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The truth about 4K Transcoding in Plex
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- Опубліковано 16 сер 2020
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I used to not care about 4k....then got 4k tv with HDR and a 10 bit blu ray gave me goosebumps, I was hooked.
I was the same way then I upgraded to a Sony masterclass oled with Dolby vision and it was just as jarring an improvement.
EspeciAlly documentaries in 4K hdr it’s the only way to watch those beautiful shots
Yep all the people saying just watch 1080p don't understand its not the resolution that's awesome it's the tone mapping and specular highlights that are amazing. They require better compression like HEVC. I've gotten a few 1080p versions of newer shows with HDR believe it or not and they look amazing.
Yeah me too. Bought the cheapest Sony 4K HDR model, X70 series I think. And I never even bother to download 1080p again. The HDR color alone like Malaysians would say "racun (poisoned)" me LOL!
It's 2020. Time to upgrade that TV to 4k, buddy.
Here in the UK 4k would be useless. On general terrestrial TV we have only a few 1080 channels, most of them are 1080i not even 1080p.
Geryd Blackmore true but we do have Netflix shows in 4K, and new movies are usually in 4k
bb2ridder Netflix 4K is not better bitratevise than a HD ND disc
@@39zack but its better than a 1080p NF stream, the one thing you would be comparing it too...
@@gerydblackmore5484
Ouch, LONG, LONG, LONG!!!
To be fair, it is 1080P. Well, it's 1080i, but unless you have a TUBE HDTV as I did back in the day with a 42" Rear Projection 1080i TV.
Here in the U.S. Most TC channels are 1080i, with some being 720P. 720P using for things like ESPN. Sports type channels with a lot of fast action. Now if you have a 1080P TV, well it can't show 1080i. The same goes with 720P being shown on a 1080P TV. It can't!! So it has to be converted on the fly. So 1080i, means Interlace. This means all the even lines are shown in the first frame and then all the odd lines are done in the second frame. As in Interlaced. 1080P is Progressive. It shows all the Lines at once per frame. The same goes for 720P. TV's can only show the video in its native resolution.
In the US, we have 60HZ, which means showing 60 frames per second. So with 720P showing 60 frames per second, you'll get a better picture for fast-moving objects. A ball is thrown or kicked. Not have the Ghosting. But the Resolution is raised up on the fly to fill a 1080P TV Screen. With a 1080i TV source. You have basically 30 frames per second instead of 60 frames. You want a better resolution for your TV channel, you pick 1080i. The TV takes the Odd Lines and the even lines and combines them together and shows them both at once. Then shows that frame 2 times. Because you still are 60Hz and need 60 frames. So the odd and even lines get combined and then doubled and shown on the screen in its 1080P Native Resolution.
It gets even more complex with Movies that are in 24 frames per second. You have to turn that into 60 frames per second to be shown on a TV in the U.S. To do this, they do 3:2 pulldown. This means the first frame they show 3 times, and the next frame 2 times, then 3 times, then 2 times. Like 11122333445556677788999 This turns 24 frames into 60 frames per second. But because it's not the same, some people can see this effect. This is where 120HZ and 240HZ TV's come into play. For 120HZ, each frame is shown 5 times. 111112222233333444445555566666777778888899999. Now you are back to even frames. That turns 24 frames into 120 frames. The same goes for 240Hz, but now 1 frame turns into 10 frames. Some people think the effect makes things look cartoonish.
With a 4K TV, you give it a 1080i signal it does the same. Combines the odd and even lines, and then show 2 frames, but it's also scaling it up to the 4K resolution screen. Again, a 4K TV can't just show 1080i or 1080P, it has to scale it up to its native resolution. If you try to play a 4K video on a 1080P TV, it's going to be clueless. It doesn't know what 4K is. Which means you need to transcode the 4K video down to at least 1080P. That is power-hungry. So it' best to have a 1080P version and a 4K version. I have a whole different 4K Movie area for my 4K movies. I keep them separate. But for Direct Play, while the movie may be direct play, I'm still having to transcode Audio, which for 4K is also power-hungry. My NAS should be able to play 1 4K movie at a time. I'm having issues with PLEX running on my new 75" 4K Samsung QLED TV. It's my only 4K TV currently. I think it's PLEX issue running on the TIZEN OS. Watching the resources with the Plex Dash app, for CPU and RAM usage, I have more than enough of both. It plays fine for the first 1-2 minutes and then I start having buffering issues. I'm just waiting now for a new 4K AppleTV. It seems to work OK playing on my desktop computer on my 34" Ultra Widescreen Monitor, but it's 1080P, not 4K. If anything it's working harder transcoding the video also and it plays.
In the end, I was perfectly happy with the 70" 1080P TV I had gotten from my brother. He upgraded to a Sony 85" Bravia 4K TV. It is huge and nice. But I was happy with the 1080P TV. It did 3D and that was kind of cool. Then it took a dump on me. Between the new TV, and a pretty nice new Surround Sound receiver. Because my older one doesn't support 4K. The receiver supports 2 independent subs, so I ended up getting another Sub. I still want to get some Atlas Speakers. I'm forking out more money to get Netflix in 4K. In the end, I still think 4K is overrated!!! I think for any real benefit with 4K, you need a 100" screen minimum at about 6-8 feet away!!!! At some point, my 50" Panasonic Plasma in my master bedroom will take a dump, and then I'll have to get a 4K TV for there. I love my Plasma!!!! I had a 50" plasma in my family room also that was going out and was replaced by the 70" 1080P Sharp. That TV really had some poor off axes viewing. The Plasma, you could be way off to the side and it still looked great.
If you don't have 4K now, don't be in a rush to get it. Really, it's about the only kind of TV's you can buy these days. At least here in the U.S. 720P is pretty rare, and 1080P, almost impossible except small TV's I guess. We have 8K now creeping along out there. That's just insane. Do you have room for a Movie Theater size screen in your house? 4K for TV is very slowly creeping out in the U.S. in test markets. New 4K HDHomerun I have ordered. But TV shows coming out in 4K? Not anytime soon. That's years away. It took years just to get HD cameras everywhere for TV. It's just very expensive. 4K, it takes up a tom more space. Need much faster hardware to process and edit than 1080P. For streaming?!?!?! 4K is maybe really real 1080P quality. If you're getting 1080P, it's really about 480P quality. Maybe a bit better. Get your 4K TV when you have no choice in the matter. You TV died, now what type of thing. Just be prepared to switch everything else to 4K. ROKU 4K or Firestick 4K, or 4K AppleTV. 4K surround sound receiver,. 4K Netflix and other streaming services that have that option. It's a lot of other costs people don't think about.
I'd love a follow-up to this video that goes into actual detail about the transcoding process and BENCHMARKS that show the limitations of Software transcoding (What Codecs can be transcoded by just a CPU? How many streams? What bitrates? How does ARM compare with AMD and Xeon?), as well as a head to head showing the differences between Quicksync and NVDEC. Can you edit Plex's built-in transcoder to get different outputs? How does Plex decide when AND HOW to transcode a file? There's so much we don't know!
You can do it on handbrake.
Time for an update. 4K HDR transcoding works beautifully now! Might be a cool video to update and instruct.
How so? My 4k home movies don't transcode for family remotely at all.
I was surprised with this video.
Like another poster said, After getting a 4K TV I’m hooked on 4K HDR 10 bit.
I direct play to our 4K Apple TV’s.
My PMS is a 2018 Mac Mini with 32 gigs RAM and I7.
My shared content in 4K to friends and family ( gig fiber up and down) get transcoded to various formats.
CPU never breaks a sweat, RAM does get used.
Anyway, I just wanted to say that if you have the hardware and bandwidth, 4K is definitely worth it and beats the crap out of 1080!
I’ve just always ripped both the 4K and regular blu rays. Doesn’t really add much time and space isn’t an issue for me.
Seems like it's the easiest method.
I’ve done the same with Blu-ray and DVD, I’m carrying dumb devices for kids and TiVo which don’t handle 1080p very well. Also nice to stream under 5mbps for my poor home connection.
Edit: it’s fine I never stream except for vacation and I’m not going anywhere soon even if I could afford to hence my rapid Plex library expansion.
Sorry if this is a dumb question but is there a way to printout a list of the Movies and/or TV Shows that I have on Plex?
In Unraid, can you utilise TWO P2000 GPU's to increase you transcoding performance ? And do you configure the server to do that ?
Instead of separate libraries, wouldn't it be more elegant to put them in the same library, add a "4k" label to the 4k versions, then add that label to the Exclude Labels section of the user restrictions?
Please tell me when and where to time travel so that I can pick up myself an RTX 4000 card as well, thanks
I use their optimized version feature to do exactly what i think you are looking for, without needing 2 libraries. I open my Movies library, filter down to 'Resolution is 4K' then click the 3 dots, optimize. I just make a custom, 20Mbps 1080P file. I believe it updates as new movies come in too. It stores the second copy with the original. Then, since streams outside my house are limited to 15Mbps each, it transcodes from the 1080P file. You could set it up with different settings if you wanted it to automatically make versions of everything that matched the quality you wanted. I like having the 4K files for my home network.
In my tests though, it still does not ton map correctly if the 4k file is HDR
@@Bytemybits You could filter to just 4k non HDR ones, and keep a separate library for just HDR. However that point is still an issue until they implement the tone mapping. It's on the roadmap. At least I keep reading that.
By the way, great videos. I really enjoy all of your content and have learned a ton from you!!
Doesn't this option just use plex transcoding to create the 1080P file, and therefore have all the issues of transcoding?
@@EsotericArctos I'm not sure, I think they tonemap correctly now, don't they? I moved all my movies to 1080 a while back so I'm not really able to respond to that.
I’ve been keeping 4K separate for years for this very reason but now that I have gigabit up as well as down and pretty much all devices can direct play I turned remote access back on for 4K. After watching this I was curious since I just migrated my plex over to a vm on a relatively modern hp enterprise server with a pass through quadro card so I played a 4K movie on my iPhone and switched original quality to 15mbps 1080p and it looked and played great. But there was no real point to that. Lol
Huh, I've been auto generating a 720p optimized copy of everything in my plex library for like a decade. Why don't you turn that setting on?
What? So you just never learned how to use a transcoder?
Transcode all you want, for me storage space is important 1080p is just fine although my vision is bad so, past 1080p makes very little difference my primary concern is having a nice selection in my collection and having easy access on any device anywhere! So all of my movies or shows are highly compressed and still look quite good!
So wich pc should i use for plex? 1080p and 4k.. you guys rip blurays and dvds, they take alot of space in the hdds.
do you still feel the same with the way plex is now? i only have at most 3 or 4 people access my plex at a time so is it still not worth it? i want to give them the Netflix experience and Netflix does 4k
I keep both 4K and 1080p copies of the same movies in the same directory and have had no issues with it. Plex usually figures out which file to play for each resolution
So how well does plex transcode 4k hdr mkv to mp4, is there video issues with that and how much system resource are used under that situation?
That's what my 4K is in. Ya, it takes about 4 times the resources of 1080P transcoding. There are a number of variables. So really, all you can do is get a 4K video and test it on your system and see how it does. You can watch Plex DASH to see how much CPU and RAM it's using compared to a 1080P version. 1080P Direct play one TV and 4K directly play on a 4K TV. Generally, you are transcoding the Audio while the Video may be Direct Play. Then see how 4K transcodes down to 1080P or 720P may be for streaming online away from home or for friends and see how much in resources it's going to suck up doing that. Does it make sense to have 4K, no 4K, or both 1080P and 4K copies.
You can have both the 4k and 1080p version in the same directory. I've found that Plex seems to be smart enough that when a client requests a 1080 or lower resolution it uses the 1080p version to transcode.
I was curious so I also did a 1 off test where I started playing a HDR movie, then turned on Subtitles (to try and force transcoding 4k) and plex switched over to the 1080p version to transcode and add subtitles.
I've never had plex do this. In my case, it always transcodes the 4k file. I thought for the longest time that it would always transcode the first file saved for that movie, but I've since found cases where it still transcodes the 4k file (or defaults to it).
I wish it was as smart as you are suggesting, but I haven't experienced it myself.
Yes, I have experienced this too. It may also depend on the version of the client app that is trying to play it, but I have nothing to back that claim.
Yea, it has gotten better as of late with regards to plex being smart and picking the lower quality version to stream. I keep a 1.5gb 1080p duplicate copy to go with anything I have in 4k hdr. In the past I always had to tell people I share with to manually go to "play version" if they notice its 4k or when it buffers to pick the 1080p version but lately in most cases plex is just picking the one it can stream automatically
Which going console works best with plex?y Xbox One just doesn't seem to be cutting the mustard.
Is it possible to select the hardware card to use for Trnascoding. I want to be able to have my old video card transcode while leaving my new card free for gaming.
Just wanted to chime in if its not already noted....Using the Plex beta client on Apple TV via Testflight tone maps HDR to SDR very well. Seems to also be more reliable compared to the mainstream release when transcoding 4k to 1080p as I never experience any issues unless my server is in the middle of a parity check and has 4+ streams at once.
im confused you can optimize movies into other resolutions by clicking on the bottom right corner and selecting optimize and it will save a second copy in the movie file folder at a smaller res and bitrate for transcoding. i do this for all my 4k videos and havent had any tone mapping issues but i suspect my 4k hdr videos arent really hdr but i dont have many.
I do the same thing and as far as i can tell ive had no hdr issues converting
i just tested it again and it did not carry over the color :/
Not all 4k is HDR, but more often than not it is. Even if it's not HDR but still bt.2020, it's going to look off. Bt.709 4k would look fine (Bad Santa 2 comes to mind).
However, I've found that even with optimized files, you have to choose to run the optimized file. I have friends and family who will start up a movie (limited to 720p) and it will default to transcoding the 4k file instead of the available 1080p file or the already existing "optimized" version (same resolution but may or may not be the same bitrate)
Question.. while streaming 4kuhd media to a 4k upscale pixel shifting display i get the results of no frame drops and plenty of data transferring is coming in for 4k and mem and processor at 22% via 4k fire stickTV. Randomly during playback for like 5 seconds it losses smoothness detail but just enough to tell not enough to gross me out. Then when i stream the same way with fire stick and my native 4k tv using 4k uhd content and get real close to my tv i can see it do the same thing however with the native 4k tv its blind to the naked eye from 10 feet back viewing at 55 inches. Is there certain tvs that use better chips that keep them from doing this? I don't think its the nets fault to some degree. I have also checked voltage in wall and tv and both are good however once in a while i can get slight drop in the current thats running from the walls not enough drop to power off my devices but my other question is even if its a 1% drop can that also contribute to the 5 second micro loss in my display?
My system resources i dont think are being wasted because thats all my server does is host media files so it can use those resources to transcode if it wants to. But the tone mapping stuff is pretty ridiculous and i think should be implemented.
HDR to SDR Tonemapping is somewhere on the roadmap, The thing is the good folks at Plex pretty much have been in the process of completely rewriting the transcoder to be able to handle these sorts of "advanced" functions.
Also, I've had good luck dropping a 4k and 1080p file into the same folder and letting Plex choose the right one for the job. If the client comes back as 1080p or smaller, the server automatically chooses the right file. Strange thing, I know plenty of people who have tried this and it fails to pick the right one. I think it partly depends on the client, the client's hardware, and the client's version of Plex, as well.
I need to try this. I'm on plex since almost the beginning and I don't know it's capable of doing it.
I've unfortunately been in the camp where Plex seems to almost always prefer to just do my 4k rip even when I have a 1080p rip in the same directory.
@@davidreddick3016 I've always been curious about why I've had such good luck with this. Could it be the files? The clients? Settings on the client? Settings on the server? I dunno at this point.
People have been requesting tonemapping for years. Not sure how much «the good folks» at Plex really care.
For my the HDR 4K files seems a lot less washed out when I watch them on plex, vs VLC for instance.
what is the difference in streaming a freshly ripped UHD movie from disc that is 75GBs and passing that same 75GBs movie through handbrake with the mkv 4k preset. Are they both 4k movies?
So what would be the best way to play 4K on your tv?? USB?
Ok i have an issue and need help please!!!
I have a and thread ripper pc with 32gb ram and amd 6800xt gpu i use plex all the time now i have run out of sata ports and hardrive space. i use my desktop pc as a server i have a nvidia shield tv pro as my media player on my projector. i play 4k content all the time over my home network via ethernet cable
whats my best option to gain more hardrive space
buy a 18tb hard drive and get rid of the old 3, 4, 8tb hardrives i currently have
buy a raid multi bay hardrive enclosure
buy a nas sever enclosure ( is it fast enough to play 4k content can it be used stand alone and still have my pc transcode)
awww im so confused which way to go i need more space i have 22tb of movies and i am an completely out of space
For 4K I only use the HEVC/H.265 for very specific things.
With no GPU encoding it will max out and destroy all 24 threads on my server, with the GPU it's nearly a blip on the radar.
I don't have enough users to worry about maxing out the GPU for now so all is fine for me now.
Like only 1 external user, all the others are local.
this guy does not know what he is talking about GPU accelerated transcoding can handle 4k transcoding like its nothing
@@utkarsh1874 Exactly!
if you use the windows & mac desktop app you’ll see that there is hdr to sdr tone mapping, i wish they’d add it to more things
I just don't get the keeping of OG files when talking 4K. Not everyone has a petabyte of storage. On average, a raw 4K full length film is +/- 60GB. Just one. The amount of 4K content is only going to grow exponentially, so I've been re-encoding them before adding them to my library.
The latest version of Handbrake does a great job turning those massive files down to a great 10 or 12bit H.265 mp4 version, with all the audio and subtitle options intact. And on average 1/5th the file size. I have not seen any difference in picture quality depending on what app or player you use. I concur the Nvidia shield is the best box to get when playing back media via plex. Or if playing direct on a PC, use VLC.
Not only does this help your RAID, but the file format is more widely compatible. Streaming does not take as big a toll on your local or extended network, as well.
Just sayin.
How big is the 4K file typically after its encoded in handbrake? What quality setting?
@@BrianGarside You ask 10 people that question and you are going to get 10 different answers.
BUT, I've had good luck converting my 4K files to *H.265/MP4* with an average bitrate of 10Mbps (10000K), 2-Pass Encoding, with a Constant Framerate. This has minimized any issues playing the file across any OS/Device. And I'm hard pressed to see ANY difference in quality on my 4K sets, but that's just MHO.
Audio is even more of a personal preference, but I try to keep all original tracks intact, even the commentary tracks. The newest version of Handbrake also has options for 7.1 channels, so make sure you are using the latest version. Codec I tend to use AAC, bitrate needs to scale to the number of channels. _I can't stress enough how opinionated people are on this, audiophiles will probably lambaste me,_ but I use around 192kbps for stereo, 320 for 5.1, and 512 for 7.1.
The file size drops to on average 10GB per +2hr film. Around 6-7GB for a 'short' 90min film.
Fair warning - depending on the device you run handbrake on, converting a 4K movie will take a LONG time. An older i5 PC with only a few cores/threads will take over a DAY per file, for example.
Hope this helps.
(Edit: If these settings work for you, you can scale that video bit-rate for your other files, as well. Everything else staying the same, a 1080p video would be good with 2500K or 2.5Mbps video bitrate in the H.265 format, since it's 1/4 the resolution.)
@@edwardgreenjr167 You encode just like I do h.265. I think I do ~9k for video but with MKV to allow subtitles, for audio I only do Auto pass on DTS MA or True HD. Great info. Thanks Edward. I use my GPU so it encodes at a reasonable time span on my i9k.
Exactly what i do. Handbrake the 4k and 1080 versions and keep them both. Way less space than a raw 4k and all my clients direct play without washout.
@Hugh G. Rection I'm glad someone said it, saved me the hassle!
"It's baffling that you would want to watch 4k"
Lmfao, literally WHAT? This is a pretty shit take.
Most of my HD content I have is 720p. I have a nice 4K tv and with how it scales 720p (3x integer scale) it still looks good
What OS would you recommend for a Plex Server? I'm thinking of going with Windows 10, since i'm most familiar with it, but Linux is more lightweight. FreeNAS looked interesting, since I could double my server as a NAS, but apparently it doesn't support GPU transcoding for Plex, or at least I haven't found a forum that confirms it does...
i would recommend Unraid... that's what i'm using
isnt having multiple resolutions of a movie also a waste tho? 4k is just sooo much bigger in size i am not sure if replacing 1080p with 4k is worth it. wwyd?
Might be a dumb question - So as long as the TV is 4k, and supports HDR and 4k... I don't have to worry about transcoding? I want to build a NAS server and don't want to transcode at all, just want to stream 1080p and 4k movies directly. Will that be a problem for the NAS server? It is just for local viewing, not for sharing.
Hey, about the goodness of Nvidia Shield being able to support those 4K codecs, will Mi Box be able to do the same for less money?
It will but keep in mind if you play high bitrate (remux) 4k stuff you'll experience stutters. That's why most people recommand 1080p for Plex or whatever service
should do a video trying and your thoughts on jellyfin...another plex alternative...but its free...i just switched over for awhile to try it
thanks for this video. i have a shield and your info helped me understand my setup better.
Hi Jason. Your hardware transcoding guide was very helpful, however Is old and now, do not work for me. I have a and 5600 CPU and a Pquadro 2000 but with new Plex HW transcoding wouldn't work on updated Linux desktop
yes same, I have a 4K/HDR folder separated telling my friends that they can use it only if they can direct play which is never the case. I'm the only one with an Nvidia Shield ... and on my network obviously. The same can be said about Atmos sound that some players couldn't decode making Plex transcode sound. The biggest problem is that no everyone are using smart TVs, and Plex just automatically transcodes with those kind of players.
that is exactly the point, most of my friends use their mobile phones
The new Nvidia Shield can do dolby vision on video files now and thenew version of Make Mkv and some other software can get the Dolby Vision to work
Good to know. Always been a tough decision between Atmos (MKV) and DolbyVision (MP4).
@@surject there is a way to have both, working on a write up on my boyfriend's blog, look for it in the next few months, I will say, it requires a lot of storage space
@Byte My Bits I would like to see you talk more about x265 4k movies are too damn big. I've seen 4k converted to x265 with amazing quality also I'm still doing fine with 1080P and 720P. Now when I upgrade my TVs that most likely will shift to 4k with an x265 focus.
What device are you using to stream your content to?
@J J Yeah 10,000 for server and 100$ for TV..lol
Great video thanks 🙏. It’s been 8 months do you have a 4k tv now? 😑 I’m very disappointed to hear plex can’t do 4k. And I verified this last night. A ton of stutter and yeah colors are completely washed out. I was really excited to set up a movie media server, unless there is an alternative but it looks like I gotta keep doin what I’m doin: transfer my movie onto a ssd drive and watch it usb style. 😢
I bet a similar conversation was made when 1080p files started replacing SD. And the same conversation will be made with 8k files.
Anytime now the HDR remapping will be sorted out, and my 1660 can handle easily the one or two transcodes at a time to the few friends that I have given access to my server.
Unless I was getting paid for it, and sharing my server to tens of people, there is zero chance I am going to spend the time, storage and extra logistics of ether downloading or transcoding my files to multiple versions. I grab it for myself at the resolution I am going to direct play it on my tv (nowadays mostly 4k HDR) and I let the transcoder do the rest for anyone that wishes to take advantage of my setup.
I can not follow the logic of "you should not transcode 4k". It is exactly what the transcoder is for. And I don't believe the average user is expecting more that a couple of trancodes at a time, something that can even be done with software on a newer CPU. Sure the quality won't be as good as a ripped version, but honestly, if any of my friends that stream on my 20mbit upload line would want the full 4k HDR experience, then they would probably download the movie themselfs.
he's saying not to transcode it because plex handling 4k sucks right now. As a principle what you are saying is spot on, hes just saying that as of right now plex sucks at transcoding 4k and especially if it's HDR.
@@chomp7927 actually no, he's saying dont do it because.. "waste of resources" - regardless if it sucks or not
@@mailmanonfire odd that you drag this up from months back when it was true back then, but now that Plex can handle transcoding HDR down it actually changes things. If you care going for purely monetary concerns then smaller lower quality files that look OK are good enough.
But if you were going for having the best quality on hand and letting Plex serve you the best your device could handle then back when this video came it out wasn't in the cards and keeping two copies, while it would give you all the best options at any time, would be a waste of resources. But that changes now. Now you can store that best quality file and only need the one file to get the best on any device using Plex. The only "waste" left is the high usage needed to downsample that but that will only get better as time goes on but as of now it's at least possible. 3 months ago it wasn't but now that's all changed.
@@chomp7927 And the fakt that he is tying to get a good image with hdr10 on a 1080p monitor... please now how something works, befor saying something is wrong.
@@Svixdelux 1, you're talking about a year old thread, things have changed since then. 2, there are 1080p monitors and TV's and phones that can do HDR10 so that doesn't matter, and now that plex can down-sample for your device it's moot anyways. 3, for the love of god if you want to necro a year old thread about a topic that has completely changed already and try to sound like you know what you're talking about learn to fucking spell first.
I'm using Synology (Australia), 15 terabyte of movies, no issues with friends direct streaming 4K. They love it!
I am looking at the qnap ts 873 ,I already use a roku ultra I dont think transcoding is needed with my setup
The Roku does not have a trueHD or Atmos passthrough, so plex will transcode the audio but not the video. the Nvidia Shield does have passthrough TrueHD and Atmos and Plex will not decode either as the Nvidia shield will do it
Lately, Plex won't play mp4 files encoded with AV1.....any solutuion. AV one.....
Is there a way to upscale 480 to 1080 in plex
Do you have a video on UHD 770 transoding?
I cant get my plex to stop friggen trying to transcode 4K media.. plex needs to make it easier to figure out the issue.
so if you're the only person using your Plex server... it makes sense?
When you have a 4k OLED TV it is worth it...
After using MakeMKV to rip a 4K bluray, is handbrake still the best option to convert MKV to MP4?
It's probably already MP4!!!! MKV is just a wrapper.
www.howtogeek.com/200736/what-is-an-mkv-file-and-how-do-you-play-them/
If you don't transcode it, then how can you play 4k video on plex in 4k? Magic?
Most Content i used is 1080p and only this Sources are choised for Transcoding. 4K are for Local an Direct Play only
Yeah I'm thinking of doing the same - have my physical collection 4K, but my digital collection just be 1080p/standard bluray versions of those same movies. That would be to share with friends and when I'm not at home. When I am home just grab the disc. I don't see the point in wasting all the resources.
and subtitles are still kind of busted on 4k, it does have HDR to SDR tone mapping for direct play, at least on the WIndows app
I have 4k content with mine. I pre-convert to 1080p and everyone outside my house can only see 1080p, while inside my house, we can stream 4k. Inside the house it works great. I have a GTX1050 doing my hardware transcoding and it works great. Server is a HP DL380P G8 rack mount server.
I agree, anyone dabbling with 4K needs to have both the 1080p and 4K version of the same movie. The 4k version is for private direct play ONLY or else, you need to spend stupid amounts of money to share it, transcode and streaming around.
So at the end you tell us it's not worth it because you don't have the display hardware to enjoy it?
Even now with tone mapping being a thing - I struggle to get a fluent transcoding out of my QNAP TS 463D. Even when using the UHD graphics and the Vaapi Driver fix it buffers all the time. Plus I loose HDR anyways so why even bother with 4K. It's a nice to have but the ressources required aren't worth it IMO. Better have something like a Shield TV on the other end that doesn't require transcoding at all.
What about plex server on amd threadripper 3960x? lol
I don't mind if I can't transcode 4k. What I care is that PLEX would rather transcode a 4k file than use an already existing 1080p file. I've also created lots of "optimized" files but unless I chose to use it, it has in the past still just still transcoded!
If a video has a 1080p file and a 4k file and the system requesting it is at 1080p or lower, why can't they just tell it to transcode the 1080p version?
the nvidia shield can’t handle vp9 profile 2, for that reason i prefer the chromecast ultra
1. i need 4k hdr transcoding because of the subtitles, when i add subtitles it does not show HDR any more
2. you can tell plex to convert a video to a couple of preferences (1080, 720p) so they are allready there, and that solves the live transcoding.
Jason, I’m pretty sure what you talking about with optimised libraries already exists. I just tested it myself then with Forrest Gump the movie. I have two files one 4K another 1080p for the movie (both in the same plex movie library). I did a remote stream on my phone with wifi off and it defaulted to the 1080p stream. Previously I clicked the optimise button to get that 1080p file. So your conclusion is right, don’t transcode 4K on the fly! Have two files locally for those remote users or those clients that can’t handle many codecs.
Yes, this exists in Plex already, and I'm quite surprised that Jason didn't know about it. It's nothing new
i think he's still talking about hdr to sdr tone mapping
not taxing your server vs taxing your storage, the age old question. Sure for the some of you out there that run a raid 0 or a raid 1 this doesnt effect you as much. What about the folks that have a raid 10? Then storage vs server tax transcoding becomes a bigger issue. The bigger your libary the larger this problem becomes. Besides the REALLLLLLLLL reason why people dont transcode 4k is bandwidth. Fibre folks be sharing 4k all day, a gtx 1070 is all you need. You can stream 6-7 4k to 1080p and if you have a mid tier "beefy" CPU you can squeeze another 2-3, thats a lot of transcoding for my needs. As for the colour being washed out, well thats their fault its not my problem. Get a proper client or dont complain, my server are for my needs first i will make sure I have the right client to play everything. If my friends and family dont well thats kinda their problem. thats my 2centz great video!
Current plex version HDR is scaling down on 4k to 1080p and looks fine as far as tone mapping.
What software do you use to rip DVD/Blu Ray?
I use mkv
I use a program called MakeMKV. It'll rip DVD's Blu-Ray's and even HD DVD's!!!
www.makemkv.com/
You can use another program called Handbrake to compress the file down. Pick audio types to support, etc.
handbrake.fr/
So you can RIP your Discs reasonably fast. DVD's are pretty quick. So rip a bunch of discs. Then you can use handbrake and batch process all those ripped discs and that can take a lot of time, depending on what you want to do. So let the computer do its thing while you're away. Come back, compare sizes, see if they look the same. Play on PLEX on your TV and see if that works for you. Or change some settings until you figure out what is best for your needs. There's a lot of help out there. there are default settings, etc.
@@jbdragon3295 I currently use DVDFab to rip blu ray/DVD and Handbrake to deinterlace (or at least try to) DVDs. For some reason no matter what I do, DVDs mostly always come out bad. I mean I could be just spoiled by Blu Ray but when I play the disc, it looks decent but when I rip it, motion looks terrible and its still interlaced even with deinterlace on
I have the same basic setup because all my 4k videos are HDR, and while I share, I'm the only person who has a 4k HDR capable TV
And igpu is better at transcoding than a top spec gpu now as well if I'm not mistaken
Only intel has good igpu all else is trash...
Plex do offer the possibility to automatically transcode 4K media into other resolutions via their 'optimize' feature.
I have setup an optimization that automatically transcode my 4K video files to 1080p as soon as they are added to the library.
If the player can read 4k in direct play mode the 4k file is used, else the 'optimized' version is use either to read in direct play or to transcode to lower resolution (720p or less for plex user with bad connection)
However for HDR content, color mapping is still an issue..
Plex has come a long way since this video.
Yup I'd find it best to rip both the UHD disc and the 1080p disc. Tonemapping can take a decent GPU to process through smoothly on top of CPU transcoding the file. It's just not worth the time and effort.
So in practice you could;
Rip the UHD disc bet separate the video and audio stream
Rip just the video stream from the HD disc
So you'll use the (likely) higher bitrate atmos track for both the hd and uhd video streams and could save you a handful of GB having the streams share the same audio track.
Plex can't play a 4K video decently to my Panasonic 4K TV which has a Plex client built in. Don't get why this transcoding has to happen in the first place. VLC o the other hand plays my 4K videos off the same server to the TV flawlessly.
I'm probably wrong because I'm not really up to date on video but I believe that 4K is 2x the resolution and 4x the amount of data of 1080P.
use intel uhd 630, it can hold 4-5 transcoding in 4k
I don’t get this argument that HDR->SDR is a waste of resources. I paid for lifetime Plex pass so I could watch my library when not home and share it for my family so I don’t need to transcode but maybe a few streams simultaneously. I just hate it that I need two libraries so I can actually watch those movies anywhere I go. I don’t even mind having a dedicated GTX 1660 for my Plex docker as long as I could only have to have a single library and version of each movie/show.
My 4k content is in SDR and my plex server can CPU transcode 4k just fine.
1080 is 2k lol so how is 4k 4 times?
Optimized defaults is a thing, literally does what you described!?
Rtx 4000……? 😳 😂 You're ahead of time
The people I deal with s4s 4K Remux content (80gb files). You're end users connection needs to be Hardwired and preferably and internet connection of atleast 200mbps up/down.
I do agree Transcoding 4K isn't something you want to do. I usually only grant access to people who are about that life. My server can do it but I usually block and stop a user if I catch them
They've mentioned in their newsletter that HDR->SDR tonemapping is coming, they have to update a few other dependencies first. It's been a month or two since that newsletter, I forget the details, but they're aware of the issue and it's something we're supposed to see eventually.
I doubt it. I believe they don't give one crap about it.
@@timramich they did it ^^
How can I prevent plex from transcoding on my local network?
J J I use the Plex web app on a laptop wired 1gb, iPhones on WiFi and an iPad on WiFi all inside the house and Plex doesn’t always direct play.
PLEX almost always wants to transcode. You may have the Video that Direct Plays, but not the Audio. SO the video is in 1080P and so Direct Plays on your 1080P TV. But the Audio? There may be 1 or more audio tracks and if you don't have the audio setup for playing one of those or the one you want, the Audio is going to want to transcode.
ou can transcode all your own videos using settings you know will allow for direct play with your hardware. You can convert using Handbrake. Of course, if you watch in another room, now that may have to transcode. If you turn on Subtitles, now Plex has to transcode!! PLex now has to place text into the video. If you want to copy some movies onto your iPad or Android phone or whatever for watching on those devices because you'll be away from the internet, or to slow, etc. Now you're transcoding down for that device. You almost can't get away without transcoding.
Netflix for example doesn't transcode. They just have a bunch of different versions to play spending on the connection speed. So I lean this way. I have what 4K movies I have it their own 4K movie folder and everything else is 1080P in the normal movie folder. These are the ones getting transcoded for outside of my network as its far, far less resource hungry to do that over 4K. You can't even see my 4k directly unless I give you access, and the only people with access are those at my house. Outside, it's streaming 4Mbps 720P quality transcoded from 1080P.
No 4k TV wtf
I just got my first 4K a couple months ago!!! A 75" 4K Samsung QLED TV. I only did that because the free 70" 1080P Sharp TV took a dump less than a year after getting it from my brother who upgraded his TV to a 4K 85" Sony Bravia. That 70" replaced my 50" Panasonic Plasma which I loved. Super wide viewing angles and a great TV. The Sharp, you off to the side a little bit and it's so faded. The 3D that it supported was cool. Really, after getting my 4K TV, I don't get the Hype. I was happy with that 1080P 70" Sharp. The video, so long as you were right in front was nice. I didn't have to upgrade any of my other hardware. I was happy. I went from 50" to 70". That was a huge change in size. My new 4K TV is 5" larger in size. I then had to get a new Surround Sound receiver that supported 4K. I went with a higher-end one this time. So that wasn't cheap. I ended up getting a second Sub since it supports 2 independent Subs. This new one is Wireless. Works great. I still need to get my other sub fixed. So I'm using a smaller sub on that side of the room. I need to replace the Plate Amp on the sub. It was replaced once before.
Right now, 4K, take it or leave it. Really, don't worry about 4K until you need a new TV because your current one died on you. You really are forced to buy a 4K TV these days.
RTX 4000 card? Are you from future?
I let a friend tryout my 4k movies. Direct play with no issues. I forgot to disable and a couple weeks later i saw him streaming a 4k transcoded to 720 at 2Mbs. I texted him what was he thinking.. His response.. Oh that must be my Dad. 😱 Needless to say he lost his privilege. But good to see my Synology was able to do it.
If the file is 4K, I'm viewing it in 4K, luckily on my Samsung TV it Direct Plays pretty much everything.
I think video quality is subjective from person to person on how important it is. For me 4K HDR looks better then 1080. 1080 is still acceptable for me if 4k is not available. 720 is not. Only time 720 or lower resolution is acceptable for me is cause you literally can't get said media in a better quality. I don't re encode my video to anything less then what the video was shot on. For me to lower the quality at all really defeats the purpose of buying the videos at all. I'll just go to Netflix or something and stream.
4k and 4k HDR are two different things. 4k vs 1080p more detail but nothing special. 4k HDR vs 1080p wow! Huge difference.
@@ckirkyg most things you can get in 4k hdr. But yes. Not a huge difference between 4k ana 1080
Most 4k discs aren't 4k. They mostly only have HDR to offer. Streaming services seem to have more actual 4k content than 4k discs offer.
@@timramich and how did you determine that?
@@phillipzan2005 Most are upscaled from 2k. I'd say somewhere in the 1% range of releases are actually 4k. Hollywood doesn't want to spend the money on hard drives and CGI would take 4x longer to render in 4k.
I don't think my server can even transcode 4k at all. Not enough horse power. It'll transcode 1080p just fine though.
Native 4K is 3X greater than 1080p and 5X greater than 720p. Even against HD(X) "infinity" its a ball hog. I find the best way to go streaming is HDX with HLG and turn on 4k upscaling enhancements. Also outside server service takes control from best view streaming options. Plex should serve no different.
Good idea keeping a different folder for 4K!
No. It's not. They've had like 5 years to get this feature going, but they keep focusing on retarded ass features relating to OTA and DVR stuff, free programming from no-name places with ads, content from studios (which working with them will eventually mean the studios demand Plex block copyrighted media). They bluntly state that they're not interested in HDR tonemapping and don't give a crap what thecm customer thinks. I wonder what will happen when ATSC 3.0 gets mainstream. Will they dick around with HDR tonemapping still or actually get off their asses?
That is bad idea for customers who have huge library , I have 28TB at least 20TB of it is 4K so I need to make another 20TB cluster of hardisks to have 1080p version of it and go convert these videos ? That is expensive and not cheap solution nor it is efficient as he claim to be in the video
@J J
I'm doing the whole 2 copies. With a separate Movies 4K folder. I only have 1 4K TV right now in the family room. I'm not doing 4K streaming over the Internet as my Upload bandwidth is only around 11Mbps. Downloads is much faster but it doesn't do me or anyone else wanting to stream 4K movies remotely. It's just not going to happen. Besides the 1TB Comcast Cap!!!
I have a pretty large NAS right now. Just over 27TB of space. I don't have a ton of 4K movies right now. I still have 5.5TB free right now before needing to expand more. I don't need everything in 4K anyway. 1080P is still my goto format and really looks just fine. Some movies that I really LIKE, then I get in 4K. But still have a 1080P version and that is the one that gets transcoded for everyone remotely. It's not a Resource HOG. Space-wise when you think about it. It's not all that much, making it worth it.
In time, as I get another 4K TV, in a few years as 4K matters more, and maybe it's time to think about upgrading my NAS to something much faster that'll be out a few years from now. It'll have movie movies, slowly building up more 4K. Then the 1080P duplicates can slowly go away. Giving me more space. Right now for me, it makes no sense to toss the 1080P versions. It'll be years if ever before anyone outside my Network will be able to stream anything from me in 4K.
I keep a 1080 copy to go with my 4k hdr, the space is negligible when talking 35+gb for a 4k movie whats 1.5gb more hurt.. i keep everything in the same library so there is 2 copies and in most cases plex automatically picks the 1080p copy when someone streams that movie.
JB Dragon you talking about different scenario ,
My system can run 4k easy but for some reason plex doesn't want to.
I don't think it is worth transcoding anything unless it is really needed. Personally I don't see the advantage of transcoding over direct streaming, unless for some reason you need to change the bandwidth being used.
I have the Quadro P2000 and could not even get 1 client to transcode 4k, i got about 0.5-0.7x in Conversions when i tested. After days of testing and not figuring out i noticed i was using x86 and not the "newer" x64 bit version in Windows. wow what a difference, now i transcode up to 12x.
This should be made a video about by someone! *hint* ;)
I wouldn't transcode on the server..send the full res signal to the device and let it take care of it..and most devices these days can do hardware transcoding on device...
Yeah 4k will remain an aspiration for me until Im cool with how much space it takes and plex handles it better.