Very curious as to your thoughts on the flower hackamore? And whether you think it is realistic to think of teaching a horse to ride in the correct frame with it? I ride my horse in it with the reins on one of the 'regular' circles rather than the leverage action circle if that makes sense. Personally cannot go bitted at the moment just as my horse still has his wolf teeth. Awesome videos, recently found your channel and really enjoying watching through them. I love love love your mums commentary when she films you riding!
Shelby - Great you are providing options with pros and cons. This is what a professional should provide to their audience without bias (other than what is working for their horses). Very proud of the approach you are taking. So proud of you kiddo.
Shelby, you should be so proud of yourself as a human being. I'm 64 years old and I've been exposed to a lot of people in this world and can spot a phony a furlong away. You're the real deal.
I really love your review on this. I didn't even know leather bits were a thing. I do prefer bitless when riding, but if I have to ride in a bit, I should aim to get this leather bit. Thank you for this review. You're very knowledgeable in this industry, not biased at all like some people.
I have that same Sweet Billy’s Bit. My old horse goes very nicely in it too. Thanks for this detailed review! Wish we could show in these... You and Milo look wonderful.
Thanks for the video Shelby! These informative videos are really helpful! Your review videos are always great to watch because you give a full overview of the item and the pros and cons of them. Not just your opinions but also facts about the items.
We are riding the ottb in our stable with a leather bit. He's extremely sensitive in his mouth but tends to get too strong to ride completely bitless. Since using the leather bit he has gotten much better and has become so much easier to collect!
Some day I would really like to see disciplines change their rules for bits when showing, I feel like we shouldn't have so many rules for what you use (I mean like using leather or rubber bits or different rings, obviously you shouldn't go around the jumper ring in a western shank or have a beginner in dressage show in a double bridle) in the show ring. If your horse goes better in a slightly stronger bit, even if you show hunters over fences, you should be able to show in that with no judgement. Or if you ride and show in dressage, you should be allowed to use a leather or rubber bit. I'm not saying ALL bits are a okay, my personal goal is to have the horse in the softest bit possible for them (And I don't like or use super harsh bits if I can help it) but if the horse goes best in a certain bit they should be allowed to show in that bit. Sorry for rambling, I was just kinda thinking about that while watching this video.
Love my flower hack, and now realizing I need a leather bit! Price is so reasonable for a new bit! Hope it lasts for a good while and my horse doesn't chew through it! Thanks for the review!
I love the flower hacks, mostly because they can work as a side pull and have a little leverage if needed! We’ve used a little S hack for our on and off the track arabs from time to time and I love switching to give them the best option! :) maybe we’ll give a leather bit a go. (:
I would love to try one of these and I am sure my barrel horse would love it and my older would chew though it and I totally agree I can’t stand those big Tom thumbs I will still ride with a light bit if I running competition but for practicing this would be amazing
Huh, i never knew about these. I may look into them more later. But thank you Shelby, for not just saying "Milo liked it, and it seems to be pretty good". Pros and cons are needed when making a good decision!!
YES! Thanks so much, love your channel 😁 Also, I dont know if I asked, but do you have Horse A Lot? It’s an amazing app, you can post your training methods and answer questions. Now I’m going to try it on my horse, she may or may not like it though...
Great video! Never heard of leather bits, but I doubt my mare would like it since she's not that easy to collect. Milo seems much more comfortable in it!
Credit where credit is due: good girl! And thank you! I hate any metal on a horse, as you probably know, and that means anywhere, but a leather bit I can live with. Or a flexible rubber one. A lot safer for the horse in hard hands. Thank you for reviewing this. Now all you riders need to do is get this one legal for dressage. Get off your butts ladies and pressure the Federation. Letters, emails, protests, calls, whining at contests to the judges until they get fed up. They are there for the riders, not the other way around.
I always find it interesting that rates shows have rules like can’t go bitless or a leather bit. I wonder if long a go someone ruined it for everyone else or if they are just set in their ways.
Hi Shelby! I have a been riding a horse with what we think has early signs of Navicular in his front right hoof and possibly left considering it often is in both but usually worse in one side making it appear as the other is fine. He gallops and rears in the pasture and usually stops limping once he walks for a few minutes if he limps at all. For the most part he is often sound and I make sure that I ride him on soft ground and I put boots that protect the sole of his feet when we go on a rare trail ride. I have been riding him for a year and a half and he is my heart horse so I am considering buying him even though he has this issue instead of leasing a 4th level dressage horse. Would you buy a horse with navicular? I’ve heard a lot of stories of horses with navicular that once they have wedges and egg bar shoes they are completely sound for the most part with the occasional off day. I’ve even heard stories of horses doing the upper levels of dressage and jumping! I’ve talked to 3 people about this and done a lot of research but I’d like another opinion from someone as open minded as you! I will definitely talk to my vet but I’d like more than one opinion! Thank you! Edit: I don’t plan on doing excessive riding on him, 3-4 times a week at most and I don’t plan on doing more than flat work/lower levels of dressage. He’s only 12 and I don’t want his career to end early because of this as he does still enjoy working some instead of standing there 24/7 in a pasture or stall.
For horses that don’t like bits what are the bitless options you would recommend that won’t damage the horses nasal bone or nerve bundles? Love your videos and your horses! ❤️
Katie Laeger I know you're asking Shelby, but a padded sidepull is the lightest and most gentle you can get. Other gentle bitless options would include flower hackamore, star hackamores, wheel hackamores, etc, and then plain leather sidepulls and things of the like. Similar things would be a leather bosal, a plain nylon halter, or a classic thick bosal (in trained hands-harsh hands can make a bosal like that harsh). A step up from there for harshness would put you at rope halters, rope noseband side pulls, thin rawhide bosals, etc. Anything that puts all the pressure on a tiny area of tissue. Up from that would be little s hackamores (with leather nosebands!), jumping hackamores (the thin ones with cross under reins), and very short shanked mechanical hackamores. Up from there is going to be your normal or average short shanked hackamores, and some of the quicker release cross unders. Up even more is a rope noseband version of the little s, or any other short shanked thing. The harshest is your long shanked mechanical hackamore, and your standard Dr. Cooks (as it doesnt release pressure). The of course you have the "why would you ever put that on a horse you sadist" option- bike chain mechanical hackamores and wire noseband mechanical hackamores. I hope that gave you an idea of the gradient of bitless options :) (my older horse rides in a flower hack, and he's relatively good except for issues stopping, and a tendency to spook pretty intensely)
I imagine my old, cranky pony to not like these. but I actually really want to try. he's just at that point where he doesn't like bits or hackamores, or even being ridden. but he has to put up with me until my younger gelding has more miles on him. he might like these, though.
Hi Shelby, I had a few questions about the bit itself. So 1) i’ve heard some people talk about soaking their leather bits in something along the lines of sunflower oil to soften it before it goes in their mouth. what are your thoughts on that/would you ever do something like that? 2) Does the small metal piece at the center of the leather make a difference performance-wise (for example, can the horse feel when its there vs not) or is it just to prevent the horses chewing through the bit? Thank you! Super excited to see if I can find one of these near me ☺️💗
Sophie.Grace 42 These ones are pre soaked and the metal piece on the leather covered ones is pretty thick so it would make quite a difference in flexibility
Shelby Dennis oh that’s interesting! thank you! as far as getting one of these made, do you think i could have a local craftsman/leather worker create one of these and attach the rings for the headstall/bridle and reins?
Sophie.Grace 42 yeah probably. The Etsy store that Shelby mentioned in the description, Sweet Billy’s Bits sells them for 35 dollars though which is probably cheaper than what you would get custom
I’ve been super interested in using leather bits for my boy because he’s sensitive but I’m dressage rider and it’s not legal so I haven’t. Hope to see them legalized in the show ring soon,
Oh and did you hear that hazel park in Michigan shut down? Awful situation. They didn't give any notice. None. Everyone showed up for work one day and they were told to go home. People are scrambling to find new tracks for their horses too. If anyone is looking, I imagine there will be quite a few looking for new owners.
The one thing that I'm weary of is the leather bits growing mould, have you seen this happen with the bits you have? Or have you heard of it happening?
That shouldn't happen to any leather so long as it's properly kept. Same with bridles and saddles, if it's growing mould then they aren't being properly taken care of.
NippleNinja2 I would wipe it down with saline solution or a diluted alcohol-type wound spray for cleaning but regular cleaning wiping down with water would be fine
could this become moldy from it getting wet all time in the horses mouth all the time or is it relatively clean? I always worry about build ups of bacteria in bits, even metal ones, it just seems to be something people really don't talk about when it comes to bits I'm curious to hear thoughts on the subject anyone might have.
I'm so glad you are doing UA-cam . You are only a few of youtubers that actually don't moan about bits and they hurt horses . Yes bits can hurt horses but only if the owners , riders or trainers use them improperly. #Shelbyisbest
Lily Williamson Not if it’s taken care of. The leather bit covered bit at the track is over a decade old and still in perfect condition. I also live in an extremely wet environment so any leather tack will be exposed to dampness fairly frequently. It’s just about taking care of it, leather is frequently used in damp environments even for human fashion and it lasts
Both bitless and leather bits or anything that isn't traditional(rubber included) everyone preaches about how bitless or softer bits are legal to compete in but they aren't at least not where I live and under Equine Canada rules.
Hay it me the bit maker I make a leather mouth with a metal chain to keep it from coming a part and he thuth the leather i can replace the leather so you don't have to buy a new one
Do you think it would be more comfortable for him if you got it wet before putting it in his mouth? You said that it would feel kinda rough when it's in his mouth dry until it became wet. I honestly like rubber and leather bits and I'm happy to see a lot more people transitioning to them. I would definitely use this on my horse if I was forced to go back into bits or if I got a horse that I won't listen bit less. It seems like he liked it and I'm glad you like it as well. Keep up the great work! 🐴🐎👍🏻😊
No, it’s the warmth of the mouth that softens it and does so quickly. It’s no different than putting in a rubber bit when it goes in dry. I never said rough, I just said that it softens and moulds to the mouth. The bit is smooth leather, not rough..
The leather doesn't chafe? All I can think of are these leather pants I used to have and when they got moist from sweat..good God they weren't comfortable in tender places. I can only imagine the smell after a while of use too. Stinky horse spit plus wet leather. What about hygiene? Do you have to sterilize it often so bacteria can't grow? I think my I her germaphobe would twitch to death, but I can see the pros of a leather bit...just don't think I could use one without being grossed out. Mostly, I use a hackamore, but we may get a horse for my husband to ride and it uses a bit.
Pheeno Barbidoll It gets softer from moisture so would be far less like to chafe than metal or rubber. It’s really no less hygienic than riding in leather tack lol
Shelby Dennis True...the idea of mouth germs just squick me out. Phobias aren't known for their firm grasp on logic lol My vision of hell would be being forced into dentistry. Ugh.
I ride my mare in a Pelham, she's a Ottb and a hunter, how do you deal with death threats? so many people dm me with hurtful things to the point where ive had to delete my instagram because of it
HalflingerEQ I am so sorry to hear that anyone would send you death threats. That is cruel and unreasonable behaviour on their part, and you need to report their comments to whichever social media site they are commenting on. People like that need to be held accountable for their words. You are not in the wrong- they are. A Pelham can be used kindly, especially when the rider uses the snaffle rein predominantly and does not rely on the curb rein. Please ignore the cruel people, and if you work with a trainer focus on what your trainer suggests instead😊
We dip them... this is a review, not a how to use them, which is why you also don’t see me untacking but that doesn’t mean I left my horse tacked for 3 days. Anyways, with leather wiping them down is probably better since it’s porous and when they’re moist already washing them isn’t really going to do much because they’ve already been saturated.
Some of the metal ware used in dressage horses mouths is grotesque , the degree of neck bending and vicious controlling by using these devices is abhorrent, why are bit less and leather bridles not allowed on the dressage scene ? less substantial control?and aesthetics ?.
Sarah Jones bitless should be allowed but dressage has the strictest rules regarding bitting. Abrasive mouthpieces and large shanks aren’t allowed like they are in many many other arenas. I think it’s a massive generalization to claim they’re grotesque and vicious
@@Milestone-Equestrian In U.K, and Europe the format is double bit ,bit ring , savage curb chain etc ,no generalisation let alone Massive unfortunately why are these contraptions standard in dressage I ask again?
Sarah Jones Thats only for the upper levels. The double bridles are not allowed in lower levels and are for refinement. It’s a huge generalization to try to claim that everyone uses one when it’s specific to upper level riders. The shanks and the curbs are more humane than what is allowed in western disciplines, show jumping and more. You’re massively mistaken about how they work and the notion that everyone uses them... please go read up on bitting regulations in dressage before having an opinion on it. There’s laws in place for both noseband and curb chain tightness and the shank length. The mouthpieces are smooth. If you want to talk savagery, go to the jumper ring where nothing is regulated and the set ups are much much worse with no refinement of hands like dressage riders have.
@@Milestone-Equestrian Thank-you for both replies .but I still think that any form of bit misuse is savagery and the bleeding mouths abound with horses having their heads yanked about especially in the racing and jumping scene ,what do you think of Hackamore bridles and the use of them? times are changing and a lot of horse welfare issues are being exposed especially in the National Hunt racing world in the U.K I hope it is for the horses sake and not just to save the face of racing as people are leaving the sport due to the numbers of fatalities which are horrendous and are listed on deathwatch U.K each week..... Finally and most certainly not least I send a huge respect and gratitude to horse people who really look after their charges and have their best interests at heart I see that you are clearly one of these.
Sarah Jones Again, dressage has some of the best bitting regulations so the misuse is far less there than other disciplines. There’s also blood rules in place that result in disqualification. The facial nerves are still very sensitive and can cause the same amounts of pain and damage as bits when misused it’s just less obvious since it’s soft and hard tissues. There’s some bits that shouldn’t exist but they exist outside of dressage and aren’t allowed in that ring but at the end of the day any equipment can be abused but that doesn’t make the equipment itself had
I do, and bridleless. But bits are useful for dressage work and getting proper carriage. Also, facial nerves are sensitive, too. All up to what the horse prefers but I think my horses are pretty happy considering if I can ride bridleless, they’re inherently softer than anyone who doesn’t have that level of control
Evi Marioli There doesn’t “have” to be but a lot of horses go better with one and considering they’re not abusive whatsoever unless they’re misused, I’d love to know why you’re questioning the use of the softest bit on the market.
@@Milestone-Equestrian 1.I don't think bits are abuse but I'm 100% sure they are uncomfortable to the horse 2. No animal wants something in their mouth but they need some time to get used to a hackamore...all those people saying that their horse likes bit is bacause they only tried bitless one and were too bored to try a second time so that the horse can get used to it 3.What I don't understand is that u can do with a bit what u can do bitless so why do u have one...what if there's a chance 1 in a billion your horse doesn't like bits? *No difference to u huge difference to him*
Evi Marioli No horse “likes” having pressure on its face especially when it’s been proven that the hard palates of the face are less equipped to handle it. A hackamore is way harsher than this leather bit. Question for you, why do you rely on pressure for control anyways? Evidently you need your hands more than I do considering my horse also goes bridleless.
Evi Marioli Also like... tons of animals go out of their way to play with things and put them in their mouth and many horses open their mouths for the bit and don’t want to drop t after. To say no animal wants something in their mouth is a load of shit 😂. My horse does like his bit. I’ve more than tried bitless because he can go without anything.
@@Milestone-Equestrian I honestly have NO PROBLEM with leather bits so good job for trying it and I really hope u will use it more but can we PLEASE agree that anything metal on the horse's face is wrong?I wouldn't put anything metallic on my dog/cat/cow/goat so what's the difference with horses?Just cause it's "tradition" doesn't make it ok
That person 04 Because my horse goes way better in a bit? And no, not at all 😂 that’s like me saying why go bitless if the bridle will eventually break and you’ll need to get a new one
I have a couple of concerns about this bit though. Leather I know if exposed to being wetted a lot can start to grow mold and might make the horse sick and possibly die. My other concern is that leather might start to get rough and possibly cut up the horses mouth. I don't think bits in general should be used. Being with your horse with body language and cues is more of a free way of riding to how I see it.
Phantom Of Memories The leather shouldn't grow mold or get rough if it's being cared for and cleaned properly. Those would be issues created by rider negligence and not inherently a flaw in the bit design itself.
It shouldn’t get rough either as it softens in the horses mouth, I think it’d be pretty much impossible for it to develop sharp points because of that. You’re far more likely to get roughing happening with plastic bits. You can be with your horse and their body language whilst using a bit.
I see where your coming from because the bits look moist but ive sewn with leather and if the leather is properly oiled and soaked well with oil it will repel moisture just like someone who oils their saddle after almost every ride can get it wet without worrying about water damage. Proper care and storage is key but that does mean the user has to take care of their equipment
Phantom Of Memories while I can appreciate your concern regarding a horse getting sick, the likelihood of a horse possibly dying from any mould on a bit is infinitesimal. A horse's system, while sensitive in some ways, is very different from a human's and since they live outdoors, eat off varied surfaces, nibble on things that could host mould or bacteria, they are far better equipped to handle these types of situations. Like a leather saddle, a leather bit will typically dry out quite well after use by being hung in a dry, warm tack room where mould is less likely to grow😊
Well I don't like bits I don't ride yet I am a beginner but I wish people can not use bites and I respect your choice but otherwise it's still like your videos and your horses LOL I have three horses that are race horses so one of them is Crystal she is both of my little horses mother their names are 7 because she has a 7 on her forehead she is the oldest sister and her youngest sister which was born on April 4th is name to Ruby and all of them are girls all of them are thoroughbreds LOL love you and your horses
Thank you! I encourage you to further your knowledge and understanding of bits before making a conclusive decision. It's important to be open minded for both bitless and bitted options as at the end of the day it's whatever works best for the horse and neither is truly kinder based off of the physiology of the horse.
Alexandra_Kittendaughter XxSpirtXxSso In what world is it an “extreme” to ride in a snaffle? Why do you need to know where it’s from? Just ride bitless if it’s too “extreme” for you amiright
Alexandra_Kittendaughter XxSpirtXxSso I'm not trying to bad-mouth you here (no pun intended), so please don't take offense at what I'm about to share, I'm just trying to open everyone's minds who think that one thing is always better than another, no matter the horse, gear or circumstances, etc. I've had multiple horses of whom I've tried every style of bitless bridle on the market, most of which they all hated more than bits... the only two that worked were custom made side-pulls & the worst bridles by far were cross-unders (which caused all manner of dangerous behaviour just to get the wretched things off their poor heads), yet almost every horse responded so well to a Myler Comfort Snaffle they actually put their heads down and open their mouths ready for their bitted bridle, and work so happily in them they actually enjoy what they do, so sometimes bitless is worse than forking out multiple pay packets for innovative bits that may or may not work. For me and my farm, if a horse doesn't like bitted or bitless then they retire from all riding altogether. Just speaking from my own personal experiences with bitless and bitted bridles so people know that though they should go ahead and try that side-pull bitless bridle they've been wanting to try, but not expect more positive results than than the likes of this leather bit, and if they want to try the bit then try it. Keep an open mind, people... the best horse trainers are the ones who never stop looking to learn from others - horses and people - rather than having an opinion set in stone. What works for one doesn't necessarily mean it'll work for another. And Shelby, keep up the good work, your review has broadened my horizon of leather bits.
Just ride bitless? the issue with the leather bit is a horse can chew through it, it also tends to sit on the tongue and not be as valuable as a snaffle- it's a hundred times better than sticking metal in there for sure but it's still pretty unnecessary
TheAssholeProphet USE WHATEVER YOUR HORSE WORKS BEST IN. Bitless options “sit on the nose” and create twice as much pressure onto areas less equipped to deal with it. Not all horses like that. The tongue is far better equipped to handle pressure so bits that use predominately tongue pressure are far softer than bitless options acting on the mandibular nerve and hard palates of the face due to the nerve density in these facial areas. Horses can blow throw bitless options and ignore them or create head tossing habits as an attempt to escape them. All pieces of equipment have their pros and cons which is why it is SO important not to have the “my way or the highway” mentality of someone such as yourself when it comes to using equipment. Also, this leather bit IS a snaffle. Please learn about the equipment you’re talking about before trying to weigh in. You have such a habit of coming onto my channel and making comments entirely unfounded by fact. I get that you like bitless and that’s fine but don’t act like your opinion is fact.
"Bitless options “sit on the nose” and create twice as much pressure onto areas less equipped to deal with it." Where are your sources on that? And where are your sources that "the tongue is far better equipped to handle pressure (than the nose)". Not trying to hate, genuinely curious. It seems like a lot of these bitless vs bit debates are just people from both sides pulling facts out of thin air.
melodymare I have about 20+ sources on my bitting videos that you’re free to look up. I find it rather interesting that people typically never demand sources from pro bitless people making claims that all bits are worse than bitless but the second I refer to something from my studies in a comment, people assume I haven’t done my homework
TheAssholeProphet it would be exceedingly difficult for a horse to chew through a leather bit quickly, as most leather bits are layers of leather stitched together. Over time it would be possible, but all equipment we use for horses can wear down and need replacement at some point. If a leather bit is softer, gentler and works well with certain horses, I am sure most owners would be okay with replacing it when it starts to degrade to the point of needing replacement- at least I know I would😊
More than that die a week due to being turned out, are you going to start depriving your horse of natural behaviours just because they have a tendency to hurt themselves? 24 a week out of the millions racing is negligible and I'd also love to see your source for that.
like a horse Do you ride? What level of experience do you have in riding in either a bit or bitless? Have you observed in person and over a period of time this equine behaviour of "constant pain" caused by a bit? If not, you do not have the requisite first-hand experience to make such a claim. In absence of some extended personal experience, you would need to gather valid studies and research of equine behaviour indicative of "constant pain" from a bit in order to make an educated comment.
Read ride Learn That was my opinion which I am aloud to have .I think that people should stop riding in bits .You don’t need to observe anything to think that .
like a horse of course you are allowed to have a opinion, however your comment was not worded as an opinion- it was worded as a statement of fact. When you state that her horse cannot get away from the constant pain, you are making a claim, not an opinion. It is also disconcerting to see you make such a claim on a video in which it is the rider is reviewing and riding in a leather bit, which is very soft, and therefore highly unlikely to cause pain.
A bit used for communication uses pressure, a bit used for control uses pain. Some are of course more inheritly cruel than others and most people you see use a bit for control, but that does not mean all bits cause pain, especially not constant pain
Code is the chestnut with the blaze in the flower hack, the text moved onto the filly I ride in the leather bit. Oops
Very curious as to your thoughts on the flower hackamore? And whether you think it is realistic to think of teaching a horse to ride in the correct frame with it? I ride my horse in it with the reins on one of the 'regular' circles rather than the leverage action circle if that makes sense. Personally cannot go bitted at the moment just as my horse still has his wolf teeth.
Awesome videos, recently found your channel and really enjoying watching through them. I love love love your mums commentary when she films you riding!
Shelby - Great you are providing options with pros and cons. This is what a professional should provide to their audience without bias (other than what is working for their horses). Very proud of the approach you are taking. So proud of you kiddo.
Shelby, you should be so proud of yourself as a human being. I'm 64 years old and I've been exposed to a lot of people in this world and can spot a phony a furlong away. You're the real deal.
best comment ever
I really love your review on this. I didn't even know leather bits were a thing. I do prefer bitless when riding, but if I have to ride in a bit, I should aim to get this leather bit. Thank you for this review. You're very knowledgeable in this industry, not biased at all like some people.
LOVE the way you explain things so rationally thanks for sharing!
That one dislike is Raleigh
TheMiningDog14 And Rick
TheMiningDog14 lmao
Ok so What?What u don't realize people is that many people ride without a bit not just Raleigh and Rick
Evi Marioli The point is that these people (Well only Reighleigh) harrasses people for riding in a bit.
R/woosh
Evi Marioli it’s called a joke honey
I have that same Sweet Billy’s Bit. My old horse goes very nicely in it too. Thanks for this detailed review! Wish we could show in these...
You and Milo look wonderful.
Thanks for the video Shelby!
These informative videos are really helpful!
Your review videos are always great to watch because you give a full overview of the item and the pros and cons of them. Not just your opinions but also facts about the items.
We are riding the ottb in our stable with a leather bit. He's extremely sensitive in his mouth but tends to get too strong to ride completely bitless. Since using the leather bit he has gotten much better and has become so much easier to collect!
The realization that we have gone really far with tack design and bits
Another AMAZING video Shelby!!!! Excited for the next!!!
Some day I would really like to see disciplines change their rules for bits when showing, I feel like we shouldn't have so many rules for what you use (I mean like using leather or rubber bits or different rings, obviously you shouldn't go around the jumper ring in a western shank or have a beginner in dressage show in a double bridle) in the show ring. If your horse goes better in a slightly stronger bit, even if you show hunters over fences, you should be able to show in that with no judgement. Or if you ride and show in dressage, you should be allowed to use a leather or rubber bit. I'm not saying ALL bits are a okay, my personal goal is to have the horse in the softest bit possible for them (And I don't like or use super harsh bits if I can help it) but if the horse goes best in a certain bit they should be allowed to show in that bit.
Sorry for rambling, I was just kinda thinking about that while watching this video.
100% agree, great comment
Great review. Until your video here and Jeteventings video, I'd never heard of this bit. Thanks for sharing!
Oh, thank you Samantha!
Great professional review shelby! You are my fav eq UA-camr😊
Love my flower hack, and now realizing I need a leather bit! Price is so reasonable for a new bit! Hope it lasts for a good while and my horse doesn't chew through it! Thanks for the review!
My mustang wears an Oring by sweet billy bits. His is the round one not the flat. He goes really well in it.
I’m really considering this bit!
Great video! I'm super interested in trying this with my horse! He is super soft mouthed as well!
This was so interesting thank u I think I'm going to look into getting a leather bit!! X
I love the flower hacks, mostly because they can work as a side pull and have a little leverage if needed! We’ve used a little S hack for our on and off the track arabs from time to time and I love switching to give them the best option! :) maybe we’ll give a leather bit a go. (:
I would love to try one of these and I am sure my barrel horse would love it and my older would chew though it and I totally agree I can’t stand those big Tom thumbs I will still ride with a light bit if I running competition but for practicing this would be amazing
the meroth leather bit is legal now with FEI regulated shows. USEA and USEF according to the new by-laws.
Awesome review
Huh, i never knew about these. I may look into them more later. But thank you Shelby, for not just saying "Milo liked it, and it seems to be pretty good". Pros and cons are needed when making a good decision!!
YES! Thanks so much, love your channel 😁 Also, I dont know if I asked, but do you have Horse A Lot? It’s an amazing app, you can post your training methods and answer questions. Now I’m going to try it on my horse, she may or may not like it though...
Great video! Never heard of leather bits, but I doubt my mare would like it since she's not that easy to collect. Milo seems much more comfortable in it!
went into to youtube to put on sleep music because it is midnight but shelby first😂
Credit where credit is due: good girl! And thank you! I hate any metal on a horse, as you probably know, and that means anywhere, but a leather bit I can live with. Or a flexible rubber one. A lot safer for the horse in hard hands. Thank you for reviewing this. Now all you riders need to do is get this one legal for dressage. Get off your butts ladies and pressure the Federation. Letters, emails, protests, calls, whining at contests to the judges until they get fed up. They are there for the riders, not the other way around.
I love your channel and I love the name Archie ❤️❤️❤️
great video. i have been pondering weather or not to get a leather bit for a while. my only issue is my horse likes to chew on everything. haha.
I always find it interesting that rates shows have rules like can’t go bitless or a leather bit. I wonder if long a go someone ruined it for everyone else or if they are just set in their ways.
Hi Shelby! I have a been riding a horse with what we think has early signs of Navicular in his front right hoof and possibly left considering it often is in both but usually worse in one side making it appear as the other is fine. He gallops and rears in the pasture and usually stops limping once he walks for a few minutes if he limps at all. For the most part he is often sound and I make sure that I ride him on soft ground and I put boots that protect the sole of his feet when we go on a rare trail ride. I have been riding him for a year and a half and he is my heart horse so I am considering buying him even though he has this issue instead of leasing a 4th level dressage horse. Would you buy a horse with navicular? I’ve heard a lot of stories of horses with navicular that once they have wedges and egg bar shoes they are completely sound for the most part with the occasional off day. I’ve even heard stories of horses doing the upper levels of dressage and jumping! I’ve talked to 3 people about this and done a lot of research but I’d like another opinion from someone as open minded as you! I will definitely talk to my vet but I’d like more than one opinion! Thank you!
Edit: I don’t plan on doing excessive riding on him, 3-4 times a week at most and I don’t plan on doing more than flat work/lower levels of dressage. He’s only 12 and I don’t want his career to end early because of this as he does still enjoy working some instead of standing there 24/7 in a pasture or stall.
This is really interesting! Wish it was dressage legal tho
A happy shiny orange boy
I like it all tought im like the harses anti bit person, I think its the best! Milo is like: uh what, oh wait i like it!
How do you clean the leather bit?
Shelby can you do a video on how to work down through the bits if you already have one what is the title of the video
For horses that don’t like bits what are the bitless options you would recommend that won’t damage the horses nasal bone or nerve bundles? Love your videos and your horses! ❤️
Katie Laeger I know you're asking Shelby, but a padded sidepull is the lightest and most gentle you can get. Other gentle bitless options would include flower hackamore, star hackamores, wheel hackamores, etc, and then plain leather sidepulls and things of the like. Similar things would be a leather bosal, a plain nylon halter, or a classic thick bosal (in trained hands-harsh hands can make a bosal like that harsh). A step up from there for harshness would put you at rope halters, rope noseband side pulls, thin rawhide bosals, etc. Anything that puts all the pressure on a tiny area of tissue. Up from that would be little s hackamores (with leather nosebands!), jumping hackamores (the thin ones with cross under reins), and very short shanked mechanical hackamores. Up from there is going to be your normal or average short shanked hackamores, and some of the quicker release cross unders. Up even more is a rope noseband version of the little s, or any other short shanked thing. The harshest is your long shanked mechanical hackamore, and your standard Dr. Cooks (as it doesnt release pressure). The of course you have the "why would you ever put that on a horse you sadist" option- bike chain mechanical hackamores and wire noseband mechanical hackamores. I hope that gave you an idea of the gradient of bitless options :) (my older horse rides in a flower hack, and he's relatively good except for issues stopping, and a tendency to spook pretty intensely)
AJ // thanks for answering! 😊
Micklem Bridle all the way
Would you reccommend the round leather bit or the flat one? I’m keen to get one for my fussy horse.
I would prefer a round one, just a thicker one.
I imagine my old, cranky pony to not like these. but I actually really want to try. he's just at that point where he doesn't like bits or hackamores, or even being ridden. but he has to put up with me until my younger gelding has more miles on him. he might like these, though.
Hi Shelby, I had a few questions about the bit itself. So
1) i’ve heard some people talk about soaking their leather bits in something along the lines of sunflower oil to soften it before it goes in their mouth. what are your thoughts on that/would you ever do something like that?
2) Does the small metal piece at the center of the leather make a difference performance-wise (for example, can the horse feel when its there vs not) or is it just to prevent the horses chewing through the bit?
Thank you! Super excited to see if I can find one of these near me ☺️💗
Sophie.Grace 42 These ones are pre soaked and the metal piece on the leather covered ones is pretty thick so it would make quite a difference in flexibility
Shelby Dennis oh that’s interesting! thank you! as far as getting one of these made, do you think i could have a local craftsman/leather worker create one of these and attach the rings for the headstall/bridle and reins?
they should be able to!
Sophie.Grace 42 yeah probably. The Etsy store that Shelby mentioned in the description, Sweet Billy’s Bits sells them for 35 dollars though which is probably cheaper than what you would get custom
I’ve been super interested in using leather bits for my boy because he’s sensitive but I’m dressage rider and it’s not legal so I haven’t. Hope to see them legalized in the show ring soon,
Oh and did you hear that hazel park in Michigan shut down? Awful situation. They didn't give any notice. None. Everyone showed up for work one day and they were told to go home. People are scrambling to find new tracks for their horses too. If anyone is looking, I imagine there will be quite a few looking for new owners.
The one thing that I'm weary of is the leather bits growing mould, have you seen this happen with the bits you have? Or have you heard of it happening?
That shouldn't happen to any leather so long as it's properly kept. Same with bridles and saddles, if it's growing mould then they aren't being properly taken care of.
Do you clean it just with water like a normal bit?
NippleNinja2 I would wipe it down with saline solution or a diluted alcohol-type wound spray for cleaning but regular cleaning wiping down with water would be fine
First love you Shelby
Maddison And onna i dont really think being first matters, just understanding the video. But hey, who am I to speak LMAO 😂
could this become moldy from it getting wet all time in the horses mouth all the time or is it relatively clean? I always worry about build ups of bacteria in bits, even metal ones, it just seems to be something people really don't talk about when it comes to bits I'm curious to hear thoughts on the subject anyone might have.
Harley Montgomery it shouldn’t become mouldy if it’s stored properly
I'm so glad you are doing UA-cam . You are only a few of youtubers that actually don't moan about bits and they hurt horses . Yes bits can hurt horses but only if the owners , riders or trainers use them improperly. #Shelbyisbest
Are these show legal for jump phases?
Yes
Milo is so freakin cute
What about a rubber mullen mouth? Does it compare to the leather bit?
Kourtney Anne less flexible in the mouth and doesn’t Mould or soften in the same way so while it’s still soft I’d say it’s a step up from the leather.
Ah okay! Thank you!
Have you tried them on Archie at all? If so, how'd he like them?
Q Tee No, he’s happy in his current bit so I don’t see a need to change it
do you have a tie down on your horse if so i dont like it because when ever the horse tries to lift it's head the tie down pull's on the horse
Nope, he is just wearing a bridle and a saddle...
Would the leather not get ruined pretty quickly from being wet?
Lily Williamson Not if it’s taken care of. The leather bit covered bit at the track is over a decade old and still in perfect condition. I also live in an extremely wet environment so any leather tack will be exposed to dampness fairly frequently. It’s just about taking care of it, leather is frequently used in damp environments even for human fashion and it lasts
Shelby Dennis that's really cool. It'd be a fun thing to try :)
Casually liking my own comment like everyone else.
Early! Yeah!
i swear i saw that leather was allowed... although i event so USEF and USDF may be diffrent
right , i just reviewed the rules and i'm pretty sure its legal as long as it has a headstall attached to it.
Both bitless and leather bits or anything that isn't traditional(rubber included) everyone preaches about how bitless or softer bits are legal to compete in but they aren't at least not where I live and under Equine Canada rules.
Distinct Girrafe Rubber bits are most definitely competition legal under equine Canada rules.
Hay it me the bit maker I make a leather mouth with a metal chain to keep it from coming a part and he thuth the leather i can replace the leather so you don't have to buy a new one
If I ever get a horse, I might think about a leather bit...hmmm😜
Wouldn't that leather degrade quickly from getting wet in their mouth?
89
NO ROOTS
Do you think it would be more comfortable for him if you got it wet before putting it in his mouth? You said that it would feel kinda rough when it's in his mouth dry until it became wet. I honestly like rubber and leather bits and I'm happy to see a lot more people transitioning to them. I would definitely use this on my horse if I was forced to go back into bits or if I got a horse that I won't listen bit less. It seems like he liked it and I'm glad you like it as well. Keep up the great work! 🐴🐎👍🏻😊
No, it’s the warmth of the mouth that softens it and does so quickly. It’s no different than putting in a rubber bit when it goes in dry. I never said rough, I just said that it softens and moulds to the mouth. The bit is smooth leather, not rough..
Oh ok, sorry, I misunderstood. Thanks for explaining :)
The leather doesn't chafe? All I can think of are these leather pants I used to have and when they got moist from sweat..good God they weren't comfortable in tender places. I can only imagine the smell after a while of use too. Stinky horse spit plus wet leather. What about hygiene? Do you have to sterilize it often so bacteria can't grow? I think my I her germaphobe would twitch to death, but I can see the pros of a leather bit...just don't think I could use one without being grossed out. Mostly, I use a hackamore, but we may get a horse for my husband to ride and it uses a bit.
Pheeno Barbidoll It gets softer from moisture so would be far less like to chafe than metal or rubber. It’s really no less hygienic than riding in leather tack lol
Shelby Dennis True...the idea of mouth germs just squick me out. Phobias aren't known for their firm grasp on logic lol My vision of hell would be being forced into dentistry. Ugh.
Why isn't it dressage legal?
I ride my mare in a Pelham, she's a Ottb and a hunter, how do you deal with death threats? so many people dm me with hurtful things to the point where ive had to delete my instagram because of it
HalflingerEQ I am so sorry to hear that anyone would send you death threats. That is cruel and unreasonable behaviour on their part, and you need to report their comments to whichever social media site they are commenting on. People like that need to be held accountable for their words. You are not in the wrong- they are. A Pelham can be used kindly, especially when the rider uses the snaffle rein predominantly and does not rely on the curb rein. Please ignore the cruel people, and if you work with a trainer focus on what your trainer suggests instead😊
This is a great video, but you really should wash the bits after every use so they don't get that nasty saliva build up. :>
We dip them... this is a review, not a how to use them, which is why you also don’t see me untacking but that doesn’t mean I left my horse tacked for 3 days. Anyways, with leather wiping them down is probably better since it’s porous and when they’re moist already washing them isn’t really going to do much because they’ve already been saturated.
Some of the metal ware used in dressage horses mouths is grotesque , the degree of neck bending and vicious controlling by using these devices is abhorrent, why are bit less and leather bridles not allowed on the dressage scene ? less substantial control?and aesthetics ?.
Sarah Jones bitless should be allowed but dressage has the strictest rules regarding bitting. Abrasive mouthpieces and large shanks aren’t allowed like they are in many many other arenas. I think it’s a massive generalization to claim they’re grotesque and vicious
@@Milestone-Equestrian In U.K, and Europe the format is double bit ,bit ring , savage curb chain etc ,no generalisation let alone Massive unfortunately why are these contraptions standard in dressage I ask again?
Sarah Jones Thats only for the upper levels. The double bridles are not allowed in lower levels and are for refinement. It’s a huge generalization to try to claim that everyone uses one when it’s specific to upper level riders. The shanks and the curbs are more humane than what is allowed in western disciplines, show jumping and more. You’re massively mistaken about how they work and the notion that everyone uses them... please go read up on bitting regulations in dressage before having an opinion on it. There’s laws in place for both noseband and curb chain tightness and the shank length. The mouthpieces are smooth. If you want to talk savagery, go to the jumper ring where nothing is regulated and the set ups are much much worse with no refinement of hands like dressage riders have.
@@Milestone-Equestrian Thank-you for both replies .but I still think that any form of bit misuse is savagery and the bleeding mouths abound with horses having their heads yanked about especially in the racing and jumping scene ,what do you think of Hackamore bridles and the use of them? times are changing and a lot of horse welfare issues are being exposed especially in the National Hunt racing world in the U.K I hope it is for the horses sake and not just to save the face of racing as people are leaving the sport due to the numbers of fatalities which are horrendous and are listed on deathwatch U.K each week..... Finally and most certainly not least I send a huge respect and gratitude to horse people who really look after their charges and have their best interests at heart I see that you are clearly one of these.
Sarah Jones Again, dressage has some of the best bitting regulations so the misuse is far less there than other disciplines. There’s also blood rules in place that result in disqualification. The facial nerves are still very sensitive and can cause the same amounts of pain and damage as bits when misused it’s just less obvious since it’s soft and hard tissues. There’s some bits that shouldn’t exist but they exist outside of dressage and aren’t allowed in that ring but at the end of the day any equipment can be abused but that doesn’t make the equipment itself had
Why don’t you just ride bitless if your horse is sensitive???
I do, and bridleless. But bits are useful for dressage work and getting proper carriage. Also, facial nerves are sensitive, too. All up to what the horse prefers but I think my horses are pretty happy considering if I can ride bridleless, they’re inherently softer than anyone who doesn’t have that level of control
Why does there have to be a bit?
If u tell me one reason I'll stop asking
Evi Marioli There doesn’t “have” to be but a lot of horses go better with one and considering they’re not abusive whatsoever unless they’re misused, I’d love to know why you’re questioning the use of the softest bit on the market.
@@Milestone-Equestrian 1.I don't think bits are abuse but I'm 100% sure they are uncomfortable to the horse
2. No animal wants something in their mouth but they need some time to get used to a hackamore...all those people saying that their horse likes bit is bacause they only tried bitless one and were too bored to try a second time so that the horse can get used to it
3.What I don't understand is that u can do with a bit what u can do bitless so why do u have one...what if there's a chance 1 in a billion your horse doesn't like bits? *No difference to u huge difference to him*
Evi Marioli No horse “likes” having pressure on its face especially when it’s been proven that the hard palates of the face are less equipped to handle it. A hackamore is way harsher than this leather bit.
Question for you, why do you rely on pressure for control anyways? Evidently you need your hands more than I do considering my horse also goes bridleless.
Evi Marioli Also like... tons of animals go out of their way to play with things and put them in their mouth and many horses open their mouths for the bit and don’t want to drop t after. To say no animal wants something in their mouth is a load of shit 😂. My horse does like his bit. I’ve more than tried bitless because he can go without anything.
@@Milestone-Equestrian I honestly have NO PROBLEM with leather bits so good job for trying it and I really hope u will use it more but can we PLEASE agree that anything metal on the horse's face is wrong?I wouldn't put anything metallic on my dog/cat/cow/goat so what's the difference with horses?Just cause it's "tradition" doesn't make it ok
Why didn't you just go bitless? Won't you need to constantly need to buy a new one from the damaged?
Nvm I heard why you didn't go bitless. But the second question still stands.
That person 04 Because my horse goes way better in a bit? And no, not at all 😂 that’s like me saying why go bitless if the bridle will eventually break and you’ll need to get a new one
I have a couple of concerns about this bit though. Leather I know if exposed to being wetted a lot can start to grow mold and might make the horse sick and possibly die. My other concern is that leather might start to get rough and possibly cut up the horses mouth. I don't think bits in general should be used. Being with your horse with body language and cues is more of a free way of riding to how I see it.
Phantom Of Memories The leather shouldn't grow mold or get rough if it's being cared for and cleaned properly. Those would be issues created by rider negligence and not inherently a flaw in the bit design itself.
It shouldn’t get rough either as it softens in the horses mouth, I think it’d be pretty much impossible for it to develop sharp points because of that. You’re far more likely to get roughing happening with plastic bits. You can be with your horse and their body language whilst using a bit.
I see where your coming from because the bits look moist but ive sewn with leather and if the leather is properly oiled and soaked well with oil it will repel moisture just like someone who oils their saddle after almost every ride can get it wet without worrying about water damage. Proper care and storage is key but that does mean the user has to take care of their equipment
Phantom Of Memories while I can appreciate your concern regarding a horse getting sick, the likelihood of a horse possibly dying from any mould on a bit is infinitesimal. A horse's system, while sensitive in some ways, is very different from a human's and since they live outdoors, eat off varied surfaces, nibble on things that could host mould or bacteria, they are far better equipped to handle these types of situations. Like a leather saddle, a leather bit will typically dry out quite well after use by being hung in a dry, warm tack room where mould is less likely to grow😊
Well I don't like bits I don't ride yet I am a beginner but I wish people can not use bites and I respect your choice but otherwise it's still like your videos and your horses LOL I have three horses that are race horses so one of them is Crystal she is both of my little horses mother their names are 7 because she has a 7 on her forehead she is the oldest sister and her youngest sister which was born on April 4th is name to Ruby and all of them are girls all of them are thoroughbreds LOL love you and your horses
Thank you! I encourage you to further your knowledge and understanding of bits before making a conclusive decision. It's important to be open minded for both bitless and bitted options as at the end of the day it's whatever works best for the horse and neither is truly kinder based off of the physiology of the horse.
Thank you very much and lol do you like RaleigLink14
Estrella Granados I do not agree with the vast majority of what she says
Than it is ok
If ur going to these extremes ya might as well go Bitless😂 anyways where did u get it
Alexandra_Kittendaughter XxSpirtXxSso In what world is it an “extreme” to ride in a snaffle? Why do you need to know where it’s from? Just ride bitless if it’s too “extreme” for you amiright
Alexandra_Kittendaughter XxSpirtXxSso I'm not trying to bad-mouth you here (no pun intended), so please don't take offense at what I'm about to share, I'm just trying to open everyone's minds who think that one thing is always better than another, no matter the horse, gear or circumstances, etc.
I've had multiple horses of whom I've tried every style of bitless bridle on the market, most of which they all hated more than bits... the only two that worked were custom made side-pulls & the worst bridles by far were cross-unders (which caused all manner of dangerous behaviour just to get the wretched things off their poor heads), yet almost every horse responded so well to a Myler Comfort Snaffle they actually put their heads down and open their mouths ready for their bitted bridle, and work so happily in them they actually enjoy what they do, so sometimes bitless is worse than forking out multiple pay packets for innovative bits that may or may not work. For me and my farm, if a horse doesn't like bitted or bitless then they retire from all riding altogether. Just speaking from my own personal experiences with bitless and bitted bridles so people know that though they should go ahead and try that side-pull bitless bridle they've been wanting to try, but not expect more positive results than than the likes of this leather bit, and if they want to try the bit then try it. Keep an open mind, people... the best horse trainers are the ones who never stop looking to learn from others - horses and people - rather than having an opinion set in stone. What works for one doesn't necessarily mean it'll work for another.
And Shelby, keep up the good work, your review has broadened my horizon of leather bits.
Just ride bitless? the issue with the leather bit is a horse can chew through it, it also tends to sit on the tongue and not be as valuable as a snaffle- it's a hundred times better than sticking metal in there for sure but it's still pretty unnecessary
TheAssholeProphet USE WHATEVER YOUR HORSE WORKS BEST IN. Bitless options “sit on the nose” and create twice as much pressure onto areas less equipped to deal with it. Not all horses like that. The tongue is far better equipped to handle pressure so bits that use predominately tongue pressure are far softer than bitless options acting on the mandibular nerve and hard palates of the face due to the nerve density in these facial areas. Horses can blow throw bitless options and ignore them or create head tossing habits as an attempt to escape them. All pieces of equipment have their pros and cons which is why it is SO important not to have the “my way or the highway” mentality of someone such as yourself when it comes to using equipment. Also, this leather bit IS a snaffle. Please learn about the equipment you’re talking about before trying to weigh in. You have such a habit of coming onto my channel and making comments entirely unfounded by fact. I get that you like bitless and that’s fine but don’t act like your opinion is fact.
"Bitless options “sit on the nose” and create twice as much pressure onto areas less equipped to deal with it."
Where are your sources on that? And where are your sources that "the tongue is far better equipped to handle pressure (than the nose)".
Not trying to hate, genuinely curious. It seems like a lot of these bitless vs bit debates are just people from both sides pulling facts out of thin air.
all her sources have been listed on her video specifically talking about bits vs bitless.
melodymare I have about 20+ sources on my bitting videos that you’re free to look up. I find it rather interesting that people typically never demand sources from pro bitless people making claims that all bits are worse than bitless but the second I refer to something from my studies in a comment, people assume I haven’t done my homework
TheAssholeProphet it would be exceedingly difficult for a horse to chew through a leather bit quickly, as most leather bits are layers of leather stitched together. Over time it would be possible, but all equipment we use for horses can wear down and need replacement at some point. If a leather bit is softer, gentler and works well with certain horses, I am sure most owners would be okay with replacing it when it starts to degrade to the point of needing replacement- at least I know I would😊
24 horses die a week on race track's
More than that die a week due to being turned out, are you going to start depriving your horse of natural behaviours just because they have a tendency to hurt themselves? 24 a week out of the millions racing is negligible and I'd also love to see your source for that.
They can’t escape from the bit that’s constantly causing your horse pain .
like a horse Do you ride? What level of experience do you have in riding in either a bit or bitless? Have you observed in person and over a period of time this equine behaviour of "constant pain" caused by a bit? If not, you do not have the requisite first-hand experience to make such a claim. In absence of some extended personal experience, you would need to gather valid studies and research of equine behaviour indicative of "constant pain" from a bit in order to make an educated comment.
Read ride Learn That was my opinion which I am aloud to have .I think that people should stop riding in bits .You don’t need to observe anything to think that .
like a horse of course you are allowed to have a opinion, however your comment was not worded as an opinion- it was worded as a statement of fact. When you state that her horse cannot get away from the constant pain, you are making a claim, not an opinion. It is also disconcerting to see you make such a claim on a video in which it is the rider is reviewing and riding in a leather bit, which is very soft, and therefore highly unlikely to cause pain.
A bit used for communication uses pressure, a bit used for control uses pain.
Some are of course more inheritly cruel than others and most people you see use a bit for control, but that does not mean all bits cause pain, especially not constant pain