Moloch - The Deadly Force Driving Humanity To The Brink?

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  • Опубліковано 11 вер 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 123

  • @LivBoeree
    @LivBoeree  7 місяців тому +72

    Hey everyone! This film was made by the excellent filmmaker @DaganOnAI - Dagan approached me to see if I'd post it directly to my channel, and given how beautifully he has compiled the various arguments, I couldn't refuse! So while I can't take any credit for this film, it is my pleasure to share it with you all, because its message is so incredibly important. Please give him a follow!
    Much love,
    Liv

    • @Paul_Marek
      @Paul_Marek 7 місяців тому +4

      This outline of the problem was great. Awesome work. I'd love to see (and participate with) ideas and discussions and action around solutions soon too. Are there any communities with this focus?

    • @waynekington4426
      @waynekington4426 7 місяців тому

      great summary. maybe he can do tiktok one minute grabs, to try to get more people coming to your channel to hear this important message. i see the irony of my suggestion.

    • @markreynolds6220
      @markreynolds6220 7 місяців тому

      hi live Rudolf Steiner wrote extensively about moloch but refereed to him as ahriman [Zoroastrian demon] he speaks extensiveness about these types of dynamics and meaning behind y thy exist on the material plain. ua-cam.com/video/eSxVKxIMrAE/v-deo.html

    • @maddson2088
      @maddson2088 5 місяців тому

      Amazing

  • @DaganOnAI
    @DaganOnAI 7 місяців тому +61

    Thanks, Liv! I'm really honored that you liked the movie and agreed to share it on your page! I am just one of many people who learned about the concept of Moloch thanks to your relentless efforts to popularize it, and I hope this movie, which is in large part built on your interviews and lectures, can contribute something, however small as it may be, to these efforts.

    • @nunyabiznizz4778
      @nunyabiznizz4778 7 місяців тому +2

      Great video c:

    • @TennesseeJed
      @TennesseeJed 7 місяців тому +2

      Great video! Moloch lives!

    • @DaganOnAI
      @DaganOnAI 7 місяців тому

      @@nunyabiznizz4778 Thanks!

    • @DaganOnAI
      @DaganOnAI 7 місяців тому +1

      @@TennesseeJed Thank you so much!

    • @TennesseeJed
      @TennesseeJed 7 місяців тому +1

      @@DaganOnAI Thank you for such important observations!

  • @debatology
    @debatology 7 місяців тому +11

    This has to be one of the most important videos humanity needs to watch now. Thank you for continuing this important mission

  • @BRUXXUS
    @BRUXXUS 7 місяців тому +10

    Thank you and Dagan for this. I love having videos like this to share because Moloch really is a concept that can instantly put things into perspective for most people.

    • @DaganOnAI
      @DaganOnAI 7 місяців тому +1

      Thank you🙏

  • @JDUK71
    @JDUK71 7 місяців тому +13

    Moloch is everywhere and has been around a very long time, destroying its ability to remain unseen is everybody's best first move.

    • @tuckerbugeater
      @tuckerbugeater 7 місяців тому +1

      MolocStein is ahead of the game for some reason

  • @raresmircea
    @raresmircea 7 місяців тому +4

    Veritasium’s video about the prisoner’s dilemma is very much related to this and a must watch for anyone who isn’t familiar with how the various strategies tend to play out

  • @drysponge-hv8im
    @drysponge-hv8im 7 місяців тому +7

    For scalable coordination, incentives are needed (not just values, culture, volunteering).
    Incentive structures fostering healthy win-win competition are the way to go I think.
    Such an incentive structure cannot be owned/gamed and captured by anyone, so it has to be independent of a specific agent/location.
    Only a self-sustaining distributed network could achieve that.
    It should not depend on trust, so it has to be provably secure, and thus involve cryptography.
    It can be achieved by a single blockchain that rewards everyone providing value to the network from consensus protocol instead of external sources.
    None of the existing blockchains do that though.

    • @tuckerbugeater
      @tuckerbugeater 7 місяців тому

      Do whatever they tell you to cuz you seem like a good puppet

    • @drysponge-hv8im
      @drysponge-hv8im 7 місяців тому +1

      @@tuckerbugeater Care to elaborate?

  • @packardsonic
    @packardsonic 7 місяців тому +4

    The key is simple! All we have to do is raise awareness about our shared goal. We need to clarify a framework of what to consider good. That framework we all can understand is the satisfying of Max-Neefs fundamental human needs. We want want people to be mentally, physically and emotionally healthy and that clearly requires having all their needs satisfied. We are not plants, we are not bears, we are psychological beings and most of our needs are psychological. This doesn't make them any less necessary than physical needs. If anyone doesn't have any of their needs for participation, understanding, idleness, freedom, creativity, affection, identity, protection and subsistence OR THEY WILL DEVELOP PATHOLOGIES. Pathological people are either a burden or a danger.to everyone else. Sacrificing the future for the present is necessary when we have to to satisfy our needs because we must compete against others for it.

    • @robinschaufler444
      @robinschaufler444 Місяць тому

      "all we have to do is raise awareness" - 1) how do you propose to do this within the United States, where not only is Moloch in control of the media, but also the media is fractured and the population has become cynical? 2) how do you propose to do this within Russia and China, where all media is tightly controlled by the state?

  • @micahcabrera4637
    @micahcabrera4637 7 місяців тому +4

    Excellent summary! Passing this on to others now.

  • @TheMorninGlory23
    @TheMorninGlory23 7 місяців тому +4

    Do you think there can be personal molochs? I just notice my tendency to chase my personal pleasures to the detriment of my health feels very molochy, like for example staying up late drinking caffeine to play video games longer instead of stopping caffeine intake and going to bed at good hours and resuming my play in the morning instead. There's no race with others but there's still that FOMO energy of feeling like I just want more more more

    • @nikitashutkov1804
      @nikitashutkov1804 6 місяців тому +1

      I really like and relate to your idea! Curious to think about it :)

    • @wirezts
      @wirezts 4 місяці тому +1

      This is called self sabotage

  • @xSwitchB1ade
    @xSwitchB1ade 5 місяців тому

    Wow. Very succinctly put for such a deep topic.
    It's eerie seeing so many clips from podcasts I have consumed in their entirety, combined in such a way to enhance the message of the speakers into something even more powerful than the sum of the pieces.
    I must admit to extreme disillusion and despair though. Max Tegmark is right, Moloch is the greatest foe humanity has ever fought. The war is unwinnable, in a thousand battles even a single significant loss leads to extinction, and our historic success rate as a species leaves much to be desired.
    I hope that whatever other forms of intelligent life that exist once we cease to will not repeat our mistakes, and that history will not look upon humanity too harshly. We tried despite our flaws, and perhaps in the fight contributed something of value.

  • @MikeDS49
    @MikeDS49 7 місяців тому +6

    This, by far, is the scariest thing I've ever watched in my life. There are easily 6 other as or deadlier examples of Moloch from our financial, agriculture, medical, ocean harvesting, water and energy sectors.

    • @tuckerbugeater
      @tuckerbugeater 7 місяців тому

      Don't worry we all die sooner or later

    • @azzgunther
      @azzgunther 7 місяців тому

      I recently learned that Lyme Disease and many of the other tick-borne pathogens are very likely leaks of bioengineered or bioenhanced weapons research. There's a recent video about Plum Island that gets into it. A great example of Moloch's work.

    • @MikeDS49
      @MikeDS49 7 місяців тому

      @@tuckerbugeater Yeah, but not in big bunches at a young age.

    • @andrasbiro3007
      @andrasbiro3007 7 місяців тому

      @@tuckerbugeater
      I prefer later. Way way later, and when I choose. Soon we'll likely be biologically immortal and forever young, so it's all that more important to not kill ourselves.

    • @monicab8176
      @monicab8176 4 місяці тому

      @@tuckerbugeaterthis is the cop out attitude of someone who desperately wants to stay comfortable. This is the worst way to think. Do better 😔

  • @Jolly-Green-Steve
    @Jolly-Green-Steve 7 місяців тому +1

    3:30 The first line of this poem is used in Machinehead by Bush during the bridge.

  • @Oscarrrrrrrrrrr
    @Oscarrrrrrrrrrr 7 місяців тому

    This is a great summary. Highly recommended to check out all the sources brought up here if you wanna learn more about the topic!

  • @mickscott2284
    @mickscott2284 7 місяців тому +1

    Nothing to add, feeding the algo

  • @TennesseeJed
    @TennesseeJed 7 місяців тому +1

    Daniel! Thank Liv! Looks like we have all sacrificed our children to Moloch.

  • @nikitashutkov1804
    @nikitashutkov1804 6 місяців тому

    Thank you for your existence! :)

  • @conversatio-luisdiaz
    @conversatio-luisdiaz 7 місяців тому

    We can manage Moloch by collaborating,
    we can control it with transparency,
    -keep an eye on it.
    It diminishes when we talk and trust each other.
    When we have conversations with an intention to understand each other Moloch weakens.
    Conversations that share not only our thoughts, nor our feelings but most importantly our human needs, when we speak and take action to satisfy our human needs we will have Moloch in the palm of our hands.
    The process of Nonviolent Communication by Marshall Rosenberg, taught me this.
    Peace my friends.

  • @ianreclusado
    @ianreclusado 7 місяців тому

    For a potential solution to Moloch, we could look to the myth of the Handless Maiden, as told by Robert Johnson and Marion Woodman. It’s about a Miller who basically sacrifices his daughter to a devil in exchange for wealth and success. And the process that that daughter has to go through to redeem herself.
    You can see the daughter as a symbol of the emotional interconnective side. When you truly feel connected to other people, you can’t put things off into the commons as easily as you can, if you feel separated.

    • @ianreclusado
      @ianreclusado 7 місяців тому

      And looking over the end of the Ginsburg poem, it’s no surprise that it ends at the river. The river is where the handless maiden finally gets her hands back through the act of rescuing her drowning child.

  • @aeiouaeiou100
    @aeiouaeiou100 7 місяців тому +2

    LIv, you would really enjoy the work of Jonathan Pageau. He also uses this "Moloch logic" you describe in your videos to describe how spiritual concepts impact the real world. Also the Lord of Spirits podcasts.

  • @timb350
    @timb350 3 місяці тому

    David Thoreau once said: "The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation." THAT...right there...is the reason for EVERY single problem that exists on the planet right now (including but not limited to media addiction, AI, and the arms race). There are some who are NOT desparate. Why? What is the difference between them...and those who are? This is NOT fiction. This is NOT a rhetorical question. Every major philosopher, prophet, theologian, or thinker has recognized this exact same phenomena. There are those who can deal with the massive insanity, confusion, and complexity of life (including, but not at all limited to...everything that 'Moloch' can throw at them)...and there is the 'mass-of-men' who cannot (they are the ones who elected Donald Trump). When we can successfully understand the difference between these two groups of people... Moloch (and all it's spawn) will have been defeated. Simple...as...that!

  • @bobbolieu9013
    @bobbolieu9013 7 місяців тому

    This whole thing, and its pieces are more than just a little bit interesting

  • @MuscleBandit
    @MuscleBandit 7 місяців тому

    I'm a simple motorbike, I see Liv content and I click it ❤ 🏍

  • @Pikkiwoki
    @Pikkiwoki 3 місяці тому

    Ever feel like maybe it's more real than we think? Like what if it is some powerful intelligence that is literally feeding on human lives/souls?

  • @redorchidee137
    @redorchidee137 3 місяці тому

    i don't like musk one bit and am skeptical of rogan and peterson as well, but i do believe the message being communicated is valid and important. still, if musk says he was instrumental in the founding or creation of something, it's best to take it with a microscopic grain of sand. despite everything he says, all he cares about is profit, and even though he might understand this concept, he seems to have no issue abusing that to come out on top anyway. no matter, all the lies and deception he's been sowing over the years are growing wildly, and soon no one will be able to ignore them anymore and his little garden of weeds will be burned to nothing. or he will lose control of the bike, to go with the video analogy.

  • @gunneone
    @gunneone 7 місяців тому

    Finally a new episode ❤

  • @ComradeCooper
    @ComradeCooper 7 місяців тому +1

    I still feel as if giving any credit to the idea of a Moloch is just a convenient way to have an excuse for why people often do dumb and selfish things or pointless and counterproductive things in general.

    • @Diabloto96
      @Diabloto96 7 місяців тому +2

      or you know, helping to organize around a common enemy instead of always blaming individuals, when the various systems we live in incentivize destroying the commons. This is a systemic problem, and it requires large scale solutions, the Moloch idea helps us think in systemic ways.

    • @EinSophistry
      @EinSophistry 7 місяців тому +2

      I'm usually staunchly against personification of impersonal forces and processes, but I think the Moloch frame is useful here, if for no other reason than it may help gamify vigilance about these kinds of perverse competitive incentives. "Don't give into the pressure or Moloch will win," etc. As Eric Hoffer observed: "Mass movements can rise and spread without belief in a god, but never without a belief in a devil."

    • @tuckerbugeater
      @tuckerbugeater 7 місяців тому

      Simple frames for Simple Minds

  • @user-te4of2fq5d
    @user-te4of2fq5d 6 місяців тому

    Thank you 🙏

  • @MikhailGoncharov
    @MikhailGoncharov 7 місяців тому

    Great message! it's a hard problem and we should work on that. where do we start? education?

    • @tuckerbugeater
      @tuckerbugeater 7 місяців тому

      It was too late 6,000 years ago bub

  • @n0madtv
    @n0madtv 7 місяців тому

    The problem is nobody will believe it until they see it, then it's too late...

  • @NosnalemNaej
    @NosnalemNaej 7 місяців тому +1

    There is an astrophysicist in France called Aurélien Barreau who wrote about a very similar concept of in his last book, L'hypothèse K. His environmentalist point of view doesn't to fit in the American Overton window, so it is very unlikely that English speakers will hear about him, but his ideas a very complementary to the Moloch concept. In the fewest words possible: What happens when humans engage in repeated negative-sum games? Life becomes increasingly artificialized, degraded or destroyed. His proposed solution lies in a form of marriage between science and poetry.

  • @VanitazazasXI
    @VanitazazasXI 7 місяців тому +1

    H A I L M O L O C H

  • @HakWilliams
    @HakWilliams 6 місяців тому

    I guess we just have to accept it.

  • @sparkybob1023
    @sparkybob1023 6 місяців тому

    What is - who is moloch

  • @n0madtv
    @n0madtv 7 місяців тому

    A lot of other biblical references and pre bronze-age mythology use the same concept. A 'god', with some story or whatever that people can understand, but it's really a "demon" in the context of the bible. It is a force, as described (and often overlooked) by the bible. Another good example is Babylon. "The Great Harlot" as referenced in the book of Revelation (and all through the bible) is a city/nation, as we know from history. But when you read the context it says Babylon was many different cities, aka, a spirit or demon that 'drove' those cities. Babylon is always the biggest most profitable nation for a given time.
    This is the fundamental concept/mythology of the bible as a whole. These 'demons' or 'evil' spirits are constantly 'attacking' and persuading humans in an effort to further whatever 'evil' has planned... This is called 'sin', and it comes in many forms. The worst of which are the ones that physically destroy your body, aka the 7 deadly ones. Things like Envy, Hate, Murder, Gluttony, Perversions... these are not 'sins' because somebody decided they were evil. They are 'sins' because humans noticed how they lead to negative consequences extremely consistently.

  • @drunkduck274
    @drunkduck274 7 місяців тому

    Thanks Liv, hope the algoritm likes this one..

  • @Alec_Collins78
    @Alec_Collins78 7 місяців тому +2

    Clocks are always closer than they've ever been to whatever event.

    • @NakushitaNamida
      @NakushitaNamida 7 місяців тому +2

      the armageddon clock is a measure of probability not of time. Don't be that "literal" guy

  • @sweeze3945
    @sweeze3945 7 місяців тому +2

    When i take a game theory class next semester, i will introduce the Professor to the term moloch

  • @DaveShap
    @DaveShap 7 місяців тому

    Just want to point out that it's largely us privileged white people who are coming up with cataclysmic narratives like moloch, the meaning crisis, and the meta crisis. My personal version is the nihilistic crisis.

    • @tuckerbugeater
      @tuckerbugeater 7 місяців тому

      You'll never be white bro or Jewish

  • @JohnAllen23
    @JohnAllen23 3 місяці тому

    We are Moloch.

  • @middle-agedmacdonald2965
    @middle-agedmacdonald2965 7 місяців тому

    Dave Shapiro just mentioned you in his latest video on e/acc. I think he said he wanted to collaborate with you, but I might be mistaken.

    • @LivBoeree
      @LivBoeree  7 місяців тому

      interesting! could you link it please?

    • @middle-agedmacdonald2965
      @middle-agedmacdonald2965 7 місяців тому

      Sure thing. It's just after the fifteen minute mark. To quote him, he disagrees with you on some stuff, but he'd love to talk to you. I believe he's already done a video on Molock. Nerdy a.i. channel that is very well thought out and analytical. 130k subs if it matters. He is pumping out a.i. content daily. The video should start right in the right spot. ua-cam.com/video/pCtdI1eCO4E/v-deo.htmlsi=Ri93zntFvR3BUvXp&t=904@@LivBoeree

    • @middle-agedmacdonald2965
      @middle-agedmacdonald2965 7 місяців тому

      Can't leave a link in comments. David Shapiro is the channel. He's an a.i. guy with tons of good content. He just did a thorough analysis of the Beff Jezos and Connor Leahey interview. It's at the 15 minute mark where he mentions wanting to talk with you. He pumps out multiple videos per day lately. @@LivBoeree

    • @dystopiaeatsmoney
      @dystopiaeatsmoney 7 місяців тому

      @@LivBoeree. What do think about the work of Peter Joseph? He has a new film that premieres in March.

    • @tuckerbugeater
      @tuckerbugeater 7 місяців тому

      I think you're just watching the movie of your own self destruction and it's hilarious

  • @bobcousins4810
    @bobcousins4810 7 місяців тому

    To understand the "Moloch", one only needs to read "The Selfish Gene", then it becomes clear. Competition is driven by evolution, and for as long as we have non-identical genes, there is always a drive to compete. There is no solution to this problem.
    So while evolution made us, it may also destroy us. Perhaps Moloch is simply the other face of Gaia?
    This observation may also help explain the Fermi Paradox. Advanced civilizations that arise through evolution must contain the seeds of their own destruction.

    • @ericfaahcs1080
      @ericfaahcs1080 7 місяців тому

      Biological evolution via gene mutation and natural selection doesnt cause this, because the process is evenly distributed, no animal will increase its capacity way faster than the rest and the environment, so no polar-bear will become so powerful via biological evolution to destroy the bioshpere. With humans biological evolution reached a point, where the complexification of our minds allowed us to increase our adaptive capacity via recursive abstraction (toolmaking, coordination in large groups), in an speed that is not in balance with the environment anymore because we use a way faster process than simple biological evolution. But this same complexification of mind also allows us to have metacognition (the ability to observe our impulses and not act on them), so we are not bound to do this by our nature and evolution therefore is also not bound to destroy itself. The same capacity that becomes able to destroy that which it depends upon is also the capacity which is able to reflect on that and decide to not do it.
      This is basically parroting of what I learned from Daniel Schmachtenberger, if you want to dive deeper into it go watch his series with Nate Hagen.

  • @bocckoka
    @bocckoka 7 місяців тому

    It was time to recreate the Zeitgeist movies :)

  • @kabukitheatre3796
    @kabukitheatre3796 7 місяців тому

    …Steiner coined the term.

  • @TheCynicalSkeptic
    @TheCynicalSkeptic 7 місяців тому

    Stop making the concept overly complicated. Simply, it’s the promotion of externality. Done.

  • @Nicxlive
    @Nicxlive Місяць тому

    So you support a one world government to solve the moloch issue(honest question)?
    Since you took moloch from the Bible I recommend taking God's advice to fight it also from there.

  • @becketmariner
    @becketmariner 7 місяців тому

    I hope that in 2024 the world gets worse... more bombs more disease, more natural disasters, engineering diasters, economic meltdown, closer to midnight... I'm curious to actually see it.

  • @Tzitzemine
    @Tzitzemine 6 місяців тому +1

    So, just a video about basic dynamics of game-theory with a fancy "mysterious" name attached to it to generate attention? Meh!

    • @LivBoeree
      @LivBoeree  6 місяців тому +5

      yes, it's called storytelling! Maybe one day you will discover it yourself.

    • @therealbs2000
      @therealbs2000 2 місяці тому

      ​@@LivBoereeooh spicy 😂😂😂

  • @Anamnesia
    @Anamnesia 7 місяців тому

    Really? We're currently closer to Atomic War, than we were with the Cuban Missile Crisis? Or are you just being a Drama Queen and/or Hyperbolic??? 👀🤔

  • @jadesea562
    @jadesea562 7 місяців тому

    Its pronounced "moh-lock"

  • @junkmunkeys
    @junkmunkeys 7 місяців тому

    This entire video is packed with fear-mongering and doomer sentiments, definitely not Win-Win material. Fearing Moloch as a demon troubles me; I consider Moloch to represent the sacrifice of morals and integrity for competitive gain. This video embodies Moloch with its goofy video and audio effects, and I'm really disappointed.

  • @nudestsquirrel
    @nudestsquirrel 7 місяців тому

    TikTok

  • @magdelyn
    @magdelyn 7 місяців тому

    HELP,AMERICA DEBT NEED MONEY BACK,ALL THAT MONEY ITS NOT FOR GINOCIDE

  • @alexandrustefanmiron7723
    @alexandrustefanmiron7723 7 місяців тому

    Idiocy!

  • @HakWilliams
    @HakWilliams 6 місяців тому

    Buh bye.

  • @floorsbychrisable
    @floorsbychrisable 7 місяців тому

    A society that rewards and glorifies greed will fail. Full stop.