The use of stones is a great idea. I don't like gabions because I have seen many fail within a couple decades. Its usually because the wire mesh is made from light wires. If the structures are just made of rock they will last longer and are usually cheaper to install. In my area the rocks are cheap but the labor to fill gabions is very high so I used to design using more stone and saving the wire and labor. Failed gabions are a big expense to fix while a stone dam is usually easy and cheap. I am a retired civil engineer. Good Luck, Rick
@richardross7219 Yup. No need for pretty gabions. I throw/roll the biggest boulders in, first, then work upstream- filling in the gaps while increasing height. 3- 4 feet limits hydrostatic pressure( and labor). This limits blowouts. Careful stacking can help but takes longer so I just make a squat triangle shape, in crossection. I also add Portland cement( aprox.1 to 10) to sand/soil in the drainage, then use this for fill among the rocks in the core. Biggest boulders on downstream side are crucial to mitigate rocks washing out if dam gets overtopped.
We have also seen some failures and recommend any structures receive regular maintenance and stewardship to minimize damage. In high flowing arroyos, the gabions are often more secure and even if toppled over, often continue to reduce peaks and sediment transport. We also see great effects from smaller rock detention structures, beaver dams and their analogs, but each is site specific. Please visit our website for more information: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study.
Where we live, it's a combination of largish trees with roots attached and some rip rap to initially secure the trees. Rock, debris and other trees washed down the river collect and add to the structure. It's more self maintaining and actually will grow along the edges of the rivers. Then of course brush and trees are also planted to help secure the structure.
You're correct - but typically only when gabions are in a permanemt water contact zone and see repeated wet/dry cycles (tidal zones especially). In Nogales, the flows are intermittent and vast majority of the gabion structures are not subject to repeated wet/dry cycles and should last many decades. The structures will likely suffer occasional punctures due to tree debris, but repairs are easy and low tech. The beauty of gabions are their flexibility, relatively low cost and ease of installation/repair by relatively unskilled labor. By contrast, finding/transporting/placing large rock rip rap is usually a (very) expensive solution that also requires good jobsite access for heavy machinery - not a viable solution in impoverished areas like rural Mexico, or remote sites. Gabion baskets can be carried by hand and can be filled using local rock sources, often within the drainage area itself. Low cost solution.
@@ArthurDentZaphodBeeb You and I are from very different areas. In my area, labor is very expensive and rocks are plentiful. Digging for my personal home, yielded over 1,000 tons of 4" to 6' rock. I had to build and use a grizzley in order to have soil suitable for backfill and landscaping. Years ago there was a third alternative, Posey Sausages. They were chain link fencing that was formed into tubes and filled with rocks. These were laid into channels to prevent erosion but were very labor intensive. I took a couple of grad school courses with Prof. Posey and learned about them from him. They had been used at the Rocky Mountain Hydraulics Lab for years but, never caught on. We always have to remember that there are many different circumstances in each area around the country and world. Good Luck, Rick
As the ancestors did. American Indians put stone dams across arroyos; when the rains came, planted downstream from them. When a dam silted, they could plant in that. Agave was common. Mesquite was used to stabilize banks and as food. Years back, when a kid working with a fencing crew, one job was to repair old dams. niio
Fantastic! Maintenance is key, thank you for sharing! We have publication describing some of those ancient structures in the North American Southwest here: s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3-euw1-ap-pe-ws4-cws-documents.ri-prod/9781032286747/9781032286747c11.pdf
Excellent work. I have experimented with stone walls and infiltration channels to reduce peak runoff flows and water erosion. The key is to use local resources; in my case, the land has plenty of stones.
Thank you for this touching story. Too many bad news being broadcasted regarding things that are south of the border. This was definitely a nice change.
Overall this was well done, although I agree about the music. I am a real believer in check dams. My father and I did a lot of hard labor doing minor erosion control on the family farm, including very minor check damns like shown here, when I was a child. Also transplanting plugs of hearty grasses in ravines after rainstorms. We were not in the creek bottoms to worry about flooding, but others were.
Small and frequent works better than large and infrequent. Small and frequent means less chance of catastrophic failure, and likely less general maintenance/more improvement for effort exerted. It's more than flooding control it's about sequestered carbon, rebuilding soil, regreening, reducing fire danger, assisting wildlife, rebuilding watertables, food security, etc. It's about putting in effort and getting a very reasonable return. I am concerned about the gabions because from what I understand, they always fail eventually. Would rather see a lot more "one rock" dams to eventually replace these gabions. The nice thing about one rock dams is that can fill in with time, raising soil level, and when its filled you build another nearby to continue to collect materials...
@MariaCosta-Balogh It's a different issue from them catching sediments, it's that they'll fail (because they do eventually fail) and let loose a lot of water and sediment because the supporting wire has failed...
@@b_uppy When the wire rusts you will end up with a pile of rocks if you do no maintenance. The wires will not all fail at once, you could inspect the structure to see the extent of the rust and other modes of failure. Then in 20- 50 100 years time build another structure with the rocks or build on the rocks.
@johnclements6614 This is different from a gabion privacy fence, or decorative wall. It's not "just a pile of rocks." These gabions have a bunch of wet sediment building up behind it. It's part of the "why" they're there. These _are_ effective at accumulating silt. This is to help clear water by slowing water enough that the mud's particulate can settle out. Sediment builds up as a result. That sediment has weight and will deform and flow into the direction in the path of least resistence. If this occurs during a larger rain event this is of even more concern because forces increase. Some of these gabions depicted are quite large, well over one's head. Imagine what can happen if these give out when there is a lot of mud coming thru...
This is so sad that they do not do more rainwater harvesting with those metal and tile roofs into cisterns instead of letting it run wild in the streets. Imagine if every home gathered a thousand gallons each monsoon for use later. Talk about water retention and slow release.
Cisterns are expensive. Maybe with time. That said, respect the rainwater garden/bioswale. They can be made for the cost of a pick axe and shovel and have a lot of utility. These rebuild groundwater levels and provide ephemeral watering places for animals, too. With bioswales you can harvest street runoff to establish fruit trees. The fruit tree's bark sequesters problematic chemicals that would render other food plants, and makes good use of an overlooked source of water...
People are as much as they can. We put in a concrete tank, but will use plastic, as well. Another tank is to catch grey water, where it soaks into compost. That way even kitchen water is used (with its grease and so on).
I think people are probably doing what they can within their economic means. Also, this video is about gallions so they probably didn’t really touch on that but that would be an interesting video too.
People in richer countries like the US and England don't even do rainwater harvesting in private homes...why would you think this border town would do it???
That would be a great visual! We have a lot of research showing the efficacy of rock detention structures here if you are interested in more: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study
Hügelkultur swales could also be a low tech solution to slow the flow and filter water, carbon capture green waste, build soil, and replenish aquifers all while creating jobs for generations.
American Indians have used them for centuries. You dig deep as you can, remove caliche, and backfill with brush, logs, and so on. Add the dirt and top with coffee grounds (a la starbucks, here) and then a heavy mulch. No water escapes them and they produce a bounty.
Terraces have been used for centuries for water control... Take Machu Pichu for instance, where they used the terraced lands for agriculture and water storage. They didn't use wire mesh to hold rocks. Fabulous that we're finally getting back to environmentally fundamental solutions for perpetual issues regardless of man-made borders! 👍
Thank you! Indeed, terraces have been used for millennia for farming. Visit our publication on ancient farmers using this natural infrastructure in the Southwest here: s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3-euw1-ap-pe-ws4-cws-documents.ri-prod/9781032286747/9781032286747c11.pdf
more communities need to know about this tech, it'd be so cool to have books for different grades about usgs processes that research and address natural disasters
Love this concept. For permaculture aware folks, "new research" on rock dams and water catchment is a funny phrase. These concepts are thousands if not tens or hundreds of thousands of years old. The Indian tribes in that area had sustainable agriculture with earthworks and crop rotation instead of a barren semidesert (denuded over a century ago) with seasonal flooding.
For sure this is ancient technology! Visit our publication describing some of these in the North American Southwest here: s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3-euw1-ap-pe-ws4-cws-documents.ri-prod/9781032286747/9781032286747c11.pdf
Most of the pictures and film are results of the efforts to create and plan a sponge city! If you are interested to see results of this type of installing natural infrastructure in dryland streams, please visit www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study
Honestly, this is reinventing the wheel. They are doing good things and using modern tech to help but many of these things were used historically until they were discontinued.
Agreed! There has been a lot of confusion about various management that led to discontinuation, despite this longtime practice and qualitative observation, which is why USGS is offering scientific metrics for decision-making!
The lifespan of a gabion, or gabion basket, can range from 10 to 120 years, depending on the environment and the type of wire used to make it: Environment Gabions are designed to be permanent structures, but their longevity is directly related to the environment they are installed in. For example, gabions in industrial and coastal areas with moderate salinity may only last 30 years, while those in rural deserts or internal buildings with clean atmospheres may last over 100 years. Wire type The most common type of wire used to make gabions is galvanized steel, but PVC-coated and stainless steel wires are also used. PVC-coated galvanized gabions are estimated to last about 60 years.
I'm impressed. I am curious, though; when the wire holding the blocks together inevitably gives out, is the idea that sediment has already taken its place structurally while also serving to slow the flow? If so, then this is actually pretty cool. The wire is then, like a cast, which disappears when no longer needed, like dissolvable stitches. Like I said, I'm impressed :)
What's especially worrying is the size of these. Rock gabions fail. They need to build one rocks dams around this and build up soil levels. Plants are established around these as part of soil reclamation, flood mitigation. One rock dams avoid wash out, rust/rebuilding issues. If they do fail, the failures are small and less likely to be catastrophic. It's better to do small and frequent over large and centralized.
Thank you! Yes, the gabion wire will expire over time, and the structure will need to be maintained. And yes, when sediment infills the channel, fills up behind the gabion, and acts like a sponge to further detain stormwater, promote infiltration, and vegetation is supported. In the same cycle, both the sediment and vegetation act to further slow flows.
Borderlands Restoration Network and Watershed Management Group are both active partners here and in fact, Joaquin Murrieta-Saldivar (WSM) is leading a workshop there today!
Starting at the top of the watershed and working downstream- with overflows being channeled off on a shallow dipping contour( spreading the water out overland)- they absolutely can mitigate flooding.
In the ancient Middle East flooding was partially controlled by placing medium sized rocks on hillsides to slow and funnel the flow of water to designated channels.
We’ve published research discusses the capability of and functional similarities between beaver dams and anthropogenic rock detention structures (both natural infrastructure in dryland streams), documented by decades of scientific study, here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub However, there is not enough water in this specific system to maintain beavers currently, so humans are mimicking them.
It's better to build trenches and terraces to hold the rainfall on the hillside . You will be holding the water where it is needed and slowing down the sediment .
The graph at 4:42 suggests that an enormous portion of water is being absorbed by the soil since without absorption the areas under the curves should be equal.
Yes, when sediment is trapped at the structures, it helps to slow flows, and grow vegetation, which act to further delay stormwater. We describe these mechanisms in this video: ua-cam.com/video/c2tYI7jUdU0/v-deo.html
I have been learning about this for years wondering why the united states doesn't do this. I just assumed the government loves disasters and suffering.
Interested if they have explored using a lot more porous concrete in areas where natural solutions are not possible. Since there is minimal freezing temperatures there the more porous concrete could be effective
That is very expensive to install, and very expensive to maintain, as well as being generally intensive. You must clean it frequently... Harvesting rainwater makes much more sense because it mitigates flooding while adding to resources instead of depleting them. Would be better if they did lots of one-rock dams instead of larger, more centralized gabions because gabions fail, require much more maintenance, and I more money intensive. Opting for smaller, hyperlocalized solutions, including raingardens and bioswales reduces the risk of catastrophic failure, and builds benefits more evenly...
What a beautiful solution, Thank🍁you women. You’re working as nature, respecting nature that humans on both side of the fence receive the same humane solution to the flooding. 🌺🙏🏼🌺
Structure s i see with the gabion are too large. Micro dam's and a lot more of them farther up closer to the start point. Small$$ but can have big results.
Olá sou do Brasil vocês conhecem a Permacultura? A solução deles pra isso são curvas de nivel nos morros que desaguam nesse córrego onde fizeram a barragem. Pesquisem sobre isso, e uma vez feito a curva de nível plantem árvores nelas , a curva de nível vai reter as águas.
Yes! Natural infrastructure in dryland streams (NIDS) can be installed by both beaver or humans, using rock, wood, and mud, learn more here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub.
Para activar los subtítulos en español: 1. Ubique el botón CC en la esquina inferior derecha de la pantalla y haga clic en él para activar los subtítulos. 2. Accede al menú Configuración (representado por un ícono de ajustes) y selecciona "Subtítulos". 3. Elija "Español (México)" y desplácese hacia abajo para seleccionar "Español".
I think terracing like the Indians in the mountainous areas of South America might be a better idea - not sure if that's what you're trying to do here or not. It would need to be done on a massive scale, but it might just turn this area into a tropical paradise that could produce great amounts of food.
Do the climate models predict that the Southwest will continue drying out in coming years? If so, that could also help solve the flooding problem unless rain events become stronger even as they become less numerous.
We have seen mixed predictions of longer droughts followed by higher-intensity ‘monsoons’ here, exacerbating the problem of flooding, amongst other things.
Yes! Natural infrastructure in dryland streams (NIDS) can be installed by both beaver or humans, using rock, wood, and mud, learn more here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub.
I hope the NSGS created a tree growing zone in the upper regions of this valley. More pools, ponds, streams, rivers, lakes, need to capture these flash events. Water is life, free energy given by mother nature. Don't follow the colonial model of agriculture. Follow the ancient meso-American ways (Aztec & Mayan) of engineering & terraforming the land.
It's amazing the steps that got us here.... people did shit like this for centuries..... but governments made it Illegal..... people went to "higher education" to rediscover all this and now the gov is giving these "higher educated" people the permission to do what they took away from us in the first place. >.> meanwhile while we weren't able to do this entire ecosystems were destroyed............. thanks government.
Beavers do a better job. Beavers once controlled that. Beavers were trapped out years ago and as they make a come back, people think it is great sport (and UA-cam videos) to break the dams.
The area where I am had Army Corps of Engineers do swales and work in my area, all the ranchers have destroyed almost all collection potential since. I am at 7k feet, where water storage isnt for use, as much as to help saturation to feed the aquifer. Unfortunately people are greedy and ignorant and can’t understand how geology works. They can’t imagine the water either soaking in and feeding the earth or even evaporating into clouds and weather. Nope, if it’s not putting money right in the pockets, it can’t be a thing. Where I am, we get less than ten inches a year, that’s it. No “upstream” flow coming our way. People downstream that rely on my water, should be happy they get any at all, because I get what I get, that’s it.
the gabions will, over time, will eventually clog, it will become a dam. their will be ponding. Why not use the method the folks in India use. a series of rounded dams that slows the water down, but enables it to easily flow over the top. Video on YT. their goal is not to stop the water, the goal is to slow the water down, and collect it in a series of smaller overflow dams upstream. rather than one big one at the bottom.
This was the result of our analysis too and a series of structures, with regular Maintenance, is recommended, thank you! There are a lot of ongoing efforts to install small structures in Ambos Nogales too, referenced herein as Green Infrastructure and Rain Gardens.
We have a lot of research comparing structures naturally or anthropogenically created from earth, wood, debris, or rock that can restore implicit function of ecosystems! Please visit our Aridland Water Harvesting Study page and/or directly access this publication describing exactly that: doi.org/10.1016/j.scitotenv.2022.157738
When it comes to managing Nature you can build a dam out of stacked engineers or you can ask, what does Nature need? Her answer would be _to sequester rainfall where it lands._ To do that you need soil. Deep dark, living soil whose role is to support life. IOW call in Regenerative Agriculture (Roger Savory is semi-local) to recover the soil fertility in all that lifeless dirt we saw on the video. Low dams may still be very useful (Peter Andrews, Oz) to slow even further the loss of water but until you understand what Nature wants to create engineered solutions will remain an expensive, disaster friendly, uphill battle.
Thank you! USGS is working with the Mulloon Institute (Peter Andrews, Oz) now and also studies work done by Savory. We agree that harvesting rainfall where it falls is useful and provides many benefits. Visit our larger study to learn more: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study
For sure! We’ve published research describing similarities between beaver dams and human-built analogs and rock detention structures (a.k.a. natural infrastructure in dryland streams (NIDS)) here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub However, there is not enough water in this specific system to maintain beavers currently, so humans are mimicking them. Thank you!
It's possible to quickly bunker water and modular infrastructure. Why people are putting themselves in the path of water is puzzling and may be socially impelled rather than cause by population pressure. Lot of knee work, but gabions can certainly do a job and not just in Nogales!
Hire a lot more experienced permaculture designers, and let them do what they do without over regulation or micro controlling them. USGA is decade's behind.
While the USGS is not funding or installing natural or green infrastructure, we work with a lot of permaculture designers, restoration practitioners, land managers, and scientists in the Sky Island Restoration Collaborative, link here if you are interested: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/news/sky-island-restoration-collaboration-sirc-sernews
Well we don't really know. There was theory and talk of 10yrs passing but there was no evidence. Graphs don't prove that this works or works here. In 10 years you never recorded footage of it working or the maturing of the sponge? As a scientist I expect demonstrable results. I watch some guys who solve drainage problems in NC and they show that their work produced results. They are just tradesmen and you couldn't do that in 10 years!
Agreed! Most people recognize that beaver dams provide a plethora of valuable ecosystem services, but many dryland reaches cannot support beavers due to lack of perennial flow and habitat. Luckily, humans have and can ‘be the beaver’, and install, maintain, and receive the benefits from the same! Visit this link to learn more: ua-cam.com/play/PLHz2Oq-JGSFnKOaTGRITRPCdrjJ1PINTm.html
I love how the data shows that they almost only work for small rainfall events (not the ones that cause the floods) and we just flew over that 😂 Maybe the money should put into more efficient measures...
This video describes how science was used to plan and create a sponge city. In the publications describing the video, we document that some structures are more (or less) effective than others, to help prioritize locating efforts in appropriate channels. We find multiple natural infrastructure, that are regularly maintained, can help lower risk.
With many individuals losing their sight... And the fact that this is paid for by U.S. taxpayers- closed captions to translate the Spanish is not acceptable. The audio should be entirely in English. It seems like a major ADA violation. Can you say LAWSUIT!?😅
If you want me to pay attention to the speakers, then they should speak American English. I have no problem with the speakers speaking Mexican Spanish, I just don't pay attention. Your choice.
Yes, a border wall solves everything, especially flooding after heavy rains. You don't think the US semi arid deserts get those? You people never stop to amaze me.
A perfect* solution for nearly a half-million people. You should suggest the same thing to everyone in Topeka and the rest of Tornado Alley. *perfectly inane.
@@ErictheHalf_bee Or any place that has hurricanes. Yeah, that is not happening either. Wildfires? and so many others. Humans adapt and they modify landscapes. It is what we do.
The use of stones is a great idea. I don't like gabions because I have seen many fail within a couple decades. Its usually because the wire mesh is made from light wires. If the structures are just made of rock they will last longer and are usually cheaper to install. In my area the rocks are cheap but the labor to fill gabions is very high so I used to design using more stone and saving the wire and labor. Failed gabions are a big expense to fix while a stone dam is usually easy and cheap. I am a retired civil engineer. Good Luck, Rick
@richardross7219 Yup.
No need for pretty gabions.
I throw/roll the biggest boulders in, first, then work upstream- filling in the gaps while increasing height.
3- 4 feet limits hydrostatic pressure( and labor).
This limits blowouts.
Careful stacking can help but takes longer so I just make a squat triangle shape, in crossection.
I also add Portland cement( aprox.1 to 10) to sand/soil in the drainage, then use this for fill among the rocks in the core.
Biggest boulders on downstream side are crucial to mitigate rocks washing out if dam gets overtopped.
We have also seen some failures and recommend any structures receive regular maintenance and stewardship to minimize damage. In high flowing arroyos, the gabions are often more secure and even if toppled over, often continue to reduce peaks and sediment transport. We also see great effects from smaller rock detention structures, beaver dams and their analogs, but each is site specific. Please visit our website for more information: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study.
Where we live, it's a combination of largish trees with roots attached and some rip rap to initially secure the trees. Rock, debris and other trees washed down the river collect and add to the structure. It's more self maintaining and actually will grow along the edges of the rivers. Then of course brush and trees are also planted to help secure the structure.
You're correct - but typically only when gabions are in a permanemt water contact zone and see repeated wet/dry cycles (tidal zones especially). In Nogales, the flows are intermittent and vast majority of the gabion structures are not subject to repeated wet/dry cycles and should last many decades. The structures will likely suffer occasional punctures due to tree debris, but repairs are easy and low tech. The beauty of gabions are their flexibility, relatively low cost and ease of installation/repair by relatively unskilled labor.
By contrast, finding/transporting/placing large rock rip rap is usually a (very) expensive solution that also requires good jobsite access for heavy machinery - not a viable solution in impoverished areas like rural Mexico, or remote sites.
Gabion baskets can be carried by hand and can be filled using local rock sources, often within the drainage area itself. Low cost solution.
@@ArthurDentZaphodBeeb You and I are from very different areas. In my area, labor is very expensive and rocks are plentiful. Digging for my personal home, yielded over 1,000 tons of 4" to 6' rock. I had to build and use a grizzley in order to have soil suitable for backfill and landscaping. Years ago there was a third alternative, Posey Sausages. They were chain link fencing that was formed into tubes and filled with rocks. These were laid into channels to prevent erosion but were very labor intensive. I took a couple of grad school courses with Prof. Posey and learned about them from him. They had been used at the Rocky Mountain Hydraulics Lab for years but, never caught on. We always have to remember that there are many different circumstances in each area around the country and world. Good Luck, Rick
Clearly working together makes a better solution. Together we are stronger and alone we are weaker against all kind of threats.
As the ancestors did. American Indians put stone dams across arroyos; when the rains came, planted downstream from them. When a dam silted, they could plant in that. Agave was common. Mesquite was used to stabilize banks and as food. Years back, when a kid working with a fencing crew, one job was to repair old dams. niio
Fantastic! Maintenance is key, thank you for sharing! We have publication describing some of those ancient structures in the North American Southwest here: s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3-euw1-ap-pe-ws4-cws-documents.ri-prod/9781032286747/9781032286747c11.pdf
We use similar structures in my community to reduce the flow of rainwater into the Chesapeake Bay.
Excellent work. I have experimented with stone walls and infiltration channels to reduce peak runoff flows and water erosion. The key is to use local resources; in my case, the land has plenty of stones.
Thank you for this touching story. Too many bad news being broadcasted regarding things that are south of the border. This was definitely a nice change.
Overall this was well done, although I agree about the music. I am a real believer in check dams. My father and I did a lot of hard labor doing minor erosion control on the family farm, including very minor check damns like shown here, when I was a child. Also transplanting plugs of hearty grasses in ravines after rainstorms. We were not in the creek bottoms to worry about flooding, but others were.
Thank you for the reply. Glad to learn of your family’s stewardship and success.
Small and frequent works better than large and infrequent.
Small and frequent means less chance of catastrophic failure, and likely less general maintenance/more improvement for effort exerted.
It's more than flooding control it's about sequestered carbon, rebuilding soil, regreening, reducing fire danger, assisting wildlife, rebuilding watertables, food security, etc.
It's about putting in effort and getting a very reasonable return.
I am concerned about the gabions because from what I understand, they always fail eventually.
Would rather see a lot more "one rock" dams to eventually replace these gabions.
The nice thing about one rock dams is that can fill in with time, raising soil level, and when its filled you build another nearby to continue to collect materials...
Not sure why gabiões can not fill in with time at least partially by soil and debris?
@@MariaCosta-Balogh The metal cages fail too soon.
@MariaCosta-Balogh
It's a different issue from them catching sediments, it's that they'll fail (because they do eventually fail) and let loose a lot of water and sediment because the supporting wire has failed...
@@b_uppy When the wire rusts you will end up with a pile of rocks if you do no maintenance. The wires will not all fail at once, you could inspect the structure to see the extent of the rust and other modes of failure. Then in 20- 50 100 years time build another structure with the rocks or build on the rocks.
@johnclements6614
This is different from a gabion privacy fence, or decorative wall. It's not "just a pile of rocks." These gabions have a bunch of wet sediment building up behind it. It's part of the "why" they're there.
These _are_ effective at accumulating silt. This is to help clear water by slowing water enough that the mud's particulate can settle out. Sediment builds up as a result. That sediment has weight and will deform and flow into the direction in the path of least resistence. If this occurs during a larger rain event this is of even more concern because forces increase. Some of these gabions depicted are quite large, well over one's head. Imagine what can happen if these give out when there is a lot of mud coming thru...
This is so sad that they do not do more rainwater harvesting with those metal and tile roofs into cisterns instead of letting it run wild in the streets. Imagine if every home gathered a thousand gallons each monsoon for use later. Talk about water retention and slow release.
Cisterns are expensive. Maybe with time. That said, respect the rainwater garden/bioswale. They can be made for the cost of a pick axe and shovel and have a lot of utility.
These rebuild groundwater levels and provide ephemeral watering places for animals, too.
With bioswales you can harvest street runoff to establish fruit trees. The fruit tree's bark sequesters problematic chemicals that would render other food plants, and makes good use of an overlooked source of water...
People are as much as they can. We put in a concrete tank, but will use plastic, as well. Another tank is to catch grey water, where it soaks into compost. That way even kitchen water is used (with its grease and so on).
I think people are probably doing what they can within their economic means. Also, this video is about gallions so they probably didn’t really touch on that but that would be an interesting video too.
People in richer countries like the US and England don't even do rainwater harvesting in private homes...why would you think this border town would do it???
The rain is sporadic. The cisterns would either be empty or overflowing. You need all of the land to soak up the water and release it slowly.
People build houses in areas that have been flooded for thousands of years. And then shock - water flooded houses again...
Show time lapse images of the gabions filling up and draining over time.
That would be a great visual! We have a lot of research showing the efficacy of rock detention structures here if you are interested in more: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study
Thank you USGS for helping communities for all!!!
Hügelkultur swales could also be a low tech solution to slow the flow and filter water, carbon capture green waste, build soil, and replenish aquifers all while creating jobs for generations.
American Indians have used them for centuries. You dig deep as you can, remove caliche, and backfill with brush, logs, and so on. Add the dirt and top with coffee grounds (a la starbucks, here) and then a heavy mulch. No water escapes them and they produce a bounty.
For sure! The efforts to install rain gardens in this video are using swales to help too!
Terraces have been used for centuries for water control... Take Machu Pichu for instance, where they used the terraced lands for agriculture and water storage. They didn't use wire mesh to hold rocks. Fabulous that we're finally getting back to environmentally fundamental solutions for perpetual issues regardless of man-made borders! 👍
Thank you! Indeed, terraces have been used for millennia for farming. Visit our publication on ancient farmers using this natural infrastructure in the Southwest here: s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3-euw1-ap-pe-ws4-cws-documents.ri-prod/9781032286747/9781032286747c11.pdf
more communities need to know about this tech, it'd be so cool to have books for different grades about usgs processes that research and address natural disasters
Thank you for this video. Thank you for your excellent work on this project.
Love this concept. For permaculture aware folks, "new research" on rock dams and water catchment is a funny phrase. These concepts are thousands if not tens or hundreds of thousands of years old. The Indian tribes in that area had sustainable agriculture with earthworks and crop rotation instead of a barren semidesert (denuded over a century ago) with seasonal flooding.
For sure this is ancient technology! Visit our publication describing some of these in the North American Southwest here: s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/s3-euw1-ap-pe-ws4-cws-documents.ri-prod/9781032286747/9781032286747c11.pdf
Yeah, and they built the pyramids, with lasers.
What can be achieved when people use science and work together.
They can also make it rain in deserts regions….not bad its the best thing I have seen in years
Working together to find solutions! Sounds like a winner to me. 🙂
Go Holland and see how they handle the problem. It has centuries of experience. No shame in learning from others.
Thank you for sharing this information.
Cant wait to see the results!
Most of the pictures and film are results of the efforts to create and plan a sponge city! If you are interested to see results of this type of installing natural infrastructure in dryland streams, please visit www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study
Honestly, this is reinventing the wheel.
They are doing good things and using modern tech to help but many of these things were used historically until they were discontinued.
Agreed! There has been a lot of confusion about various management that led to discontinuation, despite this longtime practice and qualitative observation, which is why USGS is offering scientific metrics for decision-making!
The lifespan of a gabion, or gabion basket, can range from 10 to 120 years, depending on the environment and the type of wire used to make it:
Environment
Gabions are designed to be permanent structures, but their longevity is directly related to the environment they are installed in. For example, gabions in industrial and coastal areas with moderate salinity may only last 30 years, while those in rural deserts or internal buildings with clean atmospheres may last over 100 years.
Wire type
The most common type of wire used to make gabions is galvanized steel, but PVC-coated and stainless steel wires are also used. PVC-coated galvanized gabions are estimated to last about 60 years.
Thank you for sharing this information!
Here in the Pacific Northwest mountains, the gabions are only showing to last about 5-10 years.
I'm impressed. I am curious, though; when the wire holding the blocks together inevitably gives out, is the idea that sediment has already taken its place structurally while also serving to slow the flow? If so, then this is actually pretty cool. The wire is then, like a cast, which disappears when no longer needed, like dissolvable stitches. Like I said, I'm impressed :)
What's especially worrying is the size of these. Rock gabions fail.
They need to build one rocks dams around this and build up soil levels. Plants are established around these as part of soil reclamation, flood mitigation.
One rock dams avoid wash out, rust/rebuilding issues. If they do fail, the failures are small and less likely to be catastrophic.
It's better to do small and frequent over large and centralized.
Thank you! Yes, the gabion wire will expire over time, and the structure will need to be maintained. And yes, when sediment infills the channel, fills up behind the gabion, and acts like a sponge to further detain stormwater, promote infiltration, and vegetation is supported. In the same cycle, both the sediment and vegetation act to further slow flows.
Wire in Gabons is stainless steel so very low corrosion !
@josephpadula2283
Really? Not thin, zinc coated chicken wire like in the pics?
Yes.
Borderlands Restoration and Watershed Mgmt Group have been doing this for years.
With the incoming Regime this policy goal will be in jeopardy.
Musk “DOGE” will cut the funding!😮
Borderlands Restoration Network and Watershed Management Group are both active partners here and in fact, Joaquin Murrieta-Saldivar (WSM) is leading a workshop there today!
Brilliant initiative.
Starting at the top of the watershed and working downstream- with overflows being channeled off on a shallow dipping contour( spreading the water out overland)- they absolutely can mitigate flooding.
Why didn't Noah do that in Iraq 🇮🇶?
@mrbaab5932 It was a worldwide tsunami. The only escape was to high ground.
Mt Ararat
In the ancient Middle East flooding was partially controlled by placing medium sized rocks on hillsides to slow and funnel the flow of water to designated channels.
I can't help but wonder if introducing beavers to the environment would be prudent or feasible.
We’ve published research discusses the capability of and functional similarities between beaver dams and anthropogenic rock detention structures (both natural infrastructure in dryland streams), documented by decades of scientific study, here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub However, there is not enough water in this specific system to maintain beavers currently, so humans are mimicking them.
It's better to build trenches and terraces to hold the rainfall on the hillside . You will be holding the water where it is needed and slowing down the sediment .
The graph at 4:42 suggests that an enormous portion of water is being absorbed by the soil since without absorption the areas under the curves should be equal.
Yes, when sediment is trapped at the structures, it helps to slow flows, and grow vegetation, which act to further delay stormwater. We describe these mechanisms in this video: ua-cam.com/video/c2tYI7jUdU0/v-deo.html
Job well done
I have been learning about this for years wondering why the united states doesn't do this. I just assumed the government loves disasters and suffering.
Subtitles too small. But thanks for the informative video.
👍 working together
Interested if they have explored using a lot more porous concrete in areas where natural solutions are not possible. Since there is minimal freezing temperatures there the more porous concrete could be effective
That is very expensive to install, and very expensive to maintain, as well as being generally intensive.
You must clean it frequently...
Harvesting rainwater makes much more sense because it mitigates flooding while adding to resources instead of depleting them.
Would be better if they did lots of one-rock dams instead of larger, more centralized gabions because gabions fail, require much more maintenance, and I more money intensive.
Opting for smaller, hyperlocalized solutions, including raingardens and bioswales reduces the risk of catastrophic failure, and builds benefits more evenly...
What a beautiful solution, Thank🍁you women. You’re working as nature, respecting nature that humans on both side of the fence receive the same humane solution to the flooding. 🌺🙏🏼🌺
Structure s i see with the gabion are too large. Micro dam's and a lot more of them farther up closer to the start point. Small$$ but can have big results.
Get rid of the music. I speak for everyone that is here for the knowledge!
Olá sou do Brasil vocês conhecem a Permacultura? A solução deles pra isso são curvas de nivel nos morros que desaguam nesse córrego onde fizeram a barragem. Pesquisem sobre isso, e uma vez feito a curva de nível plantem árvores nelas , a curva de nível vai reter as águas.
¡Gracias!
Are beaver dams natural sponge solutions?
Yes. But it is very dry there.
Yes! Natural infrastructure in dryland streams (NIDS) can be installed by both beaver or humans, using rock, wood, and mud, learn more here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub.
Nice to see ancient techniques being brought back.
Now they just need to put sokar and water collection on each roof.
¿porque falta subtítulos en español para la narración en inglés?
Para activar los subtítulos en español:
1. Ubique el botón CC en la esquina inferior derecha de la pantalla y haga clic en él para activar los subtítulos.
2. Accede al menú Configuración (representado por un ícono de ajustes) y selecciona "Subtítulos".
3. Elija "Español (México)" y desplácese hacia abajo para seleccionar "Español".
I think terracing like the Indians in the mountainous areas of South America might be a better idea - not sure if that's what you're trying to do here or not. It would need to be done on a massive scale, but it might just turn this area into a tropical paradise that could produce great amounts of food.
Very cool
Do the climate models predict that the Southwest will continue drying out in coming years? If so, that could also help solve the flooding problem unless rain events become stronger even as they become less numerous.
We have seen mixed predictions of longer droughts followed by higher-intensity ‘monsoons’ here, exacerbating the problem of flooding, amongst other things.
So farmers with private dams ant retention ponds get fines for holding water but its ok when the government dose it
leaky dams slow the flow, not stop it.
@@neill392We know that, but the water right laws don’t agree. It’s stupid.
Exactly. Anyone who has dealt with the western states water right laws would love to use these techniques, but know they can’t!
Beaver dam analogs
Yes! Natural infrastructure in dryland streams (NIDS) can be installed by both beaver or humans, using rock, wood, and mud, learn more here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub.
The beaver dam Gabon will build up trash and act like a dam, and collapse may cause high hazards.
I hope the NSGS created a tree growing zone in the upper regions of this valley. More pools, ponds, streams, rivers, lakes, need to capture these flash events. Water is life, free energy given by mother nature. Don't follow the colonial model of agriculture. Follow the ancient meso-American ways (Aztec & Mayan) of engineering & terraforming the land.
It's amazing the steps that got us here....
people did shit like this for centuries..... but governments made it Illegal..... people went to "higher education" to rediscover all this and now the gov is giving these "higher educated" people the permission to do what they took away from us in the first place. >.>
meanwhile while we weren't able to do this entire ecosystems were destroyed............. thanks government.
Beavers do a better job. Beavers once controlled that. Beavers were trapped out years ago and as they make a come back, people think it is great sport (and UA-cam videos) to break the dams.
Fast waters move boulders. Who knows.
The area where I am had Army Corps of Engineers do swales and work in my area, all the ranchers have destroyed almost all collection potential since.
I am at 7k feet, where water storage isnt for use, as much as to help saturation to feed the aquifer.
Unfortunately people are greedy and ignorant and can’t understand how geology works. They can’t imagine the water either soaking in and feeding the earth or even evaporating into clouds and weather.
Nope, if it’s not putting money right in the pockets, it can’t be a thing.
Where I am, we get less than ten inches a year, that’s it. No “upstream” flow coming our way. People downstream that rely on my water, should be happy they get any at all, because I get what I get, that’s it.
Where do you live..
It's sad that people are so greedy & ignorant to take care of the environment.
the gabions will, over time, will eventually clog, it will become a dam. their will be ponding. Why not use the method the folks in India use. a series of rounded dams that slows the water down, but enables it to easily flow over the top. Video on YT. their goal is not to stop the water, the goal is to slow the water down, and collect it in a series of smaller overflow dams upstream. rather than one big one at the bottom.
This was the result of our analysis too and a series of structures, with regular Maintenance, is recommended, thank you! There are a lot of ongoing efforts to install small structures in Ambos Nogales too, referenced herein as Green Infrastructure and Rain Gardens.
Can you put mud in those rock structures? Or dead trees? Look how beavers build dams,
We have a lot of research comparing structures naturally or anthropogenically created from earth, wood, debris, or rock that can restore implicit function of ecosystems! Please visit our Aridland Water Harvesting Study page and/or directly access this publication describing exactly that: doi.org/10.1016/j.scitotenv.2022.157738
When it comes to managing Nature you can build a dam out of stacked engineers or you can ask, what does Nature need? Her answer would be _to sequester rainfall where it lands._ To do that you need soil. Deep dark, living soil whose role is to support life. IOW call in Regenerative Agriculture (Roger Savory is semi-local) to recover the soil fertility in all that lifeless dirt we saw on the video. Low dams may still be very useful (Peter Andrews, Oz) to slow even further the loss of water but until you understand what Nature wants to create engineered solutions will remain an expensive, disaster friendly, uphill battle.
Thank you! USGS is working with the Mulloon Institute (Peter Andrews, Oz) now and also studies work done by Savory. We agree that harvesting rainfall where it falls is useful and provides many benefits. Visit our larger study to learn more: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/science/aridland-water-harvesting-study
Beavers have been doing this same thing for millennia 🙂
For sure! We’ve published research describing similarities between beaver dams and human-built analogs and rock detention structures (a.k.a. natural infrastructure in dryland streams (NIDS)) here: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969722048379?via%3Dihub However, there is not enough water in this specific system to maintain beavers currently, so humans are mimicking them. Thank you!
Wrong video yet here we go. Happy Thanksgiving Merry Christmas and Happy New Year
Yes
Rock damn is a very good idea why not
Better hope Trump doesn't hear about this excellent program.
Lol, because he will try to take credit for it?
He'd probably try to stop it, our take credit for it if he thought it would work
Don’t build in a flood area
🎉🎉👏🏽👏🏽
It's possible to quickly bunker water and modular infrastructure. Why people are putting themselves in the path of water is puzzling and may be socially impelled rather than cause by population pressure. Lot of knee work, but gabions can certainly do a job and not just in Nogales!
There are simpler, better, cheaper structures than gabions, but good on them for trying...
Hire a lot more experienced permaculture designers, and let them do what they do without over regulation or micro controlling them. USGA is decade's behind.
While the USGS is not funding or installing natural or green infrastructure, we work with a lot of permaculture designers, restoration practitioners, land managers, and scientists in the Sky Island Restoration Collaborative, link here if you are interested: www.usgs.gov/centers/western-geographic-science-center/news/sky-island-restoration-collaboration-sirc-sernews
100years maybe you should have moved the dam town out of that valley 75 years ago
They say that hindsight is 20/20 and yes, we also recommend avoiding building and living in flood-prone areas when possible.
turn off the background MUSIC>
Occupants are the problem. Stop living where the water kills you.
Just don't build your house where is floods.... like 200 feet up a hill is not that much further
Well we don't really know. There was theory and talk of 10yrs passing but there was no evidence. Graphs don't prove that this works or works here. In 10 years you never recorded footage of it working or the maturing of the sponge? As a scientist I expect demonstrable results. I watch some guys who solve drainage problems in NC and they show that their work produced results. They are just tradesmen and you couldn't do that in 10 years!
Where in NC, I live in NC.
I would like to see evidence of work being done & the results, I would like see what was done & how it was done.
Click "like" if you want to see rock dams built instead of endless war funding. -------->
Just leave the beaver dams alone, and they will do the job.
Do they have Beavers along the US Mexico border?
Agreed! Most people recognize that beaver dams provide a plethora of valuable ecosystem services, but many dryland reaches cannot support beavers due to lack of perennial flow and habitat. Luckily, humans have and can ‘be the beaver’, and install, maintain, and receive the benefits from the same! Visit this link to learn more: ua-cam.com/play/PLHz2Oq-JGSFnKOaTGRITRPCdrjJ1PINTm.html
I love how the data shows that they almost only work for small rainfall events (not the ones that cause the floods) and we just flew over that 😂 Maybe the money should put into more efficient measures...
4:38 The earthworks lower the water levels so they don't overflow the bank and cause deadly floods. It helps if you actually pay attention. 🙂
This video describes how science was used to plan and create a sponge city. In the publications describing the video, we document that some structures are more (or less) effective than others, to help prioritize locating efforts in appropriate channels. We find multiple natural infrastructure, that are regularly maintained, can help lower risk.
More government funding that needs to be cut.
With many individuals losing their sight... And the fact that this is paid for by U.S. taxpayers- closed captions to translate the Spanish is not acceptable. The audio should be entirely in English. It seems like a major ADA violation. Can you say LAWSUIT!?😅
Sounds like a worthwhile endeavour. Take them to court over this and waste some more taxpayer money. Good luck!
DEI verbage- no bueno for Fed agency!
No
Let Mexico worry about themselves. America first! 🇺🇸
You are not the brightest bulb, are you? This method could benefit everyone on both sides of _any_ border.
@@mathiasfriman8927 You just don’t get it.
@@AppalachianPatriotyou're the one who doesn't get it.
@@lorettarussell3235 I get it. I’m not a Liberal/Leftist/Democrat.
If you want me to pay attention to the speakers, then they should speak American English. I have no problem with the speakers speaking Mexican Spanish, I just don't pay attention. Your choice.
If you can't read the captions, you are not worthy of the information.
A correct border wall would solve it, something tunnel proof, seismic sensors
Yes, a border wall solves everything, especially flooding after heavy rains. You don't think the US semi arid deserts get those? You people never stop to amaze me.
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz how about . . . don't live there
A perfect* solution for nearly a half-million people. You should suggest the same thing to everyone in Topeka and the rest of Tornado Alley.
*perfectly inane.
@@ErictheHalf_bee Or any place that has hurricanes. Yeah, that is not happening either. Wildfires? and so many others. Humans adapt and they modify landscapes. It is what we do.
Instead of gabion retainers, could have dug keyline trenches to distribute the water onto the ridges.
Far cheaper and more effective at soaking water.
Why not both?
Keyline trenches appear to be effective too.
No