Matt, I've been a fan of yours for a while-- which is why I can't believe I just accidentally found the analysis you did on the Golden Girls "Isn't It Romantic?" episode back in Sept/2015. I actually wrote that episode. I enjoyed your comments and nice words. One secret though-- they didn't use ice cream in the "ice cream clown Sundaes." They used mashed potatoes. Thanks! Jeffrey Duteil
Oh my goodness what an honor to hear from you! Thanks so much for writing that lovely episode. Glad to hear the ice cream wasn't in any danger of melting!
I remember that episode. I was sitting on my Grandmas lap, eating ice cream. My Grandparents just laughed. She gave me a big squeeze and smiled at me. She knew. I told her in the later years as I got older that I wanted to be like mary. Go to the city, get a job, have a car and have a cool life. She told me it was a great idea. I did. It was. Thank you Mary and all the Merry men and women along the way.
@a hellenic pagan (great UA-cam user name, by the way!), from what I remember of the character of Phyllis (truly, Cloris Leachman was comedic gold!), she would rather her brother be a Gay Man than date the bane of her existence, Rhoda!
But not to take away from how everyone treated him, and that he was allowed to be himself and not the typical stereotype gay of the day. Yes, that's the joke, but Phyllis still accepted him and loved him, and he was allowed to fit right in. Rhoda herself made no judgements and liked hanging with him.
The backstory to this episode is as awesome as the show itself. The actress who plays Rhoda, Valerie Harper, has said that the final scene-where she gives her “He’s gay” line-is her proudest professional moment. (Apparently it was the first time “gay” was used on an American TV show referring to homosexuality.) It also got the biggest laugh of any Mary Tyler Moore epsidoe… apparently it took upwards of a minute for the studio audience’s laughter and cheering to die down! They ended up having to cut most of the audience response out of the final broadcast edit since their reaction to the joke was so uproarious and long.
@a hellenic pagan, thank you so much for this backstory to this scene. Frankly, I have always loved Valerie Harper, not only as an actor, but energetically, as well. I know that both Mary Richards and Mary Tyler Moore "could turn the world on with a smile," but Valerie Harper always did a great job of making ME smile, with her performances, especially as "Rhoda." And yes, I do recall watching "Rhoda" when I was younger, too, and LOVED iT! Oh, dear; I have a feeling I AM going to start watching another show; funny, how all the situation comedies I watch have been off the air for several years: "Frasier," "The Jeffersons," etc.
Another thing that's significant about this episode is that Ben is a totally "normal" guy. He has a job, a home, a sister, he's willing to go out with a friend, he's nice, he can laugh, and hang out with people, he cares enough about Phyllis to not yell at her and storm out, he is a successful musician, he came out to Rhoda at some point so he's not closeted, Rhoda liked him as a friend, he is not a stereotype, he doesn't seem depressed or filled with self hate. I do really think this is an amazing episode, and I remember when I saw the first run - I was so pumped by it, as a gay person myself. This was the most watched show on TV in its time slot, 10s of millions of people watched it, and suddenly they were in the position to think things like, huh, I wonder if my single cousin is gay. He's kind of like Ben....
I was born in 74. I grew up knowing a gay couple. My parents made certain that Henry and Ray were no big deal to my brother or me. I was heart broken when only Ray came to my wedding in 96. My Dad explained that Henry’s work still didn’t know and they were concerned someone would find out at his work. He worked at the bank in the small town my mother was from, so much of our family on her side was still from there. I was instantly relieved that they decided not to come together when one of my cousins made a slur and said if any from the Navy came, they would beat them up. (My groom was Navy.) I would have been horrified if they had tried to hurt Henry or Ray. They were some of the most genuinely sweet people I knew. They’ve passed away since then. I wish they’d lived long enough to see marriage equality.
Oh my god WHAT? I've lived in Minnesota my entire life and had no idea we never technically decriminalized homosexuality. That's kind of insane. And the fact that the last time it was enforced was in this century is mind boggling to me. So... thanks for that lesson I guess?
They aren't really enforceable since Lawrence v. Texas though. Still, it would be a nice symbolic gesture to repeal it, but I don't know how amenable Minnesotans at large are to that.
Alexa Renae Wow! I just celebrated 25 years in Minneapolis and I never knew this 'law' existed. With 12.5% of Minneapolis LGBTQ they'd have to build a lot more jails to contain all of us.
I remember this being huge for me back then. I was a teenager at the time and I still remember the subject of homosexuality being brought up in my high school psychology class. The outpouring of homophobia was unbelievable although for the time it was perfectly acceptable and I had to sit there and take it. So, this one episode of MTM was a treasure for me (and at least one other friend of mine who, like me, was not out at the time...even to me). At the time (1973) the only glimmer of positive depictions of being gay for me was in rock...glam rock, actually. But even then it was done as a way to shock the fans, to be noticed and not so much to inspire any solidarity. Most of the people doing glam were straight and since having long hair was pretty much acceptable, wearing make up and being flamboyant was more dangerous and thusly, more rock and roll. Glam gave me something to grab on to as a teenage gay boy...but this episode of MTM gave me something more. It showed me that being gay didn't necessarily mean I had to move to New York and walk on the wild side, I could be just that guy playing his dog food commercial music with the girls. Thanks, Mary....and thanks Matt for this video!
I remember one of the questions the teacher asked the class was "can homosexuals love?"....Well, the answer was a resounding "no". Beyond that any more discussion was peppered with homophobic slurs and the usual acceptable amounts of hate that teenagers in the mid 70s were allowed.
It’s a wonderful episode. The punchline isn’t that Phyllis is weird, it’s more that she would rather have her brother be gay (with all of the negative views of that in 1973) than have him marry Rhoda. According to the producers, the actor who played Ben was gay in real life and had no problem playing the role. Actors still say the industry is homophobic today and I can’t imagine what it would have been like back then. When they were shooting the MTM pilot, the test audience thought Rhoda was unlikeable so the script supervisor suggested that Phylis’s’ daughter say that she liked Rhoda. The audience then would think that if a child liked Rhoda, she must be okay. It worked. By the time the Brother’s Keeper episode came along, audiences loved Rhoda and I think her liking Ben had a similar effect. “If Rhoda likes Ben, he must be okay.” Great video once again!
It's nothing specific. It's just their overall position on gay rights. Homosexuality is punished by Life Imprisonment in the South and Death in the North.
Tyler Hill it's actually 14years jail term in the South and yes death sentence in the North, to a great extent, even advocacy for lgbt rights is considered an offense as well, thankfully, there are nascent underground organizations of activists all working for a change, still a long road ahead, but we're hopeful.
Thanks for talking about this episode. I grew up watching MTM with my siblings (I was 9 when this ep first ran) and I love the way they wrote this. I agree that Phyllis's relief that her dear brother is NOT into Rhoda is the intended joke. This was decades ahead of its time.
My favorite part is the little tag scene around the piano. So strenuously non-dramatic and loving. And Mary's little smile at the scene is an enormous gesture in this context. Mary approved is a bfd. All without a word or Afterschool Big Speech.
Yep I saw it ! We watched MTM every week ! I loved He beauty, her style, her kindness to all , her apartment, her friends ! A woman in the early 70s in TV journalism in her own TV series wasn’t common at ALL ! I wanted to be her. To throw MY hat in the air and proclaim myself as a professional woman in charge of her own destiny ! 💪🏻
@@DavidEFarner Most of us want to be Mary but are really Rhoda which is still much better than being Phylllis. The 2 oldest actresses on the show Betty White and Cloris Leachman are the only two that still remain. God or Budha or someone bless Valerie Harper,the real deal!
Back in 2001 while on holiday in the United States, I bought a VHS Box Set from Virgin Records in Times Square called Mary Tyler Moore - Party Girl. It featured four episodes from the show, highlighting Mary Richards' party disasters. Growing up, I had only watched the series on and off. But to my surprise and delight, My Brother''s Keeper was one of the episodes included. It was a keeper, indeed. Thank you for recapping this groundbreaking episode from the history of mainstream television.
It was groundbreaking for many reasons, like a single career woman who is independent, but this was one of the most amazing episodes.......however my #1 would be the Chuckles the Clown funeral....pure comic gold
MTM is my fav show of all time. I was 14 in 1973, my parents and I watched MTM and all the other ground-breaking shows on television all throughout the 70s. I remember this episode and it was great to see Phyllis get another little dig, especially having the 'news' broken to her by her nemesis, Rhoda. To us, watching...it was simply a fact of life and it wasn't a 'big deal'..it was indeed a big deal re: network television, but to us it was just another great show and we were pretty okay with much of the changes going on in the era. Some changes, no...even I still say SOME changes were not made for the best, but this...culturally...very significant but not significant to those of us who do not believe in labels, division, identity politics. So he was gay? He was a nice guy. Like many a nice gay guy - including my cousin - I have known in my lifetime.
Thank you Matt - I was hoping you'd do a video on that program. The first time I saw it, I laughed my ass off when Rhoda said, "He's gay". Totally unexpected. But the show ended positively, and Phyillis doesn't display any less affection for him after he's outed. On a side note, the actor who played her brother was openly gay in real life.
@Merchant2, thank you for the note of trivia about Robert Moore; I love the fact that he is a fellow Robert (my first name is Robert) who is also an openly Gay Man. Personally, I shall not deny that I prefer LGBTQIA+ actors portraying LGBTQIA+ characters, but I shall also refrain from denying that a talented actor, straight or not, is a talented actor.
@@RobertAlvarezThePsychicWitch Sexuality of an actor is like the old joke, "Gay? Or just British?" Gays have been playing straight on screen for a century, kinda late to get upset - shouldn't colour-blind casting work both ways? Neither Valerie Harper or Nancy Walker were Jewish, but could they have found 2 finer Morgensterns? Conversely, should Lauren Bacall or Paul Newman not be allowed to play WASPs?
@@unowen-nh9ov I had never heard the old joke, "Gay? Or just British?" before today, and I find it so funny! Especially as it seems as though that enchanted place across the pond seems incapable of producing bad actors. I honestly had no idea that neither Valerie Harper nor Nancy Walker were not Jewish, which goes to show how well they portrayed their respective roles, and I must admit, I had not thought about the late and great Nancy Walker in far too long. And, I can honestly say I do not recall ever thinking about the respective ethnic backgrounds of neither Ms. Bacall nor Mr. Newman. What a great reply from you. Thank you.
@@RobertAlvarezThePsychicWitch Matt Boner was criticized recently for playing a trans role, but I really hope to see it someday because I think he's talented & want to see what he did with it. I've never looked to a movie for representation & am old & biased enough I want casting to be on talent, casting by type or representation forces all movies to become documentaries, & I think we all know autobiography can be the biggest friction of all. I know identity politics is important, but it can be just as hazardous to make it our only identity (as politicians use it now to manipulate, dehumanize & diviide us for profit). Obviously this thread shows it provokes a lot of feelings & memories in people, the personal IS political. But today I think of this as a tribute to the actress who gave us Rhoda, her employer & friend who gave us this show & all the wonderful talents they worked with on both sides of the camera. Thanks, MTM! In all its guises.
Oh how the world has changed. I'm just 51 years we went from "they don't want a monogamous relationship" to "they want all the monogamous relationships only for them selves" still wrong but... 😂 😂 😂... Progress? Maybe in another 50 years someone will get them the message that being gay is literally no different than being straight.
Heh, yeah, I can't even imagine how many mental gymnastics people have had to do to rationalize their prejudice over just the last few decades! But thinking about what TV was like when this episode came out, it's clear that a LOT has changed.
Matt Baume I was raised on Norman Lear shows and Mary Tyler Moore, Rhoda ect. So I really want to say thank you for the nostalgia bombs, I'm loving them. I am proud that most of my favorites are standing the test of time in their attempt to educate the world about" the gays". I'm sorry. I love that phrase. It's so silly. People put "the" in front of everything they don't understand.
Well no, it is different. It's just that it's only really different in one way - who one is schtupping. Which I suppose falls under the dictum of "a difference which makes no difference is no difference." So I guess you're right after all. :)
I read somewhere that Robert Moore, who played Phyllis's brother, Ben, back in the day directed the original version of The Boys In The Band for Broadway. How cool is that.
I'm so thrilled to discover your channel, which is covering all the shows I grew up with and helping me understand how they may have shaped who I am. Our house was a devoted CBS house, and as a Jewish north Jersey girl born in '66 I was raised on Norman Lear and MTM. I think this must have been one of if not THE first gay character I ever saw on tv. Rhoda's "he's gay!" line is burned into my head like our first phone number. It surely normalized it to some degree for me, even if it was also the focus instead of being not big deal. But it is truly these small acts of courage and vision that together can bend towards justice.
It's interesting how fiction can accomplish things that fact cannot. No amount of documentary footage of gay men at the time could break through people's prejudices the way that shows like this could, and I think that's because of the viewpoint of the regular characters. We know them already, we like them (or we wouldn't be watching), and thus it's like being told something by a friend rather than some detached source - it engages our trust. Crap like homophobia gets best chipped away when the chipper is someone we trust; it feels like persuasion instead of force, such as the imposition of laws might feel. Human heads have such interesting insides!
As an All in the Family episode showed, often the issue was actually about passing, Archie's macho jock friend had to out himself. Just as decades earlier Hollywood did movies about Negroes & Jews "passing" for "normal".
I've been slowly watching the Mary Tyler Moore Show and got to this episode recently. Went flying blind and was so pleasantly suprised. The epilogue is so sweet and so wonderful, to see a sister embrace her brother that way as she approached the piano with him, and Cloris Leachman plays it so tenderly. I was moved to tears at the end.
In 1972 ABC aired THAT CERTAIN SUMMER with Hal Holbrook, Martin Sheen, Hope Lange and Emmy winner Scott Jacoby. A remarkable film that presented the topic of homosexuality very sympathetically. And it still holds up very well today.
Love the video, Matt, and thanks for sharing it with us. There is one unintended lesson here that most gay and lesbian people have had to learn and that's the differing degrees of what our friends and family find acceptable. In relation to Phyllis being grateful her brother is gay instead of in love with Rhoda, most of us have had to come to the realization that being gay places us on a ratings scale of what's acceptable and what's not. A lot of us have been excluded from family gatherings and celebrations because we're gay, yet adulterers, liars, gossip mongers, drunks, etc. are perfectly acceptable and welcomed with open arms. As a contrast, toss in a sudden tragedy or terminal illness, and suddenly we drop on the scale to "more accepted" because our help is needed. Once the issue is resolved we're usually elevated once again to the top of the scale and regain our unacceptable status. No doubt, if this episode were based on a real story, we would find that after a week or two, Phyllis would not be so welcoming, loving, and accepting.
I remember when this episode first aired. We watched it as a family as part of our regular Saturday night thing. I was pretty naive at the time and didn't understand the joke... My mom and sister had to explain it to me. I ended up feeling uncomfortable about it. If ten year old me had only understood what the word would mean for me. *smile*
thank you!!! i've wanted this episode to get culture cruise treatment for a looong time, and this is just perfect. personally, interpreted phyllis's relief as once again picking at how much she dislikes rhoda (which is a reoccuring theme in the show), but nonetheless, i remember seeing this episode after buying the series on DVD and being shocked. i don't know why i love the mary tyler moore show so much. i'm young, a lesbian, and never grew up watching it. it's not particularly remarkable, just a good sitcom that prominently featured women before that was an established trope. but it's episodes like these that were handled with such care for 1973 that make me love the show!
I was a "tween" when this series aired, and there's a lot in them that's hard to parse or undetectable to younger people who no longer have the cultural references. Just watching Mary navigate her day in the workplace was major, as the idea of a woman in her job was revolutionary in itself. It's like Uhura on _Star Trek;_ she may look like "just a switchboard operator" to younger eyes, but she was a beacon to women in the 60's just because she was _there._ (Not to mention black people.) Context often carries a lot of the meaning in entertainment like this.
Serai3 it's certainly one of the reasons i began watching the show! i may not fully be able to comprehend what it was like at the time to see an independent career woman like mary richards on tv, but i do feel like the show is, if nothing else, a good example to younger viewers such as myself the barriers that women still faced culturally and professionally in the early seventies. i know some situations were most likely exaggerated for effect, but you can still feel the undercurrent of just how mary is the "exception" in a male-dominated workplace rather than the rule, how mr. grant can be condescending to her despite being considered a softie in the series, and just in general how she is treated more as a secretary than a fellow employee of equal standing (although, technically, she was considered "management" in comparison to murray or gordie.) it was in the seventies that my grandmother was told she needed her husband's permission to open a savings account at a bank! when that feels hard to believe, or when older women speak of the influence of shows such as this, having such a cultural touchstone of a show (and a genuinely funny and inspiring one at that) is so very helpful and enjoyable :-)
It's not that I think you can't comprehend it, no! It's that the show is filled with little signifiers that have to do with the time it was created that would just be meaningless to anyone who wasn't around then. I watch movies from the 30's and I'm sure there's a ton of stuff in there that I'm not getting, from jokes to set decor, simply because I was born in the 60's. (Hell, there are things in Monty Python that I feel must be jokes, but I can't be sure because I have no context!) I'm very glad the difficulties of Mary's position come across to you, though, and that you find her inspiring. I was fascinated by the idea that a woman could live alone and be happy and successful at all, as the culture in the early 70's certainly didn't offer that as a general option. :)
I was 12 when the show debuted & have always referred to it as my Intro. to Secular Humanism .101. The network wouldn't allow the lead to be divorced so Mary became single, Rhoda being Jewish was an issue (a later episode Mary dumps a bigoted friend by claiming to be Jewish). The show was criticized for not being feminist, but not only did it deal with social, political, economic & human rights issues on screen, many women were hired to write, it was MTM's studio & show & she directed an episode.
Great job, Matt. You had better believe that Valerie Harper had something to do with how this amazing episode panned out. Do you know that she is the first big star to give an interview to The Advocate?
I think I read or saw an interview with MTM where she said the writers and she wanted Murray to be the first gay character to regularly appear on a sitcom. It would have made a lot of sense, but the producers wouldn't hear of it.
I'm glad you posted this. But please remember, back in 1973, we knew that some folks were gay. We didn't talk about it because we nose into other people's business. Giants like Paul Lynde told jokes that got laughed at because they were funny. We didn't care that he was gay. Everyone knew it! We loved him just the same because that's the way things were back then.
@@yakkyjoe1 > Everyone but Matt seems to get the joke. What do you mean? He says this in so many words. 4:20 "But I don’t think that’s what’s actually going on -- the joke is more that Phyllis just worked herself up into a frenzy for what turned out to be no reason at all. Despite all her dramatics, there was a totally reasonable explanation for what was happening that she was simply too wrapped up in herself to consider. In other words, Phyllis is the punchline, not Ben. Her ignorance is the joke. Not his sexuality."
Fun Fact: the actor that played Ben was gay in real life. Before taking the role, he had multiple conversations with the production and writing teams to ensure the script was solid and that, in no way, would homosexuality be the butt of the joke. He also went on to direct several episodes of the spin-off, 'Rhoda."
AWESOME episode! I've been binging the MTM Show and I wondered what it must have been like for this episode to air when it did. I really appreciate your putting perspective on it. Illegal? Incapable of sustaining relationships like heterosexuals? What a load of shit! I'm so glad we're still making progress. Stay Strong! And thanks for your excellent show!
@Matt Baume, this was a great video, and I remember watching "The Mary Tyler Moore Show" when I was younger, and do not recall this episode. Thanks for this.
I've only recently started watching The Mary Tyler Moore Show and I feel like a lot of the situations are timeless. The joke about Phyllis being relieved at the explanation of why he has no interest in dating Rhoda would work just as well today!
More significant is the self-confessed murderer, Laurence Luckinbill, starred in Boys in the Band, uncle of The Matrix creators, Lucy's son-in-law & married father of 5.
I was happy to see a new episode of culture cruise! I like the Mary Tyler Moore show and haven't seen it in a long time. I am probably due for a serious re-watch. Thanks for bringing this up. I had no idea there was an episode like this. Even though the moment was brief in the episode it did make a point especially for that time. Best, Marvin 😀
I am 57 years old and watching this made me realize that I grew up in a very gay-friendly bubble! I lived in a suburb of Chicago, went to a big high school, where I think the attitude towards gay teachers was "don't ask don't tell" long before that was a thing. Chicago is super gay-friendly, something I didn't realized until I moved away. It was weird watching this video and hearing that those were the attitudes that were around. Granted I was 12 when this was on, and I am sure I watched it, and got the joke that Phyllis would rather have a gay brother than him dating Rhoda. Just weird to realize that homosexuality was still illegal in so many states at that time. I guess because I had a gay uncle, my step-grandmother's brother was gay, I had teachers who were quietly open, I just never really thought about it. Happy our world has changed, still has a lot of changes to happen. Thanks Matt for your cool and insightful videos!!
My God, as soon as I get my paycheck I'm funding you. Every morning I watch one of your videos on my way to work. Filled with a sense of comfort in knowing I'm not alone
You should review the Friends episode where Ross’s ex wife and her partner got married. Friends may’ve been the first popular tv show to show a lesbian couple get married and raise a child together. Which makes since as Friends co-creator David Crane is openly gay.
I remember chatting with my mother back when that episode was coming up, talkin about the fact that so many people were complaining on a religious basis that they were going to boycott the episode. Quoth my mother, a Christian, " What I don't get is, if these people's 'Christian' values are so offended by a gay wedding, why are they watching a show in which every single week, one of the characters sleeps with another person they're not married to? And now, when one of them wants to actually *make a commitment* and get *married*, NOW is when they're going to have a fit?" 🙄🤣
I was in my twenties in the '70s, and gay life was much more open and accepted than you seem to understand. We partied at the bars and everywhere else, and never felt threatened through the course of it all. Sure, today there is a greater awareness of the LGBTQ Community. That I agree on. Note: Above I was describing life in Lansing, Michigan.
I came out of the closet in the summer of 1976 (I was 24). This was Los Angeles. Like you in Lansing, I never felt threaten. My friends/coworkers/bosses couldn't care less. The late 70's truly was the best time of my life. What an adventure!
@@spiff8862 Except for that whole AIDS thing, which would kill the actor playing Ben & countless others. Congratulations on your safe islands, meanwhile in reality hate crimes occur every day, even in countries were homosexuality isn't criminalised.
I was too, but really the reason you remember it as fun was because you were in your 20s. I lost my job at a college because I was a Lesbian, my wife was threaten by her boss for the same reason. What changed was AIDS and the effort to get equal rights, because people were denied rights, and beaten up, and stung in the park, than put in mental institutions, and denied housing, and murdered. And the police often did little, usually did little.
Great upload; it's important to gay history these golden moments in popular cultural history are memorialised, doesn't hurt to remind things weren't always as they are now in the 21st century - thank you for your great work.
Thank you so much for digging up these amazing bits of gay media history that might have either been forgotten by one generation or were never known by another. It's also a reminder, when looking at history in retrospect, that the 70s were the decade when everything started to swing the right way in terms of social issues only to have all of that wrecked in the 80s.
The 1980's began with ronald reagan being elected president and then 1 month later John Lennon being killed. Somebody or something was giving a not so subtle hint as to which side would be winning and which side would be losing during that horrible decade
Civil Rights grew post-WWII & UDHR, Mattachine movement existed pre-Gay Lib, Stonewall was '69. '70's was Disco & Pride, '80's became AIDS & living (& dying) in fear. Ben died in the '80's. AZT cocktail announced in '96, things changed again.
Yes, such a weird situation! There was a general pull-back on gay characters in 1983 for some reason -- I believe there were 2 series that were announced as having gay characters, and neither one made it to air.
I love this show so much because I was a kid and lived in Minneapolis when this show started so whenever I see the opening credits it reminds me of Minneapolis when I was a kid.
its not what you normally cover, but there is a 1997 movie called Bent that shows a history people like to ignore. How LGBT people were treated in WW2 europe and got shipped to concentration camps also. Even if you dont review it i think you would enjoy seeing the side of WW2 that never gets shown when through a straight prospective because even after WW2 they were still imprisoned and considered a group that "deserved it"
1st camp opened in 1934, initially for ANYONE who deviated from the Nazi "norm" or were opposition - gypsies, priests, we got the pink triangles, yellow & mass murders were later.
Ironically, six years later, an episode of the Mary Tyler Moore spinoff "Lou Grant" (which was actually an hour long dramatic series about her at that point former boss working in LA on a newspaper) also did a gay episode, but it was kind of in the typical way shows did them back then. The episode is called Cop and was the season 3 premiere. You can actually watch it on Hulu.
I love this series of sorts you have of gay moments in TV/movies. I'd love to see an episode on the complicated messages of Chasing Amy or on the show Survivor (perhaps just the first season regarding Richard Hatch and some of the homophobia surrounding him & his win).
Like this episode, it lampooned her self-absorption, the chorus boys doing a big production number finishing with "It sure isn't you!" & Phyllis scowling @ the camera.
Jeff, I just found your site about a week ago and as a pop culture nerd I'm having a great time viewing your vids and strolling back through memory lane. Please keep up the great work! Not sure if it was noted in the comments, but another interesting thing about this particular episode is that actor Robert Moore who played Phyllis's brother was gay in real life, as was Dick Clair who co-wrote this episode. No doubt their life experience helped make the episode as great as it was/is. On a side note, have you ever addressed Solly and Mae from the 1984 cult classic "Angel"? If you have, I'm sure I'll find it, but if you haven't, you might find them worth some consideration!
I love this in-depth analysis because I've so often wondered what gay people thought about these old-school attempts to broach what was then a taboo subject, but I never wanted to be that guy who says to a friend, "Hey, you're gay. What'd you think about how Hill Street Blues handled the topic?" Because tone-deaf.
Very interesting gay reviews of TV shows. Mary was in the 1970's and you look kind of young, did you watch them on video? When I was 7 my family was watching MTM on Saturday nights then Bob Newhart (and Carol Burnett). I do remember so controversial characters on shows, especially the ones of All in the Family with the character Beverly. Thanks for the positive memories.
Matt, I've been a fan of yours for a while-- which is why I can't believe I just accidentally found the analysis you did on the Golden Girls "Isn't It Romantic?" episode back in Sept/2015. I actually wrote that episode. I enjoyed your comments and nice words. One secret though-- they didn't use ice cream in the "ice cream clown Sundaes." They used mashed potatoes. Thanks! Jeffrey Duteil
Oh my goodness what an honor to hear from you! Thanks so much for writing that lovely episode. Glad to hear the ice cream wasn't in any danger of melting!
💖💖💖 sooo happy y’all got to do an interview together!! youu guys are both very talented :)
Fantastic job. Thank you for this coverage.
I think that's normally how they do it, right? At least that's what I've heard. Lol
I remember that episode. I was sitting on my Grandmas lap, eating ice cream. My Grandparents just laughed. She gave me a big squeeze and smiled at me. She knew. I told her in the later years as I got older that I wanted to be like mary. Go to the city, get a job, have a car and have a cool life. She told me it was a great idea. I did. It was. Thank you Mary and all the Merry men and women along the way.
Thanks for a wonderful post.
It sounds like you had a wonderful grandma.
@@prestonbruchmiller497 I still think of her daily.
I love this post
Grandmothers like yours deserve the world!
The punchline was that she preferred him to be gay rather than dating Rhoda
@a hellenic pagan (great UA-cam user name, by the way!), from what I remember of the character of Phyllis (truly, Cloris Leachman was comedic gold!), she would rather her brother be a Gay Man than date the bane of her existence, Rhoda!
And heavens forbid being her sister in-law
@a hellenic pagan I heard THAT!
Well, yeah. When compared to the idea of him marrying Rhoda, his being gay is not anything to be upset about. That's the point Matt made.
But not to take away from how everyone treated him, and that he was allowed to be himself and not the typical stereotype gay of the day. Yes, that's the joke, but Phyllis still accepted him and loved him, and he was allowed to fit right in. Rhoda herself made no judgements and liked hanging with him.
The backstory to this episode is as awesome as the show itself. The actress who plays Rhoda, Valerie Harper, has said that the final scene-where she gives her “He’s gay” line-is her proudest professional moment. (Apparently it was the first time “gay” was used on an American TV show referring to homosexuality.) It also got the biggest laugh of any Mary Tyler Moore epsidoe… apparently it took upwards of a minute for the studio audience’s laughter and cheering to die down! They ended up having to cut most of the audience response out of the final broadcast edit since their reaction to the joke was so uproarious and long.
Bret Abel they had a gay character in All in the Family in the fifth episode, from February 1971.
@a hellenic pagan, thank you so much for this backstory to this scene. Frankly, I have always loved Valerie Harper, not only as an actor, but energetically, as well. I know that both Mary Richards and Mary Tyler Moore "could turn the world on with a smile," but Valerie Harper always did a great job of making ME smile, with her performances, especially as "Rhoda." And yes, I do recall watching "Rhoda" when I was younger, too, and LOVED iT! Oh, dear; I have a feeling I AM going to start watching another show; funny, how all the situation comedies I watch have been off the air for several years: "Frasier," "The Jeffersons," etc.
Bret Abel it didn't get the biggest laugh!
Bret Abel WONDERFUL WONDERFUL!!! THANK YOU!! :-)🎵
Love knowing this
Another thing that's significant about this episode is that Ben is a totally "normal" guy. He has a job, a home, a sister, he's willing to go out with a friend, he's nice, he can laugh, and hang out with people, he cares enough about Phyllis to not yell at her and storm out, he is a successful musician, he came out to Rhoda at some point so he's not closeted, Rhoda liked him as a friend, he is not a stereotype, he doesn't seem depressed or filled with self hate. I do really think this is an amazing episode, and I remember when I saw the first run - I was so pumped by it, as a gay person myself. This was the most watched show on TV in its time slot, 10s of millions of people watched it, and suddenly they were in the position to think things like, huh, I wonder if my single cousin is gay. He's kind of like Ben....
I was born in 74. I grew up knowing a gay couple. My parents made certain that Henry and Ray were no big deal to my brother or me. I was heart broken when only Ray came to my wedding in 96. My Dad explained that Henry’s work still didn’t know and they were concerned someone would find out at his work.
He worked at the bank in the small town my mother was from, so much of our family on her side was still from there. I was instantly relieved that they decided not to come together when one of my cousins made a slur and said if any from the Navy came, they would beat them up. (My groom was Navy.) I would have been horrified if they had tried to hurt Henry or Ray. They were some of the most genuinely sweet people I knew. They’ve passed away since then. I wish they’d lived long enough to see marriage equality.
Imzadde You and your parents are wonderful people. ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Surprised you didn't have the cousin beaten up. They joked about the groom getting beat up and should have felt the fists themself.
Oh my god WHAT? I've lived in Minnesota my entire life and had no idea we never technically decriminalized homosexuality. That's kind of insane. And the fact that the last time it was enforced was in this century is mind boggling to me. So... thanks for that lesson I guess?
It's wild, but a lot of states still have those laws on the books!
They aren't really enforceable since Lawrence v. Texas though. Still, it would be a nice symbolic gesture to repeal it, but I don't know how amenable Minnesotans at large are to that.
Skippy the Magnificent I’d like to think Minnesotans would be up for that but then again Michele Bachman was in office here soooo 🤷🏼♀️
Alexa Renae Wow! I just celebrated 25 years in Minneapolis and I never knew this 'law' existed. With 12.5% of Minneapolis LGBTQ they'd have to build a lot more jails to contain all of us.
Alexa Renae Voters here did pass gay marriage!
Isn't the joke that Phyllis hates Rhoda so much that as long as he's not with her she'd be fine?
I remember this being huge for me back then. I was a teenager at the time and I still remember the subject of homosexuality being brought up in my high school psychology class. The outpouring of homophobia was unbelievable although for the time it was perfectly acceptable and I had to sit there and take it. So, this one episode of MTM was a treasure for me (and at least one other friend of mine who, like me, was not out at the time...even to me). At the time (1973) the only glimmer of positive depictions of being gay for me was in rock...glam rock, actually. But even then it was done as a way to shock the fans, to be noticed and not so much to inspire any solidarity. Most of the people doing glam were straight and since having long hair was pretty much acceptable, wearing make up and being flamboyant was more dangerous and thusly, more rock and roll. Glam gave me something to grab on to as a teenage gay boy...but this episode of MTM gave me something more. It showed me that being gay didn't necessarily mean I had to move to New York and walk on the wild side, I could be just that guy playing his dog food commercial music with the girls. Thanks, Mary....and thanks Matt for this video!
What did they say?
I remember one of the questions the teacher asked the class was "can homosexuals love?"....Well, the answer was a resounding "no". Beyond that any more discussion was peppered with homophobic slurs and the usual acceptable amounts of hate that teenagers in the mid 70s were allowed.
Wow. Couldn't love. That's a sobering reminder of what it was like and the distance we've travelled.
Brent Braniff Beautiful Brent! :-)
rhyfeddu AMEN Rhy!! :-) :-)
One of my favorite episodes... As a gay man the entire 2 years I lived in Minneapolis I pretended I was Mary... even tho in reality I'm the Rhoda.
Being Rhoda is not a bad thing! She is my favorite character on this show. I would love to have a friend like Rhoda.
No not a bad thing at all! I mean I am a NY jew so... haha
We're all secretly Rhoda. Except for the few Phyllises.
@@334578x Everybody needs a Rhoda in their life. She comes in , says something funny and then she's gone
I did not like Rhoda or Mary but liked Phyilis and her dumb daughter😲😴😆!
It’s a wonderful episode. The punchline isn’t that Phyllis is weird, it’s more that she would rather have her brother be gay (with all of the negative views of that in 1973) than have him marry Rhoda. According to the producers, the actor who played Ben was gay in real life and had no problem playing the role. Actors still say the industry is homophobic today and I can’t imagine what it would have been like back then. When they were shooting the MTM pilot, the test audience thought Rhoda was unlikeable so the script supervisor suggested that Phylis’s’ daughter say that she liked Rhoda. The audience then would think that if a child liked Rhoda, she must be okay. It worked. By the time the Brother’s Keeper episode came along, audiences loved Rhoda and I think her liking Ben had a similar effect. “If Rhoda likes Ben, he must be okay.” Great video once again!
From Nigeria I say thank you Matt Baume🌼
Hang on. Things will get better there soon.
It's nothing specific. It's just their overall position on gay rights. Homosexuality is punished by Life Imprisonment in the South and Death in the North.
Tyler Hill it's actually 14years jail term in the South and yes death sentence in the North, to a great extent, even advocacy for lgbt rights is considered an offense as well, thankfully, there are nascent underground organizations of activists all working for a change, still a long road ahead, but we're hopeful.
Thanks for talking about this episode. I grew up watching MTM with my siblings (I was 9 when this ep first ran) and I love the way they wrote this. I agree that Phyllis's relief that her dear brother is NOT into Rhoda is the intended joke. This was decades ahead of its time.
My favorite part is the little tag scene around the piano. So strenuously non-dramatic and loving. And Mary's little smile at the scene is an enormous gesture in this context. Mary approved is a bfd. All without a word or Afterschool Big Speech.
Like when she acknowledges to her parents their 30-something daughter is on the pill & has all-night dates.
Yep I saw it ! We watched MTM every week ! I loved He beauty, her style, her kindness to all , her apartment, her friends ! A woman in the early 70s in TV journalism in her own TV series wasn’t common at ALL ! I wanted to be her. To throw MY hat in the air and proclaim myself as a professional woman in charge of her own destiny ! 💪🏻
I think she's relieved because this means Rhoda wont end up with Ben.
I thought the joke was Phyllis was happy her brothers gay so that he wouldn't be dating Rhoda
@@DavidEFarner Most of us want to be Mary but are really Rhoda which is still much better than being Phylllis. The 2 oldest actresses on the show Betty White and Cloris Leachman are the only two that still remain. God or Budha or someone bless Valerie Harper,the real deal!
I justed watched this clip yesterday not knowing that Valerie Harper died that day.
RIP Valerie Harper. Thanks for the laughs.
Back in 2001 while on holiday in the United States, I bought a VHS Box Set from Virgin Records in Times Square called Mary Tyler Moore - Party Girl. It featured four episodes from the show, highlighting Mary Richards' party disasters.
Growing up, I had only watched the series on and off. But to my surprise and delight, My Brother''s Keeper was one of the episodes included.
It was a keeper, indeed.
Thank you for recapping this groundbreaking episode from the history of mainstream television.
It was groundbreaking for many reasons, like a single career woman who is independent, but this was one of the most amazing episodes.......however my #1 would be the Chuckles the Clown funeral....pure comic gold
Esp. when it's judgy Mary who loses it!
Rest In Peace Rhoda! We love and will forever miss your smile, humour and wit. Thanks for all the laughs. 🙏🏻❤️🙋🏼♂️
MTM is my fav show of all time. I was 14 in 1973, my parents and I watched MTM and all the other ground-breaking shows on television all throughout the 70s. I remember this episode and it was great to see Phyllis get another little dig, especially having the 'news' broken to her by her nemesis, Rhoda. To us, watching...it was simply a fact of life and it wasn't a 'big deal'..it was indeed a big deal re: network television, but to us it was just another great show and we were pretty okay with much of the changes going on in the era. Some changes, no...even I still say SOME changes were not made for the best, but this...culturally...very significant but not significant to those of us who do not believe in labels, division, identity politics. So he was gay? He was a nice guy. Like many a nice gay guy - including my cousin - I have known in my lifetime.
MARY was so ahead of her time...and the show thank you for posting!
i remember watching this as a teenager in 1973. it was powerful and life-affirming to me at the time.
Thank you Matt - I was hoping you'd do a video on that program. The first time I saw it, I laughed my ass off when Rhoda said, "He's gay". Totally unexpected. But the show ended positively, and Phyillis doesn't display any less affection for him after he's outed. On a side note, the actor who played her brother was openly gay in real life.
@Merchant2, thank you for the note of trivia about Robert Moore; I love the fact that he is a fellow Robert (my first name is Robert) who is also an openly Gay Man.
Personally, I shall not deny that I prefer LGBTQIA+ actors portraying LGBTQIA+ characters, but I shall also refrain from denying that a talented actor, straight or not, is a talented actor.
@@RobertAlvarezThePsychicWitch Sexuality of an actor is like the old joke, "Gay? Or just British?" Gays have been playing straight on screen for a century, kinda late to get upset - shouldn't colour-blind casting work both ways? Neither Valerie Harper or Nancy Walker were Jewish, but could they have found 2 finer Morgensterns? Conversely, should Lauren Bacall or Paul Newman not be allowed to play WASPs?
@@unowen-nh9ov I had never heard the old joke, "Gay? Or just British?" before today, and I find it so funny! Especially as it seems as though that enchanted place across the pond seems incapable of producing bad actors.
I honestly had no idea that neither Valerie Harper nor Nancy Walker were not Jewish, which goes to show how well they portrayed their respective roles, and I must admit, I had not thought about the late and great Nancy Walker in far too long.
And, I can honestly say I do not recall ever thinking about the respective ethnic backgrounds of neither Ms. Bacall nor Mr. Newman.
What a great reply from you. Thank you.
@@RobertAlvarezThePsychicWitch Matt Boner was criticized recently for playing a trans role, but I really hope to see it someday because I think he's talented & want to see what he did with it. I've never looked to a movie for representation & am old & biased enough I want casting to be on talent, casting by type or representation forces all movies to become documentaries, & I think we all know autobiography can be the biggest friction of all. I know identity politics is important, but it can be just as hazardous to make it our only identity (as politicians use it now to manipulate, dehumanize & diviide us for profit). Obviously this thread shows it provokes a lot of feelings & memories in people, the personal IS political. But today I think of this as a tribute to the actress who gave us Rhoda, her employer & friend who gave us this show & all the wonderful talents they worked with on both sides of the camera. Thanks, MTM! In all its guises.
Bomer. Boner is either spell check or a Freudian slip!
Oh how the world has changed. I'm just 51 years we went from "they don't want a monogamous relationship" to "they want all the monogamous relationships only for them selves" still wrong but... 😂 😂 😂... Progress? Maybe in another 50 years someone will get them the message that being gay is literally no different than being straight.
Heh, yeah, I can't even imagine how many mental gymnastics people have had to do to rationalize their prejudice over just the last few decades! But thinking about what TV was like when this episode came out, it's clear that a LOT has changed.
Matt Baume I was raised on Norman Lear shows and Mary Tyler Moore, Rhoda ect. So I really want to say thank you for the nostalgia bombs, I'm loving them. I am proud that most of my favorites are standing the test of time in their attempt to educate the world about" the gays". I'm sorry. I love that phrase. It's so silly. People put "the" in front of everything they don't understand.
when someone says "they" or "them" you know it's coming from ignorance.
@Brie Stoll, indeed, I also watched a lot of Norman Lear shows growing up, so these nostalgic visits are wonderful for me, too.
Well no, it is different. It's just that it's only really different in one way - who one is schtupping. Which I suppose falls under the dictum of "a difference which makes no difference is no difference." So I guess you're right after all. :)
I read somewhere that Robert Moore, who played Phyllis's brother, Ben, back in the day directed the original version of The Boys In The Band for Broadway.
How cool is that.
Very!
I'm so thrilled to discover your channel, which is covering all the shows I grew up with and helping me understand how they may have shaped who I am. Our house was a devoted CBS house, and as a Jewish north Jersey girl born in '66 I was raised on Norman Lear and MTM. I think this must have been one of if not THE first gay character I ever saw on tv. Rhoda's "he's gay!" line is burned into my head like our first phone number. It surely normalized it to some degree for me, even if it was also the focus instead of being not big deal. But it is truly these small acts of courage and vision that together can bend towards justice.
Dearest Matt, as a gay man who came out in 1982, yr vids make me laugh(& cry) in the most wonderful way! Thank you! Many hugs always ernie ☺💝🎶
It's interesting how fiction can accomplish things that fact cannot. No amount of documentary footage of gay men at the time could break through people's prejudices the way that shows like this could, and I think that's because of the viewpoint of the regular characters. We know them already, we like them (or we wouldn't be watching), and thus it's like being told something by a friend rather than some detached source - it engages our trust. Crap like homophobia gets best chipped away when the chipper is someone we trust; it feels like persuasion instead of force, such as the imposition of laws might feel. Human heads have such interesting insides!
As an All in the Family episode showed, often the issue was actually about passing, Archie's macho jock friend had to out himself. Just as decades earlier Hollywood did movies about Negroes & Jews "passing" for "normal".
I've been slowly watching the Mary Tyler Moore Show and got to this episode recently. Went flying blind and was so pleasantly suprised. The epilogue is so sweet and so wonderful, to see a sister embrace her brother that way as she approached the piano with him, and Cloris Leachman plays it so tenderly. I was moved to tears at the end.
One of the first gay characters I was exposed to was Jack on Dawson’s Creek. I’d love to see your take on him.
I’m 64 so remember this time. MTM was brilliant. Great video❤️
In 1972 ABC aired THAT CERTAIN SUMMER with Hal Holbrook, Martin Sheen, Hope Lange and Emmy winner Scott Jacoby. A remarkable film that presented the topic of homosexuality very sympathetically. And it still holds up very well today.
Love the video, Matt, and thanks for sharing it with us. There is one unintended lesson here that most gay and lesbian people have had to learn and that's the differing degrees of what our friends and family find acceptable. In relation to Phyllis being grateful her brother is gay instead of in love with Rhoda, most of us have had to come to the realization that being gay places us on a ratings scale of what's acceptable and what's not. A lot of us have been excluded from family gatherings and celebrations because we're gay, yet adulterers, liars, gossip mongers, drunks, etc. are perfectly acceptable and welcomed with open arms. As a contrast, toss in a sudden tragedy or terminal illness, and suddenly we drop on the scale to "more accepted" because our help is needed. Once the issue is resolved we're usually elevated once again to the top of the scale and regain our unacceptable status. No doubt, if this episode were based on a real story, we would find that after a week or two, Phyllis would not be so welcoming, loving, and accepting.
I remember when this episode first aired. We watched it as a family as part of our regular Saturday night thing. I was pretty naive at the time and didn't understand the joke... My mom and sister had to explain it to me. I ended up feeling uncomfortable about it. If ten year old me had only understood what the word would mean for me. *smile*
thank you!!! i've wanted this episode to get culture cruise treatment for a looong time, and this is just perfect. personally, interpreted phyllis's relief as once again picking at how much she dislikes rhoda (which is a reoccuring theme in the show), but nonetheless, i remember seeing this episode after buying the series on DVD and being shocked. i don't know why i love the mary tyler moore show so much. i'm young, a lesbian, and never grew up watching it. it's not particularly remarkable, just a good sitcom that prominently featured women before that was an established trope. but it's episodes like these that were handled with such care for 1973 that make me love the show!
I was a "tween" when this series aired, and there's a lot in them that's hard to parse or undetectable to younger people who no longer have the cultural references. Just watching Mary navigate her day in the workplace was major, as the idea of a woman in her job was revolutionary in itself. It's like Uhura on _Star Trek;_ she may look like "just a switchboard operator" to younger eyes, but she was a beacon to women in the 60's just because she was _there._ (Not to mention black people.) Context often carries a lot of the meaning in entertainment like this.
Serai3 it's certainly one of the reasons i began watching the show! i may not fully be able to comprehend what it was like at the time to see an independent career woman like mary richards on tv, but i do feel like the show is, if nothing else, a good example to younger viewers such as myself the barriers that women still faced culturally and professionally in the early seventies. i know some situations were most likely exaggerated for effect, but you can still feel the undercurrent of just how mary is the "exception" in a male-dominated workplace rather than the rule, how mr. grant can be condescending to her despite being considered a softie in the series, and just in general how she is treated more as a secretary than a fellow employee of equal standing (although, technically, she was considered "management" in comparison to murray or gordie.) it was in the seventies that my grandmother was told she needed her husband's permission to open a savings account at a bank! when that feels hard to believe, or when older women speak of the influence of shows such as this, having such a cultural touchstone of a show (and a genuinely funny and inspiring one at that) is so very helpful and enjoyable :-)
It's not that I think you can't comprehend it, no! It's that the show is filled with little signifiers that have to do with the time it was created that would just be meaningless to anyone who wasn't around then. I watch movies from the 30's and I'm sure there's a ton of stuff in there that I'm not getting, from jokes to set decor, simply because I was born in the 60's. (Hell, there are things in Monty Python that I feel must be jokes, but I can't be sure because I have no context!) I'm very glad the difficulties of Mary's position come across to you, though, and that you find her inspiring. I was fascinated by the idea that a woman could live alone and be happy and successful at all, as the culture in the early 70's certainly didn't offer that as a general option. :)
I was 12 when the show debuted & have always referred to it as my Intro. to Secular Humanism .101. The network wouldn't allow the lead to be divorced so Mary became single, Rhoda being Jewish was an issue (a later episode Mary dumps a bigoted friend by claiming to be Jewish). The show was criticized for not being feminist, but not only did it deal with social, political, economic & human rights issues on screen, many women were hired to write, it was MTM's studio & show & she directed an episode.
Great job, Matt. You had better believe that Valerie Harper had something to do with how this amazing episode panned out. Do you know that she is the first big star to give an interview to The Advocate?
I think I read or saw an interview with MTM where she said the writers and she wanted Murray to be the first gay character to regularly appear on a sitcom. It would have made a lot of sense, but the producers wouldn't hear of it.
I'm glad you posted this. But please remember, back in 1973, we knew that some folks were gay. We didn't talk about it because we nose into other people's business. Giants like Paul Lynde told jokes that got laughed at because they were funny. We didn't care that he was gay. Everyone knew it! We loved him just the same because that's the way things were back then.
Valerie Harper said it was one of the proudest moments of her career. God bless her
I thought Phyllis was 'relieved' because Ben was gay and was not going to marry Rhoda, so I thought the joke was on Rhoda.
Everyone but Matt seems to get the joke.
But Rhoda got a hug from Phyllis out of the deal!
@@yakkyjoe1
> Everyone but Matt seems to get the joke.
What do you mean? He says this in so many words.
4:20
"But I don’t think that’s what’s actually going on -- the joke is more that Phyllis just worked herself up into a frenzy for what turned out to be no reason at all. Despite all her dramatics, there was a totally reasonable explanation for what was happening that she was simply too wrapped up in herself to consider. In other words, Phyllis is the punchline, not Ben. Her ignorance is the joke. Not his sexuality."
This is one of the most entertaining, and affirming channels on UA-cam. I am such a fan!
You should do the episode "George" of MASH which in 1974 deals remarkably well with the issue of gay military men
Fun Fact: the actor that played Ben was gay in real life. Before taking the role, he had multiple conversations with the production and writing teams to ensure the script was solid and that, in no way, would homosexuality be the butt of the joke. He also went on to direct several episodes of the spin-off, 'Rhoda."
R.I.P. Rhoda, much respect and love.
Thank you for doing an episode on this! I really love this episode of the show.
AWESOME episode! I've been binging the MTM Show and I wondered what it must have been like for this episode to air when it did. I really appreciate your putting perspective on it. Illegal? Incapable of sustaining relationships like heterosexuals? What a load of shit! I'm so glad we're still making progress. Stay Strong! And thanks for your excellent show!
Technically, they didn't say all gays are incapable, just '' The Average'', but they were alluding to mean all!
@Matt Baume, this was a great video, and I remember watching "The Mary Tyler Moore Show" when I was younger, and do not recall this episode. Thanks for this.
I've only recently started watching The Mary Tyler Moore Show and I feel like a lot of the situations are timeless. The joke about Phyllis being relieved at the explanation of why he has no interest in dating Rhoda would work just as well today!
so well explained. Great episode, Matt!
Ironic choice to show that "Dan August" clip. The blonde actor is Monte Markham, who played Blanche's gay brother on The Golden Girls.
Good Catch! ....
More significant is the self-confessed murderer, Laurence Luckinbill, starred in Boys in the Band, uncle of The Matrix creators, Lucy's son-in-law & married father of 5.
I was happy to see a new episode of culture cruise! I like the Mary Tyler Moore show and haven't seen it in a long time. I am probably due for a serious re-watch. Thanks for bringing this up. I had no idea there was an episode like this. Even though the moment was brief in the episode it did make a point especially for that time. Best, Marvin 😀
Matt: I love your content and so glad you touched upon this particular episode of MTM. Keep up the great work. :)
I am 57 years old and watching this made me realize that I grew up in a very gay-friendly bubble! I lived in a suburb of Chicago, went to a big high school, where I think the attitude towards gay teachers was "don't ask don't tell" long before that was a thing. Chicago is super gay-friendly, something I didn't realized until I moved away. It was weird watching this video and hearing that those were the attitudes that were around. Granted I was 12 when this was on, and I am sure I watched it, and got the joke that Phyllis would rather have a gay brother than him dating Rhoda. Just weird to realize that homosexuality was still illegal in so many states at that time. I guess because I had a gay uncle, my step-grandmother's brother was gay, I had teachers who were quietly open, I just never really thought about it. Happy our world has changed, still has a lot of changes to happen.
Thanks Matt for your cool and insightful videos!!
I love ❤️ Cloris Leachman!
Thanks for captioning your videos.
As always, you look great in that sailor suit ;P And Cloris Leachman
My God, as soon as I get my paycheck I'm funding you.
Every morning I watch one of your videos on my way to work.
Filled with a sense of comfort in knowing I'm not alone
Wonderful story! I am old enough to remember when the MTM show was on tv, and to appreciate the significance of this particular episode.
This is why I love your channel!
RIP Ms Harper 💔
You should review the Friends episode where Ross’s ex wife and her partner got married. Friends may’ve been the first popular tv show to show a lesbian couple get married and raise a child together. Which makes since as Friends co-creator David Crane is openly gay.
I remember chatting with my mother back when that episode was coming up, talkin about the fact that so many people were complaining on a religious basis that they were going to boycott the episode. Quoth my mother, a Christian, " What I don't get is, if these people's 'Christian' values are so offended by a gay wedding, why are they watching a show in which every single week, one of the characters sleeps with another person they're not married to? And now, when one of them wants to actually *make a commitment* and get *married*, NOW is when they're going to have a fit?" 🙄🤣
@@tejaswoman Many of these so called "christians" are that way because they are bitter and alone and probably have not had sex in a real long time
@@charlesritt5088 Ourold high school joke was,"She's got a date with the Lord!"
I was in my twenties in the '70s, and gay life was much more open and accepted than you seem to understand. We partied at the bars and everywhere else, and never felt threatened through the course of it all. Sure, today there is a greater awareness of the LGBTQ Community. That I agree on.
Note: Above I was describing life in Lansing, Michigan.
I came out of the closet in the summer of 1976 (I was 24). This was Los Angeles. Like you in Lansing, I never felt threaten. My friends/coworkers/bosses couldn't care less.
The late 70's truly was the best time of my life.
What an adventure!
@@spiff8862 Except for that whole AIDS thing, which would kill the actor playing Ben & countless others. Congratulations on your safe islands, meanwhile in reality hate crimes occur every day, even in countries were homosexuality isn't criminalised.
I was too, but really the reason you remember it as fun was because you were in your 20s. I lost my job at a college because I was a Lesbian, my wife was threaten by her boss for the same reason. What changed was AIDS and the effort to get equal rights, because people were denied rights, and beaten up, and stung in the park, than put in mental institutions, and denied housing, and murdered. And the police often did little, usually did little.
Great upload; it's important to gay history these golden moments in popular cultural history are memorialised, doesn't hurt to remind things weren't always as they are now in the 21st century - thank you for your great work.
I remember seeing this as a kid back in the Seventies! Great episode. Loved Rhoda and Phyllis.
Thank you so much for digging up these amazing bits of gay media history that might have either been forgotten by one generation or were never known by another. It's also a reminder, when looking at history in retrospect, that the 70s were the decade when everything started to swing the right way in terms of social issues only to have all of that wrecked in the 80s.
The 1980's began with ronald reagan being elected president and then 1 month later John Lennon being killed. Somebody or something was giving a not so subtle hint as to which side would be winning and which side would be losing during that horrible decade
Civil Rights grew post-WWII & UDHR, Mattachine movement existed pre-Gay Lib, Stonewall was '69. '70's was Disco & Pride, '80's became AIDS & living (& dying) in fear. Ben died in the '80's. AZT cocktail announced in '96, things changed again.
As always, great episode!!
Hey Matt, remember the character Munroe from Too Close For Comfort (TV Series 1980-87)
I really enjoy these videos and I'm glad to learn more while watching them.
Jerry here,
I tried watching that Mike Wallace report on homosexuals. It's here on UA-cam. I can't. I just can't. It's wretched.
Awesome program, very intelligent, sincere and educational.
Wow. By the time I watched it, it was in reruns, but I really loved that show. It's great to see that it held up so nicely.
Terrific video, Matt Baume!
As a young gay man in the 90’s watching Nick at Nite, MTM was my number one. This episode is one of my faves.
I'm really into television and all of it's different phases and you do a great job breaking down how the networks treated homosexuality.
What an amazing video! I had been totally unaware of this early portrayal of a positive gay character in a sitcom.
I'm in a happy marriage and my husband's family treats me as one of them. It's wonderful to see how the freedom and equality I enjoy today began.
All because of Rhoda.
I'm watching this very sad, realizing Valerie Harper has just died.
This is a fantastic UA-cam Channel. Enjoying your content and sharing with friends.
1973: I was hitting the biggest gay club in Dallas--the Bayou Landing! Gloria Gaynor et. al.
Matt, your videos are so clever and insightful and I really enjoy watching them 🙂
I’d love to see an analysis of Steven Carrington on Dynasty, who was gay and then not gay then gay again... depending on which actor played him.
Yes, such a weird situation! There was a general pull-back on gay characters in 1983 for some reason -- I believe there were 2 series that were announced as having gay characters, and neither one made it to air.
I love this show so much because I was a kid and lived in Minneapolis when this show started so whenever I see the opening credits it reminds me of Minneapolis when I was a kid.
I love Mary Tyler Moore. I can't believe they had this episode! That's so good
its not what you normally cover, but there is a 1997 movie called Bent that shows a history people like to ignore. How LGBT people were treated in WW2 europe and got shipped to concentration camps also. Even if you dont review it i think you would enjoy seeing the side of WW2 that never gets shown when through a straight prospective because even after WW2 they were still imprisoned and considered a group that "deserved it"
1st camp opened in 1934, initially for ANYONE who deviated from the Nazi "norm" or were opposition - gypsies, priests, we got the pink triangles, yellow & mass murders were later.
Ironically, six years later, an episode of the Mary Tyler Moore spinoff "Lou Grant" (which was actually an hour long dramatic series about her at that point former boss working in LA on a newspaper) also did a gay episode, but it was kind of in the typical way shows did them back then. The episode is called Cop and was the season 3 premiere. You can actually watch it on Hulu.
I love this series of sorts you have of gay moments in TV/movies. I'd love to see an episode on the complicated messages of Chasing Amy or on the show Survivor (perhaps just the first season regarding Richard Hatch and some of the homophobia surrounding him & his win).
Awesome Historical Context and Commentary. Thank you.
Watched episode when first aired, I did not think it was a big deal at the time.
Phyllis went on to have her own show set in San Francisco with a very gay opening sequence.
Like this episode, it lampooned her self-absorption, the chorus boys doing a big production number finishing with "It sure isn't you!" & Phyllis scowling @ the camera.
Jeff, I just found your site about a week ago and as a pop culture nerd I'm having a great time viewing your vids and strolling back through memory lane. Please keep up the great work! Not sure if it was noted in the comments, but another interesting thing about this particular episode is that actor Robert Moore who played Phyllis's brother was gay in real life, as was Dick Clair who co-wrote this episode. No doubt their life experience helped make the episode as great as it was/is. On a side note, have you ever addressed Solly and Mae from the 1984 cult classic "Angel"? If you have, I'm sure I'll find it, but if you haven't, you might find them worth some consideration!
Actor Robert Moore who played Phyllis's brother died in 1984 of AIDS related pneumonia. He probably was gay in real life.
Just because it was illegal doesnt mean people sgreed with it- it was more accepted than you think, just kept quiet- like illegal marijuana
This is such a great channel!
I love this in-depth analysis because I've so often wondered what gay people thought about these old-school attempts to broach what was then a taboo subject, but I never wanted to be that guy who says to a friend, "Hey, you're gay. What'd you think about how Hill Street Blues handled the topic?" Because tone-deaf.
This made me happy. I always loved the MTM Show.
Great content as always Matt
Well done. Thank you.
Very interesting gay reviews of TV shows. Mary was in the 1970's and you look kind of young, did you watch them on video? When I was 7 my family was watching MTM on Saturday nights then Bob Newhart (and Carol Burnett). I do remember so controversial characters on shows, especially the ones of All in the Family with the character Beverly. Thanks for the positive memories.