreciate the effort you put into this. I will be buying the Robobrew due to cost factor, I wish it had a better controller with the ability to link to a phone app. I believe you can use the chilling coil on the Robobrew as a CFC also.
Great to hear thank you. You can use the immersion chiller supplied in a couple of different ways and at extra cost there is a full CFC also...well worth getting!
Hi good review. I've thinking of buying a G30 but I wonder if you know if there is a new updated model in the works? The G30 is still a couple of years old now.
Thanks. Actually the G30 is 7 years old. There are two new models coming from GF very soon. I will have videos about them. I am being sent two test units next week.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Are there a new G30?
No. But there are 2 new larger GF brewing systems coming very soon. I will have content out for release
Another awesome video man! keep up the good work. Your channel have so mutch good informative videos.
Cheers!
Thank you! Much appreciated :)
Good review! I've been using a Grainfather with the old controller for a few years, never bothered with the upgrade to the new controller, as running it fully manual isn't exactly hard work. In this respect I don't see the Robobrew controller as much of an issue in use. What does appeal is the price, compared to the Grainfather I could buy 2 Robobrew units and easily do a parallel double brew day with an IPA in one and a Scotch Ale in the other, for example. Or double up on one recipe I have that has an 80% beer tax on it (the one my mates love and keep coming around to drink).
Fair play. If you dont need it then not point paying for it. For sure the Robobrew is more value on this basis but I would also grab a cfc :)
Hi David. Thanks for another great video - I’ll be looking forward to your future brews using these systems. I live in Australia and bought a GF connect about a year ago for $1150AUD. At the time there was a lot of quality control issues with the RB - and legal issues over here between companies making and marketing them. That seems to have worked out now and the RB has been through a lot of R&D since then and appears to be a much better product now. Two issues I still have with the RB is that you have to supply hoses and fittings for the chiller, and, the RB chiller is still made of stainless steel - I understood copper is a better heat exchange material than stainless steel. Maybe you can show how to connect the RB chiller pipes, and, do a comparison between chilling times! :-) Thanks again. Cheers.
Thanks Jeff. Yes things have certainly evolved in this time. The problem with copper is many are alarmed by the potential health issues. This has caused a shift in the market with SS being introduced by many suppliers. It is not as good but it pleases many. Yes I agree that the RB should at least come with chiller fittings.
David Heath Thanks David for your response. Fair enough people are concerned about potential health issues with copper - I understand. I’m sure if I had a RB I could rig up some hoses, but agree, they really should have some type of fitting attached. Keep on brewing and keep those videos coming - I really get excited each time I see a new David Heath video. Cheers. Jeff
They actually have a CFC that goes straight on, strange really!
Great review. The most objective I have seen so far. No wasted time and straight to the point. Excellent. Muy bueno. By the way, could you make a video showing how to mash or brew with the Robobrew? We will appreciate it very much. Thank you
Hi, thank you. The Robobrew is now sold as the Brewzilla. I have many videos on my channel that show its use. Here is a quick start guide:- ua-cam.com/video/HxLJau-hBTs/v-deo.html
I've lost my Grainfather grain basket handle, do you know if the Brewzilla handle will work on the Grainfather basket? It's substantially cheaper for a "simple bar" of metal!
Edit : It does indeed fit and works! need a very small "tweak" to get into the basket, but once in there it feel solid and it has a nice hookable shape compared to the original handle.
I no longer have a G30, so I cannot say sadly.
I decided that it was worth the price to try the brewzilla one. I'll update my comment when it get here for the future viewers :)
Great, much appreciated :)
G’day David ! I really enjoy your videos and this is a good balanced and honest review.
I have recently bought the Robobrew gen 3 and have had 2 reasonably trouble free brews on it so far. I also noticed that you recently joined the Robobrew Brewzilla facebook page, welcome to the darkside :)
Hey :) Great to hear :) Well you know brewing is brewing its all the right side as I see it. I have uses for both, so that works well for me :)
Well done David. Thought I was dead set on the Grainfather , but you have given us reasons to give the Robobrew another look. Simple things like the lid and unit handles, the notched tube handle and the cam lock... makes you wonder why they are missing from something as high end as the Grainfather is. When adding a cam lock to the Grainfather- do you then lose the safety valve feature?
I am giving it all another thought, but I must say it’s the higher position of that controller and its incredible features that still have me leaning towards the Grainfather. The ready to go counter flow chiller is another big plus. Thanks again David. Happy Brewing.
Thanks Richie. The choice between these is full of pros and cons! I guess you could do a camlock conversion and keep the safety feature but you would be doing it differently to others. You can close off the valve instead during the boil to make sure there are no accidents though. Yes the controller and CFC are really a large parts of the process and should not be put aside if the cost is a non issue for you.
Great comparison of features. I've been looking at the Brew Monk and also the Robobrew so this was really interesting to see the Robobrew compared to one of the 'Big Guns'. One thing I've wondered is if you could just use a BIAB bag in the Robobrew so have the bag open at the top and the wort recirculating through the top? It does seem a bit strange (at least to me) that the grain baskets with these all in ones only have mesh bottoms as opposed to having mesh sides and bottoms which you do see on some of the high end US systems like the Clawhammer electric kettles. There is probably a scientific/use reason for that though, maybe the re-circulation pump would just clog all of the time. Thanks for the video.
Thanks James. Actually I wondered exactly this when I first started using all in one systems. I did some testing and got very similar results back from using a bag and a grainbasket. The Robobrew (now really the Brewzilla) also has a sister product called the Digiboil, that is a uncirculated BIAB brewer. Ive used that a fair bit and it also works well for what it is. I used it in this video:- ua-cam.com/video/jWx_Bh2jBlQ/v-deo.html
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Glad I wasn't the only person curious about this and interesting that you got pretty much the same results from the experiment. Good to know also that that method 'does work' should people have a fault or defect with the brew basket. Thanks for the reply David, much appreciated.
No problem, glad you found it useful James :)
Great video! I am still on the fence as to which to system to buy but this helped a bit. I do like the controller and counterflow chiller on the grainfather though i am not certain it is worth the extra $. Having done 6 brews or so using the manual stovetop method which was a pain and not very accurate i think i could go with either of these for my first all in one electric system
Since this video was made Brewzillas have been upgraded further. Better controller and improved heating elements that eliminates bottom burning.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thanks i ended up getting the robobrew 3.1.1 after a demo at my local brew store. For the price of the grainfather i was able to get the robobrew, brewtech brew bucket brewmaster edition and a grainfather sparge water heater.
Great, yes it certainly offers very good value
David, Great video. I have on occasion felt you were a bit biased toward the Grainfather line of products, and I am happy to feel wrong about my assumptions now. There are a few items that may be of interest to you about the Robobrew versions of old. (For reference I own 2 robos and a GF, although I don't have the BT controller version) The pipework used to have the same system as the grainfather, as well as the malt screens having silicon. Even the 3.0 robobrew I received right before the 3.1 came out (grrrr) had silicon for the top screen, but not the bottom. Even older models had silicon everywhere. The camlock addition was new to the 3.0 line, 2.0 and older were identical to the Grainfather in that regard. While the pump is indeed fully manual, the elements can be left fully "on" and the system will control them as it needs to, I think the switches are just there as a safety measure for the most part (I could be wrong about the reasons I dunno...) No argument at all regarding the position of the Robo controller... they really should consider a more accessible controller for us floor brewers. I use my Robo on a milk crate and that's still a bit too low to save my back. The extra screen at the bottom of the malt pipe is new to the 3.0 line, and some users have stated it's more trouble than it's worth. Personally I couldn't say, I haven't used it. Last thing, you mentioned wanting a false bottom, consider using the False bottom from your Robo in the GF, it'll fit. You could also use the Robo's malt pipe since I believe the only reason it's smaller is to accommodate the false bottom. If you prefer the GF pipework and screen I suspect you could probably interchange those as well.. i haven't tried but it all looks to fit together nicely enough.. ok that's all I have..
Again, fantastic vid!
🍻🍻😎 Much appreciated 🍻🍻😎
An excellent video and a great help to me. Thanks for posting.
Thank you Robert, glad you found it useful :)
Great video, very informative! Almost makes me want to get back into home-brewing :)
Thank you :) Go for it :)
Hi David, what is according to your experience the smallest batch size possible in the Brewzilla 3.1 (with good efficiency)? Thanks!
Sorry for the delay in reply. 10L works well in my experience 🍻🍻🍻
@@DavidHeathHomebrew thanks lot!
@thijsberg 🍻🍻🍻
Brand new to all this and was getting lost, amazing that you picked out the pros and cons as well as educating me on the process, excellent job! Think I’m gonna go for the brewzilla
Great that you found it useful Sam :)
I think you would have difficulty trying to fit the bluetooth connect to the robobrew, the reason being is the robobrew has dual heating elements, hence the double switch, the controller uses either heating element depending on the temp selected, if under a certain temp it uses the smaller element and both for boiling, whereas the grainfather has a dedicated low/full power element which is controlled by the pid. hope this makes sense.
I've heard that people have managed to get round this not just with Brewzilla but other systems also. I've not seen the need for it though.
Thanks, David. This certainly helps my imminent purchasing decision.
Great to hear Scot, I just released a larger system comparison video also, if that is of interest :)
Excellent video. Thank you for going to the trouble of making it.
Thank you. I am glad that you found it to be useful.
Thanks David for this video, about mash thickness, brewfather formula is grain kilos x 2,7 +3,5 for brewzilla I see you use grain kilos x 3 + 6,75, what is the reason for this difference?
Could it be that you are looking at a profile for the 65L Brewzilla not the 35L?
What do you think is the maximum amount of grain one could add to the Robobrew? Is it beyond the 8 kg/18 lb max they list?
Hi Peter, you can add 9kg but this is not advisable as the efficiency will go down. I would suggest 7.5kg is about right as a maximum. Best to do a reiterated mash for strong beers in any brewing system. Check this out:- ua-cam.com/video/C-7NiGZgKyQ/v-deo.html
This comparison was quite nice. I was wondering if you knew about future generations coming out on either for the grainfather or robobrew 3.1.1? I know the g70 came out and the 65l brewzilla were released, but I'm looking into the smaller version between the two and do not want to purchase them if a new version is going to be released soon.
Thanks Blair, no news on either at this point. I have a larger system comparison guide coming very soon.
so does the grain farther switch the pump on and off auto? is that a big advantage over the robobrew
Yes it can if you use the app. Many including myself are not using the app though due to all the issues. I would not say it's much of an advantage really.
Thanks for this, do you know if the robobrew false bottom fits the GF? Not a massive fan of the small filter on the GF when using hop pellets as I find it clogs up the filter even after wirlpooling.
I intend to trail a mix of components from both soon :)
Great video. I was wondering if the small batch pipework from the Grainfather fits on the Robobrew? Also, I find the false bottom doesn’t fit well and there’s a gap around it that let crap go through. Is there a way to improve that? Maybe by installing a silicone gasket from the grain basket?
Thank you. I will be trying various parts from each and seeing what works and what doesnt. No sooner did I film this video and a friend borrowed the Robobrew for the weekend!
David Heath Hey David, just saw your new video about the false bottom, do you have a gap around it that let stuff go through? Also, did you have a chance to test the small batch pipework on the robobrew basket?
Thanks for a very good video. I have today the Bulldog brewer 30 L (same as Cobra) - how would you rate the quality of Robo Brew and Grainfather vs that one - I'm considering to buy a new system.
Thanks Bjorn. I would put it below both of them in terms of quality and reliability. Though right now (and for some time) the GF software is very buggy still. I have a more recent guide series here:- ua-cam.com/play/PLeY07JqsrXM8qdQcqQnMGB2T5h9PLpt_Z.html
Were are this two made?country of origin
Grainfather is a New Zealand company and Kegland is Australian. The brewing systems from both are made in China.
Really good honest comparison. Seems the GF has been beaten at its own game by something cheaper. Surely they should put the price down of this old system now?
Thank you Alan :)
Excellent. Question. Are these systems good for beginners ?
Yes, both are very suitable for first time brewers.
Great video, really helpful. I also do small batches.. can you explain why the BrewZilla couldn't handle them? You mentioned small pipework, but I was struggling to work out what that meant in practise. (What is the smallest batch size either could handle?
Thank you. You can do 15L batches in both by standard and in some cases lower. Gf have a “small batch pipework” product that allows 10L. Brewzilla doesnt have this but some users have bought the standard pipework and cut it in half to mimic this. Cheaper also :)
I like that controlebox unit on the GF is on top. And not on the bottom like the Robobrew clones.
. I hope that Grainfather will come out this year with there 50 Liter EU version that has double stronger pumps,camlock,wifi,more handles, and thicker isolated stainless steel. And most of all a affordable € price.
Thanks for the comparison between the 2's.
Do you have price Infos for the 50l GF yet? Wifi sounds great!
@@mzmagister No more info yet. Grainfather doesn't want to provide any more detailes yet. I'm really hoping that it will be this summer or this year for the 230 EU version.
. This would not be any good news for Speidels bm50 sales than hi hi lol. I think that the choice for me would be between the brewzilla or the new grainfather 50 liter. The prices between the 2 is very important to me. I dont want to sell any of my kidneys for just a brew kettle. That why i lost interest in all of Speidels overpriced products.
Without my liver and kidneys i cannot drink. I need them. So the prices must be ride for the gf50.
.
Thank you from Norway.
Many thanks Erik. I live close to Drammen :)
Thanks for this very informative video. I'm in the process doing some research on buying a brewing system and this was a big help.
Great to hear Mike. If you have any questions then I am happy to help further.
Thanks for another informative video. I have a couple of questions regarding the general brew time for these systems. I currently brew 12L BIAB (14.5l pre boil)on a gas stove and takes around 3.5 - 4 hours. With these systems if the mash water had been set on the delayed timer, from start of mash to end of clean up what would be the average brew day for a 19L batch ? Do you feel much time would be saved by doing full volume/no sparge for a 12L - 15L brew using extra grain to adjust for lower efficiency? Or do you feel the systems wouldn't work well for this method? Thanks
Hi Dave, I don’t think you will save much time compared. The key advantage of all in one systems is greater efficiency, ease of temp control, convenience and flexibility of volume.
You can also brew anywhere with a water supply and power.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew hi, thanks for your response. It's definitely the ease of taking the brewing to the man cave that will please the Mrs..My main concern is the possible increase on the time. I have read various forums suggesting grain father brew days between 4-7 hours.
On a UK volt system do you think 4 hours would be achievable from start of mash to clean up with a 19l batch? Thanks
Different people take different time. I can easily do a 4 hour turn around with a 60 min boil. I clean up as I go.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew nice. Thank you. Have a good day
Sir how can I contact you? I have questions on how to reactivate and grow yeast.
You can contact me here. You may find these videos helpful:- ua-cam.com/video/fzcnyyvWAYA/v-deo.html and ua-cam.com/video/LCocmYRTsiw/v-deo.html and ua-cam.com/video/cSebtK23nFw/v-deo.html and ua-cam.com/video/-iGgxs6QjPY/v-deo.html
I had to experiment with a dry yeast(processed), the result wasn’t pleasant but I got a good reaction which showed that the yeast was still alive.
I have a few questions if you don’t mind Sir
Seeing that bakers yeast and yeast for beer/wine are of different purposes are the steps towards making this yeast’s the same? Do they have different foods that ought to be fed to the yeast while they grow. I used cassava flour and sugar, because I wanted something that is high in carbohydrate.
Yes, yeast is yeast but yeast selection is vital for the best result. Luckily these days yeast of all varieties are available to all.
Beer yeast is best grown using malt, often dried malt extract.
Very helpful and considered review, thank you
Many thanks Michael :)
Great objective comparison. I'd love to know what the difference is in mash temps are within the grain bed. At a guess the dimensions could have an effect on this but not sure. Keep up the good work David.
The important thing here is that you activate enzymes. That will happen with both the GF and RB.
I found the base of the grainfather breaks in time if you tilt it with liquid in it
You will find that is covered by warranty.
why are you tilting it?
SIIIOXIDE when cleaning and lifting to pour out last amount of liquid
Hi David,
Thanks for the video...appreciate the review..one of the things I do dislike about the GF is the screw on fittings over the camlocks from robo. Any chance you know a good place to buy the parts to convert the GF? I’m a US guy and it seems like over here fittings are NPT whereas I understand the GF fittings are BSP fittings so I’m having trouble here finding this conversion to do it properly. Thanks in advance.
Hi, Ive not found anywhere that sells all parts as a kit sadly. I do intend to do a video guide showing the parts and include a how to.
David Heath can’t wait for this video 👍🏻. Definitely something I think should have been Done on the GF from the start.
If money wasnt an issue and you could only buy one - which one would you go with?
Good question! I guess I would buy the GF but modify it with improvements in line with Robobrew. Pretty expensive route though. I am looking at how you could use the GF controller with other brewing systems. If that works then perhaps my answer will change.
David, Seeing the robobrew has no silicone gaskets for grain basket, I'm wondering if the grainfather really needs them either? I might try a batch without them and see. Your thoughts? Cheers John V
Need, no, not for all. It is for protection and fit. Fit varies. Give it a try :)
Is there any issues with programming the Robobrew when the unit is placed on the floor which I believe most users do so they can easily remove mash basket
Just the comfort side really but its not like it takes long.
So the Robobrew is a decent competitor to the Grainfather. I already have the Grainfather but if I was in the market today I might have gone for the Robo instead considering the huge price difference. Though it does seem inconvenient to have the controller down by the floor, without any connectivity. I mostly use my phone for controlling the GF when I brew but having the interface on the controller easily accessible is nice.
Hi, Its pros and cons really. Only people can decide what matters and what suits them the best. I would not want to be without my GF but equally I am happy with the RB as an extra brewing system for the price involved.
@@normalguy7898 I think they are both good value for money but if you have to choose just one then that depends on what you are looking for.
I like that controlebox unit on the GF is on top. And not on the bottom like the Robobrew clones.
. I hope that Grainfather will come out this year with there 50 Liter EU version that has double stronger pumps,camlock,wifi,more handles, and thicker isolated stainless steel. And most of all a affordable € price.
Thanks for the comparison between the 2's.
@@africantwin173 I have my fingers crossed on this also :) Glad you enjoyed the video , thank you :)
Normal Guy i seriously don’t. i bought a sparge water heater, kegerator, 2 fermonsters and two kegs for money saved.bluetooth controls are a non issue for me.
Fantastic review!! Thank you.
Many thanks, glad you enjoyed it Jonathan:)
Have a robo gen 2. Works great, efficiency around 79-80 . Don't mind pushing buttons on the machine rather than off Bluetooth .The way I see it, you pay for the extra Bluetooth technology with recipes etc. But hey its not hard to research and be a little more hands on.
Great to hear Matt and thanks for the feeback. Yes, everyone needs to decide what matters to them.
David,
Have you got any experience (direct or otherwise) of the latest Bulldog system, the 'Bulldog Master Brewer'?
I'm currently looking to invest in an all-in-one system and finding it very difficult to choose between the robobrew, grainfather and Bulldog Master Brewer. My main issue is the lack of information available on the Bulldog system.
Hi, Yes I have. Whilst this is a step up from their past offerings it is also a step up in price. For less money you can buy a Robobrew brewzilla or for a bit more a Gf. I think both of these offer a better experience and value for money. I have a more detailed buyers guide coming in 2-3 weeks.
Thanks for the feedback David, it's very much appreciated. I'd be curious to know what you consider to be the main downsides of the Master Brewer (apart from the obvious, the controller).
I'm particularly attracted to the ease of sparging when bought with the matching water heater (which you can just plug and pump), available for £580. Which would only put it £100 more than an equivalent robobrew set-up (UK prices) and £200 less than an equivalent GF set up.
I await you next video with bated breath :)
Thanks again.
The main downsides I would say are the cost vs what else is out there and the poor reputation of the company behind it.
This video really confirmed my choice of brewing system. I have the grainfather, with that I found that the heat delay timer to very useful. Thanks for you insight it helped me immensely. Pierre
Great to hear Pierre, many thanks for your feedback
Hi David - thanks for another excellent video. Do you find the lack of PID in the Brewzilla controller causes any issues with overshooting mash temperatures or other problems with temperature control? Would it be worth the trouble to add a PID-enabled controller to the Brewzilla? Grateful for your thoughts as always!
Thanks Henry, much appreciated :) I've not had any over shooting at all with the 35L or 65L Brewzilla units. So it doesn't seem worth changing to me.
Thanks David - I really appreciate your reply, very kind of you to get back to me so quickly!
Thanks David, if I'd have known about the RoboBrew, I think I'd have purchased it instead of the Grainfather. The things that I don't like about the Grainfather are;
the silicone seals on the grain basket, it takes everal attempts to get them right unless the basket shell is heated up, a real pain in the ass;
the glass lid is awkward to remove when it's hot;
I've had the pump and the pump filter clog up when using hop pellets, I now use the Mangrove Jacks hop spider, for hops or pellets, because I don't have any faith in the Grainfather filtration system;
I don't like the grainfather recipe web-site, I have tried to enter some recipes from books, and it's not at all easy, so I don't find the automatic bluetooth recipes are much use to me, I brew on the fly from Camra's Brewing British Ales Book;
However the counterflow wort chiller is just brilliant.
I hope that GF will introduce a filtration system similar to the Robobrew version, most other things are probably issues that can be modified by myself.
Thanks for your feedback Eve. With the silicone seal you can leave it off or what I do is just make sure the inner walls are wet before I try adding it. A spray bottle works. Yes the glass lid...wear gloves! Not a bad idea for brewing in general anyway. You can blow the filter out pretty fast by attaching a bicycle pump to the cfc wort out end. Afew pumps and problem solved usually. GF are revamping the recipe creator website, worth trying again soon I should think.
SImply use a bit of starsan spray on the silicone ring and it slides in fine.
It sure does :)
Thanks for theadvice Kerry, but is starsan any more lubricating than water? I have tried water and it doesn't work on my GF, as I have already said the only way to be sure with mine is to leave the shell in the heating water before adding grain.@@kerryhales8736
Thanks for theadvice David, but is starsan any more lubricating than water? I have tried water and it doesn't work on my GF, as I have already said the only way to be sure with mine is to leave the shell in the heating water before adding grain.
i'm wondering if the grainfather controller can be retrofitted onto the robobrew?
I believe so, it is something that I am looking into currently :)
@@DavidHeathHomebrew good luck! they look very similiar in design so i cant see them not using very close parts to boot.
@@gangaskan2255 The main thing is to make sure it is safe really before I share it.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew of course! saftey is always number one.
I think it should be easy if you want to do that. The heating element is just powered by a mechanical relay I guess, the pump is also a relay, the termistor has to be adjusted to have the same resistance profile as the grainfather controller would expect otherwise the temperatures would be off.
Really excellent review David. I have the Grainfather and love it but if I ever get another system I think I would go for the Robobrew because of the price
🍻🍻🍻Much appreciated 🍻🍻🍻
So you can't use these for high abv beers?
Sure you can. See this video:- ua-cam.com/video/C-7NiGZgKyQ/v-deo.html This method works for any system.
Great video, very informative, Thank you!
Many thanks Rob, much appreciated :)
Dear David, thank's a lot for Your wonderful videos and well thought out informations! I decided to go for a brewzilla 35l V3.1 and just ordered one. Since You have both systems: Did You ever try if the the micro pipework of the Grainfather fits the brewzilla as well? I would love to be able to do small batches and gain a little more flexibility.
Thanks Frank. Sadly not. There is a cheaper work around though. Buy an extra normal pipework from Kegland. Cut this down by about 40-50%. You now have small batch pipework. I am yet to try this.
@@DavidHeathHomebrew Thanks a lot for your quick response. I might try that work around...
Hi! if heating elements were to break, how could they be replaced?
Thats going to be a problem as heating elements are welded on all systems that I have seen. Its unusual for them to fail without being abused or used in a wrong way.
Very informative, thanks
Great, thank you :)