Oops............at around 19:30 you mis-state the basic air conditioning cycle. The whole process can be done with ordinary air (that's how most systems work in airliners) but it is much more efficient and compact for an A/C system to use some sort of special gas which can change state from a liquid to a gas and back again at reasonable temperatures and pressures. "Freon" R-12 is the familiar stuff from days past, but these days cars usually use 134-A or the newer R1234YF refrigerant. The compressor discharges hot, high-pressure gas. This gas then goes to the condenser (not the evaporator as you say) where the hot gas is cooled and turned into a high pressure liquid. Since the hot gas not only gives off it's heat, it changes state to a liquid as well; therefore, the amount of heat rejected to the outside air via the condenser is even more dramatic. From there it goes to the expansion valve near the evaporator (inside a box under the dash) where the high pressure liquid is expanded and converted into a lower pressure gas. Any gas cools as it expands, but by also changing state from a liquid to a gas, the resulting heat absorption is more dramatic. As this cool gas travels through coils the box, a fan blows cool air into the car. The cool, low-pressure gas is returned to the compressor where it is again converted to a hot, high-pressure gas thus completing the A/C cycle.
@@DiscoFang Strictly speaking, the receiver/filter/dryer is not part of the air conditioning cycle. The system will operate without it; perhaps not for long, but it will function. The receiver/filter/dryer, as the name implies, has three functions. It provides a reservoir of refrigerant, it filters out any crud, and it has a desiccate to trap water because a tiny bit of water can freeze in the expansion valve and shut down the whole system. Often these three functions are handled by an all-in-one unit, but some systems might contain separate components. A typical receiver/filter/dryer also includes a glass sight gauge so you can see the refrigerant. And yes, as you say, it's important for a well tuned A/C system.
Hi, kind of appreciate your approach on this project ad would like to know from where did you buy these blue colour plastic clips(at around 22.16 mts)? Hope I'm not late to ask questions Jeff. Thanks
Hi Jeff - I have a 1985 911 with factory AC that barely cools. It has the same small side vents, but also has a center dash vent which works well for fresh air. In any case I'm very interested in seeing how well the electric retro-fit AC system works. Keep up the good work and excellent videos!
Has anyone else noticed UA-cam has royally fucked up UA-cam for non subscribers? I can't even watch this video without the UA-cam overlay on top now! Before I had to hit close, where it went away automatically, now it doesn't go away at all!?
This couldn't have come at a better time. My old man just got the same kit for he's g series and no one wanted to touch it in Sydney without charging an arm and a leg to install it. We just got the 175a alternator installed so this walkthrough will come in handy
Glad to see you are putting in an electric AC system in your 911 "Harry". I want put this type of AC system in two my VW Sciroccos, an 81.and 87. This kit for electric AC appears to well though out and easy to install. Looking to see part 2 of this install of AC on this Porsche. Merry Christmas 🎄 and Happy New Year 🎉 to you and Mrs Jeff.
Not a bad kit, although for the price I'd expect better mounts than some zip ties. Overall though it does go together quite easily. Some ducting for the condensers would probably help with air flow especially at speed to make things super chilly 😉
Nice work Jeff, but i recommend getting rid of the plastic tie straps and replace them with aluminium straps. Heat cycling will dry out the plastic tie straps and they will fracture.
Hey Jeff, plug those open hoses to avoid any contamination while building the system. Small particles can ruin the compressor. Also water from the air can enter the dryer and saturate the desiccant and the PAG oil as it is hydroscopic. I assume you are using 1234yf refrigerant otherwise you must have a RHL.
I can't help being captain obvious here. The fact that the A/C is not pulley driven but electrical makes no difference to how much engine power it will eat up. Kilowatts is kilowatts. When you turn on the A/C your new beefier alternator will need to generate as much power to run the A/C would've taken when driven by the crank directly.
The kind of mechanical compressor fitted to these cars originally used around 8 HP. Modern AC components like ours are designed to use less power so the pumps do not have to work as hard. Our compressor typically uses 900W which is 1.2 HP.
I'm not even close to as expert as you, but is it okay for the oil lines to rub up against the condenser fan? It seems like it could rub through over time.
Little bit of chapterisation which may help some users looking for help with their installations. Learn more about our electric air conditioning systems for Porsche 911s and more at classicretrofit.com! 911 airflow system 02:43 What comes in the kit 03:48 Condenser fitting 06:37 Wiring pt. 1 16:21 Planning hose pathways 18:29 Fitting hose ends 21:24 Wiring pt.2 24:27 Power wire 25:11 Fuse panel 25:25
This is a great idea for any car without factory A/C , but I'm not convinced about the long-term use of those hose clamps, I would advise checking locally if you can get a proper A/C hose crimper with the correct crimping collars for this hose and fittings combination. I hope that you have access to the correct vacuum pump and manifold gauge setup to evacuate the system correctly after leak testing with oxygen free nitrogen. I would imagine that this setup would outlast any conventional belt drive compressor system as it's isolated from the heat and vibration of the engine and with no shaft seal to leak this is a winning setup 👍
The hose clamps we used have been used in motorsport for around 20 years now. They are rated far in excess of the pressure of the pump and higher rating than most hydraulic fittings. They also do not rust out since there is no ‘collar’ for condensation to get trapped behind.
@@ClassicRetrofit Interesting piece of information as those hose clamps must be exceptional to match hydraulic pressures which are in the range of 1000-3000psi
The hose and 'Oetiker' clamp system we use meets SAE J2064 rev 2015 which calls for a working pressure of 500 PSI for AC systems. Max pressure in our system is typically 250 PSI. Oetiker clamps are used all over modern vehicles, including in high pressure fuel injection systems.
@@davidg2073 we are talking about AC, for clarity I meant compared with normal AC fittings which are crimped with a hydraulic tool. The spec is only 500 PSI but they are prone to failure from rusting.
Nice work, condenser should be fitted so that the smaller outlet ( which is the liquid line) should be at the bottom, so you are effectively stacking liquid refrigerant in the condenser 👍
I noticed one of the condensers was touching the wing/bumper flange at the AC line connector, can the condenser be moved inboard or put some edge protection on wing return flange
A "quality kit" that includes sticky tape and cable ties to secure major components like the dryer and the fan shrouds? Given the impressive standard of your build(s) you surely cannot be happy with these fixings? I wonder what will hold in the evaporator! Otherwise the kit is quite impressive and your videos are the kangaroos b*****ks.
Wrong. The parts are mechanically fixed by other means (fan shroud is bolted in). Zip ties for securing only as per any modern production car. Tape supplied is a gasket for providing air right seal.- it is NOT used to ‘stick’ anything - it isn’t even adhesive.
@@ClassicRetrofitJeff sorry if I have offended you and prompted your touchy riposte. I seem to remember your line " I will just pull off the backing to the sticky tape and install the condenser to the shroud with cable ties in all corners". Also the dryer is secured to its bracket with two cable ties. I have a number of modern and classic cars which I look after myself and I have to say none of them have components attached with cable ties . The only place they are to be found, as their name suggests, is for "tying cables".
DavidG Jeff is installing our product. The inference of your comment suggested that our product is not high quality based on the use of zip ties. In this application of zero load, this type of fastening allows easy removal of the shroud for cleaning the condensers from the back WITHOUT having to de gas the system. There is always a reason behind engineering choices. P.s. the paper backing tape is ‘stuck on’ but the foam is not sticky - semantics.
@@ClassicRetrofit It is disappointing that Jeff has seemingly gone to ground and is relying on a third party to make his response. It is noted however that contrary to Jeff's original statement there is now no denial that sticky tape and zip/cable ties were used in the installation of key components. I note the supplier/sponsor's comment that the condenser is under zero load and would be fascinated ,as an engineer, to see the calculations that support that analysis. The comment regarding cleaning the condensers without de-gassing as a reason for using zip-ties is also somewhat tenuous as the condensers are plumbed with flexible piping which would not inhibit their removal from any type of mechanical fixings whilst keeping the installation fully charged. As we are protracting this discussion I would also suggest that fixing the condenser utilising only two mounting points is also, in my humble opinion. far from optimal due to the diagonally imposed torsional forces. The cuddly Jeff I and so many of my Porsche owning friends so admired seems to have gone off stage and been replace by a corporate spokesperson!
Oops............at around 19:30 you mis-state the basic air conditioning cycle. The whole process can be done with ordinary air (that's how most systems work in airliners) but it is much more efficient and compact for an A/C system to use some sort of special gas which can change state from a liquid to a gas and back again at reasonable temperatures and pressures. "Freon" R-12 is the familiar stuff from days past, but these days cars usually use 134-A or the newer R1234YF refrigerant.
The compressor discharges hot, high-pressure gas. This gas then goes to the condenser (not the evaporator as you say) where the hot gas is cooled and turned into a high pressure liquid. Since the hot gas not only gives off it's heat, it changes state to a liquid as well; therefore, the amount of heat rejected to the outside air via the condenser is even more dramatic. From there it goes to the expansion valve near the evaporator (inside a box under the dash) where the high pressure liquid is expanded and converted into a lower pressure gas. Any gas cools as it expands, but by also changing state from a liquid to a gas, the resulting heat absorption is more dramatic. As this cool gas travels through coils the box, a fan blows cool air into the car. The cool, low-pressure gas is returned to the compressor where it is again converted to a hot, high-pressure gas thus completing the A/C cycle.
This needs more thumbs up please
You are spot on. I stuffed that explanation. I will correct it in the next vid ;)
Great explanation. You both missed the role, importance and its place in the sequence, of the dryer.
@@DiscoFang Strictly speaking, the receiver/filter/dryer is not part of the air conditioning cycle. The system will operate without it; perhaps not for long, but it will function. The receiver/filter/dryer, as the name implies, has three functions. It provides a reservoir of refrigerant, it filters out any crud, and it has a desiccate to trap water because a tiny bit of water can freeze in the expansion valve and shut down the whole system. Often these three functions are handled by an all-in-one unit, but some systems might contain separate components. A typical receiver/filter/dryer also includes a glass sight gauge so you can see the refrigerant. And yes, as you say, it's important for a well tuned A/C system.
Was that a glitch in the Matrix at 1:52 ? 🐱
Here in UK an onboard log fire is more of a priority.
Hi, kind of appreciate your approach on this project ad would like to know from where did you buy these blue colour plastic clips(at around 22.16 mts)? Hope I'm not late to ask questions Jeff. Thanks
As always, you’ve managed to go past the issues and ended up with a serviceable neat set-up. Amazing work Jeff💪
Hi Jeff - I have a 1985 911 with factory AC that barely cools. It has the same small side vents, but also has a center dash vent which works well for fresh air. In any case I'm very interested in seeing how well the electric retro-fit AC system works. Keep up the good work and excellent videos!
It has 2 huge vents on the door. Just have to crank the window lever 🤣
I can not turn the volume down any further, still loud.😊
I need your help with same car installation
Has anyone else noticed UA-cam has royally fucked up UA-cam for non subscribers? I can't even watch this video without the UA-cam overlay on top now! Before I had to hit close, where it went away automatically, now it doesn't go away at all!?
Wonderful, it's all dark with other videos still visible at the bottom along with the overlay..
Since you didn’t mention it, I thought I’d ask. Are you upgrading the alternator related wiring when upgrading your alternator?
Definitely need a larger cable from ALT to starter. Also I'd use hose clamps for the receiver drier instead of cable ties. Cheers.
Yep ;)
Nice Jeff, I've contemplating this install myself! Looking forward to the test results👍
Thanka mate. Me too :D
This couldn't have come at a better time. My old man just got the same kit for he's g series and no one wanted to touch it in Sydney without charging an arm and a leg to install it. We just got the 175a alternator installed so this walkthrough will come in handy
It is a lot of parts, but once you get going it is reasonably straight forward.
Happy Christmas Mr & Mrs Jeff, more tools for Christmas Jeff?
Italian language lessons for Mrs Jeff?
Glad to see you are putting in an electric AC system in your 911 "Harry". I want put this type of AC system in two my VW Sciroccos, an 81.and 87. This kit for electric AC appears to well though out and easy to install. Looking to see part 2 of this install of AC on this Porsche.
Merry Christmas 🎄 and Happy New Year 🎉 to you and Mrs Jeff.
How amps is the new alternator?
Not a bad kit, although for the price I'd expect better mounts than some zip ties. Overall though it does go together quite easily. Some ducting for the condensers would probably help with air flow especially at speed to make things super chilly 😉
1:51 Jeff the Cat makes an appearance.
TE TIRAS HABLANDO 19 MINUTYOS DEL VIDEO Y NO MUESTRAS LOS TRABAJOS QUE HACES SOLO EN CAMARA RAPIDA ASI LA GENTE NO APRENDE ,AUN ASI LIKE
I'm not sure if you know this, but capslock is yelling on the internet.
Nice work Jeff, but i recommend getting rid of the plastic tie straps and replace them with aluminium straps. Heat cycling will dry out the plastic tie straps and they will fracture.
Hey Jeff, plug those open hoses to avoid any contamination while building the system. Small particles can ruin the compressor. Also water from the air can enter the dryer and saturate the desiccant and the PAG oil as it is hydroscopic. I assume you are using 1234yf refrigerant otherwise you must have a RHL.
Great vid as usual. Particularly like the bespoke compressor bracket - from the Nik Blackhurst school of bracketry. 😊
I can't help being captain obvious here. The fact that the A/C is not pulley driven but electrical makes no difference to how much engine power it will eat up. Kilowatts is kilowatts. When you turn on the A/C your new beefier alternator will need to generate as much power to run the A/C would've taken when driven by the crank directly.
True
The kind of mechanical compressor fitted to these cars originally used around 8 HP. Modern AC components like ours are designed to use less power so the pumps do not have to work as hard. Our compressor typically uses 900W which is 1.2 HP.
@@ClassicRetrofit I’m sure modern compressors are way more efficient than older ones. That wasn’t my point however.
It’s isn’t really true because their is some drag associated with the extra pulley of a belt driven AC compressor.
👍🏻
So jealous of how *little* customization you had to do on this. Took me 5 videos, lol.
Still took me a good couple of days to this point, but it wasn't too bad at all.
I'm not even close to as expert as you, but is it okay for the oil lines to rub up against the condenser fan? It seems like it could rub through over time.
Little bit of chapterisation which may help some users looking for help with their installations. Learn more about our electric air conditioning systems for Porsche 911s and more at classicretrofit.com!
911 airflow system 02:43
What comes in the kit 03:48
Condenser fitting 06:37
Wiring pt. 1 16:21
Planning hose pathways 18:29
Fitting hose ends 21:24
Wiring pt.2 24:27
Power wire 25:11
Fuse panel 25:25
First time I have actually done that, but it is all now added :D
Merry Christmas Jeff for you and your Family 🌲🌲👍👍
Very good Job Love it so much best Work by Jeff ❤️👍❤️
Cool!
You need to go back to factory seats or retro seats for harry. Those racing seats are shit.
This is a great idea for any car without factory A/C , but I'm not convinced about the long-term use of those hose clamps, I would advise checking locally if you can get a proper A/C hose crimper with the correct crimping collars for this hose and fittings combination. I hope that you have access to the correct vacuum pump and manifold gauge setup to evacuate the system correctly after leak testing with oxygen free nitrogen. I would imagine that this setup would outlast any conventional belt drive compressor system as it's isolated from the heat and vibration of the engine and with no shaft seal to leak this is a winning setup 👍
The hose clamps we used have been used in motorsport for around 20 years now. They are rated far in excess of the pressure of the pump and higher rating than most hydraulic fittings. They also do not rust out since there is no ‘collar’ for condensation to get trapped behind.
@@ClassicRetrofit Interesting piece of information as those hose clamps must be exceptional to match hydraulic pressures which are in the range of 1000-3000psi
The hose and 'Oetiker' clamp system we use meets SAE J2064 rev 2015 which calls for a working pressure of 500 PSI for AC systems. Max pressure in our system is typically 250 PSI. Oetiker clamps are used all over modern vehicles, including in high pressure fuel injection systems.
@@davidg2073 we are talking about AC, for clarity I meant compared with normal AC fittings which are crimped with a hydraulic tool. The spec is only 500 PSI but they are prone to failure from rusting.
Getting too many adverts for me…
That is UA-cam, not me.
I get subtitles as standard for some reason. I noticed you use this as a drinking game everytime Jeff sais "umm". 😁
Nice AC kit!
You must be completely smashed then ;)
Nice work, condenser should be fitted so that the smaller outlet ( which is the liquid line) should be at the bottom, so you are effectively stacking liquid refrigerant in the condenser 👍
It is. Hot in the top cold out the bottom ;)
What’s the cats name? Loo
Monkey ;)
Nice kit! Very tidy installation. As always great job and you make it look so easy.
I noticed one of the condensers was touching the wing/bumper flange at the AC line connector, can the condenser be moved inboard or put some edge protection on wing return flange
They are an extremely tight fit, so that is as much room as I can find.
Yes but is it any good at cooling the car ?
That is a really nice kit. Clearly well thought out!
Superb demonstration
hi Jeff great work as usual. :-)
but should you heatschrink the entire fuse?
how do you see if it is blown?
It is an 80A fuse. if it blows you will know (very unlikely).
This is giving me Ideas. 🤔
Summer in Australia = Australian football 😍😍😍😍😍
Aussie Rules football is played in Winter?
@@HomeBuiltByJeff damn..... Anyway... Aussie rules football is great.... Cats & Saints r my teams....
Looks good
A "quality kit" that includes sticky tape and cable ties to secure major components like the dryer and the fan shrouds? Given the impressive standard of your build(s) you surely cannot be happy with these fixings? I wonder what will hold in the evaporator! Otherwise the kit is quite impressive and your videos are the kangaroos b*****ks.
Wrong. The parts are mechanically fixed by other means (fan shroud is bolted in). Zip ties for securing only as per any modern production car. Tape supplied is a gasket for providing air right seal.- it is NOT used to ‘stick’ anything - it isn’t even adhesive.
@@ClassicRetrofitJeff sorry if I have offended you and prompted your touchy riposte. I seem to remember your line " I will just pull off the backing to the sticky tape and install the condenser to the shroud with cable ties in all corners". Also the dryer is secured to its bracket with two cable ties. I have a number of modern and classic cars which I look after myself and I have to say none of them have components attached with cable ties . The only place they are to be found, as their name suggests, is for "tying cables".
DavidG Jeff is installing our product. The inference of your comment suggested that our product is not high quality based on the use of zip ties. In this application of zero load, this type of fastening allows easy removal of the shroud for cleaning the condensers from the back WITHOUT having to de gas the system. There is always a reason behind engineering choices. P.s. the paper backing tape is ‘stuck on’ but the foam is not sticky - semantics.
@@ClassicRetrofit It is disappointing that Jeff has seemingly gone to ground and is relying on a third party to make his response. It is noted however that contrary to Jeff's original statement there is now no denial that sticky tape and zip/cable ties were used in the installation of key components. I note the supplier/sponsor's comment that the condenser is under zero load and would be fascinated ,as an engineer, to see the calculations that support that analysis. The comment regarding cleaning the condensers without de-gassing as a reason for using zip-ties is also somewhat tenuous as the condensers are plumbed with flexible piping which would not inhibit their removal from any type of mechanical fixings whilst keeping the installation fully charged. As we are protracting this discussion I would also suggest that fixing the condenser utilising only two mounting points is also, in my humble opinion. far from optimal due to the diagonally imposed torsional forces. The cuddly Jeff I and so many of my Porsche owning friends so admired seems to have gone off stage and been replace by a corporate spokesperson!
DavidG over 600 systems installed. Zero issues. Final comment.
Nice work. ✌️✌️✌️
Thanks mate
Hi Jeff, just wanted to ask what the meaning of the number plate on Harry is. I've been meaning to ask for a while.
Luft air pistol model 28 ?
2.8L air cooled ('luft' in German is 'air', not 'red' like in Nena's song 99 luft ballons)
2.8 litre 'Air' cooled ;)
Wahoo!!!! I am first View, Like, Comment. YES!
Haha. Thanks mate :D
Happy holidays to you and Mrs Jeff. Hope you are all well. Stay safe