Salute to William and Hoop Dreams. had a great time giving my opinion on these two classic basketball stories. He had the opportunity of a lifetime filming this documentary that changed countless lives. For that much respect.
Stunted growth you seem to know a lot of documentaries have you ever seen or heard of the Morningside 5 its similar to hoopdreams aired around the same time except it's a Westcoast version a documentary about there journey back to the state tournament lead by stais boseman ( usc Trojans)( Corey shaffold ) Dwight curry) during the mist of the early 90s L.A. riots
I believe the knee injuries was William biggest issue you can’t improve when you rehabbing every time he made one step forward it seem it was took steps back I understand why he lost that hunger he had more talent than Arthur
William now lives in San Antonio, TX. He's still married to his girlfriend that he had in hoop dreams. His son William Gates Jr played division 1 basketball and I believe he did play for a short time at st.joes under the same coach. I believe William is still a pastor. For the most part he lives a quite comfortable life.
One of the realest quotes I ever heard came outta William's mouth during the movie. *"When you get to the NBA, don't forget about me", and that stuff. Well, I should've said to them, "if I don't make it, don't you forget about me."*
Facts. I tell people that quote all the time. And all those people at St Joe's probably don't even talk to him anymore but they damn sure would have if he made it
William Gates is so damn awesome, he was so real the whole time and put up with so much crap, especially that asshole old coach. They screwed Agee and when Gates faltered they basically gave up on him and slung on him. I had never heard of this movie until the Agee video, so I found it and watched it thanks to you. My favorite part in that movie oddly enough is when Arthur's mom passes the nursing exam with the highest grade in the class of 89, she cried and said so many people told her she couldn't do it, you can't have a soul and not feel for that woman. Cheers.
I blame the head coach at St. Joes Pingatore more than anything as far as why William lost the love for the game. A coach at the amateur level is more than just a coach he is a role model and mentor for the players on his team. Pingatore had no interest in any of his players llves outside the court and saw Arthur, William and others as nothing but pieces of meat to run and jump and win him championships. I remember watching the scene he finds out William has a child he couldn't even fake giving a damn about that. William was just a shiny toy to him and he ran him into the ground.
@@ajwillz5513 They would've been lethal. I always remember that scene where Williams team as St Joes is eliminated from the playoffs and Arthur's team actually went farther. The head coach was looking like a dumbass at Arthur backstage and went up to Arthur like man we should of kept you lol
Couldn't stand that coach. I feel like deep down he didn't even like black men. And he lucked out with Isaiah Thomas and he used that as bragging rights to claim he was a much better coach than he was.
@@DerekT860 He represents the real side of many amateur coaches. They don't give a damn about their black players. It's all about what they can do to help them win. He was only "nice" to Zeke because Zeke made him look good as a coach.
The first time I watched HoopDreams was when I was in summer school at Marshall H.S in 94 and like you explained, I thought the movie was very sad and motivational at the same time and I eventually met both of these men,who are genuinely good people in real life ✌
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
My son is a sophomore in high school. He plays football and is SPECTACULAR at it. Runningback and DB. He’s never seen Hoop Dreams but as I type this I have him watching these 2 videos. My husband takes care of the coaching side while I take care of the classroom portion. They’re always attending camps. My husband tries to make sure he has every chance. We sat him down and told him, “ when you don’t want this anymore please let us know, we won’t be mad and we won’t pressure you”. We do stress letting football get him into college though. We feel even if he decides to not try and make it to the next level he’ll have that college education. We have a total of 5 sons, ALL of whom played football. From tight end, to receiver, to safety, to corner. He’s our youngest and we stress too him, “THIS IS YOUR LIFE“! I wanted him to watch these videos so that he will know, even though it’s a different time, those same things that were important back then still are. So thank you for making these short videos. Hoop Dreams the movie is on Demand so we’re going to sit down and watch it with him soon.
Why would you have him watch these videos and not the actual movie hoop dreams. He can’t learn anything from the videos. But you can learn everything from watching the movie hoop dreams with your son.
@@CREOLEHEAT Yeah she sounded stupid. Got all these sons and putting them on that football Plantation. They played the sport but did it get them anywhere?
If you’re poor inner city youth, the path to at least getting an education is much easier. There’s more people willing to see you succeed and not looking for a financial windfall when you succeed. Most of these young athletes are sponsored by individuals or families to get them out of their environment. These days, that’s about what it takes. You can’t be running the streets with your friends, because it’s so easy to wind up at the wrong place at the wrong time. When you’re poor, like these two were, you have to be sheltered from the chaos around you. Your mom’s financial situation, your dad’s drug problem, your brother’s lifestyle choices can not be on your mind. They had their opportunity, now it’s your turn. Life isn’t fair and you only have small windows of time to make it as a professional athlete.
Can anyone imagine if the coach at ST JOES would have kept Arthur and put him on varsity as a tenth grader. I believe they would have won the state championship together. Let’s not forget Arthur’s team made it to state Final four at Marshall.
Had William not suffered his knee injury, I would agree. But I feel like he may have lost that extra gear as a player, so they probably wouldn't have been as lethal as a duo had Arthur stayed.
Like the late great Luther Bedford said, if Arthur was making the progression they felt he should have been Making on the court, economics would have not kept him from attending Joes. He caught his growth spurt a little too late for Ping’s liking
As a long time high school coach it's incumbent upon us to look out for our players period. I've sent many young men on to play college ball on all levels and the one thing they have all had in common is they want to play! I've had players clearly out of it, glassy eyed and tell me coach I'm good. Fingers bent, ankles swollen, knees hurting all tell me; "I'm Good!" I wish he'd had another coach who cared more about him than making it to state.
His situation was wild getting injured then having a baby in high school but he still made it through. The coach at St. Joe's didn't really give a fuck about him he was viewed as a commodity. Both him and Arthur dealt with alot trauma off the court too.
@@nC_DUKE_ they only value us for our sweat equity we put into the game. We 80% of the league n don't own shit. Chicago bulls even fronted on Jordan after all them chips. They only look at us as thoroughbreds in sports.
This is the very ugly side of basketball. This is why sometimes i feel like i wanna tell my kid to pursue something else but i think he’s got a little bit of too much of me inside of him.
I always felt like the mother low-key pressured him, and his brother, god rest his soul, didn't help him navigate through it, but he seemed to be dealing with depression on his own because of his struggles and looked at William as the remedy, or answer to all his troubles. You could see William's mental deteriorating as time went on and from what the movie showed no one noticed because they wanted him to make so bad. When he was up, everyone was there, but when the strong needed that support... It wasn't looking to well. I think just having someone to talk to that didn't have anything to gain from him would've definitely been good for him. Next video: Jameer Nelson, perhaps?
I've watched the film so many times and read the book, but never got that impression. I feel like his mother just wanted her sons to be safe, happy, and successful in whatever they chose to do. The father, meanwhile...
You should do Howard Nathan next... His team beat Arthur's team in the state tournament and he was one of William's roommates at the Nike Camp... Howard was a four-year starter at Peoria Manuel High School... He played a year at De Paul and had a short stint with the Atlanta Hawks... Howard was also compared to Isiah Thomas in High School... R.I.P. Howard Nathan... 🏀💪🏿
I bought this documentary at a yard sale for 10 cents. I was a senior in HS playing my 3rd year of varsity...not knowing what my future was going to be I hated hoop at that time and didnt want to play college. This documentary gave a lot of answers to a lot of questions. Ended up quitting and focusing on college. I'm an engineer today and Hoop Dreams helped a ton.
I felt bad for William Gates. In the beginning of the Hoop Dreams, William sound so excited and enthusiastic to go to the NBA. By the end of his Senior year, he was beginning to lose his passion for basketball due to the amount of pressure Pingatore gave to him. From pressuring him to come back early from his meniscus injury from his knee, belittling all his mistakes at practice and having the NERVE to encourage him to abandon his girlfriend and baby to focus only on basketball.
It's rough but you bring up a good point about wishing William had the heart that Arthur had. Not trying to be judgemental or cruel. William had pressures on him as a teen that I can't imagine. But it did seem like he just was never 100% commited to basketball. If he never got injured and family was in better financial shape who knows....
He lost his love for the game once it became more like a job. He couldn't handle the pressure & dealing with that knee injury. There was too much pressure from his brother & coach.
I truly believe Gates would have been good enough to make it to the NBA if it wasn't for that knee injury! Hoop Dreams is a legendary classic sports film that will never die!
Honestly it's easier for young black men to become doctors and lawyers than make it to any pro league. But they always sell up dreams as life pursuits. It's either rap, drugs or hoops. Once I woke up to that truth as a former MC I took my ass back to school and my life improved dramatically and I would do it the same if given the opportunity.
In my opinion, if it wasn’t for his continuing injuries in high school, he would be playing professionally in some league. Salute to William and Arthur.
A lot of players in the hood had skills also but never played organized basketball and chose a different path in life man I rooted for both them guys on that movie that was a great documentary 👍🏾🙌🏾
If you watch the hoop dreams dvd with the commentary from william and arthur. William said he faked the knee injury at mcdonalds camp he said everyone was too good and seeing jaylen rose play point at 6'9 he knew he had no chance. His story was sad basketball wise he had the talent knee injuries are no joke the surgeries back then were done poorly and hurt him more than helped him.
Yea those doctors were on some experimental shit back then. Faking an injury is mad soft though. Always thought he lacked the heart Arthur had. Ain't no faking injuries because you scared fam
@@stuntedgrowth isnt that crazy ? Cant believe he admitted that pissed me off because i felt so bad when it happened in the movie to find outit was fake makes me think hes such a sucker for doing that its almost impossible to get that opportunity. Sucker shit smfh
@@stuntedgrowth arthurs response was like wowwww you dirty dog. In his head he prob wanted to swing on him Arthur never would have backed down over a basketball game smfh too good? Clown shit.
@@stuntedgrowth real shit, you already lost before you stepped on the floor, with his heart & more guidance I agree Agee would’ve been the better prospect .
I didn’t know anything about this, such a great video. I enjoyed it. Now let me go find EVERYTHING documented here and get into it real quick. Awesome job. I THINK I saw hoop dreams years ago in school but doesn’t hurt to go rewatch it.
Me personally: as he got older and started seeing people were trying to use him for a meal ticket ( his father he never really saw as kid till he was like 16-17 years old in the movie ) PLUS THE EARLY INJURIES he really DID BECOME disillusioned with playing basketball in general regardless of making to pros but much respect to him and Arthur for getting their college degrees at least .
Loving this one thanks for sharing very information blessed love to all knowledge is power hopefully everyone pays attention keep up the good work I remember him the down fall was to me he had plenty of problems off the court with his family and prusre he was like a meal ticket to everyone 🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿🇯🇲🇯🇲🇯🇲
I disagree. William wasn't the best shooter, and wasn't that athletic. Had he not been injured, he would've played college ball, but wouldn't have made it to the NBA.
The simple answer is that it’s really damn hard to make the NBA. He and Agee managed to play D1 basketball, which is already really impressive and difficult to begin with. 3 percent of high school basketball players play college basketball (only 1% D1), and only 1% of college players go on to play in the NBA. One of Gates’s high school and college teammates, Amal McCaskill, did manage to make the NBA and play a long time professionally in Europe
I Loved watching hoop dreams! It’s on demand, I would watch it so much when it came out on Starz! I was addicted too the Documentary it was sad in the end. But overall it was really good!
Appreciate these videos and updates on agee and gates watched hoop dreams numerous times and wasn’t until the other day saw the follow up where agee followed a young pat bev that was good too
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream journey -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
I'm from Chicago and I never knew about the Michael Jordan invitation with the Wizards nor the secret tryout/comeback with the Bulls. Hell, I didn't even remember his brother was so good. My dude, you're in your purpose. Well done. Continue Courageously
I gotta watch this movie again in the near future…classic…I thought I was Agee as a freshman in H.S….they need to do another hoop dreams would be dope!
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
CURTIS WAS LIKE THAT WITH ALL OF US GOD REST HIS SOUL THAT'S MY BIG BROTHER LIKE HE ALWAYS SAID WE'RE BASKETBALL FAMILY I WENT TO GORDON TECH I PLAYED BALL FOR THEM THEN I PLAYED BALL FOR WELLS
One of my favorite movies. Both very talented but it’s one of those things that life just hits everyone differently, and sometimes our paths are led to different areas. It’s not a bad thing most of the time, and believe it or not, our passions become clearer in those times.
Good shit g. Mid way thru the video I thought about Daniel Gibson and how his career was cut short cause he wasn't feeling it any more. One of my best friends in HS was right behind Gibson and I remember running into his mom at the store during his freshman or sophomore year in college and she was telling me how he was getting tired of basketball. The wrong coach, the wrong situation, the wrong decisions will zap that love so quick its heartbreaking sometimes. If you can do enough research, do a video about Tack Minor. He went to LSU, graduated HS in 03. Booker T Washington, Houston, TX. Him and D Gib had a LEGENDARY game against each other once. The gym was filled to the rafters on some Above The Rim type shit when Birdie went to see Kyle play at the beginning of the movie.
@@adrianmcclain6384 I be tryna tell niggas D Gib used to pull up from half court and the volleyball lines, launching that hoe, nothing but net. The country might know Boobie Gibson but Houston know D Gib
@@adrianmcclain6384 I heard about the TJ Ford and Daniel Ewing years but I SEENT them niggas Tack and Gib hoop. I was like "oh nah these niggas HOOPING HOOPING" 😂😂
A guard that shoots 50% from the FT line tells you all you need to know about his chances in the NBA. Shame, he seemed like such a nice kid in that doc, I remember somebody had a dupe copy and it passed around the neighborhood
@@UNKLP66 seeing that when I was 12 when it came out. I thought he was such a waste . In high school I knew so many people like that. Who were lazy and arrogant and went no where because of it.
@jessearias2863 To me Curtis Gates from that clip at Colby College was better than William and Agee combined and he did help William with his game 🏀 spending time and supporting his brother
@@UNKLP66 yes he did, but If you watch the lenny Cooke story you see that you have to do the right thing every time and step on your journey, just to have a chance to make it. The average pro sports carrier is only 3 to 4 years. Those are the lucky ones. Most don't even get that.
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
I grew up with this movie too, and its a reminder that if you had/have the work ethic to even attempt to make it into the league you already have a lot of traits other people don't. Those things can translate into some dope shit and careers.
This is why Allen Iversons story is so great because, he went to a D1 school like Georgetown. 80% of exposure comes from going to a school that's national and being on Television. Gates was talented just like Arthur but there home situations derailed them.
Gotta disagree with the heart comment. I feel like people say that without truly understanding what that means. William had more heart than anyone in the documentary. The only difference between him and arthur is arthur never had the pressure when it came to basketball and had the opportunity to grow organically. William damn near physically peaked at 14 and was expected to immediately be a big contributor to varsity program at a top 10 school. My favorite part of the documentary was at the end of senior their senior when st joes lost their last game. When arthur and william hugged, arthur was so much bigger than william contrary to their freshman year when william was the star and it was felt like you were watching him pass the torch to arthur. To say he aint have heart is mad disrespectful because he always put 100 percent into the game even when he was hurt
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
@@randyrichardson4671Dude get outta here with ur stupid conspiracy theories and Trust me bro sources. Yeah, you definitely fake a knee injury from an old geezer coach that pushes you too hard. Dumbest logic I ever heard of.
5:00 In the movie theater, when we saw the scalpel go INTO Gates' knee, the entire audience gasped. That was 1995-96. I was 23, and in my prime. I'm 49 in 2022, and in my last few months of life. I STILL gasp when I watch this.
Damn I still have this on dvd Hoop Dreams this is a classic one of the best documentary William Gates wented to the famous high school St. Joseph in Chicago where former NBA legend Isiah Thomas played that dude was a hella of player his freshman year in high school imagine if didn't got injury his knee his sophomore through his senior year things probably turn out different probably I think he would probably wented to Illinois or Georgetown credit to Marquette they still gave him a full scholarship when he was injured his 1991 high school class was stack with top players to enter college Chris Webber, Juwan Howard, Jalen Rose hell basic the damn fab five crew LOL, Jason Kidd, Glenn Robinson, Corliss Williamson, Donyell Marshall, Alan Henderson, Travis Best etc all this dudes was former NBA Players.
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream, including Juwan! -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
I think William loved basketball but the more he got bigger as its unveiled throughout the film. Pressure shot at him from everyone and he couldn't deal with it and internally he wasn't ready for it. Leading him to fumble in those state games and ultimately his knee giving out. I also believe William's flop was karma at Pingatore for not properly nurturing Arthur as a player and allowing him to be himself while at St. Joseph's.
And that part when they were downstate and we saw Arthur's name on the jumbotron and the film makers editing a shot of Pingatore's face right after. The film makers were criticized for making Saint Joe's and the coach look like bad people.
You should do one on Donnie carr ball player from the 90s out of Philly, went to Lasalle he went up against kobe in high school in the catholic league championship
The first time I saw this movie it was the summer of 2004 I just turned 13 and the pistons just won the championship. It’s crazy to think that his big bro died a day befor 9/11
William Gates was the Thomas Sheppard of high school basketball On another note... The machines doctors used to treat his knee was janky as hell...LOL...smh 💯
It’s not that William lacked heart! Why’re you saying that! William had heart but he had so much pressure like you said from his family, his coach, and HIS INJURIES that he couldn’t showcase it🤦🏼♂️
@@jesusisking9744 well duh YOU wouldn’t say that because ….you’ve already said it . In MY opinion he lost heart and love for the game …you don’t tell anybody but yourself how to feel
@@thetruthandnothingbutthetr6484 why’re you so hostile? I guess I was trying to tell someone how to feel; It just felt like an injustice to say that Arthur had heart and should’ve had the opportunity William had because “he didn’t have heart”. Also you were the one who commented on my post also trying to tell someone how to feel
That coach at st joes pingatore was straight garbage…pressured William to come back to early and destroyed his confidence…that guy was in the mold of old coaches who saw black players as just meat to win championships…William could’ve made the league imagine if him and Arthur would’ve just stayed in the neighborhood and balled out at Marshall
Salute to William and Hoop Dreams. had a great time giving my opinion on these two classic basketball stories. He had the opportunity of a lifetime filming this documentary that changed countless lives. For that much respect.
Awesome job.👍🏾
Stunted growth you seem to know a lot of documentaries have you ever seen or heard of the Morningside 5 its similar to hoopdreams aired around the same time except it's a Westcoast version a documentary about there journey back to the state tournament lead by stais boseman ( usc Trojans)( Corey shaffold ) Dwight curry) during the mist of the early 90s L.A. riots
You just made your Channel unstoppable with these two videos
I believe the knee injuries was William biggest issue you can’t improve when you rehabbing every time he made one step forward it seem it was took steps back I understand why he lost that hunger he had more talent than Arthur
@@jarmaincharleston7405 It definitely was. Arthur had more heart though.
William now lives in San Antonio, TX. He's still married to his girlfriend that he had in hoop dreams. His son William Gates Jr played division 1 basketball and I believe he did play for a short time at st.joes under the same coach. I believe William is still a pastor. For the most part he lives a quite comfortable life.
That's successful too
Him and Author have a podcast on UA-cam as well
I thought he lived in Waco. I met him at an old job of mine.
@@onlyone23km maybe he did at one point but his son Jr attended clemens high school in shertz right outside San Antonio.
I heard he was an ABA coach for the Texas Wranglers.
One of the realest quotes I ever heard came outta William's mouth during the movie. *"When you get to the NBA, don't forget about me", and that stuff. Well, I should've said to them, "if I don't make it, don't you forget about me."*
Dude had wisdom @ his age 🎯💯‼️
BRO THAT USED TO RUN AS A COMMERCIAL TRAILER FOR THE DOCUMENTARY WHEN IT CAME OUT THATS REAL SPIT FRFR
Facts. I tell people that quote all the time. And all those people at St Joe's probably don't even talk to him anymore but they damn sure would have if he made it
Hoop Dreams is the best sports documentary of all time
hoop dreams and MTAG are at the top my list of sports docs
@rasclaaat what’s MTAG?
One of them, indeed.
@@coreyhawkins8925 more than a game , LeBron’s basketball doc
INDEED!!
William Gates is so damn awesome, he was so real the whole time and put up with so much crap, especially that asshole old coach. They screwed Agee and when Gates faltered they basically gave up on him and slung on him. I had never heard of this movie until the Agee video, so I found it and watched it thanks to you. My favorite part in that movie oddly enough is when Arthur's mom passes the nursing exam with the highest grade in the class of 89, she cried and said so many people told her she couldn't do it, you can't have a soul and not feel for that woman. Cheers.
That movie was too real. I loved Agee and Gates because they were being themselves. Rip to Bo and William's brother and Arthur's lil bro.
Exactly man that fuckin coach Smh
It's the best documentary of all time, sports or not. It's just a human story, a very real and raw one.
I saw this film multiple times.
That's everyone's favorite part of the movie
The pressure can burst pipes or make diamonds. The hood brings the reality out of life at a young age. Fun only last so long
I blame the head coach at St. Joes Pingatore more than anything as far as why William lost the love for the game. A coach at the amateur level is more than just a coach he is a role model and mentor for the players on his team. Pingatore had no interest in any of his players llves outside the court and saw Arthur, William and others as nothing but pieces of meat to run and jump and win him championships. I remember watching the scene he finds out William has a child he couldn't even fake giving a damn about that. William was just a shiny toy to him and he ran him into the ground.
Agreed 💯
I agree bro! Can you imagine if he would have kept Arthur to play with William on varsity from tenth grade to 12th????
@@ajwillz5513 They would've been lethal. I always remember that scene where Williams team as St Joes is eliminated from the playoffs and Arthur's team actually went farther. The head coach was looking like a dumbass at Arthur backstage and went up to Arthur like man we should of kept you lol
Couldn't stand that coach. I feel like deep down he didn't even like black men. And he lucked out with Isaiah Thomas and he used that as bragging rights to claim he was a much better coach than he was.
@@DerekT860 He represents the real side of many amateur coaches. They don't give a damn about their black players. It's all about what they can do to help them win. He was only "nice" to Zeke because Zeke made him look good as a coach.
The first time I watched HoopDreams was when I was in summer school at Marshall H.S in 94 and like you explained, I thought the movie was very sad and motivational at the same time and I eventually met both of these men,who are genuinely good people in real life ✌
I spoke online to Arthur, but personally met William.
@@onlyone23km cool
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
My son is a sophomore in high school. He plays football and is SPECTACULAR at it. Runningback and DB. He’s never seen Hoop Dreams but as I type this I have him watching these 2 videos. My husband takes care of the coaching side while I take care of the classroom portion. They’re always attending camps. My husband tries to make sure he has every chance. We sat him down and told him, “ when you don’t want this anymore please let us know, we won’t be mad and we won’t pressure you”. We do stress letting football get him into college though. We feel even if he decides to not try and make it to the next level he’ll have that college education. We have a total of 5 sons, ALL of whom played football. From tight end, to receiver, to safety, to corner. He’s our youngest and we stress too him, “THIS IS YOUR LIFE“! I wanted him to watch these videos so that he will know, even though it’s a different time, those same things that were important back then still are. So thank you for making these short videos. Hoop Dreams the movie is on Demand so we’re going to sit down and watch it with him soon.
Why would you have him watch these videos and not the actual movie hoop dreams. He can’t learn anything from the videos. But you can learn everything from watching the movie hoop dreams with your son.
Stop stressing football as his way to get an education. That should happen regardless of what sport he plays.
@@CREOLEHEAT Yeah she sounded stupid. Got all these sons and putting them on that football Plantation. They played the sport but did it get them anywhere?
If you’re poor inner city youth, the path to at least getting an education is much easier. There’s more people willing to see you succeed and not looking for a financial windfall when you succeed. Most of these young athletes are sponsored by individuals or families to get them out of their environment. These days, that’s about what it takes. You can’t be running the streets with your friends, because it’s so easy to wind up at the wrong place at the wrong time.
When you’re poor, like these two were, you have to be sheltered from the chaos around you. Your mom’s financial situation, your dad’s drug problem, your brother’s lifestyle choices can not be on your mind. They had their opportunity, now it’s your turn. Life isn’t fair and you only have small windows of time to make it as a professional athlete.
Can anyone imagine if the coach at ST JOES would have kept Arthur and put him on varsity as a tenth grader. I believe they would have won the state championship together. Let’s not forget Arthur’s team made it to state Final four at Marshall.
Agreed
Had William not suffered his knee injury, I would agree. But I feel like he may have lost that extra gear as a player, so they probably wouldn't have been as lethal as a duo had Arthur stayed.
Like the late great Luther Bedford said, if Arthur was making the progression they felt he should have been Making on the court, economics would have not kept him from attending Joes. He caught his growth spurt a little too late for Ping’s liking
As a long time high school coach it's incumbent upon us to look out for our players period. I've sent many young men on to play college ball on all levels and the one thing they have all had in common is they want to play! I've had players clearly out of it, glassy eyed and tell me coach I'm good. Fingers bent, ankles swollen, knees hurting all tell me; "I'm Good!" I wish he'd had another coach who cared more about him than making it to state.
Facts
Big Facts.
His situation was wild getting injured then having a baby in high school but he still made it through. The coach at St. Joe's didn't really give a fuck about him he was viewed as a commodity. Both him and Arthur dealt with alot trauma off the court too.
Facts and the Coach and school did Arthur Agee even worst one of the most racist documentaries I ever seen
@@nC_DUKE_ how was the documentary racist?
@@nC_DUKE_ How was the coach racist ?? Author didn’t produce like he was suppose to
@@nC_DUKE_ they only value us for our sweat equity we put into the game. We 80% of the league n don't own shit. Chicago bulls even fronted on Jordan after all them chips. They only look at us as thoroughbreds in sports.
This is the very ugly side of basketball. This is why sometimes i feel like i wanna tell my kid to pursue something else but i think he’s got a little bit of too much of me inside of him.
I always felt like the mother low-key pressured him, and his brother, god rest his soul, didn't help him navigate through it, but he seemed to be dealing with depression on his own because of his struggles and looked at William as the remedy, or answer to all his troubles. You could see William's mental deteriorating as time went on and from what the movie showed no one noticed because they wanted him to make so bad. When he was up, everyone was there, but when the strong needed that support... It wasn't looking to well. I think just having someone to talk to that didn't have anything to gain from him would've definitely been good for him.
Next video: Jameer Nelson, perhaps?
Moms did the best she could. And she got two sons into college. Don’t put it on her.
@@vincewilson8969 naw we not doing that the black women did nothing shit this year we blaming whoever accountable 😂
It was all on that coach he literally pressured him into back to back injury
I've watched the film so many times and read the book, but never got that impression. I feel like his mother just wanted her sons to be safe, happy, and successful in whatever they chose to do. The father, meanwhile...
Don't talk about my family you don't know shit his mother was never like that
You should do Howard Nathan next... His team beat Arthur's team in the state tournament and he was one of William's roommates at the Nike Camp... Howard was a four-year starter at Peoria Manuel High School... He played a year at De Paul and had a short stint with the Atlanta Hawks... Howard was also compared to Isiah Thomas in High School...
R.I.P. Howard Nathan... 🏀💪🏿
I bought this documentary at a yard sale for 10 cents. I was a senior in HS playing my 3rd year of varsity...not knowing what my future was going to be I hated hoop at that time and didnt want to play college. This documentary gave a lot of answers to a lot of questions. Ended up quitting and focusing on college. I'm an engineer today and Hoop Dreams helped a ton.
I felt bad for William Gates. In the beginning of the Hoop Dreams, William sound so excited and enthusiastic to go to the NBA. By the end of his Senior year, he was beginning to lose his passion for basketball due to the amount of pressure Pingatore gave to him. From pressuring him to come back early from his meniscus injury from his knee, belittling all his mistakes at practice and having the NERVE to encourage him to abandon his girlfriend and baby to focus only on basketball.
Yes he told him to "write em off"
It's rough but you bring up a good point about wishing William had the heart that Arthur had. Not trying to be judgemental or cruel. William had pressures on him as a teen that I can't imagine. But it did seem like he just was never 100% commited to basketball. If he never got injured and family was in better financial shape who knows....
He lost his love for the game once it became more like a job. He couldn't handle the pressure & dealing with that knee injury. There was too much pressure from his brother & coach.
He lost his love after his knee injury. He couldn't get back to that level of play he was at pre-injury and it began to weigh on him.
Doc Rivers went to Marquette. Don't forget about him.
DWade too.
@@KevinWei24 jimmy butler too
I truly believe Gates would have been good enough to make it to the NBA if it wasn't for that knee injury! Hoop Dreams is a legendary classic sports film that will never die!
He almost made it to the Toronto raptors
He went to the combine we are a basketball family
Honestly it's easier for young black men to become doctors and lawyers than make it to any pro league. But they always sell up dreams as life pursuits. It's either rap, drugs or hoops. Once I woke up to that truth as a former MC I took my ass back to school and my life improved dramatically and I would do it the same if given the opportunity.
In my opinion, if it wasn’t for his continuing injuries in high school, he would be playing professionally in some league. Salute to William and Arthur.
Who ever is making stunted growth god bless you I love this channel
This was beautifully done. I felt emotional watching both of their stories. Great job man. You are great at telling stories.
Bro this one and the one on Arthur Agee hit home. Both very dope and greatly done. You need an award for these.
I AGREE, I wish Arthur Agee was given the same opportunities a William Gates.
Damn,3 knee surgeries before even getting out of high school? Damn the basketball gods threw the book a William
Yeah that's straight up crazy man. He had so much potential just couldn't stay healthy long enough.
Rest in Power to Curtis Gates!
A lot of players in the hood had skills also but never played organized basketball and chose a different path in life man I rooted for both them guys on that movie that was a great documentary 👍🏾🙌🏾
I definitely remember the movie; my dad used to recruit in the Chicago area back in the day tried to recruit his older brother if I'm not mistaken.
I've watched all your videos and this is the first one that put tears in my eyes. Great words spoken.
If you watch the hoop dreams dvd with the commentary from william and arthur. William said he faked the knee injury at mcdonalds camp he said everyone was too good and seeing jaylen rose play point at 6'9 he knew he had no chance. His story was sad basketball wise he had the talent knee injuries are no joke the surgeries back then were done poorly and hurt him more than helped him.
Yea those doctors were on some experimental shit back then. Faking an injury is mad soft though. Always thought he lacked the heart Arthur had. Ain't no faking injuries because you scared fam
@@stuntedgrowth isnt that crazy ? Cant believe he admitted that pissed me off because i felt so bad when it happened in the movie to find outit was fake makes me think hes such a sucker for doing that its almost impossible to get that opportunity. Sucker shit smfh
@@stuntedgrowth arthurs response was like wowwww you dirty dog. In his head he prob wanted to swing on him Arthur never would have backed down over a basketball game smfh too good? Clown shit.
@@stuntedgrowth real shit, you already lost before you stepped on the floor, with his heart & more guidance I agree Agee would’ve been the better prospect .
@@stuntedgrowth didn't Giannis do that in the bubble with his foot or ankle?
I didn’t know anything about this, such a great video. I enjoyed it. Now let me go find EVERYTHING documented here and get into it real quick. Awesome job. I THINK I saw hoop dreams years ago in school but doesn’t hurt to go rewatch it.
Me personally: as he got older and started seeing people were trying to use him for a meal ticket ( his father he never really saw as kid till he was like 16-17 years old in the movie ) PLUS THE EARLY INJURIES he really DID BECOME disillusioned with playing basketball in general regardless of making to pros but much respect to him and Arthur for getting their college degrees at least .
Great Great video you could always see the pressure in his eyes 🙏🏾
This here best documentary film. Raw talent off-court life situations were the best. 90’s classic.
Loving this one thanks for sharing very information blessed love to all knowledge is power hopefully everyone pays attention keep up the good work I remember him the down fall was to me he had plenty of problems off the court with his family and prusre he was like a meal ticket to everyone 🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿🇯🇲🇯🇲🇯🇲
Thanks again for the second video buddy.The westside of Chicago basketball community is very grateful..
Been waiting for this 🔥
I remember my dad taking me to a Warriors game as a kid and watching Gates, Jim McIlvaine, and Amal McCaskill.
Another superb video, well done. It definitely was difficult to watch, because we all were pushing for both of them "to make it" NBA that is.
Honestly believe if Gates didn't damage his Knee he would have made it. He was a special talent, even now he would be a terror.
I disagree. William wasn't the best shooter, and wasn't that athletic. Had he not been injured, he would've played college ball, but wouldn't have made it to the NBA.
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS.... PROPS 2 YOU MAIN , LOVE THIS , KEEP EM COMING‼️🏀🏀🏀🏀🏀🏀🏀🏀🏀
The simple answer is that it’s really damn hard to make the NBA. He and Agee managed to play D1 basketball, which is already really impressive and difficult to begin with.
3 percent of high school basketball players play college basketball (only 1% D1), and only 1% of college players go on to play in the NBA.
One of Gates’s high school and college teammates, Amal McCaskill, did manage to make the NBA and play a long time professionally in Europe
Next doc…Dontonio Wingfield, Lamar Greer, Tremaine Fowlkes, Corey Louis, Casey Sanders
I Loved watching hoop dreams! It’s on demand, I would watch it so much when it came out on Starz! I was addicted too the Documentary it was sad in the end. But overall it was really good!
Appreciate these videos and updates on agee and gates watched hoop dreams numerous times and wasn’t until the other day saw the follow up where agee followed a young pat bev that was good too
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
I really love this dudes videos. Very entertaining.
God bless both of those guys. I love them and I know how it feels to have your hoop dreams fade away.
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream journey -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
I'm from Chicago and I never knew about the Michael Jordan invitation with the Wizards nor the secret tryout/comeback with the Bulls. Hell, I didn't even remember his brother was so good. My dude, you're in your purpose. Well done. Continue Courageously
Do Douglas Edwards(FSU),or his brothers Steve Edwards(Miami) and Allen Edwards (Kentucky).
I gotta watch this movie again in the near future…classic…I thought I was Agee as a freshman in H.S….they need to do another hoop dreams would be dope!
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
@@JH-us6zp that’s dope and good looking definitely wanna hear these men speak on different topics…see where they at
CURTIS WAS LIKE THAT WITH ALL OF US GOD REST HIS SOUL THAT'S MY BIG BROTHER LIKE HE ALWAYS SAID WE'RE BASKETBALL FAMILY I WENT TO GORDON TECH I PLAYED BALL FOR THEM THEN I PLAYED BALL FOR WELLS
You should do a Stunted Growth on William Gates' older BROTHER, who was the metermaid, who was great in high school.
His brother looked like Zion with that red shirt on
😂
One of my favorite movies. Both very talented but it’s one of those things that life just hits everyone differently, and sometimes our paths are led to different areas. It’s not a bad thing most of the time, and believe it or not, our passions become clearer in those times.
Am I the only that thinks he should do one on Flip Murray or Hakim Warrick next
Philly ballers,
I remember heckling him bad at a ref gm and he proceed to score 39pts in the second half and looked at me after every bucket 🪣 😂🤣
Put it in your memory banks🔥
Good shit g. Mid way thru the video I thought about Daniel Gibson and how his career was cut short cause he wasn't feeling it any more. One of my best friends in HS was right behind Gibson and I remember running into his mom at the store during his freshman or sophomore year in college and she was telling me how he was getting tired of basketball. The wrong coach, the wrong situation, the wrong decisions will zap that love so quick its heartbreaking sometimes. If you can do enough research, do a video about Tack Minor. He went to LSU, graduated HS in 03. Booker T Washington, Houston, TX. Him and D Gib had a LEGENDARY game against each other once. The gym was filled to the rafters on some Above The Rim type shit when Birdie went to see Kyle play at the beginning of the movie.
Tack has 72 D Gib had 47 and it was standing room only!!!
@@adrianmcclain6384 72!!! I don't think it's been a game like that in the city since but I'm prolly wrong
@@adrianmcclain6384 I be tryna tell niggas D Gib used to pull up from half court and the volleyball lines, launching that hoe, nothing but net. The country might know Boobie Gibson but Houston know D Gib
@@holagovito yea Willowridge with TJ and Ewing games was pretty crazy but Jones was so small that’s why that one was so so live!
@@adrianmcclain6384 I heard about the TJ Ford and Daniel Ewing years but I SEENT them niggas Tack and Gib hoop. I was like "oh nah these niggas HOOPING HOOPING" 😂😂
Awesome the other Hoop Dreamer
That’s just too much for a kid to bear.
A guard that shoots 50% from the FT line tells you all you need to know about his chances in the NBA. Shame, he seemed like such a nice kid in that doc, I remember somebody had a dupe copy and it passed around the neighborhood
You should also do his brother Curtis next. Good job JC
That would be a good one
Curtis Gates... "This ain't the time to be teaching nobody no lesson"
@@UNKLP66 seeing that when I was 12 when it came out. I thought he was such a waste . In high school I knew so many people like that. Who were lazy and arrogant and went no where because of it.
@jessearias2863 To me Curtis Gates from that clip at Colby College was better than William and Agee combined and he did help William with his game 🏀 spending time and supporting his brother
@@UNKLP66 yes he did, but If you watch the lenny Cooke story you see that you have to do the right thing every time and step on your journey, just to have a chance to make it. The average pro sports carrier is only 3 to 4 years. Those are the lucky ones. Most don't even get that.
These were great JC.
Damn bro great story loved Hoop Dreams when I was younger!!!! Always wonder why happen to them!!!!
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
I grew up with this movie too, and its a reminder that if you had/have the work ethic to even attempt to make it into the league you already have a lot of traits other people don't. Those things can translate into some dope shit and careers.
I feel bad for guys like this because they didn’t have access to ground-breaking knee surgery techniques that today’s athletes enjoy.
Facts had William got surgery now his knee would have been fine
Love the video fam
This is why Allen Iversons story is so great because, he went to a D1 school like Georgetown. 80% of exposure comes from going to a school that's national and being on Television. Gates was talented just like Arthur but there home situations derailed them.
Another classic
That was the best episode this year
Great piece man
Gotta disagree with the heart comment. I feel like people say that without truly understanding what that means. William had more heart than anyone in the documentary. The only difference between him and arthur is arthur never had the pressure when it came to basketball and had the opportunity to grow organically. William damn near physically peaked at 14 and was expected to immediately be a big contributor to varsity program at a top 10 school. My favorite part of the documentary was at the end of senior their senior when st joes lost their last game. When arthur and william hugged, arthur was so much bigger than william contrary to their freshman year when william was the star and it was felt like you were watching him pass the torch to arthur. To say he aint have heart is mad disrespectful because he always put 100 percent into the game even when he was hurt
I agree
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
Bet u didn't know he faked his knee injury at the mcdonald's camp...that's heart?? Lol
@@randyrichardson4671Dude get outta here with ur stupid conspiracy theories and Trust me bro sources. Yeah, you definitely fake a knee injury from an old geezer coach that pushes you too hard. Dumbest logic I ever heard of.
Great video !!
Cabrini Green 🤯 that boy had to Hoop through Candy Man 😅😂
U not a real hooper if u ain’t seen hoop dreams!
We need one on PJ Hairston, William Graves and Killian Hayes.
bro killian still writing his story
@@300IQPUG JC has done vids on other players who are young and are still writing their own story. For example, Marvin Bagley III.
5:00 In the movie theater, when we saw the scalpel go INTO Gates' knee, the entire audience gasped. That was 1995-96. I was 23, and in my prime. I'm 49 in 2022, and in my last few months of life. I STILL gasp when I watch this.
I remember when I met him at my old job and got a photograph with him.
Damn I still have this on dvd Hoop Dreams this is a classic one of the best documentary William Gates wented to the famous high school St. Joseph in Chicago where former NBA legend Isiah Thomas played that dude was a hella of player his freshman year in high school imagine if didn't got injury his knee his sophomore through his senior year things probably turn out different probably I think he would probably wented to Illinois or Georgetown credit to Marquette they still gave him a full scholarship when he was injured his 1991 high school class was stack with top players to enter college Chris Webber, Juwan Howard, Jalen Rose hell basic the damn fab five crew LOL, Jason Kidd, Glenn Robinson, Corliss Williamson, Donyell Marshall, Alan Henderson, Travis Best etc all this dudes was former NBA Players.
Arthur and Will now host a podcast. give them a follow to support and listen to them speak to some amazing individuals about their Hoop Dream, including Juwan! -> ua-cam.com/users/HoopDreamsThePodcast
Bless his mom's ,she looks like a sweet soul threw the screen you know !
I think William loved basketball but the more he got bigger as its unveiled throughout the film. Pressure shot at him from everyone and he couldn't deal with it and internally he wasn't ready for it. Leading him to fumble in those state games and ultimately his knee giving out. I also believe William's flop was karma at Pingatore for not properly nurturing Arthur as a player and allowing him to be himself while at St. Joseph's.
And that part when they were downstate and we saw Arthur's name on the jumbotron and the film makers editing a shot of Pingatore's face right after. The film makers were criticized for making Saint Joe's and the coach look like bad people.
@@KevinWei24 Pingatore was a piece of shit, it not hard to tell it.
I felt bad for him because his brother was trying to live his dreams through him and had too much pressure on him too
I think his brother was a part of it to. But at the end he hurt he knee and back then and even now a knee injury means you are done.
i love that movie! thank you
You should do one on Donnie carr ball player from the 90s out of Philly, went to Lasalle he went up against kobe in high school in the catholic league championship
I was 13 when this came out, this movie turned me onto basketball n although i was never that good that sport saved my life
The first time I saw this movie it was the summer of 2004
I just turned 13 and the pistons just won the championship. It’s crazy to think that his big bro died a day befor 9/11
Very dope series
You should do one on Tom Kleinschmidt. DePaul and Chicago high school legend. He was one of William Gates's high school rivals.
Wow I was just thinking about this
Anyone find it interesting that the coach at St Joseph’s made him run all those extra drills after having surgery on his knee?
Bro, you got good taste in music. I could listen to this background music all day. What’s the instrumental?
William Gates was the Thomas Sheppard of high school basketball
On another note...
The machines doctors used to treat his knee was janky as hell...LOL...smh
💯
Never heard of the movie but I want to check it out
Arthur would’ve made it if he went D-1 like William on the first go round. Put Arthur on Marquette and he going pro no doubt !!
It’s not that William lacked heart! Why’re you saying that! William had heart but he had so much pressure like you said from his family, his coach, and HIS INJURIES that he couldn’t showcase it🤦🏼♂️
He lacked heart
@@thetruthandnothingbutthetr6484 I wouldn’t say that
@@jesusisking9744 well duh YOU wouldn’t say that because ….you’ve already said it . In MY opinion he lost heart and love for the game …you don’t tell anybody but yourself how to feel
@@thetruthandnothingbutthetr6484 why’re you so hostile? I guess I was trying to tell someone how to feel; It just felt like an injustice to say that Arthur had heart and should’ve had the opportunity William had because “he didn’t have heart”. Also you were the one who commented on my post also trying to tell someone how to feel
@@jesusisking9744 you don’t read rooms very well do you
Remember watching something like a documentary a while back
I'm glad they're both doing well. That pressure they put on those young brothers was not cool at all.
That coach at st joes pingatore was straight garbage…pressured William to come back to early and destroyed his confidence…that guy was in the mold of old coaches who saw black players as just meat to win championships…William could’ve made the league imagine if him and Arthur would’ve just stayed in the neighborhood and balled out at Marshall
They're from different neighborhoods. If William stayed at his, he would've gone to Westinghouse HS.