Before EVs were a thing, you would rely exclusively on the engine heat to heat the cabin so all existing AC units for cars were designed only to cool as there was literally no reason to add the extra cost and complexity to reverse the flow. Since a lot of EVs are based on ICE platforms, they used what was available before scaling up production of bespoke EV parts like AC/heat pump units. Additionally, despite what this video says, heat pumps are worse than PTC below a certain temperature and slower to provide heat when turning on the vehicle, so they are still used as initial/backup heating for cabin even in EVs with heat pumps.
@LAndrewsChannel I understand the reasoning but not exactly the math. For example Tesla delivers same range but with much lesser battery capacity which is nowadays the biggest cost factor including the car. When VW group makes the ID platform from zero, how is it that the sell the heat pump as an option? They could had made the battery pack smaller, reduce the cost and "kill the market" for the same range. I guess it's about culture and you pay the price for it.
@@chat-1978 You are diverging from the subject. Tesla is using PTC in their car alongside heat pumps just like many other brands. Also where is Tesla delivering same range with "much lesser battery capacity"? An ID.4 Pro 4Motion with a 75.5 kWh usable capacity achieves 507 km range while a Tesla Model Y LR with 70 kWh pack usable achieves 493 km range in slightly better conditions for the Tesla. Numbers from Bjørn Nyland. Where is that "much less"? The efficiency "advantage" for the Tesla is 5%, close to nothing real world. Stop treating Tesla like some kind of messiah, they are not. They were the first to start developing the modern EV, but their lead shrank to almost nothing now. VW sells everthing as an option.That's how they are choosing to sell their vehicles. Heat pumps do not magically extend the range, especially in the summer (duh) so there is the option for the consumer to not include it to save money if they live somewhere with much milder and short winters.
@LAndrewsChannel if I gave you the idea that I love Tesla then you are incorrect. Unfortunately I do drive an id. 4 and there is no way that it achieves those numbers not even with favorite conditions. Not sure about Tesla and my comparison was unfair. Problem is that when the heat pump is an option, you can't really compare apples to apples. And you are right, we deviated a bit. Thank you for your time and answers.
typically, a complete automotive heat pump system, including the compressor, evaporator, condenser, and associated components, weighs around 20 to 30 kilograms (44 to 66 pounds). This weight is higher than a standalone PTC heater but is offset by the heat pump's energy efficiency, which is especially important for extending range in electric vehicles.
Thank you for pointing that out! You’re absolutely right that in some models and regions, the PTC heater is positioned after the A/C coils, especially for defrosting, and there are setups with separate paths for the PTC heater and heat pump. Tesla and other brands sometimes vary this configuration depending on the climate and specific vehicle needs. For clarity in the video, I simplified the layout to avoid confusion and make it easier to follow. Appreciate your input-it’s great to have this kind of feedback to show how varied these systems can be!
Not at all. They are already cheaper to buy with tax credits. They will attain real piece parity with gas cars by next year. You don't need that expensive gasoline to run your car.
Wow very good video
thank you for the request
Keep up the good Work !!👍🏽
Since every airco is a heat pump, why did the ptc ever exist in EVs?
Before EVs were a thing, you would rely exclusively on the engine heat to heat the cabin so all existing AC units for cars were designed only to cool as there was literally no reason to add the extra cost and complexity to reverse the flow. Since a lot of EVs are based on ICE platforms, they used what was available before scaling up production of bespoke EV parts like AC/heat pump units.
Additionally, despite what this video says, heat pumps are worse than PTC below a certain temperature and slower to provide heat when turning on the vehicle, so they are still used as initial/backup heating for cabin even in EVs with heat pumps.
@LAndrewsChannel I understand the reasoning but not exactly the math. For example Tesla delivers same range but with much lesser battery capacity which is nowadays the biggest cost factor including the car.
When VW group makes the ID platform from zero, how is it that the sell the heat pump as an option? They could had made the battery pack smaller, reduce the cost and "kill the market" for the same range.
I guess it's about culture and you pay the price for it.
@@chat-1978 You are diverging from the subject. Tesla is using PTC in their car alongside heat pumps just like many other brands.
Also where is Tesla delivering same range with "much lesser battery capacity"? An ID.4 Pro 4Motion with a 75.5 kWh usable capacity achieves 507 km range while a Tesla Model Y LR with 70 kWh pack usable achieves 493 km range in slightly better conditions for the Tesla. Numbers from Bjørn Nyland. Where is that "much less"? The efficiency "advantage" for the Tesla is 5%, close to nothing real world. Stop treating Tesla like some kind of messiah, they are not. They were the first to start developing the modern EV, but their lead shrank to almost nothing now.
VW sells everthing as an option.That's how they are choosing to sell their vehicles. Heat pumps do not magically extend the range, especially in the summer (duh) so there is the option for the consumer to not include it to save money if they live somewhere with much milder and short winters.
@LAndrewsChannel if I gave you the idea that I love Tesla then you are incorrect. Unfortunately I do drive an id. 4 and there is no way that it achieves those numbers not even with favorite conditions. Not sure about Tesla and my comparison was unfair.
Problem is that when the heat pump is an option, you can't really compare apples to apples.
And you are right, we deviated a bit. Thank you for your time and answers.
The PTC appears more simple than the heat pump. How much does the heat pump and it's components weigh?
typically, a complete automotive heat pump system, including the compressor, evaporator, condenser, and associated components, weighs around 20 to 30 kilograms (44 to 66 pounds).
This weight is higher than a standalone PTC heater but is offset by the heat pump's energy efficiency, which is especially important for extending range in electric vehicles.
it was amazing
The PTC heater is after the A/C coils in the event defrost is on, your diagram is incorrect.
Thank you for pointing that out! You’re absolutely right that in some models and regions, the PTC heater is positioned after the A/C coils, especially for defrosting, and there are setups with separate paths for the PTC heater and heat pump. Tesla and other brands sometimes vary this configuration depending on the climate and specific vehicle needs. For clarity in the video, I simplified the layout to avoid confusion and make it easier to follow. Appreciate your input-it’s great to have this kind of feedback to show how varied these systems can be!
Jesus! an EV is just an expensive joke.
Not at all. They are already cheaper to buy with tax credits. They will attain real piece parity with gas cars by next year. You don't need that expensive gasoline to run your car.
EV's are rapidly evolving as well.